bobmac
Major Champion
I'm trying to remember the last time I heard of a mass stabbing.
Gun activists.
- Thread starter Taz
- Start date
Britishshooting
Club Champion
True in most cases I agree. Unfortunately I think it's just too late in the USA. Yes they can impose tighter restrictions and checks like the UK does for instance but it's going to have little impact now when there is so much free access to guns.
I'm in no way saying 'open carry' for instance is the right move and would improve the situation but a lot of these cowards target vulnerable areas and in cases that they don't they usually get gunned down by a member of the public before a mass murder occurs.
Some people that own guns in the UK complain of how hard it is to access guns but I do genuinely think we have it right and I'm not trying to say otherwise, I'm just playing devils advocate.
Britishshooting
Club Champion
June 2017 for one. Vehicle ramming and stabbing killed 8.
bobmac
Major Champion
I'm sorry, I meant in the US
Ye Olde Boomer
Well-known member
I can understand your disgust with America allowing the private ownership of para-military weapons.
I share it.
As for self-defense weapons like handguns, I can understand laws against concealed carry but you should be able to have whatever you want in your own home.
But as an American, I cannot for the life of me understand the proscription of sporting arms in the UK.
If you can ban the ownership of hunting and target shooting arms, you can just as easily outlaw golf clubs and cricket bats as well.
That looks plain and simple to me. Obviously not to you, which is fine.
I can't see it as anything but an intrusion on individual rights.
This is clearly an issue where we won't agree, but that's irrelevant as we write our own laws, not one another's.
I share it.
As for self-defense weapons like handguns, I can understand laws against concealed carry but you should be able to have whatever you want in your own home.
But as an American, I cannot for the life of me understand the proscription of sporting arms in the UK.
If you can ban the ownership of hunting and target shooting arms, you can just as easily outlaw golf clubs and cricket bats as well.
That looks plain and simple to me. Obviously not to you, which is fine.
I can't see it as anything but an intrusion on individual rights.
This is clearly an issue where we won't agree, but that's irrelevant as we write our own laws, not one another's.
Kellfire
Blackballed
Like black slaves? That was legal in your country for a while.
There was even a war that was in part waged over it with large swathes crying out for their right to own black people. But eventually most of society moved on. As they would over guns.
Ye Olde Boomer
Well-known member
Slavery was an original sin, begun while an English colony, from which America has still not recovered and may never recover.
We were the last western nation to abolish it because we've always been a socially regressive nation.
It is very much the same as presently being the only developed nation on the planet without comprehensive socialized medicine.
It's inevitable, but we'll be by a shameful margin the last to get there. That, not firearms, is our greater national disgrace.
The firearms thing is cultural.
I must understand how firearms ownership is not integral to UK culture.
I don't believe you will ever understand how it's integral to our culture.
That's OK. It's not something that you need to understand.
Some Americans don't understand the principle of monarchy in the Third Millennium, but it doesn't bother me.
HRM Bess seems like a nice lady.
We were the last western nation to abolish it because we've always been a socially regressive nation.
It is very much the same as presently being the only developed nation on the planet without comprehensive socialized medicine.
It's inevitable, but we'll be by a shameful margin the last to get there. That, not firearms, is our greater national disgrace.
The firearms thing is cultural.
I must understand how firearms ownership is not integral to UK culture.
I don't believe you will ever understand how it's integral to our culture.
That's OK. It's not something that you need to understand.
Some Americans don't understand the principle of monarchy in the Third Millennium, but it doesn't bother me.
HRM Bess seems like a nice lady.
Britishshooting
Club Champion
It was also a fundamental aspect of the British Empire.
Quite a difference in my opinion than equal rights of the human race and outlawing of slavery than banning an inanimate object.
Guns wont ever be banned in the UK altogether never mind the US.
Kellfire
Blackballed
Having guns statistically impinges in the rights of others - the right to not be shot.
Kellfire
Blackballed
Yea the English have a pretty awful history. Maybe one day they’ll stop but Brexit suggests otherwise.
The Queen and her family are leeches and hopefully their days are numbered and we’ll move towards a republic.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
And then we will elect Tony Blair (for example) as president, spend loads of cash on houses, offices, entourage, travel, hotels, protection, etc, and be no better off. Can't see it being any different.
Ye Olde Boomer
Well-known member
We have a "Bill of Rights," that is what we call the first ten amendments to our constitution.
We are constitutionally guaranteed the right to bear arms.
We are NOT constitutionally guaranteed the right to not be shot.
Each nation has its own laws and its own priorities.
I have plenty of problems with our priorities, but not having an NHS bothers me a lot more than private firearms ownership.
The overwhelming majority of American gun owners do not commit felonies, and it's already illegal for convicted violent felons to retain their firearms rights,
Ye Olde Boomer
Well-known member
This is not an issue on which we'll ever agree,
but it must be an entertaining topic because we do keep on about it.
but it must be an entertaining topic because we do keep on about it.
Britishshooting
Club Champion
Is this solely on a general populous level or inclusive of police/armies etc?
My guns in my possession would never harm another even somebody burgling my home. I could beat them with a 7 iron instead and be less likely to go down for manslaughter. Where does banning of inaminate objects stop though? Just guns or are knives included as thats the bigger issue here in the UK? Include the car as well vehicle ramming is on the up. Large crowds a car can cause a horrendous amount of casualties/fatalties.
Soon we'll be eating from sporks and travel solely by foot if we have to ban objects that could potentially be used to harm others. This is moreso on a UK Level but the hoops of gun ownership and cost of firearms is not worth the hassle to someone who wants to cause carnage. A rambo knife and car for ramming purposes would be the easiest route hence this being a very popular choice for terrorists...
You can apply your closing statement to any inaminate object by the way, even a pencil if you desired.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
In terms of personal protection, in my home I could stab a burglar to death with a knife, a sword, a grass hook, I could chop him with an axe, or a mattock, whack him with a hammer, a base ball bat, a pick axe handle. I could be more inventive, and use a chisel, a screw driver, a spanner, or a wheel brace. Any of which could prove lethal.
All of these would probably see me end up in the clank.
My best bet is the rubber bar I use for my tennis elbow. It doesn't look much (it's pink for starters) but I could whack the crap out of someone without doing lasting damage. Weapon of choice.
All of these would probably see me end up in the clank.
My best bet is the rubber bar I use for my tennis elbow. It doesn't look much (it's pink for starters) but I could whack the crap out of someone without doing lasting damage. Weapon of choice.
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
I've got this vision in my head now, Chris.....and it wont go away.......Pink? What were you thinking?
bobmac
Major Champion
So out of all the inanimate objects mentioned above which were designed for a purpose, the gun is the only one designed to kill
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
The colour represents the resistance level. My requirement was the pink one. It looks like a 14" sex toy.
Wolf
Well-known member
Could argue Knives and swords were originally inveted to kill but only 1 out of 3 is technically in need if a license.. But thats just me being pedantic..
I see both sides of the argument in that guns laws 100% should be that they shouldn't be able to be carried uless used for sport or work but around that very stringent rules and requirements for usage, safety and storage.. But being devil's advocate its not the gun that kills thats merely the tool, its the person pulling the trigger that is the killer and why we need proper gun laws.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
I don't think my katana is designed for health benefits, but in general, yes, you are correct. That said, do any killing in your house, with whatever weapon, and you will be in trouble for it.
