# F1 2022



## bobmac (Jan 31, 2022)

With the start of the new season looming, there's still no word from Lewis.
Will he return or not?
And will Red Bull be able to afford Max's new wage demands?

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/f1-...-Max-Verstappen-contract-Helmut-Marko-F1-news

An interesting time ahead with testing only a few weeks away.


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## Beedee (Jan 31, 2022)

At least there won't be a Djokovic moment for F1 this year.  A spokesman for F1 said: "F1 (FOM) will require all travelling personnel to be fully vaxxed and will not request exemptions."


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## theoneandonly (Jan 31, 2022)

SLH will be back im sure. New cars start to be released in the coming couple of weeks. We won't really know what it all means untill the first race but I'm looking forward to it. So much so me and my eldest are driving over to Spa for the Belgian GP.


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## Bunkermagnet (Jan 31, 2022)

It wouldn’t surprise me if LH walked away, and who can blame him.
Red Bull and JV are a perfect match, childish and petulant.


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## Swango1980 (Jan 31, 2022)

I'll be intrigued how all the teams do in relation to their performances last year. And how Russel will get on at Mercedes.

I'd love to see 3 or 4 drivers having the cars to compete against Max, and see how Max does under that pressure, and how many of them he sends into the wall (and how often he'll score an own goal by going into the wall himself).


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## Foxholer (Jan 31, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			It wouldn’t surprise me if LH walked away, and who can blame him.
Red Bull and JV are a perfect match, *childish and petulant*.
		
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Also the way I'd describe some of LH's actions, on and off the track, in the past.
I think LH will stay - this year. While I wouldn't be surprised if he did walk away, I believe the challenge JV provides will be too much for him - and his ego - to resist.


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## Beedee (Jan 31, 2022)

More than anytime in the last 8 years, this year is about the car.  The new rule changes are such so fundamental that I really don't see a two manufacturer fight.  One team will have found the special loophole and the others will take at least half a season to catch up / FIA to change the rules to help RB.

Lewis v George could be interesting.  Lando v Danny would be a good fight.  I think if it's any of the other teams, one of the team will be far too dominant to be challenged by their team mate.


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## Robster59 (Jan 31, 2022)

I have a feeling that Lewis will stay on.  He may decide to go for another world title and then hang up his boots as World Champion.


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## Swango1980 (Jan 31, 2022)

Maybe Lewis will decide whether he stays on AFTER he gauges how the Mercedes will perform. If it looks to be a fantastic car and likely to dominate, he may well stay on. If it looks dodgy, and that other cars look better, he may decide to step down and use the finale of last season as an excuse, rather than the fact he just does not think he'll be competitive.


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## SaintHacker (Jan 31, 2022)

Merc have already published few pics from the factory showing LH so I think he is a dead cert to be on the grid this year, particularly as this will likely be his last chance to win that 8th title. 
The interesting thing will be who his main challenger is, i have a strong suspicion it will be his own team mate rather than anyone from red bull/ferrari


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## cliveb (Jan 31, 2022)

One of the main factors that made it difficult for Lewis last year was the woeful support from Bottas left him to fend entirely for himself.
There were lots of races where Bottas had just one job to do to make Max's life difficult, and he routinely failed to do so.
I think Russell should be much better able to mix it with Red Bull.
But if George decides to try and directly compete with Lewis, any on track squabble between them will leave the door wide open for Max.

I have a sneaking feeling that Lewis might pull George aside and tell him something like this:
"You are the future for this team. But if you try and mix it with me straight off the bat, it will get messy, it will be bad for the team, and chances are you will come off worse.
But... If you agree to be my support wingman this year and help me beat Max, I will spend my final year (2023) doing the same for you".

(This is all based on the assumption that Merc and Red Bull stay as the dominant teams, and despite the new regulations coming in, I can't see why that wouldn't be the case).


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## BiMGuy (Jan 31, 2022)

I am 99% certain Lewis will be on the grid next season. He is playing games with F1. His SM following is nearly as big as the rest of F1 combined, so him not posting will be hurting the brand more than him. His silence as they say, speaks loudly. 

What it is also doing is taking column inches away from Max and Redbull. They and the FIA were desperately pushing Max into the media, now the F1 media is only speculating about Lewis. The new young gun and current world champ has all but been forgotten for the time being. 

As much as the new regs are intended to bring the teams closer together, a change in regs rarely does. I was hoping this to be the case before last season. Now, I hope Mercedes come out and drive off into the sunset.


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## Cherry13 (Jan 31, 2022)

I think LH will stay, as others have stated it’s just a bit of a power play to put a squeeze on Liberty and FIA (although fia should rise above it and not care that they could cause the biggest star to walk away. They will be petrified of taking the blame if he does) hence the talk of structural changes and such things, although this is long overdue. 

I am hoping for a midfield team to break the pack and do a brawn, but that’s looking less and less likely. I initially thought it might be Aston, but they seem to have some internal wranglings at the moment that aren’t looking good. Maybe mclaren can close the gap or Renault. 

Interesting to see both red bull and merc failed safety tests.  Apparantly Mercedes’ went pretty left field but they failed a pretty standard test so have reverted back to a more conventional design.  Wonder if we’ll ever find out what it was they did with the side pods. 

Red bulls is slightly more worrying as it’s the front wing, and will require a redesign, so they obviously assumed it would pass first time. Although they’ve stated should be done ready in time. 

Here’s hoping for a good season ahead with plenty of drama…. Just a bit less involvement from the stewards please.


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## Oddsocks (Feb 1, 2022)

Surely the legal implications of LH not turning up are huge.  Morally I agree with this if he chose to do it but merc would sue him for huge numbers.


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## Swango1980 (Feb 1, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Surely the legal implications of LH not turning up are huge.  Morally I agree with this if he chose to do it but merc would sue him for huge numbers.
		
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I doubt it. As far as I can tell, they are in good terms, and Mercedes were equally upset by how last season finished. If LH stepped away, I am sure they would spin it as the correct thing to do based on the injustice of last season. If they were to Sue LH, that would be extremely damaging PR to Mercedes. Plenty on non-Hamilton fans dislike Mercedes anyway (a lot of people also don't like to see the same winning team every year, unless they are supporters). If Mercedes then sued Hamilton, I'd imagine they'd lose a lot of support from Hamilton fans as well.

And, suing the driver that won you multiple world championships will stink to many F1 fans.


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## BiMGuy (Feb 1, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Surely the legal implications of LH not turning up are huge.  Morally I agree with this if he chose to do it but merc would sue him for huge numbers.
		
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Like they did with Nico?


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## bobmac (Feb 1, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Maybe Lewis will decide whether he stays on AFTER he gauges how the Mercedes will perform. If it looks to be a fantastic car and likely to dominate, he may well stay on. If it looks dodgy, and that other cars look better, he may decide to step down and use the finale of last season as an excuse, rather than the fact he just does not think he'll be competitive.
		
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It must be terrible when you think you have a fast car and then Red Bull or Ferrari come out with something faster.
I'd love to see this appear at Bahrain next month...does anyone want a go?


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## Smiffy (Feb 1, 2022)

He'll be there. 100% guarantee.
He's at his most dangerous when things are stacked against him, and he's going to want to put right what happened last season.


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 1, 2022)

Although the change to the rules might make for better racing long-term, the likely outcome this season, as noted above by Beedee, is one team finds something that works much better than what the others have and they win it easily.

You’d think the power train advantage that Merc have would put them in a good place to be up there, assuming they don’t make an error with their aero package.


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## cliveb (Feb 1, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			Although the change to the rules might make for better racing long-term, the likely outcome this season, as noted above by Beedee, is one team finds something that works much better than what the others have and they win it easily.
		
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Problem is that for a team to come out of nowhere and surprise us all with something radical requires that they are allowed to think outside the box. The FIA technical regulations are now so prescriptive that nobody really has any scope for thinking outside the box - all they can do is tinker around the edges. It's a crying shame that we'll never see the likes of another Colin Chapman allowed to apply their genius.


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## Swango1980 (Feb 1, 2022)

bobmac said:



			It must be terrible when you think you have a fast car and then Red Bull or Ferrari come out with something faster.
I'd love to see this appear at Bahrain next month...does anyone want a go?

View attachment 40903

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Only Batman is allowed to drive that.


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 1, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Problem is that for a team to come out of nowhere and surprise us all with something radical requires that they are allowed to think outside the box. The FIA technical regulations are now so prescriptive that nobody really has any scope for thinking outside the box - all they can do is tinker around the edges. It's a crying shame that we'll never see the likes of another Colin Chapman allowed to apply their genius.
		
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That’s not entirely true, there is still plenty of scope for difference within the designs, even if they seem very similar. It’ll be something like the double diffuser when Brawn GP came from nowhere, just something simple that’s within the rules (or on the edge of them) which no one else has done and just happens to be brilliant.


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## cliveb (Feb 1, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			That’s not entirely true, there is still plenty of scope for difference within the designs, even if they seem very similar. It’ll be something like the double diffuser when Brawn GP came from nowhere, just something simple that’s within the rules (or on the edge of them) which no one else has done and just happens to be brilliant.
		
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I guess the Merc DAS system was an example of that, but it didn't really make a huge difference, and I don't feel there are enough loopholes in the tech regs for us to see another innovation as effective as the double diffuser.


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## bobmac (Feb 1, 2022)

We'll find out next month


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 1, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I guess the Merc DAS system was an example of that, but it didn't really make a huge difference, and I don't feel there are enough loopholes in the tech regs for us to see another innovation as effective as the double diffuser.
		
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I hope you’re right as that would be the best result for racing (assuming the regs work as intended). We will find out soon enough….. I’d be very surprised if one of the teams doesn’t stumble across something….


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 8, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I guess the Merc DAS system was an example of that, but it didn't really make a huge difference, and I don't feel there are enough loopholes in the tech regs for us to see another innovation as effective as the double diffuser.
		
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Looking at the Haas, looks like there is plenty of opportunity for differences between the cars. The Haas is quite different to the generic car, will be interesting to see in the next few days whether the others have gone in a similar direction to Haas, or are thinking differently.


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## Piece (Feb 8, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			Looking at the Haas, looks like there is plenty of opportunity for differences between the cars. The Haas is quite different to the generic car, will be interesting to see in the next few days whether the others have gone in a similar direction to Haas, or are thinking differently.
		
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I wonder how much of the aero stuff was digitally scrubbed from those Haas pics?


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## BiMGuy (Feb 8, 2022)

Piece said:



			I wonder how much of the aero stuff was digitally scrubbed from those Haas pics?
		
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It’s pretty much just a release of their 2022 livery. Which is what all of the releases coming over the next few weeks will be.


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 8, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			It’s pretty much just a release of their 2022 livery. Which is what all of the releases coming over the next few weeks will be.
		
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I got the impression from Steiner's comments that it wasn't entirely a red herring. 

Anyway, I'm hopeful there is room for meaningful differences in how the cars are developed.


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 8, 2022)

Piece said:



			I wonder how much of the aero stuff was digitally scrubbed from those Haas pics?
		
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Plenty, I'm sure! No doubt there will be meaningful differences when the real thing is launched, but I was pleased to see the possibility of it being different to the generic car revealed last year


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## bobmac (Feb 8, 2022)

If Lewis isn't in the bat mobile, I'm not watching


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## Beedee (Feb 9, 2022)

I see Lando has just committed to McLaren for 4 years.  With a Mercedes seat almost certainly available in the next year or two, that's a big commitment to make.  Always liked McLaren, so I hope the car is as good as he hopes.


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## Swango1980 (Feb 17, 2022)

Masi removed as race director, and will be offered a new position (probably within the Red Bull team  )


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## Foxholer (Feb 17, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Masi removed as race director, and will be offered a new position...
		
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Predictable - and the right decision imo.


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 17, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Masi removed as race director, and will be offered a new position (probably within the Red Bull team  )
		
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Had to happen. Hope the new position is as far away from anything to do with race day as possible


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## SaintHacker (Feb 17, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			Predictable - and the right decision imo.
		
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I disagree. On the whole he has done a decent job, he just lost the plot at Abu Dhabi whilst under huge pressure. I feel that by removing him the FIA have admitted things were done incorrectly and so therefore something needs to be done about the result of the race, but that clearly won't happen. I think they could have kept him on but brought another co-director in alongside to help with the decision making process. Or have 'call takers' who speak to the teams so they cannot speak directly to the race director and try to influence his/her thinking.


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## Foxholer (Feb 17, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			I disagree...
		
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Fair enough. It's a free world!
But 'losing the plot at Abu Dhabi' demanded such action imo. Decisions by committee don't work in F1 type environments!


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## greenone (Feb 17, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			I disagree. On the whole he has done a decent job, he just lost the plot at Abu Dhabi whilst under huge pressure. I feel that by removing him the FIA have admitted things were done incorrectly and so therefore something needs to be done about the result of the race, but that clearly won't happen. I think they could have kept him on but brought another co-director in alongside to help with the decision making process. Or have 'call takers' who speak to the teams so they cannot speak directly to the race director and try to influence his/her thinking.
		
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It wasn't just Abu Dhabi, spa was a complete farce as well. And was verstappens extra 'victory' over Hamilton going into that last race. I hope the signs of revival at Williams continue.


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## SaintHacker (Feb 17, 2022)

greenone said:



			It wasn't just Abu Dhabi, spa was a complete farce as well. And was verstappens extra 'victory' over Hamilton going into that last race. I hope the signs of revival at Williams continue.
		
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Spa was a farce but it was within the rules, which Masi didn't write.(and which have now been changed thankfully)


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## cliveb (Feb 17, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			I disagree. On the whole he has done a decent job, he just lost the plot at Abu Dhabi whilst under huge pressure. I feel that by removing him the FIA have admitted things were done incorrectly and so therefore something needs to be done about the result of the race, but that clearly won't happen. I think they could have kept him on but brought another co-director in alongside to help with the decision making process. Or have 'call takers' who speak to the teams so they cannot speak directly to the race director and try to influence his/her thinking.
		
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What happened in Abu Dhabi resulted in many teams and other interested parties losing faith in the FIA. Something had to be done, and offering up Masi as scapegoat was the easy way out. For sure he ****ed up, but quite probably so would anyone else under the same pressure. I sort of feel sorry for him, but he had to go.

Incidentally, I believe cutting the direct radio line between teams and race director is one of the things that's also been announced.


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## BiMGuy (Feb 17, 2022)

cliveb said:



			What happened in Abu Dhabi resulted in many teams and other interested parties losing faith in the FIA. Something had to be done, and offering up Masi as scapegoat was the easy way out. For sure he ****ed up, but quite probably so would anyone else under the same pressure. I sort of feel sorry for him, but he had to go.

Incidentally, I believe cutting the direct radio line between teams and race director is one of the things that's also been announced.
		
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The direct radio line between the teams and race director has been in place for years. It’s only recently been broadcast to the public.


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## Beedee (Feb 17, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Spa was a farce but it was within the rules, which Masi didn't write.(and which have now been changed thankfully)
		
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Yes Spa was a farce, and no, he didn't break the rules that time, but he made decisions that were fundamentally ludicrous.  It was 100% obvious that no racing could possibly take place, and his decision gave free points and a win to one team - a team that on at least two occasions (and arguably more) benefited from his questionable decisions.


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## Wabinez (Feb 18, 2022)

Please let this be the fastest on the grid…


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## cliveb (Feb 18, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			The direct radio line between the teams and race director has been in place for years. It’s only recently been broadcast to the public.
		
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Not sure what point you're trying to make.
Regardless of how long it's been in place, and whether or not it's broadcast, the abuse of that line by Merc and RB at Abu Dhabi was the primary reason that Masi got in such a flap and ended up making the bad decisions he did. I cannot believe that without those messages he would have done the same thing.

That is why the FIA have announced that it will be removed, and IMO that's a good thing.


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## SaintHacker (Feb 18, 2022)

Has it actually been removed? I've read some reports that its been stopped completely and others that its just not being broadcast anymore. Obviously the director or one of his assistants will need to be able to speak to the teams during the race


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## bobmac (Feb 18, 2022)

Genuine question as I can't remember but when Toto spoke to Massi, he was asking him to follow the rules about the safety car and lapped cars. Whereas Christian Horner was asking Massi to NOT  follow the rules and only let some lapped cars through and to bring in the safety car a lap early to give them ''just one more lap'' Have I got that right?


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## SaintHacker (Feb 18, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Genuine question as I can't remember but when Toto spoke to Massi, he was asking him to follow the rules about the safety car and lapped cars. Whereas Christian Horner was asking Massi to NOT  follow the rules and only let some lapped cars through and to bring in the safety car a lap early to give them ''just one more lap'' Have I got that right?
		
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Pretty much sums it up


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## cliveb (Feb 18, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Has it actually been removed? I've read some reports that its been stopped completely and others that its just not being broadcast anymore. Obviously the director or one of his assistants will need to be able to speak to the teams during the race
		
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What I heard was that the radio comms would go through a layer of assistants to act as a buffer between the teams and the RD.
Don't recall anything about whether they will still be broadcast.
Also read that there is to be a remote referee (like VAR in football) to assist the RD in making decisions.


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## cliveb (Feb 18, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Genuine question as I can't remember but when Toto spoke to Massi, he was asking him to follow the rules about the safety car and lapped cars. Whereas Christian Horner was asking Massi to NOT  follow the rules and only let some lapped cars through and to bring in the safety car a lap early to give them ''just one more lap'' Have I got that right?
		
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Put like that, yes, that's what happened. (Although it was Jonathan Wheatley rather than Christian Horner who persuaded Masi to break the rules by only unlapping the cars between Lewis and Max, and to bring the safety car in straight away. I think all Horner said (earlier) was something to the effect of "get those lapped cars out of the way").

What you haven't made clear is the aggressive tone of voice that Toto used when telling Masi what he was doing was against the wrong. Mind you, given the consequences of Masi's decision, and considering it was in the heat of the moment, you can heardly blame Toto for his outburst.


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## Swango1980 (Feb 18, 2022)

cliveb said:



			What I heard was that the radio comms would go through a layer of assistants to act as a buffer between the teams and the RD.
Don't recall anything about whether they will still be broadcast.
Also read that there is to be a remote referee (like VAR in football) to assist the RD in making decisions.
		
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That is good, VAR is fool proof...


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## Swango1980 (Feb 18, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Put like that, yes, that's what happened. (Although it was Jonathan Wheatley rather than Christian Horner who persuaded Masi to break the rules by only unlapping the cars between Lewis and Max, and to bring the safety car in straight away. I think all Horner said (earlier) was something to the effect of "get those lapped cars out of the way").

What you haven't made clear is the aggressive tone of voice that Toto used when telling Masi what he was doing was against the wrong. Mind you, given the consequences of Masi's decision, and considering it was in the heat of the moment, *you can heardly blame Toto for his outburst*.
		
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Indeed, I wouldn't have expected Toto to politely say "excuse me sire, I don't believe your decision follows the rules, could you please reconsider. No? OK, fair enough, catch you later"


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## cliveb (Feb 18, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			That is good, VAR is fool proof...
		
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## Beedee (Feb 18, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			That is good, VAR is fool proof...
		
