Attitude Towards Womens Golf

[Ethan]

At the club I play at men and women have equal membership and play any day of the week. Some comps are men only, some are women only, some are for both/either. Any club member can play off any tees they want, so if a woman wants to play off the black tees, or a man off the red, either is fine.

I think this issue of women's professional golf is interesting. I admire players who can hit every green and fairway, as many women pros do, but to be honest, when I watch professional golf, I want to see shots I couldn't possibly ever hit - a 3 iron from 240 yards or a drive of 340 yards. I am not so interested in seeing a golfer nudging the ball 250 yards down the fairway and hitting a hybrid from 190 yards whether they are male or female.

One of the big issues for women's golf is that US TV ratings have plunged since the huge rise and dominance of Asian women players in the last few years. Americans like American players and they haven't got their head around a lot of these newer Asian players. Even the Americans of Asian origin mixed in have been overlooked too. In any case, that has had a knock on effect on the profile of the game. The American TV networks (and LPGA Tour) are desperate for a local hero - Lexi Thompson, perhaps.

 

[AmandaJR]

Ooh what a hot potato and always will be. I hit the ball a decent way but when I play courses whose only challenge is length and impossible to get on a Par 4 with my Sunday best drive and 5 wood then it's no fun and realistically no challenge as there's not much I can do to beat/match the course. I'd much rather face a course that makes me think my way round and manage the course rather than just blast it as far as I can. At a risk of stating the obvious - physically there's a difference between the boys and girls!

Some of the comments I read on here about ladies golf make me laugh out loud and I think must be said in jest until the poster defends their position and I realise they meant it. Each to their own and just so long as I never have to play golf with that type of golfer then I don't really care what they think.

 

[FairwayDodger]

its unfair that you dont get the privilege of going first. Its also unfair that the men are used a guinea pigs to see the how the wind affects the tee shots on the next hole.

True. Although in the situation I described I was playing our so-called "mixed medal". This is actually two separate medals but men and women can play in the same group.

 

[garyinderry]

how do you find that adams 25 degree fdodger? i just got the 16degree A12 pro and it is a beast of a club. im thinking of changing my 19degree mizuno hybrid as i think the reg shaft doesnt suit.

 

[FairwayDodger]

how do you find that adams 25 degree fdodger? i just got the 16degree A12 pro and it is a beast of a club. im thinking of changing my 19degree mizuno hybrid as i think the reg shaft doesnt suit.

I love it, hit it really well and have great confidence with it.

Trouble is I bought it to fill a gap in my old irons. With my new set that gap doesn't really exist any more but I can't bring myself to take it out the bag and I hit it in preference to my 5 iron. Need to wean myself off it during the winter!

 

[garyinderry]

I love it, hit it really well and have great confidence with it.

Trouble is I bought it to fill a gap in my old irons. With my new set that gap doesn't really exist any more but I can't bring myself to take it out the bag and I hit it in preference to my 5 iron. Need to wean myself off it during the winter!

if its not broke then dont fix it. going to try and nab the stiff version of my mizuno and if i cant then il go down the adams route. they sit really well at address dont they. beautiful clubs!

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Lots of points, not all of them positive. I have no problems with lady members, even those that are occassionally slow. We as a club need them to survive and they need to have equal rights on and off the course. They have a course measured for CSS/SSS off the reds and handicaps are allotted accordingly. They aren't all long hitters especially those of a certain age or who aren't that prodigious in ability but surely it's no different to the 23-28 handicapper nobbling shots or carving it off the tee.

Competitions are there for the enjoyment of the membership and some are men only. women only or open to both sexes. We have a couple over the long bank holiday weekends which are open to both. Do women win them? Not often but there again the percentage entering is significantly smaller. If they do then I have no gripe. Sames as anyone that wins. Best player on the day.

On the subject of role models we regularly have the BBO junior girls teams playing. Apart from looking old for their age (or I'm just old) these guys are always polite and couteous in the clubhouse, have been drilled on etiquette and always replace divots and repair pitchmarks, and hit it silly distances with such long, languid swings. Our club like others need to nuturing these. They are going to be our lifeblood in the years to come and of course the better the player, the more reflected glory the club gets so it becomes a win win. To be fair though our junior boys are similar in term of etiquette and so are the BBO boys teams we have visiting.

This is a forum and so there will always be a modicum of "boyish" behaviour but as long as it doesn't cross a line which I think for most is pretty clear (and if you aren't sure either don't comment or err on the side of caution). For the most part the active lady members on here give as good as they get and I would hope they are comfy enough on here by now to hold their hand up and say "NO" if they think something has gone too far. I wouldn't want the forum to change and become a conservative and insular set up. It has thrived in last few years and someone once said wisely, behave as you would behave in your clubhouse and you won't go far wrong.

