Scratch?

[kid2]

Evening All,

Id be interested to know the differing opinions on this one......I guess most on here with the exception of a handful play this game because we enjoy it....Some of us want to get better at it....Some are happy just going out for the weekend stroll......

Me i want to get as good as i can....Or as good as time and skill level let me.....
My question is.....Do you think that its possible for the average joe with the 2.4 kids the wife the dog the mortgage and the 9-6 job monday to friday to be able to get to scratch.....

I have the greatest respect for those that can reach this even if they are not tied down with the above responsibilities......
On the other hand while i may have one day thought it possible i believe that it would be a better goal for me to reach maybe a low single digit handicap which to be fair is a super achievement in itself also....

I think that to get from maybe a 4 or 5 handicap to scratch requires some serious practice and more time and effort than the average Joe has......
I suppose that to get to high singles is another milestone thats easy enough to get to with a certain standard of golf but to take that then from say 9 down requires you to be good with the scoring clubs whilst keeping the ball in play off the tee....

From 5 to scratch i think requires a serious short game and an ability to recover from any lie to save par as well as being lethal with a putter.......
I would be happy to play to a 5 or 6 and i think for me it is achievable with some work......

Does anyone share the view i have to maintain a lowish handicap....
Is scratch really out of reach of all but the really gifted ones that have the 20 or 25 hours a week to put the effort in for?...

 

[GreiginFife]

Guy I work with has 4 kids, works longer than 9-6 and a sizeable mortgage but plays off +1.
He credits it to having a good balance outside of work (we don't do weekend work) which allows him enough time to practice. But he, in true analyst fashion, only works on the specific things that he finds fault with and is very methodical.

 

[Imurg]

It's possible to get to scratch in the situation you describe - you do need shed-loads of natural ability to do it without a serious amount of hard work. An hour or two a day of quality practice should do it!
Single figures is hard enough - most won't ever get a sniff of it, let alone get there.
Low singles, it gets even harder.
In a way, this game is harder the better you get. When you're off 28 and you screw up a couple of holes it only takes a couple of pars and you're back on track.
When you get low you can't afford to mess up any hole with worse than a bogey - unless you're a birdie machine.....which I'm not!
For me, scratch is virtually unattainable - I don't have the time, nor really the inclination, to put in the hours required. IF I've reached the pinnacle of my golf career then I'm OK with that - to reach Cat 1 is something the majority won't ever do - and I feel I'll be able to maintain a handicap in single figures for a good few years yet.
Setting a goal of reaching scratch whilst on 14 is too much in my opinion. Getting to 9 is the start, then 5 etc etc etc
You can do it - it takes time and patience. I did it through playing, lessons could well be your route.

 

[Fader]

IMO there's a far greater gap in level of play between a scratch handicapper and 5 handicapper, than there is between the same 5 handicapper a guy of off 9.

The reason being is generally speaking a guy off 9 will already have a decent standard and likely have the ability to shoot 4 or 5 over, so would only need to tighten things up a bit to get to around a 5 handicap. However a guy off 5 would have to get to a whole new level of consistency and would some seriously good short game skills to be able to pull off a score during an off day.

Hope that makes sense so far!

As for the average Joe achieving it. I think that would determine in how much they want it and how much time they're willing to sacrifice outside of their 2.4 children and 9-6 working week lives. I don't think you'd achieve it with 1 range session and 1 Round on a Sunday each week. I think they'd need be at the range 3 times a week then working on short game at least the same amount of time. Then they'd still need to be playing as well to get the scores to get the handicap down, but what cost would it come at? Can't see a partner liking it if your working a 37 hour week then putting in 16-20 hours on golf which would effectively be all the hours your not working or sleeping.

I think basically you either need a shed load of talent to be good enough to play off scratch with minimal practice time or you need a lot of spare hours without constraints to be able to manufacture the ability to play at that level.


