Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Foxholer]

https://humanism.org.uk/2018/10/29/...ules-that-austria-can-keep-its-blasphemy-law/

Let’s get out of this madness and quickly...... Blasphemy Laws by the back door....Freedom of speech is absolutely vital in a truly free society.

Yeah, that's completely irrelevant as the UK will still remain a member of the ECHR, which is a good thing.

How many times must it be stated that

THE ECHR IS NOT PART OF THE EU.

Oh and for what it's worth, I believe it's reasonable to have (reasonable) blasphemy laws - for the same reason that there are (already) laws covering slander and libel!

Freedom of speech; certainly - but with reasonable limits!

 

[bobmac]

Oh and for what it's worth, I believe it's reasonable to have (reasonable) blasphemy laws - for the same reason that there are (already) laws covering slander and libel!

Who decides what's reasonable?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Just loving Aaron Banks...

I certainly would not buy any double glazing from him.
I think this ones a runner.

 

[Fade and Die]

How many times must it be stated that

THE ECHR IS NOT PART OF THE EU.

Oh and for what it's worth, I believe it's reasonable to have (reasonable) blasphemy laws - for the same reason that there are (already) laws covering slander and libel!

Freedom of speech; certainly - but with reasonable limits!

The ‘crime’ of blasphemy is all about the demands of religious fascists that their ideology not be subject to criticism of any kind. if the mad ruling by the ECtHR stands then it is inevitable that ‘blasphemy’ will be used as a cudgel by the most violent, the most bigoted of religious believers to silence all and any criticism of their ideology.

 

[Foxholer]

The ‘crime’ of blasphemy is all about the demands of religious fascists that their ideology not be subject to criticism of any kind. if the mad ruling by the ECtHR stands then it is inevitable that ‘blasphemy’ will be used as a cudgel by the most violent, the most bigoted of religious believers to silence all and any criticism of their ideology.

Please explain how 'defaming the prophet of Islam' - however it is done - is legitimate freedom of speech!

It seems to me that your view is almost as extreme as those you are describing! Though there is certainly a danger that laws and sentences could be used, unreasonably, in that way - as has indeed happened in some countries. That's why I stressed 'reasonable'!

Now....Back to Brexit/EU!

 

[Foxholer]

Who decides what's reasonable?

'The usual culprits'!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Taxes are to take your money off you and spend it on what someone else thinks it should be spent on. Why not keep it and spend it on things you want.

Because we are not all as fortunate as those who have more than just sufficient - and some depend upon others (through a redistributive tax system) to have even a very basic standard of living. One of the decent things about living in a democracy is that our representatives are elected to look beyond the specific needs of their own constituents - to take a wider view about what is best for UK society as a whole.

Anyway - not surprised to read that Johnson is coming out strongly against what May is reported to have agreed re a customs union. He has the ear of enough of the Leave constituency to make whatever May might have got agreed sound like the worst deal ever, a sell-out - and many of those lending him their ear will be calling Johnson to be just the person to take over from May. My Deal or No Deal might be what May tells her colleagues - reject it and No Deal will be on yuor head. Except Johnson is semi-detached from all that so might keep his.

Actually strikes me that, given the degree to which he continues to undermine the PM, Johnson should have the Tory party whip removed.

 

[Fade and Die]

Please explain how 'defaming the prophet of Islam' - however it is done - is legitimate freedom of speech!

It seems to me that your view is almost as extreme as those you are describing! Though there is certainly a danger that laws and sentences could be used, unreasonably, in that way - as has indeed happened in some countries. That's why I stressed 'reasonable'!

Now....Back to Brexit/EU!

Apologies for taking this thread off on a tangent but last point on this freedom of speech malarkey........As Raif Badawi, who has been kept in jail in Saudi Arabia since 2012 for “insulting Islam through electronic channels,” has said “freedom of expression is the air every thinker breathes.”

Anyways back to the serious stuff.... who’s looking forward to bendy bananas?😬

 

[Foxholer]

.... who’s looking forward to bendy bananas?😬

That (and cucumbers having to be straight) was another complete load of b-s pushed by sections of that great espouser of 'free speech' - the UK Press!

There is much to be criticised about that particular body's use of its significant power to shape opinion!

 

[Fade and Die]

That (and cucumbers having to be straight) was another complete load of b-s pushed by sections of that great espouser of 'free speech' - the UK Press!

There is much to be criticised about that particular body's use of its significant power to shape opinion!

And yet it WAS a directive from 1994 till 2008 when it was repealed as the EU were concerned about good food going to waste. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CONSLEG:1994R2257:20060217:EN:PDF So not quiet the BS you make out!

