IanM
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True... but that cannot happen as we are not allowed to leave....
Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!
- Thread starter drdel
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True... but that cannot happen as we are not allowed to leave....
Doon frae Troon
Ryder Cup Winner
I know the leavers want to take the UK back to the 1940's but surely the 1340's is a step too far.
Perhaps a good birching would be more appropriate.
D
Deleted Member 1156
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D
Deleted Member 1156
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No, the leavers want to take the UK back to pre Maastricht.I know the leavers want to take the UK back to the 1940's but surely the 1340's is a step too far.
Perhaps a good birching would be more appropriate.
Doon frae Troon
Ryder Cup Winner
They EU have said they will negotiate but May has to move her 'red lines'.
Shame for the UK to be ruined just because of one woman's pride.
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
The Remainers call that we didn't understand what we were voting for or that it was a binary vote seems to suffer from memory loss.
We were actually voting on whether we wanted to remain in Cameron's Reformed European Union that he had negotiated on our behalf OR to Leave the European Union. The vote decided by a majority to reject his reformed EU and that was that.
NOW, The process to leave the EU is by invoking article 50 of the Maasterick Treaty which gives up to two years for the EU and the Leaving member country to negotiate the terms of leaving. This period can be extended if agreed by all existing EU Member States.
From my view when those of us voted to leave we voted on the bases that we rejected Cameron's reformed EU and preferred to Leave the eu and it's institutions. We expected our Government to negotiate the best trading arrangements possible but not to consider in any way us remaining a member.
If Parliament frustrate or stop us leaving the EU and it's institutions then I consider they are no longer representative of the British Public's democratic wishes and must all be held accountable for their actions. I don't understand exactly how this public accountability would manifest but it really is a concerning situation.
We were actually voting on whether we wanted to remain in Cameron's Reformed European Union that he had negotiated on our behalf OR to Leave the European Union. The vote decided by a majority to reject his reformed EU and that was that.
NOW, The process to leave the EU is by invoking article 50 of the Maasterick Treaty which gives up to two years for the EU and the Leaving member country to negotiate the terms of leaving. This period can be extended if agreed by all existing EU Member States.
From my view when those of us voted to leave we voted on the bases that we rejected Cameron's reformed EU and preferred to Leave the eu and it's institutions. We expected our Government to negotiate the best trading arrangements possible but not to consider in any way us remaining a member.
If Parliament frustrate or stop us leaving the EU and it's institutions then I consider they are no longer representative of the British Public's democratic wishes and must all be held accountable for their actions. I don't understand exactly how this public accountability would manifest but it really is a concerning situation.
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bluewolf
Money List Winner
Just going slightly of topic.. I wonder where we'd be right now if Gina Miller hadn't taken the Government to Court? 
For those more in the know.. Would we now be exiting with May's deal?
For those more in the know.. Would we now be exiting with May's deal?
drdel
Tour Rookie
I think you might want to take a moment and remember the 'red lines' stem from the vote to leave and provides the basis for a withdrawl: but a discussion that the EU demanded artificially removed the inclusion of the 'future' relationship, yet insisted on a large goodwill payment. That is not a negotiation. Note the Labour Party have their red lines !! You need to 'play-the-ball' not the person.
Personalising the issue is IMO part of what's wrong with the HoC and media reporting on this negotiation. The UK's problem is not the Red Lines but the EU's strategy of stonewalling because they are desperately afraid that one or other of the 27 will latch onto any concession given to the UK and want it to.
The membership is not a coherent bunch. You will see how the German MEPs (among others) are very unhappy with Brussels stance) and the stupid 'Twitter' posts show the level of intellect behind the EU. Verhofstadt was well and widely truly trashed for his attempt to get 'likes' in response to his childish pro-EU posts. Any negotiation needs the desire for agreement on both sides - what we have is an EU brick-wall of internal fear.
ColchesterFC
Journeyman Pro
Just going slightly of topic.. I wonder where we'd be right now if Gina Miller hadn't taken the Government to Court?
For those more in the know.. Would we now be exiting with May's deal?
