Does size really matter

[furyk_or_unique]

Madandra,
Something else must be going horribly wrong with the rest of your game if you hit it those distances but are still off 11!
Seriously though, I think the key here is to do with performance and distance on mis-hits. Whoever the poster was who said they had an old persimmon head they hit further than anything is suffering from a slight memory lapse I think. I simply don't believe you, otherwise countless tour pros would still be using persimmon. The reason they've all switched is because they're hitting it miles further - check out the tour driving stats to get some idea of how much over the last 25 years.
In the more recent titanium era, the key here is forgiveness and with a larger head more of your mis-hits go further than they would with a smaller head - so on average it may seem you're driving it further, when in fact your best ones aren't much different.
Thank you for listening....

 

[USER1999]

I am not dreaming about hitting persimmon further. There is a ditch on my course on the 17th that I used to be able to carry when I was 20 years old with my Sunday best drive. I can't get near it now. I am 23 years older, and don't hit it as far.

If I could take my D1 back in a time machine, yeah, sure, more of my drives would carry the ditch, but right now, they don't.

 

[RGuk]

Doesn't matter. Clubhead speed at impact as long as clubhead is on plane = distance.

I'm glad you aren't writing any golf books. What's the plane got to do with it???

Well Dave you certainly shouldn't consider writing golf books. Every decent instruction manual around will say you need to keep the club head on plane throughout the swing in order to consistently and predictably have the club head square at impact. If you ain't square at impact you're not gonna hit any fairway or green.

Plane has nothing to do with distance, don't try and argue this one. You don't even need to be square at impact to achieve maximum distance. The science of pure distance is different to the mechanics of a repeating and straight hitting golf swing.

Honestly.......(I don't want an argument b.t.w.)

Dave

 

[pingpal]

Dave, I'll argue what I like, thanks. My post does say clubhead speed at impact = distance. All I was saying was that if that clubhead comes into the ball really steeply or from either side you will lose distance by imparting too much side/top/back spin, whatever. I am referring to a driver which most of us think about when distance is mentioned. Modern driver and ball are designed to impart minimum spin for greater distance.
So clubhead speed equates to distance....Jeeez you sound like Dave Pelz

 

[RGuk]

Thank you for not fanning the flames! I appreciate it.

"All I was saying was that if that clubhead comes into the ball really steeply or from either side you will lose distance by imparting too much side/top/back spin, whatever. I am referring to a driver which most of us think about when distance is mentioned. Modern driver and ball are designed to impart minimum spin for greater distance."

I agree 100%.

Phew......

Dave

 

[Dave3498]

Most of the 460cc drivers have the high COR factor built in with a new upper limit for, 2008 onwards, of 0.83, but none of the new 3, 5 and 7 woods etc. employ any trampoline effect on their faces. We can however, get a pretty good distance off the tee with a 3 wood, and in fact I know people who can hit their 3 wood just as far as their driver.

Is the larger clubhead better? I don't think so, but it is more forgiving on offset strikes, which I predict you will do more of with the big face.

 

[madandra]

Madandra,
Something else must be going horribly wrong with the rest of your game if you hit it those distances but are still off 11!

You have hit the nail on the head. Short game was shocking but I am working on it over the winter months.

 

[ianmc]

ITS ALL TO DO WITH THIS MONENT OF INERTIA THAT ALL THE MANUFACTURERS ARE RAVING ABOUT IN MY OPINION 460CC CLUBS GO FURTHER THAN THERE 425 COUNTERPARTS IVE GOT A 460CC PING G5 AND IT GOES UP TO 25 TO 35YDS FURTHER THAN MY OLD HIPPO 425

 

[RGuk]

"IVE GOT A 460CC PING G5 AND IT GOES UP TO 25 TO 35YDS FURTHER THAN MY OLD HIPPO 425"

Yes! that's like saying my Porsche goes faster than my Fiesta. No disrespect to Hippo, but if Ping didn't make clubs that performed better under the same swing condidtions as the cheap n cheerful manufacturers, they'd be very upset!!

 

[Lloydy84]

Bigger heads do not make the ball go further!

the reason newer drivers go further than old ones is down to the shaft, shaft technology is the reason why the new drivers go further.

I would bet my house that if you put a persimmon head onto my driver shaft the distance would be within 5 yds of with the huge titanium head!

the only reason big heads are good is that you can hit it off centre and still achieve a decent strike.

 

[furyk_or_unique]

Bigger heads do not make the ball go further!

Have to say I think this is absolute hogwash when you consider that the rebound properties of an old persimmon head insert would be nowhere near those of a well-engineered large titanium face.

If not, then manufacturers have clearly been wasting their time for the last 25 years. Clearly shafts have something to do with it as well, but some of the conclusions people have jumped to here seem a tad baffling to me.

As I've said before, take a look at the tour driving stats over the last three decades and then tell me that old drivers go as far as modern ones.

Persimmon is dead; let it rest in peace along with hickory shafts, gutta balls etc

 

[USER1999]

The R and A measure average driving distances at a few golf courses every year as part of a monitoring programme, and since 2001 (If I remeber the details correctly), for the average golfer, drives have remained at about 200 yards. Ie: for all the increases in club head size and shaft technology, the average golfer has not benefitted.

Hence size does not matter....

There may be a different reason for this though. Maybe the average golfer is such a poor fit to the equipment he chooses to use, that he is not taking advantage of the technology on offer.

 

[Dave3498]

Correct me sombody if I'm wrong, but as I understand it, the people who take part in long driving competitions, hitting over 400 yards, don't use any trampoline effect on their clubface at all. They rely upon their clubhead spead and the springyness of the ball. When you think about it; and knowing that every force has and equal and opposite reaction, if the clubface is 'giving way' then there will be less compression of the ball, so what you gain on the clubface, you lose on the ball.

 

[Lloydy84]

the tour driving stats are not increasing in distance because of the big heads, it's probably to do with many things,
the ball technology,
shaft technology,
the increased need for long hitting, making the tour players focus on this aspect of the game more.

and by the way the "trampoline effect" is banned now, so the 460 cc heads are designed solely for forgiveness.

 

[madandra]

When I watched Classic Golf Sam Snead Arnie and Jack were all hitting 300 yard drives 40 years ago.

 

[Dave3498]

Sorry to disagree with you LLoydy84, but trampoline effect faces are not banned now, they are simply limited to 0.83 coefficient of restitution. Compare this to the old persimmon drivers which were probably around zero COR.