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Worked well enough in the Euros so it could work well in most of the world.  The Silverstone round however ...


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## Swango1980 (Feb 23, 2022)

So, what do we think the odds are on the Russian GP being cancelled? Not until September, but I imagine the FIA will need to make a decision a long way in advance of that.


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 23, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			So, what do we think the odds are on the Russian GP being cancelled? Not until September, but I imagine the FIA will need to make a decision a long way in advance of that.
		
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You would hope they would cancel asap and not pander to Putin and his cronies let alone giving Russia money through sponsorship, TV etc. Already talk of the CL coming to Wembley and even if Putin doesn't push on any further with this I'd love to see sport take a lead and say no and send a statement


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 23, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			I disagree. On the whole he has done a decent job, he just lost the plot at Abu Dhabi whilst under huge pressure. I feel that by removing him the FIA have admitted things were done incorrectly and so therefore something needs to be done about the result of the race, but that clearly won't happen. I think they could have kept him on but brought another co-director in alongside to help with the decision making process. Or have 'call takers' who speak to the teams so they cannot speak directly to the race director and try to influence his/her thinking.
		
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I realise I'm replying to this nearly a week later....

But I think the problem would have been had he stayed, that he'd be constantly accused of bias going forward, either in favour of Red Bull, or in favour of Merc (to compensate for his error).

My view is that actually the pressure on him to deliver a grandstand finale to the season was coming from Liberty, rather than him bowing to pressure from Red Bull. Just look at all the hype surrounding that final race, plus the decision to not punish Verstappen in any meaningful way after the disgraceful driving in Saudi to ensure they went into the last race level on points. I think they got it badly wrong and massively overestimated the general desire for entertainment over the integrity of sport (not inconsistent with the US approach more generally, dare I say). It's clear now to everyone that the critical role of the race director is to implement the rules consistently and fairly, I think Masi could do that, but perception is everything and a fresh start is better for everyone, including him.


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## theoneandonly (Feb 23, 2022)

Nice to see the cars get a run out today and no surprise to see the RB was nothing like the launch car. The times meant nothing but I can't wait for race day.

Some nice pictures
https://www.planetf1.com/features/f1-barcelona-track-pictures/


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## Canary_Yellow (Feb 24, 2022)

I'm enjoying keeping my eye on the testing, I'm sure the lap times are meaningless, but it has got me daring to dream that the likes of McLaren and Ferrari might be able to compete at the front with Merc and Red Bull. How good would that be if we had wheel to wheel racing with so many teams up there?!


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## SaintHacker (Feb 24, 2022)

Interesting how many teams are struggling with the car 'porpoising', something to do with the way the new cars handle the ground effect, which they couldnt model in the sims/wind tunnel.

In other news Haas have said they will be removing all the Uralkali branding from their cars. Isn't that daddy Mazepins company? Fair play to them.


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## Foxholer (Feb 24, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Interesting how many teams are struggling with the car 'porpoising', something to do with the way the new cars handle the ground effect, which they couldnt model in the sims/wind tunnel.

In other news Haas have said they will be removing all the Uralkali branding from their cars. Isn't that daddy Mazepins company? Fair play to them.
		
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Yep!
There's also the Russian GP scheduled for late September to consider.


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## Swango1980 (Feb 25, 2022)

Russian Grand Prix has been cancelled


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## Swango1980 (Feb 25, 2022)

Interesting about Haas driver Nikita Mazepin. He brings in sponsorship money from his father, Dmitry, who is a billionaire with close ties to Putin. It looks like Haas will be looking to sever ties with him (or maybe they will legally have to with the sanctions?)


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## Beedee (Feb 25, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Interesting about Haas driver Nikita Mazepin. He brings in sponsorship money from his father, Dmitry, who is a billionaire with close ties to Putin. It looks like Haas will be looking to sever ties with him (or maybe they will legally have to with the sanctions?)
		
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Best thing that could happen to Haas, as long as they can find enough money to survive.

In general I don't like the drivers that have seats bought for them.  I know that includes Perez, Stroll and Latifi, and probably others.  But at least those drivers are good enough for a seat on merit  (well 2 of them definitely).  Mazepin's been awful from day one.  Actually, after videoing himself groping a girl and then sharing it on line, Mazepin's been an embarrassment to the team since before day 1.


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## greenone (Feb 25, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Best thing that could happen to Haas, as long as they can find enough money to survive.

In general I don't like the drivers that have seats bought for them.  I know that includes Perez, Stroll and Latifi, and probably others.  But at least those drivers are good enough for a seat on merit  (well 2 of them definitely).  Mazepin's been awful from day one.  Actually, after videoing himself groping a girl and then sharing it on line, Mazepin's been an embarrassment to the team since before day 1.
		
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They should survive. Gene Haas isn't short of cash, he wanted to reduce his commitment. I'm sure he can find the money down the back of the sofa untill they get new sponsors.


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## Beedee (Feb 25, 2022)

Is this one the new rules more more interesting racing ...




Send out a leaky water tanker as the safety car


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## Swango1980 (Mar 2, 2022)

I also posted this on the WW3 thread, but also relevant here.  Motorsport UK will refuse to recognise licenses of competitors from Russia.

So, although Mazepin can race in F1 for Haas (although I believe talks are still ongoing behind the scenes), he will be unable to race in the British Grand Prix


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## greenone (Mar 2, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			I also posted this on the WW3 thread, but also relevant here.  Motorsport UK will refuse to recognise licenses of competitors from Russia.

So, although Mazepin can race in F1 for Haas (although I believe talks are still ongoing behind the scenes), he will be unable to race in the British Grand Prix
		
Click to expand...

First Domino, I don't believe for a second that other national associations won't follow Motorsport uk's lead.


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## Wabinez (Mar 3, 2022)

__
		http://instagr.am/p/CapoqJ3Ne7a/

just happening to post a picture of Pierre Fittipaldi, in Bahrain, in a Haas, with rumours of Mazepin being removed from the seat…..


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## Imurg (Mar 5, 2022)

According to Sky, Haas have terminated Mazepin's contract..


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 5, 2022)

Imurg said:



			According to Sky, Haas have terminated Mazepin's contract..
		
Click to expand...

Confirmed https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/3...ussian-drivers-contract-with-immediate-effect but he seems far from happy, which I understand as the situation isn't his doing but important that sport presents a united front the the current crisis


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## 4LEX (Mar 5, 2022)

I'm a better F1 driver than Mazepin. Clown of a driver who only got a ride due to his Dad. You could put a bottle of coke in the seat and it would get the same amount of points.


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## Foxholer (Mar 5, 2022)

4LEX said:



			I'm a better F1 driver than Mazepin. Clown of a driver who only got a ride due to his Dad. You could put a bottle of coke in the seat and it would get the same amount of points.
		
Click to expand...

While his father's contribution undoubtedly helped, his 'qualifications' (eg from Karting) aren't all that poorer than Ralf Schumaker's - whose appointment to Williams was very likely influenced by his brother's qualities. It was likely a 'mutually beneficiaal' arrangement though.
Had he been in a more competitive team, I'm certain he'd have had more success.
And FWIW, I'd put money on Mazepin being a better F1 driver than you!


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## theoneandonly (Mar 5, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			While his father's contribution undoubtedly helped, his 'qualifications' (eg from Karting) aren't all that poorer than Ralf Schumaker's - whose appointment to Williams was very likely influenced by his brother's qualities. It was likely a 'mutually beneficiaal' arrangement though.
Had he been in a more competitive team, I'm certain he'd have had more success.
And FWIW, I'd put money on Mazepin being a better F1 driver than you!
		
Click to expand...

Mazepin leaves F1 with more spins (22) than race starts(21).


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## BiMGuy (Mar 5, 2022)

4LEX said:



			I'm a better F1 driver than Mazepin. Clown of a driver who only got a ride due to his Dad. You could put a bottle of coke in the seat and it would get the same amount of points.
		
Click to expand...

Show us your super licence?


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## Beedee (Mar 5, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Show us your super licence?
		
Click to expand...

Amazing what daddy's corrupt billions can buy.

Haas took him for one reason only - daddy's money.  Good on them for getting rid.  Slimy little entitled scumbag.  The sport is better without him and daddy.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 5, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Amazing what daddy's corrupt billions can buy.

Haas took him for one reason only - daddy's money.  Good on them for getting rid.  Slimy little entitled scumbag.  The sport is better without him and daddy.
		
Click to expand...

Agree with that 100%. But you don’t get a SL without being a very very good driver.


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## Beedee (Mar 5, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Agree with that 100%. But you don’t get a SL without being a very very good driver.
		
Click to expand...

To get a super licence you need to accumulate 40 points over 3 years in one of 37 different "junior" formats.  That doesn't sound that hard for a billionaire's son who can buy drives in any format.  His pre-F1 career was medicore.  

Is he a faster driver than the vast majority of people - yes he is.  Should he have been even close to an F1 drive - on pure talent, OMG no.


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## Foxholer (Mar 5, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Mazepin leaves F1 with more spins (22) than race starts(21).
		
Click to expand...

So? Just means he pushes (excessively). His team-mate wasn't exactly a star either - in spite of his 'genetic advantage'! Basically the car was not competitive!


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			So? Just means he pushes (excessively). His team-mate wasn't exactly a star either - in spite of his 'genetic advantage'! Basically the car was not competitive!
		
Click to expand...

So he's shit and you clearly haven't seen much of him.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 6, 2022)

Beedee said:



			To get a super licence you need to accumulate 40 points over 3 years in one of 37 different "junior" formats.  That doesn't sound that hard for a billionaire's son who can buy drives in any format.  His pre-F1 career was medicore. 

Is he a faster driver than the vast majority of people - yes he is.  Should he have been even close to an F1 drive - on pure talent, OMG no.
		
Click to expand...

You do realise that in the junior formulas the cars are all pretty much equal? So it doesn't matter how much money you have if you're not a good driver you won't get superlicence points. Do you also hate Latifi, Stroll and countless other drivers over the years who have brought a large amount of sponsorship money in to 'buy' their seat? Pay drivers have always happened in F1, and for the lower teams probably always will.


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## cliveb (Mar 6, 2022)

Mazepin has shown through his off track behaviour that he's a despicable entitled child.
And compared to the rest of the field, yes he is seriously untalented.

But let's keep a sense of perspective. As a racing driver he is almost certainly far, far better than any of us on here. I bet if any of us jumped in a F1 car we'd seriously embarrass ourselves. The one time I drove a single seater with slicks and wings (FF2000), it was psychologically impossible to corner it fast enough to remotely approach it's capabilities.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Mazepin has shown through his off track behaviour that he's a despicable entitled child.
And compared to the rest of the field, yes he is seriously untalented.

But let's keep a sense of perspective. As a racing driver he is almost certainly far, far better than any of us on here. *I bet if any of us jumped in a F1 car we'd seriously embarrass ourselves*. The one time I drove a single seater with slicks and wings (FF2000), it was psychologically impossible to corner it fast enough to remotely approach it's capabilities.
		
Click to expand...

Just like mazepin.


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## cliveb (Mar 6, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Just like mazepin.
		
Click to expand...

No, not just like Mazepin. He typically laps a few seconds off the pace. Most of us on here would be lucky to even finish a lap.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			No, not just like Mazepin. He typically laps a few seconds off the pace. Most of us on here would be lucky to even finish a lap.
		
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Talk me through his debut race.


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## cliveb (Mar 6, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Talk me through his debut race.
		
Click to expand...

Nobody here is suggesting that Mazepin deserves to be in F1.
But the way you post gives the impression you think he's completely without any kind of ability whatsoever - that's where I disagree with you.

OK, so in his debut race Mazepin spun off and crashed at turn 3.
Are you forgetting that Schumacher also managed to spin off? Is he too without talent?
Or does the fact that Schumacher managed to avoid the barrier while Mazepin didn't make the difference between them night & day?

I'm just asking people to keep a sense of perspective.


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## Jason.H (Mar 6, 2022)

Lance Stroll wouldn’t be there without his dads bank account. F1 moves very fast soon Mazepin will be forgotten. The fact that he’s been there this long is credit to him.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 6, 2022)

Jason.H said:



			Lance Stroll wouldn’t be there without his dads bank account. F1 moves very fast soon Mazepin will be forgotten. The fact that he’s been there this long is credit to him.
		
Click to expand...

Or how desperate Haas were to keep the money buying his seat rolling in


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## Jason.H (Mar 6, 2022)

Look back to Maldonado, he was bankrolled by Venezuela. Whilst the country’s economy was in free fall. At least he got there by winning GP2 and went on to win a F1 race in not the best of cars.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 6, 2022)

There are very few drivers in any top level motorsport that don’t have some serious financial backing. There are also quite a few trading on their family name. 

In F1 there are more drivers paying for a seat than not. Even the likes of Alsono and Perez.

Someone like Callum Ilott was much better than a number of the current F1 grid.  He simply doesn’t have the backing to fund a seat. 

Jamie Chadwick can’t get a seat in F3 because she doesn’t have a spare £1 million to pay for it. 

Top level karting will drain your wallet to the tune of £150k a season.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 6, 2022)

Jason.H said:



			Look back to Maldonado, he was bankrolled by Venezuela. Whilst the country’s economy was in free fall. At least he got there by winning GP2 and went on to win a F1 race in not the best of cars.
		
Click to expand...

I see your Maldonado and raise you a Pedro Diniz


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Nobody here is suggesting that Mazepin deserves to be in F1.
But the way you post gives the impression you think he's completely without any kind of ability whatsoever - that's where I disagree with you.

OK, so in his debut race Mazepin spun off and crashed at turn 3.
Are you forgetting that Schumacher also managed to spin off? Is he too without talent?
Or does the fact that Schumacher managed to avoid the barrier while Mazepin didn't make the difference between them night & day?

I'm just asking people to keep a sense of perspective.
		
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How many times did mazepin out qualify Schumacher?
How many times did he finish ahead of Schumacher?


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## cliveb (Mar 6, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			How many times did mazepin out qualify Schumacher?
How many times did he finish ahead of Schumacher?
		
Click to expand...

As a general rule I'm a calm and polite guy, but you're starting to irritate me.
Have you actually read what I've written and made any kind of attempt to understand it?

Let me ask you a couple of questions:
1. Do you actually believe Mazepin has no talent whatsoever - because that's how your postings come across?
2. How do you think you'd perform against Mazepin in an F1 car?


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			As a general rule I'm a calm and polite guy, but you're starting to irritate me.
Have you actually read what I've written and made any kind of attempt to understand it?

Let me ask you a couple of questions:
1. Do you actually believe Mazepin has no talent whatsoever - because that's how your postings come across?
2. How do you think you'd perform against Mazepin in an F1 car?
		
Click to expand...

1 yes talentless rich kid.
2 stupid whatifery

Can you give me examples of his talent?

I can show you plenty of his crappiness

Do you work for Uralkali or something?


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## cliveb (Mar 6, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			1 yes talentless rich kid.
2 stupid whatifery

Can you give me examples of his talent?

I can show you plenty of his crappiness

Do you work for Uralkali or something?
		
Click to expand...

There is no doubt that Mazepin's talent as a racing driver is way below everyone else on the F1 grid.

But an example that he has some degree of ability is that he can sometimes actually keep an F1 car on the circuit.
Something you & I wouldn't be capable of.

(And of course I have no connection to Uralkali - nor any other Russian organisation or person).

Your refusal to answer my second question says it all.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			There is no doubt that Mazepin's talent as a racing driver is way below everyone else on the F1 grid.

But an example that he has some degree of ability is that he can sometimes actually keep an F1 car on the circuit.
Something you & I wouldn't be capable of.

(And of course I have no connection to Uralkali - nor any other Russian organisation or person).

Your refusal to answer my second question says it all.
		
Click to expand...

I can't answer your question because it's stupid.


But here's mazepin keeping it on the track.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 7, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			1 yes talentless rich kid.
2 stupid whatifery

Can you give me examples of his talent?

I can show you plenty of his crappiness

Do you work for Uralkali or something?
		
Click to expand...

Despite your ranting, he’s far more talented a driver than 99% of everyone else competing in motorsport.

Yes he has been put through based on his Dad’s wealth, yes he appears to be a tit. But to say he is talentless is comical. 

Your main issue seems to be rich people spending money on their kids. Why is that?


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## theoneandonly (Mar 7, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Despite your ranting, he’s far more talented a driver than 99% of everyone else competing in motorsport.

Yes he has been put through based on his Dad’s wealth, yes he appears to be a tit. But to say he is talentless is comical.

Your main issue seems to be rich people spending money on their kids. Why is that?
		
Click to expand...

Who's ranting, what an odd thing to say. 

More talented than 99% than everyone else in Motorsport? 

The best comparison would be with his teammate as they have the same car and resources.
How did he fair against him?


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## SaintHacker (Mar 8, 2022)

So Christian Horner has now come out and said that no rules were broken and MV won the championship fairly. 🤦‍♂️ Is he actually that blinkered/deluded or is he just unhappy his puppet Masi isn't there to help him out any more and if they want to win another championship they will actually have to do it fairly?


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## Foxholer (Mar 8, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			So Christian Horner has now come out and said that *no rules were broken and MV won the championship fairly.* 🤦‍♂️ Is he actually that blinkered/deluded or is he just unhappy his puppet Masi isn't there to help him out any more and if they want to win another championship they will actually have to do it fairly?
		
Click to expand...

Er...What rule/s was/were broken? Are you suggesting Masi cheated/was corrupt?


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## bobmac (Mar 8, 2022)

There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to wave all the lapped cars past.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 8, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			Er...What rule/s was/were broken? Are you suggesting Masi cheated/was corrupt?
		
Click to expand...

The rules that were not followed, that ultimately resulted in Masi having to step away from that position. It was fairly well publicised at the time.


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## cliveb (Mar 8, 2022)

bobmac said:



			There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to wave all the lapped cars past.
		
Click to expand...

Not sure about the actual wording but it's my understanding that lapped cars don't HAVE to be waved through. However, the spirit of the rules are that if any are waved through, then they all should be.

Apart from that, the rule that was utterly ignored was the one about bringing in the safety car. Masi definitely brought it in 1 lap too soon.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 8, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Not sure about the actual wording but it's my understanding that lapped cars don't HAVE to be waved through. However, the spirit of the rules are that if any are waved through, then they all should be.

Apart from that, the rule that was utterly ignored was the one about bringing in the safety car. Masi definitely brought it in 1 lap too soon.
		
Click to expand...

Isn’t the rule. They are either let through or not? And then the safety car has to complete an additional lap once any lapped car has passed it. 

What Masi did was let some lapped cars through then pull the safety car in early.

Only one team were in support of Masi keeping his job as race director.


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## bobmac (Mar 8, 2022)

cliveb said:



*Not sure about the actual wording* but it's my understanding that lapped cars don't HAVE to be waved through.
Apart from that, the rule that was utterly ignored was the one about bringing in the safety car. Masi definitely brought it in 1 lap too soon.
		
Click to expand...

''There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to wave all the lapped cars past.''  Michael Masi, October 2020


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## Tashyboy (Mar 8, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			Er...What rule/s was/were broken? Are you suggesting Masi cheated/was corrupt?
		
