# Draw/Fade setting on Drivers



## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

Hey folks, 

I have the Titleist 913 D3 in 9.5 degree. My default shot seems to be a fade or dead straight with it (rare on dead straight). On really lazy days it's a long high push to the right but I know what I've done and correct it quick for the next shot. I have it set to A1 which I believe is the default loft and lie for this club according to the spec sheet. I didn't get a wrench with it but that was why I got it cheaper. I'm interested to play around with the surefit settings one day but before I buy a wrench do you think it makes much of a difference? I see weight sliders, loft adjusters and all sorts on drivers now and I just wonder if it's actually doing anything? 

For instance, you set it to Draw bias but maybe on a hole you would quite like to fade it? Is it best to just keep it on A1 and work it as and when it's required? I can hit a fade anytime, the draw just needs a little extra help. I was able to draw the Ping G15 I had no bother, but this one I can't quite manage when I think I'm set up for it. No big loss apart from distance when hitting the fade. 

I'm not a big hitter, averaging about 210yds but I just wonder if it's all just marketing blurb. 

I think the last time I used my driver on Trackman I was getting a launch angle of 16.4 degrees or something, and I do send the ball quite high. Maybe I'm flipping the club and adding loft. I plan to spend a whole lesson on Driver, but just in case the guy wants me to change the setup on it, is it worth getting the wrench? 

Cheers 

Paul


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## swasterix (Jul 15, 2015)

I bought my SLDR off eBay without a wrench. Picked the wrench up on eBay for around a tenner. Went on a GC2 and had a mess around until I found the best setting and haven't touched it since.


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## Whereditgo (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			Hey folks, 

I have the Titleist 913 D3 in 9.5 degree. My default shot seems to be a fade or dead straight with it (rare on dead straight). On really lazy days it's a long high push to the right but I know what I've done and correct it quick for the next shot. I have it set to A1 which I believe is the default loft and lie for this club according to the spec sheet. I didn't get a wrench with it but that was why I got it cheaper. I'm interested to play around with the surefit settings one day but before I buy a wrench do you think it makes much of a difference? I see weight sliders, loft adjusters and all sorts on drivers now and I just wonder if it's actually doing anything? 

*For instance, you set it to Draw bias but maybe on a hole you would quite like to fade it? Is it best to just keep it on A1 and work it as and when it's required?* I can hit a fade anytime, the draw just needs a little extra help. I was able to draw the Ping G15 I had no bother, but this one I can't quite manage when I think I'm set up for it. No big loss apart from distance when hitting the fade. 

I'm not a big hitter, averaging about 210yds but I just wonder if it's all just marketing blurb. 

I think the last time I used my driver on Trackman I was getting a launch angle of 16.4 degrees or something, and I do send the ball quite high. Maybe I'm flipping the club and adding loft. I plan to spend a whole lesson on Driver, but just in case the guy wants me to change the setup on it, is it worth getting the wrench? 

Cheers 

Paul
		
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You know you can't adjust the settings during the round, right?


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

It's interesting that you bring that particular driver up. It's kind of about that one too. I've also heard the SLDR driver is harsh on mis*****. I have the SLDR S 5 wood and I got to be honest it's the best club I've ever used. It's entered that thought into my head of what the driver would be like, and then I wondered about the effectiveness of the weights sliders. My train of thought then went on to the current Surefit system I have and how effective that could be for me to achieve the same result. 

All I want is a smooth swing go to shot. I don't feel comfy with the fade as it's a whole lot of trouble if it goes wrong on my course. The course is set for some one who can draw the ball off the tee. It's just something I'm going over at the min


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

Whereditgo said:



			You know you can't adjust the settings during the round, right?
		
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That's my point. Once it's set you can't change it so you're snookered so why have the setting on the club? Not that I'm constantly wanting to work that ball for each hole. I just want to change my default shape and if I can do that via Surefit I'd be happy. If it's not going to work then is that one that will work this way? 

open to suggestions of course.


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## Oddsocks (Jul 15, 2015)

Currently using my d3 913 in A1 and until my driver form comes back consistent I will not tweak it.

