# Car Leasing



## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

I'm looking at getting a new car and for the prices quoted I can't look past leasing one. The cost compared to normal garages is ludicrous!

Has anyone has any experience with car leasing (personal not business) and who have you used for it?

Looking at getting a Ford Fiesta Zetec S for anyone interested! :thup::clap:


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## Aztecs27 (May 26, 2016)

If you're not fussed about owning it, then it's definitely a viable option! Same as PCP schemes...You're never really going to pay the balloon payment at the end, so you just upgrade to a shiny new one....we're currently looking at this with a Lexus NX. as we can get a brand new "Luxury" model (which has all the toys you'd ever need and none of the pointless ones like touch pad mouse and heads up display) for a relatively low price (helps that my dad works for Lexus and can immediately get a nice chunk of discount off the car anyway!) 

I don't think Lexus offer personal leasing, but if they did I'd probably be jumping on that bandwagon!


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## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			If you're not fussed about owning it, then it's definitely a viable option! Same as PCP schemes...You're never really going to pay the balloon payment at the end, so you just upgrade to a shiny new one....we're currently looking at this with a Lexus NX. as we can get a brand new "Luxury" model (which has all the toys you'd ever need and none of the pointless ones like touch pad mouse and heads up display) for a relatively low price (helps that my dad works for Lexus and can immediately get a nice chunk of discount off the car anyway!) 

I don't think Lexus offer personal leasing, but if they did I'd probably be jumping on that bandwagon!
		
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it just makes a lot more sense mate - don't see the need to own it myself! Really don't see much of a difference.

The one i've been looking at gives me plenty enough miles to do what I need to do also! 

It's about Â£100 cheaper a month too which always helps!


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## Deleted Member 1156 (May 26, 2016)

Leasing can be a very good option but don't forget to look at the total cost rather than just the monthly payments. I've seen some excellent looking deals that have a hefty up front payment that you have to factor in  :thup:


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## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

drive4show said:



			Leasing can be a very good option but don't forget to look at the total cost rather than just the monthly payments. I've seen some excellent looking deals that have a hefty up front payment that you have to factor in  :thup:
		
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Aye I know matey, I own a car at the moment so got a couple of thousand there. :thup:


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## Lord Tyrion (May 26, 2016)

We lease through work and frankly it is a joy. No slimy car salesmen, no worrying about depreciation. You know what you have to pay each month and at the end of that period you hand the keys back and start again with a new one. I have a Volvo XC60 at the moment, a car I could never afford to buy outright but Volvo were supporting the lease deals when I was looking so bingo, I'll have one of those please. Personal lease, company lease, doesn't really matter, same difference.

On D4S point. A lot of headline deals have 6 months up front. We always go 3 months up front. It sounds as though you are wise to that though.


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## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			We lease through work and frankly it is a joy. No slimy car salesmen, no worrying about depreciation. You know what you have to pay each month and at the end of that period you hand the keys back and start again with a new one. I have a Volvo XC60 at the moment, a car I could never afford to buy outright but Volvo were supporting the lease deals when I was looking so bingo, I'll have one of those please. Personal lease, company lease, doesn't really matter, same difference.

On D4S point. A lot of headline deals have 6 months up front. We always go 3 months up front. It sounds as though you are wise to that though.
		
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beautiful car, wish my budget would stretch that far!

I think i'm going to ask my manager if there is an option for me to go on a business lease - can save a lot of money that way!

On the Volvo regards, my uncle has the Volvo V40 D4 (R Design I think), it is the most stunning car i've been inside! Also scarily fast!!


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## kerber0s1983 (May 26, 2016)

I've just taken a Nissan X trail on personal lease from Nationwide Vehicle Contracts - after years of company cars, etc. I've had this one a couple of months and this is my 2nd lease with them

Couldnt fault them or leasing in general, delivered quickly and the pull for me for leasing over a PCP from a garage was there was a lot less to pay up front (1k as opposed to 5k, if i went to Nissan) plus road tax and servicing all in - no hassle

I wont be buying another car again, will carry on leasing


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## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

kerber0s1983 said:



			I've just taken a Nissan X trail on personal lease from Nationwide Vehicle Contracts - after years of company cars, etc. I've had this one a couple of months and this is my 2nd lease with them

Couldnt fault them or leasing in general, delivered quickly and the pull for me for leasing over a PCP from a garage was there was a lot less to pay up front (1k as opposed to 5k, if i went to Nissan) plus road tax and servicing all in - no hassle

I wont be buying another car again, will carry on leasing
		
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just had a quick look at these, some excellent prices! Really good price on a Seat Ibiza on there which looks nice!

Thanks for the review i'll definitely keep them in mind.


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## kerber0s1983 (May 26, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			just had a quick look at these, some excellent prices! Really good price on a Seat Ibiza on there which looks nice!

Thanks for the review i'll definitely keep them in mind.
		
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No worries - enjoy the search for a car!

I did get a lot of odd looks from main dealers when walking in and going straight to the boot and asking if i could put my clubs in to see if they fitted, only to walk straight out if they didn't without taking brochures etc


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## stokie_93 (May 26, 2016)

kerber0s1983 said:



			No worries - enjoy the search for a car!

I did get a lot of odd looks from main dealers when walking in and going straight to the boot and asking if i could put my clubs in to see if they fitted, only to walk straight out if they didn't without taking brochures etc
		
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there's always the back seat


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## Lord Tyrion (May 26, 2016)

I always take two sets of clubs with me into a showroom when I am down to a short list. Mine and my sons. If they don't fit in then the car is of no use. When my kids were small I would take their pram in. You don't want to find out after you have picked it up for 2/3 years that it can not do what you need it for. I stopped worrying about the thoughts of dealers/car salesman a long time ago.

Don't discount Volvo's. I'm on to my third now. Not because I am brand loyal but they always do cracking lease deals. If there is one you fancy then bang an email off. Nothing lost and you may be pleasantly surprised.


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## butchercd (May 26, 2016)

drive4show said:



			Leasing can be a very good option but don't forget to look at the total cost rather than just the monthly payments. I've seen some excellent looking deals that have a hefty up front payment that you have to factor in  :thup:
		
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Exactly this, add the up front cost to get a true monthly cost. Its also worth shopping around, BMW for instance are doing deals with 1 month upfront, so you can pick up a 1 Series at the moment for Â£249 upfront and Â£249 a month which is quite reasonable


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## kerber0s1983 (May 26, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			there's always the back seat 

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I'm away with work a lot and try to get a round in the evenings wherever i am when away, so don't want them on show


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## Aztecs27 (May 26, 2016)

kerber0s1983 said:



			I've just taken a Nissan X trail on personal lease from Nationwide Vehicle Contracts - after years of company cars, etc. I've had this one a couple of months and this is my 2nd lease with them

Couldnt fault them or leasing in general, delivered quickly and the pull for me for leasing over a PCP from a garage was there was a lot less to pay up front (1k as opposed to 5k, if i went to Nissan) plus road tax and servicing all in - no hassle

I wont be buying another car again, will carry on leasing
		
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Thanks for this! 

I guess the only thing for me is that I have to find the up-front chunk of money every 2-3-4 years or however long the lease is...but I'm seriously considering this now as I'm pretty sure the exhaust is going to fall of on my Mondeo shortly, so need to get something sorted soonish! Will take a look at Nationwide! cheers!


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## gripitripit (May 26, 2016)

kerber0s1983 said:



			I've just taken a Nissan X trail on personal lease from Nationwide Vehicle Contracts - after years of company cars, etc. I've had this one a couple of months and this is my 2nd lease with them

Couldnt fault them or leasing in general, delivered quickly and the pull for me for leasing over a PCP from a garage was there was a lot less to pay up front (1k as opposed to 5k, if i went to Nissan) plus road tax and servicing all in - no hassle

I wont be buying another car again, will carry on leasing
		
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I lease through them also and cannot complain. A good company IMO and would highly recommend.


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## gripitripit (May 26, 2016)

Volvo are doing good deals at the mo with a 1 month up-front payment. 
259 a month for 4 years including all maintenance is a cracker. Limited to 8k a year though.


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## Aztecs27 (May 26, 2016)

gripitripit said:



			Volvo are doing good deals at the mo with a 1 month up-front payment. 
259 a month for 4 years including all maintenance is a cracker. Limited to 8k a year though.
		
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That's my problem (as I'll be going personal lease) - I need 15k a year so everything is a bit more expensive.

Just checked Nationwide for X-Trails and an n-tec model which is one below their top spec on a 4 year lease can be had for just under Â£300 a month (probably a bit more than that with a maintenance plan), which is great. 

Fuel economy looks average though from what I can tell. 

kerber0s1983 what fuel consumption do you get from yours?


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## Lord Tyrion (May 26, 2016)

I like the look of an X-Trail but they are a big car for a 1.6d engine. That engine is not half going to have to work hard to shift that car. Fine in Norfolk but you are in the West Country, plenty of hills there for it to be working hard on.


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## kerber0s1983 (May 26, 2016)

I get on average about 45-47 a gallon but that is all on fairly short single carriageway/town driving. 

When its on motorways etc i usally get 50-51 to the gallon.

Its fine for being a 1.6 around here, as not really hilly at all, so dont know about that.

I've got the ntec 4WD 7 seat.

I think from memory adding the maintenance was about 50quid a month.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 26, 2016)

Kerber - You are probably in an ideal location for that car / engine. I have had one lease car and one hire car with that type of set up. I was forever changing gear and the noise of the engine working hard drove me nuts. MPG was also average due to the work it was doing. If I got it on a flat dual carriageway or motorway it was great so I don't discount them entirely but for my area it was not good. My fault for not doing my homework. You have to really think about the motoring you do and where you will be driving. They would be fantastic in Holland!


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## butchercd (May 26, 2016)

Try here:

http://www.contracthireandleasing.com/

You can pick a car and tailor the mileage, upfront payment and spec. Checks loads of different companies and you can pick a deal.


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## Aztecs27 (May 26, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I like the look of an X-Trail but they are a big car for a 1.6d engine. That engine is not half going to have to work hard to shift that car. Fine in Norfolk but you are in the West Country, plenty of hills there for it to be working hard on.
		
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That thought had crossed my mind. From what I've read the Honda CRV with similar size engine has more poke and torque (on the diesels) which will aid with this!

If I had my way, I'd just get a fully loaded Seat Leon but the wife insists we need a big car (having owned a mondeo for 5 years)!! There's only us two and our dog FFS!


