Brexit Two Months On

[Doon frae Troon]

The new Ken Loach film [I, Daniel ?] is supposed to be a tough watch.
The two male film critics who saw it both admitted being very tearful.

I don't suppose IDS, Maggie May, Farage, The Three Breakfasteers etc will bother to view.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I suspect apart from the film critics and a hardy few not many people will go to see I, Daniel. A good BBC2 film, not for a fun night out spending £10 to see it. Easy to knock the system but it does need updating, too many abuses. The problem is that the system has become so huge that good people get caught up in the blunt changes. The staus quo can not remain however, the country can't afford it and many tax payers do not want it stay as it is.

 

[vkurup]

In my post, which you quoted, I blamed both sides for a poor performance. I don't blame anyone for how I cast my vote(to Remain) as I researched the hell out of the subject. I dislike the EU even more now than I did before the start of the referendum campaign but my preference was in but with a cut back on the federalism.

Going to Hartlepool is very poor by the BBC. I know it very well. Getting a balanced audience from there is nigh on impossible. I'm sure, as many know, going to other very poor towns will give a warped view.

Hobbit... apologies for that.. It was not picking on you and I should have mentioned that my comment about adults complaining about 'Remainers not doing enough' was not directed at you but to a wider population that has taken that stance. I was only using your post as a reference point.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Any form of media is now unbalanced, the Press/BBC seem to think that they can print say any old tosh/lies and get away with it.

The Sun using a picture of an interpreter as a 'child' is just one of many.
A recent anti Scottish Independence Spectator piece has been stripped down to contain around 40 lies within 1800 words.

 

[delc]

Isn't part of the supposed problem with politics now that such people don't have a voice or aren't listened to? Should the BBC only report the views of articulate middle classed people? Let's hear what they have to say, in all its horror.

On the basis of what I saw on Question Time from Hartlepool yesterday evening, Yes! Their seemed to be some thuggish right wing UKIP members in the audience that the Nazi Party would have been proud of! I was particularly appalled when they booed that Polish lady who complained about increasing discrimination against her country folk. It wasn't even as if she was a recent immigrant, having lived here for twenty years and being married to an Englishman. Do the Leavers really think she should be deported and split up her family?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

On the basis of what I saw on Question Time from Hartlepool yesterday evening, Yes! Their seemed to be some thuggish right wing UKIP members in the audience that the Nazi Party would have been proud of! I was particularly appalled when they booed that Polish lady who complained about increasing discrimination against her country folk. It wasn't even as if she was a recent immigrant, having lived here for twenty years and being married to an Englishman. Do the Leavers really think she should be deported and split up her family?

This is going to be part of the problem. I suspect that the vast majority of those who voted Leave do not expect existing migrants to be 'deported' (well I hope that that is the case). But I suspect also that many of those who voted Leave will have voted that way because of the current migrant population - so 'foreigners' in front of them in the GP surgery queue; the housing queue; the job queue; the school places queue etc.

Problem is that if you are not going to deport any of the current immigrant population then none of that will change. And I fear that in that population of Leave voters we will have anger and resentment building - and going forward who will be able to differentiate between a current migrant and a new immigrant. Nobody - that's who.

And so if that Polish woman in Hartlepool is in front of such a Leave voter in the queue at the GP - how will she be viewed? I think her 'not wanted' experience will become ever more common to her.

 

[delc]

This is going to be part of the problem. I suspect that the vast majority of those who voted Leave do not expect existing migrants to be 'deported' (well I hope that that is the case). But I suspect also that many of those who voted Leave will have voted that way because of the current migrant population - so 'foreigners' in front of them in the GP surgery queue; the housing queue; the job queue; the school places queue etc.

Problem is that if you are not going to deport any of the current immigrant population then none of that will change. And I fear that in that population of Leave voters we will have anger and resentment building - and going forward who will be able to differentiate between a current migrant and a new immigrant. Nobody - that's who.

And so if that Polish woman in Hartlepool is in front of such a Leave voter in the queue at the GP - how will she be viewed? I think her 'not wanted' experience will become ever more common to her.

The vast majority of immigrants in the UK are not from the EU. They are refugees from Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria and various other Middle-Eastern and African countries destabilised by Western interventions. The Blair/Brown New Labour Government were particularly keen on taking them in the hope that they would vote for them and keep them in power for ever. Fortunately this tactic didn't work! It is the children of these immigrants that are now filling our schools, and in a very few cases turning into terrorists. We could have controlled this immigration, but failed to do so. I rather doubt that too many EU citizens will want to come to our impoverished little island anyway now, particularly now the Pound has become pretty worthless!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

The vast majority of immigrants in the UK are not from the EU. They are refugees from Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria and various other Middle-Eastern and African countries destabilised by Western interventions. The Blair/Brown New Labour Government were particularly keen on taking them in the hope that they would vote for them and keep them in power for ever. Fortunately this tactic didn't work! It is the children of these immigrants that are now filling our schools, and in a very few cases turning into terrorists. We could have controlled this immigration, but failed to do so. I rather doubt that too many EU citizens will want to come to our impoverished little island anyway now, particularly now the Pound has become pretty worthless!

That may well be the case - but it isn't going to mollify the Leave voter who following Brexit expects to get nearer the front of the queue and not have so many foreigners in front of them. But unless a lot of these foreigners are ask politely to leave - then the make-up of the queue will not change.

 

[IanM]

Correct. Blair opened the doors. He had his reasons I suppose. Immigration is far less of an issue than sovereignty and ridding ourselves from the unelected commissioners and their flunkies

BBC News at 6 was interesting...........going on about how exposed we are at the EU Summit and how tough it will be. Completely slanted report as ever.

