# Andy Murray



## Farneyman (Aug 15, 2016)

Take a bow son. Fantastic.:thup:


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## delc (Aug 15, 2016)

A fantastic final, with great tennis by both players. Well done Andy.


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## HowlingGale (Aug 15, 2016)

Yep have to agree. He is certainly the greatest sportsman Scotland has produced in my lifetime.

I know he was representing GB but we need a hero up here coz we're mince at everything else.


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## ArnoldArmChewer (Aug 15, 2016)

The Keegan Bradley of tennis.


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## Farneyman (Aug 15, 2016)

ArnoldArmChewer said:



			The Keegan Bradley of tennis.
		
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So much so I don't think he gets a mention for winning gold on the GB Olympics thread


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Aug 15, 2016)

Brilliant player and typical understanted/dour Scot with a dry sense of humour.  BTW - apparently hr has a typical Dunblane accent and delivery - that being quite differnet fr0m Stirling or Perth (nearest big towns).  Top man.


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## Albanach (Aug 15, 2016)

ArnoldArmChewer said:



			The Keegan Bradley of tennis.
		
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I don't get the comparison??


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## AmandaJR (Aug 15, 2016)

I think Andy is brilliant and have really warmed to him over the years. He hasn't been at his best but was so determined to win gold that he kept fighting - sometimes with himself and his game! He was obviously very very proud to win gold for his country.


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## Hosel Fade (Aug 15, 2016)

HowlingGale said:



			Yep have to agree. He is certainly the greatest sportsman Scotland has produced in my lifetime.
		
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Chris Hoy?


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## HowlingGale (Aug 15, 2016)

Hosel Fade said:



			Chris Hoy?
		
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Yeah, I suppose it depends on the definition of sportsman. I consider Hoy more of an athlete than a sportsman.

Also I think Tennis is more mainstream than track cycling. So it gets more exposure rather than being a niche if that makes sense.


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## tugglesf239 (Aug 15, 2016)

Hosel Fade said:



			Chris Hoy?
		
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this


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## Lazkir (Aug 15, 2016)

I have a lot of time for Andy, as an Englishman I think he gets a really bad press. It was a great win for him, but credit to Del Potro for making him earn it.


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## Tongo (Aug 15, 2016)

Lazkir said:



			I have a lot of time for Andy, as an Englishman I think he gets a really bad press. It was a great win for him, but credit to Del Potro for making him earn it.
		
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Agreed. Del Potro is a class player. Had he not suffered from so many injuries I think he would have been challenging the likes of Murray, Djokovic, Nadal and Federer for Grand Slam titles on a regular basis.


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## User62651 (Aug 15, 2016)

Murray has kicked on again since linking with Lendl, has a decent legacy now despite losing so many grand slam finals over the years - 3 slams, 2 Olympics and a Davis Cup in the bag. If Djokovic can't get back to where he was 3 months ago Murray could bag a couple more slams over the next year or two. Think he should retire at 31 and not flog a dead horse playing at a lower level than he once did like Federer does these days. He's never going to catch Nadal, Fed or Djokovic in slams now so 5 would be a good career haul I feel. You are of course a long time dead so its up to him if he wants a longer career. 

More concerning for LTA/GB is where is the next Andy Murray?


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## Tashyboy (Aug 15, 2016)

Watched the first two sets last night and it looked like they were playing in a sauna. The humidity must of been massive. Del Porto looked a beast with a forearm smash that was bionic. murrays serving early on was proper pants. The atmosphere early doors created by the Argie fans was akin to a football match. What was that song they were singing, it was immense. 
Gutted I did not stay up and watch the end, 100m and 400m.
Needed my beauty sleep.


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## ArnoldArmChewer (Aug 15, 2016)

Albanach said:



			I don't get the comparison??
		
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Very boring to watch !


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 15, 2016)

Watched the first two sets and thought once Del Potro tied it up he'd kick on with that support behind him. Massive performance from Murray to dig in and take the gold again


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## Slime (Aug 15, 2016)

I was exhausted just watching it.
I'm stuggling to think of a sport that produces fitter sportsmen ................ they're bionic!
Oh, and footballers struggle to play two matches a week, that's just three hours of competition, with teammates!


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## Hacker Khan (Aug 16, 2016)

I suspect in years to come we will raelise just how good Andy is.  Growing up in the 70s and 80s you just got resigned to the fact the brit would generally be relatively poor, and even when they did reach a semi final they would inevitable bottle it.  However with Andy he is a genuine world class tennis player who has got grand slams in an era playing against arguably some of the best tennis players ever.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 16, 2016)

I wouldn't have thought there would be much debate 

Andy Murray is clearly one of best sportsmen the nation has seen - whether that be Scotland or GB 

He will be classed as a legend of GB sport 

As a player he is brilliant and as a bloke he seems very nice and down to earth


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## User62651 (Aug 16, 2016)

Slime said:



			I was exhausted just watching it.
I'm stuggling to think of a sport that produces fitter sportsmen ................ they're bionic!
Oh, and footballers struggle to play two matches a week, that's just three hours of competition, with teammates!
		
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Daft comment - was clearly a slog in Rio but tennis players get a break every 2 games, take on liquids/food etc and lots of stopping/strolling between points. Of course they're supremely fit but the level of fitness in pro footballers is also extremely high, their body of work is done pre-season then they're topping up with 1 or 2 games a week and daily light training combined with strict diet. The sheer pace of top level football is also incredible for 90 minutes and chances of injury much higher than tennis.


