Fitting... who and what to believe

[Zig]

Thanks for all the comments everyone. I've paid for a fitting with a local pro, great reputation, this weekend. Figured I'll go there, tell him about my Rogue and the AG fitting, and then let him cut through the cra*, and just tell me what to buy, whatever that may be.

And when I get home with my shiny new club, I'm realistic enough to know that the bad shots I hit off the tee are still my fault, and not the clubs!

Just for a chuckle... I borrowed a driver to play 18 holes last night. Hit it great off the tee all the way round. Had a Ping tour stiff shaft in it too - what's that all about!!! I only need to try a seniors flex now and I've got a full house!

 

[Ethan]

Thanks for all the comments everyone. I've paid for a fitting with a local pro, great reputation, this weekend. Figured I'll go there, tell him about my Rogue and the AG fitting, and then let him cut through the cra*, and just tell me what to buy, whatever that may be.

And when I get home with my shiny new club, I'm realistic enough to know that the bad shots I hit off the tee are still my fault, and not the clubs!

Just for a chuckle... I borrowed a driver to play 18 holes last night. Hit it great off the tee all the way round. Had a Ping tour stiff shaft in it too - what's that all about!!! I only need to try a seniors flex now and I've got a full house!

Good luck with the fitting. The Ping Tour shaft isn't really very stiff, though.

 

[Refurbished2020]

For what it's worth, my experience of AG is that the majority of their staff are retail salesmen, finding the one 'qualified fitter' is a lottery especially if they are on commission.
Their recommendation was a set of Nike's which felt like hitting a poker and quite honestly I think a blacksmith could have done a better job. I went to a Custom Fitter, then near Rothwell. His fitting session was more than twice as long, far more involved and I ended up with a 10 club set with all shafts aligned for less than the 8 off-the-shelf Titleist that I had fancied. Andrew had distinct views on off-the-shelf sets, no matter the make, and definitely unflattering so if you go that route you can accept their views or not but you will not automatically be paying higher prices. You may not come out with a Ping, Callaway or any other 'big name brand' but what you get will be suited to you.

 

[Ethan]

A few years back, I played with a guy in a comp. He was a rugby player in his late 30s, not the sort of guy whose pint you would want to knock over. On the first, he pulled out a hybrid and hit a massive hook. He did the same a couple of holes later and I asked him what sort of club he was using. It was a Nicklaus hybrid with an A flex graphite shaft. His irons had Project X 6.0 shafts. I asked him where he got it and he told me it was AG in Slough. I had a waggle and it was so flexible it might still be vibrating. He told me he was fitted for it at AG. I advised him to go back, find the guy who sold it and fit it into him head first. The guy needed at least an S flex in a decent brand, possibly an X. The Nicklaus was a cheap piece of rubbish with a noodle shaft suitable for someone in their 70s. I later heard that at the time AG had a sales incentive for staff to push Nicklaus.

 

[Blue in Munich]

Thanks for all the comments everyone. I've paid for a fitting with a local pro, great reputation, this weekend. Figured I'll go there, tell him about my Rogue and the AG fitting, and then let him cut through the cra*, and just tell me what to buy, whatever that may be.

And when I get home with my shiny new club, I'm realistic enough to know that the bad shots I hit off the tee are still my fault, and not the clubs!

Just for a chuckle... I borrowed a driver to play 18 holes last night. Hit it great off the tee all the way round. Had a Ping tour stiff shaft in it too - what's that all about!!! I only need to try a seniors flex now and I've got a full house!

There is a school of thought in shaft fitting that getting the right weight is more important than the right flex.

 

[Golfnut1957]

When you consider that COR is maxed out and that head size is maxed out then with regard to heads there is not a lot the manufacturers can do to increase distance.

A good fitter might optimise launch angle and spin to eek out a bit more distance, but who among us is consistent enough reproduce those two factors swing after swing.

That leaves the shaft. I genuinely believe this is where the big gains can be made and so perhaps it was the shaft that produced your 20 yard gain. Or then again perhaps it was pixie dust supplied by the AG "fitter".

 

[trevor]

A few years back, I played with a guy in a comp. He was a rugby player in his late 30s, not the sort of guy whose pint you would want to knock over. On the first, he pulled out a hybrid and hit a massive hook. He did the same a couple of holes later and I asked him what sort of club he was using. It was a Nicklaus hybrid with an A flex graphite shaft. His irons had Project X 6.0 shafts. I asked him where he got it and he told me it was AG in Slough. I had a waggle and it was so flexible it might still be vibrating. He told me he was fitted for it at AG. I advised him to go back, find the guy who sold it and fit it into him head first. The guy needed at least an S flex in a decent brand, possibly an X. The Nicklaus was a cheap piece of rubbish with a noodle shaft suitable for someone in their 70s. I later heard that at the time AG had a sales incentive for staff to push Nicklaus.

I remember being conned into buying Nicklaus irons at Camberley many years ago because the figures they said I was getting were far better than anything else. Was fairly new to the game at the time so believed him but I remember I didn’t have those clubs very long. Never been into an AG since on principle.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I remember being conned into buying Nicklaus irons at Camberley many years ago because the figures they said I was getting were far better than anything else. Was fairly new to the game at the time so believed him but I remember I didn’t have those clubs very long. Never been into an AG since on principle.

The Nicklaus brand along with Wilson were their biggest mark up profits so there was a big sales drive to shift as much of this stuff as they could. I went into AG at Bird Hills near Maidenhead and as a golfer with lots of playing experience they tried to flog me the Nicklaus starter set. I knew they weren't what I wanted but the bloke kept pushing and pushing so words were exchanged at I walked out.

