Maximum handicap 18?

[rosecott]

i am a member of a club and of course i've played a comp off back tees. my handicap is 3 and only took 1 year to get there with no lessons i started on 12.

if you cant play to a decent standard after a few month then you shoudn't be on the course. all high handicappers do is hold everyone else up and are the cause of slow play

This debate reminds me of the “That Was The Week That Was” sketches (that dates me) with John Cleese, Ronny Barker and Ronnie Corbett.
John Cleese (Cat 1 and 2 players) looks down on Ronny Corbett (Cat 3 players) who looks down on Ronnie Corbett (everyone else).

Sorry - product of age and red biddy - Ronny Barker was in the middle.

 

[rosecott]

Simplest solution I suppose would be for every card to be handed in. More scores would mean more accurate handicaps. The downside would be slower rounds as every pity would need to be seen in.

In my mad world, I like the idea of all cards being handed in (not socials obviously, but everything else Q' or not). With the advent of h'cap'ing computers, it could be done.
Our club tried to bring in a system to cut/increase players based on 9 hole scores made in our summer midweek 9 hole roll-ups. It was almost universally unapproved of.
So, player "a" scores 20/21/20/19/23 points, gets no cut and then romps off with a biggie late summer with 45 points. Player "b" makes 14/15/12/13/15, gets no +0.1 and starts the autumn still to high for his capability.
and the same happens with Sunday games.....

I despair.

Why not include all cards - including social golf? It happens elsewhere.

 

[jammag]

ok so I think we get the point now, your getting frustrated because higher handicappers are winning tournaments and you are not. which you believe is because of the current handicap system. People are always going to play better or worse than there handicaps I bet no one will play to there handicap twice in a row.

As said earlier I play off 19 but get frustrated because I have not played a round to 19 in a while. Because our club only runs a comp twice a month mainly if I cannot make that date then I am screwed in trying to get the handicap down. I dont wanna be off that much neither will the people who are romping home with the comps. I dont know whether this is a problem at most clubs with not enough comps to get handicaps down.

Only way I see this changing is if you miss a buffer which should be at 3 or 4 shots then you should punished harder than a .1 and everyone who shoots under a buffer should be decreased rapidly til you get a steady number.

For example, if someone gets down to a 10 handicap yet suffers an injury where it puts them out for a couple of months, its highly unlikely they would come back and play to 10 again, if they are punished realistically then they would perhaps get up to a 14 handicap within a few rounds and then it would suit there ability at there time. Then they can work there way back down. A more flexible handicap system would help people and make competitions a fair reflection on current ability.

 

[IM01]

but there are some very good high handicappers on the Forum, always willing to give technical advice and golf strategy tips to single figure and low teen players

Used to play off 2 but have managed to half my hcp after joining this forum......thanks for the tips guys

 

[rosecott]

ok so I think we get the point now, your getting frustrated because higher handicappers are winning tournaments and you are not. which you believe is because of the current handicap system. People are always going to play better or worse than there handicaps I bet no one will play to there handicap twice in a row.

As said earlier I play off 19 but get frustrated because I have not played a round to 19 in a while. Because our club only runs a comp twice a month mainly if I cannot make that date then I am screwed in trying to get the handicap down. I dont wanna be off that much neither will the people who are romping home with the comps. I dont know whether this is a problem at most clubs with not enough comps to get handicaps down.

Only way I see this changing is if you miss a buffer which should be at 3 or 4 shots then you should punished harder than a .1 and everyone who shoots under a buffer should be decreased rapidly til you get a steady number.

For example, if someone gets down to a 10 handicap yet suffers an injury where it puts them out for a couple of months, its highly unlikely they would come back and play to 10 again, if they are punished realistically then they would perhaps get up to a 14 handicap within a few rounds and then it would suit there ability at there time. Then they can work there way back down. A more flexible handicap system would help people and make competitions a fair reflection on current ability.

I hope you have misdirected your attack - I am not complaining about high handicappers in any way - my only beef is players knowingly playing off false handicaps.

 

[rosecott]

Knob.

 

[musselburghgolfclub]

this is nothing to do with it but being a junior we like to get hcaps down and sometimes boast about it but the mens game at my club is all about trying to bandit to cat4 then submit a cat2 score and then take home the win.

hcap 24.2
weapons nike ignite sasquatch 10.5
nike t60 ignite
cobra hump irons
vokey 54 spin milled
nike oz1

 

[rosecott]

I can't believe that. I've been around a lot longer than you've been alive and I've never been a member of a club where that was the norm.

 

[bobmac]

but there are some very good high handicappers on the Forum, always willing to give technical advice and golf strategy tips to single figure and low teen players

Used to play off 2 but have managed to half my hcp after joining this forum......thanks for the tips guys

Duffer
How's the putting going?

 

[rosecott]

I'm starting to wish I hadn't started this. I feel like I'm opening the batting for England v the rest of the world - and I'm Scottish!

 

[Aztecs27]

Hopefully I'll have more time to get some comps played over the next month or so to get my H'cap down to mid-teens when I can find some consistency.

That's a bit blase Mr Moderator sir!

For someone with a handicap of 19 and has gone up 2 .1's

Think you need to play a lot more comps and then you might come down a bit. Not being funny but you make it sound like a given that you will get to a mid handicap by just playing a little more.