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## Robster59 (Aug 16, 2016)

It was a tremendous match to watch.  Murray was superb throughout the match, Del Potro was immense in the second set but I did wonder if he would be able to continue it into the third and fourth and I think his previous long semi didn't help.  
Murray is now a different player to a few years ago.  Still superbly fit but with a little more steel in him these days and much less likely to crumble under pressure.  
A deserved champion who wears his heart on his sleeve.


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## Slime (Aug 16, 2016)

maxfli65 said:



			Daft comment - was clearly a slog in Rio but tennis players get a break every 2 games, take on liquids/food etc and lots of stopping/strolling between points. *Of course they're supremely fit but the level of fitness in pro footballers is also extremely high*, their body of work is done pre-season then they're topping up with 1 or 2 games a week and daily light training combined with strict diet. The sheer pace of top level football is also incredible for 90 minutes and chances of injury much higher than tennis.
		
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When it boils down to pure physical fitness, I'd say tennis players are in a different league to footballers.


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## Foxholer (Aug 16, 2016)

Slime said:



			When it boils down to pure physical fitness, I'd say tennis players are in a different league to footballers.
		
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Many footballers run twice as far in a game as most Tennis players in a match, though Tennis players are generally sprinting! Whether Tennis players could do that while getting their legs battered by tackles, fouls and the need to kick the ball is moot!

Wozniaki ran the New York marathon in 3:26 2 months after losing to Serena Williams in the US Open final (having run twice as far as her to get there!). I once watched some unforgettably fantastic athleticism in the 4th and 5th hour of an Aussie Open match between Yannick Noah and Roger Smith (Noah won 16-14 in the 5th!). 

So it's 'different fitness' - not 'better fitness'


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## Norrin Radd (Aug 16, 2016)

i remember watching a bleep test and tennis players came out well on top of fitness levels ,yes the footy boys are fit but not like the tennis boys .
 oh and the boxers came out second .


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## User62651 (Aug 16, 2016)

Slime said:



			When it boils down to pure physical fitness, I'd say tennis players are in a different league to footballers.
		
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Ok but measured sports analysis and research show your instincts betray you.


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## Lord Tyrion (Aug 16, 2016)

Foxholer is right, it is different types of fitness and all pro sportsmen are the fittest they can be for the type of sport you need. Some need explosive, short bursts, some need more endurance, others more muscular. They are fit appropriate for their sport.

I remember reading somewhere the absolute fittest sportsmen were Nordic skiers followed closely by road cyclists.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Nov 5, 2016)

With Djokovic beaten in the quarters of the BNP Paribas Masters in Paris and Andy Murray winning his quarter - Murray has only to win his semi and he is world #1.  C'mon Andy - do the business,


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## Doon frae Troon (Nov 5, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Foxholer is right, it is different types of fitness and all pro sportsmen are the fittest they can be for the type of sport you need. Some need explosive, short bursts, some need more endurance, others more muscular. They are fit appropriate for their sport.

I remember reading somewhere the absolute fittest sportsmen were Nordic skiers followed closely by road cyclists.
		
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Cue to bring back 'Superstars'.
I cannot understand why no one has.

I think rowers tended to be the fittest in those days.
Footballers did not do well with the exception of Kevin Keegan.
Sir Andy looks superbly fit. I hope he carries on to become the UK's first top ranked tennis player.
He was very cool in his interview, saying 'it was peaking early as he did not expect this to happen until early spring'.


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## sawtooth (Nov 5, 2016)

Love or hate him it will be a fantastic achievement to make No.1 and he should do it now with only Raonic standing in his way.


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## GeeJay (Nov 5, 2016)

I'd love to see Andy get No.1 status. Like all of the top players he works tremendously hard on his game and fitness and is a truly great tennis player. He would also seem to be a nice guy too.

Good luck today against Roanic.


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## Farneyman (Nov 5, 2016)

To make it to No 1 in the world would be the cherry on the cake for Andy. A fantastic achievement in itself to make it  to 2nd. 

Just one more match to go!


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## delc (Nov 5, 2016)

ArnoldArmChewer said:



			The Keegan Bradley of tennis.
		
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Does Andy use an anchored tennis racket then?!!!


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## HowlingGale (Nov 5, 2016)

We've been waiting his whole career for him to kick on and be regarded as a legend. Hope this is the start of something truly magnificent. Regardless of what he does from here he'll always be a legend in my eyes. 

He's silenced his doubters. Now he just needs to win more for himself. C'mon Andy.


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 5, 2016)

Congrats Andy Murray on an amazing achievement - one of GB greatest Sportsmen and one of the best tennis players that have been. Fully deserved number one spot


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## chrisd (Nov 5, 2016)

HowlingGale said:



			We've been waiting his whole career for him to kick on and be regarded as a legend. Hope this is the start of something truly magnificent. Regardless of what he does from here he'll always be a legend in my eyes. 

He's silenced his doubters. Now he just needs to win more for himself. C'mon Andy.
		
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How does a Grand Slam winner, Olympic champion ans a regular world top 5 ranked player have ANY doubters?


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## PhilTheFragger (Nov 5, 2016)

chrisd said:



			How does a Grand Slam winner, Olympic champion ans a regular world top 5 ranked player have ANY doubters?
		
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how about a multiple Grand slam winner and Double Olympic Champion (singles)

well done Andy, fine effort,


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## Slime (Nov 5, 2016)

Brilliant, absolutely brilliant!  :thup:


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## Norrin Radd (Nov 5, 2016)

Top performance from a top sportsman,well done Mr  Murray:thup:


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## HowlingGale (Nov 5, 2016)

chrisd said:



			How does a Grand Slam winner, Olympic champion ans a regular world top 5 ranked player have ANY doubters?
		
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I seriously do not know, but they're out there. Small minded, I guess.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 5, 2016)

Fantastic performance. The next challenge is to stay there for a significant period of time and add to his grand slams.


