Christian bakers 'gay cake' appeal defeat

freddielong said:
What if it was the other way around what if it was a gay baker refusing to bake a cake saying support heterosexual marriage.

On a similar note I read that a straight couple recently came over to the island for a civil ceremony as no council in the UK will give these to straight couples, should they have just sued the council.
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Yeah because gay people are notorious for discriminating against straight people getting married. At least you didn't bring hitler into it.

Can we please stop the ridiculous examples.

There is legal action ongoing to extend civil partnerships to straight people and several gay rights organisations are active in that campaign.
 
CheltenhamHacker said:
Or in fact the moral of the story is not to discriminate based on your beliefs. You're welcome to believe what you want, but the second you discriminate based on that, you're in the wrong.
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Yes, perhaps using the word moral was the wrong move. I have mixed feelings about this. Discrimination is wrong but pushing a button to prove a point is also unecessary. Asking for a political statement on a cake from a known, this is N.Ireland remember, christian bakery is like prodding a wound. They went looking for trouble and found it. Big surprise. I don't know that anyone comes out of this with any credit. There are bigger and more important cases of discrimination than this. When Peter Tatchell doesn't support you then you know it's the wrong argument to pick.
 
FairwayDodger said:
Yeah because gay people are notorious for discriminating against straight people getting married. At least you didn't bring hitler into it.

Can we please stop the ridiculous examples.

There is legal action ongoing to extend civil partnerships to straight people and several gay rights organisations are active in that campaign.
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The examples are not ridiculous. To the baker what he was asked to write may have been just as offensive to him than a reference of Hitler to a Jew would be.

I would have no problem if someone had said to me sorry mate but because of our beliefs we would rather not write that on a cake. I would have went next door it's as simple as that.

Need to consider everybody's beleiefs not just our own.
 
sawtooth said:
The examples are not ridiculous. To the baker what he was asked to write may have been just as offensive to him than a reference of Hitler to a Jew would be.

I would have no problem if someone had said to me sorry mate but because of our beliefs we would rather not write that on a cake. I would have went next door it's as simple as that.

Need to consider everybody's beleiefs not just our own.
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Just to confirm, a) being homosexual isn't a belief, and b) I genuinly cannot believe you've seriously compared it to Hitler/Jews. You've officially lost this battle I think.
 
sawtooth said:
The examples are not ridiculous. To the baker what he was asked to write may have been just as offensive to him than a reference of Hitler to a Jew would be.

I would have no problem if someone had said to me sorry mate but because of our beliefs we would rather not write that on a cake. I would have went next door it's as simple as that.

Need to consider everybody's beleiefs not just our own.
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Rubbish, what part of the baker losing the case and the appeal do you not accept.

If you offer a service you offer it to all, they took the order for the cake, the man who ordered the cake left happy, 2 days later they phone him up and say they can no longer do the cake as the message is against their beliefs.

He didn't go looking for trouble, he didn't single them out.

By the way, comparing it to Hilter and Jews is deeply offensive.
 
Sawtooth hasn't compared gays to Hitler turn down your am I offended radar he used it as a marker as something pretty much everyone is offended by never was there a comparison.
 
In my view the nuts and bolts of this case does come down to bias based on sexual orientation which is wrong and the court made the correct call. That may upset some hardline religious organisations particularly on the unionist side it seems from reading the article quotes but peoples rights and equality under law must come before old fashioned perhaps entrenched and intolerant religious views that are thankfully dying out over time.
 
freddielong said:
Sawtooth hasn't compared gays to Hitler turn down your am I offended radar he used it as a marker as something pretty much everyone is offended by never was there a comparison.
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Were did I say he compared Hitler to gays? He was comparing the 2 situations by going completely extreme with his example. Nothing to do with an offended radar, just common decency.
 
So to precise:- two bakers welcome gays in to their shop and bake cakes for them, then they are asked to put a message on a cake that is a concept even their own government dosent agree with, and refuse, They are sued for a hate crime and even though the complainants main supporter disagrees with the action they are found against and have to pay costs.. Is that right so far?
 
Farmergeddon said:
So to precise:- two bakers welcome gays in to their shop and bake cakes for them, then they are asked to put a message on a cake that is a concept even their own government dosent agree with, and refuse, They are sued for a hate crime and even though the complainants main supporter disagrees with the action they are found against and have to pay costs.. Is that right so far?
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Not sued by anyone, taken to court by the NI Equality Commission and found guilty of discrimination, the cake order with pictures and words accepted at the same time.
It was one man who ordered the cake.
They have to pay the cost of the appeal as they lost, that they decided to action.
Not sure why you'd call it a hate crime.
 
I do not give a tuppeny crap what adults do in private, but if i were asked to write this slogan they would be told no.

Being forced to write something in any form, cakes included that you totally oppose is not something i support

Compromise would be make them a cake with

WE DO NOT

SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE

and let them eat the first 3 words first..
 
Could these bakers find themselves in hot water again if they refused to make a cake with a pro abortion message on it?
 
If i walk into callaway and ask them to produce a golf shaft with Support Taylor Made golf, would they have to do it?
 
The point I got from it was:

You can be Christian, you can be a baker, by default you are a Christian Baker... but you can't run a business offering bakery goods and services that are aligned solely with the values and beliefs of a Christian

Seems pretty simple
 
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