GIR's or not

[funkyfred]

Hope you don’t mind me bringing this up to the top of the forum, but I was looking at Haplesshackers score card from Monday, and was impressed with the scoresaver system he was using.
It brings up something I mentioned several weeks ago about GIR, and how do YOU score it? Hapless didn’t have one in 18 holes of golf and his target (according to his scorecard) is 4%, that’s one GIR in 25 holes?? And again looking at his scorecard he has a 400 yard par five hole, the 9th. Any way back to my point, now we all have a drive and we are allowed 2 putts per hole, but what’s in between. Pars and GIR is for scratch golfers, if you play off a 5 handicap, you are being allowed another 5 shots to play to the same standard as the scratch golfer. Now these shots are allowed on the five hardest holes. Therefore isn’t it right to think that you can take an extra shot to get onto the green on that particular hole(s). and still be on the green in GIR

Where I play, we have 7 holes over 400 yards with the shortest being 416 yards (S.I 1) up hill into a narrow opening, only the big hitters can really get up there. We also have another par 4 at 452 yards (S.I 3) with a great big lake in front of it, and just to make it worse, there’s a ditch at 250 yards to pick up any long drives, how can the mere mortal get GIR on these holes.

Surely GIR is something that should be obtainable, if that means taking (allowed) 3 shots to reach the green on a particular difficult par 4, then that’s should be the standard. Of course its easy for me playing of a 26h/c where I’m allowed 2 extra shots on 8 holes to make some greens but surely that s what the handicap system is for.
So my 11/18 and 12/18 GIR in my 2 rounds yesterday will go into my book, I’m sure they will give me more encouragement than haplesshackers 0% and with a target of 5%.
Obviously as I improve as a golfer my GIR will become harder as my h/c comes down.

What do you good people think?

Thanks Hapless for showing us your scorecard, lets hope we see another at the other end of the scoring system..

 

[theeaglehunter]

That is a very interesting idea, and basically boils down to whether you are considering your gross strokes or net strokes to find the number of GIR you hit. I have always thought of it, and recorded it, as the gross number so even if I get a shot on a par 4 I would consider that I am not on in regulation if my ball is say just short after 2 shots. It would be interesting to see how many more greens I would be considered to have hit if working it out depending on the amount of handicap shots I get on a specific hole, but this to me would be pretty pointless overall as more times than not if I had played to / near to my handicap I would have hit 100% net GIR leaving me nothing as a subjective target upon which to improve.

I do get what you are saying, but I think it is best left to the traditional method of strokes allowed to be on in regulation, it gives you a better reflection of where you are in terms of your game.

 

[haplesshacker]

To answer your question as I would score it.

On my scorecard, everything is based against scratch. Therefore on a par 3 I would record a GIR if I got there in one. Par 4s, would be if I landed on the green in 2, and par 5s in 3. So all scores are recorded as gross / scratch level. The programme takes into account..........hang on; I'm thinking.

Okay.

Yes I record everything as a scratch player ie. GIRs. But at my h'cap I'm only expected to hit for eg, 5% of them. As my h'cap gets better, then the software would expect me to get a higher percentage of GIR. Therefore my encouragement is to beat my expected percentages.

As you have seen the programme also gives you your gross birdies, pars, bogeys etc. And then gives you a net birdies, par bogeys etc.

Perhaps SS2 would answer this a bit better.

Anyway there is a free trial for 30 days on Scoresaver 2. Give it a trial.

Not sure if I've helped really.

 

[rgs]

Everyone will have their own opinion on what constitutes GIR irrespective of handicap.
I fall into the camp which believes your handicap should dictate your GIR stats.
18 handicapper should reach par 4's in 3 shots, par 3's in two shots, Par 5's in 4 shots. Anything less is stil a GIR but is also a bonus.
And in 2 putts per hole he shots level par net.

 

[birdieman]

GIR is related to par, not to someone's handicap. 1 shot on a par 3, 2 shots on a par 4 3 shots on a par 5 - simple.

Trying to tell yourself you're a better player than you are by suddenly making GIR a net thing is delusional imo.

If you have a high handicap and cant make a long par 4 in 2 then you haven't hit a GIR. It's no biggy, its your total score that counts, not GIR.

