Out on Licence

Papas1982 said:
If we're gonna go back to as far as the crusades then we may as well just accept its a them and us world.
Click to expand...

A “them and us” world was created a long time ago and that’s not going to change in a long time

I accept that wars will have played a part in some beliefs. But if we accept that as an excuse for their actions then quite simply any terrorist act should be responded to with the same force. Its not ideal, buta soft touch won't work.
Click to expand...

No one said anything was an “excuse” - and what’s this soft touch you are talking about ? We as a nation went to war because of a terrorist act , we killed thousands of them - you think that’s a soft touch ?!
Blue in Munich said:
Would there be repercussions? Perhaps if we stood up to them, fought fire with fire, there wouldn’t be an issue; they’d be less inclined to do it.
Click to expand...

We went to war into their country and fought fire with fire - how did that work out ? How many others lost their lives because we went fire to fire - and people I worked with lost their lives because we went fire to fire

And the ones that brought your wife and daughter into it are the terrorists who attack innocent civilians; I’m just pointing out the fact that they are gutless cowards who love soft targets. I’m sorry if you’re uncomfortable with that fact, but it is a fact, so please spare me the moral reprimand.
Click to expand...

Really disappointing
 
Liverpoolphil said:
Why is it petty ?

You want to be part of a society that has the death penalty as part of his judiciary system , it was removed from our society because it wasn’t a deterrent and it was decided it wasn’t part of a civilised society - it’s not ever going to be re introduced so if you want to be part of a society like that then there are nations around the world that still have it.



And what would be the repercussions from the Islamic society for example - they are already committing these acts because of involvement in their lives - and then what happens when we start to make martyrs of them. Bringing my wife and daughter into it is low - really low , thought better.
Click to expand...

Re the bold. What a load of rubbish. Are you seriously saying that it wasn't a deterrent , meaning the murder rate hasn't increased.? Do you not watch the news or read newspapers from which it is clear that murders are now rife.
Feral youths are routinely stabbing people in London and elsewhere at a rate of knots.
Your views are unbelievably naive, and that is putting it politely. I cannot imagine anyone ,who cares more for society's protection than for way out trendy theories about reforming scum, thinking the way you do. The way you think just flabbergasts me.
And no, it isn't low to put it to you straight so that you think what you may want done , if the threat against safety became personal. It's a pertinent point that you choose to ignore
A fair man would want the same protections for all innocent citizens that he would want for his own family. And to focus your thinking on that is quite proper.
 
Papas1982 said:
I wasn't advocating the death penalty. I'm not opposed to it tbh. But I simply meant life inprisonment for any involvement at all.
Click to expand...
There are always degrees of involvement including unwitting involvement.
Do you put someone in gaol who has once clicked on a link advocating jihad?
Or as that policewoman the other day with porn received but not open a link and fail to report it?
Or someone whose house is being used but they are unaware of it, or you think they are unaware of it but are not sure , or they thought it was a koran study group?
 
Liverpoolphil said:
A “them and us” world was created a long time ago and that’s not going to change in a long time
Click to expand...
I don't see too many people of the western world going on killing sprees over there.
Liverpoolphil said:
No one said anything was an “excuse” - and what’s this soft touch you are talking about ? We as a nation went to war because of a terrorist act , we killed thousands of them - you think that’s a soft touch ?!
Click to expand...

I mean it the treatment to anyone involved at all. Carry out or aid any terrorist knowingly and you're inside for ever. I'm not talking the reactions to events. More the attempts to prevent repeats if yesterday where people are released.
 
Jamesbrown said:
Death penalty would be effective if it was done right. It’s no good offering a meal and an early bedtime is it?
Hanging, forced drowning would be more suitable. And cheaper.
Even if your a criminal sympathiser you could at least disable them and remove some limbs, genitalia or sight if that makes you sleep better at night that criminals still have a life?

Terrorists, rapists, murderers all must go.
Click to expand...

You should also add kiddy fiddlers to your list.
 
Backache said:
There are always degrees of involvement including unwitting involvement.
Do you put someone in gaol who has once clicked on a link advocating jihad?
Or as that policewoman the other day with porn received but not open a link and fail to report it?
Or someone whose house is being used but they are unaware of it, or you think they are unaware of it but are not sure , or they thought it was a koran study group?
Click to expand...
Didnt think I needed to clarify wiling involvement. Presumed that woukd be obvious been as the thread was regarding the release of convicted people.
 
Swinglowandslow said:
Re the bold. What a load of rubbish. Are you seriously saying that it wasn't a deterrent , meaning the murder rate hasn't increased.? Do you not watch the news or read newspapers from which it is clear that murders are now rife.
Click to expand...

