Brexit - or Article 50: the Phoenix!

[robinthehood]

Billions already transferred out of the UK economy in to the EU. Frankfurt lapping up city businesses. Remind me what we stand to gain from this.

Although I'll add that fortunately Frankfurt has absolutely nothing much else going for it so not everyone will be rushing to go there.

 

[Hobbit]

Billions already transferred out of the UK economy in to the EU. Frankfurt lapping up city businesses. Remind me what we stand to gain from this.

Oh me sides! Oh, you're killing me!

Remind me of the "equivalence" deal signed on the 1st Nov giving the UK, as a non-EU financial centre, equal footing with EU investment houses. Remind me of the announcement that UK investment houses will continue to have the 'right' to continue investing in the EU post-Brexit. Remind me of the headline that announced over 1,000 EU financial jobs heading to the UK so that offices for their banks can be opened.

The only financial aspect not yet agreed is financial passporting of personal accounts, which is a worry to those of us with UK pensions being paid into UK accounts but needing to have money transferred into the EU. Good thing several of the UK banks have already announced the opening of an EU based subsidiary, e.g. RBS this week, so that monies can still be moved. That's something the pensions investment companies in the EU are very keen to see, especially Germany and France that have taken advantage of the second best growth market(UK) after the USA.

There will be billions lost a year. But I wonder how much money will move in the other direction to be processed by the EU banks setting up offices in the UK.

Two sides to every story...

 

[robinthehood]

Equivalence 🤣🤣🤣 sorry thats just too funny. Do your research on what that really means and see how equivalent we'll be.
Although to be fair there is a study that suggest the city is a drain on other industries in that it Hoover's up talent that could be developing those other industries. Maybe it 'll be a good thing..

 

[Slime]

Billions already transferred out of the UK economy in to the EU. Frankfurt lapping up city businesses. Remind me what we stand to gain from this.

Independence.

 

[IanM]

Billions eh? Bit like Goldmans.....just extended lease on London office.

In the week Macron says a referendum in France would see a Leave Majority, the EU allows France a budget deficit level denied to Italy...

Rules eh? Oh how we laughed

 

[Hacker Khan]

Funny how the lady forgot to mention, although later reported at the end of the piece on the BBC news, that the majority of the intelligence that is used by the EU police comes from -------- you've guessed it, the U.K. So if we're at risk it comes to pass if there is no cooperation, the rest of the EU public is at a bigger risk.

There are those that believe the world is flat.

Yes, I think that was her point. She was not making any political points on Brexit, just saying a hard Brexit would have initial consequences for us in her area of expertise. Reading between the lines I am guessing she does not want a hard Brexit as it will make her, and her colleagues in Europe job, more difficult. Therefore the public everywhere will be under increased risk. Kind of a lose lose.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I don’t think you can say Farage’s influence was negligible. He alone practically forced Cameron to hold the referendum.

I agree, saying Farage had no influence on the referendum is rather 'forgetful'.
Leader of the Brexit skinheads, the bus posters etc etc.
At the time he had between 4 to 5 million supporters mainly in southern and eastern England.
They seem to have trotted back to the Tory party now.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/brexit/8068963/england-leave-uk-to-quit-eu/

Many Scots have been saying this for a while now.
It is a real win win situation, England leaves with it's share of the UK debt [85%] under the same terms that they 'warned' Scotland about in 2014.
They can just do it, no Brexit, no EU debt and gaining the isolation that they crave.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Barclays Bank. "We are fully prepared to be 100% operational in case of hard Brexit."

JCB, "trading on WTO terms is a matter of routine."

Aviva, "we have a presence in several global markets and so believe Brexit will not impact us at all."

GlaxoSmithKline, "Over the longer term, we believe Brexit will not have a material impact on our business."

The Chief Economist for Deutsche Bank, "I am not at all worried about the UK whatever the arrangement, they are the most flexible country in he world."

So Aviva are essentially saying that as they are in several global markets so don't have to rely on the UKs economy that will go down the tubes, they will be fine. Well bully for Aviva.

Also the head of JCB has always been an ardent Brexiter, bit of a maverick (quit the CBI) donated 100 grand to vote leave and a vitriolic opposer of EU regulations. They also dominate the Indian market and do not have to rely so much on Europe. Which is perfectly fine and well done to them for becoming a great British manufacturing success story, but they are possibly not such an impartial commentator on the potential consequences and other companies are not in such a fortunate position with regards to global markets.

 

[Old Skier]

So Aviva are essentially saying that as they are in several global markets so don't have to rely on the UKs economy that will go down the tubes, they will be fine. Well bully for Aviva.

Also the head of JCB has always been an ardent Brexiter, bit of a maverick (quit the CBI) donated 100 grand to vote leave and a vitriolic opposer of EU regulations. They also dominate the Indian market and do not have to rely so much on Europe. Which is perfectly fine and well done to them for becoming a great British manufacturing success story, but they are possibly not such an impartial commentator on the potential consequences and other companies are not in such a fortunate position with regards to global markets.

Hot news, nobody's impartial.

Same argument can be made against the remains chat.
Funny how some people fail to accept that.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Hot news, nobody's impartial.

Same argument can be made against the remains chat.
Funny how some people fail to accept that.

Even hotter news, yes some people or organisations are.

