Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[Deleted member 16999]

So bleedin' what!

When are you going to absorb my previous statement -- All parties knew that A50 needed to be invoked first!
EU simply applied the Rules.

Do you ignore/object to those Golf ones that happen to be inconvenient for you?

It’s alright spouting this 3 years after the event!
Feel free to show us how you warned people of this and knew there was no way things would change.

You must be pleased having 20/20 Hindsight.

I take it you’ve never seen any rules change in your life?

 

[Foxholer]

It’s alright spouting this 3 years after the event!
Feel free to show us how you warned people of this and knew there was no way things would change.

You must be pleased having 20/20 Hindsight.

I take it you’ve never seen any rules change in your life?

If someone cares to resurrect the pre vote 'Brexit' thread(s), it'll be in there!

Re the Italicised sentence...The ability to say 'I told you so' is really only 'pleasing' when things work out well!

As for the sentence in bold....that merely seems to demonstrate you daft 'logic'!

 

[Deleted member 16999]

If someone cares to resurrect the pre vote 'Brexit' thread(s), it'll be in there!

Re the Italicised sentence...The ability to say 'I told you so' is really only 'pleasing' when things work out well!

As for the sentence in bold....that merely seems to demonstrate you daft 'logic'!

Of course it does, your never wrong.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It may be the case that @Foxholer and others say about No Deal being highlighted as a real possibility is true - however I might suggest that the electorate was not equally well informed - we only have to consider Cummings observation of the influence of the message on the Red Bus on the Leave vote to known that the ‘in the face’ advertising and messages would have been what informed a large section of the electorate.

So whilst the better or more fully informed may have understood that much of the Leave campaign dissing of Remain Project Fear was rubbish - and that many of the risks and the possibility of a No Deal were real - I suggest that Cummings tells us that many did not have that understanding - he tells us that many mostly listened to the Leave message - about the great deal that would be struck - and about what Leave said about Remain concerns.

There may not be that much post-vote revisionist thinking going on with the posters here, however I suggest that it is incontestable that we are not a representative of the wider electorate.

 

[SocketRocket]

It may be the case that @Foxholer and others say about No Deal being highlighted as a real possibility is true - however I might suggest that the electorate was not equally well informed - we only have to consider Cummings observation of the influence of the message on the Red Bus on the Leave vote to known that the ‘in the face’ advertising and messages would have been what informed a large section of the electorate.

So whilst the better or more fully informed may have understood that much of the Leave campaign dissing of Remain Project Fear was rubbish - and that many of the risks and the possibility of a No Deal were real - I suggest that Cummings tells us that many did not have that understanding - he tells us that many mostly listened to the Leave message - about the great deal that would be struck - and about what Leave said about Remain concerns.

There may not be that much post-vote revisionist thinking going on with the posters here, however I suggest that it is incontestable that we are not a representative of the wider electorate.

Oh I see. Most of them were too thick 🙄

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Oh I see. Most of them were too thick 🙄

Your words - not mine. Rather sad that you choose to equate not being fully informed - or being misinformed - with being thick. But if that's how you want to see it then fine - not how I see it.

I know more about aircraft navigation systems than 99.99% of the UK electorate. Does that make me intelligent and that 99.99% thick. No - it simply makes me more informed and the rest less informed about aircraft navigation systems. But feel happy to spin.

 

[Hobbit]

It may be the case that @Foxholer and others say about No Deal being highlighted as a real possibility is true - however I might suggest that the electorate was not equally well informed - we only have to consider Cummings observation of the influence of the message on the Red Bus on the Leave vote to known that the ‘in the face’ advertising and messages would have been what informed a large section of the electorate.

So whilst the better or more fully informed may have understood that much of the Leave campaign dissing of Remain Project Fear was rubbish - and that many of the risks and the possibility of a No Deal were real - I suggest that Cummings tells us that many did not have that understanding - he tells us that many mostly listened to the Leave message - about the great deal that would be struck - and about what Leave said about Remain concerns.

There may not be that much post-vote revisionist thinking going on with the posters here, however I suggest that it is incontestable that we are not a representative of the wider electorate.

Here's a thought Hugh, purely from a Devil's Advocate perspective; maybe it was the better or more fully informed that thought Remain were guilty of Project Fear. What you've done is make an assumption that it was the less informed that labelled it Project Fear. Maybe it was the other way round. And maybe that's being open minded about it, i.e. not coming at it from a closed position with an assumption already in hand.

Personally, I think both sides were guilty of lies and spin, labelling each side guilty of Project Fear. For example, some Leaver politicians painted a picture of unicorn galloping up the Mall. George Osbourne, I believe, didn't do the Remain campaign any favours whatsoever by saying there'd be an emergency budget, that 500,000 would lose their jobs within a year and families would be £4,200 a year worse off.

The emergency budget didn't happen, as many people said it wouldn't. And to lose £4,200 a year would mean that people would need to earn almost £70,000 a year gross to have the spending power capable of getting anywhere near the increased tariff rates that amount to an extra £4,200. As for 500,000 losing their jobs, it hasn't happened yet. If anything the trend is the exact opposite.

