Bar levy/card

[User2021]

Would the change in law be that bad for people ? Surely changing the law to reduce the limit would help reduce the amount of people that are dangerous on the road ?

i actually don’t think a change in the limit would have that much affect if in isolation.
Thirty years ago driving home around closing time you would often see a Police car parked up waiting in certain spots

now there just aren’t those resources.

So until there are more officers to enforce the law whatever the limit then I don’t think you will see a massive reduction.

Lets be honest unless someone reports a drink driver or they have an accident chances are they ain’t getting caught as their aren’t the Police officers out there.
I am in no way condoning drink driving it’s just an opinion.

 

[Digger]

With so many clubs struggling these days in my opinion all clubs should adapt the bar levy policy, so many car park golfers ie those who play and take off right after their round.

What, you mean those scoundrels who join a golf club, just to play golf, and may have a life outside of golf to get home to? Stone em to death I say!!

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Yes there are many variables but I suspect that two pints wouldn't put the majority of the golfing population over the limit. I know what I base my opinion on, what do you base yours on?

The reduced limits on alcohol level in Scotland effectively means one pint of a standard 4% abv beer will take you over the limit.

Scottish limit is 50 milligrams of alcohol per whatever, in England it is 80. BiM, do the maths, as the Americans would say.

I got pulled 15 years ago having had 2 pints. The years ban was difficult to take. Almost lost my job. I thought I’d be fine after 2. Needless to say I don’t have anything if I’m driving now. So yes, 2 pints can put you over.

Real life proof. Your aggressive responses suggest you regularly have two pints and then drive. Maybe worth buying a breathalyser kit and try it next time you are in that situation. Better that than gambling.

What, you mean those scoundrels who join a golf club, just to play golf, and may have a life outside of golf to get home to? Stone em to death I say!!

Agreed. If people want to spend lots in the bar that is up to them. Equally if others don't that should also be a choice. Their money, their choice.

 

[User20205]

The bar at members clubs, in the main, needs to be subsided. Stay or don’t stay but without a bar the club is no longer a members club. They can’t survive as standalone entities. Lose the bar, lose the club, lets all go down the muni....imo

 

[Twire]

I'm a member of a golf CLUB not a golf course and if paying a bar levy helps support that club then I don't have a problem with it. We have a £70 levy so not a massive amount in the great scheme of things. It does make smile when all the car park golfers come in moaning at Christmas time to use up their levy on over inflated bottles of wine.......reminds me of the folk that moan about pitch marks but rarely repair their own

 

[GB72]

What I dont get is why playing golf and going home is such a bad thing. There are hundreds of reasons why people cannot and do not hang around and if that is what they want then it is all fine with me. At my old club I found the bar boring, stuffy and not somewhere I wanted to spend my time. Used to go to my local with my playing partners. £50 bar levy was wasted most years and so resented.

Prefer where I am now and happily spend £10 at least most weeks

Not sure that I go with the suggestionabout it allowing greater purchasing powers. What next, a pro shop levy so they can get balls in cheaper

 

[Digger]

I'm a member of a golf CLUB not a golf course and if paying a bar levy helps support that club then I don't have a problem with it. We have a £70 levy so not a massive amount in the great scheme of things. It does make smile when all the car park golfers come in moaning at Christmas time to use up their levy on over inflated bottles of wine.......reminds me of the folk that moan about pitch marks but rarely repair their own

Each to his own. I go to the golf course to play golf. I have the odd drink afterwards during the summer, but wouldn't be fussed if there was no bar. In fact, if the bar isn't breaking even, I see no reason why my golf subs should go towards a failing part of the business to keep a small minority happy. Far better to plough the money back into the course. Or for those that want a drink/off course social, why not outsource the bar?

 

[DCB]

The bar at members clubs, in the main, needs to be subsided. Stay or don’t stay but without a bar the club is no longer a members club. They can’t survive as standalone entities. Lose the bar, lose the club, lets all go down the muni....imo

Great summary.


Add to that the cost of stocking the bar, with lower turnover, the cost of your stock is going to rise as you are not buying as much from the supplier. It's a vicious circle. If you value your club, support it to the hilt, or .... It may not be there that much longer.

 

[Digger]

Great summary.


Add to that the cost of stocking the bar, with lower turnover, the cost of your stock is going to rise as you are not buying as much from the supplier. It's a vicious circle. If you value your club, support it to the hilt, or .... It may not be there that much longer.

Are we saying a golf club can't be successful without a bar?

 

[patricks148]

I'm a member of a golf CLUB not a golf course and if paying a bar levy helps support that club then I don't have a problem with it. We have a £70 levy so not a massive amount in the great scheme of things. It does make smile when all the car park golfers come in moaning at Christmas time to use up their levy on over inflated bottles of wine.......reminds me of the folk that moan about pitch marks but rarely repair their own

couldn't have put it better myself.:thup:

 

[User20205]

Are we saying a golf club can't be successful without a bar?

It can’t be a club without a bar, just a course.

Look, I understand people need to shoot off, ive got young kids, but every single time? Having a soft drink/coffee/beer with your playing partners is one of the cornerstones of Golf. I wouldn’t play regularly with someone who shot off every time.

As for the bar being stuffy etc....take ownership, it’s your bar as well. Ours used to be awful, like a library, but more multi tee starts, a pool table and a dart board have started to change it. If you’re a member, make it work for you.

