3ball competing in a 4ball format

[backwoodsman]

Let's say a roll-up is normally played as a 4ball format - with the team prize being played as best 3 of 4 scores to count. But as it's a roll-up, inevitably there will occasionally be an odd three ball or two because of the numbers who turn up. What's the fairest way of getting a total score from the three balls so that they can compete equably with the "3 from 4" scores of the 4 balls?

(I think this has been discussed before, but I can't find it - so a link would do if that's easier?)

 

[duncan mackie]

Only way that is vaguely 'fair's is to include a ghost player.

Randomly establish the player and ensure he marks his scores for every hole (in his game it might not count!) then score him back into the team of 3 to get their team of 4 score.

 

[rulefan]

We use the second best score of the three as the missing player's score.
It's worked well for the last 10 years after many years of experimenting previously.

 

[jim8flog]

.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

We have on an open(2 from 4) but we were a 3 ball as a player dropped out, we still took 2 scores from the 3 players(no other scores were allowed)

 

[patricks148]

we have this quite regularly in our roll ups. 4 balls usually play 3/4 and the 3 get full allowance. one of the guys who lives in Spain over winter put forward an alternative they us at his club in spain, but i don't think it made that much difference

 

[backwoodsman]

Thanks.

Duncan, rulefan & Patrick - I'm guessing no-one really bothers to keep track (?) but have you noticed whether the three balls win, or don't win, more frequently than the 4balls?

 

[patricks148]

Thanks.

Duncan, rulefan & Patrick - I'm guessing no-one really bothers to keep track (?) but have you noticed whether the three balls win, or don't win, more frequently than the 4balls?

more frequently the 4 balls still, but 3 balls occasionally

 

[duncan mackie]

Thanks.

Duncan, rulefan & Patrick - I'm guessing no-one really bothers to keep track (?) but have you noticed whether the three balls win, or don't win, more frequently than the 4balls?

Depends on the performance of not only the ghost but the other players in the team and the performance of the other teams! It's not the same as using a multiplier or other arithmetic adjustment which may introduce bias (and more importantly will always be accused of doing so one way or another!)

Rulefan's approach is simple to implement, but flawed in the limitation ie the second best player in that group's score rules out a better player completely!
Randomly drawing the ghost (which could include any of the 3 in the group or not as you decide) is more like drawing the team in the first place.

 

[rulefan]

Thanks.

Duncan, rulefan & Patrick - I'm guessing no-one really bothers to keep track (?) but have you noticed whether the three balls win, or don't win, more frequently than the 4balls?

Yes we have done quite a bit analysis. The 3 balls win in proportion to the number of 3 ball entries. That's why we settled on it.

 

[Crazyface]

At my last place (and only for scrambles) the "ghost" player was off 14 and the other three had to get an extra drive in (5).

 

[GB72]

Had 2 methods used. The simplest, and probably not exactly the fairest, is that you have an imaginary 4th member who is given 2 points on every hole. Simple but not exactly fair or accurate.

The other option used is that all scores are recorded and the group who are short pick a card from another team at random and pick golfer A,B,C or D and use their score for the fourth team member. Fairer but means all scored need recording.

Have also had the format change to 2 out of 4 counting where the groups play of 3/4 allowance but the 3 ball play off full handicap.

 

[backwoodsman]

Ta all - food for thought. (Occasioned by the fact that our roll-up may have to change to 4ball being the norm rather than 3ball - in which situation, the occasional 4ball is solved by one player dropping (by choice or by lot) from the team comp, getting a £ back, and being only in the individual comp.)

 

[rulefan]

We use the same (2nd best in a 3 to count again) whether there are predominately 3s or 4s.

If you are interested we have an 'official' membership of 80 and about 20 who may 'drop in'. Typically between 20 and 40 play on Monday, Wed and/or Fri (the club allocate 10 tee times to us). We put £3 in the pot and prizes are distributed depending on field size. £12 per person max. At the end of the month total winning or losses are totted up and for every £6 won a shot is taken off your (fiddle/rollup) handicap. For every £6 loss you get a shot back. You start the year on your official handicap. I don't think anyone has won or lost £75 in a year.

 

[Robin Hood]

We have agonised over this too.
We play 2 scores to count - full handicaps.
If there is a 3 ball they add 5 points on to their final score.
It seems to work.

 

[rulefan]

Our winning score range from 95 to 120+. Lowest from 70 to 90. I don't think our guys would settle for 5 bonus