# Gap wedges



## pingman93 (May 14, 2012)

Hi guys 
I was just wondering why people have up to 3 gap wedges in the bag I don't want to sound stupid I just was wondering. And with all the different degrees how do you know which one to use


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## fundy (May 14, 2012)

dont think i know of anyone who carries 3 gap wedges. You may get people who carry a pitching wedge (45 degree) a gap wedge (50 degree) a sand wedge (55 degree) and a lob wedge (60 degree) - so in effect 4 wedges but they will have a standard distance gap between them and use them for different situations

(lofts are approx, some will differ by a degree or 2)


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## Wolfman (May 14, 2012)

Yes i think you are confused

A gap wedge or sometimes GW or AW is the wedge between the PW pitching wedge and SW sand wedge


It is in the bag to fill the loft gap of the other clubs so distance control is easier


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## duncan mackie (May 14, 2012)

as fundy explains generally people carry wedges with different lofts in the same way as you carry different irons.

if a PW is a 10 iron (and on one set I have it is) then GW would be an 11, SW a 12 and LW a 13 - which might explain why  some don't like the latter much!

many carrying all of these will also have differences in the sole design/bounce angle so that some clubs are better suited to shots from different lies/surfaces


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## fundy (May 14, 2012)

duncan mackie said:



			as fundy explains generally people carry wedges with different lofts in the same way as you carry different irons.

if a PW is a 10 iron (and on one set I have it is) then GW would be an 11, SW a 12 and *LW a 13 - which might explain why  some don't like the latter much!*

many carrying all of these will also have differences in the sole design/bounce angle so that some clubs are better suited to shots from different lies/surfaces
		
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Brilliant


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## abeabel (May 14, 2012)

Hi all im new on here and was just wondering how i start a discussion thread?


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## pingman93 (May 14, 2012)

Cheers guys so like I hit my pw aprix 120 yards so with a 52 degree would it be roughly like 60 then a 54 like 40 yards or am I on the wrong lines still. It's just I'm wondering wether to add them to my bag


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## fundy (May 14, 2012)

my carry yardages for full swings are approx PW (46degree)  130 yds, GW (50 degree) 120 yds, SW (54 degree) 110 yds, LW (58 degree) 100 yds, not that I hit them flat out all the time (honest!)


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## Kellfire (May 14, 2012)

I carry a PW (42 degrees), 47 Mizuno, 51 Mizuno, SW (55 degrees) and 60 Mizuno.

They all have different uses in different lies and I hit all but the 60* to a consistent distance with good spread... and I don't hit the 60 full.


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## duncan mackie (May 14, 2012)

fundy said:



			my carry yardages for full swings are approx PW (46degree)  130 yds, GW (50 degree) 120 yds, SW (54 degree) 110 yds, LW (58 degree) 100 yds, not that I hit them flat out all the time (honest!)
		
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mine are pw - 118yds, 52 - 90yds, 56 - 75yds and 60 - 65yds

you will have to establish what works for you


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## RGDave (May 14, 2012)

pingman93 said:



			Cheers guys so like I hit my pw aprix 120 yards so with a 52 degree would it be roughly like 60 then a 54 like 40 yards or am I on the wrong lines still. It's just I'm wondering wether to add them to my bag
		
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You're on the wrong lines. If your PW goes 120, then a 52 will go about 100, depending on the loft (of the PW)


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## DaveM (May 14, 2012)

I only use a PW & SW. Open the face shorten the swing etc to get different distances. They didn't have all these fancy things when I started lol.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 15, 2012)

Most people i think Carry 4 wedges now
Pw Gap Sw Lob

I think its just the degress of them and the bounce is the important thing

Important question is, Do you need a Gap Wedge?
for me yes, wedges are the scoring part of your game


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## bobmac (May 15, 2012)

Most people i think Carry 4 wedges now
Pw Gap Sw Lob
		
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I beg to differ


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## Imurg (May 15, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



*Most* people i think Carry 4 wedges now
Pw Gap Sw Lob
		
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Let's call it "Many" or "some".....

I've got 3 wedges. One's called a PW but it's really a 9 iron


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## spawn_ukuk (May 15, 2012)

Quite a few carry 4, as you should wedges are important you need the options in the scoring part of the hole


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## garyinderry (May 15, 2012)

im quite handy with all my wedges. i dont hit them very far but i know to a certian extent ho far them will go. i hit them quite hard say 90% and can drop 5 balls and they will not be very far away from each other when they land. they are an essentail part of my game due to being a short enough hitter off the tee.


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## bobmac (May 15, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			Quite a few carry 4, as you should wedges are important you need the options in the scoring part of the hole
		
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I've only got 2 wedges and I have more than enough options thank you.
I've lost count of the times I've seen someone carrying 4 wedges and cant hit any of them.
3, I understand as the modern PW is more like an old 9 so GW and SW is plenty.


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## garyinderry (May 15, 2012)

once you have faith in your ability to strike down on a wedge i find it easier to commit to the shot if im hitting it harder. therefor having a 58 wedge and hitting it hard is easier than hitting a half or 3/4 SW. this is not something you can just start doing. i have put alot of work into my short game. hours around greens on my own.

when the wind is up then this gameplan has to go on the back burner. keeping them lower is then the name of the game.


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## sydney greenstreet (May 15, 2012)

abeabel said:



			Hi all im new on here and was just wondering how i start a discussion thread?
		