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## jusme (May 27, 2016)

I have spoken to so many people who assume that leasing is expensive. Do your homework and it is anything but. It came out the clear winner for me. Especially if you are flexible with models. Overstock of some cars bring fantastic deals around the country. Many reputable nationwide options. I took the best price online and got my local dealer to match it. I negotiated extra mileage also.


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## tugglesf239 (May 27, 2016)

I'm thinking of doing the same. 

Comp car currently but the choices are very limited. 

Looking at a Audi all-road currently via nationwide 

Lings cars is also a great website if your eyes can handle it


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## Aztecs27 (May 27, 2016)

Have been sweet talked by my dad to go and test drive the Lexus NX tomorrow. He can offer Â£5k discount on the car, which makes it a very attractive prospect! Whatever happens, I would like to ideally get it changed before my exhaust falls off and the MOT and service is due (July!) on my Mondeo.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 27, 2016)

Please do a write up on it after the drive. I think they look great and would be an ideal size for my family. Auto Express are running one at the moment and their criticisms are mpg, nothing you can say about that on a test run, and ride quality. They are complaining that they feel every bump in the road. I would be interested to hear your take on it after a drive. They may have huge wheels and sport mode on so it may not give a true picture.


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## Alex1975 (May 27, 2016)

https://www.nationwidevehiclecontracts.co.uk/?gclid=CLaj6oOW-swCFRS6Gwodq3MP0Q


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## Aztecs27 (May 27, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Please do a write up on it after the drive. I think they look great and would be an ideal size for my family. Auto Express are running one at the moment and their criticisms are mpg, nothing you can say about that on a test run, and ride quality. They are complaining that they feel every bump in the road. I would be interested to hear your take on it after a drive. They may have huge wheels and sport mode on so it may not give a true picture.
		
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Will do! I might not be the best person to judge the ride - our current Mondeo Titanium has 18 inch, low profile wheels and stiffened suspension, so is a pretty firm ride! Anything else is probably going to feel luxurious! 

IF you've not seen one in person, they are REALLY nice cars and I mean REALLY nice. The interior is absolutely stunning. It's not a massive car, but we can get a small dog crate in the boot (big enough for a spaniel - we tried it on the showroom model they had) with enough space either side for a couple of smaller overnight bags. 

The MPG was my issue and the guys at Lexus were fairly straight up with me to be honest. The official numbers are nothing like what you get, but they assure me that an average of mid-40's can be achieved as long as you're not driving like a total douche...Which I'd be fine with (Mondeo currently averages 45mpg over last 5 years)...as it wouldn't cost us any more in fuel costs, in theory. But I can see why they'd bemoan it in their reviews.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 27, 2016)

I've seen a couple, one in motion the other parked up. They really stand out, I love the lines. I'd be fine with mid 40's, as long as I don't have to drive like a nun to get that figure.

Looking forward to the write up.


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## Aztecs27 (May 27, 2016)

Cat now firmly amongst pigeons....There's a new VW Tiguan out and the boot is considerably bigger than the last model (and bigger than the NX AND CRV bootspace)


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## stokie_93 (May 27, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Cat now firmly amongst pigeons....There's a new VW Tiguan out and the boot is considerably bigger than the last model (and bigger than the NX AND CRV bootspace)
		
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love the look of the Tiguan!


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## Aztecs27 (May 27, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			love the look of the Tiguan!
		
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Yep it's stunning! it looks like a less fat Q5.


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## stokie_93 (May 27, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Yep it's stunning! it looks like a less fat Q5.
		
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nothing on the Touareg though.

Was stuck behind the R version of one of them the other week. Was beautiful.


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## Aztecs27 (May 27, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			nothing on the Touareg though.

Was stuck behind the R version of one of them the other week. Was beautiful.
		
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Yea, but the Toureg gets about 3 miles to the gallon! Absolute bohemoth of a car!


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## stokie_93 (May 27, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Yea, but the Toureg gets about 3 miles to the gallon! Absolute bohemoth of a car!
		
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something that looks that mean should do no more than 2 miles to the gallon


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## Three (May 27, 2016)

Personally I found that paying to rent a car, then give it back, was one of the most moronic things I ever did in my life, financially speaking. 
I leased a brand new Saab for 18 months, yeah great at the time.  And then what? All  that money gone and nothing to show for it. 

Stokie, please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't you make a comment on another thread about moving out of home? ie you're living with your parents still?    Again, apologies if I got that wrong, but if that is the case, leasing a lump of tin is really really stupid.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 27, 2016)

When does anyone make a profit on a car? Never been convinced that buying makes financial sense any more than leasing. You lose money either way. Don't forget the tyre kicking salesman who offers you diddly for your car as a trade in.


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## Deleted member 18588 (May 27, 2016)

Exactly!
When I leased my current car the salesman spent ages trying to convince me to buy rather than lease (commission for him as opposed to figures for their leasing arm).
Why would I buy something that is only ever going to depreciate in value?
If I lease all I am paying the leasing company for is the depreciation on the vehicle plus a small margin for them.
If I had bought that same car it would be worth the same either way but I am stuck with a vehicle that I either have to sell privately or trade in and take a hit.
No thanks!


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## gripitripit (May 27, 2016)

Lease a brand new car for 2 years @ Â£135 a month (Mrs corsa) or spend 3.5k on a second hand car. After 2 years what is your second hand car worth and how much have you sent on it when it goings wrong? 
No brainer IMO


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## Smiffy (May 28, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			When I leased my current car the salesman spent ages trying to convince me to buy rather than lease
		
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That might be because if _*he*_ demonstrated the car to you, and carried out the test drive, he was just trying to earn a living.


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## Deleted member 18588 (May 28, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			That might be because if _*he*_ demonstrated the car to you, and carried out the test drive, he was just trying to earn a living.
		
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But I had advised him from the outset that I was looking to lease a vehicle.


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## Smiffy (May 28, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			But I had advised him from the outset that I was looking to lease a vehicle.
		
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His fault then.
If it had been me, I would have advised you to go to the leasing company for a demo


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## DCB (May 28, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			His fault then.
If it had been me, I would have advised you to go to the leasing company for a demo


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&#128513;&#128514;&#128513;


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## DCB (May 28, 2016)

Lived for 20 years in " company car " world.  Had the option to lease, but stayed within the car scheme. Left that cosy world and had to find my own wheels. Leasing looked an option until I tallied up all the costs associated with a given make/model and the mileage I'd be doing. Small print is small for a reason  Ended up buying as it did indeed work out slightly more cost effective.


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## vkurup (May 28, 2016)

Always been on a PCP, so never been a problem with them.   Just seen another about *Personal Contract Hire* - anyone use this option.  The difference between the PCP and the PCH is the low upfront and low monthly but no option for a balloon payment at the end to keep it.  
I fancy at Volvo XC60.. the PCH option works out to about 2K deposit + 330 monthly!!!.. have not compared the PCP option yet.   I am looking for a XC60, so if anyone knows a good deal going around, do shout


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## Deleted member 18588 (May 28, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			His fault then.
If it had been me, I would have advised you to go to the leasing company for a demo


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Honda CR-V leased through Honda. Marshalls Leicester was the dealership but all leased vehicles apparently supplied via their York branch.

I can understand the Leicester salesman and his manager being pee'd off but that's down to Marshalls to sort out.

Either way I still would not put a large chunk of my cash into an asset that will lose around Â£3000 the moment it leaves the forecourt.


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## Aztecs27 (May 28, 2016)

So just taken the NX for a test drive. Lovely vehicle. I wouldn't be considering it if my Dad didn't work there but with the deal they can give it seems like a no brainier. 

Can't comment on fuel economy really, but seems real world normal driving (cruising at 80 on the motorway and not driving like a total bell all the time) will give 42-45 mpg. Ride is slightly firm (we were in and F sport whic my has stiffened suspension but it was still much better than my Mk 4 Mondeo titanium). 

It's definitely not a drivers car. Doesn't fling you about though and it's not like you think you're going to roll it, but it's not something you'd buy to drive for fun on the weekends. Does have enough poke to overtake which is fine for me. It's quiet, REALLY comfy and has everything you'd need. 

Basically, if we can get a decent deal on servicing, all signs point to us buying one as the wife really likes it.


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## vkurup (May 28, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			So just taken the NX for a test drive. Lovely vehicle. I wouldn't be considering it if my Dad didn't work there but with the deal they can give it seems like a no brainier. 

Can't comment on fuel economy really, but seems real world normal driving (cruising at 80 on the motorway and not driving like a total bell all the time) will give 42-45 mpg. Ride is slightly firm (we were in and F sport whic my has stiffened suspension but it was still much better than my Mk 4 Mondeo titanium). 

It's definitely not a drivers car. Doesn't fling you about though and it's not like you think you're going to roll it, but it's not something you'd buy to drive for fun on the weekends. Does have enough poke to overtake which is fine for me. It's quiet, REALLY comfy and has everything you'd need. 

Basically, if we can get a decent deal on servicing, all signs point to us buying one as the wife really likes it.
		
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the NX is not on our list (yet).. does it take a big golf bag without dropping the back seats? 
The other one on our list is the Kia Sportage..  but the 2016 design change is set to divide opninion ... anyone looking at the 2016 Kia Sportage?


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## triple_bogey (May 28, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			So just taken the NX for a test drive. Lovely vehicle. I wouldn't be considering it if my Dad didn't work there but with the deal they can give it seems like a no brainier. 

Can't comment on fuel economy really, but seems real world normal driving (cruising at 80 on the motorway and not driving like a total bell all the time) will give 42-45 mpg. Ride is slightly firm (we were in and F sport whic my has stiffened suspension but it was still much better than my Mk 4 Mondeo titanium). 

It's definitely not a drivers car. Doesn't fling you about though and it's not like you think you're going to roll it, but it's not something you'd buy to drive for fun on the weekends. Does have enough poke to overtake which is fine for me. It's quiet, REALLY comfy and has everything you'd need. 

Basically, if we can get a decent deal on servicing, all signs point to us buying one as the wife really likes it.
		
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Which model did you go for? The 300H or 200T? I'm looking at getting the 300H as the family car.


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## Aztecs27 (May 28, 2016)

vkurup said:



			the NX is not on our list (yet).. does it take a big golf bag without dropping the back seats? 
The other one on our list is the Kia Sportage..  but the 2016 design change is set to divide opninion ... anyone looking at the 2016 Kia Sportage?
		
