# Same shaft, different head - Irons



## One Planer (Jan 26, 2013)

I'm off for a fitting in a couple of weeks for some irons and wedges so ill have the answer then either way but I thought i'd pose the question for you equipment experts. 

If you put the same shaft, say what I play DG R300, in: 

A blade iron head

A muscle cavity head 

A game improver head

And lastly...

A super game improver 

Would you expect to see a difference in launch angle between the different heads?

Would you expect a massive difference between heads?


----------



## kev_off_the_tee (Jan 26, 2013)

I'm definitely not an expert, but wouldn't different heads (styles, weight, materials) alter the spec of the club such as swing weight (among others) in which case I'd say a different club head could alter the launch angle


----------



## bigslice (Jan 26, 2013)

i would say yes, even if they had the same loft.


----------



## thecraw (Jan 26, 2013)

Absolutely. They will have different spin ratios, different launch etc etc. It won't be huge differences but there will be a difference in stats and figures.


----------



## MGL (Jan 26, 2013)

A blade usually has the centre of gravity designed a little higher up the club face, giving a lower trajectory. The real objective of a super-game improver head is to get the ball in the air and thus inspire confidence and will have a lower CoG. I was going to say, it will depend on the manufacturer, but no prizes for guessing who that will be..........


----------



## Imurg (Jan 26, 2013)

Centre of Gravity would be different on each head and that alone would be enough to change launch angles....


----------



## One Planer (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks for the replies. Pretty much as I thought.

Based on the above. 

Out of my 32's (Cut Muscle) and 63's (Muscle Cavity) which I'm looking at getting, again same R300 shaft, would you expect to launch higher?


----------



## Foxholer (Jan 26, 2013)

^
What these 2 say. Launch is all about CofG which will be higher in the blades than the Super GIs

Head weights will be the same - within a gram or 2 so swing weight won't be affected significantly.


----------



## Imurg (Jan 26, 2013)

I doubt you'll see much difference between them.......


----------



## duncan mackie (Jan 26, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Would you expect a massive difference between heads?
		
Click to expand...

not from a good manufacturer - that's why they adjust the lofts!

however, in practice there will be some in the hands of most golfers because different golfers atributes will get different results from different heads. in some hands these could be very large.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 27, 2013)

I've been watching a few reviews by the much debated Mark Crossfield.

He seems to like them although they launch a little low. 

That's fine by me as my 32's launch low(ish) anywho :whoo: as with my old R7's tended to be a bit on the high side.

I can get the 32's to fly higher if needed so I expect the same of the 63's.


----------



## Oddsocks (Jan 27, 2013)

In towie style .... Well jel!


----------



## Phil2511 (Jan 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I've been watching a few reviews by the much debated Mark Crossfield.

He seems to like them although they launch a little low. 

That's fine by me as my 32's launch low(ish) anywho :whoo: as with my old R7's tended to be a bit on the high side.

I can get the 32's to fly higher if needed so I expect the same of the 63's.
		
Click to expand...

What happens if like so many on here you hit the JPX825 pure?


----------



## fundy (Jan 27, 2013)

Have you tried the 63s yet? What else have you tried to compare them to to ensure they are the best option for you? Or are you openly confessing to being a complete mizzy whore and hence they are the only option?


----------



## One Planer (Jan 27, 2013)

fundy said:



			Have you tried the 63s yet? What else have you tried to compare them to to ensure they are the best option for you? Or are you openly confessing to being a complete mizzy whore and hence they are the only option? 

Click to expand...

Bit of both Steve :thup:

I've hit a friends MP62's and a second hand set of MP58's in a local AG.

Being honest I preferred the 62's over the 58's. Hence me looking towards the 63's.

The way I see it is, if I can hit the 32's well most of the time, it should be no "harder" to hit the 63's(?)



Phil2511 said:



			What happens if like so many on here you hit the JPX825 pure?
		
Click to expand...

Too chunky and too much offset. I'm looking for something with a similar top line, offset, head size and sole to the 32's.

From what I've read the 63's are close enough to fit the bill while having a small cavity for the small amount of forgiveness I think will help.


----------



## fundy (Jan 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Bit of both Steve :thup:

I've hit a friends MP62's and a second hand set of MP58's in a local AG.

