Someone played my ball. What do I do

[Markrichold]

Hi all, we had an unusual situation yesterday. Playing in a foursomes stroke play comp, my partner hit a good drive, a little left but not in any danger we thought. As we approached where we thought the ball should have been we watched a golfer playing in the opposite direction play a shot. We searched for our ball for three minutes but couldn’t find it. We did find another ball and at this point suspected the golfer playing in the opposite direction may have played our ball. One of the other pair in our group said I needed to go back to the tee to play three from the tee. I went back and hit three from the tee. Not a great shot and my partner had to walk back towards me and play the fourth shot. After my partner had played the fourth shot we were walking down the fairway and the golfer we previously saw playing in the opposite direction came walking back towards us. He had our ball in his hand and apologised for playing our ball. Do we carry on with the ball we played three from the tee or can we replace the original ball where it had been played from and carry on without penalty? It seems unfair to say we had gone over the three minutes searching when through not fault of ours the ball wasn’t there to be found. I can’t find anything in the rules that covers this situation. We had a split opinion about what should happen when we discussed it with other players in the clubhouse afterwards. I would appreciate any input on this. Thanks Mark

 

[Steven Rules]

The Rule is 18.2a(1). The ball was not found within three minutes. It is lost. The second ball played from the tee is the ball in play. Harsh - but that is the Rule.

It is not that unusual - unfortunately. It happened to me a week ago. My ball should have been in the middle of the fairway. Within the three minute search period I hastily made my way 100 yards to the offender who was about to play another stroke with my ball. My ball marking was face up. I could see it from 10 yards away as I approached. I picked my ball up off the ground from under his nose. Pointed to my marking. Pulled another ball from my pocket with my marking, which I had taken with me for just this purpose, showed him his error. Gave him a full serve. Told him (with his marker nearby) that he had incurred a two stroke penalty and stormed off. Then, with anger still seething inside me, managed a double bogey from the middle of the fairway.

 

[Crumplezone]

Does it not come under 9.6 ball moved by outside influence? As you are certain the other player played your ball, it should be drop in the same spot without penalty. I don't think the time spent looking is relevant.

 

[srixon 1]

Similar thing cost me two strokes in a county competition last year. The tee shot finishes over a rise so you cannot see the ball finish position from the tee. One of my fellow competitors said my ball had gone into the (position A) on the right so I hit a provisional into position B. After looking for my ball at position A for 3 minutes without finding it I went to my ball at position B. Lo and behold there is my original ball, not lost at all and through no fault of my own it was deemed to be “lost”. Which cost me the two strokes.

 

[Steven Rules]

Does it not come under 9.6 ball moved by outside influence? As you are certain the other player played your ball, it should be drop in the same spot without penalty. I don't think the time spent looking is relevant.

If the certainty occurred within the three minute search period then proceed under 9.6. If the certainty occurred after the three minute search period expired (as in #1) then the original ball is lost.

The time spent looking is very relevant.

Edit. And note that if you are proceeding under 9.6, the ball is replaced on its original spot (which if not known must be estimated). The ball is not dropped.

 

[Budds]

Moral of the above is that YOU are responsible for your own ball, in spite of any dodgy, or even foul, action by anyone else. Often applies in proper life too, though, as in the above cases, can seem harsh.

 

[Orikoru]

Same thing happened to me in a betterball pairs match a couple of months ago. Someone playing up the adjacent hole took my ball. My partner got the ball back from them, so we were actually within the 3 minutes - however since none of us saw it happen we couldn't pinpoint where to replace the ball. So I was effectively out of the hole (no point going back to hit 3 off the tee). We lost that hole and I was fuming. Luckily we still won the match. Whilst it was grossly unfair, there was nothing we could do, our opponents couldn't exactly let me just drop the ball wherever we liked.

 

[rulefan]

however since none of us saw it happen we couldn't pinpoint where to replace the ball.

You should have simply made your best estimate.

 

[Swango1980]

Same thing happened to me in a betterball pairs match a couple of months ago. Someone playing up the adjacent hole took my ball. My partner got the ball back from them, so we were actually within the 3 minutes - however since none of us saw it happen we couldn't pinpoint where to replace the ball. So I was effectively out of the hole (no point going back to hit 3 off the tee). We lost that hole and I was fuming. Luckily we still won the match. Whilst it was grossly unfair, there was nothing we could do, our opponents couldn't exactly let me just drop the ball wherever we liked.