 

[duncan mackie]

Interesting comments (apart from those on driving) but I think the underlying issue has been skirted round.
Putting aside general card systems and members discounts (these have convience, links to membership benefits and club stats elements but aren't strictly relevant to levy) the underlying issue is in knowing you have the income to support the existence of a bar/catering facility, and for what hours and services. As such they were originally the preserve of members clubs where catering isn't run at a profit (pointless) and staffing costs are a significant element of the proposition. Many, many, of these clubs have gone over to very basic, focused, services (coffee machine in the clubhouse is all you can get before 1100 for example) and levies were designed to ensure catering levels that were provided didn't make a loss.
Issues about the legality of aspects generally caused them to fall away a little; despite these having been created by the introduction of them in the wider 'club's ' categories where they were seen as a route to increased profits ie another marginal profit source to add to the membership package.
In my view they are generally a good thing if done for the right reason - for many clubs the alternative is the complete removal of all catering facilities and, of course, they only come in because the majority of the club's membership vote that way! Those against always have a choice.
Is a golf club without any catering facilities still a club is an interesting philosophical question, but I wouldn't want to be a member at one and have always found it strange turning up to those with an empty clubhouse and no staff!

 

[Digger]

It can’t be a club without a bar, just a course.

Really? Can you define a club then? I ask because there are plenty of photographic clubs up and down the country with no bar.

Look, I understand people need to shoot off, ive got young kids, but every single time? Having a soft drink/coffee/beer with your playing partners is one of the cornerstones of Golf. I wouldn’t play regularly with someone who shot off every time.

What if it's not a need? What if they actually want to ' shoot off'?

I'm playing devils advocate slightly as I do use our clubs facilities, but I don't want to be told I 'Should'.

 

[User20205]

I'm playing devils advocate slightly as I do use our clubs facilities, but I don't want to be told I 'Should'.

Do what you want, no should about it, but being a member of a golf club comes with certain responsibilities, all of which are made clear upon joining. Join or don’t join a club with a levy. Go to the AGM and change it?

I’m not going down the route of comparing spurious, tenuous ‘other’ clubs to a golf club. A strip club, a chess club, a club biscuit.....except to say that a photography club doesn’t need the same infrastructure as a golf club.

Golf is many things to many people, take/give to it what you need, but not wanting to stay and be sociable with the fellas you’ve spent 4hrs with is odd IMO. The world must be a very scary place?

Even Homer stays for a pint

 

[Blue in Munich]

Scottish limit is 50 milligrams of alcohol per whatever, in England it is 80. BiM, do the maths, as the Americans would say.

I did the maths for 30 years, thanks, so if it's all the same to you I'll stick with what I found out during that rather than a couple of posts off a golf forum. :thup:

The actual limit is pretty irrelevant if there are no resources to enforce it.

 

[Break90]

I'd say that on a normal saturday and wednesday(comp days), around 250 people play across our two courses, sundays a similar number most of the year, with other weekdays being relatively quiet (lets say 100-120 players)

Using saturdays as an example, in my experience around 75-80% of golfers go into the clubhouse afterwards. We have a large lounge bar, spike bar and patio, all recently renovated with new furniture, lighting etc, and massive glass frontage overlooking the course. Especially during the summer its a very popular place. Most groups stay for drinks and lunch (or snacks, coffee and cake etc)

I personally spend around 50 quid per month, and I'd say I'm pretty typical in that within the group of 12 that I play in each week. There will be a large number of people who don't spend anywhere near this, and a smaller number that drink in there all weekend and spend a considerably larger amount.

The bottom line is the catering and bar just about breaks even, and they do a fantastic job. The quality of the offering is top notch, the staff are great, and the event catering (matches, social events etc) is quality.

Our club has around 1400 members , of which around 1000 fall into the 7 day membership across both men and women.

Adding the 5 day members (around 300), the 50 pound bar levy realises somewhere in the region of 65k each year. If cancelled, this equates to around 60 full membership fees. It's a large amount of money to replace, or more accurately, to not have in the bank at the beginning of the membership year to aid budgeting and forecasting etc.

For me it's a part of being a member. You get a discount so it's a win win as far as I'm concerned. In my 4 years as a member I honestly can't remember a single person questioning the bar levy.

 

[HampshireHog]

We have a non-refundable Levy of £150 usable in the Bar, Halfway Hut and for Comp entries. Frankly, even playing only once a week if I can’t spend that at least 3-4 times over I’d be staggered. There are occasions when I can’t stay for a drink after a round but as a rule I do, and I would be less inclined to play with members who typically prefer to play and go.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

How many have left the club (in all honesty) knowing they have maybe have had one too many and how many have know fellow members that have left definitely worse for wear. What do you do especially in the latter case. Playing devils advocate slightly, and a scenario I've come across. what happens if someone calls the police who are conveniently waiting outside the club, they get tested and pass the test. Word has a way of getting out and in this case the law decided the driver was fit so would you really risk being ostracised in the club?

 

[NorfolkShaun]

I nearly always stop for a drink, sadly we are tied to a hotel so really limited 'Club' atmosphere in the bar.

Personally i don't drink alcohol after a round and drive, I have a 30 min drive and could not face losing my license.

Club i used to be at some of the gents would play and then sit drinking in the bar most of the afternoon. No idea how they got home.

Would have no issue with a bar levy at a golf club, as mentioned part of the club.

 

[OnTour]

Find out how much the bar manager gets paid and staff then justify why you need to cough up extra to keep them in a job.

£28,000 for manager alone, sorry but unless the bar justifies it by paying its way then scrap it. Install self service or honesty bar like north Warwickshire have 👏

Sunday at ncc the famous Sullivan speed drinkers, keeping the bar manager in a job. Nobody mention smashing into the front gate 🤔

Drinking is overrated, golf is about the course. The pub is the drinking club.