Being honest I preferred the 62's over the 58's. Hence me looking towards the 63's.

The way I see it is, if I can hit the 32's well most of the time, it should be no "harder" to hit the 63's(?)



Too chunky and too much offset. I'm looking for something with a similar top line, offset, head size and sole to the 32's.

From what I've read the 63's are close enough to fit the bill while having a small cavity for the small amount of forgiveness I think will help.
		
Click to expand...

Hit anything that doesnt have Mizuno written on the back?


----------



## One Planer (Jan 27, 2013)

fundy said:



			Hit anything that doesnt have Mizuno written on the back?
		
Click to expand...

Actually a set of Nike Pro Combo's and Taylormade MC's. Wasn't overly keen on the TM but the Rorys were nice.


----------



## Region3 (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Actually a set of Nike Pro Combo's and Taylormade MC's. Wasn't overly keen on the TM but the Rorys were nice.
		
Click to expand...

I think someone has a spare set of those with S300's.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

Region3 said:



			I think someone has a spare set of those with S300's.   

Click to expand...

RickG?  :ears:

In all seriousness I'm going to pick the MP63's up Wednesday next week and I'm sticking with the same TT DG R300 shaft I have in my MP32's.

I get a good, penetrating flight and the shaft feels stable through the swing. No hook or losing it left like I'm over powering the shaft.

Is it wrong to be happy with the shaft when buying new irons or should you get custom fit regardless?  

My MP32's are standard length and lie with R300 shafts. MP63's will be basically the same, just a different head, hence the OP.

Edit: I'm also getting the wedges too :whoo: and sticking with TT DG wedge flex, exactly the same as I have in my MP-T10's as, again, I'm happy with that shaft.

Problem is choosing between the T4 and the MP-R12 :mmm:


----------



## moogie (Jan 28, 2013)

A big investment,  pricewise,  for new irons,  without taking up a custom fit opportunity......bit of a gamble id say
Some would even say foolish


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

moogie said:



			A big investment,  pricewise,  for new irons,  without taking up a custom fit opportunity......bit of a gamble id say
Some would even say foolish
		
Click to expand...

This is my point. Curious to know why is it foolish?

I have the same shaft in my MP32's hit them fine, get a flight I like and a shape that suits. What more is a fitting going to tell me other than different shafts that "may" suit.

My MP32's are standard length, loft and lie and, again, I hit them fine.

I'm essentailly keeping the same shaft and adding a different head, hence the OP.


----------



## Foxholer (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Is it wrong to be happy with the shaft when buying new irons or should you get custom fit regardless?  

Edit: I'm also getting the wedges too :whoo: and sticking with TT DG wedge flex, exactly the same as I have in my MP-T10's as, again, I'm happy with that shaft.

Problem is choosing between the T4 and the MP-R12 :mmm:
		
Click to expand...




moogie said:



			A big investment,  pricewise,  for new irons,  without taking up a custom fit opportunity......bit of a gamble id say
Some would even say foolish
		
Click to expand...

While custom fit would probably be beneficial, it is by no means essential for someone who has done some research and targeted a particular set/set-up, though now would be an appropriate time to do it. If going the Mizuno way, a trip to a Mizuno fitting centre would probably be the best 'compromise' if nearby.

Mizuno wedges have always been very good and I believe the decision is really one of looks. I prefer a straight edge rather than tear-drop, so I'd opt for the T4. 

Enjoy the new toys.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

Foxholer said:



			While custom fit would probably be beneficial, it is by no means essential for someone who has done some research and targeted a particular set/set-up, though now would be an appropriate time to do it. If going the Mizuno way, a trip to a Mizuno fitting centre would probably be the best 'compromise' if nearby.
		
Click to expand...

Isn't the naitionl fitting centre in London? If so, too far for me Foxy. 

Thing is it's not like I'm blindly doing it. The lightweight shafts I had in my previous TM sent the ball fiurther up then forward.

Tried my frinds MP series irons (67's I think) with S300 shafts. Ball flight was a little lower than what I get from the R300, but gave me very little help when I wasn't swinging well.

As I say. I find the R300 give me the flight, shape and feel I'm after. So I suppose the question is. Why change?



Foxholer said:



			Mizuno wedges have always been very good and I believe the decision is really one of looks. I prefer a straight edge rather than tear-drop, so I'd opt for the T4. 

