Hardest hole v SI 1

[Neilds]

Following on from the Hardest Hole thread, how many people think their hardest hole is not the SI 1 hole? I know that it is not just difficulty that decides SI but does it on your course?
I recall the first time I played Wrag Barn, near Swindon, about 7 years ago as a 24 handicapper, I birdied the SI 1 and par on the SI 2 ?. I have never fully understood the grading of the SI 1 hole

 

[Deleted member 23344]

Our S1 hole is dead straight with a wide fairway ... no way the hardest. I’m sure others will give a proper explanation, but I understood that the index numbers are not in the order of perceived hardness, but rather they are arranged to give a more equitable application of shots across the board between those that get one or two shots and those that get considerably more.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

At my course the hardest hole on the front 9 is the SI 2 and the hardest on the back 9 is the SI 1. I don't think you would find anyone who has played the course that would disagree.

I know the system is not necessarily geared up to be like that but I do find it oddly satisfying and how it should be ?

Good question

 

[Imurg]

Our SI 1 is about 400 yards off the whites, slight dogleg left
4 bunkers on the corner, 1 on the right, 1 either side of the green.
Played into the breeze, normally, and slightly uphill for the 2nd shot to a raised green with a ridge running through it.
Plays about 1.3 over par and is officially the 2nd most difficult hole on the course
Off the yellows (378) it drops to 5th hardest
Higher SIs seem to be towards the fringes of each 9 with the lower ones towards the middle and, to an extent, do mirror difficulty as well.

 

[BubbaP]

I think I recall a few clubs did list two sets of SI on the card. One being the usual "space out for matchplay ", and the other a reflection of difficulty based on analysing comp scores.

 

[USER1999]

Our index 1 and 2 are pretty much spot on. Arguably you could reverse index 3 with index 5, as 3 is the harder hole, but as it is the second, it doesn't work that early.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Our hardest hole is the 12th (https://www.royalascotgolfclub.co.uk/course/course-tour/hole/12/ - apologies for the awful music) but for the longer hitters it never plays as such as they can clear the line of trees that runs down the right (and ditch that also runs the length of the hole from the corner of the dogleg)

Our 16th is the hardest in competitive play (SI3 - https://www.royalascotgolfclub.co.uk/course/course-tour/hole/12/ ) which is by far the toughest driving hole. OOB tight right but longer hitters, especially those with a draw can aim at the big oak and move it back and because of their length it widens past the tree. For the average player the landing zone between the tree and OOB is about 20 yards wide

 

[jim8flog]

It would be a really tough choice to chose between our stroke index 1-3 holes very depends on the direction an strength of the wind and depends on whether or not you are a long and straight hitter, a long hitter or a straight medium hitter.

For me it has to be a our stroke index 2 because it is uphill all the way, 2 tier green and an approach more suited to a short par 4 due to the surrounding contours. I can only reach it on a good day with a running fairway in summer.

The SI 1 one is downhill most of the way with a largish dogleg. Try to overpower the drive and you can right through the fairway in to the woods. Reachable by a medium but good accurate player

The S1 3 is a long downhill 220 yards par 3, the predominate wind is left to right, the green is two two tiered with a big left to right slope and there is a very big bunker well short of the green designed to catch any shot short and straight which bounces right on landing, woods on the left which a ball aimed too much left will normally end up in. It is the only par 3 on the course where I have had a hole in one though.

 

[jim8flog]

Following on from the Hardest Hole thread, how many people think their hardest hole is not the SI 1 hole? I know that it is not just difficulty that decides SI but does it on your course?
I recall the first time I played Wrag Barn, near Swindon, about 7 years ago as a 24 handicapper, I birdied the SI 1 and par on the SI 2 ?. I have never fully understood the grading of the SI 1 hole

If the course are SIs are set up for match then difficulty is a secondary concern.
Ours are set up for Stableford simply because far more Stableford, medal competitions and swindles who use St'ford are played than matches. We had two cards at one time but players kept using the wrong card.

