Stupid Members!

[louise_a]

we currently have a survey on our website for members to voice their opinions on the club and things they would like to see improved.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Lots of lame excuses being offered by golfers who seem to be happy to let other members of THEIR club do all the work and then rip them to pieces because they are not able voice YOUR opinion which you have not conveyed to them....Priceless.

Same as Local Government, if you don't vote you should be barred from making an opinion.

I have been a committee member at three clubs over a period of 35 years, done stints on County and National committees as well.
There are thousands of golf club committee members who do a great job {+ a few wrong uns].
At one of my clubs a low handicap member had served over 40 years since first being elected aged 18 in the 1960's. He did a fantastic job and was elected Captain [twice] chairman and eventually president for his service to his club.
How dare some of you generalise about a group of guys who at the very least care a lot more about your club than you do.

 

[Birchy]

we currently have a survey on our website for members to voice their opinions on the club and things they would like to see improved.

Thats a great idea. Best way for a club to get through to its members is via the website imo. Would be interested to see how it goes with that.

You on the committee at your club Louise?

 

[louise_a]

I am only on the ladies committee, Birchy, and also the Social one, but that does very little.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

The OP isn't talking about an AGM or an EGM here, it's a meeting that's part of a series of roadshows that the SGU are putting on to help clubs to identify what their problem areas are and what can be done to get out of that situation.

In reality, the fact that these roadshows are being held is a very scary as it's a reaction to a massive downturn in club membership. There can't be many clubs across the land that don't have membership vacancies or that aren't feeling the squeeze in some other way.

If clubs don't act now, it'll be too late.

As a SGU 'hosted' meeting I think the value it has had for the club is that it will have brought to attention of members things to be considered. What memebrs actually discuss in the meeting itself is usually pretty random and often down in the weeds.

My club had an EGM late last year to discuss various things - but it got somewhere and nowhere at the same time. The key thing that was agreed that we'd have a series of 'topic specific' members meetings in which we focus only on the topic of that meeting. One might be on club finance/income/membership; course changes and improvements; clubhouse and facilities.

Of course these are inter-linked - but let's say first agree what we want of the course - with priorities set - outside of finance and other constraints. Quite seperately consider finances. Overlay. As soon as you start discussing say whether we want to take out the bunker on the third - we immediately got into the cost aspects. So FIRST decide what we want of the bunker in the context of other changes we might do to the hole and to the course. We come aeway wit a plan for the course. etc

 

[bladeplayer]

Just been at a members meeting at my club, co hosted by the SGU (Scottish Golf Union for our Southern Cousins).

It was basically a forum for members to voice their opinions and ideas on how the club should go forward, what with the current challenges facing all/most golf clubs ie the financial climate and flagging memberships. Our club is not in trouble, but for the first time in recent memory we have no waiting list, so this was really the catalyst for calling the meeting and putting some sort of business plan in place for the club to move forward.

All sounds sensible and a good idea so far?

Step forward stupid members.......apparently some of the greatest challenges facing our clubs future are as follows:

the balcony overlooking the 18th is too noisy....the womens toilets can be a bit messy....the showers are too cold....the path between the 3rd green and 4th tee is untidy....the course (while being widely recognised as one of the best in the county) is a bit too hard and doesnt have enough colour on it???WTF???....the trolley shed is too small....the flowerbeds at the entrance are a bit untidy....best til last, the course is not very good in the winter! Are you frickin kidding me? We are 750 ft above sea level in Scotland, of course the course isnt very good in winter!

The whole night ended up a bit of a shambles and in my opinion a much wasted opportunity. Thankfully some good did come from the night. I had a nice pint. I clearly identified the lunatics at our club. I managed to leave without assaulting anyone!

Enjoyed your post , nodded at bits of it , laughed at bits of it & tutted typical at bits of it ..

but do you mind if i ask (not meant to be smart or condescending in any way ) what did you bring to the meeting ?

i agree the points you mention brought up by the lunatics are trivial and i agree with your opinion of them .. but you never mentioned what you added to the night ?

what i get from your post was you sat at the bar and watched the mayhem unfold whilst sipping a pint ..

Again apologies if this is worded wrong , its not an attack on you or anything its a genuine question ..

 

[Deleted member 17920]

Lots of lame excuses being offered by golfers who seem to be happy to let other members of THEIR club do all the work and then rip them to pieces because they are not able voice YOUR opinion which you have not conveyed to them....Priceless.

Same as Local Government, if you don't vote you should be barred from making an opinion.

I have been a committee member at three clubs over a period of 35 years, done stints on County and National committees as well.
There are thousands of golf club committee members who do a great job {+ a few wrong uns].
At one of my clubs a low handicap member had served over 40 years since first being elected aged 18 in the 1960's. He did a fantastic job and was elected Captain [twice] chairman and eventually president for his service to his club.
How dare some of you generalise about a group of guys who at the very least care a lot more about your club than you do.

