Rules Clarification Please.

[sawtooth]

Hi,

I have a couple of situations that I am unclear about regarding the rules of golf and would appreciate some expert advice.

1. If I play a provisional of the tee do I need to play my 1st ball if I find it? I know that i can declare the ball lost and I also know that I am not even obliged to look for it. However, if i do look for it and find it and dont fancy it, can i just carry on with my provisional?

2. Also, if I hit a provisional ball can i play that ball more than once? or do you have to make a decision after a single shot? I wondered if you could keep playing a provisional until you reach the spot where you will start looking for your original.

Many Thanks, I am sure somebody will have the answer out there.

 

[freddielong]

point 1 if you find it you have to play it, there is no option to declare it lost, all you can do is not look for it.

point 2 you can hit you provisonal again but only if it is still behind the point where you would start looking for your first ball.

Hope this helps

 

[sawtooth]

Thanks a lot for the reply. That does make sense cheers.

I played a friend at Stableford today and I gave him back the poing retrospectively because we were unsure about the ruling. Thankfully he beat me by a few any way so did not change the result.

Out of interest if this happens again and I chose not to look for it I guess that would be "lost" as you say and therefore eligible to keep playing my provisional.

What then if an opponent decides to search and finds it for me? Do I have to then acknowledge that the ball is infact not lost and therefore I must play the original? Its a hyperthetical situation but interested to know what you think.

 

[freddielong]

Yes doesn't matter who finds your ball once found, it is found,

 

[drawboy]

Once you declare the ball a lost other people shouldn't be looking for it anyway, they should accept your decision.

 

[freddielong]

Once you declare the ball a lost other people shouldn't be looking for it anyway, they should accept your decision.

Should but don't have to if you are playing matchplay for example, there is nothing to stop your opponent looking for you ball for 5 mins, if he thinks it will put you in a worse spot than your prov ball

 

[Ethan]

Once you declare the ball a lost other people shouldn't be looking for it anyway, they should accept your decision.

Should but don't have to if you are playing matchplay for example, there is nothing to stop your opponent looking for you ball for 5 mins, if he thinks it will put you in a worse spot than your prov ball

The rule used to be different, but was changed after complaints. In a big amateur event about 15 or 20 years ago, a guy hit his second shot on a brutal par-4 into deep woods. He said he would play a provisional, then hit it in the hole for par and declared the original ball lost. His opponent found the original in deep doodah where the player would have had no chance of making par, but the declaration stood and the provisional was counted as a winning 4.

Can't do that any more, but if you hit a terrible drive that is a certain penalty drop or two and a couple of hacks from the knee high, you can play another tee shot, but if you do not declare it as a provisional, it is not, and is in play. Then it doesn't matter what your opponent says.

In fact, this happens a lot by accident. Lots of people say "I'll play another". That is not declaring an intention to play a provisional, and by rights "another" is in play as soon as they have hit it.

 

[Leftie]

You cannot declare a ball lost.

If you play a provisional and the original is found the original ball is in play and you either play it or take the usual drop or replay options under penalty. Note that if for instance the ball is unplayable and drop options are no good so you elect to play 3 off the tee (for instance), then you must go back and do so. You cannot take your provisional as 3 off the tee.

As Ethan said, if you know that you will be unable to play the original ball, then play another and as long as you don't call it a provisional then that is the ball in play.

 

[sawtooth]

If I understand correctly, if I were to hit a poor tee shot into severe trouble for example, I should not state play a provisional but simply play another (3rd shot) by declaring ball unplayable (not lost).

I also believe that it is not necessary for me to go and look at the ball to determine playability of the ball. I can decide its unplayable.

I guess the subtle but key difference is the announcement to play a provisional. If I do that and if the original is found it must be played. Announcing this before the ball is struck protects against an unfair advantage being obtained because the player would otherwise be able to select the best between the original and provisional and that cannot be allowed?

If this is so far correct, what stops somebody hitting a errant tee shot and hitting a provisional (announcing it first) and then not really attempting to look for 5minutes knowing if he/she finds it, it would be detrimental? Is that illegal or just unsporting behaviour? And finally as somebody else just mentioned, the opponent is entitled to find the ball for the player? Thats another grey area because only the player can identify his ball as being his surely? Does the opponent ask "i think i found your ball can you confirm its yours?"

Sorry to labour this point but when I am in a medal I want to be sure I know the rules in case this scenario comes up.

Thanks.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

If you hit your first shot into trouble and then hit another without declaring it a provisional it becomes the ball in play irrespective of whether the original is the found.

You are perfectly entitled to hit a provisional (having declared the ball so first) and not bother looking for the original and telling your partners your intention is to proceed and play on with the provisional. However if someone in your match decides to look "on the off chance" and finds it the original is the ball in play.

In my opinion if a player has stated an intention to ignore the first ball it goes against the spirit of the game to go off an look for it, especially in matchplay, just so that he potentially is forced to play from a worse position.

 

[JustOne]

And finally as somebody else just mentioned, the opponent is entitled to find the ball for the player? Thats another grey area because only the player can identify his ball as being his surely? Does the opponent ask "i think i found your ball can you confirm its yours?"

Sorry to labour this point but when I am in a medal I want to be sure I know the rules in case this scenario comes up.

Thanks.

If he's unsporting enough to go look for it then declare "i think i found your ball can you confirm its yours?" then it really is down to your own honesty/integrity and sportsmanship. I'd probably say "No, but I did hit one just like that in here yesterday!

 

[bobmac]

If he's unsporting enough to go look for it then declare "i think i found your ball can you confirm its yours?" then it really is down to your own honesty/integrity and sportsmanship. I'd probably say "No, but I did hit one just like that in here yesterday!

So the guy who goes to try and find the ball is unsporting, but the person who says no when clearly he can identify his ball, isnt?

 

[Ethan]

One further point (possibly made already).

If you think you have hit your tee shot (or another shot) into the nasty, then hit a properly declared provisional, then find the first one in a horrible place, one of your valid options is to replay the shot. However, in this case, you can't then opt to use the provisional as your 3 off the tee. You must go back and play another off the tee.

 

[bobmac]

One more point if I may.

See pic below.

You hit your ball left into the trees and you announce and hit a provisional which finishes up in position 1.
You then hit it again into position 2, and then again into position 3.If then your opponent finds your first ball, you must play it.
If however you hit a shot from position 3 which is in front of where you assume your original ball lies then the original ball is deemed lost and your opponent can look as hard as he/she wants....it's lost and 2nd ball is in play.

 

[DCB]

It's all quite cleary described for all the options in Rule 27.