Embedded ball

[Marko77]

Just wondering, with this prolonged wet period most of the country is being subjected to; how many clubs, if any, have a local rule in place covering embedded balls anywhere on the course?

edit: except hazards of course!

 

[ArnoldArmChewer]

Just wondering, with this prolonged wet period most of the country is being subjected to; how many clubs, if any, have a local rule in place covering embedded balls anywhere on the course?

Good point, not sure if our club does. We are still on preferred lies for another week.

 

[Marko77]

Yeah, we have preferred lies in place till end of the month which covers the short grass.

The number of times though that I or others have just missed a green or fairway and found little or no ball left visible to hit is becoming very frustrating - adding 3 or 4 shots to a round easily.

Our club doesn't have the local rule in place but am considering asking the Committee to put in place.

 

[duncan mackie]

right now the issue is more likely to be casual water - and that doesn't need a LR.

equally embedded in a closely mown area (fairways/fringes) is covered by 25-2

once growth start in the rough it becomes less likely that the ball will embed, but clubs should review the need for such relief situations at all times.

we removed 'winter rules' about 3 weeks ago because the ball was no longer picking up mud all the time, but may need to re-consider that over the next few days, even if only for a short period.

 

[CMAC]

we dont but we should have, ball went in about 3 inches twice and had to be played as it was rough and not fairway.......very unfair rule. The fact your in rough anyway is bad enough but having to take an unplayable just because all the ground is very soft is just not cricket!

 

[duncan mackie]

Yeah, we have preferred lies in place till end of the month which covers the short grass.

The number of times though that I or others have just missed a green or fairway and found little or no ball left visible to hit is becoming very frustrating - adding 3 or 4 shots to a round easily.

Our club doesn't have the local rule in place but am considering asking the Committee to put in place.

on the basis of what you have written I cannot understand why they wouldn't have relief available!

 

[sJoe]

From what I understand the Rules of Golf allow a free drop if a ball is embedded in its own pitch mark anywhere on the course. provided its a mown area, anytime of year..

 

[Airlie_Andy]

As a slight aside, a local course has a long par 3 with a 2 tier green and the slope between the 2 tiers is very severe. During a particularly wet spell last year I hit perfect hybrid into the green but the ball plugged into the face of the slope on the green (between) the 2 tiers. Now I removed my ball and repaired the divot but it was impossible to replace the ball in the same position because it would immediately begin rolling back down the slope onto the lower tier. We came to the conclusion that I should replace it and allow it to roll away then play it from where it ended up. Was this correct?

 

[duncan mackie]

As a slight aside, a local course has a long par 3 with a 2 tier green and the slope between the 2 tiers is very severe. During a particularly wet spell last year I hit perfect hybrid into the green but the ball plugged into the face of the slope on the green (between) the 2 tiers. Now I removed my ball and repaired the divot but it was impossible to replace the ball in the same position because it would immediately begin rolling back down the slope onto the lower tier. We came to the conclusion that I should replace it and allow it to roll away then play it from where it ended up. Was this correct?

you would need to replace it at the nearest point, not nearer the hole and not in a hazard, that the ball will remain at rest.

 

[Fyldewhite]

From what I understand the Rules of Golf allow a free drop if a ball is embedded in its own pitch mark anywhere on the course. provided its a mown area, anytime of year..

Hmmmm, "closely mown" is the rule. That means grass cut to fairway height or lower. So semi rough and any other "mown" areas are not covered in rules of golf and need a local rule covering an embedded ball "through the green" to obtain relief. Otherwise, play as it lies or declare it unplayable.

 

[Kellfire]

We played preferred lies in last week's medal and Tuesday's Rabbit's match. It wasn't necessary for all the holes on the course but it made more sense to have a blanket rule.

 

[Foxholer]

I believe that any ball plugged in its own pitchmark, through the green, should be moveable (closely mown) or droppable (elsewhere) all the time. I don't believe the additional penalty of having to play it from a plugged lie is fair or equitable.