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Couldn't say for sure, but I suspect it probably does. Not a huge boot, but big enough. We got our dog crate in there.



triple_bogey said:



			Which model did you go for? The 300H or 200T? I'm looking at getting the 300H as the family car.
		
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300H. Its absolutely fine for a family car.


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## JohnnyDee (May 29, 2016)

After 30 years of having had a company car supplied I switched to leasing end of last month and love it. Just sorry I never did it 20 years ago. 

Got a car that I speced up with everything that I wanted, no jobsworth fleet manager moaning about what wasn't in my allowance and I love it! What's more no need to worry about it having to be given back if job bellies up.

Happy days!:thup:


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## stokie_93 (May 31, 2016)

Three said:



			Personally I found that paying to rent a car, then give it back, was one of the most moronic things I ever did in my life, financially speaking. 
I leased a brand new Saab for 18 months, yeah great at the time.  And then what? All  that money gone and nothing to show for it. 

Stokie, please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't you make a comment on another thread about moving out of home? ie you're living with your parents still?    Again, apologies if I got that wrong, but if that is the case, leasing a lump of tin is really really stupid.
		
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I know where I stand with my finances thanks buddy.

Cheers for your concern though! :thup:


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## Aztecs27 (May 31, 2016)

Bah. Having second thoughts on the commitment of the NX (as much as both me and my wife want one!)...Such a good deal, but still money that we could use for her 30th/a holiday/overpaying the mortgage or whatever...

One way or another a decision will be made before the end of the week.


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## Rooter (May 31, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Bah. Having second thoughts on the commitment of the NX (as much as both me and my wife want one!)...Such a good deal, but still money that we could use for her 30th/a holiday/overpaying the mortgage or whatever...

One way or another a decision will be made before the end of the week.
		
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I'm with you dude, i used to spend a fortune a month on cars whether thats loan payments, lease, finance etc. Now i couldn't think of a worse thing to have a huge monthly bill for! I looked at some of the sites the guys have listed and looked a few cars i would 'like' then realise that they are all 4/500 a month +! I can do a lot with 4/500 quid a month! 

I suppose its about priorities, wants, needs, desires, but for me now, a car is low on the list. Family holidays, renovating the house, new extension trump a car. Each to their own though! I have a mate who is doing OK, DINKI and spends about 1000 a month on his finance for his M3. He loves it and is happy! That just makes me shudder!

If you want it and can afford it, do it.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 31, 2016)

VW have just announce another big dip in profits due to the emmissions scandal. May be worth looking at a VW dealer as I suspect they will be offering some tasty offers at the moment to bring people back into the fold.


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## MegaSteve (May 31, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			VW have just announce another big dip in profits due to the emmissions scandal. May be worth looking at a VW dealer as I suspect they will be offering some tasty offers at the moment to bring people back into the fold.
		
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If my mates recent experience of trying to do a deal with them is anything to go by... Then, no chance of any 'deals'... Still adopting the high and mighty we've done nothing to be ashamed of approach... In the 'states, it would seem, they're bending over backwards to right their wrong but clearly don't feel disposed to do so in Europe...


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## Aztecs27 (May 31, 2016)

Rooter said:



			I'm with you dude, i used to spend a fortune a month on cars whether thats loan payments, lease, finance etc. Now i couldn't think of a worse thing to have a huge monthly bill for! I looked at some of the sites the guys have listed and looked a few cars i would 'like' then realise that they are all 4/500 a month +! I can do a lot with 4/500 quid a month! 

I suppose its about priorities, wants, needs, desires, but for me now, a car is low on the list. Family holidays, renovating the house, new extension trump a car. Each to their own though! I have a mate who is doing OK, DINKI and spends about 1000 a month on his finance for his M3. He loves it and is happy! That just makes me shudder!

If you want it and can afford it, do it.
		
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Yea, we need a car (exhaust is just about done on the Mondeo!) and do quite a few long journeys a year so the peace of mind that we're unlikely to breakdown is good. But the deal we've been offered is very good (Â£380 a month for a car with spectacular standard equip) and we can afford it and still have money left over at the end of the month but any weekends/unexpected payments would significantly eat into the extra we're left with ad it isn't that much! 

Trouble is, it's such a good deal that any other cars of similar size/spec that I've looked at come in at around the same amount due to the discount we're getting! And a smaller car isn't s realistic option. 



Lord Tyrion said:



			VW have just announce another big dip in profits due to the emmissions scandal. May be worth looking at a VW dealer as I suspect they will be offering some tasty offers at the moment to bring people back into the fold.
		
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Well they can't be too desperate. I spoke to them on Friday and requested so numbers on a new Tiguan and said I'm ready to buy. Not heard a peep since.


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## stokie_93 (May 31, 2016)

MegaSteve said:



			If my mates recent experience of trying to do a deal with them is anything to go by... Then, no chance of any 'deals'... Still adopting the high and mighty we've done nothing to be ashamed of approach... In the 'states, it would seem, they're bending over backwards to right their wrong but clearly don't feel disposed to do so in Europe...
		
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they're still fantastic cars at the end of the day...


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## MegaSteve (May 31, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			they're still fantastic cars at the end of the day...
		
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As against what?


Thus far my lad has had three letters advising/confirming his vehicle is amongst the 'problem' ones and that's it...

"A solution is being worked on"... Doesn't really cut it...

Not really great customer service... Last VAG product he buys...


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## stokie_93 (May 31, 2016)

MegaSteve said:



			As against what?


Thus far my lad has had three letters advising/confirming his vehicle is amongst the 'problem' ones and that's it...

"A solution is being worked on"... Doesn't really cut it...

Not really great customer service... Last VAG product he buys...
		
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If they gave an honest showing of their emissions, would you have still purchased the car?

Not sure about anyone else but unless the emissions massively affects my tax for the year I rarely let it affect my choice.

Just out of curiosity, since the scandal came out how has it affected your son? Did his car get recalled?


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## Lord Tyrion (May 31, 2016)

Do I believe the emissions figures given out? No. Do I believe the mpg figures given out? No. Both are lab driven and false. Emissions figures are for tax purposes only but the govt are not going to alter the VW figures and hit owners retrospectively. The scandal is bad pr for VW but has no impact on drivers or owners.


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## MegaSteve (May 31, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			Just out of curiosity, since the scandal came out how has it affected your son? Did his car get recalled?
		
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As per my post... Some letters and that's it....

Won't know the full impact until he comes to trade it in...
Sure the VAG group won't mark it down but don't know how other groups will view it...


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## stokie_93 (May 31, 2016)

MegaSteve said:



			As per my post... Some letters and that's it....

Won't know the full impact until he comes to trade it in...
Sure the VAG group won't mark it down but don't know how other groups will view it...
		
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but other than the letters there's been no issue with the car etc?

As far as i've seen the cost of the cars hasn't depreciated in any way...

Hope he doesn't get stung by it though.


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## vkurup (May 31, 2016)

VW is paying out substantial amount of money to US drivers and doing buy backs.  No such luck in the UK.  Now if only we were not part of the EU, we could have control over our own air and set new NOx targets and get them to payout.  This is a good reason to leave the EU!!



Aztecs27 said:



			Well they can't be too desperate. I spoke to them on Friday and requested so numbers on a new Tiguan and said I'm ready to buy. Not heard a peep since.
		
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Keenly looking at the Tiguan,none available for a test drive for another 2 weeks.  Looks like a good car. let me know what kind of deals u get and i we can compare notes.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 1, 2016)

Well, you only live once...Just ordered (not on Lease) a brand new Lexus NX Luxury (with navigation)...It's a lot of money, but with the discount we've been given, it was an offer too good not to take up.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 1, 2016)

Please update every so often once you have it. You can't beat real drivers experiences rather than motoring journo's. It could tempt a few on here if they have got it right. 

I remember a while ago reading that about 70% of Lexus drivers also play golf so they do a lot of golf related promotions, golf days etc. Maybe you will benefit there as well.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 1, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Please update every so often once you have it. You can't beat real drivers experiences rather than motoring journo's. It could tempt a few on here if they have got it right. 

I remember a while ago reading that about 70% of Lexus drivers also play golf so they do a lot of golf related promotions, golf days etc. Maybe you will benefit there as well.
		
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Been reading the Lexus owners forum - mostly positive stuff there. Main sticking point is MPG (as has already been highlighted), but some are getting 40+ others are struggling to get 35mpg...

I'm hoping to be in the former camp so my wallet isn't taking as much of a hit compared to the 44 I was getting in the Mondeo - but it's a gorgeous car - can't wait to pick it up in 3 weeks.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 2, 2016)

If you go on a forum of any relatively new car you will see the most active threads are usually mpg related and how people feel cheated. When I got my current car I also looked at a Mazda CX-5. That had been out about 6 months and was getting rave reviews in the motoring press. The Mazda forum was full of angry drivers getting nowhere near the promised figures. The same applied to most other cars I was looking at. The anger subsided on older models as by then people had been able to do their homework/speak to others who had the same model and could establish the real mpg figure, not the fantasy figure given out by the mfrs. I'm hoping you can get the mid 40's figure as that is my bottom line figure and that would bring this car into my area for the next change.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			If you go on a forum of any relatively new car you will see the most active threads are usually mpg related and how people feel cheated. When I got my current car I also looked at a Mazda CX-5. That had been out about 6 months and was getting rave reviews in the motoring press. The Mazda forum was full of angry drivers getting nowhere near the promised figures. The same applied to most other cars I was looking at. The anger subsided on older models as by then people had been able to do their homework/speak to others who had the same model and could establish the real mpg figure, not the fantasy figure given out by the mfrs. I'm hoping you can get the mid 40's figure as that is my bottom line figure and that would bring this car into my area for the next change.
		
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Exactly, people that listen to the mfr's numbers are always going to be disappointed! I never really drive like a loon, so would hope I can get semi-decent numbers...if not, I'll just have to appreciate how nice the car is! And if it's really bad, I'll trade it back to Lexus and buy a CT200 or something!


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## USER1999 (Jun 2, 2016)

There seem to be quite a few on here happy to put up with driving a tortoise with a hernia, with poor fuel consumption, and a four wheel drive system they will never need, in order to look down on people from their lofty cabin.

Don't get 4x4s, they are rubbish!


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 2, 2016)

Lots of 4 x 4 looking cars are actually only FWD now. I suspect 75%, probably more, of XC60, X3, Q5 etc are FWD with exceptions being AWD. Even those are now running systems where 2 wheels are running most of the time and 4 only when they sense slippage. 