 

[BubbaP]

Expect this will be unusual as the SI 1 is a par 5, the 11th.
Teeing area is at an angle to the fairway, which although quite wide has OB both sides. It is a 3 shotter for most of us, with the approach being over water or a big tree depending on the angle you are hitting from.
Flyover

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Expect this will be unusual as the SI 1 is a par 5, the 11th.
Teeing area is at an angle to the fairway, which although quite wide has OB both sides. It is a 3 shotter for most of us, with the approach being over water or a big tree depending on the angle you are hitting from.
Flyover

As it happens our SI 1 is our 550yd par 5 11th hole

OoB all down the RHS - tee shot into a gently rising fairway. 3rd shot after good tee and 2nd will be an 'uphill' blind shot of about 100yds. Into the prevailing wind. Only the very longest hitters have any chance of getting home in two, and for any who might try the green is well protected by a cross-bunker 30yd short and right of the front, and a nice big greenside bunker

It's not our hardest hole...but just after the turn it's one we have to negotiate with care as it can be a bit of a card-wrecker

 

[ScienceBoy]

Back at south winch 1-4 were all difficult in their own ways. A quirky par 4 that is a layup many, a long par four with a tough approach, a loooooong par 5 and a par 3 over water with tricky chips onto it.

If you played those four well you were onto a good round.

 

[Pathetic Shark]

The 17th on the Old Course St.Andrews is accepted to be one of the hardest holes in the world. It is SI 5.

 

[nickjdavis]

I've just had a look at ours and compared them with the hole difficulty stats from our handicap software.

Now I know that with the exceptions of 2 holes, the SI's have been the same for 20 years and I'd be surprised if any statistical analysis took place before then (course opened in 1993) of the scoring on each hole....but....our SI's are uncannily in line with the scoring averages of the holes.

Only the first and the third are out of kilter.

The 18 holes in terms of DIFFICULTY / SI....

6/13, 10/11, 12/5, 8/9, 2/2, 16/17, 4/4, 15/15, 7/7, 18/18, 9/8, 13/10, 1/1, 17/16, 3/3, 14/14, 5/6, 11/12

somehow its difficult to believe that someone didn't do any analysis in the early days!!!!

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Our si1 is not the hardest in my opinion, but it is one of the toughest. There are at least 3 holes I find harder.

 

[Dan2501]

Hole 9 at Lancaster is SI1 and it deserves it, rough hole. Tight teeshot on a hole that doglegs to the left with OB left, a stream half way down and trees down the right. Finding the fairway is the tough bit but the green slopes from back to front so hit the wrong section of the green and you can end up with a tough putt. Tough hole that has ruined plenty of cards, including mine.

 

[GG26]

Our SI1 is the 16th, a 430 yard par 4, which has a brook running across it 100 yards out and from that point it doglegs slightly right. It is easily the hardest hole on the course to get par so is rightly SI1.

 

[larmen]

I like our SI1 hole. It has oob on the left, water on the right, and you have to carry water on everything but a left side pin.

However, it isn’t the longest par 4 and I can reach it in 2. I nearly birdied it a couple of weeks ago if on the 2nd shot I didn’t catch only air at my 1st go.
The hardest hole in my opinion is the SI3 hole which is a long par 4 and has some trench running across the fairway so my 2nd shot on a good day is a layup still some 130 away.

 

[Orikoru]

Our hardest hole (in my opinion and the one I gave in the other thread) is SI 3. That's the 2nd hole. The SI 1 is given on the 7th hole, which is a tough hole as it's a long par 4 as well, but it's much straighter than the 2nd and not as long.

The only really strange one is that SI 4 is a straightforward 350 yard par 4. I often wondered why it had such a low SI, but an old member I was playing with told me that many years ago the tee used to be further back and tucked over on the left meaning you had to basically hit a draw, and it all made sense. I guess courses change over time but often nobody updates the stroke index.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Our toughest hole is the par 3 that I linked to in the other thread. Stroke index 11!!? 200+ yards uphill with steep drop off on one side feeding down a bunker.

I don’t know a single person at the club who wouldn’t take a bogey if offered before teeing off.