Brexit Two Months On

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Hobbit said:
I love this concept. After all, who do you fight with if there's no national boundary. Unfortunately I just can't see it ever happening. Even supposedly modern, western countries appear to have areas where local nationalism exists... UK/Scotland independence for example.
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Having a sense of national identity is surely, in itself, no reason to wish to go to war with anyone.
 
FairwayDodger said:
Such a short term view that so many of us have taken. I've no doubt the day will come when we regret leaving and want back in.
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^^ See below....


ColchesterFC said:
I think that the next 5 to 10 years will determine if you are correct or not. If the EU implements reforms to appease the current anti EU feeling and moves back towards being a trading bloc with less of the political interference n you could be right. If it takes the opposite path and goes towards ever closer political union then I think you'll be wrong.

But of course probably the biggest factor as to whether we regret leaving Will be the success or otherwise of the UK outside of the EU.
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I agree with this ^

I think the collapse of the EU is likely to happen. If it had remained a trading bloc then fine but trying to create a federal state with all the cultural differences was always going to be a step too far.
 
Hobbit said:
I love this concept. After all, who do you fight with if there's no national boundary. Unfortunately I just can't see it ever happening. Even supposedly modern, western countries appear to have areas where local nationalism exists... UK/Scotland independence for example.
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The Irish managed to infight for years :eek:
 
MetalMickie said:
Really does not make any sense.
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How so. The SNP wish an independent Scotland to be in the EU - it cannot control what the rUK does. If it turns out that Scotland ever becomes independent then it's status with the EU will be similar to what the UK's currently is (excepting probably membership of the euro).

And when in the EU Scotland will be in the single market and will have the EU's trading relationship with rUK. And if one day 50yrs hence the rUK decides that it wants to join the EU (it can't rejoin as it's the UK that left and the rUK that would be joining) then great.
 
Well there is one immediate consequence of all this. I won't be able to afford a round of golf next week when I'm in the Algarve, what with the pound being so weak against the Euro. It will cost me a fortune....
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
How so. The SNP wish an independent Scotland to be in the EU - it cannot control what the rUK does. If it turns out that Scotland ever becomes independent then it's status with the EU will be similar to what the UK's currently is (excepting probably membership of the euro).

And when in the EU Scotland will be in the single market and will have the EU's trading relationship with rUK. And if one day 50yrs hence the rUK decides that it wants to join the EU (it can't rejoin as it's the UK that left and the rUK that would be joining) then great.
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Disingenuous.

The SNP wanted independence from UK before Brexit, so it wanted separation from Westminster but would accept being governed by Brussels. That really makes no sense.

In any event the current state of the Scottish economy would need to improve or an independent Scotland would be likely to fail the EU's tests for new members.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
Yes - Except an independent Scotland would want to be in a Europe without boundaries - though there would be one with the rUK. I'm sure if rUK wished to apply to rejoin the EU, then Scotland wouldn't oppose the application ;)
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SNP want independence, full stop... and that's something you've said previously. Brexit has very little to do with the SNP's wish for independence other than its another lever/vehicle for them to use.

MetalMickie said:
Disingenuous.

The SNP wanted independence from UK before Brexit, so it wanted separation from Westminster but would accept being governed by Brussels. That really makes no sense.

In any event the current state of the Scottish economy would need to improve or an independent Scotland would be likely to fail the EU's tests for new members.
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spot on!
 
MetalMickie said:
Disingenuous.

The SNP wanted independence from UK before Brexit, so it wanted separation from Westminster but would accept being governed by Brussels. That really makes no sense.

In any event the current state of the Scottish economy would need to improve or an independent Scotland would be likely to fail the EU's tests for new members.
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I suppose it's the actual and perceived levels of devolution you get in both situations. Some would are the UK is not governed by Brussels now, some would argue it is.
 
Hacker Khan said:
I suppose it's the actual and perceived levels of devolution you get in both situations. Some would are the UK is not governed by Brussels now, some would argue it is.
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An independent Scotland is in far better shape that Italy, Greece and Portugal............. but that's not saying much!

I wonder what sort of economic state France and Germany will be in when they exclude us from their "Market" so we stop being able to but cars and wine from the former and cars and industrials from the latter?

Who needs whom more?
 
IanM said:
An independent Scotland is in far better shape that Italy, Greece and Portugal............. but that's not saying much!

I wonder what sort of economic state France and Germany will be in when they exclude us from their "Market" so we stop being able to but cars and wine from the former and cars and industrials from the latter?

Who needs whom more?
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I'm sure VW will be happy losing £9 BILLION in car sales
 
IanM said:
An independent Scotland is in far better shape that Italy, Greece and Portugal............. but that's not saying much!

I wonder what sort of economic state France and Germany will be in when they exclude us from their "Market" so we stop being able to but cars and wine from the former and cars and industrials from the latter?

Who needs whom more?
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To keep the Scottish analogies going. To claim the Eu need the uk more than we need them is like saying the uk needs Scotland more than we need the uk.
 
Hardly surprising when one of the criteria is "access to education" which at university level is free in Scotland. Wonder how the result would have looked without that measure.
 
ColchesterFC said:
Hardly surprising when one of the criteria is "access to education" which at university level is free in Scotland. Wonder how the result would have looked without that measure.
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You are starting to get picky now.;)

Perhaps if England and Wales had followed Scotland's lead they may have come top.
However.......they would have had to have made savings elsewhere to afford that route.
 
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