I play off a lowish handicap and hit it quite well on Sunday, however I only hit 7 out of 18 greens in regulation. That's why I have to chip and putt well as do we all, if we don't it's another 0.1 usually.

 

[freddielong]

GIR's is what it is you can't start manipulating it to make you look better just because you don't like the figures

par 3 = 1 shot
par 4 = 2 shots
par 5 = 3 shots

it is a good way of gaugeing improvements but is lost if you start changing the system

 

[medwayjon]

Totally agree, GIR is GIR regardless of handicap, as you improve you get more GIR's.

Its like having 2 shots on a par 4, scoring a 3 net 1 and then saying you got a hole-in-one. Its just not true!

 

[Macster]

Yep GIR is against Par, not according to what you're handicap says it might be.

If your GIR stat is rubbish, its rubbish, work on it, and your scores will come down, simple as.

My GIR on my last round was only 44%, and Fairways Hit of 61.5%.

However, I only had 31 putts and a Gross 75, as I chipped very well and didnt have a 3 putt on my card.

GIR and other stats merely help you analyse your game, they dont write your score.

 

[haplesshacker]

Succintly put, well most of you. Though I do understand where RGS is coming from. However I like to have a stable platform for which to aim for. If that's 5% for my h'cap, then so be it. I know in my own mind which holes I get shots on and it's not much of a calc to work out on the course whether it's anet GIR anyway.

 

[User 105]

yep agree. The online tracking software I use doesn't take handicap into account.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

It is as the others say based on gross scores. I think you really should try the Scoresaver software out and see what it tells you about your game based on your handicap. Providing you keep the stats honestly as you play it will reveal some interesting trends. Also, if you like the free 30 day demo, PM SS2 as it is his baby and he may be able to give you a discount code when you buy the system. I think it costs around £35 but is (or at least was) as one-off payment and well worth the money. Best piece of statistical kit on the market

 

[mattdeeks]

Does anyone use Golfshake and what do other people think off it?

I've used it for a while and I think it is quite good for tracking your scores, GIRs etc etc

 

[brendy]

As already mentioned (numerous times) stats need to be taken and analysed from a scratch handicap.
The main reason being its the most stable place to start, handicaps and target stats rise as well as fall, scratch does not.
Scratch also is an attainable score if taken on a per hole basis, so why not measure yourself against the course and let your handicap look after the figures that determine your ability in the longer term. Its hard to concentrate on your game as it is witout trying to keep tabs on how many more greens or putts you need before you are happy with your stats. Dont get me wrong, I love statistics but they are for reading and gauging your game but I wouldnt get hung up on them.
Finally, using net GIR wont work for the folllowing reason. Say a 18 handicapper takes GIR on a par 4 as 3 onto the green, this leaves the putts in regulation still at 2 for every one of the 18 holes, for a 18 handicapper, thats a fairly tough order on anything short of a good day.

 

[Herbie]

As already mentioned (numerous times) istats need to be taken and analysed from a scratch handicap.
The main reason being its the most stable place to start, handicaps and target stats rise as well as fal, scratch does not.
Scratch also is an attainable score if taken on a per hole basis, so why not measure yourself against the course and let your handicap look after the figures that determine your ability in the longer term. Its hard to concentrate on your game as it is withoit trying to keep tabs on how many more greens or putts you need before you are jappy with your stats. Dont get me wrong, I love statistics but they are for reading and gauging your game but I wouldnt get hung up on them.
Finally, using net GIR wont work for the folllowing reason. Say a 18 handicapper takes GIR on a par 4 as 3 onto the green, this leaves the putts in regulation still at 2 for every one of the 18 holes, for a 18 handicapper, thats a fairly tough order on anything short of a good day.

I agree with this good post Brendy, in fact Im very chinese with it!

 

[roccokj]

It would be kind of hard to find out if you are improving using the nett GIR system, I would say most people would averaging nett GIR between 90-100%? Thats of course if your handicap remained the same, like during the winter.

 

[brendy]

I did edit my post once I saw the typos haha. I was sat in the car outside Ards shopping centre waiting on my wife buying picking up a new top!

I agree with this good post Brendy, in fact Im very chinese with it!

 

[mono217]

good software.