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Welcome aboard, go to the start of the forum and pick which section you want ie The Lounge for all things golf related or out of bounds for other topics, once selected yu will see at the top in blue  +Post New Thread, click on it then put in your topic headline then anything you want to add in the bar below it.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 15, 2012)

bobmac said:



			I've only got 2 wedges and I have more than enough options thank you.
I've lost count of the times I've seen someone carrying 4 wedges and cant hit any of them.
3, I understand as the modern PW is more like an old 9 so GW and SW is plenty.
		
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Just because they cant hit them doesnt mean they have done wrong by having 4
they just gotta get better with there wedges and they will have a better game


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## DaveM (May 15, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			Just because they cant hit them doesnt mean they have done wrong by having 4
they just gotta get better with there wedges and they will have a better game
		
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If they have only 2 less to learn. Learn to feel the club then you will know what to do. If they have 4 and always play a full shot. When are they going to learn what to do on the inbetween distances. Always find questions on here about that. Start with 2 learn how to use them for all lenght shots. Then by all means add another if you really need it. But 4 not needed.


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## garyinderry (May 15, 2012)

i dont understand people learning the d.plez method. surely every short game shot must have a certain amount of feel involved. 1/4, 1/2,3/4, full bull is just that. see it, choose wedge for the desired height/ distance and feel it! 


trying to play quarter shots on demand is alot harder than commiting with 4 wedges.


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## fundy (May 15, 2012)

bobmac said:



			I've only got 2 wedges and I have more than enough options thank you.
I've lost count of the times I've seen someone carrying 4 wedges and cant hit any of them.
3, I understand as the modern PW is more like an old 9 so GW and SW is plenty.
		
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Bob, I know you feel quite strongly about the too many wedges argument, however, if I have 3-4 degree gaps in my irons why should I then go up to 5, 6 or even 7 degree gaps in my wedges (which is what would happen if I carried fewer wedges). Surely Im better off having the gaps closer in the 80-130 yard range as that is where I am after the tee shot on most par 4s

If you only advocate 2 wedges, do you believe people should only carry 4 other irons too?


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## bobmac (May 15, 2012)

As I said, I dont mind 3 wedges.
If you add a 4th however, you have to lose a long iron/5 wood/hybrid to make the 14 clubs.
Now, if your 3 iron/hybrid wont reach, you then have to choke down /swing easy/ cut in a 3 wood which is no picnic for even the best golfers.
On the other hand, if you only have 3 wedges, it's a lot easier to manufacture a shot using one of them (given some practice).
So, I find it much easier to vary my distances with the wedges than I would trying to knock off 20-30 yards off my 3 wood.
Just the way i play I guess.
I have no problem with people who want to beef up the short end of the bag, only dont buy another wedge to hide your lack of ability to play the chips/pitches / bunker shots.
Basically, what would you rather hit, a 3/4 GW or a 3/4  3 wood.


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## DaveM (May 15, 2012)

I have to agree with Bob. Mind you that is probably coloured by the fact, that when I started Way back in the late 50's early 60's. You did not have all this choice. (Being lefthanded not much choice of clubs either). So you had to learn how to use the wedges. It also has the advantages that you can do it with all the irons in the bag. Try practising a few lob shots over a bunker on to the green with a 5 iron. Good fun and very satisfying when it works.


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## fundy (May 15, 2012)

personally i find it easy enough to knock 10 or 15 yards off either my 3 wood or hybrid just by going down the grip a touch. just prefer to have smaller gaps with my wedges, partly due to being a relatively poor wedge player (relative to handicap im definitely poor). its an area i am working hard on, but ultimately i have too much hit with the hands through impact which makes distance control and consistency harder than it should be. I guess the other part to it is I dont mind missing 10 yds short or long with a 3 wood approach invariably - if I do that with a wedge in hand then im seething!

If i could self design the gaps in my bag, id definitely have a degree bigger gap on the lofts on the irons from 3-7 iron, would then enable me to cover every base lol


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## Snelly (May 15, 2012)

bobmac said:



			As I said, I dont mind 3 wedges.
If you add a 4th however, you have to lose a long iron/5 wood/hybrid to make the 14 clubs.
Now, if your 3 iron/hybrid wont reach, you then have to choke down /swing easy/ cut in a 3 wood which is no picnic for even the best golfers.
On the other hand, if you only have 3 wedges, it's a lot easier to manufacture a shot using one of them (given some practice).
So, I find it much easier to vary my distances with the wedges than I would trying to knock off 20-30 yards off my 3 wood.
Just the way i play I guess.
I have no problem with people who want to beef up the short end of the bag, only dont buy another wedge to hide your lack of ability to play the chips/pitches / bunker shots.
Basically, what would you rather hit, a 3/4 GW or a 3/4 3 wood.
		
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Well said Bob.  

Like all my contemporaries at my club in the early 80's, I grew up with a PW and a SW that were the same as the rest of my clubs and we all regularly shot below par with them in the bag.  No-one needs 4 wedges. I get the argument about lofts and full swings etc but I don't agree with it. Over-complication that only benefits the companies that flog you the extra ones at Â£90 a pop.

My personal opinion is that if you think you need 4 wedges then you have fallen victim to the marketing machines in golf that convince you that this is the case.  It just isn't.  