Advantage of that type of car, easier to get in and out of (wait until you get a sore back / knees and you will understand), roomier cabin, pleasant driving position. I have a FWD XC60. Fast when I need it, cruises beautifully and I get around 45mpg on a daily basis. Full AWD cars are unnecessary for most people but as I say, most that you see will not be that type.


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## USER1999 (Jun 2, 2016)

I had a big 7 seat Toyota 4x4 in NZ at Xmas.  It was fast, and to my mind, dangerously unstable for the speeds it could do. I also found the driving position really uncomfortable. Each to their own!


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 2, 2016)

I could not drive a Q7, XC90 or similar, probably a similar size to the one you describe. Big beasts designed for American freeways. The smaller ones, all relative of course, give you the benefits without the wobble.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Our (aka my wife's) criteria was a 'big' car with a hatchback...Unfortunately you don't get many 'saloon' style cars with this any more and HID didn't want an estate as they "look like a hearse" (in Murph's case, it actually IS a hearse - unless he's got rid) 

The Mondeo seems to be the last one that has it - and even the new one, although looks great, is finished poorly inside (compared to the previous guise. So a 'Crossover' was our only other option.


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## USER1999 (Jun 2, 2016)

Still fully hearsed up!


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Top man!


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## Rooter (Jun 2, 2016)

Have 4 kids and not want to drive an espace/Galaxy/people carrier and see what you end up with...

It will be an x5, xc90 or q7. I tried them all and the xc90 was by far the best value for money.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Rooter said:



			Have 4 kids and not want to drive an espace/Galaxy/people carrier and see what you end up with...

It will be an x5, xc90 or q7. I tried them all and the xc90 was by far the best value for money.
		
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The new ones look the absolute business too!


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## Rooter (Jun 2, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			The new ones look the absolute business too!
		
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Don't, I get XC90 envy every time i see one! Mine is a 2010... :-(


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Rooter said:



			Don't, I get XC90 envy every time i see one! Mine is a 2010... :-(
		
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That was like me with my Mk4 Mondeo when I saw one of the new ones...That is until I sat in one...Put me right off them! Perhaps that's the answer?  (probably not, as the interior of the new XC90 looks awesome  )


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## Rooter (Jun 2, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			That was like me with my Mk4 Mondeo when I saw one of the new ones...That is until I sat in one...Put me right off them! Perhaps that's the answer?  (probably not, as the interior of the new XC90 looks awesome  )
		
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It's not at all! The new xc90 I would buy over the Audi and BMW. A truly stunning place to sit!


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 2, 2016)

Rooter said:



			It's not at all! The new xc90 I would buy over the Audi and BMW. A truly stunning place to sit!
		
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Thought as much! That is a lot of the reason I just bought the Lexus.


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## gripitripit (Jun 2, 2016)

murphthemog said:



			There seem to be quite a few on here happy to put up with driving a tortoise with a hernia, with poor fuel consumption, and a four wheel drive system they will never need, in order to look down on people from their lofty cabin.

Don't get 4x4s, they are rubbish!
		
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Lovely driving position and view from my Range Rover and you are right. No intention of going off road especially with low profile 22" tyres. And again bang on with the mpg...22 to the gallon. But very comfortable all the same.


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## Smiffy (Jun 4, 2016)

murphthemog said:



			There seem to be quite a few on here happy to put up with driving a tortoise with a hernia, with poor fuel consumption, and a four wheel drive system they will never need, in order to look down on people from their lofty cabin.

Don't get 4x4s, they are rubbish!
		
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murphthemog said:



			I had a big 7 seat Toyota 4x4 in NZ at Xmas.  It was fast, and to my mind, dangerously unstable for the speeds it could do. I also found the driving position really uncomfortable. Each to their own!
		
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I drove down through France last year on holiday in a new X-Trail 7 seater.
1.6 Diesel engine, and Automatic too. Got everything in there including all my fishing gear with masses of room to spare.
Superb comfort (no aches or pains after 5 hours non-stop), 80-90 most of the way down (just ticking over at 3,000 revs), and returned an average of 52.3 to the gallon.
I'm off again in 4 weeks time and will be taking the same motor again.
Not worried about the drive down at all.


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## vkurup (Jun 4, 2016)

Had a look at the new Tiguan... very aggressively styles (was sitting in the R-line)... but the boot is tiny.  It seems more like a souped up Golf rather than a big crossover.  Earlier in the day had a look at the XC60.  very spacious, but compared to the styling of the Tiguan, the XC60 feels ancient. Am looking fwd to taking a XC60 D4 2-wheel drive for a spin on Monday


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 4, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Had a look at the new Tiguan... very aggressively styles (was sitting in the R-line)... but the boot is tiny.  It seems more like a souped up Golf rather than a big crossover.  Earlier in the day had a look at the XC60.  very spacious, but compared to the styling of the Tiguan, the XC60 feels ancient. Am looking fwd to taking a XC60 D4 2-wheel drive for a spin on Monday
		
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Glad to hear about the tiny boot. Confirms we made the right decision in not waiting to try one (still not heard from the VW dealership for what it's worth!). Not that the boot in the NX is massive by any stretch but big enough for our needs.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 4, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Had a look at the new Tiguan... very aggressively styles (was sitting in the R-line)... but the boot is tiny.  It seems more like a souped up Golf rather than a big crossover.  Earlier in the day had a look at the XC60.  very spacious, but compared to the styling of the Tiguan, the XC60 feels ancient. Am looking fwd to taking a XC60 D4 2-wheel drive for a spin on Monday
		
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I have an XC60 D4, 2WD, manual. Had it for 2 years now. If you have any questions fire away. As a freebie, in winter I get 40-42mpg, in summer 43-45mpg. On a motorway run you can get around 48mpg if you drive on or just under the limit. If you go over it drops quickly. Lovely cruiser and the best seats out there.


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## MC72 (Jun 5, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I have an XC60 D4, 2WD, manual. Had it for 2 years now. If you have any questions fire away. As a freebie, in winter I get 40-42mpg, in summer 43-45mpg. On a motorway run you can get around 48mpg if you drive on or just under the limit. If you go over it drops quickly. Lovely cruiser and the best seats out there.
		
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I had an xc60 AWD for a couple of years and found it very practical, ie big boot, and comfortable for long journeys. The economy was around mid-late 30s mpg generally although may get into the 40s on a run (2.4D 5cyl engine). I had the manual and it was not a great car for those who enjoy driving, and didn't handle that well. Most accurate way of describing it would be "big comfortable barge". Volvo dealers are absolutely shocking, clueless and technically inept - probably not much different from most mainstream franchises. It's (xc60) miles behind most other brands now in terms of tech, and inside the car it does feel a generation behind the competition. I don't think I'd buy another Volvo.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 6, 2016)

MC - A big comfortable barge is a good description and frankly that is why I got one. If I wanted to go around hairpin bends at 60mph then I would get a German car. However I don't want to feel every bump in the road, I want to wallow and glide and the XC60 outdoes its German counterparts on that front. Also, if you want a drivers car do you really get an SUV? A different beast surely.

The dealers up in the NE, a closed shop unfortunately, are not good, no argument there. In terms of tech, the XC60 is next in line for an upgrade. All other models have been re-done recently. The main engine in the XC60, D4 it is catchily called, is new and the safety equipment is equal or ahead of all other mfrs. The central media display is poor except on the new XC90 and will presumably be rolled out onto other models over time. 

The reality is Volvo do what they always do. They offer a genui9ne alternative to the Germans. They are not a drivers car, they are not cutting edge. They are damned comfortable though and they are a great place to eat miles on a long journey.


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## Rooter (Jun 6, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			They are not a drivers car, they are not cutting edge. They are damned comfortable though and they are a great place to eat miles on a long journey.
		
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Next time yours is in the dealers for a service, go sit in the new XC90, seriously, i believe its a better car than the Q7, X5 and Range Rover.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 6, 2016)

Rooter - I wouldn't disagree with that. It looks a real step up in quality. Perhaps Volvo have poured money into this model because they know it will sell well in China and the US. My comments were more about the XC60. Incidentally, I would also suggest the new V90 is a real competitor for the Germans as well. I'm in for a service at the end of the month so I will be having a peruse then. Those two are out of my price range but a little sit in a nice car is always pleasant.


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## vkurup (Jun 6, 2016)

Test drove the xC60, liked it.  It is about 3 mth wait for a new one.  Getting a used one v/s a new one does not make sense as the new ones are on 0% APR!!! The internals of the XC90 are way too good but with the XC60 being replaced in the next 2 years, it will get a facelift.  The sales guys are fairly laid back as the XC90/60 sell by themselves

Stopped by to look at the new Tiguan.  I liked the interiors better than the Volvo.  The big shock was that it would fit my golf bag sideways!!  It has some clever cutouts in the boot, which help get the (golf) driver head into it. Havent test driven it yet.  The SL model is probably the one in contention rather than the R-line.  Had to deal with a a bit more aggressive, young sales person who put us off. 2 month wait for a new one if not in stock

Final stop was to look at the Kia Sportage.  They have changed everything inside and outside. I am not sure it was love at first sight. Will test drive it over the weekend. I could fit my sofa into the boot and still have space to play with. I need to be convinced about the sportage though the economic argument is hard to beat for it.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 6, 2016)

Don't just use the dealer. Try online places such as Drive the Deal. They use dealers and so on but they should get you the best discounts without having to speak to slimy salesmen. If you like the dealer then you can also use it as leverage. Based on the Volvo forum I dip into you should be able to get around 15-20% discount on an XC60. I suspect the Tiguan is too new to get much of a deal. I don't know about Kia's.

Have you looked at a Mazda CX-5? Worth looking at.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 6, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Test drove the xC60, liked it.  It is about 3 mth wait for a new one.  Getting a used one v/s a new one does not make sense as the new ones are on 0% APR!!! The internals of the XC90 are way too good but with the XC60 being replaced in the next 2 years, it will get a facelift.  The sales guys are fairly laid back as the XC90/60 sell by themselves

Stopped by to look at the new Tiguan.  I liked the interiors better than the Volvo.  The big shock was that it would fit my golf bag sideways!!  It has some clever cutouts in the boot, which help get the (golf) driver head into it. Havent test driven it yet.  The SL model is probably the one in contention rather than the R-line.  Had to deal with a a bit more aggressive, young sales person who put us off. 2 month wait for a new one if not in stock

Final stop was to look at the Kia Sportage.  They have changed everything inside and outside. I am not sure it was love at first sight. Will test drive it over the weekend. I could fit my sofa into the boot and still have space to play with. I need to be convinced about the sportage though the economic argument is hard to beat for it.
		
