Fellow competitor picks incompletely holed ball from the hole?

[delc]

NO! Your OP was about whether 'another FC' - the guy who picked the ball out of the hole - should be penalised! The fact that it turns out that you (should have) caused a couple of DQs is what I am talking about.

If you are it's all of your own making!

I knew what the rules were if the player himself had picked the incompletely holed ball from the hole, but not if this was done by a fellow competitor, as this was a situation I had never come across before. Normally I carry a rule book, but I didn't have it with me on that particular day.

 

[Foxholer]

So are you going to report your Breach(es)?

 

[delc]

Sorry guys, but but I won't be asking any more questions on this rules forum, because of all the nit-picking unpleasantness!!! I'll put any questions directly to the the R&A in future. :angry:

 

[palindromicbob]

Sorry guys, but but I won't be asking any more questions on this rules forum, because of all the nit-picking unpleasantness!!! I'll put any questions directly to the the R&A in future. :angry:

Well you now know the correct process so you know what to do in future. I like yourself think it's ridiculous that in this situation the player who's ball it was is at risk of dropping a shot due to the intervention of an FC that wasn't authorised to touch the ball.

It is one you should contact the R&A about. Would be interesting to see what they would say but I don't think you'd like the answer.

 

[chrisd]

Sorry guys, but but I won't be asking any more questions on this rules forum, because of all the nit-picking unpleasantness!!! I'll put any questions directly to the the R&A in future. :angry:

Seeing your posts on this web site Del I hope that the R & A have an abundance of patience!

 

[North Mimms]

Amazingly, this happened to me when playing at Sherfield Oaks yesterday (see photo). This was the result of a putt from just off the green at the 4th hole. It was quite a breezy, gusty day and the wind was pushing the flag stick to one side. Just after I took this photo the wind slackened for a second or two and the ball dropped into the hole. The flagsticks at this course are about as slim as they get. Of course, this problem would be solved if the hole was made slightly bigger!

If the wind was so strong that it was bending the flagstick, the LAST thing I would have done in this case was get my phone out to take a photo! What if the wind had strengthened while you were taking photo and the stick bent further and pushed the ball away from the hole?
I would have walked up to the hole pretty sharpish and moved the pin to ensure ball dropped before any misfortune befell it!

 

[North Mimms]

Seeing your posts on this web site Del I hope that the R & A have an abundance of patience!

Look out for advert
"R&A are looking to recruit at least three additional Rules experts to deal with sudden increase in queries"

 

[chrisd]

Look out for advert
"R&A are looking to recruit at least three additional Rules experts to deal with sudden increase in queries"

New R &A announcement of rule change!


" in order to placate an incessant emailer the hole size with immediately be increased to 12" except for players with the yips who will have deemed to have holed out if their ball lands near the green"

 

[delc]

Well you now know the correct process so you know what to do in future. I like yourself think it's ridiculous that in this situation the player who's ball it was is at risk of dropping a shot due to the intervention of an FC that wasn't authorised to touch the ball.

It is one you should contact the R&A about. Would be interesting to see what they would say but I don't think you'd like the answer.

I would think that the chances of replacing the ball in the exact same position as per rule 18-4, resting between the flagstick and the lip, and it remaining at rest there are pretty remote. Therefore the next option is placing it on the lip and holing it from there, which would cost the player a stroke. Sounds rather unfair to me! :mmm:

 

[Colin L]

I wouldn't argue that there was anything fair about it but if you think it through, what else could the ruling be in those circumstances? Could you really see the R&A/USGA coming up with a Decision that allowed a ball to be deemed to be holed when it has not met the requirements of the Definition of a ball holed?

I wouldn't fancy being the clod who lifted the ball when it was someone's tee shot that was wedged between flag and hole.

 

[North Mimms]

I would think that the chances of replacing the ball in the exact same position as per rule 18-4, resting between the flagstick and the lip, and it remaining at rest there are pretty remote. Therefore the next option is placing it on the lip and holing it from there, which would cost the player a stroke. Sounds rather unfair to me! :mmm:

I don't see why it should be difficult to replace the ball "wedged". I mean we've all had a ball get stuck like that, and have to be encouraged to drop

 

[delc]

One of the problems is that the (UK sized) ball has got bigger, but the hole hasn't! I am old enough to remember 1.62" balls, and don't remember many instances of the ball wedging itself between the lip and the flagstick with those. Maybe clubs should do more to publicise the definition of 'ball holed', so that members know not to pick wedged balls out of the hole without making them drop fully in first?

 

[North Mimms]

I wouldn't argue that there was anything fair about it but if you think it through, what else could the ruling be in those circumstances? Could you really see the R&A/USGA coming up with a Decision that allowed a ball to be deemed to be holed when it has not met the requirements of the Definition of a ball holed?

I wouldn't fancy being the clod who lifted the ball when it was someone's tee shot that was wedged between flag and hole.

If someone was about to pick up my ball, I'd shout Stop before they had a chance. Just like when your foursomes partner is about to tap in the putt they just missed.
I never seem to have controversies like some

 

[North Mimms]

One of the problems is that the (UK sized) ball has got bigger, but the hole hasn't! I am old enough to remember 1.62" balls, and don't remember many instances of the ball wedging itself between the lip and the flagstick with those. Maybe clubs should do more to publicise the definition of 'ball holed', so that members know not to pick wedged balls out of the hole? :)

I don't know where you get the idea that 90% of golfers think that a ball in the position of your photo is "holed"
Each and every time I have played with someone whose ball has wedged like that, they have moved the pin to make sure it drops before lifting the ball up

 

[delc]

I don't know where you get the idea that 90% of golfers think that a ball in the position of your photo is "holed"
Each and every time I have played with someone whose ball has wedged like that, they have moved the pin to make sure it drops before lifting the ball up

I have seen several instances of this happening, usually in friendly games, and of course in the case of the fellow competitor in the thread starter. I always make a point of putting them right. :mmm:

 

[North Mimms]

I have seen several instances of this happening, usually in friendly games, and of course in the case of the fellow competitor in the thread starter. I always make a point of putting them right. :mmm:

Things always seem more complicated in a delc 4 fourball !

 

[Foxholer]

I don't know where you get the idea that 90% of golfers think that a ball in the position of your photo is "holed"
Each and every time I have played with someone whose ball has wedged like that, they have moved the pin to make sure it drops before lifting the ball up

I agree! I've seen a couple of dozen such instances and only ever heard of 1 other instance where it was picked out before allowing it to drop.

 

[atticusfinch]

Maybe clubs should do more to publicise the definition of 'ball holed',

The definition of holed is in the rules of golf. It would be a waste of money for a club to issue a special notice for that purpose.

 

[North Mimms]

The definition of holed is in the rules of golf. It would be a waste of money for a club to issue a special notice for that purpose.

Especially since it is often those who need to be educated the most, are the ones least likely to read notices on boards!

 

[delc]

The definition of holed is in the rules of golf. It would be a waste of money for a club to issue a special notice for that purpose.

The club member 'fellow competitor' in my original thread starter obviously would have benefitted!