There is a difference between coming to a conclusion after showing no previous bias and examining the facts/using the best estimates based on their expertise in that field Yes that conclusion will come down on one side or the other so some people will see it as biased if it does not adhere to their view. But their whole USP is the fact they are impartial.

The other situation is where an organisation or person has a vested interest in one outcome or is being funded by one side of the argument. I agree it is getting increasingly difficult to find the former, especially in a world where organisations use names like European Research Group to deliberately confuse and give a false impression, but they do exist. Trick is to ask where any research came from and what their background is. Some people are just as capable of filtering our Alistair Campbell as they are Nigel Farage.

 

[drdel]

What next....

A Dutch pop group has released a song focussed on why Brits should stay in EU...!!!!

And,

France, unlike Italy, is being allowed to break the EU budget deficit limits for next year because it (Macron) is a strong supporter of EU integration - bribery?

 

[MegaSteve]

I agree, saying Farage had no influence on the referendum is rather 'forgetful'.
Leader of the Brexit skinheads, the bus posters etc etc.
At the time he had between 4 to 5 million supporters mainly in southern and eastern England.
They seem to have trotted back to the Tory party now.

Uummm the total UK wide vote for UKIP in 2015 was less than 4 million...

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I despair of the level of scaremongering coming from many Remain/establishment sources, and echoed by some Remainers on here. In some cases its at best disingenuous, others need their meds upping. Yes there'll be a dip but its up to the government to manage that. That's what they are in place for. Enact the vote and manage the mechanics of it.

I just wish people would be more even handed and use their intelligence to at least question the hysterical rantings. Research the rants, from both sides, for God's sake. At least that way you won't look like an idiot. George Osbourne is THE prize idiot. "Emergency budget," and "every family will lose £4,200 in the first year," and "800,000 jobs will be lost." And there's some people on here who quoted it as gospel. Idiots.

A simple look at the countries not in the EU but on its immediate borders, and look at their exports and interdependencies. Anyone even remotely believing the scare stories needs a professional carer.

Are there riots in those countries? No. Do they have problems trading with the EU? No. What is Switzerland's main manufactured product exported to the EU? Its medicines. The UK is the EU's second biggest supplier of pharmaceuticals. Do you honestly think the EU will put up a barrier to medicines? No doubt we'll hear the "argh but, argh but..." trotting out the same old rubbish...

The electorate is being softened up for a second vote, and it will be a large majority for Remain. Propaganda wins!

Excellent post Brian, as always you are the voice of reason 👍

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Barclays Bank. "We are fully prepared to be 100% operational in case of hard Brexit."

JCB, "trading on WTO terms is a matter of routine."

Aviva, "we have a presence in several global markets and so believe Brexit will not impact us at all."

GlaxoSmithKline, "Over the longer term, we believe Brexit will not have a material impact on our business."

The Chief Economist for Deutsche Bank, "I am not at all worried about the UK whatever the arrangement, they are the most flexible country in he world."

Drive4show Golf "I will continue to buy foreign golf equipment, imports will not be affected"

Fixed for you Brian 🤣

 

[SocketRocket]

Even hotter news, yes some people or organisations are.

There is a difference between coming to a conclusion after showing no previous bias and examining the facts/using the best estimates based on their expertise in that field Yes that conclusion will come down on one side or the other so some people will see it as biased if it does not adhere to their view. But their whole USP is the fact they are impartial.

The other situation is where an organisation or person has a vested interest in one outcome or is being funded by one side of the argument. I agree it is getting increasingly difficult to find the former, especially in a world where organisations use names like European Research Group to deliberately confuse and give a false impression, but they do exist. Trick is to ask where any research came from and what their background is. Some people are just as capable of filtering our Alistair Campbell as they are Nigel Farage.

What concerns me a little that many of the remain fraternity seem to wish their country to fail just to say 'I told you so' its rather sad really. I understand its difficult for many but how much better it would be if people would accept the outcome and put their backs into the countries future rather than all this wailing and gnashing of teeth.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Uummm the total UK wide vote for UKIP in 2015 was less than 4 million...

Ummmmmmmm.....but that was before they actually started believing things written on the sides of a bus and excluding the EDL sub section.
Also a much larger turn out in the Referendum,

 

[SocketRocket]

Ummmmmmmm.....but that was before they actually started believing things written on the sides of a bus and excluding the EDL sub section.

The smiley does not mask your trolling.

 

[User62651]

What concerns me a little that many of the remain fraternity seem to wish their country to fail just to say 'I told you so' its rather sad really. I understand its difficult for many but how much better it would be if people would accept the outcome and put their backs into the countries future rather than all this wailing and gnashing of teeth.

We're still in the EU so it's too early to claim that. Some people are trying to stop Brexit because they don't want the country to fail. And there lies the problem, no consensus at all. Once we have left in March19 then we'll see if there's any kind of pulling together but no matter how it goes post Brexit, both sides will dress it up as they were correct, no matter what evidence is provided. This will rumble on and on for at least a decade.

 

[Tashyboy]

Billions already transferred out of the UK economy in to the EU. Frankfurt lapping up city businesses. Remind me what we stand to gain from this.

What we stand to gain from this?

No one is going to waste there time trying to explain what we have to gain from this, because your not prepared to listen.