Any relief when old hole is on your line on putting green?

[Skypilot]

I'm pretty sure you have to grin and bear it when an old filled hole is on your line...
But - What's the ruling when the previous hole hasn't been filled?

I've been playing two courses a lot recently and nearly every hole on both courses has an extra hole!

I've been lucky so far but my pp came unstuck this week. He was a couple of inches off the green so he played a soft chip and run over the hole but completely muffed it.
We assumed he'd have to take his punishment as he was technically just off the putting surface.
But what is the ruling when you are on the green?

 

[Farneyman]

I would imagine not as I've never noticed a pro getting this type of relief on the TV...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I'm thinking that this would so obviously be a problem that it is not a mistake or laziness on the part of the greenkeepers and that a temporary local rule would have been posted to cover the situation. And that you missed it.

 

[bladeplayer]

Id be looking at 2 things

immovable obstruction , only time your allowed relief on your line is on the putting green its rule 24/2a or something close

Other would be relief from a hole made by greenkeeper (possibly GUR) so relief from that also .. will look it up later n see of the answer is not supplied beforehand

 

[duncan mackie]

Id be looking at 2 things

immovable obstruction , only time your allowed relief on your line is on the putting green its rule 24/2a or something close

Other would be relief from a hole made by greenkeeper (possibly GUR) so relief from that also .. will look it up later n see of the answer is not supplied beforehand

Your second suggestion is the applicable one. Unfortunately it won't provide relief in itself from off the green.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Found this. May be relevant

16/7 Two Holes on Each Green of Nine-Hole Course

1...
2. If so, what is the status of hole B on each green when hole A is in use, and vice versa?

1...

2. The hole not in use on each green is a hole made by a greenkeeper – see Definition of “Ground Under Repair” – and Rule 25-1 is applicable.

 

[backwoodsman]

Found this. May be relevant

16/7 Two Holes on Each Green of Nine-Hole Course

1...
2. If so, what is the status of hole B on each green when hole A is in use, and vice versa?

1...

2. The hole not in use on each green is a hole made by a greenkeeper – see Definition of “Ground Under Repair” – and Rule 25-1 is applicable.

Don't need this decision. As Duncan says, an unfilled "ex-hole" is a hole made by a greenkeeper - therefore GUR, therefore abnormal ground condition, therefore rule 25 gives relief. But not if the ball is not on the green.

 

[louise_a]

I am pretty sure you are allowed to repair it the same as with a pitchmark.

 

[Colin L]

You are permitted to repair an old hole plug but in this case, according to the OP, there is an unfilled hole.

 

[rosecott]

Found this. May be relevant

16/7 Two Holes on Each Green of Nine-Hole Course

1...
2. If so, what is the status of hole B on each green when hole A is in use, and vice versa?

1...

2. The hole not in use on each green is a hole made by a greenkeeper – see Definition of “Ground Under Repair” – and Rule 25-1 is applicable.

That rule is meant for situations where there are two in-play holes with flags in and this occurs on some 9-hole courses where you may play, for example, to a red flag first time round and a yellow flag second time round.

 

[rosecott]

I'm pretty sure you have to grin and bear it when an old filled hole is on your line...
But - What's the ruling when the previous hole hasn't been filled?

I've been playing two courses a lot recently and nearly every hole on both courses has an extra hole!

I've been lucky so far but my pp came unstuck this week. He was a couple of inches off the green so he played a soft chip and run over the hole but completely muffed it.
We assumed he'd have to take his punishment as he was technically just off the putting surface.
But what is the ruling when you are on the green?

Perhaps you should name and shame these courses for appallingly bad greenkeeping practice.

 

[rulefan]

That rule is meant for situations where there are two in-play holes with flags in and this occurs on some 9-hole courses where you may play, for example, to a red flag first time round and a yellow flag second time round.

However, that doesn't change the fact that any unfilled hole made by a greenkeeper is by definition GUR.

 

[rosecott]

However, that doesn't change the fact that any unfilled hole made by a greenkeeper is by definition GUR.

Yes, I was merely pointing out to MashieNiblick that the decision he quoted was not relevant to the situation described by the OP.

 

[williamalex1]

Yes, I was merely pointing out to MashieNiblick that the decision he quoted was not relevant to the situation described by the OP.

Does GUR not have to be marked as such by green staff ?.

 

[rosecott]

Does GUR not have to be marked as such by green staff ?.

GUR is just one element of Abnormal Ground Conditions and does not necessarily have to be marked as such in some situations such as "material piled for removal" and "a hole made by a greenkeeper".

 

[williamalex1]

GUR is just one element of Abnormal Ground Conditions and does not necessarily have to be marked as such in some situations such as "material piled for removal" and "a hole made by a greenkeeper".

I was thinking more of an old hole that's been badly refilled by greenstaff.

 

[Colin L]

If you fill in a hole, it is no longer a hole, wouldn't you say? It is a former hole, an ex-hole and would not qualify as GUR unless marked.

If it were a previous hole for putting into, then you are entitled to repair the plug, but it's not GUR.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Don't need this decision. As Duncan says, an unfilled "ex-hole" is a hole made by a greenkeeper - therefore GUR, therefore abnormal ground condition, therefore rule 25 gives relief. But not if the ball is not on the green.

That rule is meant for situations where there are two in-play holes with flags in and this occurs on some 9-hole courses where you may play, for example, to a red flag first time round and a yellow flag second time round.

Just thought it helped confirm that a hole not in use (even one meant to be there) would indeed be deemed GUR as "a hole made by a greenkeeper".

 

[Fish]

Perhaps you should name and shame these courses for appallingly bad greenkeeping practice.

I can't see it myself, if it was 1 green and an oversight ok but all of them! The newly removed plug always goes into the old 1, so for there to be 2 on every green gives me the impression that 1 is for drainage, which I've seen and look no different to a normal cupped hole, less the flag of course. Has the OP asked anyone at those clubs about the "extra holes", and if not, why not?

 

[rulefan]

I'm pretty sure you have to grin and bear it when an old filled hole is on your line...
But - What's the ruling when the previous hole hasn't been filled?

I've been playing two courses a lot recently and nearly every hole on both courses has an extra hole!

Do these holes have liners?