breaking 80.

[Oddsocks]

Ok so i have my own structure (see braking 100), and this has got me down from 20 to 12 in around 2 years, but in that time i may have only broken 80 3 or 4 times, i think a 76 is so far my personal best around a par 68, but i think to get to 10 which is my season aim , i need to approach my game from a different angle.

For example, on par5's, its the longest drive i can hit, followed by the most club i can hit, which should leave me pretty close to the green for an up and down birdie in principle,

Now if we take our first which is a par 5 about 480 off the whites, a good drive away leaves about 230/240 in at the moment, as its always slight wind against, and theres little or no roll due to soft fairways. After a good drive, a good 5w or 3w should leave me inside 50 yards at the most. but on the odd occasion due to the ball being on a slope and your feet being below the ball, i can hit a draw second shot which can leave me behind a little tree or in a bunker around 25 yards short of the green. you can be blocked by the tree but more importantly an up and down from that bunker is near on impossible.

my scores on the first this year have ranged from 8's to more recently, 2 birdies and 3 pars, so generally my scoring on this hole is around 4.6 over the last 5 rounds,

My point is at the moment i seem to basically play on the attack for everything, on good rounds in case of the 76 it works, but in bad rounds... well we know what that means 0.1. os my handicap lowers, and i strive for better scores, should i be changing my approach to the game in respect of course management in search of better scoring.

the reason i ask it a few weeks back i played royal ashdown and after an up and down front 7, i changed my attitude and approach from 8 through to 17, i dropped the driver & instead of playing for length and out with the 3w playing for consistency, on 16 & 15 i hit a driver, but for the rest it was a 3w for position. im just wondering if being always on the attack is killing scores.

 

[chris661]

Re: braking 80.

im just wondering if being always on the attack is killing scores.

I play with quite a few really low cat 1 guys (2,3,4) ant they ALWAYS get as close to the green as they can then rely on the short game to get a birdie at worst.

I think it really depends on your ability with your long game and how confident you are to go for it.

 

[G1BB0]

Re: braking 80.

not really qualified due to high h.c but instead of getting it really close with the second why not hit an easy iron and lay up to pw or sw length. Soft greens are more receptive so can fly one at the flag with height

just another option, also takes out the tree/bunker scenario

Our 18th par 5 is 488 off the whites, I hit 3 wood then lay up to around 120 for pw. I have had lots of birdie chances this way but usually end up 3 putting

 

[Monty_Brown]

Re: braking 80.

For me, most 500yd+ par 5s are tough to reach in present conditions, so I'm trying to be sensible. On second shots I'd rather knock a 4 iron into position on the fairway, leaving say a 70 yard pitch, rather than having a cut with a 3-wood which I know won't get me there.

Chances are the 3-wood will be off line, meaning a chip or pitch from rough, often over a bunker. That's by no means a certain up or down.

I'd rather take my chances with two percentage shots than rely on a high-tariff shot with the wood to (maybe) leave a chip and putt for birdie.

 

[patricks148]

Re: braking 80.

I'm not great from 50 yards if i'm going to hosle one it will be from that distance. if could't reach in two i'd rather leave my self 100 to 120. but that distance i'd try to get on in two or just off the green or in a greenside bunker.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

You have to play to your strengths. I changed my approach last year to be more aggressive and to trust myself and my ability. I used to lay up on par 5s but now I'll always go for it if it's in range. For me, I feel as comfortable with a 3W as I do with a 7i so I'll play the shot that will yield the best potential result, why layup to 100yds when you can be on or near the green.


I guess what you need to ask yourself is, if you stand 3W distance from the green and give yourself 10 attempts going for it and 10 laying up, which do you feel given your game would get you the lowest score on average? On our 15th for example the worst the can happen is I hit a greenside bunker but I still have 3 to get down for par, that to me is an acceptable risk.

It's all about knowing your strengths and weaknesses and trusting yourself.

 

[ArnoldArmChewer]

Re: braking 80.

Interesting, if your risks are low have a go, if not select a club which hopefully keeps you in play.

We have a 600yd par 5, I cannot reach it in 2 in any conditions, generally I take a club to leave me approx 140-150 yards with my 3rd shot, personally I find that this approach provides me with more pars and birdies on the hole rather than lashing my 2nd and getting myself in trouble.

 

[Oddsocks]

interest thought process guys, i suppose taking some of my own advice and really working on 9i/pw/52* then laying up could take the punishment out of play. im scoring better than par as an average, but more interested in how people with a lower hc attack holes.

