World Handicap System (WHS)

[Swango1980]

My club is using cards signed by the marker only, but also asking everyone to input scores onto HDID via their own phone or computer. Obviously all cards have to be manually entered onto the computer by committee, which I'm sure is not a quick job. So entering your own score saves a bit of time, but has not yet been made compulsory.

I personally think this will do away with the terminal, or at least give people the option of entering the score on their own device post Covid.

Also feel with a bit of willing, we could do away with scorecards and just use electronic entry. Clearly people may choose to keep their score on a card, but if the rules were changed to allow cards to not be compulsory - there would be a huge cumulative saving over millions of rounds of golf played each year.

I like the HDID score entry. However, it was better initially when the default score on each hole was zero, and you had to then change it to the correct score. For some reason, the default on each hole is now Par. When going from one hole to the next, it is so easy to flick through a hole score, forgetting to change the default from par and moving on. Sadly, not everyone is careful in checking their final score, and even if it doesn't tie up with what they thought, they just assume the computer is correct. So, I wonder how many will have at least one par score on their entry that should have been bogey or worse, and never realise. It is not like the marker can check they have done it correctly, unless they happen to look at the final results, remember their fellow competitors score and raise it with committee.

Physical scorecards, at the least, allow the competition secretary to check the leading scores against what players have entered on HDID (Players need to send a photo of their card after entry). Otherwise, I'd imagine checking would be next to impossible, and you'd have to trust players were able to enter their scores into the system correctly 100% of the time.

 

[rulefan]

But (unless I am interpreting 6.1b wrongly) this is at odds with what rule 6.1b says... (don't get me wrong....I really want what you say to be correct!!!!)....

My information is straight from the top. It will be published shortly I am told.

 

[nickjdavis]

My information is straight from the top. It will be published shortly I am told.

Good....maybe they need to publish version 2 of the rulebook before November 2nd!!!!

 

[IanMcC]

But (unless I am interpreting 6.1b wrongly) this is at odds with what rule 6.1b says... (don't get me wrong....I really want what you say to be correct!!!!)....

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Can I ask, is this taken from the UK&I version of the Rules Of Handicapping Manual? If so, where do you download a copy? I thought it would come with the WHS toolkit, but sadly it didnt. I only have the draft version of the USGA version, which will obviously have some differences. Is it because my club comes under Wales Golf, rather than England Golf, that we dont have either a hard or downloadable copy yet?

 

[jim8flog]

The bit in bold is not true. If, before your round, your oldest round (20th) was in your top 8, then if you go out and shoot a rubbish round then you lose that good round, handicap will go up. It could go up quite a lot if the round you lose was an extremely good round, and the one replacing it (your 8th best which was previously outside your best 8) was a lot worse.

Probably should have said nothing major would have changed.

Having kept track of my own for a few months now I have lost a couple of good scores but the really bad ones that came in as part of the 20 have not affected/ formed part of the 8. I lost an 7 and an 8 replaced by a 11 and 12 which means a change of just one stroke to H.I.

 

[nickjdavis]

Can I ask, is this taken from the UK&I version of the Rules Of Handicapping Manual? If so, where do you download a copy? I thought it would come with the WHS toolkit, but sadly it didnt. I only have the draft version of the USGA version, which will obviously have some differences. Is it because my club comes under Wales Golf, rather than England Golf, that we dont have either a hard or downloadable copy yet?

Yes it is.... https://www.englandgolf.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/England-Golf-Rules-of-Handicapping.pdf

 

[jim8flog]

For any round to count toward your handicap record, I think the idea is that players register on a computer system before the round, and this will provide the playing handicap.
.

Sounds very good in theory but where I play players are going out to play before the facilities are open.

 

[Swango1980]

Yes it is.... https://www.englandgolf.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/England-Golf-Rules-of-Handicapping.pdf

I assume this is just a general document for the world, and England Golf will submit one for their own interpretations of it?

One thing I couldn't find (albeit maybe I just missed it) was submitting Supplementary Scores (or whatever they'll be called under WHS), and that they must be pre-registered. I was looking for that particular subject, as I was interested to find out if the Manual would say these scores must be deleted if the Player didn't pre-register.

