# Body getting ahead of ball on downswing



## TigerdoomGF (Jul 5, 2017)

Hi guys. I've returned to the game after 15 year hiatus and have run into trouble already. I previously played off 18 Hcap.
I've been using the V1 app to video my swing on the range and have just returned home to review. Here's what I found.
I drew a straight line down from my head, through sternum, navel to the ball and played the video. Everything to top of backswing looks ok then when I start my downswing my body seems to lurch to the left (right handed) as I start with the hips. At impact my body is maybe 12-18" ahead of the line I drew and consequently the ball. 
Enough to say plenty of topped and duffed shots which is really spoiling the game for me. My assessment is that when I transfer weight on my downswing the hips remain static? My left leg looks to be supporting the weight and my balance is good...
Any suggestions or drills that could help me please? Thanks in advance.


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## the_coach (Jul 5, 2017)

TigerdoomGF said:



			Hi guys. I've returned to the game after 15 year hiatus and have run into trouble already. I previously played off 18 Hcap.
I've been using the V1 app to video my swing on the range and have just returned home to review. Here's what I found.
I drew a straight line down from my head, through sternum, navel to the ball and played the video. Everything to top of backswing looks ok then when I start my downswing my body seems to lurch to the left (right handed) as I start with the hips. At impact my body is maybe 12-18" ahead of the line I drew and consequently the ball. 
Enough to say plenty of topped and duffed shots which is really spoiling the game for me. My assessment is that when I transfer weight on my downswing the hips remain static? My left leg looks to be supporting the weight and my balance is good...
Any suggestions or drills that could help me please? Thanks in advance.
		
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so couple things to consider to improve the situation

so say you made a decent turn to the top in the backswing & kept posture pretty good while goin back

in order to 'feel' better (so at first not hitting balls here) what better needs to happen so the body doesn't get 'infront' freeze at the 'good' top of swing which has a decent deep hip turn

now keep the upper body & hips all completely still with the back still lookin at target & just bring the hands & arms 'out' & down (so hands/handle not coming straight down from the top as that for real sure will 'over-steepen' the swing) hands & handle need to be traveling out - so say more on an angle of 45Âº to place the trail elbow 'infront' of the trail hip

you able to do that & you'll feel & see how the shaft shallows out -_ the key is having the trail elbow move to the front of the trail hip_ from the top and the feeling & actuality of the hands/hands moving "out&down" on that kinda 45Âº angle is how that happens

know that sounds a ways counterintuitive as if it's the old over the top move - but for sure it is not as it's the hands/handle & arms that are working to that arc - not the out n'over top of the trail shoulder

here's a vid that will give you the visuals of what I've been speaking to above

[video=youtube;p74VYzpEZ4A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p74VYzpEZ4A[/video]


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 5, 2017)

Thanks will give it a try tomorrow


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## hovis (Jul 5, 2017)

this plagued my swing for 4 years.  i had advice as above of waiting for the arms to drop and then turn everything together and it didn't work well at all.  it was too difficult to time correctly.  if you wait a fraction too long the club gets too far inside.   if you're a little eager and turn too early you swing too much from the outside.  also, by the time you start turning it doesn't give you enough time to generate any decent club head speed. 

in the end it was a k vest session that fixed it for me.  i learned that my upper body pretty much powers my golf swing.  my hips do initiate the downswing but my torso took over very quickly to generate power.   the lunge is caused by turning the power on incorrectly.  if your lower body leads the downswing correctly the club will automatically be pulled down in a passive way to generate power and helps you stay centered. 

the downswing is over in the blink of an eye.  to try and wait or 'put' the club into certain positions simply isn't going to happen.  do you think of what your arms are doing when you hit a tennis ball and swing a baseball bat?  i did and hit my 7 iron 150.  now i dont i hit it 170


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## the_coach (Jul 5, 2017)

just to be clear the advice in post #2 is not centered around _waiting_ for the hands/handle/arms to drop 

may appear to sound like it is - but in actuality it's nothing to do with what has been described the first para written above (post #4) - that is not what I'm speaking to at all -

