All things scorecard

[bunkerblaster]

Having lost my golf rules guru to Covid19 in the spring I would be grateful for any assistance. I am having regard to the players edition rule 3.3 and the diagram setting out scorecard responsibilities. Only exceptionally do I have a scorecard prepared by the cttee prior to a round. You turn up you, date your scorecard, put name of comp, your name and handicap on. So why when I play in a scratch to 16 league does the scorer/recorder loom over when you are about to deposit your card in the slotted box and say amongst others " Have you correctly dated your card"? And why did an opponent in an inter club match remark he was recently DQd for not dating his scorecard?

 

[Colin L]

Because people don't always get things right.

 

[jim8flog]

If the committee do not prepare a card clearly you are going to have to put your name on it and probably the competition so it is known what the card is for.

The only other responsibility you have is ensure your handicap is on the card and you have signed it.

In these covid times the club should specify what has to be on the card with regards to the marker. E.G. where I play we only require the markers name.

 

[ExRabbit]

If the committee do not prepare a card clearly you are going to have to put your name on it and probably the competition so it is known what the card is for.

The only other responsibility you have is ensure your handicap is on the card and you have signed it.

In these covid times the club should specify what has to be on the card with regards to the marker. E.G. where I play we only require the markers name.

You are responsible to write down your gross scores for each hole too. Pretty obvious, but it hadn't been mentioned.

 

[jim8flog]

You are responsible to write down your gross scores for each hole too. Pretty obvious, but it hadn't been mentioned.

The OPs query was about a date on the scorecard before handing it in.

I felt it pretty obvious that the score needs to be on the card as he had read and mentioned the requirements of 3.3.

 

[nickjdavis]

Names are quite important as well...

I had a card returned the other day without a players name on it...they were obviously keen for their score to be recorded as they'd put a big arrow pointing to a 2 that they'd scored.

 

[bunkerblaster]

Thank you for your replies. Things are becoming clearer about what must be shown on a scorecard and there will also be grey areas. Regarding a missing name of a competition, if there was more than one comp. being run on that day, or a weekend the scorer would not know which comp the player participated in? If a comp. was run over two days and a date was missing, and a card processed on Monday how would the scorer know which day the round was? A different CSS per day could affect a score and a decision to disqualify? If the players name is not down in full but says "John S" you have more than one John S in your club, as a scorer how do you identify the player? Do you really have to read though a starter sheet to deduce who the player is?

I am going to run through my questions point by point so there will be more.

 

[rulefan]

There is a difference between what the Rules say must be completed by the player and penalties which may be applied and what the Committee want you to check/complete, where the Committee can only invoke a disciplinary process.

 

[rulie]

Thank you for your replies. Things are becoming clearer about what must be shown on a scorecard and there will also be grey areas. Regarding a missing name of a competition, if there was more than one comp. being run on that day, or a weekend the scorer would not know which comp the player participated in? If a comp. was run over two days and a date was missing, and a card processed on Monday how would the scorer know which day the round was? A different CSS per day could affect a score and a decision to disqualify? If the players name is not down in full but says "John S" you have more than one John S in your club, as a scorer how do you identify the player? Do you really have to read though a starter sheet to deduce who the player is?

I am going to run through my questions point by point so there will be more.

The Committee also has its responsibilities and is limited in their ability to assign those responsibilities to players. See below for an excerpt from Committee Procedures 5A,
Requesting Players to Provide Other Information on Scorecards
The Committee may request that players assist the Committee by completing scorecard related tasks that are the Committee’s responsibility. The Committee must not apply a penalty to a player under the Rules of Golf if he or she fails to comply with these requests or makes a mistake in doing so, but the Committee may provide a disciplinary sanction for a player who fails repeatedly to comply with such a request. For example, the Committee may ask players to:
Total the scores or, in a Four-Ball competition, determine the score that counts for the side.
Enter the points scored for each hole on the scorecard in Stableford.
Enter whether the hole was won, lost or tied in Par/Bogey.
Enter specific details on the scorecard such as name, date and name of the competition.
Similarly, the Committee may request that players assist the Committee by entering their scores into a computer system at the end of the round, but a player should not be penalized under the Rules of Golf if he or she fails to comply with this request or makes a mistake in doing so. But the Committee may provide a disciplinary sanction, for example in a Code of Conduct, for a player who fails repeatedly to comply with such a request.

 

[nickjdavis]

If the players name is not down in full but says "John S" you have more than one John S in your club, as a scorer how do you identify the player? Do you really have to read though a starter sheet to deduce who the player is?

.

We had three Steve Williams' at one stage. Got 2 David Evans', 2 Steve Hill's -can be a nightmare if they don't specify which one they are. I did for a laugh put all 3 Steve Williams' out together in a comp once.

 

[bunkerblaster]

Great replies thanks again. The Committee Procedures 5A reference especially helpful. There will be more.

 

[Swango1980]

We had three Steve Williams' at one stage. Got 2 David Evans', 2 Steve Hill's -can be a nightmare if they don't specify which one they are. I did for a laugh put all 3 Steve Williams' out together in a comp once.

