So this is handicap manipulation right?

[Lord Tyrion]

In this instance, they must have been on the edge of losing a shot anyway. In an average of 8 scores 1 shouldn't make a colossal difference.

 

[D-S]

If they tried their best, it's fine. It is still a legitimate score

Exactly this, by submitting a 9 hole score the day before, all things being equal, they were risking cutting their handicap further.

 

[The Squirrel]

The inference of this thread seems to be that this one score is wildly better than all other scores on their record - they had one of those magical golfing days for the ages we dream of that has never happened before or since. In statistical terms it’s a massive outlying freak result. If the new score is just another fairly normal one for them then, even if it could be construed as manipulation, it would just mean their handicap record now fairly reflects their ability and scoring pattern. So what’s the issue? Isn’t that the whole idea of a handicap system?

Much like ice-skating judging, if you altered the system so that the top and bottom scores are disregarded (e.g. take last 24 scores then remove top 2 and bottom 2 to get 20 counting rounds) it would be a better strict mathematical representation of someone’s typical ability by removing any freakish outliers. Not gonna happen though, as it would be wildly unpopular for obvious reasons. 99% of people really would not like having one of those magical days on the course where you play like a God, only to have it promptly disregarded by the handicap algorithm.

 

[IanM]

I think the calculations on the current system are fine. You can argue the pros and cons of any version.

The cheating scumbags do it persistently over a period of time. That's why some places insist on a percentage of comp scores over gen play.... at least they have to part with an entry fee.

 

[Voyager EMH]

I played in 5 comps from 16th to 30th Sept.
This replaced 5 scores from 14th to 28th June.
My HI went from 4.0 to 5.0
Course was playing much longer in Sept than those dry running-like-mad fairways in June.

I have manipulated my handicap and gained "an extra shot". But I did not play deliberately poorly. My very last 3 scores are my 8th, 9th and 10th best scores.

If I had chosen not to play in those last five comps, I would have manipulated my handicap to remain off 4.0 by not playing.

I'm clearly over-thinking.
There's a lot of it about.

 

[Imurg]

I wonder if there is any hard data as to the numbers of players deliberately manipulating their index..?
Are we dealing with thousands or just a few?
Anyone got cold, hard facts or is most of this speculation?

 

[Lucifer MorningStar]

I wonder if there is any hard data as to the numbers of players deliberately manipulating their index..?
Are we dealing with thousands or just a few?
Anyone got cold, hard facts or is most of this speculation?

Would assume it’s mainly speculation and people being bitter over someone other than them winning or getting a better score which simply just happens sometimes.

 

[Neilds]

I wonder if there is any hard data as to the numbers of players deliberately manipulating their index..?
Are we dealing with thousands or just a few?
Anyone got cold, hard facts or is most of this speculation?

Think you know the answer to that. Threads like this have no facts to back up the allegations.

 

[IanM]

Think you know the answer to that. Threads like this have no facts to back up the allegations.

I think many have come across it happening, but in the context of the many thousands of rounds played a week, it's a minority.

Mind you, when they walk off with the swag, it's blooming annoying

 

[Imurg]

But is it happening deliberately or are people signing in for cards, playing poorly - as we all do - and their index going up?
Very different things...and yet, it seems, any increase in Index "must" be through manipulation.
It's getting somewhat wearing......

 

[IanM]

But is it happening deliberately or are people signing in for cards, playing poorly - as we all do - and their index going up?
Very different things...and yet, it seems, any increase in Index "must" be through manipulation.
It's getting somewhat wearing......

I know a chap who puts in lots of social gp cards and rarely breaks 100. Shoots in 80s regularly when he plays in an Open. I "had a word" with our handicap Sec, who thanked me for commenting. I've no idea if anything was done, but I'll keep an eye on him next season.

 

[Imurg]

I know a chap who puts in lots of social gp cards and rarely breaks 100. Shoots in 80s regularly when he plays in an Open. I "had a word" with our handicap Sec, who thanked me for commenting. I've no idea if anything was done, but I'll keep an eye on him next season.

There's always going to be some
I just don't think it's in the numbers being suggested on here and in the golf media.....unless someone can prove different.

 

[woofers]

There's always going to be some
I just don't think it's in the numbers being suggested on here and in the golf media.....unless someone can prove different.

1. There is a report available that shows a players record for general play vs competition rounds, detailing number of rounds and score differentials in each ‘mode’, which can be used to investigate any suspicion of deliberate manipulation.
2. At some time everyone’s best score is going to drop off their handicap record. If the new score isn’t within the best 1 - 8, it will be replaced by what was their “9th best score”, and unless the new score is a new “best”, their handicap will probably go up. By how much is obviously dependent on just how widely spread their score differentials are. It’s just a mathematical function of rolling best x of x, it’s a shame that some folk can’t understand this.

 

[rulefan]

It’s just a mathematical function of rolling best x of x, it’s a shame that some folk can’t understand this.