Most expensive buggy hire ever

[robinthehood]

Why are some clubs banning buggies in comps? I couldn't care less it doesn't improve your golf that's for sure

 

[Kellfire]

Why are some clubs banning buggies in comps? I couldn't care less it doesn't improve your golf that's for sure

For many it does as they’d feel fatigue or an exacerbation of existing conditions if they had to walk.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

For many it does as they’d feel fatigue or an exacerbation of existing conditions if they had to walk.

In view of the very small amount of physical effort required to play a golf shot I struggle to see how a little fatigue will affect a player's ability.

Has any evidence ever been produced to support the theory?

And if a "level playing field" is to be created then surely caddies and trolleys also need to be banned.

 

[clubchamp98]

In view of the very small amount of physical effort required to play a golf shot I struggle to see how a little fatigue will affect a player's ability.

Has any evidence ever been produced to support the theory?

And if a "level playing field" is to be created then surely caddies and trolleys also need to be banned.

Yes it’s a choice to have a caddy.
It’s a choice to have an electric trolley.
It’s a choice to have a push trolley.
It’s a choice to carry your clubs.
But you can’t have a buggy ?

As long as they are avaliable to everyone who wants one ,and course allows them.
It’s just another choice!

 

[robinthehood]

For many it does as they’d feel fatigue or an exacerbation of existing conditions if they had to walk.

Makes no odds to me, if my oppo in a match has a buggy then crack on. Clubs need all the cash they can get, not allowing buggies in comps is just cutting off a revenue stream .

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Yes it’s a choice to have a caddy.
It’s a choice to have an electric trolley.
It’s a choice to have a push trolley.
It’s a choice to carry your clubs.
But you can’t have a buggy ?

As long as they are avaliable to everyone who wants one ,and course allows them.
It’s just another choice!

Exactly.

I can only base it on what happens at our Club where we have six buggies available.

Competitions on Saturdays in the season see a field of 156 and yet I don't recall ever seeing all the buggies in use.

I have played with some who have used one and never noticed any appreciable improvement in their game, even over the closing holes.

 

[Dibby]

In view of the very small amount of physical effort required to play a golf shot I struggle to see how a little fatigue will affect a player's ability.

Has any evidence ever been produced to support the theory?

And if a "level playing field" is to be created then surely caddies and trolleys also need to be banned.

What do you consider a "small amount"?

To swing a driver at 100mph takes about 2HP. Assuming you take approx 40 full shots in a round, that's 40 seconds of effort at 2HP, but this could be doubled with practice swings.

To put that in perspective, during a 100m sprint, Usain Bolt would produce about 3HP for less than 10 seconds. If you asked him to do 1 sprint an hour for 4 hours, I would be willing to bet the last sprint would be slower than the first one.
An elite track cyclist would produce around 3HP for a simialr period.

It may be surprising to many, but a golf swing is actually a big effort. This is why practising with loads of swings can lead to diminishing returns.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

What do you consider a "small amount"?

To swing a driver at 100mph takes about 2HP. Assuming you take approx 40 full shots in a round, that's 40 seconds of effort at 2HP, but this could be doubled with practice swings.

To put that in perspective, during a 100m sprint, Usain Bolt would produce about 3HP for less than 10 seconds. If you asked him to do 1 sprint an hour for 4 hours, I would be willing to bet the last sprint would be slower than the first one.
An elite track cyclist would produce around 3HP for a simialr period.

It may be surprising to many, but a golf swing is actually a big effort. This is why practising with loads of swings can lead to diminishing returns.

Very few club golfers' driver swingspeed is 100 mph or above despite the BS and, in any event, those 40 swings are spread out over approx 4 hours with pronounced gaps (recovery periods) between them.

To even reference Usain Bolt in the discussion is bizarre to say the least.

 

[Dibby]

Very few club golfers' driver swingspeed is 100 mph or above despite the BS and, in any event, those 40 swings are spread out over approx 4 hours with pronounced gaps (recovery periods) between them.

To even reference Usain Bolt in the discussion is bizarre to say the least.

That's because either club golfers are inefficient, so they use the same power and get less speed, or they produce even less power, so still have to work at their maximum.

To reference Usain Bolt is to point out the effort in swinging a golf club is higher than people imagine, people can understand sprinting is a big effort, but commonly underestimate the effort to swing a golf club. The science in terms of power usage clearly shows this. Every golf swing is like doing a sprint start, up to 5-10m. If you had to do 40 sprint starts over 4 hours, do you think the last one would be as fast as the first few?

Just because people don't feel something, doesn't make that real.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

That's because either club golfers are inefficient, so they use the same power and get less speed, or they produce even less power, so still have to work at their maximum.

To reference Usain Bolt is to point out the effort in swinging a golf club is higher than people imagine, people can understand sprinting is a big effort, but commonly underestimate the effort to swing a golf club. The science in terms of power usage clearly shows this. Every golf swing is like doing a sprint start, up to 5-10m. If you had to do 40 sprint starts over 4 hours, do you think the last one would be as fast as the first few?

Just because people don't feel something, doesn't make that real.

What golfers swing was measured (and by whom) to arrive at the claimed figures?

Were similar readings taken with clubs other than the driver? After all, unless you are having a complete 'mare, you're not going to be hitting driver 40 times in a round.

 

[Dibby]

What golfers swing was measured (and by whom) to arrive at the claimed figures?

Were similar readings taken with clubs other than the driver? After all, unless you are having a complete 'mare, you're not going to be hitting driver 40 times in a round.

The golfers swing is irrelevant, that would tell us more about how they develop that power, in terms of the power needed, all you need to know is the length and weight of a golf club, and how fast you want to move it. I believe this was originally calculated by CB Daish, but there have been plenty of similar studies since.

