jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
As it is in the amateur game. It is just that in the amateur game very few games have an official referee.
Should you be able to get relief from divots in the fairway?
- Thread starter MarkT
- Start date
As it is in the amateur game. It is just that in the amateur game very few games have an official referee.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
What about a percentage guess your balls gone in the water?
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
A virtually certain percentage guess?
Steve Wilkes
Well-known member
Once a round a free drop, no clean and only if on fairway, although I think this will be abused
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
It's defined.
Known or virtually (at least 95%) certain.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Is still a guess.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Can’t be both can it so it’s still a guess unless you see a splash.
It black and white if it’s 100% any less it’s an educated guess.
So interpretation is allowed under this rule!
D
Deleted member 3432
Guest
t
I was playing with one of our members a couple of years who had just stopped representing the county.
In his mid 50's but still playing off +3 and had played county golf for donkeys years. Reason he had stopped was the number of opponents he was playing in late teens and early 20's who were calling in the refs for a ruliing every time they were in trouble in the rough. He reckoned they were so desperate to win in the hope of attracting England selectors.
Took the enjoyment right out of it for him and as he said, if they as full time amateurs couldn't beat an old fella like him working a 40 hour week they weren't good enough for England.
I was playing with one of our members a couple of years who had just stopped representing the county.
In his mid 50's but still playing off +3 and had played county golf for donkeys years. Reason he had stopped was the number of opponents he was playing in late teens and early 20's who were calling in the refs for a ruliing every time they were in trouble in the rough. He reckoned they were so desperate to win in the hope of attracting England selectors.
Took the enjoyment right out of it for him and as he said, if they as full time amateurs couldn't beat an old fella like him working a 40 hour week they weren't good enough for England.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
It is only virtually certain, if there really is nowhere else it can be. So if the close cut grass runs out to the water, and you can't find it, it is virtually certain. If there is any possibility it is hidden by rough, then no, it's not virtually certain. Same if there are a load of leaves, etc. Virtually certain, is exactly that.
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
What are you interpreting?
The rule defines it, you don't interpret this rule..you play to it
It sets out what can and can't happen.
The fact that there only needs to 95%+ certainty doesn't mean any interpreting is going on.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Yes I know the rule.
I was answering a quote about the R&A not liking golfers interpreting anything.
This is one example that is up for interpretation.
It’s a high threshold but it’s there.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
You are making a guess under a certain set of circumstances that it’s gone where you think it’s gone.
It’s a funny one I don’t see how anyone can be 95% certain.
I have never in my 63 yrs heard anyone use that as an example
Even 99% leaves a small dought.
So I think it is open to interpretation.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
Not sure. In my view it has to be pretty obvious that the ball went in the hazard. If there is anywhere else it could be, then it isn't virtually certain. I don't see much room for interpretation unless someone is looking for it.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
I bet Mickelson or Reed would be.
Certain means 100% sure.
Virtually means an educated guess but still a guess.
That’s just how I see it.
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USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
I don't see it as a guess. If you saw it go in, then it is in.
If you didn't see it go in, but there really is nowhere else it could be, then you are vitually certain.
If there is anywhere else it can be, then no, it's not virtually certain, and you proceed accordingly.
I don't see any guessing, or any opportunity whereby what your options are, are other than the rules.
Again, there only exists an option, if you are looking for an option that is not what is obvious.
Jimaroid
Journeyman Pro
Since when does virtually mean guessing?
I’m not being that guy who posts a dictionary meanings but virtually has nothing to do with guesswork. Virtually certain, almost certain, nearly certain, effectively certain, pick any other synonym but it’s not guessing.
I’m not being that guy who posts a dictionary meanings but virtually has nothing to do with guesswork. Virtually certain, almost certain, nearly certain, effectively certain, pick any other synonym but it’s not guessing.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Certain means your 100% sure.Since when does virtually mean guessing?
I’m not being that guy who posts a dictionary meanings but virtually has nothing to do with guesswork. Virtually certain, almost certain, nearly certain, effectively certain, pick any other synonym but it’s not guessing.
Virtually certain means there is an element of dought so a small element of guesswork.
Imo the two words don’t really go together.
Your either Certain or your not .
Oddsocks
Ryder Cup Winner
It never makes sense to
1) make the divot deeper by playing from it.
2) undo potential repair work carried out from seeding
3) penalise a player from hitting a good shot
4) risk potential damage to equipment or injury to a player.
For me pros and clubman games are not comparable as the courses are rested then manicured to ensure perfection, even with pick and placed after a couple of heavy showers.
Clubman golf items played in what pros would deem as unplayable weather, if it’s on the fairway pick and place as standard.
1) make the divot deeper by playing from it.
2) undo potential repair work carried out from seeding
3) penalise a player from hitting a good shot
4) risk potential damage to equipment or injury to a player.
For me pros and clubman games are not comparable as the courses are rested then manicured to ensure perfection, even with pick and placed after a couple of heavy showers.
Clubman golf items played in what pros would deem as unplayable weather, if it’s on the fairway pick and place as standard.
Kellfire
Blackballed
Yes. Hitting the fairway should be rewarded with a good lie and it isn’t the golfer’s fault there is a flaw in the turf.
Slab
Occasional Tour Caddy
@MarkT , do the other guys in the GM office give you these ‘suggestions’ as great ideas for topics to post about, and then snigger to themselves? (A bit like sending the new guy next door for a long stand/left handed screwdriver etc)
Just beware if they next tell you to post about:
Poker chip ball markers
Where to stand on the teeing area
Colour of socks
Any dress code topic
Declaring what ball you’re using
What is advice
Timing your lost ball search
etc....
Just beware if they next tell you to post about:
Poker chip ball markers
Where to stand on the teeing area
Colour of socks
Any dress code topic
Declaring what ball you’re using
What is advice
Timing your lost ball search
etc....