It may not be as easy as that, but great if you do.

Golfmmad

It is a bit blasé and presumptuous but knowing my game the way I do, i suspect it's true. My short game has always been my downfall along with a destructive slice which, with the help and guidance of our Bob, I'm slowly eliminating with the aid of a grip and swing overhaul.

You are very right though, I need to play in a lot more comps, but sadly haven't had the time. That .2 cam on the weekend of m 1st comp in nearly ten years which happened to be the club championship on a weekend which saw th worst weather I've ever played in, so I'm not too concerned....yet

I totally get what you're saying though, and bonus marks for respecting my authority...Mr. Moderator has a rather nice ring to it

 

[RGDave]

For example, if someone gets down to a 10 handicap yet suffers an injury where it puts them out for a couple of months, its highly unlikely they would come back and play to 10 again, if they are punished realistically then they would perhaps get up to a 14 handicap within a few rounds and then it would suit there ability at there time. Then they can work there way back down. A more flexible handicap system would help people and make competitions a fair reflection on current ability.

I like this way of thinking. It would need some refinement though.

We had a chap at ours who's wish for ages was to play for the club team. He was off 16 and couldn't play to it. He played every Sunday of every weekend of every year. He never got enough 0.1s to get up to the 20-22 (?) he should have been on.

i.m.o. there needs to be a system to go up faster if your game is not even close. I'd advocate increments (0.4/0.3/0.2) to going back up. Not per stroke (no) but some system to get people moving more regularly.

Why does a 16 h'cap require a 3 shot buffer zone? Someone off 16 returning 33/34/35 points week in week out should creep up to 17, then 18, then maybe get a small cut and go round in circles.

 

[jammydodger]

I agree Dave , I made it down to 3.0 early in the year before embarking on 12 straight misses of the buffer zone. My h/c does not reflect my play this year at all. In fact I wouldnt have buffered if i'd been off 8 either

 

[jammag]

For example, if someone gets down to a 10 handicap yet suffers an injury where it puts them out for a couple of months, its highly unlikely they would come back and play to 10 again, if they are punished realistically then they would perhaps get up to a 14 handicap within a few rounds and then it would suit there ability at there time. Then they can work there way back down. A more flexible handicap system would help people and make competitions a fair reflection on current ability.

I like this way of thinking. It would need some refinement though.

We had a chap at ours who's wish for ages was to play for the club team. He was off 16 and couldn't play to it. He played every Sunday of every weekend of every year. He never got enough 0.1s to get up to the 20-22 (?) he should have been on.

i.m.o. there needs to be a system to go up faster if your game is not even close. I'd advocate increments (0.4/0.3/0.2) to going back up. Not per stroke (no) but some system to get people moving more regularly.

Why does a 16 h'cap require a 3 shot buffer zone? Someone off 16 returning 33/34/35 points week in week out should creep up to 17, then 18, then maybe get a small cut and go round in circles.

I just used the 3 shot buffer as an example, I was thinking of if you dont play to it as 2 shots is maybe not enough if you changed to this format as 1 oob or a plug in the bunker could mean you quickly use them 2 shots up. Also a larger buffer would prove you did not play to your handicap and may deserve to go up more than .1.

I feel at the moment the current handicap system shows what your was playing in the past not a current handicap. For example you can shoot 5 under your handicap maybe 3 or 4 times in a row and you still wont be down 5 in your handicap. The same applies to playing above your handicap as well it can take up to 10 rounds to just get an increase of 1 shot.

 

[rosecott]

For example, if someone gets down to a 10 handicap yet suffers an injury where it puts them out for a couple of months, its highly unlikely they would come back and play to 10 again, if they are punished realistically then they would perhaps get up to a 14 handicap within a few rounds and then it would suit there ability at there time. Then they can work there way back down. A more flexible handicap system would help people and make competitions a fair reflection on current ability.

I like this way of thinking. It would need some refinement though.

We had a chap at ours who's wish for ages was to play for the club team. He was off 16 and couldn't play to it. He played every Sunday of every weekend of every year. He never got enough 0.1s to get up to the 20-22 (?) he should have been on.

i.m.o. there needs to be a system to go up faster if your game is not even close. I'd advocate increments (0.4/0.3/0.2) to going back up. Not per stroke (no) but some system to get people moving more regularly.

Why does a 16 h'cap require a 3 shot buffer zone? Someone off 16 returning 33/34/35 points week in week out should creep up to 17, then 18, then maybe get a small cut and go round in circles.

I just used the 3 shot buffer as an example, I was thinking of if you dont play to it as 2 shots is maybe not enough if you changed to this format as 1 oob or a plug in the bunker could mean you quickly use them 2 shots up. Also a larger buffer would prove you did not play to your handicap and may deserve to go up more than .1.

I feel at the moment the current handicap system shows what your was playing in the past not a current handicap. For example you can shoot 5 under your handicap maybe 3 or 4 times in a row and you still wont be down 5 in your handicap. The same applies to playing above your handicap as well it can take up to 10 rounds to just get an increase of 1 shot.

I'm pretty certain that, if you shot 5 under 3 or 4 times in a row, your handicap committee would have you down by 5 in pretty quick time. Rule 23 (General Play) exists to deal with such situations.