That is not to say that I would say doing this is wrong.  We live in a free country and we can do what we want to do!  What I do contest though is that there is a "need" for 4 wedges. It is just nonsense.


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## fundy (May 15, 2012)

Snelly said:



			Well said Bob.  

Like all my contemporaries at my club in the early 80's, I grew up with a PW and a SW that were the same as the rest of my clubs and we all regularly shot below par with them in the bag.  No-one needs 4 wedges. I get the argument about lofts and full swings etc but I don't agree with it. Over-complication that only benefits the companies that flog you the extra ones at Â£90 a pop.

My personal opinion is that if you think you need 4 wedges then you have fallen victim to the marketing machines in golf that convince you that this is the case.  It just isn't.  

That is not to say that I would say doing this is wrong.  We live in a free country and we can do what we want to do!  What I do contest though is that there is a "need" for 4 wedges. It is just nonsense.
		
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If I carry just a PW and SW then I would have a carry gap of approx 25 yards, way bigger than any other gap in my irons, why would I want that gap at the distance Im most likely to be left with?

Thats like saying you dont need 9 irons Snelly, we could all get it round with 3 or 4 clubs, but surely its about making the game as easy as possible with how you fill your bag up?


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## duncan mackie (May 15, 2012)

bobmac said:



			As I said, I dont mind 3 wedges.
If you add a 4th however, you have to lose a long iron/5 wood/hybrid to make the 14 clubs.
Now, if your 3 iron/hybrid wont reach, you then have to choke down /swing easy/ cut in a 3 wood which is no picnic for even the best golfers.
On the other hand, if you only have 3 wedges, it's a lot easier to manufacture a shot using one of them (given some practice).
So, I find it much easier to vary my distances with the wedges than I would trying to knock off 20-30 yards off my 3 wood.
Just the way i play I guess.
I have no problem with people who want to beef up the short end of the bag, only dont buy another wedge to hide your lack of ability to play the chips/pitches / bunker shots.
Basically, what would you rather hit, a 3/4 GW or a 3/4  3 wood.
		
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the problem with this argument is that it assumes a degree of capability all round that simply doesn't exist for the majority of golfers.

purely playing devils advocate, I could suggest that giving the player clubs that they might be capable of playing consistently to deliver different results that matter would be better than a selection of 3w, 5w, 3H and 4I at the other end all of which could go anywhere except the same place/distance twice in a row!

completely agree that players should set out to be comfortable with the concept of other than an automated full swing with each club - but from what I see with 4 clubs and a putter comps they have that sorted fine already !!!


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## GreiginFife (May 15, 2012)

Snelly said:



			Well said Bob.  

Like all my contemporaries at my club in the early 80's, I grew up with a PW and a SW that were the same as the rest of my clubs and we all regularly shot below par with them in the bag.  No-one needs 4 wedges. I get the argument about lofts and full swings etc but I don't agree with it. Over-complication that only benefits the companies that flog you the extra ones at Â£90 a pop.

My personal opinion is that if you think you need 4 wedges then you have fallen victim to the marketing machines in golf that convince you that this is the case.  It just isn't.  

That is not to say that I would say doing this is wrong.  We live in a free country and we can do what we want to do!  What I do contest though is that there is a "need" for 4 wedges. It is just nonsense.
		
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In the same way that you will have grown up without 3, 4 or even 5 piece balls, graphite shafted drivers, super lightweight but super strong titanium faces with large CoR, Hybrids. 
For your argument, anyone that has bought any of these to improve their game or make their playing experience as enjoyable as possible have fallen in to the manufacturers marketing machine. 
Golf is a game played differently by all, even the pro's, and everyone will at some point have bought something that their game didn't "need" but they wanted, they like and makes them feel better. 
Personally I change between the number of wedges I carry depending on the course, my stock set is a 47* PW replacement and a 52*/56* combination. I sometimes drop my 4i and carry a 60*... Different horses for different courses - so to speak.


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## Snelly (May 15, 2012)

fundy said:



			If I carry just a PW and SW then I would have a carry gap of approx 25 yards, way bigger than any other gap in my irons, why would I want that gap at the distance Im most likely to be left with?

Thats like saying you dont need 9 irons Snelly, we could all get it round with 3 or 4 clubs, but surely its about making the game as easy as possible with how you fill your bag up?
		
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I think you make a good point.  The next logical question I would ask then is if you are right, then surely you need more clubs?  Don't hit a gentle 6 or a firm 7, pull out your custom tweaked 6.5 iron and make your normal swing. 

I am being flippant but I am trying to highlight the point that golf isn't a game of precision. There are too many variables of lie condition, lie angle, wind, elevation etc for it to be precise.  That is why I would argue that when you have a wedge in your hand, it is more about feel rather than a precise strike with a given loft.   I know that some people find this very hard to get a sense of though.

More than one way to skin a cat and all that......


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## Snelly (May 15, 2012)

GreiginFife said:



			In the same way that you will have grown up without 3, 4 or even 5 piece balls, graphite shafted drivers, super lightweight but super strong titanium faces with large CoR, Hybrids. 
For your argument, anyone that has bought any of these to improve their game or make their playing experience as enjoyable as possible have fallen in to the manufacturers marketing machine. 
Golf is a game played differently by all, even the pro's, and everyone will at some point have bought something that their game didn't "need" but they wanted, they like and makes them feel better. 
Personally I change between the number of wedges I carry depending on the course, my stock set is a 47* PW replacement and a 52*/56* combination. I sometimes drop my 4i and carry a 60*... Different horses for different courses - so to speak.
		