Is it a case of GIR's to be the way forward, or being at a distance where punishment is out of play and up and down saves are better. Its not so bad for my current course as all of the par 3's are non shot holes, and only one par4 is a non shot hole, but as the hc is getting lower, having less shots to play with may mean playing holes with a bit more thought.

 

[StrangelyBrown]

Re: braking 80.

Reading this thread with interest because I think I can learn a lot about course management from the low guys on here.

 

[chrisd]

Re: braking 80.

I was playing with my brother in law at a course we both knew quite well. He was off 6 and me, at the time off about 15. On one of the par 5's we both buttoned our drives and sat side by side on the fairway, he asked how I planned to play, I said a 3 wood to try and get on. He said that he was going with a 7 iron to leave 100 yards and that I would need to hit a career best 3 wood to make it. We agreed to play as we had said and I hit my 3 wood pretty well into a front bunker, avoiding the oob behind the green, he eased a 7 iron down and then hit the centre of the green with a wedge. I was lucky with my bunker shot and held the green and 2 putted for 5 - he lipped out and made 5.

So, week in week out which way would I play that hole? His way of course as the % chance of a birdie was much greater and the risk much less.


Chris

 

[AllyLodge]

Re: braking 80.

Reading this thread with interest because I think I can learn a lot about course management from the low guys on here.

+1
always though of myself to be a power player, but after a couple of consistent rounds but not long shots/drives etc, I'm starting to play more tactically.
So for our par 5 17th,I'd usually hit driver 5 wood and get as close to the green as possible. But now I like hitting driver 6 iron or 3 wood 5 iron,so it gives me a short iron shot to get it close.

-Ally

 

[MashieNiblick]

Re: braking 80.

I haven't broken 80 off the whites for a while now but for what it's worth OS here's my 2p worth.

It's that old chestnut, risk and reward, and how you feel about taking on a particular shot - is it one you feel confident with, using a favourite club or is it one you have doubts about? Is the trouble where you are likely to go if you hit a bad one (e.g. right and your bad shot is a slice).

My pro told me that the key to lower scores is more about eliminating the bad holes than trying to make birdies or hero pars when you you should be taking your medicine. He pointed out that to break 80 I only need 9 pars and no doubles, so to think about where the pars coming and make sure of those, and don't try to force a score on the tougher holes. Obviously the 5's are a prime par opportunity. What's most likely to get you that par? Lay up to an easy wedge distance or go for the extra yards to leave yourself a chip?

Funnily enough he said the 5's were the holes where length mattered least if you can't reach in 2. Just leave a nice comfortable distance for your 3rd and make sure you are hitting it from the fairway - preferably from a nice flat area with a good line to the flag.

 

[Region3]

Re: braking 80.

On your 1st hole Oddsocks, is it a relatively easy up and down (3 at worst) from the right hand side of the green?

If the answer is yes, then I'd consider aiming right with a draw. If you get the draw, great. If it goes straight it's an easier up and down than from the other side if you'd gone at the green and it moved left.

 

[TED]

You have to play to your strengths. I changed my approach last year to be more aggressive and to trust myself and my ability. I used to lay up on par 5s but now I'll always go for it if it's in range. For me, I feel as comfortable with a 3W as I do with a 7i so I'll play the shot that will yield the best potential result, why layup to 100yds when you can be on or near the green.


I guess what you need to ask yourself is, if you stand 3W distance from the green and give yourself 10 attempts going for it and 10 laying up, which do you feel given your game would get you the lowest score on average? On our 15th for example the worst the can happen is I hit a greenside bunker but I still have 3 to get down for par, that to me is an acceptable risk.

It's all about knowing your strengths and weaknesses and trusting yourself.

What the man said!

 

[User 105]

One bit of advice that has always stuck with me is play the shot you are comfortable with. Confidence is just so important in this game.

No point in standing there with a 3w in your hand, in range and thinking "lets give this a go". You should be able to stand there thinking "I'll put this on the green".

That's why you hear some much chat between pro's and their caddy finding the shot the pro feels comfortable hitting.

Pretty much all of our par 5's you can't get on in 2, either too long or to well protected. Maybe one of them you can if you get the wind with (which is once in a blue moon) and can drive it over 300 yards (again once in a blue moon ).

 

[Oddsocks]

Re: braking 80.

ok chris, although a valid point, would you be happier with your scrambled 5, or would you be more happy with he's text book 5. i bet the adrenalin of your 3 wood was miles more than hes lay up....

i think my above line proves why im around 12 sometimes i honestly dont know when to play that percentage shot., my 3w & 5w are go to clubs, take this as an example,.

