# To much shaft lean



## golfdub (Jun 1, 2014)

I need help, with my sky pro device it says I'm getting between 12 and 17 degrees forward shaft lean when about two months ago I was getting 3 degrees so I'm sure this is the reason I'm hitting every heavy.

Iv attached a video which is 2 weeks old and iv tweeted a few little things since then but nothing with the shaft lean.

Any ideas why I'm doing this ?

http://youtu.be/T_xmbYRBkrc


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## the_coach (Jun 2, 2014)

â€‹Would, first check your sky pro is functioning okay. 

Have had a look at the swing vid. 
The closest you can get to impact on your vid because of missing frames is 0:02, you can see from this that there definitely is not 12-17Âº of forward lean. the shaft at impact much more in line with vertical so more to the 3Âº you speak about, if that.

You didn't say what effect, apart form occasional fats, your strikes are currently having on ball flight in terms of direction or trajectory?

But the good news is you don't have anywhere close to that figure (12-17Âº), if anything looking at that swing you'd need to increase the forward lean with the irons not decrease it anyways.

Forward lean wouldn't really be responsible for fats (forward leaning shaft in general would mean you wouldn't be hitting the ball fat at all) that's more likely looking at your motion to be down to leaving a little ways too much weight on your trail leg & your hip action, left hip not clearing sufficiently so right hip & side not coming through the shot fully.

On this swing in particular, & if it's a reflection of your more general address posture. Perhaps because of your sometimes heavy contact the ball position is a little ways back at least by half a ball maybes more. 
This is causing you (or it could be the other way around) for your hands at address to be a little ways too far in front of the ball at address, which in turn means (if you pause vid at the get go at 0:00 to get the still frame) your shoulders are a ways open. But it depends which came first the open shoulders which made the arms hands a ways too far in front of the ball, or the other ways around.
You with an iron wantâ€‹ to be in the area of when your shoulders are parallel square of your target line your hands are as a guide opposite the inside of your left thigh, but you wanâ€‹t to guard against then the ball being a ways back so this opposite inside left thigh hands positon because of ball position creates too much of a forward shaft lean at address. With any iron there should be a little forwards lean at address but not exaggerated one.

Best starting point after you get the sky pro checked out & maybes you need to re-calibrate it? because the 12-17Âº info is definitely wrong based on this swing & it's something in your swing motion thats very likely to change that much overtime at all.

So you need to get back to an address position with better alignments, particularly the shoulders, so your feet, knees, hips & shoulders are very definitely all parallel left of your ball target line.

Would have been useful to see a DTL as well to have a look what's really happening to swing path & swing direction through impact, as there's definitely something going on there looking at your finish position.

But get your upper body & arms + ball position in a little ways better shape at address so your shoulder are not open & your hands are just top of the front of the ball so there is a little ways forward lean angle, so that different shoulder & arms position will stop your spine tilt leaning a little ways towards target as it is in the vid but change so the tilt is just a little ways leaning the over way, away from target, this would be a good starting point. 
You've got good tempo & rhythm going on already through your swing motion. Just change your address alignments, spine tilt, which should then give you a better swing path away from & back to & through impact which should help your strikes, so shot direction & your end balance position also.

Don't worry over a ways too much forward leaning shaft as whatever sky pro is currently saying, it's really not happening in your swing motion at all.


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## the_coach (Jun 2, 2014)

Have a look at this. but I'm not saying that your swing is a lot like this guys or that your position at address is out quite so much as this. 

But so having said that, there is with your address position a slight bit of 'out of sync' between your upper body & lower body, a little ways along these lines just not quite so much with you. Just listen to what this guy giving the explanation says & it may help you a little ways with set up.

[video=youtube_share;iBtroIzLt-k]http://youtu.be/iBtroIzLt-k[/video]


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## bobmac (Jun 2, 2014)

The yellow line shows the edge of your head at address. Your head has moved back 4in or so during your backswing and stays there through the downswing.
Keep your head still during the backswing and you will stop the fats.


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## golfdub (Jun 2, 2014)

Thank you The coach and bob mac for your input and I will get working on this tonight


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## the_coach (Jun 2, 2014)

Just a note of caution.
Don't attempt to keep your head rigidly still (no lateral movement at all) as that would cause you a good deal of problems.


Currently your smallish lateral head movement is due to the slight address misalignments, of how your upper is, in relation to your lower body plus because your shoulders are a little ways open which in turn leads to the arms being a ways forward, plus the slightly too far back ball position. 


So if at address you draw a vertical line up from back of the ball you can see your head & part of your arm triangle is too far in front of the ball positions, partly because of body alignment coupled with ball position. 
In your swing motion you can subconsciously feel both head & shoulders are a little ways too far 'in front' so the slight lateral head move back to enable you to be behind the ball come impact as you sense you need to be, sometimes you'll get more 'stuck' back than other times & leave weight too much right hence the quality of the strikes won't be consistent & you get the 'heavies'.


Any shoulders open at address will have the head a ways slightly forwards just as any closed shoulder position has the head slightly back to the right.


If your lateral head movement was due to a lower body, or upper body sway to the right from the get go that would be something you need to address. But it's not that.