Click to expand...

If you don’t know what rules were broken then there is possibly a suggestion that Masi cheated/was corrupt or just inept. He should be removed. CH saying he was bullied is pathetic to say the least.


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## Tashyboy (Mar 8, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Isn’t the rule. They are either let through or not? And then the safety car has to complete an additional lap once any lapped car has passed it.

What Masi did was let some lapped cars through then pull the safety car in early.

Only one team were in support of Masi keeping his job as race director.
		
Click to expand...

People can argue all day but what you have stated is 100% correct


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 8, 2022)

bobmac said:



			There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to wave all the lapped cars past.
		
Click to expand...

And only then, can the safety car come in.
Nothing surprises me with the Red Bull day  nursery


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## cliveb (Mar 8, 2022)

bobmac said:



			''There is a requirement in the sporting regulations to wave all the lapped cars past.''  Michael Masi, October 2020
		
Click to expand...

Given his record, I'm not sure we can take Masi's word for it.

OK, just checked the wording of the 2021 F1 sporting regs.



			39.12: If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW
OVERTAKE" has been sent to all teams Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars
that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the
safety car.
		
Click to expand...

This seems pretty definitive. If lapped cars are going to unlap themselves, then they must all do so.

But there's also this at the end of 39.12:



			If the clerk of the course considers track conditions are unsuitable for overtaking the message
"OVERTAKING WILL NOT BE PERMITTED" will be sent to all teams Competitors via the official
messaging system
		
Click to expand...

This unambiguously indicates that the lapped cars don't HAVE to be waved through if it is not appropriate.

My conclusion is that if Masi had wanted the race to end under the green flag, he should have not waved through any cars - which of course is exactly what he was going to do until Jonathan Wheatley bullied him into changing his mind.


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## greenone (Mar 8, 2022)

Tashyboy said:



			If you don’t know what rules were broken then there is possibly a suggestion that Masi cheated/was corrupt or just inept. He should be removed. CH saying he was bullied is pathetic to say the least.
		
Click to expand...

CH is pathetic full stop.


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## bobmac (Mar 8, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Given his record, I'm not sure we can take Masi's word for it.

OK, just checked the wording of the 2021 F1 sporting regs.

This seems pretty definitive. If lapped cars are going to unlap themselves, then they must all do so.

But there's also this at the end of 39.12:

This unambiguously indicates that the lapped cars don't HAVE to be waved through if it is not appropriate.

My conclusion is that if Masi had wanted the race to end under the green flag, he should have not waved through any cars - which of course is exactly what he was going to do until Jonathan Wheatley bullied him into changing his mind.
		
Click to expand...

I know what the regs say, I'm just pointing out the inconsistency of Masi


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## Tashyboy (Mar 8, 2022)

greenone said:



			CH is pathetic full stop.
		
Click to expand...

What would be interesting if any other teams echoed his thoughts. Somehow I think not.
Just out of interest ( and I don’t know) has Masi explained his reasoning behind his decisions in the last race last season.


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## Foxholer (Mar 8, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			The rules that were not followed, that ultimately resulted in Masi having to step away from that position. It was fairly well publicised at the time.
		
Click to expand...

So you can't actually specify them! And are simply showing your 'bias' toward Hamilton.
Masi didn't 'step away' - he was moved by F1 authorities, something they are entitled to do and a sensible move imo.
If the rules were not followed, how come Mercedes's appeal was rejected?
It seems to me that some folk simply can't accept a 'not preferred' result.
Anyway...Back to this season - as per the thread title.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 8, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			So you can't actually specify them! And are simply showing your 'bias' toward Hamilton.
Masi didn't 'step away' - he was moved by F1 authorities, something they are entitled to do and a sensible move imo.
If the rules were not followed, how come Mercedes's appeal was rejected?
It seems to me that some folk simply can't accept a 'not preferred' result.
Anyway...Back to this season - as per the thread title.
		
Click to expand...

Please see the detailed comments that followed mine by others. Or, are you choosing to ignore them? If rules were followed, there's have been zero controversy and Masi still in the job. That was the point I was making


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## Piece (Mar 8, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			So you can't actually specify them! And are simply showing your 'bias' toward Hamilton.
Masi didn't 'step away' - he was moved by F1 authorities, something they are entitled to do and a sensible move imo.
If the rules were not followed, how come Mercedes's appeal was rejected?
It seems to me that some folk simply can't accept a 'not preferred' result.
Anyway...Back to this season - as per the thread title.
		
Click to expand...

This has all been covered months ago in this thread.


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## DanFST (Mar 8, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			So you can't actually specify them! And are simply showing your 'bias' toward Hamilton.
Masi didn't 'step away' - he was moved by F1 authorities, something they are entitled to do and a sensible move imo.
If the rules were not followed, how come Mercedes's appeal was rejected?
It seems to me that some folk simply can't accept a 'not preferred' result.
Anyway...Back to this season - as per the thread title.
		
Click to expand...


No one is going to bite at your nonsense. It's been done 1000x

EDIT: read 48.12 of the F1 sporting regs.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 8, 2022)

T


DanFST said:



			No one is going to bite at your* twaddle*. It's been done 1000x

EDIT: read 48.12 of the F1 sporting regs.
		
Click to expand...

Fixed that for you


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## Foxholer (Mar 8, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Fixed that for you

Click to expand...


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## Foxholer (Mar 8, 2022)

DanFST said:



			No one is going to bite at your nonsense. It's been done 1000x

EDIT: read 48.12 of the F1 sporting regs.
		
Click to expand...

Notwithstanding that this thread is 2022 F1....
So why wasn't that that reg included - and accepted as a significant/catastrophic breach of the rules - in the appeal?! And that (why wasn't Mercedes set of arguments accepted in the appeal) will always my reply...Why, if rules were broken (by Masi), did the appeal fail?
FWIW...According to the FIA/Stewards 15.3 overrides/overules 48.12 (and, presumably, others).  
Now, as I posted earlier...Back to this season - as per the thread title.


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## DanFST (Mar 9, 2022)

Foxholer said:



			Notwithstanding that this thread is 2022 F1....
		
Click to expand...

*No one cares*, you brought it up.

Your contribution is just a troll, as most threads.


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## Foxholer (Mar 9, 2022)

DanFST said:



*No one cares*, you brought it up.
...
		
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Twaddle! Sainthacker did - in post 98


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## bobmac (Mar 9, 2022)

There would have been no argument without post no.99.

Masi got it wrong, everyone knows that and because of that and other bad decisions throughout the season, he was sacked.


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## Wabinez (Mar 9, 2022)

So, back on topic….


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501110911896936452

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501471601186926594
I’m here for this!


----------



## bobmac (Mar 9, 2022)

Pick your two front rows on the grid next week and what happens at the first corner  
Hamilton, Russell, Verstappen, Vettel and Vettel shoves Max into the gravel.


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## Cherry13 (Mar 9, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			So, back on topic….


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501110911896936452

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501471601186926594
I’m here for this!
		
Click to expand...

They did put two models through the crash simulations, and one of those was a radical sidepod solution… it said at the time that it had failed and they weren’t going to do any more development on it. Maybe they’ve managed to get round this and will have that new sidepod in place. 
I hope they aren’t a second faster though, that will suck majorly if one team just blows everyone away.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 9, 2022)

K-Mag is back as the other Haas driver.


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## greenone (Mar 9, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			K-Mag is back as the other Haas driver.
		
Click to expand...

Just as Gunther thought his office door was safe.


----------



## Canary_Yellow (Mar 9, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			So, back on topic….


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501110911896936452

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1501471601186926594
I’m here for this!
		
Click to expand...

There's no way they will be coming with no side pods. Where would the side impact protection be? 

I hope Merc continue to smash it personally, particularly after the unjust outcome of last season, but if they do, it won't be as a consequence of no side pods!


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## theoneandonly (Mar 9, 2022)

Would have been amusing if Haas hadn't already binned them.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/60678476


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## BiMGuy (Mar 9, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			There's no way they will be coming with no side pods. Where would the side impact protection be?

I hope Merc continue to smash it personally, particularly after the unjust outcome of last season, but if they do, it won't be as a consequence of no side pods!
		
Click to expand...

Do the side pods contain any crash protection? I thought that the safety cell was just the tub.


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## Wabinez (Mar 10, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			There's no way they will be coming with no side pods. Where would the side impact protection be?

I hope Merc continue to smash it personally, particularly after the unjust outcome of last season, but if they do, it won't be as a consequence of no side pods!
		
Click to expand...

you mean like this?


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## BiMGuy (Mar 10, 2022)

The Mercedes looks crazy on the track.

Horner has already committed that the Mercedes is not within the spirit or the regs 🤣


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## greenone (Mar 10, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			The Mercedes looks crazy on the track.

Horner has already committed that the Mercedes is not within the spirit or the regs 🤣
		
Click to expand...

Spitting his dummy like he did with DAS. As a Design Engineer I think it's an amazing bit of work.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 10, 2022)




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## Swango1980 (Mar 10, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			The Mercedes looks crazy on the track.

Horner has already committed that the Mercedes is not within the spirit or the regs 🤣
		
Click to expand...

Horner spends more time talking about other teams than he does Red Bull. Well, specifically the teams that are beating or challenging his team. Strange that.


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## Cherry13 (Mar 10, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			The Mercedes looks crazy on the track.

Horner has already committed that the Mercedes is not within the spirit or the regs 🤣
		
Click to expand...

Bit of a row back from RBR on those comments, Horner basically denying he said it, and hasn’t had time to look at Merc.  
To be fair to RBR and the other teams, if 9 teams turn up with a certain look and approach to an area of the car and 1 team is DRASTICALLY different then the FIA should be expected to look at it and clarify.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 10, 2022)

I've no time for Mercedes or Red Bull as they both spent most of their time throwing their toys out of their prams.  But you cannot trust Christian Horner's judgement on anything after he married Ginger Spice.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 10, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			I've no time for Mercedes or Red Bull as they both spent most of their time throwing their toys out of their prams.  But you cannot trust Christian Horner's judgement on anything after he married Ginger Spice.
		
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Interesting perception. From my angle, Mercedes rarely seem to come out and criticise other teams so publicly. I may be wrong, but it always appears when they do get involved in anything, it is only as a reaction to Red Bull starting the war of words. Even then, Mercedes don't seem to bite too often. Yes, they were very public about their discontent after the season finale, however most of us in here understand why that was.


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## Beedee (Mar 10, 2022)

From BBC Sport - "BBC Sport understands the FIA has looked at the Mercedes design and given it the all-clear. And it seems the FIA has also run it in CFD analysis and found it did not worsen the car’s wake - which is Brawn’s key concern with the regs, in terms of disrupting airflow for following cars. "

Doesn't stop protests or things changing of course.   Remember the X wings from a few years ago.  Within the rules, but the rules changed, primarily because Bernie thought they looked wrong.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 10, 2022)

F1 has always been about innovation - Brabham's fan car in 1978, ground effects, the Lotus two-chassis car etc.   Now it seems harder and harder to do anything clever and innovative.
But I will go with any rule that pisses Horner off or stops that nob Hamilton winning.


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## Wabinez (Mar 10, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			F1 has always been about innovation - Brabham's fan car in 1978, ground effects, the Lotus two-chassis car etc.   Now it seems harder and harder to do anything clever and innovative.
*But I will go with any rule that pisses Horner off or stops that nob Hamilton winning.*

Click to expand...

as it stands, you are going to be annoyed in some way. Either Hamilton will win and piss Horner off.

or Horner is happy and Hamilton loses.


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## Piece (Mar 10, 2022)

I'm liking all these design interpretations. Get each team thinking...and then copying.


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## Dando (Mar 10, 2022)

greenone said:



			Spitting his dummy like he did with DAS. As a Design Engineer I think it's an amazing bit of work.
		
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good old whinger spice doing what he does best


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 10, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			you mean like this?

View attachment 41727


View attachment 41728


View attachment 41729

Click to expand...

It does have side pods, they’re just narrower.

Some of the suggestions yesterday were no side pods at all!


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 10, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Horner spends more time talking about other teams than he does Red Bull. Well, specifically the teams that are beating or challenging his team. Strange that.
		
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Whilst also ignoring his own teams rule bending and driver issues....


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 10, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Do the side pods contain any crash protection? I thought that the safety cell was just the tub.
		
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The safety cell is, but there is also two side impact protection spars, one low down, one higher up, sticking out from the side of the car alongside the driver.

If I recall right, they were introduced after kubica’s smash


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## BiMGuy (Mar 10, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			The safety cell is, but there is also two side impact protection spars, one low down, one higher up, sticking out from the side of the car alongside the driver.

If I recall right, they were introduced after kubica’s smash
		
Click to expand...

They were mentioned during testing and the Merc sidepods are right on the limit of the side impact bars.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 10, 2022)

Not sure I like the ability of the teams to vote to change the rules mid season. Sounds like if 8 teams vote for a change it gets passed.

Guess if there is something in this design, it’s got a limited shelf life....

Hard to see how the mirror mounts will survive. Maybe merc have thrown that in as something they’re happy to give away?!


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## bobmac (Mar 11, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			Not sure I like the ability of the teams to vote to change the rules mid season. Sounds like if 8 teams vote for a change it gets passed.
		
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From what I've gathered the FIA and Formula One still have to agree to the changes to get them passed.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 11, 2022)

bobmac said:



			From what I've gathered the FIA and Formula One still have to agree to the changes to get them passed.
		
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My understanding is that Mercedes have passed all of their new designs through the FIA and have been given the OK. Obviously if 8 of the teams decide they want to see a change in the rules as set down, something may be done. However you have to laugh at Horner and Red Bull complaining of "spirit of the rules" when they have had flexy rear wings, suspect under tray aero and a driver who deliberately runs an opponent off the track.


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## bobmac (Mar 11, 2022)

I'd like to be associated with the remarks of the previous speaker  

Horner is only complaining about the sidepods because he didn't think of it.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 11, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			However you have to laugh at Horner and Red Bull complaining of "spirit of the rules" when they have had flexy rear wings, suspect under tray aero and a driver who deliberately runs an opponent off the track.
		
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Even Ross Brawn tried not to laugh when questioned about that yesterday, then basically said rules are black or white, something is either legal or it isn't. Someone from the FIA needs to have a word in Horners ear, he's becoming an embarrassing parody of himself.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 11, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Even Ross Brawn tried not to laugh when questioned about that yesterday, then basically said rules are black or white, something is either legal or it isn't. Someone from the FIA needs to have a word in Horners ear, he's becoming an embarrassing parody of himself.
		
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Question is..which is the "mini me", Horner or JS?


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 11, 2022)

bobmac said:



			From what I've gathered the FIA and Formula One still have to agree to the changes to get them passed.
		
Click to expand...

They do, yes. Hopefully, in line with Brawn's comments yesterday, they would only interject if the something was being done within the rules which inhibited the ability of the cars to race closer together.


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## SteveW86 (Mar 11, 2022)

I know it’s technically about last season, but new series of drive to survive out today on Netflix. Bit of binge watching this weekend


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## cliveb (Mar 11, 2022)

SteveW86 said:



			I know it’s technically about last season, but new series of drive to survive out today on Netflix. Bit of binge watching this weekend
		
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Have seen the first 3 episodes, and Horner shows his true colours even more than in the earlier seasons. The man is just incapable of accepting the truth and slings mud around at every opportunity.


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## SteveW86 (Mar 11, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Have seen the first 3 episodes, and Horner shows his true colours even more than in the earlier seasons. The man is just incapable of accepting the truth and slings mud around at every opportunity.
		
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With the amount of rain delays at “The Players”, should have the season done by tomorrow


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## Beezerk (Mar 11, 2022)

SteveW86 said:



			I know it’s technically about last season, but new series of drive to survive out today on Netflix. Bit of binge watching this weekend
		
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It got absolutely destroyed in a review on the radio this morning, called it contrived rubbish.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 11, 2022)

Beezerk said:



			It got absolutely destroyed in a review on the radio this morning, called it contrived rubbish.
		
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That’s exactly what it is. It’s designed to sex up “the show”. It has worked as intended to bring new fans to the sport.

It’s also had the impact of making some of the races contrived rubbish.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 11, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Have seen the first 3 episodes, and Horner shows his true colours even more than in the earlier seasons. The man is just incapable of accepting the truth and slings mud around at every opportunity.
		
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SAme here. Looking forward to the Haas episode tomorrow, usually one of the more 'entertaining' ones


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## Cherry13 (Mar 12, 2022)

So are Mercedes’ struggling or sand-bagging?? They are pretty far off the pace at the moment, so I think may be struggling more than usual. 
Horner withdrawing his ‘complaint’ also suggests the radical design isn’t that brilliant.


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## Beedee (Mar 12, 2022)

Cherry13 said:



			So are Mercedes’ struggling or sand-bagging?? They are pretty far off the pace at the moment, so I think may be struggling more than usual.
Horner withdrawing his ‘complaint’ also suggests the radical design isn’t that brilliant.
		
Click to expand...

Ferrari's comments suggest that they think Mercedes were sandbagging, but I guess they would say that.

Whether Merc's idea works or not, I'll guarantee that quite a few of the teams have their engineers working on models, and their lawyers working on objections this weekend, just in case.


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## Captainron (Mar 12, 2022)

Watching the new Drive to Survive. Such a good series. Makes me so happy that Verstappen won it last season. Hope it’s another tight season.


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## Smiffy (Mar 12, 2022)

Cherry13 said:



			Horner withdrawing his ‘complaint’ also suggests the radical design isn’t that brilliant.
		
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Or that he's been told to shut the f**k up already...
🙄🙄🙄


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## BiMGuy (Mar 12, 2022)

The Merc doesn’t look as settled as some of the Ferrari.

But they have been running lower power for whatever reason.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 12, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Watching the new Drive to Survive. Such a good series. Makes me so happy that Verstappen won it last season. Hope it’s another tight season.
		
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Great show.   Always makes me laugh in Series 1 where that nob Hamilton never gets a mention because he refused to be part of it.  Then he saw how popular it was and he started jumping all over the place to be included.


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## Cherry13 (Mar 12, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			Or that he's been told to shut the f**k up already...
🙄🙄🙄
		
Click to expand...

By who though? Helmut won’t tell him to shut up, he stirs as much as anybody. I think they are quietly confident that merc won’t be able to put it together and get it working. (This is where I end up with egg on my face next week)

The little i seen this morning, it looked promising the cars following each other.


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## Beedee (Mar 12, 2022)

Qualifying time last year was 1.28.997.  You needed a 1.30.6 to get to Q3.  Best time of the test so far is a 1.32.6.  So either the new cars are dog slow, or everyone's doing a lot of sandbagging.


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## Smiffy (Mar 12, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Qualifying time last year was 1.28.997.  You needed a 1.30.6 to get to Q3.  Best time of the test so far is a 1.32.6.  So either the new cars are dog slow, or everyone's doing a lot of sandbagging.
		
Click to expand...

There's a big difference between testing and quali.


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## bobmac (Mar 12, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			There's a big difference between testing and quali.
		
