Playing 18 hole shotgun start on a 9 hole course

[IJames]

Pretty sure IJames was responding to Alan Clifford?

I was indeed! @LizAig

 

[IJames]

Trying to follow their logic though, probably why it would be interesting to know if it is documented.

Although a 9-hole course, the competition is an 18-hole round. Normally, presumably a stipulated round is 1-18, if starting on the first. So, if a shotgun start is being played, why does it not simply go in numerical order (i.e. the stipulated round).

I suppose one key reason would be that, as there are physically only 9 holes, then technically everyone is starting on the front 9. Given that is a very different feature to an 18-hole course, then it opens up the opportunity to say you can complete the full front 9, and then follow this with the full back 9.

Is it documented, or does it even need to be documented generally? Perhaps it is simply just a condition of the competition, and the 9 hole clubs have all commonly adopted it as it works best?

Does seem to be 'convention over logic' then!

 

[Neilds]

Does seem to be 'convention over logic' then!

Yep, the old ‘we’ve always done it this way’ way of doing things

 

[Alan Clifford]

I suppose one key reason would be that, as there are physically only 9 holes, then technically everyone is starting on the front 9. Given that is a very different feature to an 18-hole course, then it opens up the opportunity to say you can complete the full front 9, and then follow this with the full back 9.

Surely not? If you tee'd off from the 10th tee when palying the first, haven't you played from the wrong tee.

 

[Alan Clifford]

Sorry for introducing the word "logic" into a golf discussion. I apologise profusely. But isn't a course with different tees for 1 and 10, 2 and 11, logically, and really physically too, an 18 hole course?

 

[rulefan]

If the teeing areas are different the 2 nines will have course ratings and slope.

 

[Alan Clifford]

Just a thought, if you play 3-9, 1-2, 12-18, 10-11, aren't you playing the course in the wrong order. So when you tee off from tee box 1 instead of 10, you are playing from the wrong tee? Rule 6.1b.

 

[IJames]

Just a thought, if you play 3-9, 1-2, 12-18, 10-11, aren't you playing the course in the wrong order. So when you tee off from tee box 1 instead of 10, you are playing from the wrong tee? Rule 6.1b.

No!

 

[Neilds]

No!

As per my previous question - why not?

 

[IJames]

As per my previous question - why not?

Wrong hole order perhaps, but not wrong tee - imo!

 

[rulefan]

Just a thought, if you play 3-9, 1-2, 12-18, 10-11, aren't you playing the course in the wrong order. So when you tee off from tee box 1 instead of 10, you are playing from the wrong tee? Rule 6.1b.

5.1 A “round ” is 18 or fewer holes played in the order set by the Committee.

 

[Swango1980]

Surely not? If you tee'd off from the 10th tee when palying the first, haven't you played from the wrong tee.

Not sure what you mean? On a 9 hole course, there will only be 9 starting holes, even tho it is an 18-hole round. So presumably players will only start on 1-9, and no one on 10-18.

So, a 9 hole course lends itself to play up to the 9th hole, then complete the front 9 after, before playing the back 9. An 18-hole course, that wouldn't be possible.

Still, not that I know why they do it this way, nor do I know if every 9 hole course does this.

 

[Alan Clifford]

5.1 A “round ” is 18 or fewer holes played in the order set by the Committee.

That's pretty conclusive then. So I guess the OP needs clarification from his committee.

 

[Neilds]

Not sure what you mean? On a 9 hole course, there will only be 9 starting holes, even tho it is an 18-hole round. So presumably players will only start on 1-9, and no one on 10-18.

So, a 9 hole course lends itself to play up to the 9th hole, then complete the front 9 after, before playing the back 9. An 18-hole course, that wouldn't be possible.

Still, not that I know why they do it this way, nor do I know if every 9 hole course does this.

A lot of 9 hole courses have 2 different tee boxes on each hole. Some courses they are almost next to each other so the hole plays the same on both 9s, others it can make a big difference

 

[rosecott]

A lot of 9 hole courses have 2 different tee boxes on each hole. Some courses they are almost next to each other so the hole plays the same on both 9s, others it can make a big difference

We have this set-up and, apart from one par 5 hole where there is little difference, the others are between 40 and 80 yards different.

For shotgun starts we use tees 15, 16, 17, 18, 1, 2, 3 with 2 groups on some tees depending on numbers playing. We would only use tees 4/13, 5/14 for a larger than normal field as they are a long way from the clubhouse.

This works seamlessly for us as all groups are playing holes in the same order, i.e. playing the same version of the hole as the group in front. All players know and understand how it works for us.

 

[Swango1980]

A lot of 9 hole courses have 2 different tee boxes on each hole. Some courses they are almost next to each other so the hole plays the same on both 9s, others it can make a big difference

Yes, but point I was making is you will only have one group starting in the hole(s). You won't have 2 groups teeing off different tees, onto the same fairway.

So, I'd have thought groups would simply be starting on holes 1-9, generally for 9 hole courses

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Does seem to be 'convention over logic' then!

No it's perfectly logical, unless you're saying that 9 hole courses with two sets of tees should operate differently to 9 hole courses with one set of tees, which would be illogical.

 

[LizAig]

You need to be careful with the 'Someone asked years ago' response. People have a habit of mis-remembering things and it may not have even been the right question that was asked. Try and get someone to find the response and see if that helps.

That was my concern -the phone call to England Golf must have been 40 years or so ago given two of the people I was speaking to about it were teenagers at the time

 

[LizAig]

No it's perfectly logical, unless you're saying that 9 hole courses with two sets of tees should operate differently to 9 hole courses with one set of tees, which would be illogical.

We have two sets of tees. For the ladies one hole is par 4 on front 9 but par 3 on back. I think for all tees the SI is in a different order on front 9 to back 9.

 

[Deleted member 30522]

We have two sets of tees. For the ladies one hole is par 4 on front 9 but par 3 on back. I think for all tees the SI is in a different order on front 9 to back 9.

Doesn't matter. I've not seen courses like that do differently. Finish the front 9 then begin again on the back nine