 

[Mudball]

Sums up this thread...

 

[Foxholer]

And yet it WAS a directive from 1994 till 2008 when it was repealed as the EU were concerned about good food going to waste. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CONSLEG:1994R2257:20060217:EN:PDF So not quiet the BS you make out!

Oh yes it was!

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/en/media/euromyths/bendybananas.html

That regulation covered ALL types of banana. Not just the A Grade ones - which was all the article chose to 'describe'!

Are you so gullible that you are taken in by such press snippets (The Sun in this case I believe) manipulating fact to further its own agenda?

Check out some facts!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromyth

https://blogs.ec.europa.eu/ECintheUK/euromyths-a-z-index/

 

[Fade and Die]

Oh yes it was!

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/en/media/euromyths/bendybananas.html

That regulation covered ALL types of banana. Not just the A Grade ones - which was all the article chose to 'describe'!

Are you so gullible that you are taken in by such press snippets (The Sun in this case I believe) manipulating fact to further its own agenda?

Check out some facts!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromyth

https://blogs.ec.europa.eu/ECintheUK/euromyths-a-z-index/

My final word on this as its getting silly and I would never try to go to war with the undisputed king of the pedants but the law itself is here https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:31994R2257:EN:HTML and contains these lines:

QUALITY STANDARDS FOR BANANAS I. DEFINITION OF PRODUCE

This standard applies to bananas of the varieties (cultivars) of Musa (AAA) spp., Cavendish and Gros Michel subgroups, referred to in Annex II, for supply fresh to the consumer after preparation and packaging. Plantains, bananas intended for industrial processing and fig bananas are not covered.
...
free from malformation or abnormal curvature of the fingers


So, the standards did indeed say that excessively bendy bananas may not be sold for human consumption, (but can be for industrial processing). So something is banned under the regulation: excessively bendy bananas being sold for direct human consumption. The problem is that this regulation had the force of law. It was, in theory, possible that someone could have been prosecuted for selling bendy (OK, too bendy) bananas for human consumption. And who in heck wants to live in a legal system that would allow that sort of nonsense?

 

[Foxholer]

My final word on this as its getting silly and I would never try to go to war with the undisputed king of the pedants but the law itself is here https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:31994R2257:EN:HTML and contains these lines:

QUALITY STANDARDS FOR BANANAS I. DEFINITION OF PRODUCE

This standard applies to bananas of the varieties (cultivars) of Musa (AAA) spp., Cavendish and Gros Michel subgroups, referred to in Annex II, for supply fresh to the consumer after preparation and packaging. Plantains, bananas intended for industrial processing and fig bananas are not covered.
...
free from malformation or abnormal curvature of the fingers


So, the standards did indeed say that excessively bendy bananas may not be sold for human consumption, (but can be for industrial processing). So something is banned under the regulation: excessively bendy bananas being sold for direct human consumption. The problem is that this regulation had the force of law. It was, in theory, possible that someone could have been prosecuted for selling bendy (OK, too bendy) bananas for human consumption. And who in heck wants to live in a legal system that would allow that sort of nonsense?

Read the links I posted!

It appears that you really ARE 'that gullible'!

 

[IanM]

See above Pie Chart.....

 

[Deleted member 18121]

I see that the decline of the Ferry business is now being blamed on brexit......now there's me thinking it had been on a road to ruin since the 1990s. Silly me, it's all brexits fault.

Do people really believe this rubbish!

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Tonights Channel 4 Brexit programme on 'What the Nation Really Thinks' seems to include guests from only England and Wales.
Only actually half of the Nations involved...…...the excluded pair being the two who voted stay .

 

[SocketRocket]

Ouch! Bit snappy tonight. I did rethink my post and edit it.

Are you expecting me to confirm something you already think?

It's interesting because I suspect that quite a few people think that Welfare is more to do with Out of Work benefits. I already said this in a previous post.

Out of interest, what prejudiced view did you expect me to have? I could hazard a guess but I'll admit if I'm wrong.

I merely asked you what you found interesting about the chart, it was a straight forward question and my motive for asking it was to find out why you found it interesting. You seem to think i have some hidden agenda for asking you but your suspicions are unfounded. Honest!

 

[bluewolf]

I merely asked you what you found interesting about the chart, it was a straight forward question and my motive for asking it was to find out why you found it interesting. You seem to think i have some hidden agenda for asking you but your suspicions are unfounded. Honest!

I accept that. I've never known you to be anything other than honest 👍

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

... or about golf...
.. remember we can’t agree where our PP should stand or weather the rake should be in or out of the bunker ...

Good point! And the answers to those two conundrums could easily change depending on the outcome of Brexit