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I doubt we'll see the real speed until Q3


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## BiMGuy (Mar 12, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Qualifying time last year was 1.28.997.  You needed a 1.30.6 to get to Q3.  Best time of the test so far is a 1.32.6.  So either the new cars are dog slow, or everyone's doing a lot of sandbagging.
		
Click to expand...

I think it’s a bit of both. These cars are much heavier and have less downforce, so you would expect them to be slower.


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## SteveW86 (Mar 13, 2022)

Finished drive to survive, can’t believe the season ended like that


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## Beezerk (Mar 13, 2022)

SteveW86 said:



			Finished drive to survive, can’t believe the season ended like that
		
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What a complete farce? A whole season of battling by two great drivers decided by the narcissism of one man.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 14, 2022)

Watched the Haas episode last night, brilliant as expected. Shows the Mazepin family in a very poor light, don't know if that was the intention but if accurate I can imagine Gunther and co are glad to have been given a way to get rid of them


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## BiMGuy (Mar 14, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Watched the Haas episode last night, brilliant as expected. Shows the Mazepin family in a very poor light, don't know if that was the intention but if accurate I can imagine Gunther and co are glad to have been given a way to get rid of them
		
Click to expand...

There was a huge difference in how happy the team looked with K-Mag back in the car during testing.


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## cliveb (Mar 14, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Watched the Haas episode last night, brilliant as expected. Shows the Mazepin family in a very poor light, don't know if that was the intention but if accurate I can imagine Gunther and co are glad to have been given a way to get rid of them
		
Click to expand...

Haas missed a trick when Mazepin pretty much accused them of giving Schumacher a better car and asked them to swap the cars.
OK, so they gave him a new chassis, but surely the way to put it to bed would have been to do exactly as he asked and swap the cars.
Then when Schumacher blew him away once more, the penny might have finally dropped.


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## Smiffy (Mar 14, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Shows the Mazepin family in a very poor light, don't know if that was the intention but if accurate I can imagine Gunther and co are glad to have been given a way to get rid of them
		
Click to expand...

What a couple of Jodrells they came across as. It just wouldn't sink in with either of them that Junior wasn't anywhere near good enough. And a nasty piece of work too.


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## woofers (Mar 14, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			Or that he's been told to shut the f**k up already...
🙄🙄🙄
		
Click to expand...

which would be nice….


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## woofers (Mar 14, 2022)

Watched the Senna documentary on Sky last night, all from the time when I followed F1 every week. Very revealing regarding him, Prost, the cars, the authorities and the onboard cameras which I don’t recall being shown at the time.
Fascinating, and moving, couple of hours. Worth seeing.


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## Tashyboy (Mar 15, 2022)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/60758648

Well well well.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 16, 2022)

Watched the second episode of Race to Survive last night and Lando Norris was playing at Pyrford GC which is just down the road from the McLaren base in Woking.  They showed him on the 1st and 2nd holes and looking for a ball on the 5th.  So at least I can say I'm like him in that regard.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 16, 2022)

Beezerk said:



			What a complete farce? A whole season of battling by two great drivers decided by the narcissism of one man.
		
Click to expand...

But the nob didn't win so it was a GREAT result


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## bobmac (Mar 16, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			But the nob didn't win so it was a GREAT result   

Click to expand...

You may not like Lewis but do you think he did enough to win the race?


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## BiMGuy (Mar 16, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			But the nob didn't win so it was a GREAT result   

Click to expand...

Username checks out


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## Beezerk (Mar 16, 2022)

bobmac said:



			You may not like Lewis but do you think he did enough to win the race?
		
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Both Mercedes and Lewis totally dominated the race, Red Bull were only left with desperation tactics and the hope that something “off script” would happen, and they got their wish.


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## SteveW86 (Mar 16, 2022)

Have just seen the safety cars rules have been amended to say that ALL lapped cars should unlap themselves.


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## woofers (Mar 16, 2022)

Moral victory for Hamilton last year then.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 16, 2022)

bobmac said:



			You may not like Lewis but do you think he did enough to win the race?
		
Click to expand...

Bob I really have no idea.  I didn't watch it in any detail.  Me disliking him is just the same as some people on this forum laughing at rival football teams losing.   Some people really need to get a life!
I respect his ability - I just think he's a nob.  I dealt with him in person in 2007 at the first NFL regular season game at Wembley when he was an honorary captain.  He wasn't even a world champion then and was a dick that day.  I was working with Martin Johnson who just despaired at the future of English sport with him and John Terry who was there as well.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 17, 2022)

Vettel is out of the first GP with covid. The Hulk is stepping in for the weekend.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 17, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			Bob I really have no idea.  I didn't watch it in any detail.  Me disliking him is just the same as some people on this forum laughing at rival football teams losing.   Some people really need to get a life!
I respect his ability - I just think he's a nob.  I dealt with him in person in 2007 at the first NFL regular season game at Wembley when he was an honorary captain.  He wasn't even a world champion then and was a *dick that day*.  I was working with Martin Johnson who just despaired at the future of English sport with him and John Terry who was there as well.
		
Click to expand...

What did he do that day to warrant being called a dick?


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 17, 2022)

Long time ago but he was being really obnoxious to the support staff on the field, ignored a couple of very polite requests off the field for a picture or autograph and was just acting like a prima donna.  Martin Johnson on the other hand, was going out of his way to be helpful to everyone.  And both were being paid £10K+ to be there that day.


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## bobmac (Mar 17, 2022)

Is it not possible that he may have learned to cope better with the public in the last 15 years?


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## Foxholer (Mar 17, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			What did he do that day to warrant being called a dick?
		
Click to expand...

I've seen him quite close on a golf course a couple of times - some time ago.
He was the epitome of a spoilt brat. He seems to have matured somewhat, at least as an F1 driver, since then though.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 17, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			Long time ago but he was being really obnoxious to the support staff on the field, ignored a couple of very polite requests off the field for a picture or autograph and was just acting like a prima donna.  Martin Johnson on the other hand, was going out of his way to be helpful to everyone.  And both were being paid £10K+ to be there that day.
		
Click to expand...

It is interesting people's perception, a guy at my golf club had a similar experience with him.

However, as part of his duties with Mercedes and other sponsors, I bet he has had to attend thousands of corporate events and meet tens of thousands of people in his career. Maybe he is simply not the most sociable person, and I bet it is difficult for an individual to be engaging with everyone they meet. To you, or the guy at my golf club, it is a rare opportunity to meet a very famous person, and something you remember for the rest of your days. To him, it is just another event where he meets many many people, and has to think of ways to engage with many different personalities. I'm not surprised that he didn't necessarily take a shine to you or many other people he meets, and seems quite offish. He probably also has security around him frequently, so he may get used to keeping a certain amount of distance between him and people he does not know, both physically and socially.

However, I doubt the above makes him a knob, even if it is not the ideal encounter for the member of the public. I reckon many of us would get sick and tired of constant public attention and having to be on top form when we are around people, especially if we do not have the charismatic social skills few people actually possess. Maybe there is a better case of him being accused as a knob if he went out of his way to be nasty to someone, but it often seems people make this accusation simply because he didn't go out of his way to make them feel he was really glad to meet them.


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 17, 2022)

Fair point.  There is a former NFL QB named Trent Dilfer who I know well and is one of the nicest people you could ever wish to meet.   In 1998, he had signed a ton of autographs for fans at an event and had to rush off at the end to meet his wife at the hospital for a pre-natal scan.  One fan tried to chase him to his car to sign a bunch of cards and Trent was very apologetic but had to go.  The fan then went on local radio and slagged him off to high heaven.   Trent ended up calling the show two days later to explain but what could he do?

On Hamilton, I just don't like him.  That is my perspective and to quote Bobby Brown, my prerogative.


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## Smiffy (Mar 17, 2022)

I disliked Horner anyway. But listening to his whinging and comments aimed at Lewis Hamilton and Toto Wolfe just show what a nasty piece of work the bloke is.


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## Yorkhacker (Mar 17, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			Me disliking him is just the same as some people on this forum laughing at rival football teams losing.   Some people really need to get a life!
		
Click to expand...

Does that mean you really need to get a life?


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## Foxholer (Mar 17, 2022)

Yorkhacker said:



			Does that mean you really need to get a life?
		
Click to expand...

Quite likely applies to 99% of the regular posters on here, myself included.


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## Beedee (Mar 17, 2022)

So it all starts for real tomorrow.  Really looking forward to it.

I see the new race director has come out with a simple rule for track boundaries.  Words to the effect of "As per the rule book, the white lines define the track; the curbs don't".  Good, it's annoyed me for years that all the drivers take the mickey at every race.  And every session seemed to have different rules about what was track and what wasn't.  It was pathetic.

I could never understand the "there's no benefit in cutting this corner" argument.  If there was no benefit the drivers wouldn't have been doing it every single lap.


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## Foxholer (Mar 17, 2022)

Beedee said:



			So it all starts for real tomorrow.  Really looking forward to it.

I see the new race director has come out with a simple rule for track boundaries.  Words to the effect of "As per the rule book, the white lines define the track; the curbs don't".  Good, it's annoyed me for years that all the drivers take the mickey at every race.  And every session seemed to have different rules about what was track and what wasn't.  It was pathetic.

I could never understand the "there's no benefit in cutting this corner" argument.  If there was no benefit the drivers wouldn't have been doing it every single lap.
		
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Some sort of 'bumper strip' - the kind that rattles suspension - would sort it out! Enough to force speed reduction without compromising safety.


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## Wilson (Mar 17, 2022)

I’ve just finished DTS, the finish to last season was a fix.

edited to add, I know Hamilton can be a polarising figure, but the way he handled himself after what happened was exemplary. Pretty sure if that was me, Masi would be picking his teeth out of my helmet.

And Horner is a bell end.


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## Jason.H (Mar 17, 2022)

Looking forward to it. A big change in regulations shakes thing up. Adrian Newey is arguably the best F1 car  designer ever and I  expect Red Bull to hit the ground running. Ferrari look like they have a competitive car also.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 18, 2022)

I'm looking forward to seeing the cars again today in FP1.

Today seems like it might be all about the findings from Abu Dhabi though... I really don't understand why Red Bull and Verstappen are persisting with their line that there was no error made at Abu Dhabi and Merc are bullies. As long as they keep saying that, the issue will continue to exist and be a problem. Wouldn't it be much better for them to deflect focus on to the season as a whole - I don't think any other than the most blinkered of Hamilton fans would argue that regardless of how it happened, Verstappen was a worthy winner all things considered. I don't think acknowledging the controversy of Abu Dhabi would tarnish Verstappen's championship, at least, not more than it is already being tarnished by the approach they are taking of denying that anything wasn't quite right.

Anyway, onwards and upwards, hopefully....


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## Wilson (Mar 18, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			I'm looking forward to seeing the cars again today in FP1.

Today seems like it might be all about the findings from Abu Dhabi though... I really don't understand why Red Bull and Verstappen are persisting with their line that there was no error made at Abu Dhabi and Merc are bullies. As long as they keep saying that, the issue will continue to exist and be a problem. Wouldn't it be much better for them to deflect focus on to the season as a whole - I don't think any other than the most blinkered of Hamilton fans would argue that regardless of how it happened, Verstappen was a worthy winner all things considered. I don't think acknowledging the controversy of Abu Dhabi would tarnish Verstappen's championship, at least, not more than it is already being tarnished by the approach they are taking of denying that anything wasn't quite right.

Anyway, onwards and upwards, hopefully....
		
Click to expand...

I'm not a massive fan of any of the drivers, I'd always like the British ones to win, but I have no particular affinity to any driver or team - Hamilton should have won last year's championship due to the farce of the last race. I don't buy the line about Masi being under pressure and making a mistake, there are a team around him who I'm sure would have been reminding him of the rules, I think F1 wanted a last lap showdown, and ideally a new world champion, and they got both.

I can't see how Red Bull can acknowledge there was an error made, if they do it taints Verstappen's title, so they have to continue the charade.


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## cliveb (Mar 18, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			I really don't understand why Red Bull and Verstappen are persisting with their line that there was no error made at Abu Dhabi and Merc are bullies.
		
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The hypocrisy of Christian Horner is just breathtaking. He accuses Mercedes of bullying the FIA into firing Masi when it was him and Jonathan Wheatley who bullied Masi into breaking the rules for their benefit. Masi's removal was ultimately more down to Red Bull's behaviour than Merc's.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 18, 2022)

cliveb said:



			The hypocrisy of Christian Horner is just breathtaking. He accuses Mercedes of bullying the FIA into firing Masi when it was him and Jonathan Wheatley who bullied Masi into breaking the rules for their benefit. Masi's removal was ultimately more down to Red Bull's behaviour than Merc's.
		
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You can't say that....Horner is working on the principal that if he says it enough, people will think it must be true. The guy is an embarressment to F1.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 18, 2022)

Wilson said:



			I'm not a massive fan of any of the drivers, I'd always like the British ones to win, but I have no particular affinity to any driver or team - Hamilton should have won last year's championship due to the farce of the last race. I don't buy the line about Masi being under pressure and making a mistake, there are a team around him who I'm sure would have been reminding him of the rules, I think F1 wanted a last lap showdown, and ideally a new world champion, and they got both.

I can't see how Red Bull can acknowledge there was an error made, if they do it taints Verstappen's title, so they have to continue the charade.
		
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The title is tainted either way, I think their pig headed defence of Masi’s decision making makes them look silly.


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## BrianM (Mar 19, 2022)

https://www.skysports.com/share/12570003
Not a big F1 fan but Human error was to blame for Lewis not winning title, Masi hung out to dry, even though he’s hardly mentioned 😂😂


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## 4LEX (Mar 19, 2022)

Last season was a write off, null and void to everyone bar Red Bull and Max. They didn't win it fair and square.


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## Tashyboy (Mar 19, 2022)

Because of the shower of crap that was last years F1 finale. I will not be watching this years F1

Last years winner should have an asterisk against it.


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## Neilds (Mar 19, 2022)

When will people realise that this is the *2022 *thread and just LET IT GO!!!


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## Tashyboy (Mar 19, 2022)

Neilds said:



			When will people realise that this is the *2022 *thread and just LET IT GO!!!
		
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Mods can we have an F1 thread that’s like the Football thread and just continues. Some like to bury there heads in the sand but not others.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 19, 2022)

Tashyboy said:



			Mods can we have an F1 thread that’s like the Football thread and just continues. Some like to bury there heads in the sand but not others.
		
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Rather you should start a thread about RB , Masi and co so you can spout the same shit over and over thats already been done to death.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 19, 2022)

Interesting grid with K-Mag in the mix and Ferrari on pole.  I can't see the winner coming from outside the top 4 but you never know.  I think it's damage limitation for Merc.


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## AmandaJR (Mar 19, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Interesting grid with K-Mag in the mix and Ferrari on pole.  I can't see the winner coming from outside the top 4 but you never know.  I think it's damage limitation for Merc.
		
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Just dipped into this thread for the last time for the same reason. I won't watch it as still think it was an absolute joke how the season was allowed to end. I'd think that irrelevant of those involved as it was just crazy decision-making and nothing to do with the performance of both drivers/teams in the decider. I'm oot!


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## Tashyboy (Mar 19, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Rather you should start a thread about RB , Masi and co so you can spout the same shit over and over thats already been done to death.
		
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What have I spouted. Something that has been quoted in an official investigation. There’s only one person talking shit and his mirror is broke.


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## Tashyboy (Mar 19, 2022)

AmandaJR said:



			Just dipped into this thread for the last time for the same reason. I won't watch it as still think it was an absolute joke how the season was allowed to end. I'd think that irrelevant of those involved as it was just crazy decision-making and nothing to do with the performance of both drivers/teams in the decider. I'm oot!
		
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Surely not Amanda. Some May suggest your talking shit. 😉


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 19, 2022)

Thought the cars looked good , Liked the way the wheels mixed in - also they  seemed to be using a new camera angle showing the view from the drivers angle - impressive


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## Cherry13 (Mar 19, 2022)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Thought the cars looked good , Liked the way the wheels mixed in - also they  seemed to be using a new camera angle showing the view from the drivers angle - impressive
		
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Yeh that new camera is amazing, genuinely one of the best sports viewing innovations in years. The information on the steering wheel, the view (lack of) for the drivers is just immense to take in.  
As for the report, it is what it is now, and time to move on.  Ultimately Masi has toon the fall, and I actually think that’s probably fair and right. He was out of his depth and panicked and allowed himself to be backed into a lose lose corner.  Let’s move on, concentrate on the new season and hopefully we’ll have a battle between 3 teams in a few races. 

I think the F1 will be ecstatic that Ferrari look to be back, a battle between them, Mercedes’ red bull and hopefully mclaren would be the absolute ideal scenario.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 19, 2022)

Hamilton only 5th. Clear that Mercedes not quite on it yet but enjoyable qualifying session with the new cars going for it for the first time


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 19, 2022)

Cherry13 said:



			Yeh that new camera is amazing, genuinely one of the best sports viewing innovations in years. The information on the steering wheel, the view (lack of) for the drivers is just immense to take in. 
As for the report, it is what it is now, and time to move on.  Ultimately Masi has toon the fall, and I actually think that’s probably fair and right. He was out of his depth and panicked and allowed himself to be backed into a lose lose corner.  Let’s move on, concentrate on the new season and hopefully we’ll have a battle between 3 teams in a few races.

I think the F1 will be ecstatic that Ferrari look to be back, a battle between them, Mercedes’ red bull and hopefully mclaren would be the absolute ideal scenario.
		
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It was fascinating- seeing the steering wheel but you could almost feel the bumps , their control of the car was very impressive, hopefully they use it a fair bit


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 19, 2022)

Cherry13 said:



			Yeh that new camera is amazing, genuinely one of the best sports viewing innovations in years. The information on the steering wheel, the view (lack of) for the drivers is just immense to take in. 
As for the report, it is what it is now, and time to move on.  Ultimately Masi has toon the fall, and I actually think that’s probably fair and right. He was out of his depth and panicked and allowed himself to be backed into a lose lose corner.  Let’s move on, concentrate on the new season and hopefully we’ll have a battle between 3 teams in a few races.

I think the F1 will be ecstatic that Ferrari look to be back, a battle between them, Mercedes’ red bull and hopefully mclaren would be the absolute ideal scenario.
		
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Think F1 needs a third team to spoil the big two party. It needs something to try and regain its lost credibility from last year. Some great camera shots will enhance the coverage


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## theoneandonly (Mar 19, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Think F1 needs a third team to spoil the big two party. It needs something to try and regain its lost credibility from last year. Some great camera shots will enhance the coverage
		
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Did you watch it today? I get the impression not.


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## BrianM (Mar 19, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Think F1 needs a third team to spoil the big two party. It needs something to try and regain its lost credibility from last year. Some great camera shots will enhance the coverage
		
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Ferrari are on pole……


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## Piece (Mar 19, 2022)

Haas in seventh...


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## cliveb (Mar 20, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Interesting grid with K-Mag in the mix and Ferrari on pole.  I can't see the winner coming from outside the top 4 but you never know.  I think it's damage limitation for Merc.
		
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The fact we have Alfa Romeo and Haas in 6th & 7th on the grid (plus Ferrari on pole) would seem to suggest that Ferrari have made better progress with their engine than the others.

