Attitude Towards Womens Golf

I play and live with a very talented lady golfer, my wife. She will never out drive me, but she WILL hit more fairways and GIR than I do and until I change that she will be a much better player than me and many of the men that play the game to a "reasonable" standard.
So my view on women's golf is that they can be as good as, or as bad as, any man out there in terms of technical ability​ hitting it far isn't everything.
 
The only way it would be fair for men and women to play from the same tees in a mixed comp is if all handicaps were taken from the same tee, which they are not.
We have a hole where the ladies tee is 100 yds in front of the mens, my handicap is taken from playing off the forward tee, hoe would it be fair for me to play to the same handicap but have 100 yds further to play.
 
Snelly said:
The answer is market forces. It is not a valuable product. It is just not as good.
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Yes. No. No

Market forces (here) simply dictate that the smaller target audience creates a lower value; it has nothing to do with quality.

I will happily watch and learn (probably more) from such events, but accept I am in the minority (of 'men')

I'm also as happy to tee up in a medal with a lady in the game, as a junior, senior or the club champion - any concerns I would have are based on etiquette issues and a general ability to play the game with a modicum of competency; this latter reduces for friendly games and, just for clarity, I am talking about being able to play to about 24/26.

Handicapping is accepted to be different - this difference is reflected in the use of different tees. if an 18 handicap 'bloke' played from tees with the same SSS as the lady 18 handicap's red tees then they should be on a par, so to speak. the SSS for the red tees is set to bring this equality about. You could set the SSS for the red tees using the same parameters as the men's tees but, in general, this would simply scale the upper end of the ladies handicap range even further out and brings no benefits.
 
I think it goes to a wider issue.... men's attitude to women in general.

In golf terms it really pisses me off when men slag off women golfers. There are very many reasons why (on average) women don't play golf to the same standard; and physical prowess is only one of them. For example, how many 40+ women had the opportunity to play golf as children? Compare that with men. Even now there are NO girls in the junior section at my club.

Then those that take it up in later life have to put up with all the abuse, sexism and general B.S. from the men and join clubs where they are clearly second-class citizens.

I think it affects me less than most others because guys that see me play quickly realise that I can actually hit a ball; but even I have to put up with patronising comments from men who will never play golf as well as I do.

Often comments on this forum are ludicrous. Anything "bad" that happens in the women's game is attributed to gender. Well, guess what, Kevin Na is a guy, slow play is a problem on the men's tour and male pro competitions have been suspended in conditions that the majority on this forum have continued to play in. Gaaaaaaaaaaah!!!!


And..... breathe......

:lol:
 
So, what would be the downsides of removing the red tees completely? Isn't it possible that the distinction between men's and women's tees is in itself sexist? We appear to be saying "come on ladies. Play this wonderful sport. But don't worry, you won't have to play the full game as we don't think you're good enough."
 
bluewolf said:
So, what would be the downsides of removing the red tees completely? Isn't it possible that the distinction between men's and women's tees is in itself sexist? We appear to be saying "come on ladies. Play this wonderful sport. But don't worry, you won't have to play the full game as we don't think you're good enough."
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You need to be realistic about physical capabilities and make the game enjoyable. The majority of ladies at my club simply couldn't cope with playing the course from the white tees; they just wouldn't be able to hit several greens in regulation.

I play off 7 and, at my club, am considered a "big hitter" but I've been at plenty of courses where I just wouldn't have the ammo to hit some of the greens.

But it could work - just move the whites up so they're a realistic distance for women. I'm guessing you wouldn't fancy that...
 
Not a great fan of Women's golf - but not much of a fan of watching golf full stop. I did watch a fair bit of the Ladies Open and I could relate a lot more with their play and to my surprise (I admit) I really enjoyed it. A bit like watching paralympic sport - ignore the constraints, limitations (disability) - just enjoy the sporting endeavor and achievement. And again as for paralympic sport first cast out your preconceptions and bias and when you have done this you will be able see and appreciate it for what it is.
 
FairwayDodger said:
You need to be realistic about physical capabilities and make the game enjoyable. The majority of ladies at my club simply couldn't cope with playing the course from the white tees; they just wouldn't be able to hit several greens in regulation.

I play off 7 and, at my club, am considered a "big hitter" but I've been at plenty of courses where I just wouldn't have the ammo to hit some of the greens.

But it could work - just move the whites up so they're a realistic distance for women. I'm guessing you wouldn't fancy that...
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I'm guessing that there are quite a few who would jump at the chance. There are plenty of men who can't reach the greens in regulation. That's why there's a handicapping system as a leveller. Why do we need 2 distinct levellers? It's a genuine question by the way.
 
I just wish more girls could be encouraged to pick up clubs and play. I'm always heartened to see a woman with a nice swing out on the course or at the driving range and wish it was more common.

