Roll Up Group Handicaps

[D-S]

There will be not one single club imo that will withdraw anyone’s handicap based on that person playing social golf with a different swindle HC

What someone does out there when they are playing social golf not organised by the club - has really nothing to do with anyone really providing they are treating the course with respect etc

They can play to whatever rules they want

Again, yes they can but whatever you say they will be breaching the rules laid down by the body that authorises their handicaps and governs their sport.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Again, yes they can but whatever you say they will be breaching the rules laid down by the body that authorises their handicaps and governs their sport.

Given our handicap secretary and other officials have deemed the roll up an organised event, played under rules of golf, then we are subject to not record or be known to operate two handicaps (i.e. have cuts). Even if we tried to keep it quiet these things have a way of leaking so from this Saturday we are operating the roll up as cards have to be put in, no card no chance to win the money, off full white handicaps. At the moment our roll up group is very much on the radar and I suspect those that don't put cards in this week, and particularly going forward will be in line for the education/persuasion conversations and we'd have to see where that goes regarding other sanctions

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Again, yes they can but whatever you say they will be breaching the rules laid down by the body that authorises their handicaps and governs their sport.

I’m sure it will be all ok

Plenty of ways to ensure that their social game will have nothing to do with EG

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Again, yes they can but whatever you say they will be breaching the rules laid down by the body that authorises their handicaps and governs their sport.

I have mentioned to a few rollup participants what might be coming the way of my Saturday rollup. Interestingly of the ones I spoke with the split was 50/50 OK with complying. Those against threw up the usual arguments against - as if the debate was still ongoing.

It will be interesting to see what happens. We have a well run and diligent handicap, competition and rules team in the club, and so I am pretty certain that the edict will come our way. I suspect it will be accompanied by the threat of us losing our late Saturday morning reserved tee times if we do not comply. There are a few of us who are vehemently and vociferously opposed to this. When the 'cards' issue has been raised with us in the past their voices have - in the past - held sway. My feeling is that the majority of us playing in the rollup will comply and move to submitting cards every week. I see no issue. I can still have a fun and social round of golf with three other guys even with a card in my hand.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I can still have a fun and social round of golf with three other guys even with a card in my hand.

Exactly this. Card will be put in and the world will keep turning

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Exactly this. Card will be put in and the world will keep turning

...and if its not so good as it might have been as I was careless on a couple of putts or for the fun of it I tried a risky shot or three that didn't come off...then so be it - the card will most likely sink towards the bottom of my 20, unlikely to ever be seen or heard of again.

 

[rulie]

I have mentioned to a few rollup participants what might be coming the way of my Saturday rollup. Interestingly of the ones I spoke with the split was 50/50 OK with complying. Those against threw up the usual arguments against - as if the debate was still ongoing.

It will be interesting to see what happens. We have a well run and diligent handicap, competition and rules team in the club, and so I am pretty certain that the edict will come our way. I suspect it will be accompanied by the threat of us losing our late Saturday morning reserved tee times if we do not comply. There are a few of us who are vehemently and vociferously opposed to this. When the 'cards' issue has been raised with us in the past their voices have - in the past - held sway. My feeling is that the majority of us playing in the rollup will comply and move to submitting cards every week. I see no issue. I can still have a fun and social round of golf with three other guys even with a card in my hand.

Why don't some players want to post those scores? I suspect they will be comp scores, not GP cards?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Why don't some players want to post those scores? I suspect they will be comp scores, not GP cards?

The club may well set up our rollup as a comp. The usual ‘it’s social golf’ arguments apply. Plus we allow gimmes - and there is the argument that this keeps it ‘friendly’ - as in having to hole a ‘gimme’ makes it serious. Plus holing out ‘takes time’ and makes rounds slower - to which I say “tosh”.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

The club may well set up our rollup as a comp. The usual ‘it’s social golf’ arguments apply. Plus we allow gimmes - and there is the argument that this keeps it ‘friendly’ - as in having to hole a ‘gimme’ makes it serious. Plus holing out ‘takes time’ and makes rounds slower - to which I say “tosh”.

If you allow gimmes then the card can’t be submitted and it’s a social comp that doesn’t fall under the remit

If people want to put the card in then putt out

 

[Backache]

The club may well set up our rollup as a comp. The usual ‘it’s social golf’ arguments apply. Plus we allow gimmes - and there is the argument that this keeps it ‘friendly’ - as in having to hole a ‘gimme’ makes it serious. Plus holing out ‘takes time’ and makes rounds slower - to which I say “tosh”.