Shame about McLaren, who seemed to be looking good in testing.


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## Foxholer (Mar 20, 2022)

cliveb said:



			The fact we have Alfa Romeo and Haas in 6th & 7th on the grid (plus Ferrari on pole) would seem to suggest that Ferrari have made better progress with* their engine* than the others.
...
		
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Well, 'their Car'!


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## theoneandonly (Mar 20, 2022)

cliveb said:



			The fact we have Alfa Romeo and Haas in 6th & 7th on the grid (plus Ferrari on pole) would seem to suggest that Ferrari have made better progress with their engine than the others.

Shame about McLaren, who seemed to be looking good in testing.
		
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Yes I'd expected more from McLaren, I can understand Riccardo being off the pace but a shame to see them both down the order. Haas are being called the white Ferrari 😂 reminds me of the tracing point team 🤣


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## Pathetic Shark (Mar 20, 2022)

A win for Fernando, Nico, Sergio, Daniel, Valtteri, Kevin, Max, Esteban, Carlos, Lance, Pierre, Charles, George, Lando, Nicholas, Alexander, Guanyu, Mick or Yuki would make me happy today


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## Dando (Mar 20, 2022)

Red Bull 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

They need those wings now


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## woofers (Mar 20, 2022)

Oh dear, that’s a shame for that nice Mr Horner……


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## Piece (Mar 20, 2022)

That's a few Brucey Bonuses! Max gets stroppy then retires, and Perez spins on the last lap to hand Hamilton a third place. That's peed on a few people's chips. Lovely stuff. 👍


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 20, 2022)

I think it’s clear to see that after last years ending the interest in F1 has hugely increased - with the added bonus is Ferrari being competitive this season has the potential to be a cracker. Verstappen winning last year could be the best thing to happen to the sport


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## theoneandonly (Mar 20, 2022)

Overall an enjoyable race with some good overtaking. Bonkers finish and RB will have to be concerned how both cars packed up with a few laps to go.  All in all I'd say the changes have had a good effect and hopefully we'll see more good racing.


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## SaintHacker (Mar 20, 2022)

3 out of 4 RB engines going pop, thats got to be a worry. What a shame...


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## greenone (Mar 20, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			3 out of 4 RB engines going pop, thats got to be a worry. What a shame...
		
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Hopefully plenty more will during the season. Then whinger will demand that RB be allowed to develop their engine further as it's their first year. 🙄


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 20, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			3 out of 4 RB engines going pop, thats got to be a worry. What a shame...
		
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Also funny to watch Verstappen getting more and more stressed over the radio.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 20, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Also funny to watch Verstappen getting more and more stressed over the radio.
		
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Can you imagine the outrage on the internet if Lewis spoke like that during a race?

It was a good race, the new cars looked like they could follow and race side by side. They also looked a bit of a handful to drive.

It was interesting to see the new rules of engagement curtailing Max’s aggressive overtaking and defending. Leclerc more than had the measure of him. 

If Mercedes can unlock some speed it will be a cracking season with 3 teams racing at the front.


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## Old Skier (Mar 20, 2022)

woofers said:



			Oh dear, that’s a shame for that nice Mr Horner……
		
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He’s sent a written appeal into Masi who has declared the result null and void.


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## Swango1980 (Mar 20, 2022)

Poor old Horner. Haha. A very satisfying end to the race, long may Red Bull's misfortune continue


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 20, 2022)

https://twitter.com/gqsports/status/1505524046364123137?s=2

Surely he must wear this stuff for a laugh 😂😂😂


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## Swango1980 (Mar 20, 2022)

Liverpoolphil said:



View attachment 41907

https://twitter.com/gqsports/status/1505524046364123137?s=2

Surely he must wear this stuff for a laugh 😂😂😂
		
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He must shop in same store as Calvert Lewin


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## bobmac (Mar 21, 2022)

The only downside about yesterday ......the Max Verstappen fan club at CH 4 are back.


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## Smiffy (Mar 21, 2022)

Enjoyable opener to the new season.
Great result for Ferrari, let's hope they can keep it up.
Nice to see the Haas looking more competitive, but what the hell's happened to McLaren????


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## BiMGuy (Mar 21, 2022)

I'm hearing that the fuel pump issue on Verstappen's car was actually caused by a short in the electrical system. Evidently water from all of his crying over team radio was the source of the problem.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

I've got a question about the porpoising problem...

As I understand it, the issue is caused by the rear of the floor getting too close to the ground at high speed, when the downforce is at its greatest.

Now of course I'm not an F1 engineer, but can someone in the know explain why this couldn't be solved by using rising rate springs on the back suspension which prevents the rear of the floor getting so low?


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## Swango1980 (Mar 24, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I've got a question about the porpoising problem...

As I understand it, the issue is caused by the rear of the floor getting too close to the ground at high speed, when the downforce is at its greatest.

Now of course I'm not an F1 engineer, but can someone in the know explain why this couldn't be solved by using rising rate springs on the back suspension which prevents the rear of the floor getting so low?
		
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Did the teams not already solve this problem?

The conundrum is that teams want their car as low as possible, as it will maximise pace, but not to the point that the undercarriage hits the ground. Also, if the undercarriage gets worn and damaged, the team will get penalised.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Did the teams not already solve this problem?
		
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Mercedes certainly haven't.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 24, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Did the teams not already solve this problem?

The conundrum is that teams want their car as low as possible, as it will maximise pace, but not to the point that the undercarriage hits the ground. Also, if the undercarriage gets worn and damaged, the team will get penalised.
		
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I understood the issue to be that the solution to porpoising is to raise the ride height of the car. However, in doing so, the car generates less downforce.

As it stands, the Merc either porpoises, or if raised up a bit to combat that, does not generate sufficient downforce (hence the bigger rear wing on the merc than the other cars in Bahrain).

Merc need a floor design that mitigates porpoising without having to raise the ride height. If they can do that, they can also use a smaller rear wing you’d think.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

OK, seems like I need to explain my thinking in more detail...

We know that the porpoising problem is caused by the rear of the floor hitting the ground when downforce gets high.
(Ironically, it happens on the straights, when you don't need the downforce)
We also know that raising the ride height prevents the porpoising, but at the expense of losing downforce.

My suggestion of using rising rate springs is a way of keeping a low ride height, but preventing it ever getting too low.
For sure it would make the ride quality very hard down the straights, but I doubt that would be worse than the current bouncing issue.

But I'm not an F1 engineer, so there must be a reason why this wouldn't work - although I can't see it.
You'd have thought that Merc must have already considered and rejected this, so I'm asking if anyone here can explain why.

Or could it be that a simple mechanical fix to what appears to be an aerodynamic problem hasn't been considered because it's the aero team's problem and they only think in aero terms?
Are they too close to the wood to see the trees?


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## theoneandonly (Mar 24, 2022)

It's the air stalling as the car gets closer to the ground , which then loses the downforce and then it grabs again and then stalls again and so on.


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## greenone (Mar 24, 2022)

Bear in mind the majority of the effective suspension on previous cars was the tyre sidewall. With the lower profile tyres it moves back to the actual suspension and as a result non of the teams will have it optimised yet although some will have it dialed in better than others. 

Mercedes other issue with the mini sidepods means there is alot less structure attached to the floor to stiffen it up and I'd imagine they are suffering alot more floor flutter than the less radical designs.


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## Smiffy (Mar 24, 2022)

They are thinking of strapping Horner to the rear of the car to help keep the back end down.
I'm all for that


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## greenone (Mar 24, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			They are thinking of strapping Horner to the rear of the car to help keep the back end down.
I'm all for that
		
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Too much drag strapping somebody with a mouth that size to the back of the car.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

greenone said:



			Too much drag strapping somebody with a mouth that size to the back of the car.
		
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But if they mounted him facing backwards, wouldn't all that hot air give a bit of a boost?


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## Foxholer (Mar 24, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			It's the air stalling as the car gets closer to the ground , which then loses the downforce and then it grabs again and then stalls again and so on.
		
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Pretty much this, though it's about air *flow* stalling.
The whole idea is to create downforce by manufacturing lower pressure under the car than above - the reverse of what an aeroplane wing does.
For an F1 car travelling on a track, there's actually a point where the air flow can be cut off - because the car is too close to the ground - so downforce is lost. The car then rises, so airflow restarts, as does downforce, so the car 'porpoises'.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

I'm gonna try this one last time, and then I'll give up...

We all know what causes porpoising. No need for people to explain it to us.

I'm interested in whether anyone can explain why my suggested fix (rising rate springs on the rear suspension that get stiff enough to prevent the floor hitting the ground) wouldn't work (because I'm sure Merc will have already thought of and discounted it).


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## greenone (Mar 24, 2022)

You are assuming bottoming out is the issue. If it is flutter than the only way to fix it is to stiffen the floor which isn't easy on an unsupported structure and/or raise the ride height and lose downforce.


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## Foxholer (Mar 24, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I'm gonna try this one last time, and then I'll give up...

We all know what causes porpoising. No need for people to explain it to us.

I'm interested in whether anyone can explain why my suggested fix (rising rate springs on the rear suspension that get stiff enough to prevent the floor hitting the ground) wouldn't work (because I'm sure Merc will have already thought of and discounted it).
		
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Possibly because the compromise would have a detrimental effect elsewhere - like cornering, which is exactly where the downforce is most desirable. It's not, after all, actually needed/wanted on straights. Btw. The floor shouldn't be hitting the ground anyway.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 24, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I'm gonna try this one last time, and then I'll give up...

We all know what causes porpoising. No need for people to explain it to us.

I'm interested in whether anyone can explain why my suggested fix (rising rate springs on the rear suspension that get stiff enough to prevent the floor hitting the ground) wouldn't work (because I'm sure Merc will have already thought of and discounted it).
		
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They’re already very stiff, aren’t they? My understanding was this year’s cars are stiffer than last year’s.

I’d imagine that if the suspension were stiff enough to overcome the downforce that causes porpoising, it might be too stiff to do its actual job to the detriment of drive ability and traction? Also, how much movement are we actually talking about? Presumably it’s mm?

I’m not an engineer so I can’t answer your question. However, you’d think something as simple as that would already have been considered.

Do the regs dictate which type of springs are permissible? Active suspension certainly isn’t (not that it’s your suggestion), but just thinking what is and isn’t prescribed

Edit: do you know that they aren’t already using the springs you’re suggesting? Is it possible they are?


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

greenone said:



			You are assuming bottoming out is the issue. If it is flutter than the only way to fix it is to stiffen the floor which isn't easy on an unsupported structure and/or raise the ride height and lose downforce.
		
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OK, that's a good point. However, every explanation of porpoising I've seen talks about the floor getting too low and grounding. I've never heard anyone mention lack of rigidity in the floor.


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## cliveb (Mar 24, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			I’d imagine that if the suspension were stiff enough to overcome the downforce that causes porpoising, it might be too stiff to do its actual job to the detriment of drive ability and traction?
		
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I am specifically talking about rising rate springs - ie. ones which get stiffer as they compress. It should be possible to engineer springs that have the desired flexibility at cornering speeds when they aren't compressed too much, and only get ultra-stiff (approaching lock-up) at top speed down the straight as the floor gets so low to the ground that the downforce would stall.



Canary_Yellow said:



			I’m not an engineer so I can’t answer your question. However, you’d think something as simple as that would already have been considered.
		
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Nor am I an engineer, and I agree you'd expect that the F1 teams would have already thought of it. But I still can't see why it wouldn't work.



Canary_Yellow said:



			Do the regs dictate which type of springs are permissible? Active suspension certainly isn’t (not that it’s your suggestion), but just thinking what is and isn’t prescribed
		
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Given how prescriptive the regs are, I guess it's possible that only constant rate springs are permitted.

EDIT: Just checked the 2022 tech regs. Article 10.4.3 states:



			10.4.3 The only permitted suspension elements are :
a. Springs - the primary purpose of which is to absorb and release energy in a
monotonically increasing load relationship with relative deflection between its nodes ...
		
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Now I can't say I fully understand this, but "monotonically" refers to something that varies in a way that never increases or decreases.
Perhaps this means that springs do indeed have to be constant rate.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 24, 2022)

Thier zero pod design is also a big issue with the air flow stalling. So the resolution may well be away from the floor and suspension.


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## greenone (Mar 24, 2022)

cliveb said:



			OK, that's a good point. However, every explanation of porpoising I've seen talks about the floor getting too low and grounding. I've never heard anyone mention lack of rigidity in the floor.
		
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 Flutter can have the same effect. Without seeing the data you can't rule anything out. Flutter is also something isn't modelled in CFD or necessarily shows up in a wind tunnel test.

This video is a good example of what flutter can do.


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## Canary_Yellow (Mar 24, 2022)

greenone said:



			Flutter can have the same effect. Without seeing the data you can't rule anything out. Flutter is also something isn't modelled in CFD or necessarily shows up in a wind tunnel test.

This video is a good example of what flutter can do.






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This looks different to me, this looks like movement in the bodywork (in F1 terms) whereas the issue seems to be suspension movement in the F1 car with no obvious "fluttering" in the body work? Or would it not be perceptible?


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## greenone (Mar 24, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			This looks different to me, this looks like movement in the bodywork (in F1 terms) whereas the issue seems to be suspension movement in the F1 car with no obvious "fluttering" in the body work? Or would it not be perceptible?
		
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It would be the edges of the floor, I wouldn't imagine they'd have to flutter very much to have a big effect. I'm not an expert on the laying of composites but  the first thing that struck me when I saw the revised merc was there seemed a fair distance between the floor edge and the bodywork and how they would make it stiff enough for the floor not be be moving around under load.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 26, 2022)

Hamilton


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 26, 2022)

Mercedes need to get a grip on their issues or this season will be out of Hamiltons grasp very quickly. Not helping Russell in his first season with them and a driver with a huge potential being held back


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 26, 2022)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Hamilton
View attachment 41980

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Stick to twitter....


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 26, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			Stick to twitter....
		
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excuse me ?


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## Jason.H (Mar 26, 2022)

Hamilton looked totally lost after qualifying. As fast as Mercedes develops their car the teams ahead will be doing the same. Great pole for Perez. 💪


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## woofers (Mar 26, 2022)

Jason.H said:



			Great pole for Perez. 💪
		
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 And I’m sure it’s been made all the better being congratulated by chef Gordon Ramsey (BBC Sport pic), wtf ?!


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## Jason.H (Mar 26, 2022)

woofers said:



			And I’m sure it’s been made all the better being congratulated by chef Gordon Ramsey (BBC Sport pic), wtf ?!
		
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Hopefully Ramsey wasn’t too harsh on the Red Bull catering/hospitality staff.


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## Jason.H (Mar 26, 2022)

Hopefully Mick Schumacher is ok. I’m not a fan of street circuits, how many safety car periods will there be tomorow?


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## Swango1980 (Mar 26, 2022)

What were those missile attacks nearby all about on the Friday!? Who was responsible for them? The only thing they discussed on Sky was that they happened, and the F1 teams were convinced everything was safe.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 26, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			What were those missile attacks nearby all about on the Friday!? Who was responsible for them? The only thing they discussed on Sky was that they happened, and the F1 teams were convinced everything was safe.
		
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It’s the ignored on going war between Saudi , UAE against Yemen -attacks where from Yemen


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 27, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Probably means Twitter is the best place for shit memes.
		
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...and leave them there if you haven't got anything constructive to add instead of just increasing ones post count


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## theoneandonly (Mar 27, 2022)

Jason.H said:



			Hamilton looked totally lost after qualifying. As fast as Mercedes develops their car the teams ahead will be doing the same. Great pole for Perez. 💪
		
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He said they tried something different in p3 that seems to work for him ,but clearly not when it came to qualy. Going to be a long race from 16th


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 27, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			He said they tried something different in p3 that seems to work for him ,but clearly not when it came to qualy. Going to be a long race from 16th
		
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It could well be, but I would be surprised if he doesn't pull something out of the bag


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## theoneandonly (Mar 27, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			It could well be, but I would be surprised if he doesn't pull something out of the bag 

Click to expand...

I hope so, but not much he can do in terms of setup outside of some aero tweeks. Top 8 would be an achievement


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## cliveb (Mar 27, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			He said they tried something different in p3 that seems to work for him ,but clearly not when it came to qualy. Going to be a long race from 16th
		
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Didn't he say they made some changes that worked well for P3, so went a bit further for quali, but must have gone too far?

Now the car is in Parc Ferme, they can't back those changes out. I think tomorrow might be a write off for him.


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## BiMGuy (Mar 27, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Didn't he say they made some changes that worked well for P3, so went a bit further for quali, but must have gone too far?

Now the car is in Parc Ferme, they can't back those changes out. I think tomorrow might be a write off for him.
		
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There is talk of Mercedes making changes and starting from the pit lane.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 27, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			There is talk of Mercedes making changes and starting from the pit lane.
		
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If its worth several tenths then he may aswell. He would only have 3  extra cars to get by and he should dispatch those quite quickly.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Probably means Twitter is the best place for shit memes.
		
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Bunkermagnet said:



			...and leave them there if you haven't got anything constructive to add instead of just increasing ones post count

Click to expand...

What’s wrong ? Are people not allowed to laugh at Hamilton having a mare - and btw I don’t give a monkeys about post count


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## dewsweeper (Mar 27, 2022)

Liverpoolphil said:



			What’s wrong ? Are people not allowed to laugh at Hamilton having a mare - and btw I don’t give a monkeys about post count
		
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I think you mean 'snide laugh'


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

dewsweeper said:



			I think you mean 'snide laugh'
		
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🤷‍♂️ I’m sure Hamilton will be fine 🙄


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## bobmac (Mar 27, 2022)

I heard a commentator say ''Mercedes will have to work hard to catch up with Red Bull''


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## BiMGuy (Mar 27, 2022)

Another Redbull power train dead, even before the race has started.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

Heck of start from Russell , great move to get 5th

The Ferrari’s and Red Bulls streets ahead though but they don’t seem to be showing them


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## Beedee (Mar 27, 2022)

Latifi once again.  To quote Martin Brundle about someone else (forgotten who) - "couldn't drive a nail into a bit of wood"


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## BiMGuy (Mar 27, 2022)

Ferrari have sold Redbull one there 😂


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

This could be a cracking finish to this race - Verstappen and LeClerc really going at each other


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

This is brilliant to watch and exactly what the sport needs , outstanding driving from both LeClerc and Verstappen


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## Beedee (Mar 27, 2022)

Good race.  Max drove well, but does he ever stop whinging?

Man of the season so far has to be Ross Brawn.  On the evidence of the first two races, the new regs are definitely working.


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## theoneandonly (Mar 27, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Good race.  Max drove well, but does he ever stop whinging?

Man of the season so far has to be Ross Brawn.  On the evidence of the first two races, the new regs are definitely working.
		
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Some really good racing right through the field. The early 6th to 9th battle was good fun.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

Looks like Verstappen and Leclerc have a good mutual respect for each other and it’s going to be great battle between them


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## Captainron (Mar 27, 2022)

Yes Max! Listened to it on 5 live. Sounded a great race


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## PieMan (Mar 27, 2022)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Looks like Verstappen and Leclerc have a good mutual respect for each other and it’s going to be great battle between them
		
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Apart from when Max complains every time Leclerc overtakes him!!