You head moves currently because of the current address alignments placing it at the get go a little ways too far to the left though not because you have a sway.
Get the address alignments sorted a ways better & you won't have to think about your head. Just then keep your eyes focussed back of ball & the head position through the swing will take care of itself.


Any good golf swing motion has a degree of lateral head movement to the right in the turn back to the top, then back a little ways laterally left in the downswing to impact if the left leg is posted your head still won't move forwards of impact. 


Simply this has to be because of the way the head is attached to the spinal column at the neck & the spine attached to the pelvic girdle at the base. So with the body pivot the head both turns slightly to the right & has some degree of lateral movement right too, it has too in order to accommodate the left shoulders final range of movement to the chin.


Although as I said previous the vid is not comparing your swing in any real way to the swing sent in to the instructor, neither is your address position so badly out as the instructors initial demonstration, he's just exaggerating so folks can see what exactly he talking about. 

The real reason I put it up is for you to look at the part when he's explaining how the upper body needs to 'sit' inline over the hip sockets with a slight spine tilt a little ways right away from target. 

The shorter the club so a narrower stance the nearer the right foot is to the ball position so the less is that spine tilt is, but it's still there. 

But as the clubs get longer so the stance widens some, so the right foot moves further back away from the ball position that spine tilt right naturally increasing some it has to as your right hand is lower on the club than the left, with then the greatest tilt being with the driver because it's the widest stance, right foot furthest away from the ball. (which with this club then helps to promote the +AoA you need with the driver.)


Don't worry over much about your lateral head movement. (though I agree there doesn't want to be ever any over-pronounced movement laterally)
 But if you sort out address alignments a little ways better, then just turn back to the top as you do now weight on inside of right foot some flex still in right knee, then start downswing from the ground up with weight left, left leg posted, you'll be fine.
 As you don't sway away to the right any to cause any great lateral head movement away from the ball. Just make sure you don't leave weight on the right side going to & through impact & you won't hit it heavy.


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## golfdub (Jun 3, 2014)

the_coach said:



			Just a note of caution.
Don't attempt to keep your head rigidly still (no lateral movement at all) as that would cause you a good deal of problems.


Currently your smallish lateral head movement is due to the slight address misalignments, of how your upper is, in relation to your lower body plus because your shoulders are a little ways open which in turn leads to the arms being a ways forward, plus the slightly too far back ball position. 


So if at address you draw a vertical line up from back of the ball you can see your head & part of your arm triangle is too far in front of the ball positions, partly because of body alignment coupled with ball position. 
In your swing motion you can subconsciously feel both head & shoulders are a little ways too far 'in front' so the slight lateral head move back to enable you to be behind the ball come impact as you sense you need to be, sometimes you'll get more 'stuck' back than other times & leave weight too much right hence the quality of the strikes won't be consistent & you get the 'heavies'.


Any shoulders open at address will have the head a ways slightly forwards just as any closed shoulder position has the head slightly back to the right.


If your lateral head movement was due to a lower body, or upper body sway to the right from the get go that would be something you need to address. But it's not that.


You head moves currently because of the current address alignments placing it at the get go a little ways too far to the left though not because you have a sway.
Get the address alignments sorted a ways better & you won't have to think about your head. Just then keep your eyes focussed back of ball & the head position through the swing will take care of itself.


Any good golf swing motion has a degree of lateral head movement to the right in the turn back to the top, then back a little ways laterally left in the downswing to impact if the left leg is posted your head still won't move forwards of impact. 


Simply this has to be because of the way the head is attached to the spinal column at the neck & the spine attached to the pelvic girdle at the base. So with the body pivot the head both turns slightly to the right & has some degree of lateral movement right too, it has too in order to accommodate the left shoulders final range of movement to the chin.


Although as I said previous the vid is not comparing your swing in any real way to the swing sent in to the instructor, neither is your address position so badly out as the instructors initial demonstration, he's just exaggerating so folks can see what exactly he talking about. 

The real reason I put it up is for you to look at the part when he's explaining how the upper body needs to 'sit' inline over the hip sockets with a slight spine tilt a little ways right away from target. 

The shorter the club so a narrower stance the nearer the right foot is to the ball position so the less is that spine tilt is, but it's still there. 

But as the clubs get longer so the stance widens some, so the right foot moves further back away from the ball position that spine tilt right naturally increasing some it has to as your right hand is lower on the club than the left, with then the greatest tilt being with the driver because it's the widest stance, right foot furthest away from the ball. (which with this club then helps to promote the +AoA you need with the driver.)


Don't worry over much about your lateral head movement. (though I agree there doesn't want to be ever any over-pronounced movement laterally)
 But if you sort out address alignments a little ways better, then just turn back to the top as you do now weight on inside of right foot some flex still in right knee, then start downswing from the ground up with weight left, left leg posted, you'll be fine.
 As you don't sway away to the right any to cause any great lateral head movement away from the ball. Just make sure you don't leave weight on the right side going to & through impact & you won't hit it heavy.
		
Click to expand...

you have opened up my eyes the_coach as I would of never notice my set up problem .As soon as I watched the video I cold see me in it and last night i practiced for an hour and already i can feel the difference. 

I will try and post up a behind swing and an updated front view.

Thanks again The_coach and bobmac


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