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I think I agree with you. The point I am making is in response to the posters who insinuate that 4 wedges is the way to go and represents progress - I would say that this is not true.  In fact it is a backward step, removing the feel for intuitive distance control.


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## duncan mackie (May 15, 2012)

Snelly said:



			I am being flippant but I am trying to highlight the point that golf isn't a game of precision. There are too many variables of lie condition, lie angle, wind, elevation etc for it to be precise.  That is why I would argue that when you have a wedge in your hand, it is more about feel rather than a precise strike with a given loft.   I know that some people find this very hard to get a sense of though.
		
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If you can't deal conciously with the variables how can a sense of feel help you? In fact as you move away from landing on the green, and in a predictable manner with regard to the balls reaction on landing, you introduce more variables!

Doesn't make sense as an argument.

Equally your 6.5 iron doesn't either, flippant or otherwise.

Whlst I agree there is more than one way to skin a cat, there are definitely better ways and worse; in some cases the differences will be subjective but most will be objective.

Now, I am not suggesting for one minute that rising, and overcoming, challenges on a golf course isn't one of the more rewarding elements of the game - I believe it is. However that doesn't change the fact that if I need to get a ball close to pin 90yds away on any normal inland golf course I am not going to use a 6 iron - unless of course the overhanging tree 10yds in front, fluffy lie in the semi and complete lack of hazards across the front dictate this to be the percentage shot!


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## DaveM (May 15, 2012)

This could go on for ever. Guess its folks preferences, in the end. I find 2 wedges enough. May have to put a GW in as the burner PW is a 9 iron. Oh and Greig on the Balls. The small ball that was in use before the American ball became the norm. Was a 3 piece ball. A soft center of latex, then elastic banding, followed by a balata cover. The one piece&2 piece balls that followed were a backward step.


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## HomerJSimpson (May 15, 2012)

For me:

PW = 100 yards
52 GW = 85 yards
58 SW - 60 yards

Nice even gap in yardages based on a 3/4 swing as I never hit my wedges full out. If I'm in between, I'll grip down, swing shorter or swing slower to vary the distance. It is something that just needs a little time and dedication to get right. Its an area I've neglected and plan to work on tomorrow as I'm not hitting as close as I should


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## G1BB0 (May 15, 2012)

I took a 58 to woodhall (well I bought it off RickG when I got there actually) as knew I needed it in some of the bunkers... still didnt get out of 1 of them. I dont take it to my home course and have my 3 iron in the bag instead!!! (yes I can hit it)

the 3 iron is going to be swapped for another hybrid soon though so I will chop and change depending on course/conditions


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## garyinderry (May 15, 2012)

bobmac said:



			As I said, I dont mind 3 wedges.
If you add a 4th however, you have to lose a long iron/5 wood/hybrid to make the 14 clubs.
Now, if your 3 iron/hybrid wont reach, you then have to choke down /swing easy/ cut in a 3 wood which is no picnic for even the best golfers.
On the other hand, if you only have 3 wedges, it's a lot easier to manufacture a shot using one of them (given some practice).
So, I find it much easier to vary my distances with the wedges than I would trying to knock off 20-30 yards off my 3 wood.
Just the way i play I guess.
I have no problem with people who want to beef up the short end of the bag, only dont buy another wedge to hide your lack of ability to play the chips/pitches / bunker shots.
Basically, what would you rather hit, a 3/4 GW or a 3/4  3 wood.
		
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how many times a round would someone have to play a 3/4 3wood? once, twice at most, if at all. id rather have my wedge set up to allow me to make the best and easiest shot choice on alot more approaches per round.


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## Snelly (May 15, 2012)

garyinderry said:



			how many times a round would someone have to play a 3/4 3wood? once, twice at most, if at all. id rather have my wedge set up to allow me to make the best and easiest shot choice on alot more approaches per round.
		
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I think you missed Bob's point.


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## Snelly (May 15, 2012)

duncan mackie said:



			If you can't deal conciously with the variables how can a sense of feel help you? In fact as you move away from landing on the green, and in a predictable manner with regard to the balls reaction on landing, you introduce more variables!

Doesn't make sense as an argument.

Equally your 6.5 iron doesn't either, flippant or otherwise.

Whlst I agree there is more than one way to skin a cat, there are definitely better ways and worse; in some cases the differences will be subjective but most will be objective.

Now, I am not suggesting for one minute that rising, and overcoming, challenges on a golf course isn't one of the more rewarding elements of the game - I believe it is. However that doesn't change the fact that if I need to get a ball close to pin 90yds away on any normal inland golf course I am not going to use a 6 iron - unless of course the overhanging tree 10yds in front, fluffy lie in the semi and complete lack of hazards across the front dictate this to be the percentage shot!
		
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Honestly, I have no idea what point you're trying to make.


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

Snelly said:



			I think you missed Bob's point.
		
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what was he saying?