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 27, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Yes Max! Listened to it on 5 live. Sounded a great race
		
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It was great and hopefully it’s the start of an exciting season


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## Beedee (Mar 27, 2022)

I can see the new fashion of brake-testing each other just before the DRS lines is going to end in tears at some point in the season.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 27, 2022)

Another good race. Some good battles all the way down the field. Think at this rate it will be a straight Ferrari v Red Bull battle. Russell did well to get it to 5th but Hamilton looks way off. Will Russell outperform Hamilton this season?


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## BiMGuy (Mar 27, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Another good race. Some good battles all the way down the field. Think at this rate it will be a straight Ferrari v Red Bull battle. Russell did well to get it to 5th but Hamilton looks way off. Will Russell outperform Hamilton this season?
		
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It was another great race. 

Hamilton would have been right with Russell if he’d have got in the pits under the VSC. I can’t see him being beaten over a season.

Max and Charlie will surely make contact at some point. We’ll see how friendly they are then.

Hopefully Mercedes sort themselves out quickly. A three way battle with these cars would be cracking.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 27, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			It was another great race.

Hamilton would have been right with Russell if he’d have got in the pits under the VSC. I can’t see him being beaten over a season.

Max and Charlie will surely make contact at some point. We’ll see how friendly they are then.

Hopefully Mercedes sort themselves out quickly. A three way battle with these cars would be cracking.
		
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A three battle would be fantastic. I agree that while it is great to see no quarter given racing between Verstappen and Leclerc I think you are right and at some point there will be a coming together as there was last season with Hamilton and Verstappen. It depends if its a racing incident or one of them being too brave/foolish and trying to force the issue


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## Swango1980 (Apr 8, 2022)

I remember midway through last season the expert opinion seemed to be that Red Bull were throwing everything at the 2021 car, whereas Mercedes were investing more time in the 2022 car. Therefore, Red Bull were going all out last season, and it was a big gamble as they'd be on the back foot for 2022.

Hmmmm, not what I am seeing at the moment. The Mercedes car looks terrible. It is great that Ferrari look to have put themselves right up there, it is just disappointing there are not 3 big teams up there fighting. A long way to go I guess, but Mercedes may have to do something miraculous if they do not find a solution in the next 3 or 4 races.


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## SaintHacker (Apr 8, 2022)

Its certainly strange to see. You can't help but think sooner or later Merc will 'unlock'the car and put themselves right back in the mix. It cant help with the 1st 3 races being fly aways to get any serious wind tunnel work done or new parts designed and on the car


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## SaintHacker (Apr 10, 2022)

Interesting looking drivers championship at the moment with two 'no.2' drivers in front of the no.1s. Merc will likely let the next few races play out until one driver is obviously far enough ahead before they start invoking team orders,  but red bull not so sure. Max wants no.1 driver status and expects the team mate to move over regardless, but Checo i think is likely to tell them where to go if they try that. Could be a fun few races coming up👌


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## Swango1980 (Apr 10, 2022)

Think Mercedes have done just about as good as they could have done over the first few races. They are certainly walking away with more points than their car deserves.

I do enjoy it when a Red Bull car fails to finish a race. Poor Christian Horner


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## HomerJSimpson (Apr 10, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			You can't help but think sooner or later Merc will 'unlock'the car and put themselves right back in the mix.
		
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Do you think they can and in time? If Verstappen and Leclerc keep racking up the points, will Hamilton be capable of making up the difference. I am not sure Mercedes are close to working it out just yet. Getting better for sure but still seems a way off being competitive


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## BiMGuy (Apr 10, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Do you think they can and in time? If Verstappen and Leclerc keep racking up the points, will Hamilton be capable of making up the difference. I am not sure Mercedes are close to working it out just yet. Getting better for sure but still seems a way off being competitive
		
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Lewis has more points than Max as it stands.


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## ColchesterFC (Apr 10, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Do you think they can and in time? If Verstappen and Leclerc keep racking up the points, will Hamilton be capable of making up the difference. I am not sure Mercedes are close to working it out just yet. Getting better for sure but still seems a way off being competitive
		
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I'm not sure that Verstappen is "racking up the points" considering he's only 6th in the standings, has had two retirements and has both of the struggling Mercedes drivers ahead of him. But yes, the Merc is currently uncompetitive if the Red Bull can actually finish a race.


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## BiMGuy (Apr 10, 2022)

ColchesterFC said:



			I'm not sure that Verstappen is "racking up the points" considering he's only 6th in the standings, has had two retirements and has both of the struggling Mercedes drivers ahead of him. But yes, the Merc is currently uncompetitive if the Red Bull can actually finish a race.

View attachment 42198

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What’s the saying. To finish first, first you have to finish.


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## Blue in Munich (Apr 10, 2022)

ColchesterFC said:



*I'm not sure that Verstappen is "racking up the points" *considering he's only 6th in the standings, has had two retirements and has both of the struggling Mercedes drivers ahead of him. But yes, the Merc is currently uncompetitive if the Red Bull can actually finish a race.

View attachment 42198

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I'm sure Homer is racking up the post count though.


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## theoneandonly (Apr 10, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Do you think they can and in time? If Verstappen and Leclerc keep racking up the points, will Hamilton be capable of making up the difference. I am not sure Mercedes are close to working it out just yet. Getting better for sure but still seems a way off being competitive
		
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Perhaps get up early and watch the race next year 🤣🤣 or even any race for that matter .


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## DaveR (Apr 10, 2022)

Blue in Munich said:



			I'm sure Homer is racking up the post count though. 

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Clear leader in the forum post count rankings 👍


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## Foxholer (Apr 10, 2022)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Do you think they can and in time?* If Verstappen* and Leclerc keep* racking up the points*, will Hamilton be capable of making up the difference. I am not sure Mercedes are close to working it out just yet. Getting better for sure but still seems a way off being competitive
		
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## Canary_Yellow (Apr 11, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Its certainly strange to see. You can't help but think sooner or later Merc will 'unlock'the car and put themselves right back in the mix. It cant help with the 1st 3 races being fly aways to get any serious wind tunnel work done or new parts designed and on the car
		
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Personally, I don’t think merc will “unlock” the car. The issues are more than just the porpoising, the Ferrari also has that issue, and 1 second per lap is massive. Particularly as Ferrari will continue to develop too. I’d love it if merc could do something, just not convinced there is a magic fix and think it is more fundamental.

On your team orders point, i can’t see that coming into play. Verstappen (reliability aside) will out score perez- no team orders needed, Perez would have been behind every race so far and that won’t change. Same for leclerc vs sainz. Merc are miles off the pace so the drivers championship is likely irrelevant, in which case so are team orders as it matters not which driver is getting the points.


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

The Mercedes engineers now have all the data from the first 3 races and I think with the drivers feedback, it's likely they will sort out their issues over the next race or two.


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## Bunkermagnet (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			The Mercedes engineers now have all the data from the first 3 races and I think with the drivers feedback, it's likely they will sort out their issues over the next race or two.
		
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TBH, I doubt that the Merc engineers needed as many as 3 races to see where the problems are. 
Perhaps this new chassis they are using reacts differently to how their previous low rake chassis did compared to RB and Ferrari and their high rake chassis of last year, and their use of it.


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## cliveb (Apr 13, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			TBH, I doubt that the Merc engineers needed as many as 3 races to see where the problems are.
Perhaps this new chassis they are using reacts differently to how their previous low rake chassis did compared to RB and Ferrari and their high rake chassis of last year, and their use of it.
		
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It seems unlikely in the extreme that it's anything to do with the rake of the chassis.
Low v high rake was all to do with how to generate downforce from a flat bottom.
With ground effect now in use, that is history.


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## Canary_Yellow (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			The Mercedes engineers now have all the data from the first 3 races and I think with the drivers feedback, it's likely they will sort out their issues over the next race or two.
		
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I hope you’re right, but that seems unlikely to me. They not just a little bit off the pace, they’re a long way off. I think it’s more fundamental than a tweak here or there, but I’d love to be wrong!


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## Foxholer (Apr 13, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			TBH, I doubt that the Merc engineers needed as many as 3 races to see where the problems are.
Perhaps this new chassis they are using reacts differently to how their previous low rake chassis did compared to RB and Ferrari and their high rake chassis of last year, and their use of it.
		
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I'm pretty certain that they 'found the problem' in the first practice sessions. Designing, building, testing (and getting FIA approval for?)  a solution - without simply chucking ground-force benefits away - is the challenge. And the limitations on Wind Tunnel time and overall budget may have implications too!


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			I hope you’re right, but that seems unlikely to me.
		
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If they can build a world beating car 8 years in a row, they're no dummies


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## Swango1980 (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			If they can build a world beating car 8 years in a row, they're no dummies
		
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They're not. But, history shows us that you can have absolutely dominant teams one year, and then instantly be left behind the next year. And, it is often very difficult to turn it around again to your advantage. Especially as the like of Ferrari and Red Bull (and most other constructors) have pretty good people working for them as well.


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			But, *history shows us that you can have absolutely dominant teams one year,* and then instantly be left behind the next year. And, it is often very difficult to turn it around again to your advantage. Especially as the like of Ferrari and Red Bull (and most other constructors) have pretty good people working for them as well.
		
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History does *not* shows us a team that dominates for 8 years and then instantly gets left behind the next year.


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## Neilds (Apr 13, 2022)

But in the past 8 years, have there been such radical rule changes as this year?  Might be that Mercedes need to go back to proper sidepods


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

I'm just giving my opinion


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## Swango1980 (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			History does *not* shows us a team that dominates for 8 years and then instantly gets left behind the next year.
		
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I'm not sure if you are wedding yourself to this "8 years", as if 8 is a magic number.

Red Bull dominated for 4 years immediately before Mercedes smacked them out of the park.

Ferrari dominated for 5 years (2000-2004), although were in the picture a few years after. Then they became uncompetitive.

Williams were highly competitive, then became nothing. Same as McClaren.

It also depends what you define as "instantly gets left behind". Clearly, that does not mean they are bottom of the pack, as they are not. However, 2 teams have made significant progress ahead of them with the new rule changes, and Mercedes are now mixed in with the chasing pack.

So, my instinct is that Mercedes will more than likely NOT be able to close the gap this year. That being said, it would also not be a surprise if they did turn things around. It depends on how much testing they can do, the extent of the problems (and them being able to identify them) and how many changes that can feasibly make to this years car. My hope is they WILL be able to turn things around, it would be nice to see 3 teams fighting at the top (although I'd be content with the Red Bull car continually breaking down, as it makes me laugh)


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			It also depends what you define as "instantly gets left behind". Clearly, that does not mean they are bottom of the pack, as they are not. However, 2 teams have made significant progress ahead of them with the new rule changes, and *Mercedes are now mixed in with the chasing pack.*

Click to expand...

Hardly....
George Russell is 2nd in the drivers championship
Mercedes is 2nd in the constructors championship


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## Swango1980 (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Hardly....
George Russell is 2nd in the drivers championship
Mercedes is 2nd in the constructors championship
		
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After 3 races. If you took any snippet of 3 consecutive races at any time in history, you might find the results do not match the actual performance of the cars and drivers. And, you are blissfully ignoring how those races panned out. 

I think we all know Mercedes are currently "miles" behind Ferrari and Red Bull. Unless we think Red Bull are going to continue the trend of breaking down in most races.


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## bobmac (Apr 13, 2022)

I'm done


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## Canary_Yellow (Apr 13, 2022)

bobmac said:



			I'm just giving my opinion
		
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Tell it to red bull. They were dominant before Merc were.


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## Bunkermagnet (Apr 14, 2022)

cliveb said:



			It seems unlikely in the extreme that it's anything to do with the rake of the chassis.
Low v high rake was all to do with how to generate downforce from a flat bottom.
With ground effect now in use, that is history.
		
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I appreciate the different downforce direction they are all working with, but I wonder whether the high rake chassis teams have approached the new rules from a different aspect because of that.


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## Canary_Yellow (Apr 22, 2022)

The merc does not seem to be improving based on this latest showing.


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## Neilds (Apr 22, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			The merc does not seem to be improving based on this latest showing.
		
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Hamilton no longer the best driver in his team, never mind in F1 history 🤪


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## Pants (Apr 22, 2022)

The Merc updates looking good


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## Canary_Yellow (Apr 23, 2022)

Pants said:



			The Merc updates looking good 

View attachment 42357

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Great work from the engineers, there’s no chance of that porpoising.


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## Foxholer (Apr 23, 2022)

Neilds said:



			Hamilton no longer the best driver in his team, never mind in F1 history 🤪
		
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H'mm...Bit early in the season to start that. From memory, it was 'bad timing' from the team that cost Hamilton the big points loss. I've never been one to compare drivers in different eras either.


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## bobmac (Apr 23, 2022)

Russell P1
Hamilton P4
Not bad for a couple of old tractors


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 23, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Russell P1
Hamilton P4
Not bad for a couple of old tractors
		
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🤷‍♂
Thought they were 11th and 14th respectively


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## Swango1980 (Apr 23, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Russell P1
Hamilton P4
Not bad for a couple of old tractors
		
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What?


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## Foxholer (Apr 23, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Russell P1
Hamilton P4
Not bad for a couple of old tractors
		
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That was Final Practice
Didn't go so well in the Sprint Race/Qualifying - 11th & 14th


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## bobmac (Apr 23, 2022)

Apologies, my mistake, that was FP2


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## Pathetic Shark (Apr 24, 2022)

Lewis Hamilton getting lapped


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## Smiffy (Apr 24, 2022)

Pathetic Shark said:



			Lewis Hamilton getting lapped   

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That would have gone down well...
😳😳😳😳


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## Swango1980 (Apr 24, 2022)

One of the most boring races I've seen. Watching the battle for 13th for most of it,  even though it was obvious it was difficult to overtake, without DRS, or with DRS if you were at the back of a DRS train.

Leclerc spinning out at least added a touch of drama I suppose.


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## bobmac (Apr 25, 2022)

Well done Red Bull and well done Norris and Russell getting 3rd and 4th


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## cliveb (Apr 25, 2022)

Anyone else get the feeling Hamilton has lost his mojo?
Despite what he says publicly, I reckon deep down he knows that now Merc have dropped the ball with this year's car, and given he's close to the end of his career, his chance to grab an 8th title has probably gone for good. It would be no surprise if his heart was no longer in it.


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## bobmac (Apr 25, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Anyone else get the feeling Hamilton has lost his mojo?
Despite what he says publicly, I reckon deep down he knows that now Merc have dropped the ball with this year's car, and given he's close to the end of his career, his chance to grab an 8th title has probably gone for good. It would be no surprise if his heart was no longer in it.
		
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It certainly can't be much fun.


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## SaintHacker (Apr 25, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Anyone else get the feeling Hamilton has lost his mojo?
Despite what he says publicly, I reckon deep down he knows that now Merc have dropped the ball with this year's car, and given he's close to the end of his career, his chance to grab an 8th title has probably gone for good. It would be no surprise if his heart was no longer in it.
		
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Think it was probably more a case of having nothing to race for so save the engine/gearbox etc for the next race


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## Foxholer (May 3, 2022)

Some potential new blood https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/61300470


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## SteveW86 (May 7, 2022)

Mercedes looking much more competitive in Miami, early signs showing their upgrades are working.


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## Smiffy (May 7, 2022)

SteveW86 said:



			Mercedes looking much more competitive in Miami, early signs showing their upgrades are working.
		
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And if Hamilton can be persuaded to remove his jewellery, they'll gain an extra 0.75 of a second per lap....


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## Piece (May 7, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			And if Hamilton can be persuaded to remove his jewellery, they'll gain an extra 0.75 of a second per lap....


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And another 0.25 if he goes commando 😆😉


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## BiMGuy (May 7, 2022)

It’s fantastic to see the Mercs back at the sharp end. And Redbull struggling for reliability again 😁


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## Dando (May 8, 2022)

Not sure they could find any bigger knobs or rider people to interview on the grid walk


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## Jason.H (May 8, 2022)

Dando said:



			Not sure they could find any bigger knobs or rider people to interview on the grid walk
		
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Just what I was thinking. Not really a fan of these street circuits, hope theres not too many safety cars


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## Foxholer (May 8, 2022)

Russell's hope to 'bounce back' amused me!

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1523102333009338371


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## Smiffy (May 8, 2022)

Brundell's shirt!!!
What a gutbucket he is...😱😱😱


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## Neilds (May 9, 2022)

Race Director doesn’t follow rules in last race of season, Mercedes lead push to get him fired.
New Race Director tries to enforce rules that have not been followed for years (jewellery) and Mercedes start crying 🤣🤣🤣


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## Springveldt (May 10, 2022)

Dando said:



			Not sure they could find any bigger knobs or rider people to interview on the grid walk
		
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Absolute car crash TV. So many completely clueless airheads wandering around. Laughed out loud when Brundle said "It's like the floodgates have been opened, is there anyone left in the grandstands?"

Mercedes looked more competitive but I'm wondering if it was just the layout and the temperature of the track. Still miles off the pace really though.

The Red Bull is too fast in a straight line for the Ferrari. Even with DRS LeClerc couldn't even close on Verstappen never mind over take him.


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## Canary_Yellow (May 11, 2022)

Springveldt said:



			Absolute car crash TV. So many completely clueless airheads wandering around. Laughed out loud when Brundle said "It's like the floodgates have been opened, is there anyone left in the grandstands?"

Mercedes looked more competitive but I'm wondering if it was just the layout and the temperature of the track. Still miles off the pace really though.

The Red Bull is too fast in a straight line for the Ferrari. Even with DRS LeClerc couldn't even close on Verstappen never mind over take him.
		
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It’s interesting how although cars can follow more closely, the change to aero rules also means that DRS is less effective.

I wonder if anyone has done any work to see what the lap delta required is for an overtake this season vs last season? Wouldn’t be surprised if it isn’t THAT different.

Overall I’d say better that cars can follow closely, not sure it’s massively more entertaining though.


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## BiMGuy (May 11, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			It’s interesting how although cars can follow more closely, the change to aero rules also means that DRS is less effective.

I wonder if anyone has done any work to see what the lap delta required is for an overtake this season vs last season? Wouldn’t be surprised if it isn’t THAT different.

Overall I’d say better that cars can follow closely, not sure it’s massively more entertaining though.
		
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F1 isn’t just about overtaking. The ability to follow another car closely allows a driver to put pressure on the other. An exciting battle doesn’t have to end in an overtake. Like when Vettel spun whilst being chased down by Button. 

Some exciting races have a handful o overtakes. Some dull races, like Miami have lots.


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## Canary_Yellow (May 11, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			F1 isn’t just about overtaking. The ability to follow another car closely allows a driver to put pressure on the other. An exciting battle doesn’t have to end in an overtake. Like when Vettel spun whilst being chased down by Button.

Some exciting races have a handful o overtakes. Some dull races, like Miami have lots.
		
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Of course, but drivers could put pressure on each other last season too, not as close, but drs was more powerful. The difference I guess is tyres hanging on better meaning they can stay even closer for longer, but I’m not seeing a great change in the levels of excitement between previous years and this season, yet.