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## Hacker Khan (Nov 5, 2016)

Arguably one of the greatest sporting achievements of a Brit in the last few decades when you consider where British tennis was and the competition he has faced. Legend.


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## 351DRIVER (Nov 5, 2016)

Not much of a tennis fan, but mighty impressed, hard to imagine a few years ago when he was almost unable to complete a 5 setter that he would become world number 1.

Talent is nice but without the work ethic you will never succeed in pro sport, really impressed, all i can say.


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## Farneyman (Nov 5, 2016)

Great to see an Englishman finally world no. 1 in tennis


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## Papas1982 (Nov 5, 2016)

Cements his place as a legend in British tennis IMO. 

Will need a period of dominance on the world stage if he wishes to cement himself in the top echelons of the games players. As ATM, his still clearly only the 4th best in this generation.


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## User62651 (Nov 5, 2016)

Even if he's only there a few weeks, he's done it, not much left to prove, hope he can finally win the Australian Open after so many final defeats there, the French isn't really his surface.
One more for 4 slams and 2 Olympics would be a great legacy imo, if Djokovic has peaked and on the way down 2017 could be a great year for Andy as Fed/Nadal are done imo. Not sure he'll do a Federer and keep going much beyond 2017 and his 30th birthday, family time may soon become more attractive than life on tour.

Still find watching tennis a 'challenge' but superb from Andy nonetheless.


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## USER1999 (Nov 5, 2016)

Still unconvinced, probably because I just don't like him, and he is Scottish. 

Probably just me. 

I like Federer.


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## 351DRIVER (Nov 5, 2016)

murphthemog said:



			Still unconvinced, probably because I just don't like him, and he is Scottish. 

Probably just me. 

I like Federer.
		
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What part of Switzerland are you from?


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## Papas1982 (Nov 5, 2016)

351DRIVER said:



			What part of Switzerland are you from?
		
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Irrelevent imo. I support national teams, but when watching individual I cheer who I prefer to watch.


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## GG26 (Nov 5, 2016)

Great achievement and well deserved after the consistent high level he has performed to all year.


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## Siren (Nov 5, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			Cements his place as a legend in British tennis IMO. 

Will need a period of dominance on the world stage if he wishes to cement himself in the top echelons of the games players. As ATM, his still clearly only the 4th best in this generation.
		
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The past 5 years is acknowledged as the greatest era the sport has ever known, should Murray have been in any other era he would have achieved at least 6 Majors by now and been no1 for a sustained period.


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## Papas1982 (Nov 5, 2016)

Siren said:



			The past 5 years is acknowledged as the greatest era the sport has ever known, should Murray have been in any other era he would have achieved at least 6 Majors by now and been no1 for a sustained period.
		
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Sorry, but in a sport where the aim is to be top dog. He is clearly lacking compared to the others. He's still very good. But you can only have so many legends from an era. I also don't buy that this era has all the best players. Best battles maybe, but i think it does a disservice to credit Murray above many other legends just because he's been "unlucky" to have had to face better players.

He isn't in the top 30 for major wins and has been world no 1 for less than 24hours! So whilst he's very good. Bit too soon to get too excited.


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 6, 2016)

Why do Brits always do it !

Whenever one of our sports stars reach a level that is worth celebrating people then look at ways to slap them down again !! 

Murray has done something no other Brit has done and only a handful of players have achieved in many people's lifetimes 

Reaching World Number One is an achievement that we shoold congratulate Andy on 

Throughout his career the strength and depth of the men's game has been at its strongest in any other time in the game - there hasn't been just the one or two rivals but 4 or 5 with 3 of them prob 3 of the greatest players the game has seen - that has to be taken in context 

He has won 42 singles titles over ten year - his win percentage is 78% 

3 slams with another 9 finals 

Plus his two Olympic Golds 

Winning Queens 5 times 

He even during that period he had back surgery 

He is one of GB greatest sportsmen and will be remembered as one of the best tennis players that have been.


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## sawtooth (Nov 6, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Why do Brits always do it !

Whenever one of our sports stars reach a level that is worth celebrating people then look at ways to slap them down again !! 

Murray has done something no other Brit has done and only a handful of players have achieved in many people's lifetimes 

Reaching World Number One is an achievement that we shoold congratulate Andy on 

Throughout his career the strength and depth of the men's game has been at its strongest in any other time in the game - there hasn't been just the one or two rivals but 4 or 5 with 3 of them prob 3 of the greatest players the game has seen - that has to be taken in context 

He has won 42 singles titles over ten year - his win percentage is 78% 

3 slams with another 9 finals 

Plus his two Olympic Golds 

Winning Queens 5 times 

He even during that period he had back surgery 

He is one of GB greatest sportsmen and will be remembered as one of the best tennis players that have been.
		
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On a sporting level, yes brilliant although it will probably be the shortest lived No.1 position for a very long time.

On a personal level most English people that I know can't stand him and want him to lose.

#anyonebutengland


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## Papas1982 (Nov 6, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Why do Brits always do it !

Whenever one of our sports stars reach a level that is worth celebrating people then look at ways to slap them down again !! 

Murray has done something no other Brit has done and only a handful of players have achieved in many people's lifetimes 

Reaching World Number One is an achievement that we shoold congratulate Andy on 

Throughout his career the strength and depth of the men's game has been at its strongest in any other time in the game - there hasn't been just the one or two rivals but 4 or 5 with 3 of them prob 3 of the greatest players the game has seen - that has to be taken in context 

He has won 42 singles titles over ten year - his win percentage is 78% 

3 slams with another 9 finals 

Plus his two Olympic Golds 

Winning Queens 5 times 

He even during that period he had back surgery 

He is one of GB greatest sportsmen and will be remembered as one of the best tennis players that have been.
		