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Be careful with the 0% APR deals that they've not over inflated the OTR price or given a horribly high guaranteed future value to compensate.


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## USER1999 (Jun 6, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			I drove down through France last year on holiday in a new X-Trail 7 seater.
1.6 Diesel engine, and Automatic too. Got everything in there including all my fishing gear with masses of room to spare.
Superb comfort (no aches or pains after 5 hours non-stop), 80-90 most of the way down (just ticking over at 3,000 revs), and returned an average of 52.3 to the gallon.
I'm off again in 4 weeks time and will be taking the same motor again.
Not worried about the drive down at all.
		
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The barge I had was a bit more pokey. I think it was a 3 litre petrol, with a turbo. Flipping scary when using the kick down. Very squirmy. 
Every time I have been in a four by four, I have hated the driving position, and that includes range rovers. I guess it's probably me!


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## USER1999 (Jun 6, 2016)

Wrong about the engine, a 3.5 litre v6, with 270 horses, but no turbo. Still quick though.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 6, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			I drove down through France last year on holiday in a new X-Trail 7 seater.
1.6 Diesel engine, and Automatic too. Got everything in there including all my fishing gear with masses of room to spare.
Superb comfort (no aches or pains after 5 hours non-stop), 80-90 most of the way down (just ticking over at 3,000 revs), and returned an average of 52.3 to the gallon.
I'm off again in 4 weeks time and will be taking the same motor again.
Not worried about the drive down at all.
		
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Forgot you sold Nissan's mate. I should have enquired about the X-Trail as it's a nice looking car!


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## adam6177 (Jun 6, 2016)

murphthemog said:



			There seem to be quite a few on here happy to put up with driving a tortoise with a hernia, with poor fuel consumption, and a four wheel drive system they will never need, in order to look down on people from their lofty cabin.

Don't get 4x4s, they are rubbish!
		
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Amen.  I hate 4x4s (and SUVs) with a passion.

The ONLY reason to have one is if you need to seriously go off road..... wet leaves on your drive in Surrey or Cheshire do not count.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 6, 2016)

adam6177 said:



			Amen.  I hate 4x4s (and SUVs) with a passion.

The ONLY reason to have one is if you need to seriously go off road..... wet leaves on your drive in Surrey or Cheshire do not count.
		
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Or...if you need a larger hatched car and don't want a Mondeo, Insignia or an estate car.


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## Rooter (Jun 6, 2016)

adam6177 said:



			Amen.  I hate 4x4s (and SUVs) with a passion.

The ONLY reason to have one is if you need to seriously go off road..... wet leaves on your drive in Surrey or Cheshire do not count.
		
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What about Berkshire? A friend of mine lives at the end of a dirt track.. plus 4 kids and 2 adults don't fit in much else and refuse to drive a people carrier.


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## stokie_93 (Jun 6, 2016)

Rooter said:



			What about Berkshire? A friend of mine lives at the end of a dirt track.. plus 4 kids and 2 adults don't fit in much else and refuse to drive a people carrier.
		
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Took the words out me mouth Roots :clap:

My Nan & Grandad have a 4x4 because me Nan suffers from Arthritis and finds it easier to get in and out of a higher car. 

This a legitimate enough reason Adam?


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## USER1999 (Jun 6, 2016)

My dad has a qashkai for similar reasons,  it's tall, easy to get into, and out of, but it doesn't pretend to be an off reader.


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## USER1999 (Jun 6, 2016)

Off reader? Flipping spell Checker! Off roader.


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## Blue in Munich (Jun 6, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			The reality is Volvo do what they always do. They offer a genui9ne alternative to the Germans. *They are not a drivers car, *they are not cutting edge. They are damned comfortable though and they are a great place to eat miles on a long journey.
		
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Don't know about the current ones but the T5 derivatives were most definitely a driver's car.


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## MegaSteve (Jun 7, 2016)

From what I have seen 4x4's are very handy on the school run...
Guess they are easier to bump up the kerb for a spot of pavement parking...

The one's I don't really understand the point of are the one's that look like a fastback GT on steroids...


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## adam6177 (Jun 7, 2016)

stokie_93 said:



			This a legitimate enough reason Adam?
		
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Nope.


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## Smiffy (Jun 11, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Don't just use the dealer. Try online places such as Drive the Deal. They use dealers and so on but they should get you the best discounts without having to speak to slimy salesmen
		
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You sound like the type of "customer" us "slimy salesmen" love.
The type of "customer" who's only motivation when buying a car is how much discount you can get.
I have a few names for "customers" like you, one in particular.
I won't mention it on here because I'd get a lifetime ban.
I have been a "professional" car salesman for over 30 years. I pride myself on my honesty, integrity, and willingness to help a true customer.
I have made friends out of many of my customers, many come back to me time after time and would recommend me to their friends, family or colleagues.
Could you do us "slimy" salesmen one big favour?????
When the car you purchased from a dealer 200 miles away because he offered the biggest discount goes wrong, take it back there to get it repaired.


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## KenL (Jun 11, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			Could you do us "slimy" salesmen one big favour?????
When the car you purchased from a dealer 200 miles away because he offered the biggest discount goes wrong, take it back there to get it repaired.
		
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No need, manufacturers will pay any dealer for warranty work so they are looking for such work.

Yes, there are good and trustworthy car salespeople (and I have dealt with a few) but I am sure you agree that many are not.  They would naturally have a better reputation if this was not the case.  I hear people who sell double glazing are much worse though!

BTW - I too detest monster 4x4 cars.  Pointless, I will stick with my MINI.


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## Smiffy (Jun 11, 2016)

KenL said:



			No need, manufacturers will pay any dealer for warranty work so they are looking for such work..
		
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At a much lower rate than retail, and it's normally the discount merchants who whinge and whine about every little thing and expect a loan car when none are available.
Service department then come to sales department and nick a salesman's demonstrator to keep said whinger happy.
So the salesman ends up having to lend his own car to a person that came in to his showroom 2 months previously and wasted an hour or more of his time when they had absolutely no intention of buying the car from him in the first place.
I'd personally tell them to eff off.
I love it when salesmen are called "tyre kickers" and "slimy". 
We're not slimy when you need to do a test drive, pick up a brochure or ask for details of the car you're interested in.
But as soon as we try to earn a living by selling said car, we become the worlds worst.


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## KenL (Jun 11, 2016)

It looks like you have more contempt for potential customers than they have for car salespeople!


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## Smiffy (Jun 11, 2016)

KenL said:



			It looks like you have more contempt for potential customers than they have for car salespeople!
		
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I have no problem with potential customers Ken.
Lord Tyrion (and other discount mechants) are not_* potential*_ customers.
They are time wasters.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2016)

I've bought and leased many cars over the years. By far the majority of dealers / salesmen I have come across have been awful, amateurish, a throwback. Very few behave in a way that make me feel I could trust them. Sorry you've taken the hump but that's your industry, sort it out. There are some very good dealers I've experienced but boy are they in the minority. I'll be changing my car next year and there is a good chance it will be a Skoda. The dealer up here is well respected, I've used them before, so I will go to them again. That's how sales work. Behave with respect and you get respect back.

Go onto any car forum and you will see a mass of complaints about dealers. Your industry has a major trust issue but the word on good dealers spreads and people will travel to them. Pass on the word to your colleagues, it will help them &#128512;


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## Smiffy (Jun 11, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I'll be changing my car next year and there is a good chance it will be a Skoda. The dealer up here is well respected, I've used them before, so I will go to them again.
		
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Go there, do your test drive, spend an hour talking to the salesman.
But if you get offered the same car Â£1,000.00 cheaper elsewhere what then?


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2016)

I'll be leasing it. I don't always go for the cheapest for the reason you mentioned before, you need to build a relationship with the dealer. My current Volvo is done through my local dealer despite the cost being slightly more as the differential was close enough. Same will apply this time. It depends what the differential is. 
We all make that choice all the time, cost plus service. I know a dealer will cost more but if I see the service level is worth it I will pay it. I won't if the dealer is awful but the car is good. I won't apologise for that, that is down to the quality of the dealer and staff.


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## harpo_72 (Jun 11, 2016)

Sorry I think I fall into the not very pleasant customer category. I have usually done my research, I know what I want. The next step is to get the prices, sorry just quote, nothing else is required, small talk not necessary. 
I have to say though the PCP stuff has to be watched carefully regarding APR. My general of thumb is it has to be less than 1% and ultimate car price has to be as close as the VAT free number...


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## Three (Jun 11, 2016)

KenL said:



			It looks like you have more contempt for potential customers than they have for car salespeople!
		
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That's a totally unfair comment. 

Same thing happens in golf shops with SOME people.    They come in the shop, get free professional advice, pick up clubs, are given demo clubs to go and hit for free, including advice on the difference in shafts and various models, often given free balls to hit, then say thanks and go and buy off the Internet from the cheapest source, normally a source that can only provide photos on the Internet and absolutely no other help in the decision process. 

Then guess who they go running to for more free advice when there's a problem or they think they might have fakes? 

Obviously it's not everyone, but there are plenty out there and it's pretty similar to Smiffy's experience.


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## Three (Jun 11, 2016)

harpo_72 said:



			Sorry I think I fall into the not very pleasant customer category. I have usually done my research, I know what I want. The next step is to get the prices, sorry just quote, nothing else is required, small talk not necessary.
		
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Test drive?


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## harpo_72 (Jun 11, 2016)

Some times .. Fiesta I have had for the last 16 months I did not bother to. Everything is much of a muchness


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## Three (Jun 11, 2016)

harpo_72 said:



			Some times .. Fiesta I have had for the last 16 months I did not bother to. Everything is much of a muchness
		
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That's fair enough then.


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2016)

I have been into three dealers in my area that I have been impressed by. Audi, Mercedes and Skoda, I've not been into a Lexus dealer but their reputation is also excellent. All have been polite, respectful and most of all knowledgeable. The rest have ignored me , couldn't be bothered to find out information and had less knowledge about their cars than I had. Not knowing your product is a scandal yet I could reel off a list of dealers I've been into that glaze over when you ask them a simple question. Having knowledge creates the bond between customer and dealer. If they clearly don't know their product then what can they offer over an online site? Too many salesmen, VW is the classic up here, seem to employ people who think The Apprentice is the way forward. Not for me thanks and not for many others either.