Early days though I guess.


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## Lump (May 12, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			Of course, but drivers could put pressure on each other last season too, not as close, but drs was more powerful. The difference I guess is tyres hanging on better meaning they can stay even closer for longer, but I’m not seeing a great change in the levels of excitement between previous years and this season, yet.

Early days though I guess.
		
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The issue atm is the cars are not matched. Some have good cornering speed, others straight line speed. They can only fight at certain parts of a tracks. Once they get things settled I think we’ll see more start to finish tussles.


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## Swango1980 (May 12, 2022)

Lump said:



			The issue atm is the cars are not matched. Some have good cornering speed, others straight line speed. They can only fight at certain parts of a tracks. Once they get things settled I think we’ll see more start to finish tussles.
		
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The cars are never matched. It isn't IndyCar


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## Springveldt (May 12, 2022)

Canary_Yellow said:



			It’s interesting how although cars can follow more closely, the change to aero rules also means that DRS is less effective.

I wonder if anyone has done any work to see what the lap delta required is for an overtake this season vs last season? Wouldn’t be surprised if it isn’t THAT different.

Overall I’d say better that cars can follow closely, not sure it’s massively more entertaining though.
		
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I think DRS is still effective and essentially the only way of overtaking at the moment (unless you're reckless like Max a lot of the time and just throw it down the inside and hope the other drivers moves out of your way).

The Red Bull has zero issues breezing past the Ferrari on the straights, it's just too fast while Ferrari is obviously faster through the slower corners and gets much better drive out of them. They should be unstoppable at places like Monaco but at a lot of other circuits I expect to see Ferrari take pole but during races Red Bull will just fly past once they are in DRS zones.


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## Wabinez (May 26, 2022)

https://coryfront.in/sports/mercedes-aero-winglet/

they coming back!


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## Neilds (May 27, 2022)

According to the press, Hamilton could be banned from racing this weekend if he doesn’t remove his nose piercing. He has had 2 races to remove it as it (apparently) can only be removed surgically but turned up at Monaco with it still in. Is this the same Mercedes team that threatened legal action a few months ago when rules weren’t being applied correctly but now when the FIA try and impose a rule that has been in place for years……………


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## bobmac (May 27, 2022)

Neilds said:



			According to the press, Hamilton could be banned from racing this weekend if he doesn’t remove his nose piercing. He has had 2 races to remove it as it (apparently) can only be removed surgically but turned up at Monaco with it still in. Is this the same Mercedes team that threatened legal action a few months ago when rules weren’t being applied correctly but now when the FIA try and impose a rule that has been in place for years……………
		
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I think there's a difference between breaking the rules to make your car go faster and therefor gaining an advantage over the other teams and having your nose pierced which he did in 2017.
What next, are they going to check the colour of his underpants?


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## Neilds (May 27, 2022)

bobmac said:



			I think there's a difference between breaking the rules to make your car go faster and therefor gaining an advantage over the other teams and having your nose pierced which he did in 2017.
What next, are they going to check the colour of his underpants?
		
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They check to make sure they are fire retardant 😀
And it has been said in this forum loads of times, you can’t decide what rules you will or won’t obey.


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## bobmac (May 27, 2022)

Neilds said:



			They check to make sure they are fire retardant 😀
And it has been said in this forum loads of times, you can’t decide what rules you will or won’t obey.
		
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So why has it not been questioned in the last 5 seasons?


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## Lord Tyrion (May 27, 2022)

bobmac said:



			So why has it not been questioned in the last 5 seasons?
		
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It's a whole host of jewellery he has to remove. He was given an exemption for certain piercings but he wants to get in the car jangling. It's the most pathetic thing to pick a fight over, Hamilton. He is a professional, act professionally 🤷‍♂️. Wear the bling before and after the race.


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## Jason.H (May 27, 2022)

Blame the FIA. They should  enforce the rules no matter how trivial.


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## BiMGuy (May 27, 2022)

Neilds said:



			According to the press, Hamilton could be banned from racing this weekend if he doesn’t remove his nose piercing. He has had 2 races to remove it as it (apparently) can only be removed surgically but turned up at Monaco with it still in. Is this the same Mercedes team that threatened legal action a few months ago when rules weren’t being applied correctly but now when the FIA try and impose a rule that has been in place for years……………
		
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Where did you see this? I’ve not seen it mentioned by any reasonably trustworthy press this week.


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## Neilds (May 27, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Where did you see this? I’ve not seen it mentioned by any reasonably trustworthy press this week.
		
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Not necessarily trustworthy but is on the daily Mail site.  However, it was common knowledge he was given a 2 race exemption which has now expired.


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## Lord Tyrion (May 27, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Where did you see this? I’ve not seen it mentioned by any reasonably trustworthy press this week.
		
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It's been rumbling on for a few weeks now. Damon Hill was talking about it on Sky yesterday as a real thing.


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## BiMGuy (May 27, 2022)

Lord Tyrion said:



			It's been rumbling on for a few weeks now. Damon Hill was talking about it on Sky yesterday as a real thing.
		
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I know that. But I hadn’t seen anything in the F1 press about it leading up to this race.


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## Swango1980 (May 27, 2022)

First world problems


----------



## SaintHacker (Jun 29, 2022)

Well one more day at work then off to Silverstone I go. 
Interesting announcement from McClaren today about not further developing the car due to the budget cap, Red Bull making noises about having to lay staff off (god forbid they put their staff before max's wdc chances), meanwhile Merc quietly going about their business. Could be a really intersting end to the season if, as I suspect, Toto has done his sums and the car isn't that good as they haven't blown their budget trying to get an early season advantage.


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## BiMGuy (Jun 29, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Well one more day at work then off to Silverstone I go.
Interesting announcement from McClaren today about not further developing the car due to the budget cap, Red Bull making noises about having to lay staff off (god forbid they put their staff before max's wdc chances), meanwhile Merc quietly going about their business. Could be a really intersting end to the season if, as I suspect, Toto has done his sums and the car isn't that good as they haven't blown their budget trying to get an early season advantage.
		
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Have fun. Unfortunately I’ll not be going this year. A mate of mine has been given a weekend paddock club ticket the jammy git.

I think a few teams will struggle with the cost cap. From what I hear Redbull could be in serious trouble due to the cost of their early season development, and the rates Ferrari are going through could cause problems.

I suspect Horner and co think they can get the cost cap lifted, despite previously saying rules shouldn’t be changed during the season. Maybe they can short fuel Perez for a few races again to save some cash!


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## Oddsocks (Jun 30, 2022)

Well nelsons comment definitely hit the media pages.


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## BiMGuy (Jun 30, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Well nelsons comment definitely hit the media pages.
		
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And will continue to do so as it’s media day today. It will be interesting to see Max squirm as he tries to remember what he’s been told to say.

Have you seen the Bernie interview? 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542404744500707330


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## Beedee (Jun 30, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			And will continue to do so as it’s media day today. It will be interesting to see Max squirm as he tries to remember what he’s been told to say.

Have you seen the Bernie interview?


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542404744500707330

Click to expand...

OMG!!!


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## Swango1980 (Jun 30, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			And will continue to do so as it’s media day today. It will be interesting to see Max squirm as he tries to remember what he’s been told to say.

Have you seen the Bernie interview?


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1542404744500707330

Click to expand...

He'd still take a bullet for Vladimir Putin, and the thousands of Ukrainian and Russian deaths were not intentional? Bizarre.


----------



## Jason.H (Jun 30, 2022)

Looks like Red Bull will win constructors and driver’s championship this year. Now I’ve said it it won’t happen 😅


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## Beedee (Jul 3, 2022)

Wow was a belting race!  

Can't believe Zhou's walking round the paddock chatting to people after lap 1.  Those cars are fairly well put together!

And please please please Formula 1.  Stop this rubbish obsession with new "street" circuits.  Proper race tracks give proper racing.


----------



## SteveW86 (Jul 3, 2022)

That was such good viewing, Silverstone always seems to deliver a quality race.

Hamilton and Leclerc going round Copse together showing how to race hard and fair.


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## cliveb (Jul 3, 2022)

Very entertaining last few laps, and congrats to Carlos on his first win.

Two observations:

1. Why didn't any commentators point out that Russell triggered the mayhem on lap 1?
He drifted left and tagged Gasly, who had got a much better start. A racing incident and I don't blame Russell (who was probably unsighted), but I bet if it had been someone like Stroll or Tsunoda, it would have been picked up.

2. The late safety car did Lewis no favours. It brought Perez back into the race on fresh tyres in an undamaged Red Bull. Without it, Hamilton had a good chance to hunt down both Ferraris with his much younger tyres.


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## SteveW86 (Jul 4, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Very entertaining last few laps, and congrats to Carlos on his first win.

Two observations:
*
1. Why didn't any commentators point out that Russell triggered the mayhem on lap 1?
He drifted left and tagged Gasly, who had got a much better start. *A racing incident and I don't blame Russell (who was probably unsighted), but I bet if it had been someone like Stroll or Tsunoda, it would have been picked up.

2. The late safety car did Lewis no favours. It brought Perez back into the race on fresh tyres in an undamaged Red Bull. Without it, Hamilton had a good chance to hunt down both Ferraris with his much younger tyres.
		
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I think in real time they weren’t sure what had happened because they didn’t show replays and then by the time they did they were focussing on the race. In the analysis following the race, it was definitely discussed as part of the cause of the incident.


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## Swango1980 (Jul 15, 2022)

Just seen Michael Masi has formally left the FIA, and moved back to Australia.

I guess the writing was on the cards. When someone shows the level of incompetence he did, at such a critical time, it was probably difficult for him and the FIA to continue to have a close working relationship in the long term.


----------



## Aztecs27 (Jul 15, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Just seen Michael Masi has formally left the FIA, and moved back to Australia.

I guess the writing was on the cards. When someone shows the level of incompetence he did, at such a critical time, it was probably difficult for him and the FIA to continue to have a close working relationship in the long term.
		
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The biggest surprise is it's taken this long.


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## ger147 (Jul 15, 2022)

Aztecs27 said:



			The biggest surprise is it's taken this long.
		
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His plane had to do 20 laps behind the safety car before he could fly home...


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## Swango1980 (Jul 28, 2022)

Sebastian Vettel to retire from F1 at the end of the season


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## Smiffy (Jul 28, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Sebastian Vettel to retire from F1 at the end of the season
		
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You can hardly blame him
🥺🥺🥺


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## Wabinez (Jul 28, 2022)

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CgjUE5xKW-B/?igshid=MDJmNzVkMjY=

can’t embed it sadly


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## Swango1980 (Jul 30, 2022)

Good pole by Russell. Might make tomorrows race interesting, especially with Max trying to get through the field.


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## SaintHacker (Jul 30, 2022)

Wow, what a lap! Just need LH to get a decent start then a Fernando roadblock to hold up the Bulls


----------



## theoneandonly (Jul 31, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Wow, what a lap! Just need LH to get a decent start then a Fernando roadblock to hold up the Bulls
		
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Sure was. Wonder what kind of 💩 we'll get from Ferrari


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## Smiffy (Jul 31, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Sure was. Wonder what kind of 💩 we'll get from Ferrari
		
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Horner's nose is currently stuck in the new regulations booklet...


----------



## Captainron (Jul 31, 2022)

If Russell can win that would be great. Think Ferrari will have a 1/2 though


----------



## Swango1980 (Jul 31, 2022)

Ferarri fail to deliver yet again. They seem so amateurish relative to the others.


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## Smiffy (Jul 31, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Think Ferrari will have a 1/2 though
		
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I'd stick to punching Spaniards Cam 
🥺🥺🥺🥺


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## Oddsocks (Jul 31, 2022)

Really disappointed in today.  For years every driver has been forced to play wingman to Lewis for the good of the team, with Hamilton being so far behind he should have played wingy to George so that he could close the gap…

Merc can’t win the title but George has a chance of 3rd, but not if sir Lewis doesn’t play for the team.


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## Swango1980 (Jul 31, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Really disappointed in today.  For years every driver has been forced to play wingman to Lewis for the good of the team, with Hamilton being so far behind he should have played wingy to George so that he could close the gap…

Merc can’t win the title but George has a chance of 3rd, but not if sir Lewis doesn’t play for the team.
		
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What a bizarre point of view.

Never heard of a team mate playing the wingman so that his team mate could fight for 3rd in the Championship.

Hamilton is only 12 points behind Russell, with many races to go. Ridiculous if he should be asked to stop fighting at this point. Especially as a large part if where they are now is Russell benefiting from safety cars and strategic decisions in a few races, Hamilton being hurt by them. 

Hamilton was miles quicker at the end. There was a chance of rain (it did rain, just a little late). By him moving into 2nd, it was Mercedes best chance of a win if the rain came down, and/or Max made another unfortunate spin.


----------



## Oddsocks (Jul 31, 2022)

I retract my opinion, I thought the gap was bigger.

It’s nice to see the mercs catching up.


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## SaintHacker (Jul 31, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Really disappointed in today.  For years every driver has been forced to play wingman to Lewis for the good of the team, with Hamilton being so far behind he should have played wingy to George so that he could close the gap…

Merc can’t win the title but George has a chance of 3rd, but not if sir Lewis doesn’t play for the team.
		
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They were on opposite strategies, Lewis was way quicker than George and Max on the softs. Had there been a safety car or some decent rain he would have been looking at a win so for me deffo the right call by Mercedes


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## Captainron (Jul 31, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			I'd stick to punching Spaniards Cam
🥺🥺🥺🥺
		
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Do love a punched Spaniard…..🤣


----------



## Wabinez (Aug 1, 2022)

Alonso signs for Aston Martin. Pretty much confirms Piastri for Alpine too.


----------



## jim8flog (Aug 1, 2022)

I normally watch the whole race but being out until late I decided to just watch the highlights at 11pm

Boy was it hard to actually follow what was going on and who was in front of who and could could finish ahead of whom.


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## jim8flog (Aug 1, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			Really disappointed in today.  For years every driver has been forced to play wingman to Lewis for the good of the team, with Hamilton being so far behind he should have played wingy to George so that he could close the gap…

Merc can’t win the title but George has a chance of 3rd, but not if sir Lewis doesn’t play for the team.
		
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  I thought the commentary made it absolutely clear there were no team orders (they can hear all team messages) and Hamilton overtook Russell with a faster car due to the tyre choice and when he pitted) and a skilful move.

As others had said Hamilton had a chance to win and Russell did not.


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## Oddsocks (Aug 1, 2022)

Post #404


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## BiMGuy (Aug 1, 2022)

jim8flog said:



			I normally watch the whole race but being out until late I decided to just watch the highlights at 11pm

Boy was it hard to actually follow what was going on and who was in front of who and could could finish ahead of whom.
		
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I can imagine it would have been difficult to follow if you were missing chunks of the race. 

There was a lot going on with strategy.

It’s a shame the rain didn’t come a couple of laps earlier.


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## Swango1980 (Aug 1, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			I can imagine it would have been difficult to follow if you were missing chunks of the race. 

There was a lot going on with strategy.

It’s a shame the rain didn’t come a couple of laps earlier.
		
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That would have been fantastic, would have made it a very interesting finish.


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## cliveb (Aug 1, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Ferarri fail to deliver yet again. They seem so amateurish relative to the others.
		
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Golfing analogy: Ferrari seems like a fantastically talented golfer with terrible course management.


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## Oddsocks (Aug 1, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Golfing analogy: Ferrari seems like a fantastically talented golfer with terrible course management.
		
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BDC. 😂


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## Bunkermagnet (Aug 2, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			BDC. 😂
		
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They’re F1 cars, not touring cars


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## Oddsocks (Aug 2, 2022)

Bunkermagnet said:



			They’re F1 cars, not touring cars

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The way some are being driven I’m not so sure.  Think back to the older t5 Volvo and mondeo banger racing


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## Bunkermagnet (Aug 2, 2022)

Oddsocks said:



			The way some are being driven I’m not so sure.  Think back to the older t5 Volvo and mondeo banger racing
		
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I was thinking more along the lines of their bulk


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## Beedee (Aug 3, 2022)

I'd just like to confirm that, whatever it may say in any Alpine press releases, I will not be driving for Alpine next year.  

Same goes for McLaren.  They haven't actually asked me yet, but as they appear to be offering Danny Ric's seat to everyone else, I assume my offer will be along soon.

Alonso and Vettel have definitely shaken up silly season this year.


----------



## theoneandonly (Aug 4, 2022)

The F1 conspiracy theorists would tell you Perez has been off the pace as he's been running the 💩 spa floor.....


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## theoneandonly (Aug 28, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			The F1 conspiracy theorists would tell you Perez has been off the pace as he's been running the 💩 spa floor.....
		
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But no as the red bulls were as fast as ever. 11 mins till lights out! Great atmosphere here this weekend.


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## ger147 (Aug 28, 2022)

If Max gets a clean start he will still win, SO much faster than everyone else yesterday.


----------



## Jason.H (Aug 28, 2022)

Lewis reaction to being 1.8 seconds behind in qually


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## Jason.H (Aug 28, 2022)

How will Ferrari mess up today?


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## BiMGuy (Aug 28, 2022)

Should be fun with cars out of position and lots of new gravel traps.

The chance of a safety car on lap one is strong


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## Jason.H (Aug 28, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			Should be fun with cars out of position and lots of new gravel traps.

The chance of a safety car on lap one is strong
		
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Good call


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## Piece (Aug 28, 2022)

That race was dull. Red Bull light years ahead with the rest of the field racing with the hand brake on.


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## theoneandonly (Aug 28, 2022)

Piece said:



			That race was dull. Red Bull light years ahead with the rest of the field racing with the hand brake on.
		
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Was a great weekend and some quality Ferrari 💩💩 at the end


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## Swango1980 (Aug 28, 2022)

Definitely one of the most dull races I have seen.


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## theoneandonly (Aug 28, 2022)

I've been here all weekend. Very enjoyable it was too .just stopped at a McDonald's the Belgian police sent us on a massive diversion 😂


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## BTatHome (Aug 28, 2022)

Great to see the changes they made have made for closer racing 



..... not!


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## ger147 (Aug 28, 2022)

Great performance from Max, was never in doubt. Should be a stroll to the WC from here as Ferrari is a mess and no-one else can get anywhere near the Red Bulls.

Will be interesting to see what route Mercedes take with their 2023 car to try and close the gap at the front to Max.


----------



## cliveb (Aug 29, 2022)

Lewis seems almost unique amongst F1 drivers in unconditionally admitting when he's been at fault.


----------



## theoneandonly (Aug 29, 2022)

cliveb said:



			Lewis seems almost unique amongst F1 drivers in unconditionally admitting when he's been at fault.
		
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Alonso has certainly come across as a bit of a dick in this incident.


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## Smiffy (Aug 29, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Alonso has certainly come across as a bit of a dick in this incident.
		
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Which would not be the first time..


----------



## Norrin Radd (Aug 29, 2022)

The way the red bulls are so far ahead means they are better at cheating than the rest. I thought Ferrari were the best at cheating ,but not now it seems.