At a previous club there was a Par 3 with a severe (50-60ft) drop between tee and green. In soggy conditions (6-7 months of the year there!) a shot into the short rough was very likely to plug.

Plugged balls in the semi and rough are not the way the course designer meant the 'hazards' to apply. Actually had a ball plug in the bank of a bunker yesterday. Would have been better/easier if it had dropped back into the bunker.

And there is a sample LR for the wording to covers it - even for just when 'preferred lies' applies.

 

[duncan mackie]

I believe that any ball plugged in its own pitchmark, through the green, should be moveable (closely mown) or droppable (elsewhere) all the time. I don't believe the additional penalty of having to play it from a plugged lie is fair or equitable.

At a previous club there was a Par 3 with a severe (50-60ft) drop between tee and green. In soggy conditions (6-7 months of the year there!) a shot into the short rough was very likely to plug.

Plugged balls in the semi and rough are not the way the course designer meant the 'hazards' to apply. Actually had a ball plug in the bank of a bunker yesterday. Would have been better/easier if it had dropped back into the bunker.

And there is a sample LR for the wording to covers it - even for just when 'preferred lies' applies.

there will be times and places for that LR - it's available so the issue is purely one for your club committee.

as pointed out by someone above, constantly changing the applicable rule, or where it applies, will cause confusion but something like you describe sounds as if the embedded ball 'winter rule' should be in play for much longer than, for example, preferred lies - possibly in play on that hole permenantly.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Whether we should get relief from plugged ball in the rough as a matter of course is a tricky one.

On the one hand, if you miss the fairway/green you ought to take your medicine. Relief would entail being able to lift, clean and drop and could well result in a much more favourable outcome than if the ball has settled down in the grass as a result of a golf shot.

On the other hand you are basically adding an extra shot (either penalty for an unplayable lie, or a big hack to move it 6 inches) simply due to bad weather or poor drainage.

I have only really suffered once from this rule with a plugged ball in the light rough just off the green. Was annoyed as it wasn't a bad shot and wasn't far off target. Tried to play it and should have treated it as unplayable. Cost me at least a couple of shots irrc.

 

[patricks148]

Play it as it lies, unless its on a close mowen area then its a free drop.

 

[SGC001]

I think it's a harsh one, you're basically getting penalised for the condition of the course, I think the pros usually get it extended to relief through the green on this one; which seems a little fairer to me.

 

[Marko77]

Raised it with the committee who are considering it. There seems to be a view they need approval from the Union / CONGU to implement the LR?

Another example today of why it is needed. Not a bad shot, under 10ft short of the green and what should have been a realistic up and down chance ruined by a plugged ball meaning hack at it and take a chance or take the unplayable.

Would like to say it cost me buffer but an overall lack of GIR cost me that today.

 

[duncan mackie]

Raised it with the committee who are considering it. There seems to be a view they need approval from the Union / CONGU to implement the LR?

I don't believe so - Appendix Ib (Specimen Local Rules) includes a recommended wording under 4.a
Appendix Ia introduction outlines the situations where a committee would need to approach the R&A about implementing LRs but the use of recommended (Specimen) LRs isn't one of them as they don't go against the Rules of Golf (or any specific permissions therein - as in the case of 14-3 and DMDs).

However, as long as they are doing it, it doesn't matter if they do it their way :whoo:

 

[Foxholer]

Raised it with the committee who are considering it. There seems to be a view they need approval from the Union / CONGU to implement the LR?

Seems typical 'Committee Inertia' to me!

Specimen LR is provided by R&A in the bleedin Rule Book!

Any committee member who doesn't know that, or at least to look there, (let alone the entire committee!) should be sacked!

 

[Fyldewhite]

Seems typical 'Committee Inertia' to me!

Specimen LR is provided by R&A in the bleedin Rule Book!

Any committee member who doesn't know that, or at least to look there, (let alone the entire committee!) should be sacked!

A club can introduce the local rule at anytime but can't run a competition as a qualifying comp with preferred lies between April 30th and Sept 30th without the area unions consent. CONGU clause 15.