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

For me 4 wedges is a must its gives me the options i need

PW 110 - 115 yards
GW 105 - 110 yards
SW 100 - 105 yards
LW  70 - 80 yards ( rarely hit it full )


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## One Planer (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			For me 4 wedges is a must its gives me the options i need

PW 110 - 115 yards
GW 105 - 110 yards
SW 100 - 105 yards
LW  70 - 80 yards ( rarely hit it full )
		
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You need a 64* to give you options inside 70 yards too


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## Snelly (May 16, 2012)

garyinderry said:



			what was he saying?
		
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That it is far easier to hit a three quarter wedge than a three quarter 3 wood and not only that, the circumstances when you would need to do the latter are extremely rare.


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## Snelly (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			For me 4 wedges is a must its gives me the options i need

PW 110 - 115 yards
GW 105 - 110 yards
SW 100 - 105 yards
LW 70 - 80 yards ( rarely hit it full )
		
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Really?  Well you must be an incredibly good player then.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

Snelly said:



			Really?  Well you must be an incredibly good player then.
		
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Im ok player my lob is actually a 62 degree which comes in handy


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## One Planer (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			Im ok player my lob is actually a 62 degree which comes in handy
		
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For......


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

Gareth said:



			For......
		
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What else ? high shots around the green when i need it to stop
Over trees possibly?
the usual


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## One Planer (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			What else ? high shots around the green when i need it to stop
Over trees possibly?
the usual
		
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This is not a dig so please don't think it is, but this is the point people make about manipulating wedges.

The most lofted wedge I carry is a 56*. If I need any more I just open the face a little and/or move the ball slightly forward in my stance. For me anything over 58* can cause more problems than they'll get you out of, but again that's just my opinion.

56* is more than enough loft for any shot IMHO and leave me an extra space in my bag for my hybrid


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## patricks148 (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			For me 4 wedges is a must its gives me the options i need

PW 110 - 115 yards
GW 105 - 110 yards
SW 100 - 105 yards
LW  70 - 80 yards ( rarely hit it full )
		
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what i noticed here is that you only cover 15 yards diff with 3 clubs???

What do you play off just out of interest?


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## Imurg (May 16, 2012)

As has been said, it's Horses for Courses..you pick what feels best for you.

I have - officially - 4 wedges. My PW is 45* and is really a 9 iron and to be honest I use it as such, I don't generally chip or pitch with it.

Anyway, I have a 3 wood, a 5 wood and a 24* MP Fli-Hi before I get to my irons.
I could get another club in there, maybe one that hits it around 200-210.
But the way I look at is - How often am I going to hit the green from more than 200 yards?
I have a decent long-game, I'm not going to hit the green many times out of 10 from in excess of 200 yards, either by taking a little off my 3 or 5 wood or forcing the 24....
So the likelyhood is, if I'm going at the green from 200+, that I'm going to be chipping. With my 3 "proper" wedges I have a club that will, with a bit of luck, get me to the flag regardless of how the ball is lying.
A 50* to chip'n'run, a 54 with high bounce should the ball be in a bunker or deep grass and a 58 for getting the ball up and over. Add into that the rest of the irons that can be used should the need arise and I have a club for almost any situation.
I know how the ball is going to react with each club so I choose the one that will help me play the shot I want.
I'd rather have more short clubs than long for the reason specified above.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

patricks148 said:



			what i noticed here is that you only cover 15 yards diff with 3 clubs???

What do you play off just out of interest?
		
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i play off 10

Also alot alot people open the wedges club face give them more loft which is good if you can do it
But i just keep it simple dont risk playing some wide opened face and risk thinning it
I got the wedges that gives me alot of options when i really need to make sure its right


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## richart (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			For me 4 wedges is a must its gives me the options i need

PW 110 - 115 yards
GW 105 - 110 yards
SW 100 - 105 yards
LW  70 - 80 yards ( rarely hit it full )
		
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Must get confusing knowing which club to hit when you are 105 yards out.


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## One Planer (May 16, 2012)

richart said:



			Must get confusing knowing which club to hit when you are 105 yards out.

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Or 90 yards


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## patricks148 (May 16, 2012)

spawn_ukuk said:



			i play off 10

Also alot alot people open the wedges club face give them more loft which is good if you can do it
But i just keep it simple dont risk playing some wide opened face and risk thinning it
I got the wedges that gives me alot of options when i really need to make sure its right
		
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Just that your PW,GW and sw are all within 15 yards of each other.

my pw that goes max 110 yards so use this from 90 up to 110.

My 50 deg gap wedge has no bounce and and use this for all shots upto 90 yards except out of greenside bunkers
just change the length of swing. I can open it up for lob shots as the lack of bounce helps on tight links turf.

My 56 deg sw is used, well out of sand. Where i play we have deep pot bunkers, always get out (eventually). I can hit this club about 50 yards but don't need to. If im honest i could prob get rid of the PW if i needed something else at the other end in the bag.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

Not really 100 yards i take a SW, depending on wind , lie ECT
90 i just take abit off


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## richart (May 16, 2012)

I have four wedges in the bag at the moment, as I can't hit anything less than a full shot without shanking. I have taken to holding the bottom of the grip, top of the shaft with my lob wedge in order to hit full shots 40-50 yards. Less than that its is a stab with a wedge or the putter. Have had the chipping yips chipping for years, and resorted to left hand below right, a chipper, and just giving up the game.


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

PW...5 - 110
SW...5 - 90

Depending on whether I want to hit it high, low or normal


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

Gareth said:



			For......
		