I don't see the point in setting it up in anything other than standard if you have 2/3/4/5 different shots depending on the swing. Last season my driver flight and distance was very consistent with the amp with either a dead straight or very very slight draw, when that shape is back I'll get on a trackman


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## JakeWS (Jul 15, 2015)

I have my Cobra set on 10.5 Draw, my natural shot is a fade and I can still hit one when necessary along with straight shots, I just find when I do want to draw the ball I find it a bit easier.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

This is why I'm wondering if it's just as good leaving it in A1. I can hit a high or low fade no bother. High fade, I just deliver the clubhead steeper and opposite for the low. I know I can do it. I just dislike the shot (reminds me of my old slicing days). However, whenever I set up for a draw (at the range, and I never do it on the course) I hit it either straight, or I let the clubface open up, adding loft and push it off to the right. That's usually by about 90 balls in and I'm getting sweaty. I suppose I need ot work on my relationship between path and clubface angle.

My next lesson is on the 28th and I've said to the guy I just want to work on driver. I'm halfway there to working out how I've hit it subject to where it's came off the face. I use impact tape at the range on occasion and often deliberately toe it or heel it to see how it reacts. It's dead useful to use. 

What I'm really on about here is that if I set the club on D2, 0.75 less loft  and max draw setting and swing along a straight path, will it draw? The marketing suggests so however, I can't get my head around it without changing path in to out.


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## Region3 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			What I'm really on about here is that if I set the club on D2, 0.75 less loft  and max draw setting and swing along a straight path, will it draw? The marketing suggests so however, I can't get my head around it without changing path in to out.
		
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I could be wrong, but I thought changing the settings on Titleist drivers for draw/fade just made the club sit slightly open or closed. Something you can do yourself at address.

Also - and this is only my opinion - if I had a shot I could rely on (you said you can hit a fade any time) I'd be using it all day long.
At average 210yds I can't imagine there being any situation where you absolutely have to hit a draw with driver.

You will be far better served in the long run by fixing the fault that makes you lose the ball right than trying to develop a draw.


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## garyinderry (Jul 15, 2015)

Without moving weights as well the opening and closing of the face does do something but not a great deal IMO.


Being able to open the face suits the eye of someone who hooks.  It will help his tendency to roll the face closed through impact.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

On the 9th we have water to the left, and it's a 254y par4. Elevated tee. I pretty much head for the water and it fades back into the front edge of the green about 10 yards short. Wind is always coming in from the right. It's an ideal shot for that hole, but the rest of the course doesn't suit it. My course sits on three teirs. Most of the holes, if anything goes right, you've got a long walk down a hill to get it. Everything slopes to the right so by hitting a draw it's going to stab into the hills and at least have a chance. Hitting a fade leaves you with a longer second shot and mostly up hill about 160 yards and using a 6 iron on an uphill lie isn't my favourite placement lol. 

The club at address sits a bit open to my eye on A1 and I tend to lift the base up a little so I feel the clubface is more square to the target line. I know I come over the top on it, hence the fade. I was just open to seeing if I could change it slightly. Maybe the 913 isn't quite what I was after.


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## Region3 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			The club at address sits a bit open to my eye on A1 and I tend to lift the base up a little so I feel the clubface is more square to the target line. I know I come over the top on it, hence the fade. I was just open to seeing if I could change it slightly. Maybe the 913 isn't quite what I was after.
		
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I think on A1 it sits half a degree open, and at a guess each step on the draw/fade scale will move it three quarters of a degree.


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## walliams8 (Jul 15, 2015)

I think if your a fader of the ball changing the club won't help you automatically draw it . Just play to your strengths . A lot of pros play with a fade .


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

walliams8 said:



			I think if your a fader of the ball changing the club won't help you automatically draw it . Just play to your strengths . A lot of pros play with a fade .
		
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I'd say on balance there's as many holes that suit the fade as there is that would suit a draw. On the back nine it suits a drawer of the ball as hitting a natural fade tends to leave me in touble. The front nine is where the lowest of the scoring should be done with the short 8th, 9th, 10th and 11th I can birdie on two of them no bother. If I haven't had a good front nine, I can be sure I'm going to have a bad back nine. My shot shape holds me back on the back nine. 