 

[rulefan]

Can I ask, is this taken from the UK&I version of the Rules Of Handicapping Manual? If so, where do you download a copy? I thought it would come with the WHS toolkit, but sadly it didnt. I only have the draft version of the USGA version, which will obviously have some differences. Is it because my club comes under Wales Golf, rather than England Golf, that we dont have either a hard or downloadable copy yet?

This version was distributed by England Golf so Welsh clubs will not have been on that distribution list. There is no mention of England Golf in the document itself so I assume it is for all CONGU authorities (ie GB&I). I don't know what other CONGU licensees (eg Kenya) will be doing.

 

[rulefan]

Good....maybe they need to publish version 2 of the rulebook before November 2nd!!!!

That is almost certain.

 

[rulefan]

Sounds very good in theory but where I play players are going out to play before the facilities are open.

They will be able to do it on a phone app.

 

[rulefan]

I assume this is just a general document for the world, and England Golf will submit one for their own interpretations of it?

One thing I couldn't find (albeit maybe I just missed it) was submitting Supplementary Scores (or whatever they'll be called under WHS), and that they must be pre-registered. I was looking for that particular subject, as I was interested to find out if the Manual would say these scores must be deleted if the Player didn't pre-register.

See Rule 2.1a(iii) Registering Intent to Submit a Score in General Play
and
Rule 2.1 Acceptability of Scores

 

[jim8flog]

They will be able to do it on a phone app.

ho ho ho

The majority of the early starters in a seniors comp probably do not have a smart phone let alone the APP.
We already know there are some that do not own a home computer of any sort with complaints about booking into get a tee time.
Last weekend comp only 30 members out of over 100 entered their scores via the app.

 

[rulefan]

too true

 

[IanM]

I think the variety of comment demonstrates that the current state of understanding, quality of materials and the comms mechanisms used are way short of the requirement.

 

[nickjdavis]

My information is straight from the top. It will be published shortly I am told.

I also now have this information from the very top.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Having read all this lot, and thinking how often computers go down, I think some poor officials are going to have some frustrating times ahead of them.
Why they couldn't have left the system alone, I don't know.
It really is just a pastime for most.

 

[Swango1980]

Having read all this lot, and thinking how often computers go down, I think some poor officials are going to have some frustrating times ahead of them.
Why they couldn't have left the system alone, I don't know.
It really is just a pastime for most.

It's a bit better for people that like to play golf in different countries competitively.

 

[Ethan]

When it is up and running, it will be helpful to be aware which of your scores is about to expire and what will replace them. If the score about to expire is one of the 20 but not one of the 8, your handicap will not change unless you improve the 8 best scores. If it is one of the 8, you will know that if it is one of the better scores near the top of the list, or one of the bottom scores, and roughly what you need to do to keep your handicap unchanged or to improve it.

So say I know that my best 8 scores are 77-88, handicap 10. My 9th best score is a 90.

If the score about to expire is outside the 8, then I know that scoring something better than an 88 improves my handicap proportionally. A 70-something really improves it, a 87, fractionally. The 90 won't be coming in today.

If the score about to expire is the 77, within the 8, then I need another 77 to keep the handicap the same. Anything worse will cause a proportional increase. If I know that the 9th best score is a 90, then if I don't beat that score, that 90 jumps into the top 8, and the handicap rises by over 1.5 (13/8).

On the other hand, if the score about to expire is the 88, within the 8, then worst case it will be replaced by a 90. Anything better than the 88 improves the handicap, and really good score improves it a lot.

 

[2blue]

Having read all this lot, and thinking how often computers go down, I think some poor officials are going to have some frustrating times ahead of them.
Why they couldn't have left the system alone, I don't know.
It really is just a pastime for most.

I see it as a move toward fairness.
Off the Whites (slope 124) at my Club there is only 1 hole which I can't reach in regulation. However, with the same H/cap, I play matches against players who have earned their H/cap on a course (Slope 142) where I can't reach on at least 3 or 4 of their holes.