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Its not a case of belittling his efforts. He has had a very good career. But those stats don't look half as good when put against the other three you mention. 

He is Britain greatest tennis star. But has won 3 slams. 3! That is no way enough to put him above many other greats of the game. 

When you reel off Queens as some sort of big deal it shows how quickly his BIG wins drop off. 

For all the talk of him being unlucky to have faced such good opponents. If he had only had one rival, as many of the past stars did. He would IMO still have only maybe won 5 or 6 majors because Nadal, Federer or Novak are above him in class.

atm he doesn't have the status of those mentioned. That said, he has two or theee more years to go. If Novak does have a drop off and he reaches 5/6 majors then I think that lifts him into the top bracket of players.


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## HowlingGale (Nov 6, 2016)

sawtooth said:



			On a sporting level, yes brilliant although it will probably be the shortest lived No.1 position for a very long time.

On a personal level most English people that I know can't stand him and want him to lose.

#anyonebutengland
		
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#googlethetruestory


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 6, 2016)

sawtooth said:



			On a sporting level, yes brilliant although it will probably be the shortest lived No.1 position for a very long time.

On a personal level most English people that I know can't stand him and want him to lose.

#anyonebutengland
		
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I think maybe anyone who wants to look at the real story about the "anyone but England" - they shoold look it up

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/te...cord-straight-on-anti-England-reputation.html

It's typical of the media and it seems gullible people lapped it up

Him being Scottish may create a bit of friendly rivalry and we all have on this shores but anyone who goes beyond that has a problem and I would suggest that "English wanting him to lose" is very much a minority area - only have to go to Wimbledon when he is playing or see the reactions after 

Of course you will always get the odd one which I mainly put down to being jealous , just like the doomers ( the ones that look to slap someone down when they have achieved something great )!


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## sawtooth (Nov 6, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I think maybe anyone who wants to look at the real story about the "anyone but England" - they shoold look it up

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/te...cord-straight-on-anti-England-reputation.html

It's typical of the media and it seems gullible people lapped it up

Him being Scottish may create a bit of friendly rivalry and we all have on this shores but anyone who goes beyond that has a problem and I would suggest that "English wanting him to lose" is very much a minority area - only have to go to Wimbledon when he is playing or see the reactions after 

Of course you will always get the odd one which I mainly put down to being jealous , just like the doomers ( the ones that look to slap someone down when they have achieved something great )!
		
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Yes and friendly rivalry is merely wanting him to lose (like he did us) . I don't think anyone I know wants him dead or anything like that lol.


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## User62651 (Nov 6, 2016)

He's never been media friendly or a 'character' or particularly likeable but I'd have thought his Davis Cup exploits and Wimbledon wins would have won many of the English detractors over since the flippant England football comment which has been taken out of context (running joke with Henman I think), apparently not reading this thread. Wont think it'll bother Andy much. Of his competitors I like Nadal, dont mind Djokovic but have no liking at all of Federer, just a poser imo. None of them would have touched Sampras on Wimbledon grass anyway!
World class or not Andy is officially World No.1 and has earned it this year.


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## Papas1982 (Nov 6, 2016)

maxfli65 said:



			He's never been media friendly or a 'character' or particularly likeable but I'd have thought his Davis Cup exploits and Wimbledon wins would have won many of the English detractors over since the flippant England football comment which has been taken out of context (running joke with Henman I think), apparently not reading this thread. Wont think it'll bother Andy much. Of his competitors I like Nadal, dont mind Djokovic but have no liking at all of Federer, just a poser imo. None of them would have touched Sampras on Wimbledon grass anyway!
World class or not Andy is officially World No.1 and has earned it this year.
		
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I agree that federer when at the peak of his powers got a little carried away (suit on court etc). But he dominated towards the end of the Serve and volley era and continued during the transition. Imo he's the greatest of all time as he's the only one who could have played in any of the eras and still held his own. 

Murray has actually grown on me as a person, don't care about the England remark, just doesn't capture the audience as much as the others IMO. But since being on league of their own he seems to have a good laugh.


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## Norrin Radd (Nov 6, 2016)

wow all this praise for Murray ,great stuff and well deserved to become the number one in the world for his chosen sport .
 now i have a question .will all this adulation carry on for him when he isnt number one anymore?
 or will he get the same sort of hammer that Lee Westwood now gets for not being number one anymore .


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## wrighty1874 (Nov 6, 2016)

I'm English and am a great fan of Andy Murray. Brilliant for British tennis and magical for a Scottish lad to rule the world I. A sport where 40 years ago most tennis courts were empty up there.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 6, 2016)

Norrin Radd said:



			wow all this praise for Murray ,great stuff and well deserved to become the number one in the world for his chosen sport .
 now i have a question .will all this adulation carry on for him when he isnt number one anymore?
 or will he get the same sort of hammer that Lee Westwood now gets for not being number one anymore .
		
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Slight difference being Murray has delivered on the 'big stage' whereas, thus far, Lee sadly hasn't...


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## Siren (Nov 6, 2016)

Norrin Radd said:



			wow all this praise for Murray ,great stuff and well deserved to become the number one in the world for his chosen sport .
 now i have a question .will all this adulation carry on for him when he isnt number one anymore?
 or will he get the same sort of hammer that Lee Westwood now gets for not being number one anymore .
		
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How many majors has Westwood won again? Not the best example to use.


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## USER1999 (Nov 6, 2016)

It's not Murrays fault, but I don't like his style of play. I like Fed's, Ivanisovic, Stich, Sampras, McEnroe.  Murray bores me, as did Borg, Djocko, Nadal, Courier, to name a few. 