I don't know about other clubs, but it's a reasonable assumption to assume the change of effort needed is of minimal difference, because most distance loss from driver down the bag is through shorter shafts and more loft, not the golfer changing effort of the swing, until we get to less than full swings, pitch shots, chips etc...

My calculations may not be perfect, but they are based on science and facts. It's easy to find imperfections with them, but instead of doing that, why not share the basis for your claim that it's a small effort, apart from you think so?

 

[Deleted member 18588]

The golfers swing is irrelevant, that would tell us more about how they develop that power, in terms of the power needed, all you need to know is the length and weight of a golf club, and how fast you want to move it. I believe this was originally calculated by CB Daish, but there have been plenty of similar studies since.

I don't know about other clubs, but it's a reasonable assumption to assume the change of effort needed is of minimal difference, because most distance loss from driver down the bag is through shorter shafts and more loft, not the golfer changing effort of the swing, until we get to less than full swings, pitch shots, chips etc...

My calculations may not be perfect, but they are based on science and facts. It's easy to find imperfections with them, but instead of doing that, why not share the basis for your claim that it's a small effort, apart from you think so?

You mean with barely half researched phony science.

I agree I am making assumptions, based upon playing the game for over 45 years but you are equally guilty with your assumptions regarding other clubs.

After all the majority of swings in a round will be with those other clubs.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

@£275 buggy hire
One walking, one riding, I’ve never had that; what was the playing experience like driving round while your partner walked etc. Did he tend to walk with the other pairing or did you slow down to his pace and stick beside him?

Did you have any close calls where your partner nearly sat in the cart by accident or was it pretty smooth sailing from a rules perspective?

Well done again on the win, whens the final

We had a member of our Team last year given permission to use a buggy in one match, Caddy walked alongside pulling his clubs.

 

[Dibby]

You mean with barely half researched phony science.

I agree I am making assumptions, based upon playing the game for over 45 years but you are equally guilty with your assumptions regarding other clubs.

After all the majority of swings in a round will be with those other clubs.

What part of it is phony?
The calculation of the driver swing is based solidly in facts.

The calculation of full swings with other clubs is an educated guess, based on the facts that as you move down the set, the shaft gets shorter, the clubhead gets heavier, and the assumption that for most golfers the effort needed to move a heavier shorter club at a lower speed is not that much different to moving a longer, lighter club at a higher speed.
Seeing as you disagree, what difference (in a measurable unit) do you think there is between driver and other clubs?

Even if we ignore everything, except driver and assume 1 practice swing and 1 real swing for 12 holes that it is used, it is still equivalent to 24 sprint starts. Perhaps your fitness levels are very high, and your idea of small effort is different to mine, but if I did 24 5-10m sprint starts, I would consider it a decent effort.

I will leave it at that, as clearly you have your own opinion, but hopefully, you at least consider some of the science of the matter, rather than just dismiss it out of hand because I added a few assumptions and it disagrees with your preconceived notion.

 

[Imurg]

To try add a bit of balance to this

I have been in the opposing position when someone has asked to use a buggy because of injury - and because it states clearly in our rules and conditions of competition you must be on the authorised buggy list for permanent use or have a doctors note to use only temp in comps - to ensure all rules were adhered to and fair to all as well consist then they all got the same response, and yes someone was DQ for using a buggy in a Comp when they weren’t on the list and didn’t have a note , that’s the rule of our comps and it’s up to us all to ensure they are consistent to all

Would you have accepted the Consultant's letter as evidence a buggy was required?

 

[garyinderry]

The plot thickens she has only been chair of h,caps and comps for two months. She was in the pro shop when I arrived this morning and was disqualifying 15 members from Saturdays comp for not paying their comp entry fees by Friday night and paying in the pro shop on Saturday. She must have read the book ‘ how to make enemies and cheese people off’ it’s comical.

Do you guys always have to pay the night before ? Is there no chance of becoming free and being able to rock up join in at the end of the comp?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Would you have accepted the Consultant's letter as evidence a buggy was required?

I’m pretty sure we would have - I guessing the letter would state that he would medically need to use a buggy - or words to that effect

As long as there was something official from a medical person then yes they would be allowed initial temp use of a buggy and then if the person wanted to be on the Perm Buggy list - doctors note would then be needed to state that

 

[clubchamp98]

Do you guys always have to pay the night before ? Is there no chance of becoming free and being able to rock up join in at the end of the comp?

At ours we book comps online and if you havnt got sufficient funds in your account you can’t put your name down.

I think is to do with the charges the bank put on banking cash.
Everything is on your club card.

If you rock up and there is a space the pro will put you in but it still goes off your card.

 

[garyinderry]

At ours we book comps online and if you havnt got sufficient funds in your account you can’t put your name down.

I think is to do with the charges the bank put on banking cash.
Everything is on your club card.

If you rock up and there is a space the pro will put you in but it still goes off your card.

Suppose it isn't hard to keep it topped up. A function where you get a text if it runs out or low would be mighty handy.

We just pay cold hard cash on arrival. Our comps are on all day too so you can turn up when you like and get out. Obviously the busy time will be booked out.

 

[clubchamp98]

Suppose it isn't hard to keep it topped up. A function where you get a text if it runs out or low would be mighty handy.

We just pay cold hard cash on arrival. Our comps are on all day too so you can turn up when you like and get out. Obviously the busy time will be booked out.

We did have a problem last week.
Nobody told the members you can’t use the levy money (£100) to pay your comp fees.
So lads with £102 on their cards were denied entry because of lack of funds. (Entry is £2.50).
That didn’t go down well.