As for the ladies pro game, it's sad that there really isn't the product to make it a viable option to screen live or more recorded highlights more often. It has some fantastic players at the very top but how the LET and LPGA go about promoting that is tricky issue. Clearly in the US with the Golf Channel etc there is a dedicated channel that can stream the bigger events but that option isn't available.

In essence, I don't think we have an issue on here per se and to be honest most on here will treak lady members with a degree of courtesy. Some may macho pose on here to the contrary and some may actually have issues dealing with ladies in a golf club environment but we can't let the odd 1% cloud the way the majority act

 

[duncan mackie]

On a side note, can the better ladies opt to use the gents tees for comp and handicap purposes if they want to.

Ladies, and gents, can run qualifying competitions off any measured course that is assessed for SSS for ladies and/or gents. Few clubs bother to get any tees assessed for both - we have the Red tees assessed for both (and the SSS is, of course, different for each as explained earlier)

On your earlier point; a key point in golf course design and player enjoyment is the use of the appropriate tee for the players capability. Whilst this is most obvious in terms of water/heavy rough carry from the tee it also applies to the general relationship between hazards, doglegs etc. Even with the 'normal' 3 tee approach we still have scope for significant anomalies with, for example, the disparity between the play of senior golfers and the tees used. These frequently give rise to significant swings in 'advantage' for different capabilities from different tees against different course conditions. It may be interesting to note that in the US the trend is for around 6 sets of measured tees.

Overall there are as many men who should be playing off Reds as there are women who should be playing off yellows, or whites.

 

[AmandaJR]

Lots of points, not all of them positive. I have no problems with lady members, even those that are occassionally slow. We as a club need them to survive and they need to have equal rights on and off the course. They have a course measured for CSS/SSS off the reds and handicaps are allotted accordingly. They aren't all long hitters especially those of a certain age or who aren't that prodigious in ability but surely it's no different to the 23-28 handicapper nobbling shots or carving it off the tee.

Competitions are there for the enjoyment of the membership and some are men only. women only or open to both sexes. We have a couple over the long bank holiday weekends which are open to both. Do women win them? Not often but there again the percentage entering is significantly smaller. If they do then I have no gripe. Sames as anyone that wins. Best player on the day.

On the subject of role models we regularly have the BBO junior girls teams playing. Apart from looking old for their age (or I'm just old) these guys are always polite and couteous in the clubhouse, have been drilled on etiquette and always replace divots and repair pitchmarks, and hit it silly distances with such long, languid swings. Our club like others need to nuturing these. They are going to be our lifeblood in the years to come and of course the better the player, the more reflected glory the club gets so it becomes a win win. To be fair though our junior boys are similar in term of etiquette and so are the BBO boys teams we have visiting.

This is a forum and so there will always be a modicum of "boyish" behaviour but as long as it doesn't cross a line which I think for most is pretty clear (and if you aren't sure either don't comment or err on the side of caution). For the most part the active lady members on here give as good as they get and I would hope they are comfy enough on here by now to hold their hand up and say "NO" if they think something has gone too far. I wouldn't want the forum to change and become a conservative and insular set up. It has thrived in last few years and someone once said wisely, behave as you would behave in your clubhouse and you won't go far wrong.

As for the ladies pro game, it's sad that there really isn't the product to make it a viable option to screen live or more recorded highlights more often. It has some fantastic players at the very top but how the LET and LPGA go about promoting that is tricky issue. Clearly in the US with the Golf Channel etc there is a dedicated channel that can stream the bigger events but that option isn't available.

In essence, I don't think we have an issue on here per se and to be honest most on here will treak lady members with a degree of courtesy. Some may macho pose on here to the contrary and some may actually have issues dealing with ladies in a golf club environment but we can't let the odd 1% cloud the way the majority act

Well said Homer :clap:

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

...and the difficult and not often asked question...'are we not actually very interested in a game that increasingly looks to be being dominated by the players of one country - South Korea'. I could appreciate the battle with the elements and the skill shown by the ladies over the weekend. But if South Koreans are going to 'take over'...??? I can appreciate their golf - but struggle to have any emotional attachment or involvement with any. And for the sports viewing experience to be sustainable I believe youhave to be able to develop an emotional attachment to one or more players who could get 'in the mix'

 

[HomerJSimpson]

...and the difficult and not often asked question...'are we not actually very interested in a game that increasingly looks to be being dominated by the players of one country - South Korea'. I could appreciate the battle with the elements and the skill shown by the ladies over the weekend. But if South Koreans are going to 'take over'...??? I can appreciate their golf - but struggle to have any emotional attachment or involvement with any. And for the sports viewing experience to be sustainable I believe youhave to be able to develop an emotional attachment to one or more players who could get 'in the mix'