It's an entertainment business,  and I don't find Murray entertaining.


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## PhilTheFragger (Nov 6, 2016)

I like the way that when he is winning he is British, but when he has a bad streak , we are happy to give him back to the Scots


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## Norrin Radd (Nov 6, 2016)

Siren said:



			How many majors has Westwood won again? Not the best example to use.
		
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.
so getting to world number one dosent count?


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## Papas1982 (Nov 6, 2016)

Norrin Radd said:



			.
so getting to world number one dosent count?
		
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Whilst I don't think Murray is a legend of the game. 

His is career is far more impressive than Westwoods. 
getting to number one is one of a few things needed to show an impressive career. Unfortunately, majors is the other and Lee lacks massively on that front.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 6, 2016)

Norrin Radd said:



			.
so getting to world number one dosent count?
		
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Plenty of golfers have been world number one (Westwood, Donald etc) but I think that all would rather have a major. It's what the top in each sport are judged against. Murray has now delivered on both fronts


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## GeeJay (Nov 6, 2016)

Murray has properly upped his game this year and IMHO is one of the great tennis players. He does come across as truculent at times, but his service return is second to none and his fitness is right up there. I hope he finishes the year as No.1 by winning the last tournament.


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## Val (Nov 7, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			Its not a case of belittling his efforts. He has had a very good career. But those stats don't look half as good when put against the other three you mention. 

He is Britain greatest tennis star. But has won 3 slams. 3! That is no way enough to put him above many other greats of the game. 

When you reel off Queens as some sort of big deal it shows how quickly his BIG wins drop off. 

For all the talk of him being unlucky to have faced such good opponents. If he had only had one rival, as many of the past stars did. He would IMO still have only maybe won 5 or 6 majors because Nadal, Federer or Novak are above him in class.

atm he doesn't have the status of those mentioned. That said, he has two or theee more years to go. If Novak does have a drop off and he reaches 5/6 majors then I think that lifts him into the top bracket of players.
		
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He has the title Federer was desperate for and will never get, and he has it not just the once either.

Murray will be known as a tennis great even if he doesn't win another grand slam.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 7, 2016)

Val said:



			He has the title Federer was desperate for and will never get, and he has it not just the once either.
		
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I reckon Djoko wouldn't mind having same on his CV...


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## Papas1982 (Nov 7, 2016)

Val said:



			He has the title Federer was desperate for and will never get, and he has it not just the once either.

Murray will be known as a tennis great even if he doesn't win another grand slam.
		
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Im sure federer would love the olympics. But when Murray won his first, do you honestly believe he wouldn't have traded it for a a major?

rose has a a major and an Olympic medal. Should he be rated above woods now?

murray is a tennis great. Federer as well as a few others are legends. Murray still has time to join them. But ATM, he simply isn't n


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## the smiling assassin (Nov 8, 2016)

Scotland's greatest ever sportsman: Andy Murray 
Britain's greatest ever sportsman: Chris Hoy

....


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 8, 2016)

the smiling assassin said:



			Scotland's greatest ever sportsman: Andy Murray 
Britain's greatest ever sportsman: Chris Hoy

....
		
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That certainly would throw up a good debate 

For me

Scotlands best - Chris Hoy 
GB's beat - Steve Redgrave


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## freddielong (Nov 8, 2016)

World number one, has he played the system or is he the best in the world ?


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## User62651 (Nov 8, 2016)

freddielong said:



			World number one, has he played the system or is he the best in the world ?
		
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Nah hasn't played system, could argue he's 1 or 2 in world (no lower)  - think the pros play the same number of tour events roughly, Djoko certainly plays as much as Murray just he's lost form for either emotional or physical reasons, nowt to do with Andy, he's just got his head down and importantly improved that dodgy second serve a lot, back has recuperated fully and got Lendl back coaching, which is really key I think.
if Andy plays Djoko on current form Andy wins more than he loses imo. That would make him 1. Sorry to the Fed or Nadal fans, they're nowhere near no1 now.


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## Val (Nov 8, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



*Im sure federer would love the olympics. But when Murray won his first, do you honestly believe he wouldn't have traded it for a a major?*

rose has a a major and an Olympic medal. Should he be rated above woods now?

murray is a tennis great. Federer as well as a few others are legends. Murray still has time to join them. But ATM, he simply isn't n
		
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Of course he would have, my point being is that you cannot overlook how much of an achievement winning 2 olympic titles is. Probably more difficult to win than one grand slam title, just ask Rodger.


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## Slime (Nov 8, 2016)

the smiling assassin said:



			Scotland's greatest ever sportsman: Andy Murray 
*Britain's greatest ever sportsman: Chris Hoy*

....
		
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Sorry fella, you're just wrong.
Ever heard of the great Max Woosnam?

Scratch golfer,
A 147 in snooker,
A century against the MCC at Lords.
International footballer for England,
Played for Chelsea & Man City,
Davis Cup captain,
Olympic Gold and Silver medalist (Tennis),
Wimbledon Champion,
Once beat Charlie Chaplin at table tennis whilst using a butter knife as a bat!

......................................... any good?


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## Papas1982 (Nov 8, 2016)

Val said:



			Of course he would have, my point being is that you cannot overlook how much of an achievement winning 2 olympic titles is. Probably more difficult to win than one grand slam title, just ask Rodger.
		
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They aren't any more difficult at all. They simply occur less often and therefor you need to have peaked at the right time. its more of a lottery than a proof of greater success. 
Federer didn't manage that. The competitors aren't better than major entrants though.

rose won this year, would anyone argue his triumph was better than Stensons at the Open? He simply managed to have a good week. He's nowhere near the top 5 in the world this heat because of it though. 