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## TheDiablo (Jun 11, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I have been into three dealers in my area that I have been impressed by. Audi, Mercedes and Skoda, I've not been into a Lexus dealer but their reputation is also excellent. All have been polite, respectful and most of all knowledgeable. The rest have ignored me , couldn't be bothered to find out information and had less knowledge about their cars than I had. Not knowing your product is a scandal yet I could reel off a list of dealers I've been into that glaze over when you ask them a simple question. Having knowledge creates the bond between customer and dealer. If they clearly don't know their product then what can they offer over an online site? Too many salesmen, VW is the classic up here, *seem to employ people who think The Apprentice is the way forward.* Not for me thanks and not for many others either.
		
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Made me lol as from my experience its absolutely spot on, but I didnt have the words to describe it! Unfortunately the Mrs had her heart set on a Polo, luckily there are a few dealers round this way so found the best of a bad bunch


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## markyjee (Jun 11, 2016)

Looking into leasing for the first time, on the quotes I'm getting the companies are recommending "gap insurance".
Do the people who have experience of leasing normally take this or see it as a way of the companies trying to squeeze a little bit more profit?
Is their an option when taking out my car insurance to have this covered?
Cheers


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## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2016)

Not essential and I have never taken it. Maybe a friendly dealer who posts on this site &#128145; could explain the benefits?


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## Blue in Munich (Jun 11, 2016)

markyjee said:



			Looking into leasing for the first time, on the quotes I'm getting the companies are recommending "gap insurance".
Do the people who have experience of leasing normally take this or see it as a way of the companies trying to squeeze a little bit more profit?
Is their an option when taking out my car insurance to have this covered?
Cheers
		
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I've taken GAP insurance before, although not on a lease car.  Basically it should cover the difference between what you will owe on finance and what you receive for the car from your insurance company if it is totalled.  Be interested to see what they quoted you as I was offered it by the dealer when I bought the current motorcycle, declined it from him & took it out independently for considerably less money.


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## KenL (Jun 11, 2016)

Shop around for GAP insurance as it may well be more expensive from the dealer.

The biggest rip off is the offer of a sealant for hundreds of pounds that is a total waste of time.


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## full_throttle (Jun 11, 2016)

ALA for Gap Insurance, i got mine for less than Â£1 a week over 4 years, it's not essential but give peace of mind that should your car be written off you don't loose out financially when replacing like for like


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## markyjee (Jun 11, 2016)

Cheers guys, looking at a 2 year deal, 2 companies have given me quotes, one doesn't charge fees was Â£200, other charges Â£199 fees and quoted Â£150.


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## Smiffy (Jun 14, 2016)

Blue in Munich said:



			I've taken GAP insurance before, although not on a lease car.  Basically it should cover the difference between what you will owe on finance and what you receive for the car from your insurance company if it is totalled.  Be interested to see what they quoted you as I was offered it by the dealer when I bought the current motorcycle, declined it from him & took it out independently for considerably less money.
		
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Pointless taking out GAP insurance on a lease car. As the car is registered in the finance companies name, they are the ones that would benefit.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Jun 14, 2016)

markyjee said:



			Looking into leasing for the first time, on the quotes I'm getting the companies are recommending "gap insurance".
Do the people who have experience of leasing normally take this or see it as a way of the companies trying to squeeze a little bit more profit?
Is their an option when taking out my car insurance to have this covered?
Cheers
		
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Are you talking about leasing or PCP.

If leasing then no point in Gap Insurance. However, if PCP then it is generally advisable but recommend you shop around.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 14, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Are you talking about leasing or PCP.

If leasing then no point in Gap Insurance. However, if PCP then it is generally advisable but recommend you shop around.
		
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Can someone, in layman's terms, explain what GAP insurance is/does?


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## Deleted member 18588 (Jun 14, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Can someone, in layman's terms, explain what GAP insurance is/does?
		
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See BiM's post #125.

As a lease deal does not involve you in anything other than leasing the "use" of the vehicle and there is no option to complete a purchase at the end of the term and thus there is not a figure owed during the term there is no gap between the value of the vehicle and any amount "owed".


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 14, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			See BiM's post #125.

As a lease deal does not involve you in anything other than leasing the "use" of the vehicle and there is no option to complete a purchase at the end of the term and thus there is not a figure owed during the term there is no gap between the value of the vehicle and any amount "owed".
		
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Ah! might look at taking some out then.


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## Val (Jun 14, 2016)

I have 2 cars in the family, 1 on PCP where gap insurance was encouraged due to liability in the event of theft or write off. The other is leased where gap insurance wasn't even mentioned. 

Says it all if you ask me.


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## Smiffy (Jun 14, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Can someone, in layman's terms, explain what GAP insurance is/does?
		
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Most companies now offer a combination GAP/RTI policy.
GAP was/is for finance customers, RTI was/is for cash customers.
What happens now is that if you take out a combination policy, the payout will be the one that is more beneficial to the policy holder at the time of the "incident".
If you owed more on finance than the actual price of the car (as you would do *VERY* early into a finance agreement if you had only put a small deposit down) the policy will pay out under GAP.
If, on the other hand, you were well into your finance agreement and it would be more beneficial for you to be paid out under the RTI (return to invoice) side of things, that's what you would get.
Basically, if you paid Â£25,000.00 for the car and your insurance company agreed to pay you Â£15,000.00 write off value, the RTI insurance would pay you the other Â£10,000.00 to give you back all the money you paid in the first place.
But the benefit, in all instances, is that if you were to write your car off, you just phone the RTI/GAP insurance company and they will deal with your insurance compay, taking a lot of the hassle away.
Whatever you do, don't get involved with the insurance company yourself with regards payout. The RTI/GAP insurance company will go ballistic, and may in fact refuse to pay out.

And just to repeat. If you are LEASING your car, there is absolutely not benefit to you in taking out GAP/RTI cover.
If you are buying on a PCP or other form of finance where you "effectively" own the car I would recommend it.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 14, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			Most companies now offer a combination GAP/RTI policy.
GAP was/is for finance customers, RTI was/is for cash customers.
What happens now is that if you take out a combination policy, the payout will be the one that is more beneficial to the policy holder at the time of the "incident".
If you owed more on finance than the actual price of the car (as you would do *VERY* early into a finance agreement if you had only put a small deposit down) the policy will pay out under GAP.
If, on the other hand, you were well into your finance agreement and it would be more beneficial for you to be paid out under the RTI (return to invoice) side of things, that's what you would get.
Basically, if you paid Â£25,000.00 for the car and your insurance company agreed to pay you Â£15,000.00 write off value, the RTI insurance would pay you the other Â£10,000.00 to give you back all the money you paid in the first place.
But the benefit, in all instances, is that if you were to write your car off, you just phone the RTI/GAP insurance company and they will deal with your insurance compay, taking a lot of the hassle away.
Whatever you do, don't get involved with the insurance company yourself with regards payout. The RTI/GAP insurance company will go ballistic, and may in fact refuse to pay out.

And just to repeat. If you are LEASING your car, there is absolutely not benefit to you in taking out GAP/RTI cover.
If you are buying on a PCP or other form of finance where you "effectively" own the car I would recommend it.
		
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Cheers Rob! Most helpful. :thup:


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## vkurup (Jun 15, 2016)

Question for *Smiffy and others who work in dealership*.   Am trying to compare two PCP deals. These are for 2 different cars so the quotes are not like for like. How is the residual value of the car determined?  In the past another dealer has "managed" the residual value to achieve a certain monthly figure for us. One of the dealers we are dealing with has said that the residual value is determined by the finance company and therefore cannot change.   
1) So who sets the residual value?
2) At the end of the contract, the car could be worth less or more. If the market value is more then, I can trade it in.  But if the market value is less, can get the difference back? #cheeky :rofl:


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## Smiffy (Jun 15, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Question for *Smiffy and others who work in dealership*.   Am trying to compare two PCP deals. These are for 2 different cars so the quotes are not like for like. How is the residual value of the car determined?  In the past another dealer has "managed" the residual value to achieve a certain monthly figure for us. One of the dealers we are dealing with has said that the residual value is determined by the finance company and therefore cannot change.   
1) So who sets the residual value?
2) At the end of the contract, the car could be worth less or more. If the market value is more then, I can trade it in.  But if the market value is less, can get the difference back? #cheeky :rofl:
		
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The residual value is set by the finance company. They are the ones that are guaranteeing the value subject to mileage, condition etc. 
The final figure can be manipulated "down" by the salesman to get to a figure that is acceptable to the customer (they might (might)) want to pay more a month and not have so much at the end, but on a true PCP the end figure cannot be inflated.
You normally have 3 options at the end of the agreement.
1) Pay the end figure and keep the car
2) Trade the car in, and anything you get over and above the optional final payment would go as desposit on your new car.
3) Hand the car in and walk away with nothing further to pay apart from excess mileage charges or for damage over and above what could be construed as fair wear and tear.
You could of course sell the car and keep anything over and above the final payment still owing, but trying to sell a 3 year old car privately is always a bit of a gamble.


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 15, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			The residual value is set by the finance company. They are the ones that are guaranteeing the value subject to mileage, condition etc. 
The final figure can be manipulated "down" by the salesman to get to a figure that is acceptable to the customer (they might (might)) want to pay more a month and not have so much at the end, but on a true PCP the end figure cannot be inflated.
You normally have 3 options at the end of the agreement.
1) Pay the end figure and keep the car
2) Trade the car in, and anything you get over and above the optional final payment would go as desposit on your new car.
3) Hand the car in and walk away with nothing further to pay apart from excess mileage charges or for damage over and above what could be construed as fair wear and tear.
You could of course sell the car and keep anything over and above the final payment still owing, but trying to sell a 3 year old car privately is always a bit of a gamble.
		
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Should be noted that depending on the manufacturer/finance company, the guaranteed future value may be set relatively conservatively (or not)...(correct me if I'm wrong here Rob!)

From what I can gather, based on quotes we were given for comparison and looking at residual values for models that are 3 years old - Mercedes GFV is absolutely appalling, and you won't have much chance of having any equity in the car. Honda's seemed quite competitive, and the one we got for our NX was about 16k - so unless we rag the nuts off it and cover a lot more than our contracted mileage, I would like to think we'd have equity in the NX to trade in after 3 years. 

There's also always the option of trading up early, which can be useful when newer models are released or promotions are run (lower interest rates etc).