I don't think the idea that holing out takes longer is tosh. Our roll ups operate at significantly higher speed than our medal rounds,it's not all due to holing out, but a lot is to do that we don't have a card in our hands and RoG are not rigorously applied.
If we were 'ordered' to handincards I suspect the rollup would cease to exist formally but carry on informally using our own Rules and Handicapping if necessary.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If you allow gimmes then the card can’t be submitted and it’s a social comp that doesn’t fall under the remit

If people want to put the card in then putt out

I know about having to hole out...we'd have to do away with gimmes and many who play in it are very attached to their gimmes.

As far as falling under the remit - everything about the rollup (apart from the fact that at the moment we allow gimmes) is identical to any club competition - my understanding is it is that which would require the club to require us to stop doing gimmes and hand in our cards.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I don't think the idea that holing out takes longer is tosh. Our roll ups operate at significantly higher speed than our medal rounds,it's not all due to holing out, but a lot is to do that we don't have a card in our hands and RoG are not rigorously applied.
If we were 'ordered' to handincards I suspect the rollup would cease to exist formally but carry on informally using our own Rules and Handicapping if necessary.

We apply the RoG as rigorously in our rollup as we do in any competition (except for gimmes) and any putt that is a gimme should be as tap-in - and so not requiring faffing about.

And as for my reply to Arthur Wedge - our rollup is set up identical to a club competition. If many left the rollup (we typically have 30-36 playing) we would simply have a reduced allocated number of tee times for those happy to stick a card in.

 

[rulie]

I don't think the idea that holing out takes longer is tosh. Our roll ups operate at significantly higher speed than our medal rounds,it's not all due to holing out, but a lot is to do that we don't have a card in our hands and RoG are not rigorously applied.
If we were 'ordered' to handincards I suspect the rollup would cease to exist formally but carry on informally using our own Rules and Handicapping if necessary.

Interesting comment. What Rules are not "rigoroursly applied"? And if not applied, is the round played in accordance with the Rules of golf?

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I know about having to hole out...we'd have to do away with gimmes and many who play in it are very attached to their gimmes.

As far as falling under the remit - everything about the rollup (apart from the fact that at the moment we allow gimmes) is identical to any club competition - my understanding is it is that which would require the club to require us to stop doing gimmes and hand in our cards.

Why do you have to do away with gimmies if that’s what people want

 

[Backache]

Interesting comment. What Rules are not "rigoroursly applied"? And if not applied, is the round played in accordance with the Rules of golf?

Mainly putts given and stroke and distance for lost balls

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Mainly putts given and stroke and distance for lost balls

We also have pick and place everywhere during the mud ball months

 

[Crazyface]

The club may well set up our rollup as a comp. The usual ‘it’s social golf’ arguments apply. Plus we allow gimmes - and there is the argument that this keeps it ‘friendly’ - as in having to hole a ‘gimme’ makes it serious. Plus holing out ‘takes time’ and makes rounds slower - to which I say “tosh”.

Gimmes when playing for money? That's a serious no from me! Also, roll ups and social golf are for trying those shots you would not attempt if going well in a medal and faced with a tricky shot going down the 17th.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Why do you have to do away with gimmies if that’s what people want

I thought I'd answered that. If the organisation and format of the rollup means that the club determines the rollup to be an acceptable competition for WHS we would have to stop gimmes unless a player simply puts NR for the hole whenever a gimme is accepted.

Alternatively of course maybe we change the format from individual stableford to 2 from 4 bowmaker....that would make the competition unacceptable for WHS purposes and so no cards need returned and gimmes could continue as at present.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Gimmes when playing for money? That's a serious no from me! Also, roll ups and social golf are for trying those shots you would not attempt if going well in a medal and faced with a tricky shot going down the 17th.

We play for a small pot (with 32 playing the winner will come away with maybe £14) and are pretty diligent about what is an acceptable gimme.

And as far as the 'tricky shot' question. Yes indeed - maybe I wouldn't in a medal when there is more at stake...but I may well attempt a few risk shots in a rollup comp. OK so it might mess up a card - but so what...that's OK for me in a rollup comp context - I am not bothered about rubbish scores going on my record when I put plenty of rubbish scores on my record when I am playing my most conservative golf.

 

[D-S]

Alternatively of course maybe we change the format from individual stableford to 2 from 4 bowmaker....that would make the competition unacceptable for WHS purposes and so no cards need returned and gimmes could continue as at present.

As long as you didn’t have your own handicap system.