lie angle question

[JT77]

Gary, I have had all sorts of lies on clubs, if they are too flat the heel will dig first and open the club face, too upright and will shut the face.
My mizzys were 4 deg flat, and found my swing became increasingly flat, my last set were 1.5 flat which sat about spot on for me. My new irons, well I'm waiting to see, getting good flight and strikes off them, they are standard currently.
A friend of mine got fit for some miuras last autumn and the fitter told home to play them for 3 months to get used to them, the look at his divots and see what was happening, take some pics and head back, if needed the clubs could be adjusted, but the fitter won't use a board as he feels it gives false readings.
I am currently happy with standard, would I notice if they were flat? Yes I think I would and also if they were up.
But then I am very picky and have a little ocd so I would also notice the look of the head, as it just wouldn't be the same.

 

[ScienceBoy]

I would invest in some security cameras

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I'd probably notice at the range although I'd no doubt assume it was a swing flaw and spend ages trying to fix that first

 

[garyinderry]

Getting a lend of those upright irons off my mate.

Will see if there is any change in the shape of my divots.

 

[MendieGK]

but the fitter won't use a board as he feels it gives false readings. .

This is also the view of some excellent club fitters I know.

 

[garyinderry]

What's the thinking behind this?

 

[Lump]

Mine irons are super upright. My wedges are standard lie and I bloody hate them because of it.
I believe I would spot a flat iron at setup but not be able to tell the difference between standard and upright until a few swings.

 

[garyinderry]

Why don't you get the wedges adjusted ?

 

[JT77]

Not 100% sure, it's a false surface though so u don't get a true reflection of club surface interaction so maybe he just feels that it's not right. I can find out for u if u like.

 

[garyinderry]

Please do.

Pretty sure my lie angles will be completely different to a couple of years ago. I used to really reach for the ball but now not half as much.

 

[delc]

Gary, I have had all sorts of lies on clubs, if they are too flat the heel will dig first and open the club face, too upright and will shut the face.
My mizzys were 4 deg flat, and found my swing became increasingly flat, my last set were 1.5 flat which sat about spot on for me. My new irons, well I'm waiting to see, getting good flight and strikes off them, they are standard currently.
A friend of mine got fit for some miuras last autumn and the fitter told home to play them for 3 months to get used to them, the look at his divots and see what was happening, take some pics and head back, if needed the clubs could be adjusted, but the fitter won't use a board as he feels it gives false readings.
I am currently happy with standard, would I notice if they were flat? Yes I think I would and also if they were up.
But then I am very picky and have a little ocd so I would also notice the look of the head, as it just wouldn't be the same.

If irons are too flat, it's the toe that will tend to catch the ground and cause the face to open. For right handers, the shots will go right, If they are too upright, then the heel tends to dig into the ground and the face will close and the shots will tend to go left. To hit a clean shot you will have to favour the toe end of the face or the heel end of the face respectively, so you are not hitting off the centre of the face, which is not ideal!

 

[hovis]

If irons are too flat, it's the toe that will tend to catch the ground and cause the face to open. For right handers, the shots will go right, If they are too upright, then the heel tends to dig into the ground and the face will close and the shots will tend to go left. To hit a clean shot you will have to favour the toe end of the face or the heel end of the face respectively, so you are not hitting off the centre of the face, which is not ideal!

Sorry jt but delc is correct. Too upright and the heel digs in and the toe takes over and shuts the face. Too flat is the complete opposite

 

[davemc1]

I had standard lies before the mizuno fitting, came back 2° upright. Had 2 pb's since.

Not sure thats because of lie angle, better suited shafts, more forgiving clubs or just playing better?

However im totally convinced custom fitting works.

 

[JT77]

Yep that's what I meant, just got myself a little confused. I knew what I meant though

 

[ManinBlack]

I think the effect of wrong lie angles is not as great as we might imagine for two reasons:

1. If we strike the ball properly it's ball, then turf. The club & ball are in contact for such a short time that any deflection of the clubface is likely to happen after the ball has gone.

2. The soles of modern clubs are quite rounded &, no matter which part of the sole contacts the turf, the contact is likely to be minimal.

I need my clubs 3° flat & yet, when my clubs were being regripped, I used my grandson's clubs, totally unsuitable for me, & shot one of the best rounds of the year. I could actually feel the heel digging into the ground but the shots went straight because the digging in happened post strike.

 

[Blue in Munich]

I think the effect of wrong lie angles is not as great as we might imagine for two reasons:

1. If we strike the ball properly it's ball, then turf. The club & ball are in contact for such a short time that any deflection of the clubface is likely to happen after the ball has gone.

2. The soles of modern clubs are quite rounded &, no matter which part of the sole contacts the turf, the contact is likely to be minimal.

I need my clubs 3° flat & yet, when my clubs were being regripped, I used my grandson's clubs, totally unsuitable for me, & shot one of the best rounds of the year. I could actually feel the heel digging into the ground but the shots went straight because the digging in happened post strike.

That's a big if at amateur level. The wrong lie angle will also force you into an unnatural address position which will tend to the same issues as if the club were digging in.

 

[delc]

Having my clubs flattened by a couple of degrees improved my game no end. Biggest improvement is on hard range mats and bare lines, where there is no grass to tee the ball up a bit.

 

[bladeplayer]

I use to naturally hit a draw with all my old irons . slightest bit off the draw became more of a hook , would come down near the target but excessively kick right with the l-r spin
got fitted for the Ap2's & worked on that with Graeme , went to 2*flat, spin rate hence dispersion improved massively so id say id notice it all right

 

[ManinBlack]

That's a big if at amateur level. The wrong lie angle will also force you into an unnatural address position which will tend to the same issues as if the club were digging in.

I really don't believe this is the case. I sometimes see people address the ball with the toe obviously pointing upwards. Better than nothing is to have the lie angle set correctly at address. If this is done it's unlikely to be that far out at impact.

 

[hovis]

I think the effect of wrong lie angles is not as great as we might imagine for two reasons:

1. If we strike the ball properly it's ball, then turf. The club & ball are in contact for such a short time that any deflection of the clubface is likely to happen after the ball has gone.

2. The soles of modern clubs are quite rounded &, no matter which part of the sole contacts the turf, the contact is likely to be minimal.

I need my clubs 3° flat & yet, when my clubs were being regripped, I used my grandson's clubs, totally unsuitable for me, & shot one of the best rounds of the year. I could actually feel the heel digging into the ground but the shots went straight because the digging in happened post strike.

Even if you get the ball first it makes a difference. If the toe is down then the club is pointing to the right. Toe up and the club face is pointing left. Also if your lie angles are of this will also make it difficult to find the centre of the face.

I agree a small amount isn't a big deal but i have my clubs 3.5 degrees upright and cant use standard clubs for toffee