Iran admit downing civilian airliner

[gmc40]

What’s the “Intelligence? Is this the same “intelligence” they refused to share with their own senators?

With the exception of my last point, everything in my post is factual. The last point is my opinion formed by my first two points and the thousands of other actions Trump and his cronies have taken since 2017.

And the ‘poking’ you refer to is a direct consequence of Trumps actions.

If I remember correctly, wasn’t it you a while back saying that BJ was a good foreign secretary? If so it may explain why you have formed the opinion that DT’s actions are for ‘honest’ reasons.

 

[SocketRocket]

What’s the “Intelligence? Is this the same “intelligence” they refused to share with their own senators?

With the exception of my last point, everything in my post is factual. The last point is my opinion formed by my first two points and the thousands of other actions Trump and his cronies have taken since 2017.

And the ‘poking’ you refer to is a direct consequence of Trumps actions.

If I remember correctly, wasn’t it you a while back saying that BJ was a good foreign secretary? If so it may explain why you have formed the opinion that DT’s actions are for ‘honest’ reasons.

Maybe you should explain who you are refering to?

 

[drdel]

What’s the “Intelligence? Is this the same (1) “intelligence” they refused to share with their own senators?

With the exception of my last point, everything in my post is factual. The last point is my opinion formed by my first two points and the thousands of other actions Trump and his cronies have taken since 2017.

(2) And the ‘poking’ you refer to is a direct consequence of Trumps actions.

If I remember correctly, wasn’t it you a while back saying that BJ was a good foreign secretary? If so it may explain why you have formed the opinion that DT’s actions are for (3)‘honest’ reasons.

1. 'Serious' intelligence is only spread on a need-to-know basis and there was a concern it would be leaked for political gain.
2. And the Russian support (they were Russian missiles), Syrian incursions etc. etc are all just dreamt up by USA/UK/France and others -really!
3. I have no evidence from anywhere reliable to say it wasn't and a rather large body of published defence material to say, on the basis of probability, that it was IMO.

 

[SocketRocket]

Theres some flawed logic being used here. If we follow that logic then absolutely any act carried out by Iran however brutal is all Trumps direct fault. Lets say Iran let off a dirty bomb in Israel/USA/any country they chose then its Trumps fault. This logic is flawed, taken to an extreme if Canada shot down an Iranian airliner in response to their citizens being killed by Iranians then Trump would be to blame. Its exactly this kind of irrational thinking that starts World wars.

 

[gmc40]

1. 'Serious' intelligence is only spread on a need-to-know basis and there was a concern it would be leaked for political gain.
2. And the Russian support (they were Russian missiles), Syrian incursions etc. etc are all just dreamt up by USA/UK/France and others -really!
3. I have no evidence from anywhere reliable to say it wasn't and a rather large body of published defence material to say, on the basis of probability, that it was IMO.

I’ll address points 1 & 3

1. “Leak for political” gain? Are you suggesting that if there was solid evidence of imminent attacks against American assets, Democratic party members would leak it to get one over on him. Or am I misunderstanding?
Also why wasn’t the “intelligence” declared after the act? Can’t leak the “intelligence” after the attack.
3. There is literally tonnes of evidence that Trumps actions continue to be dishonest. Time after time after time. That for me is enough to question anything he does with a huge degree of scepticism. Add in the fact that his representatives refused to share that intelligence.

 

[Tashyboy]

Maybe I am missing something, but I have lost count the amount of times that Iran has bombed tankers, petrol refinery’s, American warships. Killed Americans and Trump has done nothing. Until now.Trump sanctioned the missile attack on the very person who instigated all of these murders and he is to blame For the incompetence of shooting down a civilian airliner.

Could someone enlighten me.

 

[patricks148]

According to Jezza the Red it was a plane crash, what a plank.

what a sad man you are, the guy posts saying his thoughts are with the family of those killed and that the counties should work together to reduce tension and you want just score cheap points get a life

 

[Blue in Munich]

I take it Trump didn’t listen to you at the Pentagon briefing on this then? ??

Well not everyone on his own side is impressed with the quality of the briefing...

https://www.ft.com/content/79f87a12-31c0-11ea-9703-eea0cae3f0de

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

To be fair, it’s not “any excuse to have a pop at him” is it. His actions have indirectly led to this. He pulled out of the Iran deal purely because he’s trying to undo the actions of his predecessor. Then he decided to blow up an Iranian general because of an “imminent threat” that doesn’t exist. Unless that “imminent threat” means the impeachment hearing and this years election.