Our 17th is around 400/420, a good drive leaves a 7/6i into a green that slops away, but a knobbed drive brings bunkers 50 yards short of the green into play. a few weeks back, i was in a medal and to be fair the card was just in buffer at best, i was within my hc allowance but i knobbed a drive left, and the gps was telling me im 225 out from the centre with a slight wind against, ball sitting up nice, and i pulled my 5w out. i got two reactions straight away, one playing partner comments " your only just in buffer..." and the other off 6 says " you been ripping that all day take it on " i pondered for a minute... practice swipe... felt good, hearts racing, everything about this shot felt good... wallop......... 6 ft from the pin..

the adrenalin in that shot was amazing... but it could have gone so wrong. i was so pumped from the shot that i duck hooked my tee shot of 18 straight obb... but i wouldnt change that decision for the world.

 

[User 105]

Re: braking 80.

ball sitting up nice, and i pulled my 5w out. i got two reactions straight away, one playing partner comments " your only just in buffer..." and the other off 6 says " you been ripping that all day take it on " i pondered for a minute... practice swipe... felt good, hearts racing, everything about this shot felt good... wallop......... 6 ft from the pin..

My exact point above. You stood over the shot and felt confident. If you'd have had any doubts I bet you would have 'knobbed' it.

 

[Oddsocks]

Re: braking 80.

I haven't broken 80 off the whites for a while now but for what it's worth OS here's my 2p worth.

It's that old chestnut, risk and reward, and how you feel about taking on a particular shot - is it one you feel confident with, using a favourite club or is it one you have doubts about? Is the trouble where you are likely to go if you hit a bad one (e.g. right and your bad shot is a slice).

My pro told me that the key to lower scores is more about eliminating the bad holes than trying to make birdies or hero pars when you you should be taking your medicine. He pointed out that to break 80 I only need 9 pars and no doubles, so to think about where the pars coming and make sure of those, and don't try to force a score on the tougher holes. Obviously the 5's are a prime par opportunity. What's most likely to get you that par? Lay up to an easy wedge distance or go for the extra yards to leave yourself a chip?

Funnily enough he said the 5's were the holes where length mattered least if you can't reach in 2. Just leave a nice comfortable distance for your 3rd and make sure you are hitting it from the fairway - preferably from a nice flat area with a good line to the flag.

Some interesting tips there, i think from my course i know my bogey holes, 2nd, 9th, 11th, 15th & normally 18th. the rest is just down to paring the par 's which of late have been pretty poor, but i think thats a confidence thing. cheers mashie..

On your 1st hole Oddsocks, is it a relatively easy up and down (3 at worst) from the right hand side of the green?

If the answer is yes, then I'd consider aiming right with a draw. If you get the draw, great. If it goes straight it's an easier up and down than from the other side if you'd gone at the green and it moved left.

our first is weird, the slope on the fairway always gives a right to left ball flight, so you always factor that into your 2nd, short about 30 yards and left is a bunker that ive never seen an up and down save from, the green slopes right to left, and on the left side of the green is a bank that gives a crap lie or runs off onto the 2nd tee. from the right you have a bunker with pretty much no sand the length of the green, so anything right with draw runs 2 risks, either landing in the bunker, or having to chip over the bunker which is hard to stop a ball on as from the right the green runs away from you.

My birdies have all come from GIR, with a good uphill put from the left side, putting along the green or down teh green can be a complete mere, especially as its teh first green and our greens are always different pace to what the practice green is. In my last 5 rounds, ive always played for the left side of the green, knowing it will leave an uphill put which is more controlable.

*eureeka moment * maybe here lies the key to future lower scores, it now simply not a case of thinking fairway hit, GIR hit, now lets 2 put, i need to think of other factors, where on the green id like to be in relation to a SAFE 2 putt for a par, and also where on the green i would most like to miss to still achieve an up and down save if i do miss.

cheers region, its made me think about another angle. :thup:

 

[m10johnson]

Re: braking 80.

I play with quite a few really low cat 1 guys (2,3,4) ant they ALWAYS get as close to the green as they can then rely on the short game to get a birdie at worst.

My mate that plays off 2.3 never plays with this attitude to a hole. He will either go for the green and if he lays up then I will have a 20 yarder say. But normally he and myself would layup to around 80-100 yards and play an easy gap wedge into the green.

 

[User 105]

Re: braking 80.

My mate that plays off 2.3 never plays with this attitude to a hole. He will either go for the green and if he lays up then I will have a 20 yarder say. But normally he and myself would layup to around 80-100 yards and play an easy gap wedge into the green.

I think it depends on the player. Some are more comfortable from 50-100 well clear of any trouble and some are mustard out of bunkers etc. So if they are mustard from the bunkers then they're more likely to have a crack.