 

[hovis]

When you consider that COR is maxed out and that head size is maxed out then with regard to heads there is not a lot the manufacturers can do to increase distance.

A good fitter might optimise launch angle and spin to eek out a bit more distance, but who among us is consistent enough reproduce those two factors swing after swing.

That leaves the shaft. I genuinely believe this is where the big gains can be made and so perhaps it was the shaft that produced your 20 yard gain. Or then again perhaps it was pixie dust supplied by the AG "fitter".

You aren't getting extra distance from a shaft. If you are 20 yards longer with a new driver then you was either poorly fitted for the previous driver or your technique has dramatically changed in the interim.

 

[Golfnut1957]

You aren't getting extra distance from a shaft. If you are 20 yards longer with a new driver then you was either poorly fitted for the previous driver or your technique has dramatically changed in the interim.

I agree, but if he was 20 yards longer at AG then it came from somewhere. It wasn't from the head unless it was one of TM's 17 yard specials, and he was fitted into his previous shaft, with which he was very happy, by a Pro.
That leaves my favourite option which is pixie dust, liberally sprinkled on the launch monitor.

 

[Kpa77]

You aren't getting extra distance from a shaft. If you are 20 yards longer with a new driver then you was either poorly fitted for the previous driver or your technique has dramatically changed in the interim.

A shaft can influence timing and club delivery allowing to more a more efficient strike pattern. You can get extra distance from a change in shaft.

 

[Foxholer]

Good luck with the fitting. The Ping Tour shaft isn't really very stiff, though.

Indeed! I was fitted for this shaft at a Ping tent at Wentworth some time ago (in a G25, so that should define the year). The 'Tour Stiff' label for Ping equates to 'Low Torque' (which is the amount the shaft twists around an axis running down/through the length of the shaft).

 

[Deleted member 1740]

Stick to what you know and I'm speaking from experience!!

Otherwise it could become a very expensive experiment with drivers.

 

[hovis]

A shaft can influence timing and club delivery allowing to more a more efficient strike pattern. You can get extra distance from a change in shaft.

Yes but the point I'm trying to make is the shaft isn't providing speed to the club head to make the ball go further. All a shaft does is present loft to the ball.

 

[Zig]

Thought I'd give an update as a way of thanks to everyone for their helpful comments on the thread. And to big up good service when you get it.

In my original post I explained I had a Callaway Rogue, it got bashed on the head and cracked, and then I went to AG for a fitting. Bit unsure about the advice I got.

I've borrowed a Ping G30 from a mate, and went for a fitting at a local golf club. Pro was absolutely fab.

Tried three different drivers. He recommended the cheapest (it had the best numbers on launch monitor). Shaft matched the fitting I'd had a year ago, rather than what I was recommended at AG.
He did say there wasn't a massive difference between it and the Ping G30 I turned up with. Said there wasn't the massive increments in distance year on year that the advertising would have you believe. Asked me if I just wanted to keep my own and have a think about whether I wanted to spend the money or not. He was then very honest about lead in times at the minute etc. And he took the order without any deposit etc.

I've bought the club (cos I have to give the G30 back anyway, and fancied something new). Tried TM, Ping and Cobra, and came out with the best for me, which also happened to be the cheapest. Full marks for top service (and honesty/transparency - no gimmicks/sales banter).

All's good with the world.

 

[Orikoru]

Thought I'd give an update as a way of thanks to everyone for their helpful comments on the thread. And to big up good service when you get it.

In my original post I explained I had a Callaway Rogue, it got bashed on the head and cracked, and then I went to AG for a fitting. Bit unsure about the advice I got.

I've borrowed a Ping G30 from a mate, and went for a fitting at a local golf club. Pro was absolutely fab.

Tried three different drivers. He recommended the cheapest (it had the best numbers on launch monitor). Shaft matched the fitting I'd had a year ago, rather than what I was recommended at AG.
He did say there wasn't a massive difference between it and the Ping G30 I turned up with. Said there wasn't the massive increments in distance year on year that the advertising would have you believe. Asked me if I just wanted to keep my own and have a think about whether I wanted to spend the money or not. He was then very honest about lead in times at the minute etc. And he took the order without any deposit etc.

I've bought the club (cos I have to give the G30 back anyway, and fancied something new). Tried TM, Ping and Cobra, and came out with the best for me, which also happened to be the cheapest. Full marks for top service (and honesty/transparency - no gimmicks/sales banter).

All's good with the world.

Unless I've misread this - did you say which one you actually bought??

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Yes but the point I'm trying to make is the shaft isn't providing speed to the club head to make the ball go further. All a shaft does is present loft to the ball.

Oh, now that looks to be a candidate for "most controversial statement of the week"
My own(limited) view is that the statement is not correct.
Perhaps more qualified players would like to comment.
If it is correct, how come all those different shafts?

 

[Imurg]

The shaft is a timing device that delivers the clubface to the ball at the desired loft, path and angle.
Everyone swings differently, putting different forces on the shaft at different times during the swing.
One shaft would not, and does not, fit all.

 

[patricks148]

AG have a purpose and a role, but no way would I put their opinion over a decent pro.

Can you not pick up an exact spec rogue second hand?

this

 

[Zig]

Unless I've misread this - did you say which one you actually bought??

Cobra Speedzone, tensei orange stiff.

And no, it doesn't go as far as it does when Bryson hits it.