I think you really have a valid point that the majority of golfers just slate the committee. I think the main problem of any golf club is that its just the same people that do everything and there are not enough volunteers who put themselves forward. I don't think its about caring as some people have an emotional attachment to the club and some just couldn't care less.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I think you really have a valid point that the majority of golfers just slate the committee. I think the main problem of any golf club is that its just the same people that do everything and there are not enough volunteers who put themselves forward. I don't think its about caring as some people have an emotional attachment to the club and some just couldn't care less.

I have never slated our committee and will never do so - until, that is, I myself have served on the committee. I may express views that I may not understand why such and such a decision has been made; I may disagree with a decision, but I won't slag off the committee - in fact I often find myself defending it.

 

[Foxholer]

my point is that I don't think enough members attend because they think or believe nothing will change. It's like not liking your meal but telling the waitress that everything is OK only to slag the place off when down the pub or at work! They won't know or have the opportunity to change things if not informed of the general feeling but its a two-way street and have to be seen to listen and acknowledge your opinion/view.

An excellent, and very British, analogy and unfortunately very true.

A/EGMs are only well attended when something contentious has happened (or i about to happen) - and it has to be recent. Committees far too often get defensive. And if they get wind of any 'rebellion' are liable to 'stack' the meeting.

Generally, Committees do a good job in the background, but members should recognise that participation is for personal fulfilment rather than a socialistic one, even if the latter is a beneficial result.

And members will always have gripes, if not about the way things are run, then about the allocation of resources. The presence of folk with different attitudes is what makes it a golf club rather than a Golf Society. Though the early of Golf certainly had 'cliques' as well as cleeks!

 

[lobthewedge]

Enjoyed your post , nodded at bits of it , laughed at bits of it & tutted typical at bits of it ..

but do you mind if i ask (not meant to be smart or condescending in any way ) what did you bring to the meeting ?

i agree the points you mention brought up by the lunatics are trivial and i agree with your opinion of them .. but you never mentioned what you added to the night ?

what i get from your post was you sat at the bar and watched the mayhem unfold whilst sipping a pint ..

Again apologies if this is worded wrong , its not an attack on you or anything its a genuine question ..

As DCB hinted at, this was a meeting run by the SGU, it was their show.

The representative from SGU did a basic power point presentation highlighting the problems facing clubs and then explained that the aim of the night was to throw ideas around as to the direction the club should be taking and start the process of putting together a business plan. The floor was only opened for 20 minutes at the end, up until then all she did was walk round the room reading out what people had written down as being key strengths and weaknesses of the club.

Instead of saying that this is not a meeting for petty bellyaching, she pandered to them and actually read every single little gripe and moan out, so much of the good points were lost or clouded.

For my part, I did speak at the end and emphasised the need to invest in marketing, especially our website which is piss poor. I also made the point that we need to address the transition of junior members into full paying adults. We have a healthy junior section, but we lose the majority when they turn 18, hence a large age gap in the membership from 18 to early 30s.

I did stand at the bar though!

 

[Val]

Not very productive at all.

I mentioned a few months ago about or veteran members fee and how low is in percentage to the ordinary fee and with an aging membership there are more moving into this cat of membership. Our club thankfully have addressed the difference to an extent but not enough in my eyes. Some of these vets were not prepared to pay the additional extra which was very little and countered the addition with another proposal which thankfully got voted down. We had vets ask for a greenkeeper to be made redundant to save the vets cost rising........all mental stuff. Some of these people would rather the course condition fell down and the club suffered financially rather than pay a bit extra, these guys in the top vets cat pay 35% (I think but around that level) of an ordinary fee.

Long and short of it, people want the best for as little as the can pay and all clubs are the same. Unfortunately when fighting for members our club is not in a postition to say pay the cash or jog on, we are not in trouble yet but if membership dwindles (which it hasn't its actually grown thankfully) we could be.

 

[bladeplayer]

Instead of saying that this is not a meeting for petty bellyaching, she pandered to them and actually read every single little gripe and moan out, so much of the good points were lost or clouded.

For my part, I did speak at the end and emphasised the need to invest in marketing, especially our website which is piss poor. I also made the point that we need to address the transition of junior members into full paying adults. We have a healthy junior section, but we lose the majority when they turn 18, hence a large age gap in the membership from 18 to early 30s.

I did stand at the bar though!

Thank you for your gracious reply , again i hope i wasnt coming across as having a go , that was not the intention , you made some very good points ..

 

[SGC001]

It's a lot easier to retain members than attract new ones, you may consider their ideas stupid but if not addressing them costs you members, especially when some could be met with relatively little cost, then you could end up with an issue.

Golf had a proliferation of clubs 20 odd years ago and membership never expanded to fill them, in these times any leisure is getting squeezed and clubs will be at risk.

Edit: Clubs are competing against each and other leisure activities for their slice of the pie (which isn't growing) it's bit like advertising they're not trying to grow the market just keep the share. Of course any ideas that grow the market would be ideal.

I realise this is not about an agm, but my old club had the agm the night people sign on for the main Christmas comp, if you wanted the chance of a decent time you attended the agm.