If it’s such a deterrent why do the crimes still continue to happen in countries where the death penalty exists

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....at-executions-deter-criminals/?outputType=amp

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/thec...th-penalty-is-a-deterrent-against-crime-43227

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/news/s...e-the-death-penalty-is-an-effective-deterrent

Also why were there multiple murders going on when we had the death penalty

Feral youths are routinely stabbing people in London and elsewhere at a rate of knots.
Your views are unbelievably naive, and that is putting it politely. I cannot imagine anyone ,who cares more for society's protection than for way out trendy theories about reforming scum, thinking the way you do. The way you think just flabbergasts me.
Click to expand...

Why am I naive because I think that the death penalty is not the way to go ?
And no, it isn't low to put it to you straight so that you think what you may want done , if the threat against safety became personal. It's a pertinent point that you choose to ignore
A fair man would want the same protections for all innocent citizens that he would want for his own family. And to focus your thinking on that is quite proper.
Click to expand...

Sorry but what point am I ignoring ?
 
Swinglowandslow said:
Re the bold. What a load of rubbish. Are you seriously saying that it wasn't a deterrent , meaning the murder rate hasn't increased.? Do you not watch the news or read newspapers from which it is clear that murders are now rife.
Feral youths are routinely stabbing people in London and elsewhere at a rate of knots.
Your views are unbelievably naive, and that is putting it politely. I cannot imagine anyone ,who cares more for society's protection than for way out trendy theories about reforming scum, thinking the way you do. The way you think just flabbergasts me.
And no, it isn't low to put it to you straight so that you think what you may want done , if the threat against safety became personal. It's a pertinent point that you choose to ignore
A fair man would want the same protections for all innocent citizens that he would want for his own family. And to focus your thinking on that is quite proper.
Click to expand...
The death penalty isn't a deterant to a jihadist its a victory and way of showing their disciples and followers that the west is oppressing them so actually is their best recruitment tool.
 
Hobbit said:
Why not just keep them locked up for life - that stops them reoffending? Why kill them?
Click to expand...
The irony here is that it is pressure on the numbers in our overcrowded jails that is to blame for the early release on licence of prisoners.

These people bypass the parole board, it has the affect of reducing the prison population, but often lets people back out into society who are not ready or safe.

It is a prime example of massive underinvestment by successive governments over the past 50 years.

We need more prisons, more and better paid staff and the balls not to release people early,
people are given indeterminate sentences for a reason, the notion that it’s unfair on the poor darlings is tough.
However, the blame for early release of this particular perp is the judiciary, not the politicians.
However, now this has come to light, I would expect the first act of a new government would be to legislate to stop indeterminate sentences being turned into fixed term ones.
 
Normal prisons are'nt punishment enough for some people. Maybe we need prisons on bleak outposts like South Georgia where these people serve hard labour for life. Wind a resisted handle in your cell a thousand times a day or get half rations, forget the televisions or table tennis.
If anyone disagrees with this type of punishment then what do they suggest? Please don't say sit down with them and have a chat over a cup of tea.
 
I have no issue with the perpetrators of crimes such as this latest attack being killed by the authorities whilst carrying out their atrocities to prevent the situation escalating.

I also have no issue with stronger prison sentences following conviction.

However, the death penalty is a different matter for me as I consider it counter productive in many terrorism cases, certainly unlikely to serve as a deterrent and, finally, impossible to rectify in cases of miscarriage of justice.

Imagine if capital punishment had been applied to the Birmingham Six.
 
MetalMickie said:
I have no issue with the perpetrators of crimes such as this latest attack being killed by the authorities whilst carrying out their atrocities to prevent the situation escalating.

I also have no issue with stronger prison sentences following conviction.

However, the death penalty is a different matter for me as I consider it counter productive in many terrorism cases, certainly unlikely to serve as a deterrent and, finally, impossible to rectify in cases of miscarriage of justice.

Imagine if capital punishment had been applied to the Birmingham Six.
Click to expand...

But we are talking about 2019, not 1975.
Convictions are far more secure these days, but as I said earlier, judge each case on it's own merits.
 
Slime said:
But we are talking about 2019, not 1975.
Convictions are far more secure these days, but as I said earlier, judge each case on it's own merits.
Click to expand...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uk...-jail-miscarriages-of-justice-in-Britain.html

A few people there would be dead if you had your way

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....scarriage-of-justice-victims-uk-supreme-court


All it takes is one innocent person to be given the death penalty - but then that’s been done before as well

Quite a lot of people still get wrongly convicted
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

DaveyG
I read What a Waste and thought.... thats me! (Bring on the abuse)
2 3
Replies
48
Views
5K
DaveyG
DaveyG
L
Have you ever witnessed a Tour Pro CHEATING in a Tour Event? 54 % Yes
2
Replies
26
Views
8K
Phil2511
Phil2511
Imurg
Hear me out on this one...
2
Replies
20
Views
2K
Parmo
Parmo
Herbie
South Kyme Golf Club
Replies
2
Views
2K
Herbie
Herbie
Top