Universal Credit

[Old Skier]

Always goes back to 'get a job in a supermarket - there are thousands of them'...and '...they should think themselves fortunate' - blah blah blah. Except that's nothing to do with what I posted about.

Recall - it's OK to have up to £16,000 in savings to still qualify for UC - and up to £6,000 with it having no impact whatsoever. Yet if you have NO savings and are on UC you can't have any delayed income - of any amount no matter how little - without it impacting your UC...that's just tough - that's OK...how it is. That being the case shouldn't then those fortunate enough to have savings have to use these savings before expecting the state to help them out. After all for a couple, £6000, is about 6months UC. Plenty of time to get a job - in a supermarket perhaps - so they don't use up too much of their savings. That's what I posted about.

You see - the system works better for those who have some money than it does for those have don't have any.

All of your post suggest your son is only willing to work in one area which he appears to have had no ability to run it on a self employed business basis looking at your posts over the last couple of years. You have never mentioned what the girlfriends employment was so people can only assume her employment status was not very successful.

He, and possilly you, give the distinct impression that you cannot accept that it’s easier to become employed when your in employment even if it’s a job in a supermarket.

 

[Hobbit]

Always goes back to 'get a job in a supermarket - there are thousands of them'...and '...they should think themselves fortunate' - blah blah blah. Except that's nothing to do with what I posted about.

Recall - it's OK to have up to £16,000 in savings to still qualify for UC - and up to £6,000 with it having no impact whatsoever. Yet if you have NO savings and are on UC you can't have any delayed income - of any amount no matter how little - without it impacting your UC...that's just tough - that's OK...how it is. That being the case shouldn't then those fortunate enough to have savings have to use these savings before expecting the state to help them out. After all for a couple, £6000, is about 6months UC. Plenty of time to get a job - in a supermarket perhaps - so they don't use up too much of their savings. That's what I posted about.

You see - the system works better for those who have some money than it does for those have don't have any.

You know the difference between savings and an income, and it has been explained time and again, and again, and again. If it had been in your son's bank at the time he applied for UC it would have been a saving, as you well know. As he will be receiving it soon, or has recently received it, it is deemed an income. END OFF!

The linesman has said offside, its offside. How much of your life are you going to waste arguing its onside?

 

[Foxholer]

...
You see - the system works better for those who have some money than it does for those have don't have any.

That's correct!

And some of the rules need, imo, some tweaking to be 'fairer'.

Everything else in this thread is just noise

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Surely the bottom line would be to get a job and some regular income coming in. Surely even working in a supermarket, cleaning job etc will pay more per week than UC and with a guaranteed salary coming in weekly/monthly it is far easier to budget for food, rent etc and potentially squirrel a tiny amount away each pay day to begin to build a comfort blanket. It is clear the preferred industry will be in a mess for time to come and so a period of time doing anything that pays has to be the way forward. Too simple?

 

[Foxholer]

Surely the bottom line would be to get a job and some regular income coming in. Surely even working in a supermarket, cleaning job etc will pay more per week than UC and with a guaranteed salary coming in weekly/monthly it is far easier to budget for food, rent etc and potentially squirrel a tiny amount away each pay day to begin to build a comfort blanket. It is clear the preferred industry will be in a mess for time to come and so a period of time doing anything that pays has to be the way forward. Too simple?

Is that what your wife is contemplating?

 

[Blue in Munich]

Is that what your wife is contemplating?

Does she have to if the other bread winner in the family can provide; I believe there was only one bread winner in the OP's son's household?

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Is that what your wife is contemplating?

She was but things have taken a very peculiar twist regarding her role at the school and it looks as though she is going to be doing something different (and involving cleaning/houskeeping) but is a role that would keep her in a place she loves working out but also a £5k pay cut and change to term time. Negotiations are still going on and it is a million miles from HR but given a choice between a cleaning role, pay cut but keeping a role in these times it's a no brainer. We're waiting on final salary details including the pro-rata effect of term time to see if it's viable as like most we still have bills to pay and need to put food on the table. If not she's already looking at roles for Waitrose (they have a massive presence in Bracknell as their main distribution centre so shelf picking, cleaning) and what supermarket roles are out there locally

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Maybe your son should have had some savings then.
Being self employed was his choice after all, no one forced him in to it and with it comes the drawbacks like payments being made late or on terms past invoice.

If he'd had a simple PAYE job then it's unlikely his pay would be late and none of this would matter.

You are joking...savings...you do know that a huge number of people don't have £100 to their name at the end of every month. This may be from 2016 but I doubt things are much different today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37504449

And yes - the self-employed expect some uncertainly about when money is received. My point is that in the circumstances of the lockdown and so many having to claim UC - the UC system might have been relexed to recognise the issue of the self-employed and the timing of their last income. Maybe considered it as savings...

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Surely even £5 a week (cost of a pint around here) is manageable to save for 99% of households. I think it comes down to a lack of intent and people being able to get easy credit and so too many are spend, spend, spend even on credit and then worry about paying it off somewhere over the rainbow. It is something we have been guilty of as well running up not insignificant credit card bills and then I got made redundant so it does become a battle. These days, if I can't afford it now I have to save until I can

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Surely the bottom line would be to get a job and some regular income coming in. Surely even working in a supermarket, cleaning job etc will pay more per week than UC and with a guaranteed salary coming in weekly/monthly it is far easier to budget for food, rent etc and potentially squirrel a tiny amount away each pay day to begin to build a comfort blanket. It is clear the preferred industry will be in a mess for time to come and so a period of time doing anything that pays has to be the way forward. Too simple?