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In the Mizuno Aerolite WP Stand Bag:

*Mizuno MP 630 Driver (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 64)
Mizuno MP Titanium 5 Wood (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 74)
Mizuno MP CLK 17* Hybrid (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 84)*
Mizuno MP Fli-Hi 3 Iron (TT DG R300)
Mizuno MP-32 Irons 4-PW (TT DG R300)
TaylorMade XFT TP 52* & 56* Wedges (KBS Tour Steel)
Scotty Cameron California Del Mar

Handicap Start 2012 - 18.3>18.4


gareth - you have a big gap between driver and 5 wood. then too small a gap between 5wood and hybrid.


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

richart said:



			I have four wedges in the bag at the moment, as I can't hit anything less than a full shot without shanking. I have taken to holding the bottom of the grip, top of the shaft with my lob wedge in order to hit full shots 40-50 yards. Less than that its is a stab with a wedge or the putter. Have had the chipping yips chipping for years, and resorted to left hand below right, a chipper, and just giving up the game.
		
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The next time I'm down, I'll sort you out


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## RGDave (May 16, 2012)

Imurg said:



			As has been said, it's Horses for Courses..you pick what feels best for you.

I have - officially - 4 wedges. My PW is 45* and is really a 9 iron and to be honest I use it as such, I don't generally chip or pitch with it.

Anyway, I have a 3 wood, a 5 wood and a 24* MP Fli-Hi before I get to my irons.
I could get another club in there, maybe one that hits it around 200-210.
But the way I look at is - How often am I going to hit the green from more than 200 yards?
I have a decent long-game, I'm not going to hit the green many times out of 10 from in excess of 200 yards, either by taking a little off my 3 or 5 wood or forcing the 24....
So the likelyhood is, if I'm going at the green from 200+, that I'm going to be chipping. With my 3 "proper" wedges I have a club that will, with a bit of luck, get me to the flag regardless of how the ball is lying.
A 50* to chip'n'run, a 54 with high bounce should the ball be in a bunker or deep grass and a 58 for getting the ball up and over. Add into that the rest of the irons that can be used should the need arise and I have a club for almost any situation.
I know how the ball is going to react with each club so I choose the one that will help me play the shot I want.
I'd rather have more short clubs than long for the reason specified above.
		
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"War and peace", it's a good read.

I enjoyed this post, makes a lot of sense.

I don't carry the wedge from my set specifically to avoid the PW = 9i conundrum.
and the fact it's a proper shovel.... 

a.t.m. I'm using 3 wedges with 3 shots for each making 9 distances.

Some people scoff saying "you're not exactly a good player, so why the fancy maths?" but I do tend to get away with single putts quite often turning boring 5s into 1-putt 4s, after a wedge of exactly the right distance.

I'll never forget the "killer blow" in our 2010 matchplay victory. Skycaddie said 87 yards, slightely uphill, played 90 with 3/4 GW. Stone dead to go 4 up after 14. That's what we do it for isn't it? If it takes multiple wedges, who cares.


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

bobmac said:



			PW...5 - 110
SW...5 - 90

Depending on whether I want to hit it high, low or normal
		
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you are an acomplished player who plays off scratch. you have honed you skills over many years and what you described is all about feeling the shot. this is simply too hard for people who dont get to play and practice as much as you or who havnt got to that level of skill and feel. 

i would agree that anything over a 58 is unnecessary. i have a 60 and 64 in the garage gathering dust.


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## spawn_ukuk (May 16, 2012)

Have you seen Phil When he used his 64?


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## One Planer (May 16, 2012)

garyinderry said:



			In the Mizuno Aerolite WP Stand Bag:

*Mizuno MP 630 Driver (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 64)
Mizuno MP Titanium 5 Wood (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 74)
Mizuno MP CLK 17* Hybrid (Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki 84)*
Mizuno MP Fli-Hi 3 Iron (TT DG R300)
Mizuno MP-32 Irons 4-PW (TT DG R300)
TaylorMade XFT TP 52* & 56* Wedges (KBS Tour Steel)
Scotty Cameron California Del Mar

Handicap Start 2012 - 18.3>18.4


gareth - you have a big gap between driver and 5 wood. then too small a gap between 5wood and hybrid.
		
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It doesn't matter what it says on the sole it's how far I hit them :thup:

I was more concerend about the gap between my 5 wood and 3 iron (..... Hence the hybrid) than the gap between my driver and 5 wood, which to be honest isn't massive and I can live with.


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

im not phil mickelson. i just see that club as a waste for me personaly. the bunkers around my place are not exactly massive. in fact two of the bigger ones have been made smaller this year. i wont short side myself that badly where i cant flop the ball enough with the 58. 

as i said before i have a 60 and i used for two years to devistating  effect. it worked well for me but i decided to invest in a 58 and i use it for even more approch shots as i get very little distance from a 60, just height.


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

Gareth said:



			It doesn't matter what it says on the sole it's how far I hit them :thup:

I was more concerend about the gap between my 5 wood and 3 iron (..... Hence the hybrid) than the gap between my driver and 5 wood, which to be honest isn't massive and I can live with.
		
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i was just pointing out an obvious number gap. im the same tbh. i have a 4 wood in the bag at the minute and a 19* hybrid. i dont hit the wood very stright and will only use it when i know it safe to do so. i know how far (roughly) they go so its alll good.


