Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

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IanM said:
Not a paradox, it demonstrates the point that any vote against the EU will be ignored.

If 2nd Ref votes "leave," we'll have a rerun of the past 30 months of messing about a scare stories... a Remain win will be lauded as a triumph for democracy.....when in fact will usher in the end of this country as a soverign state.
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Surely if we are already in the EU then remaining in it can't usher in the 'end of this country as a sovereign state'. As that would mean we currently are one whilst being part of the EU. So why leave to become one? I'm confused by the leavers logic there. Not for the 1st time.
 
you might be right....But why are you ignoring specific comments from EU leaders? But, hopefully Tusk/Merkels call for addtional removal of powers from nat governements and EU army etc will be the tipping point for revolt....and the break up of the EU. (as a wanna be country..) The Italians response to the rejection of their national budget by some randoms in Brussels may have already started this....and former members of the Eastern Bloc are not happy over immigration.... but we only hear about the UK objecting!
 
When talking about a debate on arguably the most important decision parliament has had to make in decades, the BBC have reported that

Mr Corbyn claimed he preferred ITV's bid because the BBC plan clashed with the final of I'm A Celebrity... Get Me Out Of Here!

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to UK politics in 2018. You sure you want this lot to take back control?
 
IanM said:
you might be right....But why are you ignoring specific comments from EU leaders? But, hopefully Tusk/Merkels call for addtional removal of powers from nat governements and EU army etc will be the tipping point for revolt....and the break up of the EU. (as a wanna be country..) The Italians response to the rejection of their national budget by some randoms in Brussels may have already started this....and former members of the Eastern Bloc are not happy over immigration.... but we only hear about the UK objecting!
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I'm ignoring nothing. I'm giving it the consideration it deserves.
 
Hacker Khan said:
When talking about a debate on arguably the most important decision parliament has had to make in decades, the BBC have reported that

Mr Corbyn claimed he preferred ITV's bid because the BBC plan clashed with the final of I'm A Celebrity... Get Me Out Of Here!

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to UK politics in 2018. You sure you want this lot to take back control?
Click to expand...

Rightly or wrongly, the final of I'm a Celeb will get a massive audience, BBC at it by scheduling the debate to clash with it. Surely they can move it to another slot?
 
It's a pointless debate anyway - why would anyone watch it?

Can understand there being a televised debate prior to a general election and prior to the referendum. But there's no decision for the people to make, so why waste their time hearing the same old soundbites for the sake of it?
 
jp5 said:
It's a pointless debate anyway - why would anyone watch it?

Can understand there being a televised debate prior to a general election and prior to the referendum. But there's no decision for the people to make, so why waste their time hearing the same old soundbites for the sake of it?
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Exactly. If they were being true to their beliefs then May would be saying she wants to stay in the EU and Corbyn would argue for coming out. But because of the political omnishambles chuff knows that they will be arguing for, or what the point of it is.

Well actually I can see what May is doing as chances are she'll tie Corbyn in in knots about this as he has been so indecisive and absent from a lot of the debate. So she will end up looking relatively strong and increase her chances of MPs passing the current deal. So it will be a debate purely to try and convince MPs to back her in the vote. Though why they could not do that in the 4 or 5 days they have in Parliament to debate this I don't know. Although I have never up to yet watched minor celebrities eating kangaroo anuses, that may be the preferable option on that night...
 
IanM said:
Excellently oblique answer. Are you in favour of the Federalism they propose, dont believe it will happen or have selective hearing of issues.? :)
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I don't believe it will happen in the short or medium term. In the long term, with climate issues coming to the fore, Over-population, fuel shortages etc then I believe it's inevitable. And we'll probably welcome it.

Hope that helps.
 
Hacker Khan said:
When talking about a debate on arguably the most important decision parliament has had to make in decades, the BBC have reported that

Mr Corbyn claimed he preferred ITV's bid because the BBC plan clashed with the final of I'm A Celebrity... Get Me Out Of Here!

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to UK politics in 2018. You sure you want this lot to take back control?
Click to expand...
That is showing he is more in touch with the voters than other mp’s.. he has rightly clicked that If it is on at the same time as something like celeb then people might be watching how actually could do with learning something ... that’s nothing against celeb but if you put something on at same time as something that’s popular that’s also boring to a lot of people they won’t tune in....
 
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