I quite agree that the domination of ladies golf by South Korea and the Japanese will do nothing to promote the game globally although it will send it into the stratosphere in a golf mad part of the world like the Far East. I think it is difficult for promoters especially in the US and to a degree in Europe too to engage with players who by their own admission struggle with the language and some of the cultures. Clearly the US audience wants an all American player like Creamer or an old stager like Pat Hurst etc to sock it to the foreigners. In Europe the LET is really nothing more than a kindergarden and launch pad for the emerging talent to hone their games before going across the Atlantic in pursuits of the mighty $

 

[Shiny]

Our ladies section is I am led to believe thriving. As is the juniors section which from what I have seen is an almost half and half boy/girl split. This is no doubt due to haveing a female junior captain and a big push from the committee and ladies section.

 

[Garush34]

What comes first - lack of interest or lack of coverage resulting in lack of interest? I'd have thought most keen golfers would be interested in the top level of the sport played by either gender but I guess not.

this is exactly what i thought. i watch golf every day i can and i was rather disappointed when there was no golf on the tv to watch. i couldnt watch the euro golf as i was working and the chance to watch the womens over the weekend, gave me the golf i needed.
i hated the bbc's coverage always have and always will but i thought the golf was great. didnt focus too much on one player/group of players like the mens but you got to see a bit of everyone. i always watch the womens golf the few times a year its showen, and i wish there was more on.

sky certainly have the capability to do it. if they have a channel just for F1 then surely they could have a dedicated golf channel.

 

[6inchcup]

there was a dedicated golf Chanel on sky but it got dropped because of the revenue needed to keep it wasn't cost effective because of the very low viewing figures.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

there was a dedicated golf Chanel on sky but it got dropped because of the revenue needed to keep it wasn't cost effective because of the very low viewing figures.

Thought that was the Setanta platform that had the Golf Channel

 

[GreiginFife]

Thought that was the Setanta platform that had the Golf Channel

It was actually just a platform channel that piggybacked on the broadcast license that Setanta had (some back handed deal, one of the many reasons Setanta went down the pan).
Lack of revenue and viewing was one reason, the licensed broadcaster not declaring it on their platform when their conditional access contract was renewed was probably the main one.

 

[6inchcup]

It was actually just a platform channel that piggybacked on the broadcast license that Setanta had (some back handed deal, one of the many reasons Setanta went down the pan).
Lack of revenue and viewing was one reason, the licensed broadcaster not declaring it on their platform when their conditional access contract was renewed was probably the main one.

it was on sky a long time before satanta started, then got dropped like a ton of bricks along with about 5 or 6 other channels when sky had a clear out.

 

[GreiginFife]

it was on sky a long time before satanta started, then got dropped like a ton of bricks along with about 5 or 6 other channels when sky had a clear out.

No, it wasn't. Conditional access for Setanta was March 2004, The Golf Channel started broadcasting in May 2005 as part of said CA agreement. Ceased broadcasting April 2008 when Setanta renewed the CA agreement but failed to declare TGC as part of their platform requirement.
There was a golf channel that broadcast as a FTA platform channel between 2006 and 2007 just called GolfTV but it was a commercial flop as it couldn't generate revenue despite having reasonable viewing figures. So the CA agreement was pulled.

 

[Fader]

I can't claim to have seen many of the comments regarding the womens game on here over the course of the weekend as i've only really popped on fleetingly today and not at all over the weekend.

I admit I made a comment about Ms Creamers socks, but am not ashamed of that. However one thing I will say is, I actually really enjoy watching the ladies game when it is on the tv. I really enjoyed both the Kraft Nabisco and Womens Open, I think the Curtis cup left a lot to be desired but imo that was more down to poor tv coverage and not the golf.

One think the guy I had/have lessons with first said to me and still does is to watch the womens pro game to see the tempo of their swings and the way they manage a course instead of trying to over power it.

I'm not sure I agree that men & women will compete in level playing fields in the future as by pure nature mens golf seems to be erring towards the 7500+ length of golf course and focusing purely on power rather than precision, whereas the ladies game is more of precision over power. Yes there are female pro's that can get it out there and i'm sure many a lot longer than most men in the amateur game as we play it, but seriously can you see Paula Creamer or Yani Tseng competing on the length of course that Bubba and Rory do and giving them a run for their money I can't.

One last thing though, my sporting highlight of 2011 was and remains the European Solheim Cup victory, and I for one will continue to watch the ladies game not for Ms Creamers socks or Mel Reids pretty face, but simply because I enjoy watching the way that all the players ont he LET and LPGA play the game in a much better spirit than their male counter parts and play it so damn well.

:sbox:

 

[Deadlydan]

Top notch comments, Fader,couldn't agree more
I went over to the solheim and it was a spectacular experience really enjoyed the golf