95% Calculation to go?

[Crazyface]

Oooo me 'ed hurts, and I've only skim read the first page.

 

[chrisd]

My comment was about you assuming that 40% of one and 60% of the other equals 50% of combined.


What calculations did you do in these sort of comps before the WHS (not a lot has changed in that respect).

I wasnt assuming that it equals 50% but I believe in our match this week it did (someone else did the sums). I rarely played greensomes under the old system. It's a fair bit more complicated to work out shots , if it wasn't they wouldn't have great big boards to help !

 

[wjemather]

I wasnt assuming that it equals 50% but I believe in our match this week it did (someone else did the sums). I rarely played greensomes under the old system. It's a fair bit more complicated to work out shots , if it wasn't they wouldn't have great big boards to help !

For info, the CONGU recommended allowance for Greensomes was 60/40 under the old system, but since it wasn't mandatory many clubs chose to use 50/50 instead.

 

[jim8flog]

I wasnt assuming that it equals 50% but I believe in our match this week it did (someone else did the sums). I rarely played greensomes under the old system. It's a fair bit more complicated to work out shots , if it wasn't they wouldn't have great big boards to help !

The difference in the old days was instead of big boards on the outside of club we had charts either on the back of cards or on notice boards
like this

 

[chrisd]

The difference in the old days was instead of big boards on the outside of club we had charts either on the back of cards or on notice boards
like this
View attachment 40742

You may have done at your club, I dont remember seeing one (or needing one)

I'm not sure how difficult it is to understand members moaning that the new system is more complex than before . Instead of your handicap you have a handicap index, slope rating and playing handicap as well as a change in most of the allowances for different forms of competition to sort out. It might be better , or fairer, under the new system but I hear people moaning about it a year on and they weren't moaning under the old system.

 

[rulefan]

The difference in the old days was instead of big boards on the outside of club we had charts either on the back of cards or on notice boards
like this
View attachment 40742

There is no reason why a similar chart couldn't be developed for WHS. The starting points for both would be CONGU Handicap and WHS Course Handicap. No real difference.

 

[Swango1980]

You may have done at your club, I dont remember seeing one (or needing one)

I'm not sure how difficult it is to understand members moaning that the new system is more complex than before . Instead of your handicap you have a handicap index, slope rating and playing handicap as well as a change in most of the allowances for different forms of competition to sort out. It might be better , or fairer, under the new system but I hear people moaning about it a year on and they weren't moaning under the old system.

I think the wording of your post highlights this. Technically, you should replace "playing" handicap to "course" handicap. Then, all the different allowances are applied to get the Playing Handicap.

I'm sure you know what they all are. But, I agree with you, that many regular golfers are completely oblivious to the difference between course and playing handicap, let alone what percentage to apply to get playing handicap, or why this is done. The super ignorant don't understand why they cannot just play off their index.

I understand the reasons for all the components of WHS, but many many golfers do not. And, there are ways in which it could have been so much better implemented to avoid so much of the confusion. Yes, the WHS purists may argue that building the 95% allowance into the course handicap would be unfair to higher handicappers. However, in practice, I doubt this would be any issue whatsoever, not when we are talking about a player playing off 29 instead off 30 for example. In fact, virtually all high handicappers I have ever known are desperate to have a lower handicap anyway.

 

[Foxholer]

You may have done at your club, I dont remember seeing one (or needing one)

I'm not sure how difficult it is to understand members moaning that the new system is more complex than before . Instead of your handicap you have a handicap index, slope rating and playing handicap as well as a change in most of the allowances for different forms of competition to sort out. It might be better , or fairer, under the new system but I hear people moaning about it a year on and they weren't moaning under the old system.

Well, the term 'Whingeing Pom' sprang immediately to mind - again!
That said, it should be simple to create a chart/charts and site it/them near the Slope Index-to-CH ones, for the various courses and formats. In fact, it's something EG or SG should already have a blank for - as it's 'course independent'.

Note: Rulefan posted similar (though I'd challenge 'Congu') while I was still composing mine.