Its a credit to him for winning both. And is part of a legacy for him. But, the Olympic wins are IMO irrelevant when naming him as a great player. I remember Murray being introduced as an Olympic champion prior to wining a major and it was laughable. Nadal never had his tagged on the end of his intro. 

In 40 years time, if Murray ends with 3 majors and 2 olympics, there's no way he'I'll be discussed on the world stage in the same like as Djokovic, Nadal or Federer. All three of them whilst also participating in the so called greatest era of tennis have had periods of dominance. 

fwiw, I would honestly love Murray to have a good 2/3 years at the top and get 4/5 more majors which would raise him significantly in my estimations. But I don't see it happening.


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 20, 2016)

That's a brilliant win for Murray and what a fantastic end to his season 

Brilliant for him - ends the year World Number One


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## HowlingGale (Nov 20, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			That's a brilliant win for Murray and what a fantastic end to his season 

Brilliant for him - ends the year World Number One
		
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The man is a machine. Where he pulled that out from I have no idea. 

Superb role model for young kids.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 20, 2016)

The boy done good...

SPOTY is now a certainty :thup:...


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## Tashyboy (Nov 20, 2016)

MegaSteve said:



			The boy done good...

SPOTY is now a certainty :thup:...
		
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Unless Hamilton does summat special on Sunday then it could be close.


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 20, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			Unless Hamilton does summat special on Sunday then it could be close.
		
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Hamilton won't ever win SPOTY 

1. He has been WC a number of times and still not won SPOTY

2. F1 no longer on BBC so less people watching it 

3. He isn't popular


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 20, 2016)

Great win for Murray tonight and sealed world #1 spot


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## FairwayDodger (Nov 20, 2016)

Awesome performance by Murray again. Don't think many people were giving him much chance for this match but fantastic to see him pull off the win.

Scotland's greatest ever sportsman for sure, maybe Britain's greatest!


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## pokerjoke (Nov 20, 2016)

FairwayDodger said:



			Awesome performance by Murray again. Don't think many people were giving him much chance for this match but fantastic to see him pull off the win.

Scotland's greatest ever sportsman for sure, maybe Britain's greatest!
		
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I'm surprised Karen I had Murray as favourite even though he has had more time on court this week.

Watching the game to me it really looked like Djorkovic had lost some size and Murray overpowered him quite easily.

Yes,well done Andy


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## FairwayDodger (Nov 20, 2016)

pokerjoke said:



			I'm surprised Karen I had Murray as favourite even though he has had more time on court this week.

Watching the game to me it really looked like Djorkovic had lost some size and Murray overpowered him quite easily.

Yes,well done Andy
		
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It was just how much time Murray spent on court as opposed to Novak whom seemed to sail through. Think a third set would have been very difficult for Andy.

Going forward though, I think Andy has improved and will take so much confidence from the last few months. Would love to see him add to his slams count..


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## richy (Nov 20, 2016)

FairwayDodger said:



			Awesome performance by Murray again. Don't think many people were giving him much chance for this match but fantastic to see him pull off the win.

Scotland's greatest ever sportsman for sure, maybe Britain's greatest!
		
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Let's not get carried away


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 20, 2016)

richy said:



			Let's not get carried away
		
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He is certainly worthy of bejng part of that discussion - and would expect a number would have him as the greatest.


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## Farneyman (Nov 20, 2016)

Farneyman said:



			Take a bow son. Fantastic.:thup:
		
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Take another bow son. Fantastic :thup:


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## Slime (Nov 20, 2016)

FairwayDodger said:



			Awesome performance by Murray again. Don't think many people were giving him much chance for this match but fantastic to see him pull off the win.

*Scotland's greatest ever sportsman for sure, maybe Britain's greatest!*

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Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me he'd be a very distant second.


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## Tashyboy (Nov 20, 2016)

Andy Murray singles no1
Jamie Murray Doubles No1.

not a bad effort at all.


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## ger147 (Nov 20, 2016)

Murray was the pre-tournament favourite and remained the favourite all week. No surprise to see him get over the line against Djokovic who seems to have lost something in the last 6 months.


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## FairwayDodger (Nov 20, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			He is certainly worthy of bejng part of that discussion - and would expect a number would have him as the greatest.
		
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I think that's exactly it. There's no right or wrong answer in this debate but Murray would have to one of the names in the frame.


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## HowlingGale (Nov 21, 2016)

ger147 said:



			Murray was the pre-tournament favourite and remained the favourite all week. No surprise to see him get over the line against Djokovic who seems to have lost something in the last 6 months.
		
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Murray was the pre-tourney favourite but after the semis the bookies gave him no chance. Djoko was 1/2 favourite at that point.

Was looking to put an 'insurance policy' on Djoko winning but wasn't worth it at that point.


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## Hacker Khan (Nov 21, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			Unless Hamilton does summat special on Sunday then it could be close.
		
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In Olympic year I'd be surprised if Hamilton gets in the top 5.  Currently he's coming 2nd in a 2 horse race, hardly the stuff of legends.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 21, 2016)

Hard to see past Murray for SPOTY even in olympic year, especially given his gold medal (and no-one has ever retained an olympic tennis title in olympic history). Add in world #1 and his success this weekend and it's hard to argue against him


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## MegaSteve (Nov 21, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Hard to see past Murray for SPOTY even in olympic year, especially given his gold medal (and no-one has ever retained an olympic tennis title in olympic history). Add in world #1 and his success this weekend and it's hard to argue against him
		
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And, #1 reason it'll still be fresh in most folks minds...


