Foxholer
Blackballed
There's only 1 word that appropriately describes the above......Twaddle!
Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!
- Thread starter drdel
- Start date
- Status
spongebob59
Journeyman Pro
A petition backed by all of the faces who had been pretending to care about holding another referendum for the sake of ‘democracy’ have been sharing a new petition entitled ‘Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.’ They’re not even bothering to pretend to be democrats any more…
The petition saw a suspicious jump in signatures last night, with blatantly fake signatures arising everywhere from Russia, to Afghanistan, to North Korea. Tens of thousands of signatures have also come from EU states including Jean Claude Juncker’s tiny Luxembourg…
ColchesterFC
Journeyman Pro
That's what I was asking. Us leaving with no deal meaning that the EU would have to look at a trade deal pronto rather than refusing to discuss it.
spongebob59
Journeyman Pro
Mudball
Assistant Pro
I dont know the details, but If i am not wrong, petitions require a UK home address to be filled out. I could be on holiday in Lux and I can fill out the form.
BTW, the petition website is now (conveniently) down for maintenance.. Did 17m people just sign up?
Foxholer
Blackballed
Checking your post, it seems I misinterpreted your question slightly.
I did, sort of, answer to what you seem to have asked though. But answering it directly....Probably not! They could, and probably still would still, likely refuse to do a trade deal until the border arrangements were agreed - even though they could happen simultaneously.
D
Deleted member 18121
Guest
I notice that the petition to revoke article 50 has received much media attention from the main outlets.....yet the petition to leave the EU without a deal did not.
I'd like to think it was just an oversight, but I'm realistic.
I'd like to think it was just an oversight, but I'm realistic.
drdel
Tour Rookie
I had to chair and international committee of 35 nations for 3 years and what has transpired is not a surprise to me but even experienced negotiators will recognise it is almost impossible to avoid.
When anybody or organisation says a 'big 'change will come in two years but we'll start open discussions NOW on how we'll change there is one certainty and that's UNCERTAINTY - right through that period and up until the two year point you will have building confusion as the various factions fight for both the limelight, public opinion and their own benefit.
Anyone who has dealt with Political programmes and/or the EU will recognise that more time simply means more game playing to fill the time. It allow everyone to blame any ideas coming from other quarters yet it never generates consensus; unfortunately it can do the reverse and expose/generate dissent. Just look at how the contributions to this thread has generated more and more heat as time has progressed.
The EU were well aware of various political factions in the UK and their own need to be seen to be tough by the r27: they simply had to divide and rule. The UK has made it easier. The UK has been behind the curve as the EU officials (not being answerable to voters) have acted out their views on social media platforms whereas the UK has sought to be more conventionally diplomatic
It would have made next to no difference who was PM; the end game was always going to come down to an acrimonious blame game because the various sides have invested too much of their time in justifying their stance in public that they cannot backtrack.
The negotiators on both sides are largely isolated from the consequences of their action it is the people in German, Spain, Italy, Greece etc who will suffer. Yet in the UK strangely enough our business community, banking and sovereign currency will allow us to adapt more quick once this farce has run its course.
It is frustrating since we can only watch from the sidelines and the with benefit of not being accountable - the PM is at the end of a sharp stick and I don't blame her for getting a bit ratty with the game players who hold her solely responsible when they themselves would have done no better. Doesn't make the deal right so we should walk.
When anybody or organisation says a 'big 'change will come in two years but we'll start open discussions NOW on how we'll change there is one certainty and that's UNCERTAINTY - right through that period and up until the two year point you will have building confusion as the various factions fight for both the limelight, public opinion and their own benefit.
Anyone who has dealt with Political programmes and/or the EU will recognise that more time simply means more game playing to fill the time. It allow everyone to blame any ideas coming from other quarters yet it never generates consensus; unfortunately it can do the reverse and expose/generate dissent. Just look at how the contributions to this thread has generated more and more heat as time has progressed.
The EU were well aware of various political factions in the UK and their own need to be seen to be tough by the r27: they simply had to divide and rule. The UK has made it easier. The UK has been behind the curve as the EU officials (not being answerable to voters) have acted out their views on social media platforms whereas the UK has sought to be more conventionally diplomatic
It would have made next to no difference who was PM; the end game was always going to come down to an acrimonious blame game because the various sides have invested too much of their time in justifying their stance in public that they cannot backtrack.
The negotiators on both sides are largely isolated from the consequences of their action it is the people in German, Spain, Italy, Greece etc who will suffer. Yet in the UK strangely enough our business community, banking and sovereign currency will allow us to adapt more quick once this farce has run its course.
It is frustrating since we can only watch from the sidelines and the with benefit of not being accountable - the PM is at the end of a sharp stick and I don't blame her for getting a bit ratty with the game players who hold her solely responsible when they themselves would have done no better. Doesn't make the deal right so we should walk.
Some very interesting comments from the Leader of Plaid Cymru, Vince Cable of the LibDems and their deputy Leader. Corbyn should be ashamed of his behaviour, and isn't fit to lead a donkey to water let alone be leader of the opposition.
Whether you like their politics or not, the only leaders who have shown any level of consistency in the last 2 years are Nicola Sturgeon and Vince Cable. May's behind the scenes manoeuvring with Olly Robbins and Corbyn's anything but the Tories political stance at a time when consensus is needed is disgraceful.
May has met with Sturgeon on several occasions, and she has met the leaders of Sinn Fein and the DUP, and she's met with Plaid Cymru and the LibDems ALL BEFORE her deal was brought before parliament.
May invited Corbyn to a meeting last year to discuss Brexit. He finally agreed to a meeting at the end of November, after being badgered by his own party, but didn't meet till the end of January. He uses PMQ's to consistently tell the UK May won't meet but when you dig behind the scenes you soon find out who has offered to meet and who has consistently said no.
drdel
Tour Rookie
Yup, and because of the infighting there's (IMO) a grave danger he could become PM by accident/default - then we really would be in the s***. Can you imagine JC in discussion with Merkel, Macron, Juncker let alone other world leaders - Trump, the PM of India, China etc. Any embarrassment we have as the UK people and pain businesses might worry about arising from Brexit would be like comparing an ankle sprain and a broken leg.
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
Deflection!More deflection and again only aimed at one person.
Change the record!
D
Deleted member 16999
Guest
I’ve no doubt you guys have more experience on this than me, I still don’t get why everytime there’s an issue over the present Government and their performance we get Corbyn brought in to it and use him as the bogeyman.
I’m not a Corbyn supporter, I just see him as an easy excuse for people to hide or deflect from TM and her majority (whichever way it came about).
I dread JC becoming PM, but if he is elected then surely we’ll get the same people on here saying democracy has spoken and we should accept it.
D
Deleted member 16999
Guest
spongebob59
Journeyman Pro
Why is he out there ?
drdel
Tour Rookie
Statesmanship !!!!
Crazyface
Tour Winner
Crazyface
Tour Winner
I had a head of steam built up and couldn't stop.
Based on the comments from all of the above, except Sinn Fein as I have no idea their views and as they don't vote they don't matter, over this period she may well have met all of these people but she has not listened or altered her view on any issue. A little like yesterday it is more like she briefs them, she certainly does not listen and take notice.
Mudball
Assistant Pro
The petition now over 850K+.. not that i am tracking.. More interesting was the spread of the petitioners -
SocketRocket
Ryder Cup Winner
How do you know she doesn't listen?
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