In a speech at a GOP/Trump rally a few days ago VP Mike Pence gave a couple of reasons for the assassination - and neither reason was related to any imminent threat to US lives...

bottom line - according to Pence there was no imminent threat - and so there being no imminent threat Trump need not have ordered the assassination...and so we find unintended consequences...Iran trigger nervous...terrible mistake.

 

[Blue in Munich]

No, that is exactly what I meant.

Your OP implied that the missile was launched in response to Trump’s action. It wasn’t. It was launched in error. A response implies a deliberate act. It wasn’t. Perhaps I misunderstood your words but that’s how it comes across.

An error committed in the aftermath of their attack on the American bases, that action being in direct response to the Trump sanctioned assignation of the Iranian general. Had Trump not sanctioned the initial action, the response & heightened tensions that led to the error would not have existed.

Put it another way; how many times has that flight flown over that airspace without incident prior to Trump's little stunt? Sorry, but the two incidents are inextricably linked for me.

 

[gmc40]

I take it Trump didn’t listen to you at the Pentagon briefing on this then? ??

In a speech at a GOP/Trump rally a few days ago VP Mike Pence gave a couple of reasons for the assassination - and neither reason was related to any imminent threat to US lives...

bottom line - according to Pence there was no imminent threat - and so there being no imminent threat Trump need not have ordered the assassination...and so we find unintended consequences...Iran trigger nervous...terrible mistake.

I saw that clip. I think they’re just making it up as they go along.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Not all GoP Senators are convinced

 

[Piece]

An error committed in the aftermath of their attack on the American bases, that action being in direct response to the Trump sanctioned assignation of the Iranian general. Had Trump not sanctioned the initial action, the response & heightened tensions that led to the error would not have existed.

Put it another way; how many times has that flight flown over that airspace without incident prior to Trump's little stunt? Sorry, but the two incidents are inextricably linked for me.

That’s more accurate and I would agree. It is different though to what you first said. ?

 

[Blue in Munich]

Maybe I am missing something, but I have lost count the amount of times that Iran has bombed tankers, petrol refinery’s, American warships. Killed Americans and Trump has done nothing. Until now.Trump sanctioned the missile attack on the very person who instigated all of these murders and he is to blame For the incompetence of shooting down a civilian airliner.

Could someone enlighten me.

Which specific incidents are you referring to; enlighten us?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Maybe I am missing something, but I have lost count the amount of times that Iran has bombed tankers, petrol refinery’s, American warships. Killed Americans and Trump has done nothing. Until now.Trump sanctioned the missile attack on the very person who instigated all of these murders and he is to blame For the incompetence of shooting down a civilian airliner.

Could someone enlighten me.

Which incidents ?

 

[drdel]

I’ll address points 1 & 3

1. “Leak for political” gain? Are you suggesting that if there was solid evidence of imminent attacks against American assets, Democratic party members would leak it to get one over on him. Or am I misunderstanding?
Also why wasn’t the “intelligence” declared after the act? Can’t leak the “intelligence” after the attack.
3. There is literally tonnes of evidence that Trumps actions continue to be dishonest. Time after time after time. That for me is enough to question anything he does with a huge degree of scepticism. Add in the fact that his representatives refused to share that intelligence.

There is a very good reason that Top Secret data is not released for 30 years!! it would be daft to show intelligence to your enemy: sources can be researched and removed.

 

[Tashyboy]

Which specific incidents are you referring to; enlighten us?

if I have to point you in the direction of Iran attacks oil refinery, Iran attacks oil tankers, Iran attacks embassies, thenit makes your initial post all the more astonishing.

 

[Blue in Munich]

if I have to point you in the direction of Iran attacks oil refinery, Iran attacks oil tankers, Iran attacks embassies, thenit makes your initial post all the more astonishing.

So you're not going to answer the question, or you're not able to; which is it?

 

[SocketRocket]

Which incidents ?

https://www.aipac.org/-/media/publi...a-history-of-iranian-attacks-on-americans.pdf

 

[Tashyboy]

So you're not going to answer the question, or you're not able to; which is it?

So you have not heard of Iranians attacking oil tankers in the Gulf, or attacking oil refinery’s With drones. Have 5 mins on Mr Google and enlighten yourself. I did.