 

[londonlewis]

the balcony overlooking the 18th is too noisy....the womens toilets can be a bit messy....the showers are too cold....the path between the 3rd green and 4th tee is untidy....the course (while being widely recognised as one of the best in the county) is a bit too hard and doesnt have enough colour on it???WTF???....the trolley shed is too small....the flowerbeds at the entrance are a bit untidy....best til last, the course is not very good in the winter! Are you frickin kidding me? We are 750 ft above sea level in Scotland, of course the course isnt very good in winter!

I'll tacklet those one by one
1) People enjoying themselves after a round - disgusting, they should sit in silence and enjoy the tranquility!
2) The women should be employed to clean up the mess
3) Cold showers - have you not heard of a boiler?!
4) the area between the 3rd and 4th is an integral part of the course - Bobby Jones walked off a course once because of a fallen leaf on the cart path between the 3rd and 4th
5) Golf courses should be easy to make sure you flatter you members - the holes should be 3 times bigger and all greens should angle into the cup so there are no missed putts
6) where can everyone keep their necessary motorcaddies?
7) you need a professional flower keeper for your course - I am sure I could find one for you at the Chelsea Flower Show
8) dear me, golf courses should be 24/7 365 - dig up your whole course and put hot water pipes running the length and breadth of all 18 holes, this will keep the course nice and soft through winter

and finally - you only had one pint? you really should have bought more, your club needs the revenue to make all the necessary changes above...

hahah, Glad to see you have kept a good sense of humour at what must have been an eye opener for you!
Good luck keeping the course as it is and not wasting all sorts of time and effort on the trivial little things.

 

[GB72]

I have been to a couple of AGMs/Meetings at my current and previous clubs but find that the format of them is inherently flawed as only half of the issue is ever addressed. When it comes to the falling number of members, there are two points to be addressed in that there is the retention of existing members and revenue streams and how to attract new ones. The points discussed tend to be what the current membership wants and the vote is amongst existing members voting their opinion. That is all well and good from the member retention point of view, give the punters what they want and most will be happy enough. The problem is that if a club acts in the same way then whatever it is that is deterring new people from joining or from existing members spending in the clubhouse and pro shop still exists. The club needs to take opinions from further afield in my opinion. The online survey is a good one but simple tasks may help to improve the situation with better information. Never have I seen a club actually contact former members to see why they have left, never have I seen anyone politely asked why they are heading off straight after a round rather than stopping for a bite to eat etc. Surely this is the information that the club needs to attract new members and increase revenue rather than listing to the same opinions from the larger or more vocal groups in the club.

 

[MegaSteve]

I was under the impression [from many threads on this forum] that the best way to address the falling membership 'problem'... Was to simply remove the dress code...

 

[GB72]

I was under the impression [from many threads on this forum] that the best way to address the falling membership 'problem'... Was to simply remove the dress code...

I can only speak from my point of view but if they relaxed the dress code in the clubhouse then it would massively increase my spend. There are no end of times when I am passing and would drop in for a drink or some food but cannot because of jeans. That said, the membership seem happy with it as it is so I have to accept that.

 

[Akie]

Can't complain about our committee, only been a member a short while but after the draw for tee-off times on a Monday night ahead of Sunday's competition they are always available to discuss anything related to the club if you have any issues. Also recently agreed a reduction in membership for the 18-35 bracket to help bring in younger members, the club is thriving from the reports at the last AGM (hadnt joined in time to attend so probably missed the stupid ideas) so it certainly isnt all bad.

 

[bigslice]

As DCB hinted at, this was a meeting run by the SGU, it was their show.

The representative from SGU did a basic power point presentation highlighting the problems facing clubs and then explained that the aim of the night was to throw ideas around as to the direction the club should be taking and start the process of putting together a business plan. The floor was only opened for 20 minutes at the end, up until then all she did was walk round the room reading out what people had written down as being key strengths and weaknesses of the club.

Instead of saying that this is not a meeting for petty bellyaching, she pandered to them and actually read every single little gripe and moan out, so much of the good points were lost or clouded.

For my part, I did speak at the end and emphasised the need to invest in marketing, especially our website which is piss poor. I also made the point that we need to address the transition of junior members into full paying adults. We have a healthy junior section, but we lose the majority when they turn 18, hence a large age gap in the membership from 18 to early 30s.

I did stand at the bar though!

i see as the SGU trying to safeguard all clubs. the woman told us that some clubs dont want the sgu to help them!!!. i was a tad vocal in the three bad points. which were


a need for proper financial planning (we are turn over 1.6 million after all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
a sound goverence structure ( read into this captain changes every year committee changes every few ie employer a manager)
no long term business plan (this is the whole point of the sgu forum)

i also voiced my concerns that some of these changes are MAJOR and will involve a EAGM or SGM to change the constitutation and change of management structure.

these are massive possible changes and i await the outcome from my club. by the way A McC is fae here is on our committe

 

[Val]

a need for proper financial planning (we are turn over 1.6 million after all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
a sound goverence structure ( read into this captain changes every year committee changes every few ie employer a manager)
no long term business plan (this is the whole point of the sgu forum)

Every club is the same, we have a long standing treasurer who puts an amazing amount of work into the club and if he one day decides enough is enough then we as a club have a problem, we need to be more of a business than a club.