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## Hacker Khan (Nov 21, 2016)

I think he's roughly the same odds as we were to stay in Europe on the day of the vote.  About 9 to 2 on.


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## Foxholer (Nov 21, 2016)

Fantastic result and well deserved! 

From the talented but skinny little runt whose legs couldn't last of a few years ago, he's now become the player everyone fears in a final set! Djokovic's form seems to have slipped slightly and Murray was there to grab the #1!

Surely favourite for SPOTY!


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## User62651 (Nov 21, 2016)

Slime said:



			Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me he'd be a very distant second.
		
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Dont leave us hanging then, who's no.1 in your view?

Never thought too hard about that question myself, not too sure but seeing who quickly comes to mind, apart from Murray being a contender in tennis, for my time late 70's - present:

footballer.....nah 
jockey...nah
Olympians - Hoy, Wiggins, Redgrave, Coe, Farah, Thomson - all possibles as have won gold at more than one games
winter sports...nah
motor sports - Moss, Hamilton, Hunt, Sheene, Fogerty all possibles
Boxing.....nah
cricket....Botham (but England only so can't include for UK)
rugby both codes....nah
golf - Faldo
other sports....nah

Someone help me, must be a good few contenders I'm missing.


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## Liverpoolphil (Nov 21, 2016)

Greatest British Sportsman/Woman

My nominations would be

Hoy 
Redgrave
Pinsent
Thompson
McCoy
Farah
Wiggins
Murray


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## richy (Nov 21, 2016)

People will obviously lean toward a man/woman in a sport they like. 

You're not going to pick a boxer if you don't like boxing. I'd never pick a jockey or cricketer as I don't like either sports.


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## User62651 (Nov 21, 2016)

richy said:



			People will obviously lean toward a man/woman in a sport they like. 

You're not going to pick a boxer if you don't like boxing. I'd never pick a jockey or cricketer as I don't like either sports.
		
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I wouldn't agree with that, I like football more than any other sport but have not included any footballers as George Best apart I dont think UK has had any truly world class players.
I dont care for motor sport either but I put Hamilton in there as a 3x world champ.
Dont follow boxing but would put Muhammed Ali as worlds greatest sportsperson ever.


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## richy (Nov 21, 2016)

maxfli65 said:



			I wouldn't agree with that, I like football more than any other sport but have not included any footballers as George Best apart I dont think UK has had any truly world class players.
I dont care for motor sport either but I put Hamilton in there as a 3x world champ.
Dont follow boxing but would put Muhammed Ali as worlds greatest sportsperson ever.
		
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I'd say Bale is world class but wouldn't have him in the list. 

Hamilton? Hard to choose him when his car is far superior to others. 

Ali is most people's greatest but a lot of that is down to the personality he was and what he did outside the ring. Would you pick him on boxing resume alone?


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## User62651 (Nov 21, 2016)

richy said:



			Ali is most people's greatest but a lot of that is down to the personality he was and what he did outside the ring. Would you pick him on boxing resume alone?
		
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think so yes as a boxer was a master tactician and brave, rope a dope was incredibly courageous tactic v Foreman. Sugar Ray Leonard is up there too but Ali edges it. Tyson was my favourite (when I used to watch boxing) as he was so exciting to watch but he was a brawler more than a boxer.


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## Kellfire (Nov 21, 2016)

HowlingGale said:



			the bookies gave him no chance. Djoko was 1/2 favourite at that point.
		
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So by "no chance" the bookies gave him a one in three chance...?


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## HowlingGale (Nov 21, 2016)

Kellfire said:



			So by "no chance" the bookies gave him a one in three chance...?
		
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Don't look at betting in that way but if you're saying he had a one in three chance it must have been.

At those odds if they played 100 times Djoko would win twice as many as Murray. That's pretty much no chance in my view.


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## Foxholer (Nov 21, 2016)

HowlingGale said:



			Murray was the pre-tourney favourite but after the semis the bookies gave him no chance. *Djoko was 1/2 favourite at that point*.

Was looking to put an 'insurance policy' on Djoko winning but wasn't worth it at that point.
		
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Those odds were probably more to do with Djokovic's destruction of Nishikora - compared with Murray's extremely tight match with Raonic - than anything else!

Remember that it's not 'the bookies' that are giving him no chance - it's the punters! The Bookies are only reacting to punters and keeping a balanced book!


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## 2blue (Nov 21, 2016)

Slime said:



			Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me *he'd be a very distant second.[/*QUOTE]
To who??
Is there a greater athlete??
It can't be Chris Hoy as much of his acheivements, admirable as they are, are simply a 'quick dash' using machinery & training methods that unavailable/undeveloped by other nations, as you can see from the way many other cyclists have benifited.
Murray's achievments are in a different class altogether.....  no one else in Britain is close to him in tennis wereas there are loads of cyclists knocking on the door due to the advanced development team behind them.
		
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## drewster (Nov 21, 2016)

2blue said:





Slime said:



			Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me *he'd be a very distant second.[/*QUOTE]
To who??
Is there a greater athlete??
It can't be Chris Hoy as much of his acheivements, admirable as they are, are simply a 'quick dash' using machinery & training methods that unavailable/undeveloped by other nations, as you can see from the way many other cyclists have benifited.
Murray's achievments are in a different class altogether.....  no one else in Britain is close to him in tennis wereas there are loads of cyclists knocking on the door due to the advanced development team behind them.
		
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Can't help but agree Dave. In my lifetime Daley Thompson, Ben Ainslie maybe and Steve Redgrave are in the conversation but i can't see past Andy Murray as the greatest British sportsperson.
		
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## Kellfire (Nov 21, 2016)

HowlingGale said:



			At those odds if they played 100 times Djoko would win twice as many as Murray. That's pretty much no chance in my view.
		
