Ge 2017

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Anyone know the earliest date we can be back at the polling stations?

I reckon we'll be back in weeks rather than months....

What happened to fixed term governments ...

...and had the Tories not heard of Pandora's Box - because they well and truly have thrown the lid wide open.

 

[User62651]

Anyone know the earliest date we can be back at the polling stations?

I reckon we'll be back in weeks rather than months....

What happened to fixed term governments ...

How about between Christmas and New year week - it'd liven up an otherwise dreary holiday and a trip to the polling station would give us all something to do, stretch the legs!:mmm:

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

On the DUP supporting the Tories in Westminster...what is the situation in respect of EVEL? Are the DUP MPs allowed to vote on matters that are devolved to the NI assembly? Does it work the same way as how EVEL impacts the SNP MPs?

Because if the DUP MPs can't vote on matters deemed subject to EVEL then the Tory Government could be losing votes left, right and centre?

 

[ger147]

On the DUP supporting the Tories in Westminster...what is the situation in respect of EVEL? Are the DUP MPs allowed to vote on matters that are devolved to the NI assembly? Does it work the same way as how EVEL impacts the SNP MPs?

Because if the DUP MPs can't vote on matters deemed subject to EVEL then the Tory Government could be losing votes left, right and centre?

If only English MP's vote on EVEL matters, the Tories have 298 English MP's, a majority of 61.

 

[Hobbit]

Well...in my tradition - in having a belief and a faith I am forgiven all of my sins up front

Would I have been similarly pulled up if I referred to a certain Tony Bliar?

Judge unto others... and in my opinion, what has who you call got to do with it. I don't like to see the Jimmy Krankie comment, although when someone gets too giddy it comes out.

I don't like how neither the Tories nor the SNP have conducted themselves...Labour played a blinder, and well done to them.

Simply put, its disrespectful and diminishes the caller rather than the called.

The Tories won 43% of the vote, the others won 57%. Can you live with that?

Besides - the GE was not a referendum, in the end the actual %s do not matter that much - what matters is the numbers of seats - because it is on the numbers of seats that the Tories are claiming the right to form the government.

So the Tories do not have a majority of the vote and they do not have a majority of the seats, these are simple facts.

You know how the electoral system works. Twisting and semantics, again, don't make you right in this instance. It's just childish points scoring.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Why the Queen's speech has been delayed according to one theory from the BBC:

One of the reasons for the delay is also believed to be because the speech has to be written on goat's skin parchment paper, which takes a few days to dry - and the Tory negotiations with the DUP mean it cannot be ready in time.
Bizarre does not cover it. Give Queenie an ipad to read it off , get with the times.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Judge unto others... and in my opinion, what has who you call got to do with it. I don't like to see the Jimmy Krankie comment, although when someone gets too giddy it comes out.

I don't like how neither the Tories nor the SNP have conducted themselves...Labour played a blinder, and well done to them.

Simply put, its disrespectful and diminishes the caller rather than the called.



You know how the electoral system works. Twisting and semantics, again, don't make you right in this instance. It's just childish points scoring.

Yes I do know. It works on seats and not % of the vote.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

If only English MP's vote on EVEL matters, the Tories have 298 English MP's, a majority of 61.

Of course - obvious now you mention it

 

[chrisd]

I haven't read back to see if this has been said by others.

Mrs May is now going into a form of coalition with others and it's widely reported that she will change her Queens speech to suit both the coalition and those who didn't approve of certain manifesto proposals that will now not appear.

My question is - that is not what Joe Public voted for, a watered down set of proposals, so is she within her rights to govern under a false Queens Speech? (This is not my view as I'm glad she won't now be shafting us pensioners)

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I haven't read back to see if this has been said by others.

Mrs May is now going into a form of coalition with others and it's widely reported that she will change her Queens speech to suit both the coalition and those who didn't approve of certain manifesto proposals that will now not appear.

My question is - that is not what Joe Public voted for, a watered down set of proposals, so is she within her rights to govern under a false Queens Speech? (This is not my view as I'm glad she won't now be shafting us pensioners)

What's a false Queen's Speech? If The People don't like what the Tories put in their Queens Speech - and they can put in whatever they want - then they can vote the Tories out next GE.

 

[Hobbit]

I haven't read back to see if this has been said by others.

Mrs May is now going into a form of coalition with others and it's widely reported that she will change her Queens speech to suit both the coalition and those who didn't approve of certain manifesto proposals that will now not appear.