BTW, help me out with your last sentence. There's a double negative. Is it contestable that the forum is representative? Sorry, I'm a bit lost on that one.

 

[SocketRocket]

Your words - not mine. Rather sad that you choose to equate not being fully informed - or being misinformed - with being thick. But if that's how you want to see it then fine - not how I see it.

I know more about aircraft navigation systems than 99.99% of the UK electorate. Does that make me intelligent and that 99.99% thick. No - it simply makes me more informed and the rest less informed about aircraft navigation systems. But feel happy to spin.

What's that to do with it. You suggest most people that voted leave didnt understand that no deal was an option. How do you know this and are you suggesting they were either too lazy to find out or were too stupid to understand it.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

What's that to do with it. You suggest most people that voted leave didnt understand that no deal was an option. How do you know this and are you suggesting they were either too lazy to find out or were too stupid to understand it.

I am suggesting that not everyone has the inclination to look into and understand the detail and workings of all things themselves, but are happy to accept the analysis and messages provided by those in whom they trust; that they assume have done that detailed analysis, and therefore have that full and correct understanding.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Here's a thought Hugh, purely from a Devil's Advocate perspective; maybe it was the better or more fully informed that thought Remain were guilty of Project Fear. What you've done is make an assumption that it was the less informed that labelled it Project Fear. Maybe it was the other way round. And maybe that's being open minded about it, i.e. not coming at it from a closed position with an assumption already in hand.

Personally, I think both sides were guilty of lies and spin, labelling each side guilty of Project Fear. For example, some Leaver politicians painted a picture of unicorn galloping up the Mall. George Osbourne, I believe, didn't do the Remain campaign any favours whatsoever by saying there'd be an emergency budget, that 500,000 would lose their jobs within a year and families would be £4,200 a year worse off.

The emergency budget didn't happen, as many people said it wouldn't. And to lose £4,200 a year would mean that people would need to earn almost £70,000 a year gross to have the spending power capable of getting anywhere near the increased tariff rates that amount to an extra £4,200. As for 500,000 losing their jobs, it hasn't happened yet. If anything the trend is the exact opposite.

BTW, help me out with your last sentence. There's a double negative. Is it contestable that the forum is representative? Sorry, I'm a bit lost on that one.

mhm...I'm suggesting that those on this forum are not representative of the wider electorate (we are golfers and most are members of clubs after all) - and that those here might have been in that part of the electorate more inclined to dig deep and understand rather than be told - applies equally to Leave and Remain sides.

 

[Foxholer]

What's that to do with it. You suggest most people that voted leave didnt understand that no deal was an option. How do you know this and are you suggesting they were either too lazy to find out or were too stupid to understand it.

Twaddle! The word SILH used was 'many'!

Btw. I believe his post also identified his 'source'!

 

[Doon frae Troon]

£8,311,500,000.00
That is how much of our money has been spent on melted 50p coins, Get Ready and No Deal planning.

 

[drdel]

I see Poulter and Westwood have called JC a "buffoon" for his tax proposals. Right or wrong they might be wise to stay out politics

 

[drdel]

£8,311,500,000.00
That is how much of our money has been spent on melted 50p coins, Get Ready and No Deal planning.

I think you misunderstood how the Mint functions and the money has paid wages yielding tax and VAT revenue.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I see Poulter and Westwood have called JC a "buffoon" for his tax proposals. Right or wrong they might be wise to stay out politics

Is Poulter also not a resident and so taxpayer in Florida? Rarely good for sports people to get involved in politics, particularly wealthy ones. I get their point but it doesn't come across well.

 

[jp5]

I see Poulter and Westwood have called JC a "buffoon" for his tax proposals. Right or wrong they might be wise to stay out politics

No surprise though, multi-millionaries are scared of Corbyn.

I can only conclude that, for those of us not earning a lifetime's earnings in a weekend, I suspect Corbyn is probably on the right track.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Is Poulter also not a resident and so taxpayer in Florida? Rarely good for sports people to get involved in politics, particularly wealthy ones. I get their point but it doesn't come across well.

The statement they and other Sportsman criticised was Corbyn’s Statement on the amount of Billionaires there are in the world when we have so much poverty, he didn’t mention millionaires or saying people shouldn’t improve themselves, Poulter, in particular, completely missed the point.
I like this statement to put millionaires and billionaires in to perspective:
1 Million seconds = 12 days.
1 Billion seconds = 31 years.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I see Poulter and Westwood have called JC a "buffoon" for his tax proposals. Right or wrong they might be wise to stay out politics

Kind of sums it up for me.... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/shortcuts/2019/nov/04/why-are-golfers-against-jeremy-corbyn

 

[Slime]

Kind of sums it up for me.... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/shortcuts/2019/nov/04/why-are-golfers-against-jeremy-corbyn

What a pathetically written article.
What does it sum up for you .......................... golfers or the Guardian?

 

[Hacker Khan]

What a pathetically written article.
What does it sum up for you .......................... golfers or the Guardian?

It's not an article, it's a bit of frivolous satire aimed at the general stereotype of golfers. If you can't take the mickey out of yourself then lighten up.