2021 Professional Golf Thread

[howbow88]

NLU's podcast went in hard on him, but I agreed with a lot of what they said. Particularly on how when things might look dodgy rules wise, you give players the benefit of the doubt if they deserve it.

Rory for example, has previous for sticking to the rules and even going above and beyond in realms of 'fairness' https://www.google.com/amp/s/golf.c...roy-2020-pga-championship-rules-incident/amp/

Reed is the absolute opposite. Much like a thief that is caught hovering around the cookie jar... Maybe he didn't do anything wrong, but with his previous record he is not entitled to any benefit of the doubt.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

I'm not entirely convinced by rory either. There isnt the same amount of video available on how he conducted himself.

He seemed fairly convinced it was an embedded ball. Called it as such. Reed needed a refs opinion.

Rory's playing partners really should be made to protect the field to confirm what he says.

The rules are silly and open to abuse.

Maybe both balls did break the ground on the 2nd bounce. I'm not so sure.

That's my point.

Reed sought a referee's opinion whereas Rory just took it upon himself to unilaterally decide.

As for the rule I agree that it is unsatisfactory.

A simple answer, and I realise that it would never be introduced, would be to do away with "Free Relief".

If you need to pick and drop it costs a shot, regardless of circumstances.

Some might claim that would be unfair but if everyone plays to the same rules then it evens up. Would also speed up play as referees would not be called upon so often.

 

[Imurg]

That's my point.

Reed sought a referee's opinion whereas Rory just took it upon himself to unilaterally decide..

Rory sought a 2nd opinion. He said to those he was playing with that his ball was plugged.
Because, rightly or wrongly, Rory has the respect of his fellow professionals and they felt no need to confirm his judgement.
Reed, it seems, didn't have that luxury and had to call in a referee.
One wonders why Reed doesn't have that luxury.....
The journo John Huggan has summed it up for me..Reed is a Great player but he'll never be a Great Golfer.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Rory sought a 2nd opinion. He said to those he was playing with that his ball was plugged.
Because, rightly or wrongly, Rory has the respect of his fellow professionals and they felt no need to confirm his judgement.
Reed, it seems, didn't have that luxury and had to call in a referee.
One wonders why Reed doesn't have that luxury.....
The journo John Huggan has summed it up for me..Reed is a Great player but he'll never be a Great Golfer.

That’s not really looking for a second opinion though - he said his ball is embedded and was taking a drop , the second opinion he asked for was what drop could he have ? A club length or line of sight ( strange he didn’t know )

Reed sought the second opinion of a fully qualified rules official

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Rory most certainly didn't seek a second opinion.

He announced what he was doing to only one of his PP's, Sabbatini.

 

[patricks148]

Rory sought a 2nd opinion. He said to those he was playing with that his ball was plugged.
Because, rightly or wrongly, Rory has the respect of his fellow professionals and they felt no need to confirm his judgement.
Reed, it seems, didn't have that luxury and had to call in a referee.
One wonders why Reed doesn't have that luxury.....
The journo John Huggan has summed it up for me..Reed is a Great player but he'll never be a Great Golfer.

wasn't Rory told by Sabbatini what to do as he had taken a sim drop earlier in the round as had their other PP

 

[Imurg]

That’s not really looking for a second opinion though - he said his ball is embedded and was taking a drop , the second opinion he asked for was what drop could he have ? A club length or line of sight ( strange he didn’t know )

Reed sought the second opinion of a fully qualified rules official

What I'm say is that Rory announced that he thought his ball was plugged - that is an open invitation for anyone to come over and verify it.
None of the other players felt the need to come over and confirm it. Why?
Because they didn't feel that Rory was trying to pull a fast one.
Reed felt he needed the opinion of a referee to confirm and my feeling is that its because he was trying to pull a fast one and his playing partners would have known that.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

What I'm say is that Rory announced that he thought his ball was plugged - that is an open invitation for anyone to come over and verify it.
None of the other players felt the need to come over and confirm it. Why?
Because they didn't feel that Rory was trying to pull a fast one.
Reed felt he needed the opinion of a referee to confirm and my feeling is that its because he was trying to pull a fast one and his playing partners would have known that.

What?

The players would have known but the referee wouldn't? That's pretty convoluted reasoning.

And as for Rory's " invitation" to his PP's, well they would have had to be pretty damp quick as he was already picking up his ball by the time he said anything.