Enjoy the new toys.
		
Click to expand...

I've looked at both and like the look of both. I suppose it will come down to what I think on the day. Kind of leaning towars the R12, but the T4 is hard to ignore.


----------



## Foxholer (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Isn't the naitionl fitting centre in London? If so, too far for me Foxy. 

Thing is it's not like I'm blindly doing it. The lightweight shafts I had in my previous TM sent the ball fiurther up then forward.

Tried my frinds MP series irons (67's I think) with S300 shafts. Ball flight was a little lower than what I get from the R300, but gave me very little help when I wasn't swinging well.

As I say. I find the R300 give me the flight, shape and feel I'm after. So I suppose the question is. Why change?
		
Click to expand...

Your research is more than most do - and seems pretty reasonable. Can't fault your logic - it's exactly the sort of thing I would have done.

National Fitting Centre is in Surrey - at Burhill - but there are Regional and Local ones too. Here's a link, though I do remember there being some 'shrinkage' a little while ago - maybe just Surrey/Berkshire area.
http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/store/fitting-centres-details.php
 It may pay to phone them and check. T'internet is useful, but not always as current as it should be!


----------



## moogie (Jan 28, 2013)

Could well be foolish........??........dunno
But u are buying on a whim,  on a guess,  on your own opinion
If i was spending the money u are,  id defo spend an hour with a fitter,  and have it confirmed,  u may well walk out with what YOU think u should be playing................but,  better than u asking me the question...........why not u answer the question
WHY NOT GO CUSTOM FIT.........??
Can think of many reasons why u should
But very few why u are so reluctant,  not to

Please enlighten


----------



## Imurg (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't think it's that much of a gamble. There won't be a huge difference in flight between the heads and the shaft is a constant.
The 64's will probably give a tad more forgiveness but other than that it's almost replaceing 1 head with a similar performing one.

As has been said time and time again, and not putting down the custom fit process, but when you go for a fitting, you take the swing you have that day and that's what the fitter sees. If you've been playing a reasonable amount and you know and like the ball flight you get from a particular set up, just changing the head for a similar one doesn't strike me as much of a risk...


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

moogie said:



			Could well be foolish........??........dunno
But u are buying on a whim,  on a guess,  on your own opinion
If i was spending the money u are,  id defo spend an hour with a fitter,  and have it confirmed,  u may well walk out with what YOU think u should be playing................but,  better than u asking me the question...........why not u answer the question
WHY NOT GO CUSTOM FIT.........??
Can think of many reasons why u should
But very few why u are so reluctant,  not to

Please enlighten
		
Click to expand...

I'm not resistant at all to the idea of a fitting :thup:

I suppose what I'm saying is I'm happy with the R300 shaft. I gives me, as I've said, the kind of flight, shape and feel that I like.

If I'm happy with the shaft, how it feels and how it plays, why change it?

I'll be honest I've never been fit for a set of irons, the only club I've ever been fitted for is a putter, but in light of the above, what am I likely to get other than more shaft options?


----------



## Region3 (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Is it wrong to be happy with the shaft when buying new irons or should you get custom fit regardless?
		
Click to expand...

I'd still try out others if it were me. The worst that can happen is that it confirms your preference.

I've had 3 new sets of irons since I started playing again.
AP2 felt great with PX
Nike felt better with S300
Mizuno now, and PX were best again.

I actually went to the Nike fitting wanting PX, but for some reason they weren't as good in that head, and TTDG were better.

Jus' sayin'.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

Region3 said:



			I'd still try out others if it were me. The worst that can happen is that it confirms your preference.
		
Click to expand...

Would you still say this Gary with the new irons being from the same manufacturer and the heads being similar?


----------



## Region3 (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Would you still say this Gary with the new irons being from the same manufacturer and the heads being similar?
		
Click to expand...

Sorry, I don't understand the question.

But, if I were going for a fitting tomorrow I'd still want to try different shafts in different heads even though I think I know what I like.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

Region3 said:



			Sorry, I don't understand the question.

But, if I were going for a fitting tomorrow I'd still want to try different shafts in different heads even though I think I know what I like.
		
Click to expand...

I edited the quote too much 

I was  trying to refer to you and how you felt different shaft felt better/worse in different iron sets, hence my previous post.