I just thought that if somehow I could change my shape via a club setting I could have a fighting chance. Funny thing is that I can draw the 5 wood no bother around the 1st dogleg landing it up the hill. I just can't do it with the driver and it led me to thinking that it's not set up right. Mental block?


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## Oddsocks (Jul 15, 2015)

Region3 said:



			I think on A1 it sits half a degree open, and at a guess each step on the draw/fade scale will move it three quarters of a degree.
		
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Hmmmm I need to read up on this


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

Oddsocks said:



			Hmmmm I need to read up on this
		
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Good luck finding any info on it. I'm at a loss. I guess they think the chart tells all.


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## garyinderry (Jul 15, 2015)

As you add loft it will close, take loft off it will open. 


I have a 910 and Mizuno jpx 850 and it is like night and day how much effect changing the loft has on the ball flight.    Mizuno wins hands down.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

garyinderry said:



			As you add loft it will close, take loft off it will open. 


I have a 910 and Mizuno jpx 850 and it is like night and day how much effect changing the loft has on the ball flight.    Mizuno wins hands down.
		
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That first part takes some reading. I thought adding loft would open the face? and decreasing would close it. I'm awfully confused lol. 

My tutor uses the JPX 850 and pretty much drives very well with little or no effort. I like that idea of moving the weight forward much like the SLDR S I have. The weight is right in front of the club.


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## walliams8 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			I'd say on balance there's as many holes that suit the fade as there is that would suit a draw. On the back nine it suits a drawer of the ball as hitting a natural fade tends to leave me in touble. The front nine is where the lowest of the scoring should be done with the short 8th, 9th, 10th and 11th I can birdie on two of them no bother. If I haven't had a good front nine, I can be sure I'm going to have a bad back nine. My shot shape holds me back on the back nine. 

I just thought that if somehow I could change my shape via a club setting I could have a fighting chance. Funny thing is that I can draw the 5 wood no bother around the 1st dogleg landing it up the hill. I just can't do it with the driver and it led me to thinking that it's not set up right. Mental block?
		
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I know scratch golfers that still struggle to draw/ fade the ball on demand . Kaymer tried to learn to hit a natural draw instead of a natural fade and completley lost his game , if you hit a fade just learn to use it on these holes , it'll be better in the long run instead of trying to shape the ball on different holes . Depends on your skill level I guess , but getting the ball going in the right direction is tough enough for anyone let alone intentionally shaping it to that position .


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## garyinderry (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			That first part takes some reading. I thought adding loft would open the face? and decreasing would close it. I'm awfully confused lol. 
.
		
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Its the opposite to what you would think.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

walliams8 said:



			I know scratch golfers that still struggle to draw/ fade the ball on demand . Kaymer tried to learn to hit a natural draw instead of a natural fade and completley lost his game , if you hit a fade just learn to use it on these holes , it'll be better in the long run instead of trying to shape the ball on different holes . Depends on your skill level I guess , but getting the ball going in the right direction is tough enough for anyone let alone intentionally shaping it to that position .
		
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I'll likely continue on the course with the defacto standard fade for safety. The more I do it, the more comfy it'll feel. No harm in getting a wrench and playing about with it up at the range for kicks and giggles I guess. Will help with resale if I ever decide to punt it too. 

I might come out my next lesson with a totally different mindset, who knows. It happened with my irons and Im hitting those very well now. I taught myself how to hit driver.


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## Region3 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			That first part takes some reading. I thought adding loft would open the face? and decreasing would close it. I'm awfully confused lol.
		
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It's worse than you think.

They alter the loft by opening/closing the face. Close the face a bit and you open it at impact to square it up. You opening the face to square it is what adds the loft.
Conversely, to reduce loft they make the face sit more open. You close it at impact (or address) which reduces the loft.

If that's not bad enough, to alter the head for fade/draw they alter the lie angle!