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

garyinderry said:



			you are an acomplished player who plays off scratch. you have honed you skills over many years and what you described is all about feeling the shot. this is simply too hard for people who dont get to play and practice as much as you or who havnt got to that level of skill and feel. 

i would agree that anything over a 58 is unnecessary. i have a 60 and 64 in the garage gathering dust.
		
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No.
I learned how to play the wedge shot and how to vary it.
It's not difficult.
But it is quicker to pop to the shop and buy another wedge.
Do you find a big difference in your 56 and 58?
And how do you cope with only one club between your 3 wood and 4 iron?


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

i can confidently stand at any said position within my wedge range and know which one will get me to the pin. this is in part, feel. i dont know my exact yardage for these but just by looking ill know, obviously factoring in the wind etc.

for delicate shots around the green i find the 58 to be such a weapon. i played strabane at the weekend which has much faster, sloping greens than im used to at home and any time i was green side, i was able to lift the ball nicely into the air, soft landing and let the ball feed down to the hole. this could have been achieved by opening my sand wedge and cutting across it but by simply using a small back swing and up to head hight follow through i was leaving chip after chip stone dead. simple.

im not the biggest of drivers but can get it out there to an average distane and im even more ropey with woods ect. anything that i can hit over 200 yards can be dangerous. having the 4 wood and 19* hybrid can both do this so i am very carefull when i use them. this no doubt holds my game back but it also allows me to get around the course in the manner i currently do. the long clubs are my next major project


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

ill be honest with you. 190-200ish would be a gap for me. could prob be doing with a 21* hybrid for this shot or 185 into a breeze but i love the wedges so im stuck between a rock and a hard place.  we dont have any par 3' of this distance at my place and when im faced with one i just try and cut a bit of the 19*.


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## Rooter (May 16, 2012)

phew, 7 page read of that on the train was tough! i have 4 wedges, PW doesnt really count though at 45*.. thats a 9 iron in old money. I do love my 60* lob wedge though...


I reckon mine go like this ish.. (unless you count the PW i thin/sliced 50yrds towards smiffys head...)
PW - 5-120yrd use as a 9 iron or for chips over a raised fringe etc
AW - 40-100yrd utility from 40yrds out
SW - 5-75yrd from sand obviously and round the greens, sometimes when 50+ out and need height
LW- 5-40yrd never hit full, only for getting over stuff and stopping quick... i do like a cheeky 10yarder over a bunker, stream etc..


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

bobmac said:



			I beg to differ
		
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The occasional 'stubborn technophobic old fart' only carries 1 or 2 
I don't know of any (Touring) Pro that uses fewer than 3 wedges (counting PW) - and for the same reasons we should. These are the 'scoring' clubs!

If you check out Dave Pelz's book 'Short Game Bible' you'll see how 3 'finesse' swings will give you predictable distances with 3 or 4 wedges without having to be particularly creative. Likewise, the 3-9 and 10-2 etc approach of other coaches.


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## Snelly (May 16, 2012)

One day, when you have evolved as a golfer, perhaps you too will realise that whatever is in Dave's bible, how many wedges you have, what clubs you have, what shaft is in them, the material of your putter face, your laser rangefinder, how clean your shoes are, what colour tees you use and everything else that I read about on this forum that relates to how important various bits of kit are, is all actually just about irrelevant to your golf game. 

What matters is how you hold the club, how you address the ball, how you swing the club and your mental approach to the game. When these are all good, you are a good player.  When they are poor, so are you.  The clubs you are using have a very small effect on any of this, despite what you might think. 

I know this because I have been through it all. And I am living proof that I am right.


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			The occasional 'stubborn technophobic old fart' only carries 1 or 2 
I don't know of any (Touring) Pro that uses fewer than 3 wedges (counting PW) - and for the same reasons we should. These are the 'scoring' clubs!

If you check out Dave Pelz's book 'Short Game Bible' you'll see how 3 'finesse' swings will give you predictable distances with 3 or 4 wedges without having to be particularly creative. Likewise, the 3-9 and 10-2 etc approach of other coaches.
		
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Foxholer, if you look, Spawnukuk said 




			Most people i think Carry 4 wedges now
Pw Gap Sw Lob
		
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It was that a didnt agree with.
I also said I dont have a problem with people carrying 3 wedges.
I also didn't say some tour pros only carry 2 wedges
But I will say there are plenty who only carry 3, not 4
And as for Pelz...
How many majors has he won?
I was taught the 9 to 3 drill when I was 12, so there's nothing new in his "Bible"
And as for me being a stubborn technophobic old fart, you are of course entiltled to your opinion.


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

Snelly said:



			One day, when you have evolved as a golfer, perhaps you too will realise that whatever is in Dave's bible, how many wedges you have, what clubs you have, what shaft is in them, the material of your putter face, your laser rangefinder, how clean your shoes are, what colour tees you use and everything else that I read about on this forum that relates to how important various bits of kit are, is all actually just about irrelevant to your golf game. 

What matters is how you hold the club, how you address the ball, how you swing the club and your mental approach to the game. When these are all good, you are a good player.  When they are poor, so are you.  The clubs you are using have a very small effect on any of this, despite what you might think. 

I know this because I have been through it all. And I am living proof that I am right.
		
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Ah! The ABC approach to Golf - Arrogant British Condescension!

