Calling "I'm out of it" and then finding the ball

[Crow]

Well, the question swings on whether a ball was validly lost, or a concession made.

I think we agree that the ball was not lost (< mins, can't declare etc), so it is all about concession. Since the d was ambiguous at best and the player had asked the others, including his partner, to play on, I think it is reasonable to assume he was not conceding on behalf of him and his opponent, and in 4BBB the side wins or loses, concedes or not, as one. One player can pick up at any point but that is not the same as a concession; your side is still in the hole.

I am not sure there is a rule as such, but the other rules kinda point you in that direction. May be a decision somewhere.

I generally agree with that but I've never heard that a player is not able to "effectively" pick up if his ball has gone missing.

I can't see any reason why a player in a pair can't concede his own ball, but not the hole, after all one player in a pair can be DQ'd from a hole and his partner continue.

I don't have any leaning one way or the other, I'd just like to see the rule or decision that clarifies it.

 

[doublebogey7]

I generally agree with that but I've never heard that a player is not able to "effectively" pick up if his ball has gone missing.

I can't see any reason why a player in a pair can't concede his own ball, but not the hole, after all one player in a pair can be DQ'd from a hole and his partner continue.

I don't have any leaning one way or the other, I'd just like to see the rule or decision that clarifies it.

The rules allow for a player (or a team in 4BB) to concede. They do not allow for a player to declare themselves out of the hole. I guess because the rule makers never envisaged that a player would wish to do so when the facts don't support it.

 

[backwoodsman]

I've been trying to find such a rule without any luck, can you point me to it please?

Turn it on its head and try to find anything in the rules that says you can ? By which i mean anything that means you can't change your mind and continue if you suddenly happen to find the ball (in time)

 

[Crow]

The rules allow for a player (or a team in 4BB) to concede. They do not allow for a player to declare themselves out of the hole. I guess because the rule makers never envisaged that a player would wish to do so when the facts don't support it.

Turn it on its head and try to find anything in the rules that says you can ? By which i mean anything that means you can't change your mind and continue if you suddenly happen to find the ball (in time)

So it's a bit of a grey area.
I declare I'm out of a hole, opponents play on, I find my ball and say I'm playing on, potential barney ensues as opponents say I can't but nobody can find a rule stating clearly one way or the other.

Saying it was never envisaged is a bit woolly as it's something that I'd imagine could occur quite often and turning it on it's head doesn't really help me any either.
IMHO if there is no rule or decision for it then there should be.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

So it's a bit of a grey area.
I declare I'm out of a hole, opponents play on, I find my ball and say I'm playing on, potential barney ensues as opponents say I can't but nobody can find a rule stating clearly one way or the other.

Saying it was never envisaged is a bit woolly as it's something that I'd imagine could occur quite often and turning it on it's head doesn't really help me any either.
IMHO if there is no rule or decision for it then there should be.

It's pretty clear to me, if the ball isn't lost according to the rules of golf then it is in play. Nothing a player says has any bearing on the status of his or her ball and therefore has no meaning.

 

[Crow]

It's pretty clear to me, if the ball isn't lost according to the rules of golf then it is in play. Nothing a player says has any bearing on the status of his or her ball and therefore has no meaning.

It's not the status of a lost ball that's in question here, it's whether or not someone can "concede" their own ball in a BB matchplay scenario as described, even if he could clearly see his ball in which case lost definitely doesn't come into it.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It's pretty clear to me, if the ball isn't lost according to the rules of golf then it is in play. Nothing a player says has any bearing on the status of his or her ball and therefore has no meaning.

I'd go with this. The player's opponents should have been aware that nothing the player said ruled him out of the hole - the only thing that would do that would be 5mins having passed without him finding it

 

[Crow]

I'd go with this. The player's opponents should have been aware that nothing the player said ruled him out of the hole - the only thing that would do that would be 5mins having passed without him finding it

But where does it say that in the rules?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

But where does it say that in the rules?

Indeed - even after 5mins all that happens is that the players ball is lost and he can go back to where he hit his previous shot and play S&D - so even after 5mins he is not out of the hole.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

It's not the status of a lost ball that's in question here, it's whether or not someone can "concede" their own ball in a BB matchplay scenario as described, even if he could clearly see his ball in which case lost definitely doesn't come into it.

The status of the ball is all that matters.

 

[rulefan]

But where does it say that in the rules?

This tells us exactly what a concession is. If it isn't listed it isn't a concession.
He didn't concede the match. He didn't concede the hole. He didn't concede his opponent's next stroke.

[h=3]2-4. Concession of Match, Hole or Next Stroke[/h]A player may concede a match at any time prior to the start or conclusion of that match.

A player may concede a hole at any time prior to the start or conclusion of that hole.

A player may concede his opponent's next stroke at any time, provided the opponent's ball is at rest. The opponent is considered to have holed out with his next stroke, and the ball may be removed by either side.

 

[Crow]

This tells us exactly what a concession is. If it isn't listed it isn't a concession.
He didn't concede the match. He didn't concede the hole. He didn't concede his opponent's next stroke.

[h=3]2-4. Concession of Match, Hole or Next Stroke[/h]A player may concede a match at any time prior to the start or conclusion of that match.

A player may concede a hole at any time prior to the start or conclusion of that hole.

A player may concede his opponent's next stroke at any time, provided the opponent's ball is at rest. The opponent is considered to have holed out with his next stroke, and the ball may be removed by either side.

Thank you sir!