 

[fundy]

That’s not really looking for a second opinion though - he said his ball is embedded and was taking a drop , the second opinion he asked for was what drop could he have ? A club length or line of sight ( strange he didn’t know )

Reed sought the second opinion of a fully qualified rules official

not until hed already moved the ball from its massive embedded pitchmark though

 

[Whereditgo]

Looking at the feeds it does seem very unlikely that either ball would have plugged even considering that these guys consider the ball to be 'plugged' if the ball has broken the surface even slightly.

Several things that raise my eyebrows though with the Reed incident; he held the ball in his the palm of his hand for a significant amount of time (that's allowed, but not advisable), the rough was at least 2 - 3 inches deep!, the amount of poking and prodding he proceeded to do before the official arrived, he knew he would have a significantly improved lie with a drop (Rory was dropping into the same rough that his ball had come to rest in). My opinion is that he knew exactly what he was doing.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

not until hed already moved the ball from its massive embedded pitchmark though

Just like Mcilroy.

 

[upsidedown]

Here's the full feed.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1355659901897486341

Apologies if its been mentioned before but watching this clip when he puts the driver down to measure his club length the grip is nearer the hole than the tee peg where the ball "embedded" and then when he drops the ball it appears to come to rest in front of the tee peg nearest the path (probably where it would have been anyway if he had measured from the "embedded" ball) Not a good look

 

[Crow]

Apologies if its been mentioned before but watching this clip when he puts the driver down to measure his club length the grip is nearer the hole than the tee peg where the ball "embedded" and then when he drops the ball it appears to come to rest in front of the tee peg nearest the path (probably where it would have been anyway if he had measured from the "embedded" ball) Not a good look

The hole isn't at right angles to the path, and there's a rules official practically breathing down his neck for the whole dropping procedure. When dropped Reed then asks the official if it's okay, the official goes behind the ball and checks to see if it's closer to the hole, we can only assume not as he then tells Reed to proceed.
Why is that not a good look?

 

[upsidedown]

The hole isn't at right angles to the path, and there's a rules official practically breathing down his neck for the whole dropping procedure. When dropped Reed then asks the official if it's okay, the official goes behind the ball and checks to see if it's closer to the hole, we can only assume not as he then tells Reed to proceed.
Why is that not a good look?

From the camera angle the hole is behind the camera so to speak and the grip of the club is nearer the camera than the tee peg marking, surely the grip should be next to tee peg not about 9 to 12 inches away from it and to me appears to be nearer the hole?

 

[Whereditgo]

It doesn't matter that the ball comes to rest nearer the hole than the tee peg marking the club length, as long as it is not nearer the hole than the reference point.

 

[upsidedown]

have had another look on my laptop now rather than my phone . He only marks the relief area by the driver head and then when he and the ref look at the dropped ball they use the tee peg he marked the ball with ( reference point?) and the one by the driver head . Ball bounced away from the latter and when he picks up tee from RP it looks nearer the hole ?

 

[Steve Wilkes]

The tee-peg marking out the drop is only 1 club distance from the original position, it's doesn't have to be placed at an exact 'straight line no nearer the hole' only the place where the ball hits the ground on dropping and where is comes to rest can't be nearer the hole than the original position (There is a few more regulations )

 

[upsidedown]

It doesn't matter that the ball comes to rest nearer the hole than the tee peg marking the club length, as long as it is not nearer the hole than the reference point.

Just for clarification
"When a ball is embedded in the general area, free relief may be taken. The reference point for taking relief is the spot right behind where the ball is embedded. A ball must be dropped in and come to rest in the relief area. The relief area is one club-length from the reference point, is not nearer to the hole than the reference point and must be in the general area. "
If it came to rest nearer the hole than the tee peg marking the club length doesn't it mean it has come to rest outside of the relief area ?

 

[Steve Wilkes]

Just for clarification
"When a ball is embedded in the general area, free relief may be taken. The reference point for taking relief is the spot right behind where the ball is embedded. A ball must be dropped in and come to rest in the relief area. The relief area is one club-length from the reference point, is not nearer to the hole than the reference point and must be in the general area. "
If it came to rest nearer the hole than the tee peg marking the club length doesn't it mean it has come to rest outside of the relief area ?

So if you mark your 1 club length away from the hole, and you drop in that area, do you think you have to re-drop if the ball comes to rest nearer the hole than than tee-peg

 

[upsidedown]

So if you mark your 1 club length away from the hole, and you drop in that area, do you think you have to re-drop if the ball comes to rest nearer the hole than than tee-peg

By my understanding of the rules , yes I would re drop as it's outside of the measured relief area.
https://www.randa.org/Rog/2019/Rule...rence point for taking,be in the general area.