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## Smiffy (Jun 15, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			There's also always the option of trading up early, which can be useful when newer models are released or promotions are run (lower interest rates etc).
		
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Not always easy when you are on a PCP.
Not only will you have the final payment to consider, but also possibly 12 months of payments too (if you tried to trade in after 24 months of a 3 year deal for instance).


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## Aztecs27 (Jun 15, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			Not always easy when you are on a PCP.
Not only will you have the final payment to consider, but also possibly 12 months of payments too (if you tried to trade in after 24 months of a 3 year deal for instance).
		
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Good to know. To be honest, I'll leave it to my Dad and the Finance manager at Lexus to sort anything like that out with us. They've mentioned that they will always keep an eye and sort us out if there's a better deal to be had and sort out all of the finer details, but I don't know whether this is a friends and family benefit or something they do for all customers. 

I'm gutted I didn't arrange to pop down your way to try an X-Trail before we got the Lexus, as I really like the look of it! Might give you a shout in 3 years though mate?


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## NWJocko (Jun 15, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Good to know. To be honest, I'll leave it to my Dad and the Finance manager at Lexus to sort anything like that out with us. They've mentioned that they will always keep an eye and sort us out if there's a better deal to be had and sort out all of the finer details, but I don't know whether this is a friends and family benefit or something they do for all customers. 

I'm gutted I didn't arrange to pop down your way to try an X-Trail before we got the Lexus, as I really like the look of it! Might give you a shout in 3 years though mate? 

Click to expand...

They all do it if it's beneficial (i.e. they aren't losing out and you are tied into a new deal that is longer), Honda have done it with me a couple of times, not that we've changed yet right enough but that's more to do with the Mrs being indecisive!

I quite like the look of the new X Trail aswell, the Mrs wants a new Discovery


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## vkurup (Jun 15, 2016)

Smiffy said:



			The residual value is set by the finance company. They are the ones that are guaranteeing the value subject to mileage, condition etc. 
The final figure can be manipulated "down" by the salesman to get to a figure that is acceptable to the customer (they might (might)) want to pay more a month and not have so much at the end, but on a true PCP the end figure cannot be inflated.
You normally have 3 options at the end of the agreement.
1) Pay the end figure and keep the car
2) Trade the car in, and anything you get over and above the optional final payment would go as desposit on your new car.
3) Hand the car in and walk away with nothing further to pay apart from excess mileage charges or for damage over and above what could be construed as fair wear and tear.
You could of course sell the car and keep anything over and above the final payment still owing, but trying to sell a 3 year old car privately is always a bit of a gamble.
		
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Tnx Smiffy.. much appreciated.


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## Foxholer (Jun 15, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			...
I quite like the look of the new X Trail aswell, *the Mrs wants a new Discovery* 

Click to expand...

Certainly if you go this way (or maybe even with similar), be very careful near supermarket bollards! Mate of mine just changed to a Discovery (from an AMG 6.3 Merc wagon!!) and 'encountered' this issue! Repair guys immediately predicted how it was done and stated that it was the most common prang - with new door normally required! I've seen 2 more with tell-tale scrapes since!


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## karlcole (Oct 24, 2016)

hows everyone getting on with the leasing? Any regrets? im seriosuly condiering a kia sportage if anyones got on advice on what those are like?


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## vkurup (Oct 24, 2016)

karlcole said:



			hows everyone getting on with the leasing? Any regrets? im seriosuly condiering a kia sportage if anyones got on advice on what those are like?
		
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Looked at the Sportage..  It has all the mod-cons.. everything good about whats under the hood.  What we did not fancy was what is above it.  The new look did not work for us (unless you go for the first edition), the interiors has more space than my garage and you could fit all of Rooter's kid and he would have space to have some more    Did not like the quality of the interiors.  The deals on offer were pretty good.  However, at the end went for a Volvo XC60.. no regrets


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## karlcole (Oct 24, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Looked at the Sportage..  It has all the mod-cons.. everything good about whats under the hood.  What we did not fancy was what is above it.  The new look did not work for us (unless you go for the first edition), the interiors has more space than my garage and you could fit all of Rooter's kid and he would have space to have some more    Did not like the quality of the interiors.  The deals on offer were pretty good.  However, at the end went for a Volvo XC60.. no regrets
		
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i know how you feel i hate the new shape ideally want one of the olders ones but obviously having issues trying to find one on lease! good to hear about all the storage though! Thanks for the heads up though!


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## karlcole (Oct 24, 2016)

Which company did you use mate?


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## stokie_93 (Oct 24, 2016)

Ended up buying a car in the end 2nd hand. A good friends uni housemate moved over to Florida to work in golf over there so ended up selling his car. 

Got a mint Vauxhall Corsa with 8k on the clock for a very good price so will do me for the next few years fingers crossed.


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## kerber0s1983 (Oct 24, 2016)

I looked at the Sportage - but the boot is very small for the size of car - couldn't get my bag and motocaddy in the boot without taking clubs out and/or folding seats down, as i leave everything in the boot whilst away with work.

I ended up leasing a Nissan X Trail through nationwide vehicle contracts. Had it 7 months and can't fault the car or service from them - plus they were the cheapest for the car i was after.

Although i'm going to end up paying a bit in excessive mileage at the end of the lease, as i changed jobs and my mileage has gone up quite a bit.


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## vkurup (Oct 24, 2016)

karlcole said:



			Which company did you use mate?
		
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ended up PCP rather than leasing... worked that way due to a deal via the office..


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## karlcole (Oct 24, 2016)

vkurup said:



			ended up PCP rather than leasing... worked that way due to a deal via the office..
		
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Whats the major difference between the two pal?


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## kerber0s1983 (Oct 24, 2016)

PCP you generally pay a bigger deposit and then have an option to pay an agreed value at the end to own the car, or you can still walk away.

Leasing is generally a lot lowe deposit and there is no option at the end to buy, just hand the keys back.

Both of them have excess mileage charges for going over the agreed mileage amount
https://www.carwow.co.uk/guides/financing/car-leasing-explained


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## vkurup (Oct 24, 2016)

kerber0s1983 said:



			PCP you generally pay a bigger deposit and then have an option to pay an agreed value at the end to own the car, or you can still walk away.

Leasing is generally a lot lowe deposit and there is no option at the end to buy, just hand the keys back.

Both of them have excess mileage charges for going over the agreed mileage amount
https://www.carwow.co.uk/guides/financing/car-leasing-explained

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Also at a high level, the Leasing quotes generally dont show that you need to pay VAT on it.. so dont forget to add 20% on whatever price is shown.


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## kerber0s1983 (Oct 24, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Also at a high level, the Leasing quotes generally dont show that you need to pay VAT on it.. so dont forget to add 20% on whatever price is shown.
		
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a lot of the leasing sites now ask whether it is personal or business use and if personal is selected, the VAT is included in the price - Nationwide certainly do this.


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 25, 2016)

Aztecs27 said:



			Good to know. To be honest, I'll leave it to my Dad and the Finance manager at Lexus to sort anything like that out with us. They've mentioned that they will always keep an eye and sort us out if there's a better deal to be had and sort out all of the finer details, but I don't know whether this is a friends and family benefit or something they do for all customers. 

I'm gutted I didn't arrange to pop down your way to try an X-Trail before we got the Lexus, as I really like the look of it! Might give you a shout in 3 years though mate? 

Click to expand...



How is the NX getting on, still enjoying it? 

What is the mpg average you are getting after this time?


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## Aztecs27 (Oct 25, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			How is the NX getting on, still enjoying it? 

What is the mpg average you are getting after this time?
		
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Yes mate it's great, cheers. We've covered nearly 6500k and it's just so comfortable. We had a horrendous journey from Gloucester to the Lakes, up the M6, which took over 6 hours...got out the other end feeling fresh as a daisy. Normally I'd get out and barely be able to move because my back had seized up. It's not a drivers car by any means, but it's effortlessly comfortable and convenient for our needs. 

Golf clubs fit in the back comfortably and now I'm used to the hybrid style of driving to try and get the most out of it, I'm averaging 40mpg since resetting it back on about 1000 miles...Which I'm relatively happy with to be honest. Not amazing, I'll admit and always nice to get better efficiency but for a 'big' car - it could be a lot worse. The average between fill ups can fluctuate depending on what type of driving we do a lot of, but averaging 40 is good for me.


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 25, 2016)

Thanks for the write up. I have an XC60 now, nowhere near a drivers car, so your description appeals to me. No BMW for me thank you, far too hard. 40mpg is better than I have heard elsewhere so it is good to know that is achievable.

I'm going to start the process of looking in a couple of months time and I suspect I'll be getting a spreadsheet going to work out the financial side of things. I may be beating myself up about losing 5mpg when I save the same amount elsewhere. If the overall costs are similar then I need to get over the psychological cost of the mpg figure.


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## Aztecs27 (Oct 25, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Thanks for the write up. I have an XC60 now, nowhere near a drivers car, so your description appeals to me. No BMW for me thank you, far too hard. 40mpg is better than I have heard elsewhere so it is good to know that is achievable.

I'm going to start the process of looking in a couple of months time and I suspect I'll be getting a spreadsheet going to work out the financial side of things. I may be beating myself up about losing 5mpg when I save the same amount elsewhere. If the overall costs are similar then I need to get over the psychological cost of the mpg figure.
		
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If it helps, we were getting nearly 50mpg with our Mondeo and I can't say we've noticed the difference. As the NX is adaptive 4x4 too, it means that (if the user reports I've read are accurate) the tyres should last longer than 15k which is what the Mondeo was doing, plus they're slightly cheaper too. 

I can't stress how comfortable it is to drive and how enjoyable sitting in the drivers seat is. It's a proper luxury cockpit. The ride is firm, but not bone jarring, like some reviews say...but it's never not comfortable. We don't even have the "top level" memory seats, which have adjustable lumbar support. I was worried about this, but I needn't have worried - I've had zero problems with my back whilst driving in 4 months - all my other cars I've owned have given me issues. 

With the MPG - I would say I drive "normally" - not ragging it around in Sport mode (because there's no point?), but not driving like a nun the whole time either. It's all about adapting your driving style to get the most from the car...My dad has given me a few tips, which help (ie. sticking it in sport mode when going up hill as you get 20% more throttle response, so it's actually more economical to use sport mode than just keeping it in ECO mode to struggle up the hill. It actually makes it pretty fun to try and get the most out of the electric mode (as sad as that may sound!).