Reminds of a guy my dad said used to play at his club Gillingham in the 80s and 90s, a former copper who was off 4 or 5 but got divorced in his 30s and spent every waking hour after that hitting balls or chipping and putting. Was then playing 10holes here and there but usually just practising except for comps when he played the full round and was shooting very low numbers as a result of all his work. Ended up club champ for something like 5 years in a row and ended up off scratch. But he retired from the force, met someone new and gave up golf as he was now happy in his home life he didn't have the hours to dedicate to his routine due to doing a part time job and spending time with his new family, handicap drifted up a bit in couple years he carried on for and because he couldn't maintain scratch he just gave up.

Don't know how true that story is but if you look at the honours boards at gillingham his names there for something like 7 years out of 9 as club champion. Which I guess shows as an example of what can be achieved with work but can't be sustained without the same level of input.

Anyway my fingers hurt after all this typing and your all probably bored of reading now

 

[duncan mackie]

Robobum posted this a few days ago in this context -

"The journey to scratch from 28 is like freewheeling down a big hill and trying to get up a bigger hill on the other side.

Plenty of speed and momentum as you race down the hill from 28 - bottom out in the dip at about 12 h'cap then try to clamber up the other side at a much slower pace. Most people never get very far up the other side of the hill, either running out of ability, time or commitment. "

Good summary

 

[Fader]

:rofl:

Robobum posted this a few days ago in this context -

"The journey to scratch from 28 is like freewheeling down a big hill and trying to get up a bigger hill on the other side.

Plenty of speed and momentum as you race down the hill from 28 - bottom out in the dip at about 12 h'cap then try to clamber up the other side at a much slower pace. Most people never get very far up the other side of the hill, either running out of ability, time or commitment. "

Good summary

I think that's a superb way of putting it.

Also at what point do you stop enjoying just playing and start seeing as merely a struggle to achieve what was potentially an unrealistic goal to begin with.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

It's possible but oh so hard. I dream of getting there and never say never but let's get to single figures first and reassess. Personally Cat 1 will be a big ask but get there and kick on. If you never dare to dream you never dare to do

 

[kid2]

Great replies Gents .....Keep em coming.....
As a side note......As Murg has said.... My goal this season will be maybe to get to at least 10 anyway with a bonus being Singles and then after than see what level of practice i can achieve....

The one thing i do have on my side is that i have a wee fellow who is 5 and loves the game...Which should buy me another few hours here and there as i can get some practice in while he's in his Junior Club...... Here's hoping.

 

[chris661]

I am aiming for around 8 this year which going by what the pro I use said shouldn't be too much of an ask, already seeing some good improvements from a couple of lessons, but after that I reckon without serious amounts of time which I don't think I would want to commit to cat 1 will be about my limit. Life will just get in the way and I play for fun not to make a living from the game.

I have watched and talked to a few walker cup guys and a few young guys who represent the likes of ulster etc and the amount of dedication and commitment that the show is unreal not to mention the sacrifices that they make just to maintain that level never mind get better not for me.

 

[garyinderry]

getting to and staying at scratch in our weather is nothing short of astounding ! id say if we all lived in a nice climate our handicaps would all be at least a shot or two lower.

id rather have to contend with sun in my eyes and the heat, rather than the rain and cold that we get most of the season !

 

[Andy808]

Yes I do but the doctor said it will only get better if I leave it alone.

As for playing off scratch it's never going to happen for me as I don't have the time, money or commitment to playing and practicing that much. I do practice more than most at the club but I don't have the money for regular lessons so it's all self taught. I will be happy to get to mid teens and stay there. After all I play this game for fun.

 

[kid2]

getting to and staying at scratch in our weather is nothing short of astounding ! id say if we all lived in a nice climate our handicaps would all be at least a shot or two lower.

id rather have to contend with sun in my eyes and the heat, rather than the rain and cold that we get most of the season !

Never even thought of that Garr....Which is 100% correct too...Weather dont help...

 

[Wafty]

As a lad just turned 20 with no previous official handicap previously recorded, i'm also curious to see what path Golf shall lead me down this year. I've never played in any competition although I was a member of a club for a couple years as a junior and it'll be interesting to see what happens this year. About half a year ago I made a thread on here asking whether or not people thought I should learn to drive first rather than join a club right away and the replies were in the overwhelming favour of one particular option. With that now in the bag (pardon the pun) It's time to try my hand at this game with the metal sticks and little white balls

I'd like to be able to prove myself without having any golf lessons whatsoever, is this completely foolish?