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Yes, so that's a one in three chance...

For easier maths think of it as 99 games to keep the maths easier, Murray would win 33 and Djokovic would win 66.


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## Papas1982 (Nov 21, 2016)

2blue said:





Slime said:



			Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me *he'd be a very distant second.[/*QUOTE]
To who??
Is there a greater athlete??
It can't be Chris Hoy as much of his acheivements, admirable as they are, are simply a 'quick dash' using machinery & training methods that unavailable/undeveloped by other nations, as you can see from the way many other cyclists have benifited.
Murray's achievments are in a different class altogether.....  no one else in Britain is close to him in tennis wereas there are loads of cyclists knocking on the door due to the advanced development team behind them.
		
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Didn't Murray move to Spain to get further training as a youngster? Something not up and coming players can do? 

Maybe if he'd stayed in Britain he wouldn't be where he is now?

so who has the greater advantage? Him or the cyclists?

i find golf a good comparison to tennis, what with the limited Olympic coverage and four majors. 

Id say that Mcilroy and Faldo are just as impressive as both have more majors and longer spells as best in the world in the sport.
		
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## Slime (Nov 21, 2016)

Slime said:



			Scotland's greatest? I would think so, quite comfortably.
Britain's greatest? For me *he'd be a very distant second.*

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maxfli65 said:



			Dont leave us hanging then, who's no.1 in your view?

Never thought too hard about that question myself, not too sure but  seeing who quickly comes to mind, apart from Murray being a contender in  tennis, for my time late 70's - present:

footballer.....nah 
jockey...nah
Olympians - Hoy, Wiggins, Redgrave, Coe, Farah, Thomson - all possibles as have won gold at more than one games
winter sports...nah
motor sports - Moss, Hamilton, Hunt, Sheene, Fogerty all possibles
Boxing.....nah
cricket....Botham (but England only so can't include for UK)
rugby both codes....nah
golf - Faldo
other sports....nah

Someone help me, must be a good few contenders I'm missing.
		
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2blue said:



			Is there a greater athlete??
It can't be Chris Hoy as much of his acheivements, admirable as they are, are simply a 'quick dash' using machinery & training methods that unavailable/undeveloped by other nations, as you can see from the way many other cyclists have benifited.
Murray's achievments are in a different class altogether.....  no one else in Britain is close to him in tennis wereas there are loads of cyclists knocking on the door due to the advanced development team behind them.
		
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Ever heard of the great Max Woosnam?

Scratch golfer,
A 147 in snooker,
A century against the MCC at Lords.
International footballer for England,
Played for Chelsea & Man City,
Davis Cup captain,
Olympic Gold and Silver medalist (Tennis),
Wimbledon Champion,
Once beat Charlie Chaplin at table tennis whilst using a butter knife as a bat!

......................................... any good?


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## 2blue (Nov 21, 2016)

drewster said:





2blue said:



			Can't help but agree Dave. In my lifetime Daley Thompson, Ben Ainslie maybe and Steve Redgrave are in the conversation but i can't see past Andy Murray as the greatest British sportsperson.
		
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Yes in deed, Ben Ainslie has never had the recognition other than, like Ellen MacArthur (a legend in France), gets a pat on the head from Queenie....  I think BA will take the Americas Cup for GB (already done it for the USA) but will still get little recognition for it.
However with Andy its not just 'Sportsperson'..... its 'athlete'.......  high skill levels & decision making in very gruelling & high pressure situations playing in a style that ensures a measure of longevity.....  unlike the 'ugly' & injurious tennis style of of Nadal who is now 'spent'.... thro playing Table-tennis on a tennis court...  athletic but knacked!!
		
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## Fish (Jan 22, 2017)

I note that Scottish tennis player has been knocked out &#128540; I preferred the British version of him that won Wimbledon &#128521;


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## HomerJSimpson (Jan 22, 2017)

Fish said:



			I note that Scottish tennis player has been knocked out &#128540; I preferred the British version of him that won Wimbledon &#128521;
		
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Bit of a shock given that Djokovic had already gone out. Not sure he'll get a better chance


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## Lord Tyrion (Jan 22, 2017)

I bet he is steaming. May never get a better chance. I wonder if Djokovic going just relaxed him a little and he got caught out. He has been in such good form as well.


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## USER1999 (Jan 22, 2017)

Come on Feds.


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## 2blue (Jan 22, 2017)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I bet he is steaming. May never get a better chance. I wonder if Djokovic going just relaxed him a little and he got caught out. He has been in such good form as well.
		
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I think we may well see many more players trying the 'serve & volley' approach against Murray. It cuts out the base-line rallys & thus removes a great Murray strength


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## Slime (Jan 22, 2017)

I think Novak may be quiet for a little while longer .................. who's been a naughty little boy ?


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## sawtooth (Jan 23, 2017)

2blue said:



			I think we may well see many more players trying the 'serve & volley' approach against Murray. It cuts out the base-line rallys & thus removes a great Murray strength
		
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I hope you're right, I support anybody but Murray. 

(I was joking)


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## Lord Tyrion (Jan 23, 2017)

Slime said:



			I think Novak may be quiet for a little while longer .................. who's been a naughty little boy ?
		
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??? Has he done a Tiger? Haven't heard anything


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## Slime (Jan 23, 2017)

I've heard it, (from one of my sources ), that he's played away with Eugenie Bouchard ...................... allegedly.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jan 23, 2017)

Just googled her, not unattractive (big understatement). Let's hope that is not the case and that something else is the cause in his drop of form. (I'm just a softie)


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## wrighty1874 (Jan 23, 2017)

Rumour has it he was taking the same substance as Sharapova.


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