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## swasterix (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			It's interesting that you bring that particular driver up. It's kind of about that one too. I've also heard the SLDR driver is harsh on mis*****. I have the SLDR S 5 wood and I got to be honest it's the best club I've ever used. It's entered that thought into my head of what the driver would be like, and then I wondered about the effectiveness of the weights sliders. My train of thought then went on to the current Surefit system I have and how effective that could be for me to achieve the same result. 

All I want is a smooth swing go to shot. I don't feel comfy with the fade as it's a whole lot of trouble if it goes wrong on my course. The course is set for some one who can draw the ball off the tee. It's just something I'm going over at the min 

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The loft adjustment is the thing which gave the most noticeable difference to my stats. De-lofting the club opens the face, lofting closes the face. However this made a negligible difference to my shot shape, the only noticeable difference being the launch angle, and as a result of that distance. Additionally I found that moving the slider also made a negligible difference to the shot shape.

at the end of the day, whether the face is closed or open. Or whether the slider is set to fade or draw, a dodgy swing can still result in a slice, hook, draw or fade.

most importantly for me the loft setting must match the characteristics of your swing. Hit up, loft down. Hit down, loft up.

With all of this said, you're much better off investing some time with a pro on improving your swing. Rather than relying on your driver to do the work


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

swasterix;1329795

With all of this said said:
			
		


			That's why I'm feeling around just now. My lesson is on the 28th where I'm specifically looking at driver. I hope all will come true on that day. The place I get my lessons is a Titleist fitting centre too so maybe we can work something out. No doubt they'll want me trying the 915 and say they can't fit for the 913 anymore.
		
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## Deleted member 16999 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			That's why I'm feeling around just now. My lesson is on the 28th where I'm specifically looking at driver. I hope all will come true on that day. The place I get my lessons is a Titleist fitting centre too so maybe we can work something out. No doubt they'll want me trying the 915 and say they can't fit for the 913 anymore.
		
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I was fitted for my 915 at Kings Acre, once the Pro was content with the way I hit the ball he fitted me to the correct shaft, once we were happy with the shaft we then played with the loft setting, we settled on B2 as that gave me the best distance, spin rates and accuracy, we used Trackman and his knowledge,
So in essence for me it was well worth getting it fitted but be aware you might not have the correct shaft etc, good luck, 
From my Game Golf Stats I have improved an average of 13 yds on my 913 and improved my accuracy to over 66% from 55%.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

pauldj42 said:



			I was fitted for my 915 at Kings Acre, once the Pro was content with the way I hit the ball he fitted me to the correct shaft, once we were happy with the shaft we then played with the loft setting, we settled on B2 as that gave me the best distance, spin rates and accuracy, we used Trackman and his knowledge,
So in essence for me it was well worth getting it fitted but be aware you might not have the correct shaft etc, good luck, 
From my Game Golf Stats I have improved an average of 13 yds on my 913 and improved my accuracy to over 66% from 55%.
		
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It's all rather new to me and I am feeling a bit out of the loop with all this fitting stuff. It was only pros that got fitted when I stopped playing years ago. Mere mortals had to buy the biggest headed driver off the highest tee and hope for the best lol. Now it's all number crunching shaft options and weights. I am getting the hang of it but slowly. 

I'll ask the guys if they can advise on my driver or whether fitting would be suitable.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			It's all rather new to me and I am feeling a bit out of the loop with all this fitting stuff. It was only pros that got fitted when I stopped playing years ago. Mere mortals had to buy the biggest headed driver off the highest tee and hope for the best lol. Now it's all number crunching shaft options and weights. I am getting the hang of it but slowly. 

I'll ask the guys if they can advise on my driver or whether fitting would be suitable.
		
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Drinking on a Saturday night was my problem, otherwise the fitting would never have happened. :cheers:


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

The guy up at the range said that the 915 was a far superior driver to mine (he would say that) and that it's about Â£300. Fitting is done on Trackman but the Â£40 you pay gets taken off the price of the driver if you buy it. If you don't buy it you just pay the Â£40 fitting time. I understand there's 4 shaft options and mine is the Phenom RIP stiff. I could well be using the wrong setup, I'll never know until I go get fitted. I guess going for it when the least I'll have to pay is Â£40 is worth a shout. Maybe I dunno. 