 

[Foxholer]

There is no reason why a similar chart couldn't be developed for WHS. The starting points for both would be CONGU Handicap and WHS Course Handicap. No real difference.

Why Congu Handicap? That's been defunct for over a year! WHS Handicap Index is the 'base' stat now.

 

[rulefan]

Why Congu Handicap? That's been defunct for over a year! WHS Handicap Index is the 'base' stat now.

I was referring to the picture of the chart posted as opposed to the chart I was proposing. The former is a CONGU chart so it is based on the CONGU handicap.

 

[wjemather]

You may have done at your club, I dont remember seeing one (or needing one)

I'm not sure how difficult it is to understand members moaning that the new system is more complex than before . Instead of your handicap you have a handicap index, slope rating and playing handicap as well as a change in most of the allowances for different forms of competition to sort out. It might be better , or fairer, under the new system but I hear people moaning about it a year on and they weren't moaning under the old system.

Those charts were everywhere until they started to disappear through the 1980s.

From a playing perspective only, it really isn't any more complex to lookup your Course Handicap on a chart/board/app than it is to round to the nearest integer. Anyone moaning about complexity is trying to do manual calculations that they have absolutely no need to be doing.

 

[jim8flog]

There is no reason why a similar chart couldn't be developed for WHS. The starting points for both would be CONGU Handicap and WHS Course Handicap. No real difference.

The major difference is that back in the day the charts had to cover only a relatively small (compared to current) number of handicaps. These days the charts would be too big for the back of the card or the printing so small that players my age would need a magnifying glass to read them.

However it would be relatively easy for a player to produce their own within say a range of 5 shots either side of their H.I.

 

[nickjdavis]

A local club to me has such calculation tables posted on its wall by the Slope tables....I did post a picture here of them last summer.

 

[Foxholer]

Those charts were everywhere until they started to disappear through the 1980s.

From a playing perspective only, it really isn't any more complex to lookup your Course Handicap on a chart/board/app than it is to round to the nearest integer. Anyone moaning about complexity is trying to do manual calculations that they have absolutely no need to be doing.

Surely, those charts already exist either on a noticeboard or near the 1st Tee. The latter was how it was at the couple of clubs I played at when I went back home (to NZ) many years ago. The score-entry computer was on the way to Bar, so normally pretty difficult to miss.

 

[Banchory Buddha]

The difference in the old days was instead of big boards on the outside of club we had charts either on the back of cards or on notice boards
like this
View attachment 40742

Indeed, but then the system was very much simplified in my mind maybe 30 years ago?

Now we're back to needing a computer again, that's not progress

 

[BiMGuy]

How many people are having to work out their handicaps and allowances every single time they play? And why are they waiting till they are standing on the first tee to start working it all out?

Once again it smells like people looking for things to be grumpy and complain about.

 

[Swango1980]

How many people are having to work out their handicaps and allowances every single time they play? And why are they waiting till they are standing on the first tee to start working it all out?

Once again it smells like people looking for things to be grumpy and complain about.

So? That is what many people are like. The evidence is in these forums, on social media or even in real life. People complain when things are less than perfect. WHS gives them another topic to moan about, about issues that were never really issues before WHS. About issues that could have been mitigated within WHS.

 

[rulie]

People complain when things are less than what they consider perfect.

Fixed it for you!

 

[IanM]

People complain when things are less than what they consider perfect.

Fixed it for you!

Not quite

 

[backwoodsman]

Complicated??

The relationship between HI and CH is easy. You know your HI (or damn well should do) Then you just look at the effing great chart on the wall to find your CH. What's simpler??? To find your PH you just know what format you're playing and do some bl**dy easy "sums" (or look in another table (there's plenty of tgem) if you lack the mental acuity). Wheres the complication in that?. If you cant be arsed or can't manage, then its your fault and there's no reason to moan.

Whether the actual final numbers are right/wrong/from fairyland is a totally different argument - and one that most golfers don't (I suggest) give a toss about. Just play off the given number.

Sorry, rant over...