..I guess the French and Germans don't need us to buy their stuff! The Eastern Europeans are panicking about the subsidies they were promised for joining.

Trade is still trade.... my organisation is making big strides outside EU now it can.... not reported on BBC though

 

[delc]

That may well be the case - but it isn't going to mollify the Leave voter who following Brexit expects to get nearer the front of the queue and not have so many foreigners in front of them. But unless a lot of these foreigners are ask politely to leave - then the make-up of the queue will not change.

Don't forget there are 2.5 million Brits living in other EU countries who are also 'foreigners' to the local populations! it's a two way thing.

 

[SocketRocket]

On the basis of what I saw on Question Time from Hartlepool yesterday evening, Yes! Their seemed to be some thuggish right wing UKIP members in the audience that the Nazi Party would have been proud of! I was particularly appalled when they booed that Polish lady who complained about increasing discrimination against her country folk. It wasn't even as if she was a recent immigrant, having lived here for twenty years and being married to an Englishman. Do the Leavers really think she should be deported and split up her family?

Again another bout of gross exaggeration from you and others on here. The Polish Woman on QT made some outlandish comments and the people booing her were disagreeing that 52% of voters wanted her to leave the UK that was a stupid comment from her. She said “I feel I’m no longer wanted by 52 per cent of the voters.” She then said “Fifty-two per cent of the voters voted against immigration. Polish is the second most popular language in this country.” If you think that was a reasonable comment from her and consider her comments as discrimination against her then you are guilty of what you accuse others of.

 

[delc]

Again another bout of gross exaggeration from you and others on here. The Polish Woman on QT made some outlandish comments and the people booing her were disagreeing that 52% of voters wanted her to leave the UK that was a stupid comment from her. She said “I feel I’m no longer wanted by 52 per cent of the voters.” She then said “Fifty-two per cent of the voters voted against immigration. Polish is the second most popular language in this country.” If you think that was a reasonable comment from her and consider her comments as discrimination against her then you are guilty of what you accuse others of.

As far as I can remember 52% of those who voted in the Referendum did actually vote leave, often on an anti-immigrant ticket, so what is your point? Polish and other minority communities are reporting more hate crime since the Brexit vote, or do you wish to deny that as well?

 

[vkurup]

Did not watch QT... but a question on this Polish lady. If she has a kid while she is in the UK
a) with a Polish husband
b) with a British national

Does the child in a, b or both classify as a British and therefore not a 'foreigner' who should not be in the various queues?

 

[delc]

Did not watch QT... but a question on this Polish lady. If she has a kid while she is in the UK
a) with a Polish husband
b) with a British national

Does the child in a, b or both classify as a British and therefore not a 'foreigner' who should not be in the various queues?

Sounds like we might be going to go down the route of Nazi Germany. Blame and then victimise foreigners!

P.S. The Poles were our Allies in WW2.

 

[Hobbit]

Sounds like we might be going to go down the route of Nazi Germany. Blame and then victimise foreigners!

P.S. The Poles were our Allies in WW2.

And its that sort of comment that is equally unhelpful. The judicial system in the U.K., including the Police, prosecute racist behaviour, unlike Nazi Germany where it was state sponsored.

 

[SocketRocket]

As far as I can remember 52% of those who voted in the Referendum did actually vote leave, often on an anti-immigrant ticket, so what is your point? Polish and other minority communities are reporting more hate crime since the Brexit vote, or do you wish to deny that as well?

What a completely stupid statement. You are as guilty as the people you accuse. 52% of voters in the referendum voted on an anti-immigrant policy! what an outrageous statement. You seem incapable of differentiating between people who want to control immigration and anti-immigrant. Idiot!

 

[SocketRocket]

Did not watch QT... but a question on this Polish lady. If she has a kid while she is in the UK
a) with a Polish husband
b) with a British national

Does the child in a, b or both classify as a British and therefore not a 'foreigner' who should not be in the various queues?

What Queues?

 

[SocketRocket]

Sounds like we might be going to go down the route of Nazi Germany. Blame and then victimise foreigners!

P.S. The Poles were our Allies in WW2.

Trolling trouble maker.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Correct. Blair opened the doors. He had his reasons I suppose. Immigration is far less of an issue than sovereignty and ridding ourselves from the unelected commissioners and their flunkies

BBC News at 6 was interesting...........going on about how exposed we are at the EU Summit and how tough it will be. Completely slanted report as ever.

..I guess the French and Germans don't need us to buy their stuff! The Eastern Europeans are panicking about the subsidies they were promised for joining.

Trade is still trade.... my organisation is making big strides outside EU now it can.... not reported on BBC though

Fair point, much better to have the House Of Lords doing that job....

And boo BBC for pointing out that we are exposed at the EU summit as we have decided to leave them and how tough it will be. Where as everyone knows that really we will be embraced like long lost bosom buddies by the rest of the EU after what has happened. And with our well thought out plans for Brexit it will be a piece of cake, no way will it be tough cause we are Great Britain and we have regained our sovereignty!!! Up your Jacques Delors!

 

[Blue in Munich]

I just wish I could hear more Leavers articulating thought-through reasoning so that I know that they actually did know what they were voting for.

Because, as you say, my perception that Leaving will be so wrong, may be just that - a perception based upon my own 'prejudices'. There may be solid bases on the benefits of Leaving that more than balance out the downside. But most of the time I just don't hear that. And I didn't hear any coming from the Hartlepool audience last night. All I heard was stuff that reinforced my own 'prejudices'.

Having been told by yourself and others on here how stupid/ignorant/racist they are for voting leave and having see how intransigent you are in your views, they've probably decided it's not worth trying to explain as it won't make a blind bit of difference to your opinion.