Campaign for back tee golf...

[hackandburn]

Hi

I'm brand new to the forum so be gentle with me!

I'm pretty lucky in that recent years I've got to play some great course around the UK but the one thing that slightly frustrates me is that so many courses don't allow you to play off the back or even competition tees. Whilst I understand that perfectly for member's courses (protect the tees for members by all means) I don't understand it for the resort type courses. What are they saving the back tees for?

A perfect example was Carnoustie a few weeks ago - stuck playing off the yellow (6500 yards) with the whites looking really inviting (6900 yards)

I understand the back tees aren't for everyone and I'd be happy to pay more green fee to get the opportunity (as they do at some places like St Mellion) . My handicap is 6 and I hit a decent ball and I love the challenge of playing a course the way it was designed to be.

Am I being unreasonable??

 

[virtuocity]

Not at all unreasonable.

The amount these courses charge, they should have a huge championship tee box and shut half of it off for visitors and keep the rest pristine for comps.

 

[Foxholer]

Hi
...
the one thing that slightly frustrates me is that so many courses don't allow you to play off the back or even competition tees.
....
I understand the back tees aren't for everyone and I'd be happy to pay more green fee to get the opportunity (as they do at some places like St Mellion) . My handicap is 6 and I hit a decent ball and I love the challenge of playing a course the way it was designed to be.

Am I being unreasonable??

No. They are!

You should play off the tees that are likely to give you most enjoyment imo.

I've (begrudgingly) played off back tees realising that the course is too long for me. I've also played off the back when it's been extremely satisfying. I wouldn't demand to be let 'off the tips' everyhere.

But you should definitely be given the choice!

 

[chrisd]

No. They are!

You should play off the tees that are likely to give you most enjoyment imo.

I've (begrudgingly) played off back tees realising that the course is too long for me. I've also played off the back when it's been extremely satisfying. I wouldn't demand to be let 'off the tips' everyhere.

But you should definitely be given the choice!

Spot on!

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Hi H&B and welcome
A few points.

Many courses have been extended in the last 20 years and you would not be playing the course as it was designed.
Muirfield is about 200 yards longer than when I played it in my youth, I would not say it was a better course just longer and tougher.

As a former HGK I was not adverse to players using the back tees provided the wear and tear was balanced.

We know that many of our golfers have a much higher opinion of their skills than 'Mr Reality'.
If Carnoustie opened up it's back tees to all and sundry you would be on the course for 6 hours.
I would say a 4 handicap limit rather than an extra payment would be more suitable.

 

[hackandburn]

You make a good point - royal co down had a 5 handicap limit for the back tees which is fair enough and something to strive for. The difference was i was allowed to play off the whites which was awesome.
I agree that i wouldn't want to play off the very back tees at places like carnoustie but somewhere in between would be great

 

[JustOne]

I think that some courses should have a h/cap limit, 5 h/cap seems a bit low but they should consider letting single fig golfers play from whatever tee they want. Other courses should just let you choose the tee you want as their yellow tees can be very 'Mickey Mouse' sometimes. My course off the yellows is rubbish (it ain't great off the whites either!!) but I guess a bunch of 18 h/cappers might enjoy it off the yellows as they'd likely not get beaten up by the course too badly.

 

[Imurg]

The only issue with a handicap limit for anything is -

What's the "real" difference between someone off 9.4 and someone off 9.5..?

And don't say 0.1!!

One's allowed to play off the blocks and one isn't......all because of 0.1 of a shot....

 

[Foxholer]

Many courses have been extended in the last 20 years and you would not be playing the course as it was designed.
Muirfield is about 200 yards longer than when I played it in my youth, I would not say it was a better course just longer and tougher.

We know that many of our golfers have a much higher opinion of their skills than 'Mr Reality'.
If Carnoustie opened up it's back tees to all and sundry you would be on the course for 6 hours.
I would say a 4 handicap limit rather than an extra payment would be more suitable.

I believe that many of the extensions have actually been to reset the course to play as it was designed - with hazards etc in the equivalent positions as they were originally. Not such an issue for most Amateurs, but certainly Pro Golfers have got considerably longer over the last 20 years.

I think a suggested handicap 'limit' or guideline , with a small allowance within a group, is the best way to go.

 

[Fish]

I think that some courses should have a h/cap limit, 5 h/cap seems a bit low but they should consider letting single fig golfers play from whatever tee they want. Other courses should just let you choose the tee you want as their yellow tees can be very 'Mickey Mouse' sometimes. My course off the yellows is rubbish (it ain't great off the whites either!!) but I guess a bunch of 18 h/cappers might enjoy it off the yellows as they'd likely not get beaten up by the course too badly.

I don't agree with this categorisation.

