keeping score in matchplay

[super hans]

I played in the first round of our club championship knock-out on Sunday. my opponent kept a scorecard all the way round ( I just kept score in my head ). every couple of holes I would say 1 up, or all square etc and he would nod.

it was a/s until I won holes 6,7 & 9. as we walked to the 10th tee my opponent said "are you 2 up or 3 up, ive lost count?" - now given that he was keeping score on every hole, I thought it was a bit of mindgames, so I said I think its 2up (knowing full well i was 3 up.) he paused for a bit as he totted up the scorecard and said - yes youre right, its 2up.

I laughed it off and teed up and off we went up the 10th. I then decided to play the rest of the match in my mind as if I was only 2 up instead of 3. I eventually won the match 1up in my mind - (really 2&1) after halving the 18th. He congratulated me as we walked off and I asked if I could see the scorecard - he showed me it and he had entered all the scores correctly but hadn't added my winning hole at the 6th to the +/- column.

What I want to know is, if the match had gone a/s after the 18th and I lost in extra holes, what would the outcome be, and would his scorecard be a valid source of information ?

(im aware I should have corrected him at the 10th, but what is the ruling regards what is the actual score at any point during a matchplay tie with no referee/third party?)

p.s - do you keep a scorecard during a matchplay tie?

 

[Maninblack4612]

Good question & I don't know the answer, but one will be along shortly, I'm sure. I always keep a card in serious matchplay because I hate to be distracted by not being sure of the score & it's easy to forget or get it wrong.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I'd have thought that once the match is over to both players satisfaction and in their agreement - it's over. No deliberate misinformation going on and you didn't contest his statement - besides it's the players responsibility to keep track of score in the match.

 

[Spuddy]

You need to make the claim as soon as you know about it so waiting until the end of the match to make a claim about something that happened earlier in the round (that you were aware of at the time) isn't allowed.

 

[Maninblack4612]

You need to make the claim as soon as you know about it so waiting until the end of the match to make a claim about something that happened earlier in the round (that you were aware of at the time) isn't allowed.[/QUOTE
Who says? Please quote a rule.

 

[Spuddy]

You need to make the claim as soon as you know about it so waiting until the end of the match to make a claim about something that happened earlier in the round (that you were aware of at the time) isn't allowed.[/QUOTE
Who says? Please quote a rule.

the R&A/USGA... Rule 2-5

 

[super hans]

You need to make the claim as soon as you know about it so waiting until the end of the match to make a claim about something that happened earlier in the round (that you were aware of at the time) isn't allowed.

I fully appreciate that I should have corrected his (possibly deliberate?) mistake - however if he had said he was 9 up at that point and I didn't correct him, are you saying he would then be 9 up ?

 

[Spuddy]

If you knew you weren't 9 down yet agreed with him at the time that you were then you can't change your mind if he wins the 10th and says match over.

 

[super hans]

I fully appreciate that I should have corrected his (possibly deliberate?) mistake - however if he had said he was 9 up at that point and I didn't correct him, are you saying he would then be 9 up ?

that's surely not the same as agreeing with him, but I feel we're losing the point


is it a verbal agreement that determines the score or a scorecard?

 

[Fyldewhite]

If you knew you weren't 9 down yet agreed with him at the time that you were then you can't change your mind if he wins the 10th and says match over.

As above........Decision 2.5/6 is the same principle. Why on earth did you just agree with him if you knew he was wrong btw??

 

[Spuddy]

There's no requirement to keep a scorecard. You should agree the result of each hole prior to teeing off on the next.

 

[super hans]

As above........Decision 2.5/6 is the same principle. Why on earth did you just agree with him if you knew he was wrong btw??

I didn't agree with him nor did I correct him (again, my bad) - however his scorecard showed me to be 3 up at that point.

so what is the official score at that point

im 3 up because I am
im 3 up because his scorecard says so
im 2 up because I "think" I am
im 2 up because he "thinks" I am genuinely and I don't correct him
im 2 up because he tries it on and I don't correct him

 

[super hans]

There's no requirement to keep a scorecard. You should agree the result of each hole prior to teeing off on the next.

Thanks Spuddy.

 

[joma1108]

I suppose its the same in stroke play
if you say to your partner was that a 4 (for arguments sake) and they say yes, you both mark as a 4 then its a 4

its only if you go no wait that was a 5, I fluffed one earlier etc

if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, chances are its a duck

I wouldn't have agreed its just leaving yourself wide open particularly if you had lost or tied the match after the 18th.

just my humble opinion

 

[super hans]

I suppose its the same in stroke play
if you say to your partner was that a 4 (for arguments sake) and they say yes, you both mark as a 4 then its a 4

its only if you go no wait that was a 5, I fluffed one earlier etc

if it looks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, chances are its a duck

I wouldn't have agreed its just leaving yourself wide open particularly if you had lost or tied the match after the 18th.

just my humble opinion

once again, I didn't agree. I've learned my lesson though.

quarter final is tonight and I'm keeping a scorecard AND confirming the score after every hole

 

[Spuddy]

once again, I didn't agree. I've learned my lesson though.

quarter final is tonight and I'm keeping a scorecard AND confirming the score after every hole

You don't have to agree, but if you disagree then you have to make it known at the time. Best of luck tonight :thup:

 

[joma1108]

You don't have to agree, but if you disagree then you have to make it known at the time. Best of luck tonight :thup:

ok now remember some of us are hard of thinking .......but if you don't have to agree, that means you disagree and you only make it known if you disagree so that means you agree to disagree or is that disagree to agree....my heads about to burst

 

[ger147]

once again, I didn't agree. I've learned my lesson though.

quarter final is tonight and I'm keeping a scorecard AND confirming the score after every hole

You're right, you didn't agree. It was you who suggested you were 2 up and your opponent agreed with you. A bit daft IMO and any repercussions would have been caused by your deliberate misinformation to your opponent at the turn, but that's only my opinion.

 

[Maninblack4612]

the R&A/USGA... Rule 2-5

That's better!

 

[Colin L]

that's surely not the same as agreeing with him, but I feel we're losing the point


is it a verbal agreement that determines the score or a scorecard?

Spoken agreement is enough. It is possible to play out an entire match without either player writing anything down. I always keep a note of the state of a match i.e. holes up or down or square because I don't trust my memory, but I don't write down the number of strokes taken at any hole.