When did we get to the point where this was the only way to progress at golf? My mate was offered fitting on buying G30's last night at AG, the guy can't swing a banjo and hit a cow's ar$e


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## Deleted member 16999 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			The guy up at the range said that the 915 was a far superior driver to mine (he would say that) and that it's about Â£300. Fitting is done on Trackman but the Â£40 you pay gets taken off the price of the driver if you buy it. If you don't buy it you just pay the Â£40 fitting time. I understand there's 4 shaft options and mine is the Phenom RIP stiff. I could well be using the wrong setup, I'll never know until I go get fitted. I guess going for it when the least I'll have to pay is Â£40 is worth a shout. Maybe I dunno. 

When did we get to the point where this was the only way to progress at golf? My mate was offered fitting on buying G30's last night at AG, the guy can't swing a banjo and hit a cow's ar$e
		
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Without going in to detail, if I hadn't of got the 915 and fitting, I'd still be using my 913 and I wouldn't be looking to change it.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

pauldj42 said:



			Without going in to detail, if I hadn't of got the 915 and fitting, I'd still be using my 913 and I wouldn't be looking to change it.
		
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From that I can take that you got better as a result of playing more thus getting used to the gear, shots and other attributes. This is where I'm sitting it. The driver works for many a person very well. I need to change to get the best out of it.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Jul 15, 2015)

Paul77 said:



			From that I can take that you got better as a result of playing more thus getting used to the gear, shots and other attributes. This is where I'm sitting it. The driver works for many a person very well. I need to change to get the best out of it.
		
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I was very happy with the 913 and love the 915 but i wasn't actually looking for a new Driver, between the 2 the 915 imo is better, and ignorance can be bliss, what you've never had you never miss!


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

The last Titleist driver I had was the 983K in stiff too. Largely different from the 913, but funnily I hit them the same. I just need to sort out my path into the ball and I'm sure lessons will help with that muscle memory of year going up to the driving range with a driver and trying to melt balls. It's going to be a longer road to travel unlike the quick fix I had with my irons. Love hitting my irons now. I quiver when the driver needs to be used. It's just such a boring non feedback club.


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## garyinderry (Jul 15, 2015)

Boring non feed back club? 


This I cannot agree with.  You can tell instantly through feel where you have caught it.  The club screams at you when you get it wrong. 

The shock through your hands and a terrible sound.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

I take your points and yes in those situations you do get that. For instance when two drives feel the same at impact, and one goes straight and the other goes high right, I don't tend to get much feedback from that. I guess high spin off a lofted and open clubface wouldn't. My fault for doing it. It was a silly thing to put in, not really what I meant.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

Guy up the range sold me a wrench for a tenner. Cheaper than eBay. He did also confirm what a lot of folk have said on here already. It's all about how you deliver the club head to the ball. He seemed to think the settings shift had minimal impact.


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## SocketRocket (Jul 15, 2015)

Drawing and fading is all down to 'D' plane.  No matter how much you fiddle around with driver settings you will always be able to override them with an inconsistent swing path and/or clubface alignment.

IMO you need to understand technically what creates draws and fades if you want to alter your shot shape.


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## Paul77 (Jul 15, 2015)

I understand the theory of it. Face open to path but closed to target etc etc.  it's the application that goes a bit askew lol


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## UlyssesSky (Jul 15, 2015)

SocketRocket said:



			IMO you need to understand technically what creates draws and fades if you want to alter your shot shape.
		
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You're absolutely right.

However, having a driver that helps you close the club relative to the path can be a good thing. If you, for example, get your swing path from out-to-in to in-to-out but still deliver the club head too open (relative to the path), you'll either hit a push or a push-fade/slice.

So having a clubface that is either slightly closed to begin with or, through weighting near the heel, helps you close the club in your swing can make your life a lot easier.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 15, 2015)

When I went to the Titleist demo day, they recommended getting fitted, and then keeping that setting unless there was an exceptional reason to move it. If I was the OP I'd stick with hitting a fade as a stock shot and learning to draw it in the current setting and leaving it on the optimum set up


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