While I don't believe you can 'buy' a game, it certainly makes sense to use what works best. Otherwise (by your argument), there'd only need to be 1 or 2 clubs. Your use of 'modern' gear (and putter comment) also rather negates your argument too.

Had you said 'still got to get the ball in the hole - in the fewest number of strokes' we'd be 'on the same page'! 

Pelz's books do come in handy as doorstops too!


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## Snelly (May 16, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			Ah! The ABC approach to Golf - Arrogant British Condescension!

While I don't believe you can 'buy' a game, it certainly makes sense to use what works best. Otherwise (by your argument), there'd only need to be 1 or 2 clubs. Your use of 'modern' gear (and putter comment) also rather negates your argument too.

Had you said 'still got to get the ball in the hole - in the fewest number of strokes' we'd be 'on the same page'! 

Pelz's books do come in handy as doorstops too!
		
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I can certainly be arrogant that is for sure.  A design flaw I am afraid. 

However, to say that the natural extension of what I am saying means 1 or 2 clubs is ludicrous.


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

bobmac said:



			Foxholer, if you look, Spawnukuk said 



It was that a didnt agree with.
I also said I dont have a problem with people carrying 3 wedges.
I also didn't say some tour pros only carry 2 wedges
But I will say there are plenty who only carry 3, not 4
And as for Pelz...
How many majors has he won?
I was taught the 9 to 3 drill when I was 12, so there's nothing new in his "Bible"
And as for me being a stubborn technophobic old fart, you are of course entiltled to your opinion.
		
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Bob,

There's unfortunately no 'tongue in cheek' smilie. I used the closest I could find.

However, re Pelz:

If Winning Majors was the qualification to be a coach.......

He was actually a pretty handy player with 4 year scholarship to Indiana Uni, but didn't make it on the PGA Tour so turned to his other talent - Physics - and rose quite high in the NASA world before/while compiling stats/his approach to short game (and putting).

The 9 to 3 is not a 'Pelz' swing. You should (re-)read his book - at least the first 70 pages, though there is a lot of padding/waffle to get through.

As for wedge counts: Checking the WITBs of winners from last couple of months, it's pretty much even between 3 and 4.


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

Dam, i thought I was going to learn something new....


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

Old Dog?


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## bobmac (May 16, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			Old Dog? 

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Nope
I see no new tricks.
But to read his book you'd think he invented the short game.


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

bobmac said:



			Nope
I see no new tricks.
But to read his book you'd think he invented the short game.
		
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Ah. That's the OAM Approach - Overbearing American Marketing! (think Ball Flight Laws!)


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## Snelly (May 16, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			As for wedge counts: Checking the WITBs of winners from last couple of months, it's pretty much even between 3 and 4.
		
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How is that relevant to you as a 9 handicapper?


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## Foxholer (May 16, 2012)

Snelly said:



			How is that relevant to you as a 9 handicapper?
		
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Please identify exactly in my post I said it was relevant to me!


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## Neddy (May 16, 2012)

I have 4 wedges and a light top end of the bag for this reason....I am a short hitter. 

For me, a good drive goes 210-230, 3 wood 190-200, 3 hybrid 170-180, 4I 160-165 etc etc....I have at various times had a 5 wood and a 2 hybrid in the bag but soon realised that i really didn't need any more than driver, 3W and 3H.

So i carry 4 wedges, 45 PW, for 80-100 yards out, 50 GW with almost no bounce for 60-70 yards/chip shots from bare lies, 54 degree SW and 60LW for short game shots.

Yes, I could manage with 3, but as has been previously said, almost all of us COULD play the game with 5 clubs full stop, so IMO it's a mute point.

My game is suited to playing with 4 wedges, other people might be suited to carrying 2/3 and more clubs at the top. Who cares?!


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## richart (May 16, 2012)

bobmac said:



			The next time I'm down, I'll sort you out  

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Thanks Bob, you know you are always welcome in sunny Frensham.


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## DaveM (May 16, 2012)

:rofl:Love these type of threads. Especially when the side loosing resorts to name calling. To hide there lose.:thup:


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## garyinderry (May 16, 2012)

Neddy said:



			I have 4 wedges and a light top end of the bag for this reason....I am a short hitter. 

For me, a good drive goes 210-230, 3 wood 190-200, 3 hybrid 170-180, 4I 160-165 etc etc....I have at various times had a 5 wood and a 2 hybrid in the bag but soon realised that i really didn't need any more than driver, 3W and 3H.

So i carry 4 wedges, 45 PW, for 80-100 yards out, 50 GW with almost no bounce for 60-70 yards/chip shots from bare lies, 54 degree SW and 60LW for short game shots.

Yes, I could manage with 3, but as has been previously said, almost all of us COULD play the game with 5 clubs full stop, so IMO it's a mute point.

My game is suited to playing with 4 wedges, other people might be suited to carrying 2/3 and more clubs at the top. Who cares?!
		
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this pretty much sums up my feelings on the matter. ^


nice to see a good debate and in the end up everyone walking away with the opinions they came in with. we are all a bunch of plugged balls. (stick in the muds)


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## bignev (May 17, 2012)

I tend to agree with Bob. That 3 is enough for the average golfer.
I did carry 4 last year but found it gave me to many options causing some confusion. Now with 3 shots around the green seem simpler because choosing the wedge is easier.


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