chrisd
Major Champion
I think you are right DCB - don't you just wish they would write in plain English!
Chris
Chris
Match play Question
- Thread starter evahakool
- Start date
d2cko
Assistant Pro
Can you tell B not to look for it though? I know officially you can't declare a ball lost but it still happens at my club...
DCB
Well-known member
It doesn't matter, A has lifted the ball out the hole before B even looks for or finds the original.
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
officaly Not until the the 5 mins allowed search time has passed , nobody says you have to look too hard tho , just stroll around if you want but if the other player finds it within the 5 min & he knows for definate its your ball you must play the origional. no choice
last bit of that rule states.." provided his original ball has not already been found in bounds within five minutes of B starting to search for it."
DCB
Well-known member
Check out the decisions on this one bladeplayer... if A lifts it out the cup on the way past.... it's all over 
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
Sorry DCB i was updating the last post , the end of the rule does state "provided the origional ball has not been found in the 5mins " or something close to that ,have a look for exaqct wording , still leads me to believe the 5 min has to elapse 1st .. wouldnt be 100% sure tho .. apologies i was editig last post as you repliedCheck out the decisions on this one bladeplayer... if A lifts it out the cup on the way past.... it's all over
" provided his original ball has not already been found in bounds within five minutes of B starting to search for it. " thats it now mate sorry
DCB
Well-known member
bladeplayer , DarthVega,
the crux of this one is the wording "has not already been found" If player A lifts the ball out of the cup before player B looks for and finds the original ball it is all over.
It really is that simple.
the crux of this one is the wording "has not already been found" If player A lifts the ball out of the cup before player B looks for and finds the original ball it is all over.
It really is that simple.
MashieNiblick
Tour Winner
Yep agree DCB that's how I see it. So...
If provisional is picked out of hole before the second ball is found then provisional becomes ball in play.
If the first ball is found in bounds within 5 minutes before provisional is picked out of hole then picking the provisional out of the hole doesn't make any difference. First ball is ball in play.
If the first ball isn't found within 5 minutes then de-facto it is lost and provisional becomes ball in play whether or not it is picked out of the hole.
I conceed there is some room for ambiguity in relation to the proviso about not finding the first ball within 5 minutes and this could be interpreted to mean you have to look for the first ball for 5 minutes. However as there is no requirement in the Rules that a player has to search for a ball he thinks is lost when he has played a provisional I don't think that interpretation is correct.
The Decision quoted refers to "equity" which in this case is used to answer the question that, if you've holed your provisional, you can't play it from a point nearer the hole than where your first ball might be, so at what point does it become the ball in play? In my view the Decision means it can become the ball in play when it's picked out of the hole, without having to spend 5 miutes searching for the first ball, in same way that a ball played from a point nearer the hole than the where the original was likely to be would.
This cuts both ways of course and after picking the provisional out of the hole you may find your original has rebounded off a boundary wall behind the green and is just out of sight sitting down in a sprinkler head a foot off the green. Too late - you don't get to try for birdie with that ball - provisional ball has become ball in play.
Naybrains
Tour Rookie
Great use of words,you lost me after I
cheezburga
Club Champion
The 5 minutes thing is all a bit "irrelevant" - in that they always quote it when referring to looking for a ball - its to emphasise that the looking can only last for a maximum of 5 mins. In this particular instance its best to regard the "picking the ball from the hole" as being the equivalent of playing a shot at a provisional from the fairway. (ie if you don't want your ball found, then spank your provo as quick as you can and don't give the others any chance to look). If your ball is in the hole, you can't "play a shot" so in equity picking the ball out is the equivalent.
bladeplayer
Money List Winner
My bad DCB i misunderstood that one . thank you..