I had one card submitted, for a player called "Dad"

 

[bunkerblaster]

Thanks for responses. I have gone onto other scorecard thread for other answers. Seems clear to me the player should be responsible for putting their name on the card, as per their listing, eg Bubba Watson or D.J. Trahan they should sign and date the card and indicate the tees used. References to Committee responsibility look archaic, they do not reflect reality.

 

[bunkerblaster]

New WHS club scorecards. Will the player only need to put the correct playing handicap for the day on his card? This is obtained by converting your Handicap Index to a playing handicap from the chart for the colour of tees being played. Is there any requirement (or has anyone seen new cards with provision for it) to put your Handicap Index and your playing handicap for the day on the card?

Edit. I think I have the answer: The player is responsible for putting his playing handicap for the day on the card, in the box marked "Handicap". The player does not have to put their Handicap Index on the card. The player is not responsible for, and should not, reduce his playing handicap by 5% to show 95%. The competition software adjusts the playing handicap to 95%.

 

[Colin L]

New WHS club scorecards. Will the player only need to put the correct playing handicap for the day on his card? This is obtained by converting your Handicap Index to a playing handicap from the chart for the colour of tees being played. Is there any requirement (or has anyone seen new cards with provision for it) to put your Handicap Index and your playing handicap for the day on the card?

Edit. I think I have the answer: The player is responsible for putting his playing handicap for the day on the card, in the box marked "Handicap". The player does not have to put their Handicap Index on the card. The player is not responsible for, and should not, reduce his playing handicap by 5% to show 95%. The competition software adjusts the playing handicap to 95%.

You're right but getting a wee bit mixed up with the terminology. You are required to put your Course Handicap on the scorecard which is before any handicap allowances are applied. What you get after allowances are applied is your Playing Handicap.

Handicap Index: your standardised take anywhere handicap which you use to find out how many strokes you get on a particular course.
Course Handicap: your tailor-made handicap - the number of of strokes you get on the course you are going to play.
Playing Handicap : the actual number of strokes you get after applying a handicap allowance for the format of game you are going to play

 

[rosecott]

New WHS club scorecards. Will the player only need to put the correct playing handicap for the day on his card? This is obtained by converting your Handicap Index to a playing handicap from the chart for the colour of tees being played. Is there any requirement (or has anyone seen new cards with provision for it) to put your Handicap Index and your playing handicap for the day on the card?

Edit. I think I have the answer: The player is responsible for putting his playing handicap for the day on the card, in the box marked "Handicap". The player does not have to put their Handicap Index on the card. The player is not responsible for, and should not, reduce his playing handicap by 5% to show 95%. The competition software adjusts the playing handicap to 95%.

Where you mention Playing Handicap, I think you really mean Course Handicap.

 

[jim8flog]

New WHS club scorecards. Will the player only need to put the correct playing handicap for the day on his card? This is obtained by converting your Handicap Index to a playing handicap from the chart for the colour of tees being played. Is there any requirement (or has anyone seen new cards with provision for it) to put your Handicap Index and your playing handicap for the day on the card?

Edit. I think I have the answer: The player is responsible for putting his playing handicap for the day on the card, in the box marked "Handicap". The player does not have to put their Handicap Index on the card. The player is not responsible for, and should not, reduce his playing handicap by 5% to show 95%. The competition software adjusts the playing handicap to 95%.

Ditto to Colin and Rosecott

Course handicap

Advice on the Rules of Handicapping

G2.1b/1 Handicap On The Scorecard
To avoid a DQ under Rule 3.3b (4) of the Rules of Golf the player must put his/her Course Handicap on the scorecard (see Interpretation 3.3b (4)/1 of the Rules of Golf).

 

[bunkerblaster]

Thanks, yes mixing up Playing Handicap for course handicap. You obtain your course handicap by converting your HI into a CH from the chart in the club (or using the converter). Regarding the playing handicap, you need your allowances immediately when playing match play, but you do not alter the CH by 5% for strokeplay because the club software does that after processing the result later in the day?

 

[ExRabbit]

Thanks, yes mixing up Playing Handicap for course handicap. You obtain your course handicap by converting your HI into a CH from the chart in the club (or using the converter). Regarding the playing handicap, you need your allowances immediately when playing match play, but you do not alter the CH by 5% for strokeplay because the club software does that after processing the result later in the day?

Yes, hopefully it will! It is meant to. But you also need to remember to play to your course handicap - if you don't you may lose shots to your handicap calculations. For instance, if your course handicap is 20, you will only get 19 shots for your playing handicap in a singles competition, but you should still play the stroke 2 hole as if you were a 20, as 3 over par will still get you a point for handicap purposes, but not for the competition if it was stableford etc. Just play to your course handicap and let the computer do the rest. Well, that's according to what I've read so far!

 

[rulie]

Yes, hopefully it will! It is meant to. But you also need to remember to play to your course handicap - if you don't you may lose shots to your handicap calculations. For instance, if your course handicap is 20, you will only get 19 shots for your playing handicap in a singles competition, but you should still play the stroke 2 hole as if you were a 20, as 3 over par will still get you a point for handicap purposes, but not for the competition if it was stableford etc. Just play to your course handicap and let the computer do the rest. Well, that's according to what I've read so far!

Just record your gross scores, let the "system" do the rest! The player is not responsible for reporting Stableford points.