The cost of the Swing DNA and fitting process is Â£40 where I'm going, Â£25 of which is refunded with purchase of irons/clubs. I suppose for Â£15 it's worth it just to find out my stats as, well, I've never been fit and have no idea of my swing speed or other stats


----------



## moogie (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I suppose for Â£15 it's worth it just to find out my stats as, well, I've never been fit and have no idea of my swing speed or other stats 

Click to expand...



This is the right thing to do  :thup:

Never been fit before
New expensive purchase
Gotta be worth Â£15..............


----------



## One Planer (Jan 28, 2013)

moogie said:



			This is the right thing to do  :thup:

Never been fit before
New expensive purchase
Gotta be worth Â£15..............
		
Click to expand...

:thup:


----------



## GMcDowall (Jan 28, 2013)

Hey guys 
first post so ease me in gently . . . 
Custom fitting is the way forward but something like the swing DNA where they put a machine on the shaft and make you do 3 swings is rubbish, in my opinion. 
to get fit, you need to be put on the track man machine, it's the most accurate for club fitting regarding launch,speeds etc  if they are cheap enough i would say have a punt with the 63's. 
are you buying them brand new ? They'll be cheaper with the 64's out now. 
I'm not sure how much you're spending or what your budget is. 
I recently got a set of kbs shafts fitted to my mp62 black nickels and got fitted via track man and its unreal the benefits of the custom shafts. 
I now have a set of mp 64's which are less than a week old, but I got my kbs c-taper x130 shafts put in and got a set of dgr300 in my 62's. 
i know if I went to the mizuno custom centre I would have walked out with a set of s300 or x100 shafts. 
Which I tried and they were nothing like what I needed.


----------



## MGL (Jan 28, 2013)

Gareth said:



			:thup:
		
Click to expand...

Mizuno fitting centres also have blue digestive biscuits with an 'M' on the back and coffee beans ground (some would say grain flow forged but not me!) in Japan!

That's got to be worth Â£15 to a 'Mizziephile'


----------



## One Planer (Jan 29, 2013)

MGL said:



			Mizuno fitting centres also have blue digestive biscuits with an 'M' on the back and coffee beans ground (some would say grain flow forged but not me!) in Japan!

That's got to be worth Â£15 to a 'Mizziephile'



Click to expand...

I think you're on the wind up myself :ears:

I'll go through the DNA process just to get my stats and see what's what.


----------



## MGL (Jan 29, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I think you're on the wind up myself :ears:

I'll go through the DNA process just to get my stats and see what's what.
		
Click to expand...

Lol - all tongue in cheek!


----------



## One Planer (Jan 29, 2013)

MGL said:



			Lol - all tongue in cheek!
		
Click to expand...

I knew it!!!!!

I was looking forward to some grain flow forged coffee too :smirk:


----------



## MGL (Jan 29, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I knew it!!!!!

I was looking forward to some grain flow forged coffee too :smirk:
		
Click to expand...

And here's me thinking the biscuits would have been the clincher lol! 

Nice to see you took it in the spirit with which it was intended - just a little leg pull!

Of course, if you ever fancy trying out some PROPER forged clubs, you know where I am .................


----------



## One Planer (Jan 29, 2013)

MGL said:



			Of course, if you ever fancy trying out some PROPER forged clubs, you know where I am .................

Click to expand...

I never realised you were an authorised Mizuno fitter :whoo:


----------



## moogie (Jan 29, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I never realised you were an authorised Mizuno fitter :whoo:
		
Click to expand...


He is NOT.............Thats why he said PROPER Forged Clubs.........try branching out 1 day,  u never know..


----------



## One Planer (Jan 29, 2013)

moogie said:



			He is NOT.............Thats why he said PROPER Forged Clubs.........try branching out 1 day,  u never know..

Click to expand...

I still have the T-Shirt from the last time I tried that :whoo:


----------



## MGL (Jan 30, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I never realised you were an authorised Mizuno fitter :whoo:
		
Click to expand...

Hahaha - good one! Hope they work out for you when you get sorted.


----------



## One Planer (Jan 30, 2013)

MGL said:



			Hahaha - good one! Hope they work out for you when you get sorted. 

Click to expand...

I hope so too pal :thup:

Should be an intresting day out.


----------