According to a recent thread/topic, there are 18+ handicappers on here who drive (carry) the ball in excess of 250yds so, that's either not in the right direction or they have a very poor short game, either way, higher handicappers can be good off the tee and poor elsewhere in their game, to discriminate a tee position by handicap is not a true reflection of their ability to enjoy or play a particular course, I do however accept that it has to be based on something....

 

[HawkeyeMS]

I don't agree with this categorisation.

According to a recent thread/topic, there are 18+ handicappers on here who drive (carry) the ball in excess of 250yds so, that's either not in the right direction or they have a very poor short game, either way, higher handicappers can be good off the tee and poor elsewhere in their game, to discriminate a tee position by handicap is not a true reflection of their ability to enjoy or play a particular course, I do however accept that it has to be based on something....

I would argue that very few of these people drive the ball as far as they say they do and fewer hit it straight most of the time. However, I also know SF golfers who couldn't cope with a course longer than 6500yds.

 

[Smiffy]

I've said it before, (and I'll most probably say it again!)....
Some of these golf courses should be hauled up by trading standards for the way they advertise.
"Come play our 7,220 yard Championship Course for £75.00."
So you phone up, reserve a tee slot, and pay your money.
Then you tip up to play and are told you have to play it off the yellows (which makes the course 6,105 yards).
I've just been short changed by 1,115 yards!!!!
You wouldn't buy and pay for a kilo of apples from the greengrocer and accept 800 grammes so how do they get away with it???

 

[DCB]

Interesting first post. I'm afraid I don't go along with the sentiments expressed in it. I've been at resort type courses where they have given the choice of tee, along with their recommendations based on your handicap. Guess what, almost everyone wants to play off the back tees. This does mean an extraordinarily long, slow rounds and many of those taking part in this purgatory cannot be enjoying themselves.

As for the Carnoustie example, last time I played there we were told what tees to play off, they had two sets they alternated to avoid too much wear on tees. Don't have a problem with that. Imagine the hold up if everyone wanted to play off the back tees, a round would take forever.

I ave no problem with members clubs saying No to visitors and visiting parties using the back tees. I certainly wouldn't want all our visitors using our back tees when they visit my own course.

Played a local course off the whites a while back and for the first time actually wondered if I was able to make the carry to the fairway off the back tee into the prevailing west wind. Big carry to clear a skewed water hazard and a strong wind into the face. I'd happily have played off the yellows for that one We had a five hour round that day......... Back tees and visitors is just a recipei for disaster IMO.

 

[PNWokingham]

i totally agree with you onthis - you should be allowed to play from where you want not withstanding any wear and tear issues. I think you should get some advise given the quality of golfers in the party but told that you can decide - the only caveat being that you keep up with the pace of play/get round in the desired time. At our course you can play red, yellow, white or black or mix it up on each hole.

 

[Fish]

i totally agree with you onthis - you should be allowed to play from where you want not withstanding any wear and tear issues. I think you should get some advise given the quality of golfers in the party but told that you can decide - the only caveat being that you keep up with the pace of play/get round in the desired time. At our course you can play red, yellow, white or black or mix it up on each hole.

If a marshal came up and said, "you need to speed up, go off the reds from here on in", I think I'd slip away :rofl:

 

[Doon frae Troon]

At Turnberry they have an annual scratch cup that the club Pro's and club amateurs play for.
36 holes off the blue tees [Open Championship tees]
Normally in decent conditions, playing off the medal [white] tees these guys skip round in about 68 to 72.
Off the blue tees there is at least a six shot difference to the scores.
The golfing public generally have no idea how tough a real championship course is off the 'Blue' tees.

If a group of four 10 handicappers played from those tees I would confidently predict that not one of them would not break 100.

 

[PNWokingham]

for a laugh the other week in a 3 ball we decided to each play off a different tee - black (6880), White (6470) and red (5450) on each hole - so if you start black, you then go white on the next and red after that - it was great fun and the holes played very differently - first time I have gone near the red - but it was good fun!

There is certainly a pace of play issue off the back tees if you are not careful as some golfers will get into a lot more trouble with much bigger carries etc meaning more searching and provisionals

 

[Smiffy]

There is certainly a pace of play issue off the back tees if you are not careful as some golfers will get into a lot more trouble with much bigger carries etc meaning more searching and provisionals

And that Paul, is why you don't play off the Whites at Cooden

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I think GM did a feature on this a while back and I think it was Jezz (maybe wrong) who argued that as a visitor you should be able to play off whichever tee you want as you are paying for the privilege and in theory are a member for the day

 

[Fish]

I think GM did a feature on this a while back and I think it was Jezz (maybe wrong) who argued that as a visitor you should be able to play off whichever tee you want as you are paying for the privilege and in theory are a member for the day

True, but, being devils advocate here, even members have restrictions on the tees they can use at times so you shouldn't expect anything more than them, should you?