- so either in a swing through the ball or in the 'drill/exercise feel' I mention _folks will have to initiate the arm motion_ as a first move from the top -  but after the weight pressure has just been settled in the lead leg
the key factor is the intention to have the trail elbow arrive 'infront' of the trail hip - & the key factor in able to achieve this is the 'angle' in which the hands/handle & arms are moved at transition

just 'waiting for arms to drop' will largely never work as that advice just leads to everything coming down too vertically - so everything then gets a ways out of sync with the hands/arms & club in the wrong place during the top half of the downswing

this has to be an active intent of the movement of the handle & arms - but not 'drop' as in directly vertically downwards - hands/arms/handle have to move out as they are moved down on approx think 45Âº with the main goal being the movement of the trail elbow to 'infront' of the trail hip then the shaft will shallow and the arms club won't get 'trapped/stuck' behind the body - & this motion will certainly produce as much clubhead speed as has been there before - & likely if done good & then in conjunction with hip & upper body rotation will produce more clubhead speed with less effort

also getting this is good order will lead to a far more likely square to target club face angle at impact


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 5, 2017)

Here is snapshot of my swing as photographed on V1 app...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3kzBYwZPLxzNEFIM3Y3YVlsRlU/view?usp=drivesdk
It shows how much I love forward on downswing..hope it helps and thanks for advice


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 5, 2017)

Do you have to monitor this or is it now fixed 100%. I feel my setup and overall swing and balance is sound but this causes me so much grief.


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## bobmac (Jul 5, 2017)

I think it looks good in the pictures.
I think the bad shots are caused by your posture changing


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## the_coach (Jul 5, 2017)

TigerdoomGF said:



			Here is snapshot of my swing as photographed on V1 app...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3kzBYwZPLxzNEFIM3Y3YVlsRlU/view?usp=drivesdk
It shows how much I love forward on downswing..hope it helps and thanks for advice
		
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that set-up image ... not from the same swing sequence as the 2 that follow?


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 5, 2017)

Yep same swing


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## the_coach (Jul 5, 2017)

TigerdoomGF said:



			Yep same swing
		
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ok - someone shooting hand held then - that yellow vertical is in a different position on the images into were it is at intersection with mat - which is why I asked

lookin at the lead leg in the 2nd image there's a tad of bend below the knee - often times happens with a pretty fierce lateral hip shift which again often times takes head/upper body with it 

sometimes at transition too much of a lateral hip slide left then takes the upper body/head with it is more of an instinctive reaction to a lateral hip slide trailside & head shift to the right (trailside) so moving 'off' the ball right a tad in the takeaway 

would monitor that there's no lateral shift to the right goin on as you start back from the ball - as the lead shoulder arms/hands move the club from rest the hips rotate so feeling of turning into the trail hip socket weight pressure moving into the trail heel

during transition naturally there will be a tad of a drop of the vertical posture height but everything shifting that far laterally left is goin to make strike problematic

if you can get the feeling of what I described in the earlier post - so club to top then transition starting with just weight pressure downwards into the ground through the lead leg - so pushing 'into' the mat that will stop the aggressive hip slide & body movement to the left - then that feeling of the back staying looking towards target as the arms/hands move the club out & down with the objective to get the trail elbow to the front of the trail hip then rotate the lead hip & upper body

the visuals in the video should help to amplify what I'm speaking to in the thread - as well as doin the drill/exercise I outlined in the first post - spend some time doin the small smooth exercise as MS does towards the end of the video - should give a feeling of how the movements tie in together


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 6, 2017)

Hi Coach I never noticed left knee bending, I try to follow Hogan model of both knees pointing in slightly at address so will check that. I've also looked at a few posts on YouTube about secondary axis spine angle, which should be greater at impact than Address? Would you agree?


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## TigerdoomGF (Jul 6, 2017)

Today I practiced extending 1 piece takeaway as far as possible, it helped reduce lateral sway a little bit...but still there  thanks for your post


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## bobmac (Jul 6, 2017)

TigerdoomGF said:



			Today I practiced extending 1 piece takeaway as far as possible, it helped reduce lateral sway a little bit...but still there  thanks for your post
		
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I think you're looking for cures to problems that aren't there.
It may feel like you're lurching to the left but if you were, most of your weight would finish up on the outside of your left foot which it isn't.

Another indication of this is hitting the ground before the ball




Enough to say plenty of topped and *duffed shots*

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If your body is 12-18in passed the ball at impact, there's little chance of duffing it.

As I said before, in my opinion, you are just transferring the weight onto your front foot.

Watch a few Youtube vids of the top players and compare your positions to theirs


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