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## vkurup (Oct 25, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Thanks for the write up. *I have an XC60 now*, nowhere near a drivers car, so your description appeals to me. No BMW for me thank you, far too hard. 40mpg is better than I have heard elsewhere so it is good to know that is achievable.

I'm going to start the process of looking in a couple of months time and I suspect I'll be getting a spreadsheet going to work out the financial side of things. I may be beating myself up about losing 5mpg when I save the same amount elsewhere. If the overall costs are similar then I need to get over the psychological cost of the mpg figure.
		
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Out of curiosity.. what mgp do you get on the XC60. I have a new one and it has done about 4K.. the mpg is very fickle.  If i do the usual 30 mile round trip, it gives 30-35mpg avg, but at the same time, i have take in on 400 mile round trip of mostly moterway and the I can get home with more than a quarter tank left!!.  I think early days, but wanted to know other's experience


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 25, 2016)

vkurup said:



			Out of curiosity.. what mgp do you get on the XC60. I have a new one and it has done about 4K.. the mpg is very fickle.  If i do the usual 30 mile round trip, it gives 30-35mpg avg, but at the same time, i have take in on 400 mile round trip of mostly moterway and the I can get home with more than a quarter tank left!!.  I think early days, but wanted to know other's experience
		
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It will partly depend on the model you have. I have 2.0d D4, FWD, manual. In winter I get 40-43mpg, summer 45-48mpg. In summer, me only in the car, long motorway journey, I can get 50mpg and yes I do whoop when that happens, ha ha. Unusual though. Average over the 28 months I have it I would say I get 44mpg. My journeys tend to be free flowing country roads and some dual carriageways, I dream of motorways..........I don't have to do city driving but obviously that would be bad for a car of this type, too heavy for stop start traffic.

I go on a Volvo forum and these figures are matched by others with this model. Those that have the same model but with an auto gearbox get late 30's mpg. They lose about 10-15% compared to the manual version.  

What type do you have? At a guess I am thinking either auto or the 4wd version.


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## vkurup (Oct 25, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			It will partly depend on the model you have. I have 2.0d D4, FWD, manual. In winter I get 40-43mpg, summer 45-48mpg. In summer, me only in the car, long motorway journey, I can get 50mpg and yes I do whoop when that happens, ha ha. Unusual though. Average over the 28 months I have it I would say I get 44mpg. My journeys tend to be free flowing country roads and some dual carriageways, I dream of motorways..........I don't have to do city driving but obviously that would be bad for a car of this type, too heavy for stop start traffic.

I go on a Volvo forum and these figures are matched by others with this model. Those that have the same model but with an auto gearbox get late 30's mpg. They lose about 10-15% compared to the manual version.  

What type do you have? At a guess I am thinking either auto or the 4wd version.
		
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Yes.. went for the Auto, 2WD.. its great and frugal on long drives but not so efficient on short runs despite the low weight of a 2WD as against a AWD


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 25, 2016)

Based on that you are getting pretty much the average. I don't know if that makes you feel better but at least you haven't got an odd car that is performing far worse than any other. It is performing how all that version perform. Bloomin comfy on a long journey though.


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## Big_G (Feb 15, 2017)

Sorry to dig up an old thread, but could really do with some advice from peeps who have experienced this.

The better half and I have been exploring the options of either leasing a new car or taking out a PCP

If the latter we would purely be using any capital over their estimated value towards another PCP at the end of the deal

Is it likely there would be any surplus, assuming we keep the car in good condition, I would guess it would be in the dealers interests for there to be some, as you're more likely to buy another car from them?

Really not sure which path to go down, any advice from people with experience would be appreciated as this is all new to us :thup:

I remember a motto someone told me years ago "If it appreciates buy it, if it depreciates lease it"


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## Dando (Feb 15, 2017)

i had a PCP deal on my Renault capture, which after 18 months we decided was too small for the weekends away etc we wanted to be doing so i paid to terminate it early and decided to lease a Hyundai Tucson for 2 years.

I have got my car for 2 years with a 15,000 mile per year allowance. To get the same deal with the Hyundai dealer they wanted an Â£8K deposit whereas with Nationwide Vehicle Contracts I paid Â£1K and they delivered the car to my door!


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## Big_G (Feb 15, 2017)

Dando said:



			i had a PCP deal on my Renault capture, which after 18 months we decided was too small for the weekends away etc we wanted to be doing so i paid to terminate it early and decided to lease a Hyundai Tucson for 2 years.

I have got my car for 2 years with a 15,000 mile per year allowance. To get the same deal with the Hyundai dealer they wanted an Â£8K deposit whereas with Nationwide Vehicle Contracts I paid Â£1K and they delivered the car to my door!
		
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Yes, I see from others posts Nationwide have a pretty good rep, and they don't charge extra for metallic paint in the model I'm after either, everyone else seems to


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## Oxfordcomma (Feb 15, 2017)

Saw this (slightly over the top) piece in the paper this week talking about PCP and how it's turning into a bit of an issue for manufacturers because the used car prices are not matching up to the balloon payments, so people are just handing them back. 

Got my car on a PCP at the moment, it's 2 years in to a 3-year deal and having just reviewed it with the dealer I fully expect to hand mine back this time next year as well. Apparently the car is worth Â£2K less than my balance, despite the fact that an identical model is on sale from the same dealer for Â£1K more than my balance! (Not still wound up about that, honest). 

If there isn't going to be any equity for a deposit on the next one though, I'll be looking at leasing in 12 months time rather than PCP. Same end result, and probably Â£50-100/month cheaper.


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## Oxfordcomma (Feb 15, 2017)

Be interested to hear from our resident expert Smiffy if this really is a big issue for manufacturers at the moment? Rob, any comments? My car is an Audi, the guy I did the review with reckoned he had 25 on his desk that were going to hand back.


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## Bunkermagnet (Feb 16, 2017)

Oxfordcomma said:



			Be interested to hear from our resident expert Smiffy if this really is a big issue for manufacturers at the moment? Rob, any comments? My car is an Audi, the guy I did the review with reckoned he had 25 on his desk that were going to hand back.
		
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Had heard the car leasing market was the next sub prime issue. 
I did think though that a PCP had a guaranteed value at the end of the fixed term.


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## Smiffy (Feb 16, 2017)

Oxfordcomma said:



			Be interested to hear from our resident expert Smiffy if this really is a big issue for manufacturers at the moment? Rob, any comments? My car is an Audi, the guy I did the review with reckoned he had 25 on his desk that were going to hand back.
		
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It depends on how realistic the particular manufacturer is with their MGFV. 
Some manufacturers build in unrealistically high ones.
You'll normally find that these will be on slow moving models to help get them out of the door.
For instance, Nissan set MGFV's very high on the Leaf electric cars. Some people took these out for as little as Â£90.00 a month. Who couldn't resist the lure of a brand new car for Â£90.00 a month?
But with an MGFV set at over Â£15k after two years, who were they trying to kid?
The *ONLY* option was to hand back at end of term and walk away.
We had two year old Leaf Tekna models (top of the range) for sale on our forecourt at Â£12k. So how on earth was a 2 year old one going to have a value of Â£15k????
The Qashqai on the other hand had very realistic MGFV's so it was unusual to come unstuck on one of those.
Another problem is with people putting massive great deposits down on PCP. 
You then have a problem at renewal time because payments are going to shoot up massively unless you put the same deposit down next time.


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 16, 2017)

No experience re PCP & cars but motorcycle dealers have been pushing this for a few years now and apparently one of the issues with the bikes being returned is a noticeable difference in standards between a 3 year old bike bought on HP and one bought on PCP; the PCP bikes simply aren't being maintained to the same standards as bikes that are effectively owned rather than loaned, thus affecting their worth against their value.  That might be more relevant to bikes, which are more susceptible to corrosion than cars.


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## Smiffy (Feb 16, 2017)

Blue in Munich said:



			bikes being returned is a noticeable difference in standards between a 3 year old bike bought on *HP* and one bought on* PCP*; the PCP bikes simply aren't being maintained to the same standards as bikes that are effectively owned rather than loaned
		
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Both are "loaned" mate. Both HP and PCP are Hire Purchase. You won't own the bike on either until the final payments are made.....


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 16, 2017)

Smiffy said:



			Both are "loaned" mate. Both HP and PCP are Hire Purchase. You won't own the bike on either until the final payments are made.....
		
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Realise that mate, but with the HP payments I'd say the plan is to pay it all off at the end of the loan and own it, maybe keep it; with PCP the plan seems to be hand it back.  It's a great way of hiring a new bike for a few years but a lousy way of buying it in my book.

Another point on the bike PCP's is they all seem to be getting away with around 9.9% APR on the loans, the bank keeps offering me around 3%.  Why would you take the PCP?


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## Big_G (Feb 16, 2017)

Thanks guys some really interesting answers there

Strangely it was a Nissan we were looking at, the salesman was really good, and advised us against putting too large a deposit (still don't know why it's called that?) for the reasons given by Smiffy


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## Smiffy (Feb 16, 2017)

Big_G said:



			Strangely it was a Nissan we were looking at, the salesman was really good, and advised us against putting too large a deposit (*still don't know why it's called that?*) for the reasons given by Smiffy
		
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Because that's just what it is!
A PCP deal is just a hire purchase deal with the benefits of a lower monthly payment.
Nissan are being very generous on deposit allowances on PCP whereas they are offering nothing if you take out standard hire purchase.
They want you to go onto a PCP because it has been proven, time and time again, that a PCP customer is more likely to come back to you to change than a hire purchase customer (because of the end figure).
If you buy the right car in the Nissan range, these finance deposit allowances can wipe out any interest you are paying, so it's actually better than 0% finance.


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## Smiffy (Feb 23, 2017)

Blue in Munich said:



			The bank keeps offering me around 3%.  Why would you take the PCP?
		
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I am assuming that rate is advertised as a "typical" APR.
Try to get it on the loan you are looking at, and I can almost_* guarantee *_that the rate will go up at application time.


Also, as I mentioned above, look out for "deposit allowances".
If offered, (and this is the current trend on PCP deals),  these can make a big difference to how much you actually pay back.


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## stokie_93 (Apr 3, 2017)

Very close to buying a Fiesta Zetec S (140). 

Been to test drive it today and just waiting waiting for some final quotes tomorrow!

veryyy nippy compared to what I'm used to and I'm one excited lad :whoo:


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## KenL (Apr 4, 2017)

Fiesta = good car.


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