My point is not about the level of UC. It is not about the looking for work, or indeed the support that those on UC get in identifying training and opportunities. It's not about any of these - or indeed anything to do with UC in normal times. It's simply about the final income payment for work prior to registering for UC as an individual's job goes down the plughole - especially in the cliff-edge circumstances of the lockdown. That's all.

 

[chellie]

You are joking...savings...you do know that a huge number of people don't have £100 to their name at the end of every month. This may be from 2016 but I doubt things are much different today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37504449

And yes - the self-employed expect some uncertainly about when money is received. My point is that in the circumstances of the lockdown and so many having to claim UC - the UC system might have been relexed to recognise the issue of the self-employed and the timing of their last income. Maybe considered it as savings...

If he stopped smoking he could save

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Surely even £5 a week (cost of a pint around here) is manageable to save for 99% of households. I think it comes down to a lack of intent and people being able to get easy credit and so too many are spend, spend, spend even on credit and then worry about paying it off somewhere over the rainbow. It is something we have been guilty of as well running up not insignificant credit card bills and then I got made redundant so it does become a battle. These days, if I can't afford it now I have to save until I can

You might well think that - but when you are scraping along on very little - that £5 you might be able to put behind might build up to £40 over two months. Well that's great - but it's not going to go far if something goes wrong. And the £100 that the 16m have at the end of the month is not an additional £100 every month - it is £100 in total. That's it. That's all they've got for the rainy day. Why else do we have foodbanks. A lot of people in the UK live in a very different world to those of us a lot more fortunate.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

My point is not about the level of UC. It is not about the looking for work, or indeed the support that those on UC get in identifying training and opportunities. It's not about any of these - or indeed anything to do with UC in normal times. It's simply about the final income payment for work prior to registering for UC as an individual's job goes down the plughole - especially in the cliff-edge circumstances of the lockdown. That's all.

The harsh reality is those are the rules whether it is right or wrong they aren't going to change any time soon and no amount of bleating on here will change your son's situation. I don't mean to be blunt but you constantly moan about how hard done by he's been but is he alone? What has he done since UC to change the situation in terms of job hunting. You have to cut your cloth accordingly and if he is a smoker as per the post above then I'm sorry but that is simply cash going up in smoke

 

[Deleted member 16999]

How many of us in their 20’s had much in the way of savings?

Silh is totally wrong about the income/savings argument he has put forward on here, but let’s not pretend we were all as good as gold with money when we were young.

I do casework for the RBL and I can assure you, he is not alone having zero savings and I see all ages from 20’s to 80+.

 

[PJ87]

You are joking...savings...you do know that a huge number of people don't have £100 to their name at the end of every month. This may be from 2016 but I doubt things are much different today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37504449

And yes - the self-employed expect some uncertainly about when money is received. My point is that in the circumstances of the lockdown and so many having to claim UC - the UC system might have been relexed to recognise the issue of the self-employed and the timing of their last income. Maybe considered it as savings...

Articles like this really make me appreciate what I have. My parents always bang on about saving saving saving.... I always thought what I put away wasn't much but it's more than £100

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If he stopped smoking he could save

yeh - that's it. That's the answer. And he can get rid of his telly, and stop using his cooker...and stop drinking - ah hold on - he doesn't drink...and as he says - even if he fancied a pint he could't justify it.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

How many of us in their 20’s had much in the way of savings?

Silh is totally wrong about the income/savings argument he has put forward on here, but let’s not pretend we were all as good as gold with money when we were young.

I do casework for the RBL and I can assure you, he is not alone having zero savings and I see all ages from 20’s to 80+.

I get that and as I've said I was as irresponsible as many others and HID and I have a five figure credit card balance hanging over us which has created a host of issues along the way. Fortunately we've found a way out of that mess eventually and have learned a salutary life lesson along the way. We don't save masses now and definitely haven't got anything significant tucked away but we're trying much harder these days to be more prudent and stick a few quid by whenever we get a chance. I agree that many kids, 20 somethings and even people older than that didn't get taught the benefit of saving for a rainy day and have had a spend now worry later attitude. Perhaps it is something that some households will take out of this Covid mess and begin to do

 

[HomerJSimpson]

yeh - that's it. That's the answer. And he can get rid of his telly, and stop using his cooker...and stop drinking - ah hold on - he doesn't drink...and as he says - even if he fancied a pint he could't justify it.

But it is it. How much is a pack of fags or a packet of rolling tobacco and papers? Money much needed elsewhere no?

 

[GreiginFife]

You are joking...savings...you do know that a huge number of people don't have £100 to their name at the end of every month. This may be from 2016 but I doubt things are much different today.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37504449

And yes - the self-employed expect some uncertainly about when money is received. My point is that in the circumstances of the lockdown and so many having to claim UC - the UC system might have been relexed to recognise the issue of the self-employed and the timing of their last income. Maybe considered it as savings...

Yes, savings. Plenty do you know.

Lockdown has not changed the system, its not even changed that some self employed people get late payments. Its not the government's fault, nor frankly their issue, the system is the same system as it was a year ago.

Stop blaming lockdown and the government for your son's predicament.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

How many of us in their 20’s had much in the way of savings?

Silh is totally wrong about the income/savings argument he has put forward on here, but let’s not pretend we were all as good as gold with money when we were young.

I do casework for the RBL and I can assure you, he is not alone having zero savings and I see all ages from 20’s to 80+.

The income/savings argument is very simply in respect of the work shut-down circumstances of the lockdown. No wider than that.

And it's not that we shouldn't be able to have £6000 of savings to still qualify for full UC - for some £6000 in savings is unimaginable. But for income that any individual was due at the end of March 2020 but for whatever reason was delayed until after the individual registered for UC - that final income could surely have been considered by the UC system in the same way as £6k of savings...that's all.