Swango1980
Well-known member
Not necessarily, not if the hole is playing uphill from your position
Bunkers with water
- Thread starter Deeber
- Start date
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
Where I play (probably the same situation for most clubs) the only people out on the course early enough to make such decision would be greenstaff and it is not their job to set rules of play.
Play starts at 7.30 am and the manager does not start that early and I doubt if any committee member are around at that time.
Where I play there are around 50 bunkers. Just imagine how much time it would take to go out and inspect every bunker to make a decision about individual bunkers and the cost to a club of having sufficient GUR notices in the first place.
Swango1980
Well-known member
I guess the lesson of the story is, avoid the bunkers, especially when waterlogged, as some of them effectively become penalty areas rather than bunkers.
rulefan
Tour Winner
All our green staff have been instructed on recognising the condition of a 'wet' bunker and report possible issues to the course manager or his deputy. They have the authority to mark with blue flags. The LR is permanent.
bobmac
Major Champion
Some bunkers have a tendency to flood more than others.
If its been raining for days and if the forecast is for overnight rain and these bunkers are already filling up, it wouldn't take long for the green staff to check them before play starts and if necessary place GUR signs in/at them.
If its been raining for days and if the forecast is for overnight rain and these bunkers are already filling up, it wouldn't take long for the green staff to check them before play starts and if necessary place GUR signs in/at them.
woofers
Medal Winner
So the head greenkeeper doesn't mark areas considered as GUR ? He has to await clearance from the General Manager or Committee ?
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
I played in an Open a couple of weeks ago. The starter said that some bunkers were marked as GUR. One of the ones I went in there was only about 1 ft left to drop in luckily in the end of the bunker furhest away fro the flag. I had to stand out side of the bunker with ball about 18" below my feet.
Whilst in there a swan waddled across from the other greenside bunker where he had left his mate swimming and started to swim in the one I was playing from.
Whilst in there a swan waddled across from the other greenside bunker where he had left his mate swimming and started to swim in the one I was playing from.
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
I was only referring to flooded bunkers.
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
I would add that where I play a bunker so full of water that there is no spot left to drop in is a very rare occurrence and would probably mean that the course is so wet it would be closed anyway.
We used to have a some bunkers that did so and filled them in for that reason.
We used to have a some bunkers that did so and filled them in for that reason.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
Thinking about this from a fairness point of view, and disenthralling ourselves from the need to defend the status quo, why would it not be acceptable, when most if not all bunkers are full of water ( for the few days that happens), for the course manager to make a decision that all bunkers are out of play and you can drop outside without penalty ( inline with POE )
I know that the present rules say different. But the R &A could have taken the recent opportunity to allow that in their rule changes.
Why defend the present position, which clearly is unfair.
Because under normal circumstances, if you go in a bunker you can play a shot without penalty. If it is flooded, your next shot is taken but a penalty shot is added.
It is not the same as going into a pond or lake penalty area( from which you are clearly not meant to be able to play a shot )
It is not your fault that the bunker is flooded 😀
I know that the present rules say different. But the R &A could have taken the recent opportunity to allow that in their rule changes.
Why defend the present position, which clearly is unfair.
Because under normal circumstances, if you go in a bunker you can play a shot without penalty. If it is flooded, your next shot is taken but a penalty shot is added.
It is not the same as going into a pond or lake penalty area( from which you are clearly not meant to be able to play a shot )
It is not your fault that the bunker is flooded 😀
duncan mackie
Money List Winner
I think you are slightly confused (probably by some of the language in previous posts).
There is nothing in the rules of golf to prevent the actions you put forward.
Nothing.
The handicap authorities have taken the view that a course rated on the basis of its 'hazards' should not have those hazards removed and still be used to administer handicapping - pretty reasonable, even blindingly obvious, for me.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
It seems I am not so much confused as ignorant of the rules regarding flooded bunkers.
on my course there are quite a lot of bunkers, and a few very large ones.
This year the rain has been somewhat constant and so many bunkers have been full of water( I reckon you could swim in some of them!😀)
The course prides itself on not closing, so there have recently been days when what I had referred to about "bunkers out of play" would have been the fair thing to do.
But I thought the present rule prevented such a situation being possible: that all the bunkers couldn't be ruled out "en bloc".
I'd be grateful if you could spell out when this could happen, I.e., can it be so ruled for competition purposes. Your last para suggests that because of handicaps it can't be . Can club competitions be run which don't affect handicaps?
TIA
rulefan
Tour Winner
1) Handicap Qualifiers
If too many bunkers (50% in England) are declared out of play a competition cannot be a qualifier
2) Rules of Golf
The Committee should only use this Local Rule on a case-by-case basis and is not authorized to make a Local Rule providing generally that all flooded bunkers are ground under repair. So, if a committee does this, a competition will not be being played 'under the Rules of Golf'. However, the R&A may not rule or adjudicate on any question raised with them relating to the competition.
That does not mean the course must be closed.
If too many bunkers (50% in England) are declared out of play a competition cannot be a qualifier
2) Rules of Golf
The Committee should only use this Local Rule on a case-by-case basis and is not authorized to make a Local Rule providing generally that all flooded bunkers are ground under repair. So, if a committee does this, a competition will not be being played 'under the Rules of Golf'. However, the R&A may not rule or adjudicate on any question raised with them relating to the competition.
That does not mean the course must be closed.
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Foxholer
Blackballed
Nothing in The Rules prevents this, but that's a different part of Golf to Handicapping administration!
Can and does happen! Turns competition into 'non-qualifier', as does a significantly shortened course.
So Yes, comps can be run that don't affect handicaps.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
Thanks gents.