Did the original plan involve having to get the backing of the Tory party or just the cabinet. If it was the former then I would say no. If it was the latter then probably yes
Same place. It was a brief sideshow for someone who wanted her 5 minutes of fame.Just going slightly of topic.. I wonder where we'd be right now if Gina Miller hadn't taken the Government to Court?
For those more in the know.. Would we now be exiting with May's deal?
funkycoldmedina
Newbie
Let's never forget that the Conservatives never wanted Parliament to have a vote on this in the 1st placeand then when they lost that have refused any cross party collaboration until the 11th hour.
I know Conservative Mps and some of their voters see them as 'the management' but this type of arrogance has put us in such a precarious position.
Labour are an ineffective opposition and I'm no Corbyn fan but the majority of this mess lays at the door of the Conservatives
bluewolf
Money List Winner
Really? I've just googled it and even The Spectator is labelling her as a Brexiteer hero. They appear to be under the impression that without her challenge, we'd now be leaving under May's deal.
As an aside, your answer seemed quite bitter and not what I've come to expect from someone who is usually quite balanced.
Mudball
Assistant Pro
have we left the EU yet? Got the work TV going on about the farce called parliament. Seems to be on repeat - but says 'LIVE' for some reason.
Cant we just take our bags and leave... enough of this nonsense
Cant we just take our bags and leave... enough of this nonsense
I thought she loved the moment too much, was hugely patronising and saw herself as some great hero. I thought she cost the taxpayer money and delayed the process largely for the sake of it, although clearly not as much as TM has done and got nowhere. Perhaps I am being too harsh on her but she rubbed me up. Bitter? Brexit grinds us all down
I tend to be cynical about any media declaring anyone in this process a hero. They all have an angle and we need to dig deep to see who is behind it, both sides. Even the Mail, all for Brexit at one point, has changed tack since Dacre left and the Tories voting against May last night are now all traitors. We need to get this out of the way and press factory reset.
Taz
Journeyman Pro
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
Hypothetically, Jezza gets his shot at pm. He has already said that he would be able to renegotiate the deal. However the EU has said the deal on the table is the deal on the table, end of story. Kinda contradicts Jezzas fantasy. Yet he and his " followers" believe Jezza is the man.
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User62651
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Think many of Jezza's 'fans' couldn't give 2 hoots about EU or Brexit, they are more concerned with day to day survival being unable to feed or buy their kids clothes and suffering from 8 years of tough Tory cuts. They're the Jezza fans. Suggest Labour people who are more comfortably off and follow politics more closely want rid of Corbyn (like most of his backbenchers) as they know he's totally unelectable to a big proportion of the electorate. Was amazed to see Labour get 40% in 2017 GE but I think Corbyns bubble has burst now and May's electioneeering was as bad as it could possibly be then and relied on Ruth Davidson's skills/appeal to get her 13 scottish MPs from only 1 before which kept May in power in 2017.
Labour have to lose Corbyn quick.......but they wont.
Foxholer
Blackballed
Absolutely Yes!Just going slightly of topic.. I wonder where we'd be right now if Gina Miller hadn't taken the Government to Court?
For those more in the know.. Would we now be exiting with May's deal?
Her assertion - confirmed as valid by both The High Court and The Supreme Court (on appeal) simply confirmed how Article 50 could be invoked by UK - only by Parliament.
So Yes, we'd be in exactly this position!
Foxholer
Blackballed
There is so much wrong with this post that it is difficult to believe it was written mid-afternoon!
Of most concern though is the entire last paragraph. The concept that UK Parliament should be the body responsible for UK's laws and relationships was by far the main argument for leaving the EU. If that body's capability to do so is now being challenged by a self-confessed Leaver, then the entire thrust of 'Leave' is greatly diminished! The issue was blatantly obvious from the time Cameron proposed the referendum!
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SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
Im not sure that is correct. Corbyn's stormtroopers Momentum are mainly middleclass people who have never been hard up. There always have been and always will be poor people, some are victims of circumstance, some dont help themselves but creating a country where hard work and enterprise plays second fiddle to relying on others to take care of you when you are capable of doing it yourself is guaranteed to be a failure. Look after the genuine needy but always with the objective of returning them to employment where possible.
This country needed austerity to stop it going bankrupt, do you believe we can keep increasing debt or that borrowing more is the way to prosperity.
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