My question is - that is not what Joe Public voted for, a watered down set of proposals, so is she within her rights to govern under a false Queens Speech? (This is not my view as I'm glad she won't now be shafting us pensioners)

Very good point Chris. You could ask why a party of only 10 MP's has more right to be part of a govt than a party with over 260?

 

[SocketRocket]

640,000 signatures in 24hrs on on-line petition condemning any deal with the DUP.

What a stramash

Complete waste of time.

So, are you happy that the Conservatives have got into bed with the DUP?

I think he did. 3 times.

You will see my quote, It only mentioned my feeling that these petitions are a waste of time. I have not answered the question on the DUP and Conservatives as I have no idea if they will reach an agreement and what the terms would be. Ask me again after they have one if you like and I will be glad to oblige.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Very good point Chris. You could ask why a party of only 10 MP's has more right to be part of a govt than a party with over 260?

Not just the DUP - what about what The White Queen of the North is wanting in respect of the Single Market. Don't ignore wee Ruthie...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

You will see my quote, It only mentioned my feeling that these petitions are a waste of time. I have not answered the question on the DUP and Conservatives as I have no idea if they will reach an agreement and what the terms would be. Ask me again after they have one if you like and I will be glad to oblige.

Would you be happy if the DUP take on board a request from the Orange Order to seek an unbanning of such as the Portadown and Dumcree Orange Walks, and then the DUP require that from the Tory government as part of the price for their support?

it's a hypothetical - just interested in where the boundaries of your acceptance of the DUP might be.

 

[chrisd]

What's a false Queen's Speech? If The People don't like what the Tories put in their Queens Speech - and they can put in whatever they want - then they can vote the Tories out next GE.

False against the manifesto they were elected on.

So, would you be condoning a party who made several promises that helped them get elected, who then left them out of the Queens speech and never carried them through but forced you to wait 5 years before you could vote them out?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

False against the manifesto they were elected on.

So, would you be condoning a party who made several promises that helped them get elected, who then left them out of the Queens speech and never carried them through but forced you to wait 5 years before you could vote them out?

Well - if a government could only put forward a Queen's Speech covering the whole manifesto - and nothing but their manifesto - then there could be a fair bit missing as some of the policies in the manifesto are not yet thought through, costed or subject to consultation (not thinking of anything in particular of course).

And if the outcome of a GE was the need for a coalition - what then for a Queens Speech? What's in - what's out? If nothing can be out - then no Queens Speech - or no Queens Speech that would get passed - and so another GE. Surely?

 

[Lord Tyrion]

False against the manifesto they were elected on.

So, would you be condoning a party who made several promises that helped them get elected, who then left them out of the Queens speech and never carried them through but forced you to wait 5 years before you could vote them out?

Unfortunately that is the system. The same occurred when we had a Con / LB coalition a few years ago. Parts from each parties manifesto had to be dropped as compromises were looked for. Our system is not geared up for coalition politics, we are quite a black and white system. In the end you have to vote for a party / mp that you believe broadly meets your views. If compromises have to happen you have to expect they will occur broadly on the lines of their original manifesto. Not perfect but the alternative is election after election until we get a clear winner.

 

[chrisd]

Well - if a government could only put forward a Queen's Speech covering the whole manifesto - and nothing but their manifesto - then there could be a fair bit missing as some of the policies in the manifesto are not yet thought through, costed or subject to consultation (not thinking of anything in particular of course).

And if the outcome of a GE was the need for a coalition - what then for a Queens Speech? What's in - what's out? If nothing can be out - then no Queens Speech - or no Queens Speech that would get passed - and so another GE. Surely?

But if they ask the nation to vote for them on a set of pledges then it's pretty fraudulent if they don't enact any afterwards. I'm not stupid, I do understand the politics but despite what they say - the country does NOT vote for a coalition

 

[Hacker Khan]

You will see my quote, It only mentioned my feeling that these petitions are a waste of time. I have not answered the question on the DUP and Conservatives as I have no idea if they will reach an agreement and what the terms would be. Ask me again after they have one if you like and I will be glad to oblige.

You seem to have a lot of opinions on Brexit though where we have no idea if they will reach an agreement and what terms it would be on

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

But if they ask the nation to vote for them on a set of pledges then it's pretty fraudulent if they don't enact any afterwards. I'm not stupid, I do understand the politics but despite what they say - the country does NOT vote for a coalition

Indeed - we do not vote for a coalition. But we may end up with a coalition. So what would go into the coalition's Queens Speech?

The extension of your QS argument would seem to be that if a GE does not result in a majority then there would almost certainly have to be a further GE, because the manifestos of the parties in the coalition would be different.