 

[SocketRocket]

Do you notice the best golfers in your club on the chipping greens, playing out of practice bunkers, on the putting green? I see them all the time. Why dont you see them?

 

[Blocker]

In a nutshell, he's got no chance unless he's a natural or can putt like god.
To get down to single figures is a good goal but the leap from say 9 to 5 is huge
and as for 5 to scratch it's a whole new ball game with only 0.1 per shot under CSS
coming off and only 1 shot above CSS allowed instead of the 2 for H/C's of 6 and up.
Take it from some one who can't get below 5 after 30 years of trying It's too hard but I never give up hope
This could be the season to make 4 with a bit of luck.
As for golf lessons you need to get some to have a chance of a decent foundation but then you need practice ,practice ,practice which with a dog 2.4 children and a wife is never going to happen

 

[A1ex]

I think it's an impossible ask to get down to Scratch without playing serious golf. The modern clubs make it easier than it used to be but it's still a tough task, unless you dedicate 3-4 days a week minimum to it.

 

[upsidedown]

It's a whole different ball game playing off 4 than 9 and can imagine playing of scratch is twice as hard, but having said that think it's not impossible.

As we've all come down through our handicaps I'm sure we've surmised that one just below where we are would be good and a handicap 5to 6 below that a pipe dream but we occasionally do shoot that round that suggests we can do it. It's doing it regularly that's the hard bit.

I think those of us who have been lucky to get to 5 and below, whether it be by hard work and/or talent are capable of getting to scratch given time. That is the key, time. time to play, practice, play some more then practice hard.

I've been lucky to have played 20 times in the last 24 days and I'm playing the golf of my life. If this was to continue I'm confident my handicap will keep dropping. Been lucky that the weather has been fab ( mid Summer) and no work till we leave for the UK in 3 weeks time. Have to say though have not practiced at all , just played.

So I'll keep at it , probably another 12 to 15 rounds before we leave and then the challenge will be to get my UK handicap. To be honest if I shoot 3 rounds in the mid 70's I'd be stoked but would not be surprised if it doesn't happen as I'm sure the conditions are going to be so different. As touched on before I think the weather plays such a big part in your game that you'll never be able to play to your full potential whilst it's lashing it down or the course is frozen.

I think the some of the keys of getting to scratch are that you have to be mid to long and accurate off the tee. To minimise mistakes and take the birdie opportunities when they come . Have a short game to die for and putt like a demon :thup:

 

[USER1999]

To me, the key is mental fortitude. As you get better at golf, and nearer the dream, the pressure to play well ramps up. Well, it does for me any way. It's easy to want it a bit too much.

 

[bobmac]

I'd like to be able to prove myself without having any golf lessons whatsoever, is this completely foolish?

Maybe not foolish,but very unlikely.

 

[Tommo21]

In a nutshell, he's got no chance unless he's a natural or can putt like god.
To get down to single figures is a good goal but the leap from say 9 to 5 is huge
and as for 5 to scratch it's a whole new ball game with only 0.1 per shot under CSS
coming off and only 1 shot above CSS allowed instead of the 2 for H/C's of 6 and up.
Take it from some one who can't get below 5 after 30 years of trying It's too hard but I never give up hope
This could be the season to make 4 with a bit of luck.
As for golf lessons you need to get some to have a chance of a decent foundation but then you need practice ,practice ,practice which with a dog 2.4 children and a wife is never going to happen

Yeh, I know many scratch golfers, play with a few and played against a few. I don’t know of any that didn’t take the game up early, spend hours and hours on the course during school holidays and such like. Then to move onto the marriage thing and kids later on.

I don’t know one single person who took up the game late, when married with kids, to become a scratch golfer. I do know a couple who took the game up late to get down 4 and 3, but these guys were never off the golf course.
Myself, I’ve been lucky, took the game up in my early twenties and I only got down to 5 a few years back and that was after my girls flew the nest and Tommo was free to practice and play 5 times a week and more.

Even Lawrie and Poulter were 4 and 5 HC golfers before they worked hard at their game.