At our club, like many I imagine, we have a big junior section, but no girls. The ladies section therefore begins at age 45 ish, most have taken the game up late for a bit of fun, and most are generally appalling. I don't think we have any women with sub 18 handicaps at the club, and most of them cannot play to it, but CSS for their comps is so high that they don't go up as frequently as the men. We have more than enough dreadful male golfers too of course, but there is a core of good sub 10 hcap competitive golfers for which the ladies have no equivalent. It is this distinction between the better male golfers who enjoy the competitive environment, and the ladies who play with no apparent aim to improve which causes the "them and us" divide in the club.

I see that it will be difficult to have much more integration between the genders in a golfing sense until the ladies can catch up a bit ability wise.

I would do everything I could to encourage any female offspring to play golf. Though it would be difficult for her to be enthusiastic about being a member of the ladies section i describe above, so it repeats itself...
 
BoadieBroadus said:
I would do everything I could to encourage any female offspring to play golf. Though it would be difficult for her to be enthusiastic about being a member of the ladies section i describe above, so it repeats itself...
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I would suggest that she doesn't need to only play with girl two or three (more) times her age we regularly have women/ladies join in with our swindles which has both low and high handicappers young and old playing - and as there's always the mixed comps to accompany the ladies comps (until the day when all/most comps are mixed!)
 
bluewolf said:
I'm guessing that there are quite a few who would jump at the chance. There are plenty of men who can't reach the greens in regulation. That's why there's a handicapping system as a leveller. Why do we need 2 distinct levellers? It's a genuine question by the way.
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Indeed, and I'm one of them - I'd love to play my course off the whites, but definitely in the minority.

Think about it this way - look at the course set up for the US Open recently and some of those monster holes that the pros were playing to. How much fun would you have playing that length of course in all your comps? When you know that no matter how good you get you're unlikely to ever be able to reach the greens. It's meant to be fun!
 
Golf, by virtue of the handicapping system, is probably the only major sport in which men and women can compete together in a more or less equal fashion. You certainly cannot imagine the same in football, rugby, tennis, cricket etc. etc.. Of course we have to recognise the physical differences between men and women and we should be celebrating the fact that our sport can embrace the concept of men and women being able – and allowed – to compete on a level playing field created by the handicap system. I suspect that some of us men are uncomfortable at the prospect of losing to a woman. To them I say “stick to your cosy circle of friends who brag about their 300 yard drives” and draw comfort from that.

The fact that significant numbers of both sexes prefer to compete with others of the same sex should not preclude the possibilities for competitions for those who are happy to compete with members of the opposite sex.
 
rosecott said:
Golf, by virtue of the handicapping system, is probably the only major sport in which men and women can compete together in a more or less equal fashion. You certainly cannot imagine the same in football, rugby, tennis, cricket etc. etc.. Of course we have to recognise the physical differences between men and women and we should be celebrating the fact that our sport can embrace the concept of men and women being able – and allowed – to compete on a level playing field created by the handicap system. I suspect that some of us men are uncomfortable at the prospect of losing to a woman. To them I say “stick to your cosy circle of friends who brag about their 300 yard drives” and draw comfort from that.

The fact that significant numbers of both sexes prefer to compete with others of the same sex should not preclude the possibilities for competitions for those who are happy to compete with members of the opposite sex.
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hear hear!
 
most of our monthly stablefords (non board) are open to the whole club, Seniors/Men/Women & Juniors

It works pretty well off our respective handicaps without having to play off the same tees. I played in a society day and lost the longest drive to a lady, Her tee was 120 yards in front of mine and she beat me by about 10 yards ! That's just the way it is. :)
That said I also lost one to a bloke old enough to be my dad off the same tees :o

I have no problem watching womens golf, I watched it in preference to the Italian open this weekend when I had a chance. I do however have my favourites, and it's not necessarily linked to ability. I'm sooo shallow :thup:
 
There are around 40 or so ladies who take part in our competitions, we do have one very good 5 handicap player who is in her 20s, her mum, dad ands brother all play, she has played since she was 10 and was junior captain at the club. She in the only one under 30 I think, there are a few in their 30s 40s and 50s but the vast majority are retired.
Our longest hole is a 475 yd par 5 with a ditch at about 330. a lot cant get over it in 4 shots, so have little chance of even making a double bogey. This is the problem with taking the tees farther back.

The reason why there are not too many younger ladies in my opinion is that most women work these day and as ladies days tend to be midweek then they dont get the opportunity to play in many comps.
 
I don't mind women golfers, just as I don't mind women drivers! :whistle:

Don't think they should play off the back tees either as they'd be there forever!!! ;)
 
therod said:
I played in a society day and lost the longest drive to a lady, Her tee was 120 yards in front of mine and she beat me by about 10 yards ! That's just the way it is. :)
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Now THAT is not fair! I'd fancy my chances in a longest drive comp with most male pros if I had a 120 yard start!
 
louise_a said:
The reason why there are not too many younger ladies in my opinion is that most women work these day and as ladies days tend to be midweek then they dont get the opportunity to play in many comps.
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That's certainly a problem for your club. When I was looking for somewhere to join last year regular comps on the weekend was an absolute must have. I guess your committee doesn't want to encourage female membership!
 
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