What do you do when you can't exactly pinpoint where you ball crossed the margin of a penalty area? Do you make your best estimate, or do you take stroke and distance penalty (or just count yourself out of the hole in a match)?

 

[Orikoru]

You should have simply made your best estimate.

Since my ball went between trees it could have been anywhere within a 20 or 30 yard area really.

 

[Swango1980]

Since my ball went between trees it could have been anywhere within a 20 or 30 yard area really.

When your partner got your ball back, would it not have been wise for him to ask where they got the ball from? That would have been the first thing I asked

 

[rulefan]

Since my ball went between trees it could have been anywhere within a 20 or 30 yard area really.

Still make your best estimate. Playing by the Rules is your best bet.

9.6/2 – Where to Replace Ball When It Was Moved from Unknown Location​

If a ball has been moved by an outside influence and the original spot where the ball lay is not known, the player must use their reasonable judgment (Rule 1.3b(2)) to determine where the ball had come to rest before it was moved.

For example, on a particular hole, part of the putting green and adjoining area cannot be seen by the players playing towards it. Near the putting green there is a bunker and a penalty area. A player plays towards the putting green and cannot tell where the ball came to rest. The players see a person (outside influence) with a ball. The person drops the ball and runs away. The player identifies it as his or her ball. The player does not know whether the ball was on the putting green, in the general area, in the bunker, or in the penalty area.

As it is impossible to know where the ball should be replaced, the player must use reasonable judgment. If it is equally likely the ball came to rest on the putting green, in the general area, in the bunker, or in the penalty area, a reasonable judgment would be to estimate the ball came to rest in the general area.

 

[Orikoru]

When your partner got your ball back, would it not have been wise for him to ask where they got the ball from? That would have been the first thing I asked

It was a child and she just pointed to the vague area before moving on with her dad.

Still make your best estimate. Playing by the Rules is your best bet.

9.6/2 – Where to Replace Ball When It Was Moved from Unknown Location​

If a ball has been moved by an outside influence and the original spot where the ball lay is not known, the player must use their reasonable judgment (Rule 1.3b(2)) to determine where the ball had come to rest before it was moved.

For example, on a particular hole, part of the putting green and adjoining area cannot be seen by the players playing towards it. Near the putting green there is a bunker and a penalty area. A player plays towards the putting green and cannot tell where the ball came to rest. The players see a person (outside influence) with a ball. The person drops the ball and runs away. The player identifies it as his or her ball. The player does not know whether the ball was on the putting green, in the general area, in the bunker, or in the penalty area.

As it is impossible to know where the ball should be replaced, the player must use reasonable judgment. If it is equally likely the ball came to rest on the putting green, in the general area, in the bunker, or in the penalty area, a reasonable judgment would be to estimate the ball came to rest in the general area.

Thanks, good to know for next time. Although we all kind of looked at each pretty clueless. Would our opponents have to agree with us as to the position we drop in? Presumably they would.

 

[rulefan]

It was a child and she just pointed to the vague area before moving on with her dad.


Thanks, good to know for next time. Although we all kind of looked at each pretty clueless. Would our opponents have to agree with us as to the position we drop in? Presumably they would.

YOU are responsible for making YOUR best estimate.
Your opponents have the right to challenge you before the completion of the hole and later seek a ruling from the committee but ultimately it is your decision.
Therefore, the more evidence you can get the better. However, if you reasonably think this and they think that, there should be no problem.

 

[salfordlad]

It was a child and she just pointed to the vague area before moving on with her dad.


Thanks, good to know for next time. Although we all kind of looked at each pretty clueless. Would our opponents have to agree with us as to the position we drop in? Presumably they would.

I'm late to this discussion but .....

As rulefan notes, opponents are not required to agree but they can seek a ruling if they think you are taking liberties. If you genuinely have little clue where is a defensible estimate, as a practical measure, you can limit risk of a debate by selecting a spot that involves no significant advantage or disadvantage. In such a case, a Committee is extremely likely to reject any opponent ruling request.