----------



## Piece (Aug 30, 2022)

They compound their 'cheating' by being strategy fook-wits


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## BrianM (Sep 4, 2022)

Absolutely shocking pit stop from Ferrari, basic, basic errors at that level is unforgivable 😬😬


----------



## ger147 (Sep 4, 2022)

Lewis in the running here, could be close at the end with Max.


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## ger147 (Sep 4, 2022)

Alpha Tauri with the assist here for Red Bull, looks like the VSC will keep Max ahead.


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## ger147 (Sep 4, 2022)

Now Alfa Romeo with the assist for Mercedes, gamble time and Lewis and George staying out.


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## ger147 (Sep 4, 2022)

12 laps to go, safety car restart and Lewis vs Max, showtime...


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## ger147 (Sep 4, 2022)

I wouldn't fancy being Lewis Hamilton's cat tonight, presumably it's already hiding behind the couch...


----------



## Wilson (Sep 4, 2022)

The Tsunoda episode was very bizarre, and his post race interview didn’t help, as he couldn’t really explain the problem!


----------



## Oddsocks (Sep 5, 2022)

Wilson said:



			The Tsunoda episode was very bizarre, and his post race interview didn’t help, as he couldn’t really explain the problem!
		
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It stinks…. BIG TIME


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## cliveb (Sep 5, 2022)

It would have probably been futile to try, but at the point when the safety car was out and the order was Lewis then George then Max, surely there was an opportunity to play the team game:

At the restart, Lewis bolts off early, and George trundles around with Max not allowed to pass him until they reach the SC line. That could easily have given Lewis a several second gap over Max.

The fact that George asked to go on the soft tyres and gave up track position to Max before the restart tells me that he's not interested in helping out Lewis.
No doubt Lewis will realise this so the gloves could now be off.


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## Reemul (Sep 5, 2022)

cliveb said:



			It would have probably been futile to try, but at the point when the safety car was out and the order was Lewis then George then Max, surely there was an opportunity to play the team game:

At the restart, Lewis bolts off early, and George trundles around with Max not allowed to pass him until they reach the SC line. That could easily have given Lewis a several second gap over Max.

The fact that George asked to go on the soft tyres and gave up track position to Max before the restart tells me that he's not interested in helping out Lewis.
No doubt Lewis will realise this so the gloves could now be off.
		
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Mercedes could have said no stay out, they were obviously happy with the strategy he wanted as well. Lewis was stuffed due to the VSC anyways better a 2 and 4 than a 3 and 4 eh, just unfortunate for Lewis it wasn't him in 2nd.


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## Neilds (Sep 5, 2022)

cliveb said:



			The fact that George asked to go on the soft tyres and gave up track position to Max before the restart tells me that *he's not interested in helping out Lewis*.
No doubt Lewis will realise this so the gloves could now be off.
		
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Why should he help Lewis, he is beating him in the races so has a much better chance of catching the leaders


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## Springveldt (Sep 6, 2022)

Reemul said:



			Mercedes could have said no stay out, they were obviously happy with the strategy he wanted as well. Lewis was stuffed due to the VSC anyways better a 2 and 4 than a 3 and 4 eh, just unfortunate for Lewis it wasn't him in 2nd.
		
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If they pitted both then they would have had a 2 and 3. It's obvious they thought leaving them both out with George as a buffer would give the best chance of a win (in reality it would still have failed as Max was too fast on the softs) but then George waited nearly a full lap before demanding to pit that left Lewis high and dry. George saw an easy 2nd by pitting and getting softs.

Merc screwed up. They should have left both out or pitted both and settled for a 2nd and 3rd. 



Neilds said:



			Why should he help Lewis, he is beating him in the races so has a much better chance of catching the leaders
		
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He has no chance of catching the leader in the championship and this was the teams best chance of a win all season.


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## Swango1980 (Sep 6, 2022)

Springveldt said:



			If they pitted both then they would have had a 2 and 3. It's obvious they thought leaving them both out with George as a buffer would give the best chance of a win (in reality it would still have failed as Max was too fast on the softs) but then George waited nearly a full lap before demanding to pit that left Lewis high and dry. George saw an easy 2nd by pitting and getting softs.

Merc screwed up. They should have left both out or pitted both and settled for a 2nd and 3rd.


He has no chance of catching the leader in the championship and this was the teams best chance of a win all season.
		
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Agree with this. For Mercedes it was about giving themselves the best chance to win the race, and there is no chance they have any expectation that either driver will catch the leaders now. If they had pitted both for the best tyres, that would have made sense (especially if they were going to make that decision for one of their drivers). They wouldn't have beaten Verstappen, although maybe there would be a small chance if he had reliability issues or made an unlikely mistake, of which they could profit from.

Alternatively, they could have held track position, but they really needed to give Lewis a buffer by keeping Russel between Lewis and Max. Again, this may not have paid off as Max was considerably faster on those tyres, but not sure this would have been a guarantee before that decision was made (e.g. the hard tyres did very well earlier in race, and Lewis' tyres were not that old anyway.

It just seems to be a dodgy decision by Mercedes. I also thought the leading driver in any team would often be get the benefit of any strategy call, so I can see why Lewis was especially upset. It would only make more sense if Russell was in with a shout of winning the championship.

My impression of this season is that Lewis has had extraordinary bad luck in many races, whether it be due to the appearance of a safety car (or virtual), or a call from his team. Whereas it seems George has benefited a good number of times. Obviously neither would ever have a chance of the individual title. However, the whole Tsunoda incident, as mentioned by others, was just plain bizarre.


----------



## Dando (Sep 11, 2022)

I bet whinger spice wasn’t on the radio pleading for them to be allowed to race today


----------



## theoneandonly (Sep 30, 2022)

SLH tops FP1. Haven't seen that for a while. 
Sounds like RBR were naughty boys last year with regards to the budget cap with Merc and Ferrari pissed off and out for blood!


----------



## Dando (Oct 5, 2022)

how much will whinger spice moan if RBR are found to have breached the budget cap that he was apparantly unaware of


----------



## cliveb (Oct 5, 2022)

Dando said:



			how much will whinger spice moan if RBR are found to have breached the budget cap that he was apparantly unaware of
		
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We don't know yet if they did breach the cap, and Horner seems adamant that they didn't.

But if (and it's a big if) they are found to have done so, I suspect the FIA will retrospectively DQ them from the 2021 constructors championship and claw back the prize money for 2nd place. They may also have their cap for this year reduced by whatever last year's overspend was. Which could make life very difficult.

As for last year's drivers championship, I can't see anything changing. Hamilton and Alonso were allowed to keep their points in 2007 when McLaren were DQ'd and fined. But it will make Max's win even more tainted than it already was - had RB not overspent, he wouldn't have got anywhere near winning.


----------



## ger147 (Oct 5, 2022)

Red Bull will absolutely NOT be DQ'd from last year's Constructor's Championship. The latest rumour is it is a minor breach, and if there was such a breach it will most likely be dealt with via a fine, a future additional budget restriction on top of the existing budget cap or a future additional restriction on development time.


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## ger147 (Oct 5, 2022)

FIA update on budget cap outcome postponed until Monday.

Must be a good laugh behind the scenes in Japan tonight...


----------



## Piece (Oct 5, 2022)

ger147 said:



			FIA update on budget cap outcome postponed until Monday.

Must be a good laugh behind the scenes in Japan tonight...
		
Click to expand...

The fourth postponement. More time to squirrel away some $$$$


----------



## SaintHacker (Oct 5, 2022)

The delay obviously means they've found something significant. Question is what are they delaying for? To decide on a punishment? To allow the team time to explain? To make sure the allegation is watertight before handing out a punishment? Working out how they can sweep this unde the same carpet they hid Masi under?



ger147 said:



			Red Bull will absolutely NOT be DQ'd from last year's Constructor's Championship.
		
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You know this how?


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## Bunkermagnet (Oct 5, 2022)

The whole things is a joke. Merc were punished for a fractional wing flex, fair enough thems the rules. RB will probaly get a slap on the wrist, and for a sport that deals in thousands of a second, fractions of this, that and everything, to not know where their budget is at is frankly laughable. But hey, the FIA have their new favourite buddies.


----------



## Reemul (Oct 5, 2022)

Get a grip, you are all posting as if you know what the outcome already is. The whole RBR V Merc Max v Lewis is almost as bad as the LIV Tour stuff.

I tell you what, if everyone we knew listened to crap like that about us individually at work or in our lives we all be sacked and living in ditches whether it's true or not.

Wait for the outcome and then act like whiny babies as it won't suit your narrative regardless of what is said..


----------



## theoneandonly (Oct 5, 2022)

Reemul said:



			Get a grip, you are all posting as if you know what the outcome already is. The whole RBR V Merc Max v Lewis is almost as bad as the LIV Tour stuff.

I tell you what, if everyone we knew listened to crap like that about us individually at work or in our lives we all be sacked and living in ditches whether it's true or not.

Wait for the outcome and then act like whiny babies as it won't suit your narrative regardless of what is said..
		
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Who pissed on your cornflakes 🤣🤣
It's one of the biggest stories in F1 at the moment.


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## BiMGuy (Oct 5, 2022)

The whole thing is becoming unbelievably shady.

Just like Honda now being the RB engine supplier again. After RB have spent a load of money setting up a power train division. Money which can be spent outside the cost cap.


----------



## cliveb (Oct 5, 2022)

ger147 said:



			Red Bull will absolutely NOT be DQ'd from last year's Constructor's Championship. The latest rumour is it is a minor breach, and if there was such a breach it will most likely be dealt with via a fine.
		
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If it's a minor breach - yes, a fine.

But if it turns out a major breach, the FIA *must* be seen to do something significant. And DQ'ing them from a championship which they didn't win seems like the sort of thing they'd do. They've got form. Remember Schumacher in 1997, and in 2007 McLaren would have actually won, so the FIA aren't afraid of getting tough.


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## Swango1980 (Oct 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			If it's a minor breach - yes, a fine.

But if it turns out a major breach, the FIA *must* be seen to do something significant. And DQ'ing them from a championship which they didn't win seems like the sort of thing they'd do. They've got form. Remember Schumacher in 1997, and in 2007 McLaren would have actually won, so the FIA aren't afraid of getting tough.
		
Click to expand...

Indeed. If it turns out a big infringement, a tough penalty is essential. If they get a slap.on the wrist, then that will just give the other teams the green light to ignore the financial caps in future.

If there was only a minor infringement  then you'd have thought the FIA would simply announce the outcome already. Perhaps they've determined a major infringement, Red Bull are still arguing the numbers behind the scenes, and the FIA want to wait a few more days to double triple check things through, before announcing anything public and creating a media storm?


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## BiMGuy (Oct 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			If it's a minor breach - yes, a fine.

But if it turns out a major breach, the FIA *must* be seen to do something significant. And DQ'ing them from a championship which they didn't win seems like the sort of thing they'd do. They've got form. Remember Schumacher in 1997, and in 2007 McLaren would have actually won, so the FIA aren't afraid of getting tough.
		
Click to expand...

McLaren we’re shown not to have any of the Ferrari designs on their car and the whole thing was largely one person. Yet they were still fined and DQ’d. 

A lot of effort went in to making sure a Mercedes driver didn’t win the 21 championship. You can be sure there is a lot of effort going in to making sure they don’t have to give it back to them.


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## cliveb (Oct 6, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			A lot of effort went in to making sure a Mercedes driver didn’t win the 21 championship. You can be sure there is a lot of effort going in to making sure they don’t have to give it back to them.
		
Click to expand...

I don't ascribe to the conspiracy theory about what happened in 2021. I think it was just a perfect storm of inconsistent stewarding throughout the year plus Masi cocking up under immense pressure in Abu Dhabi.

No way will Verstappen's title be removed. It was the team that allegedly overspent, not the driver. Just like in 2007 when Hamilton and Alonso kept their points.


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## BiMGuy (Oct 6, 2022)

cliveb said:



			I don't ascribe to the conspiracy theory about what happened in 2021. I think it was just a perfect storm of inconsistent stewarding throughout the year plus Masi cocking up under immense pressure in Abu Dhabi.

No way will Verstappen's title be removed. It was the team that allegedly overspent, not the driver. Just like in 2007 when Hamilton and Alonso kept their points.
		
Click to expand...

If Redbull overspent by a significant amount. Max was driving an illegal car. How can he keep his points? Also, the advantage from overspending last year could carry through to this season and beyond if they have baked in an advantage.

Teams have already been questioning Redbulls ability to afford the upgrades they have brought this season. Sour grapes maybe. But there has been speculation about their spending going on for a long time.

The FIA have now postponed publishing their findings 4(?) times. That suggests there is something seriously wrong somewhere.


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## cliveb (Oct 6, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			If Redbull overspent by a significant amount. Max was driving an illegal car. How can he keep his points?
		
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In principle you're absolutely correct.
But the 2021 world champion has been declared and it won't change.
It's the same sort of situation where a medal comp is closed, the result declared, only later to find that the winner should have been penalised a couple of shots at some point.



BiMGuy said:



			Also, the advantage from overspending last year could carry through to this season and beyond if they have baked in an advantage.
		
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Yes, agreed. Perhaps if there is a major overspend discovered for 2021, the solution is to DQ them (and their drivers) from the 2022 campaign before it ends. But I don't think the FIA have quite big enough balls to do that.



BiMGuy said:



			The FIA have now postponed publishing their findings 4(?) times. That suggests there is something seriously wrong somewhere.
		
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It suggests to me that the FIA have already privately told RB that they're going to have the book thrown at them, and the legal teams are now locked in combat.


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## BTatHome (Oct 6, 2022)

So they delay again to ensure that Max can be crowned again this year .... and then can't remove that title either 😉

Seems quite ironic that the penalty for over spending is a multimillion dollar fine ... isn't that the whole issue, they really don't care about the money aspect.

Of course a fine also means that last year's car, this year's car and next year car have all benefited from that overspend ... maybe more teams will decide that an overspend is worth the penalty in the future !


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## Swango1980 (Oct 6, 2022)

BTatHome said:



			So they delay again to ensure that Max can be crowned again this year .... and then can't remove that title either 😉

Seems quite ironic that the penalty for over spending is a multimillion dollar fine ... isn't that the whole issue, they really don't care about the money aspect.

Of course a fine also means that last year's car, this year's car and next year car have all benefited from that overspend ... maybe more teams will decide that an overspend is worth the penalty in the future !
		
Click to expand...

If the infringement was large, I guess they'll just keep delaying the announcement until after Max wins the championship. Then they will have an excuse to determine a penalty that ensures it doesn't take it away from him.


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## Captainron (Oct 9, 2022)

Congratulations to Max Verstappen on winning the World Campionship….
👏👏👏


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## Swango1980 (Oct 9, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Congratulations to Max Verstappen on winning the World Campionship….
👏👏👏
		
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Indeed. At least he is making sure all.that additional money Red Bull have spent hasn't gone to waste


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## theoneandonly (Oct 9, 2022)

R


Captainron said:



			Congratulations to Max Verstappen on winning the World Campionship….
👏👏👏
		
Click to expand...

Till tomorrow 😜😂


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## Tashyboy (Oct 9, 2022)

Is that 2 titles Max has with an asterisk against them. **


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## ger147 (Oct 9, 2022)

Tashyboy said:



			Is that 2 titles Max has with an asterisk against them. **
		
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No, just the 1 asterisk from 2021.

In other motor racing news, a horriffic crash in the first Porsche Cup race at the BTCC meet at Brands Hatch this morning. Car flew off the track backwards, thru the barrier and ended up in a tree, narrowly avoiding taking out 5 marshalls.

Thankfully everyone escaped unhurt but was far too close for comfort.


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## Piece (Oct 9, 2022)

Congrats to Max this year. 👏 

Disappointed that Ferrari fell away this season.


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## Tashyboy (Oct 9, 2022)

Nothing against Max winning a second title but this is why I have fell outta live with F1.

Quote off the BBC site

Awarding full points or three-quarter points - as all the teams expected would be the case - was the difference between Verstappen leaving Japan as a double world champion, or having to go to the next race in the USA needing to gain one point on Leclerc and Perez to seal it.

Even Verstappen asked: "Are you sure?" when he was told he was champion, reflecting the historical precedent that reduced points are awarded in such circumstances. 

*But it seems that this protocol was inadvertently left out of the rules when they were rewritten over last winter following the controversial Belgian Grand Prix, when a result was declared despite no racing taking place.*


It is run by amateurs.


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## Captainron (Oct 9, 2022)

Tashyboy said:



			Is that 2 titles Max has with an asterisk against them. **
		
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Nah. This one is 100% legit. He will win a few more races to put it beyond doubt


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## Dando (Oct 9, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Nah. This one is 100% legit. He will win a few more races to put it beyond doubt
		
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How can it be legit if Red Bull broke the spending cap?


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## paddyc (Oct 9, 2022)

Got to say one of the most boring  F1 seasons I can recall.
Looked good to start with LeClerc staying with Max but Ferrari reliability  and a few curious strategies eventually  put paid to challenge. Max a brilliant  driver in a very good car ( question  marks aside on spending) I hope  we don't have Max dominating for years to come,  but I think we may.


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## Tashyboy (Oct 9, 2022)

Second title on the spin won by confusion. By a driver 100% legit? There is a smell around F1 at the moment that keeps me away. We have not even got to tomorrows delayed announcement.


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## BiMGuy (Oct 9, 2022)

Captainron said:



			Nah. This one is 100% legit. He will win a few more races to put it beyond doubt
		
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Apart from the (alleged) overspending last season could have carried an advantage into this season.


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## Wabinez (Oct 9, 2022)

Tomorrows announcement won’t change anything. Everything will be brushed under the carpet.

something along the lines of a fine and reduced wind tunnel time. Yawn.


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## SaintHacker (Oct 9, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			Tomorrows announcement won’t change anything. Everything will be brushed under the carpet.

something along the lines of a fine and reduced wind tunnel time. Yawn.
		
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I'm not so sure, I can see this becoming extremely messy if the likes of Ferrari Merc and Mclaren feel they have been put at a major disadvantage and the punishment is too lenient. The FIA might need some decent lawyers waiting in the wings...


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## SaintHacker (Oct 9, 2022)

On a different note that was another wet joke today. Pirelli must wonder why they bother manufacturing full wets THose tyres can shift 85 litres of water per second, there is nothing that will clear a wet track quicker than an F1 car. So instead of sitting in the pit lane hoping the weather clears, send them out under VSC conditions so they don't bump into each other, at 5 second intervals to allow the spray to clear a bit, and drive round and round for a while. Sorted, lets go racing and get a decent distance race on.


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## 4LEX (Oct 9, 2022)

F1 is a toxic mess. This is the first season I've not watched a single race after the disgrace of last season. Not surprised to see more cheating from RB. Theres just no point to it at the moment, a waste of time.


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## bobmac (Oct 10, 2022)

4LEX said:



			F1 is a toxic mess. This is the first season I've not watched a single race after the disgrace of last season. Not surprised to see more cheating from RB. Theres just no point to it at the moment, a waste of time.
		
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Ditto


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## Neilds (Oct 10, 2022)

But you still care enough to comment on a forum?


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## Beezerk (Oct 10, 2022)

Neilds said:



			But you still care enough to comment on a forum?

Click to expand...

In fairness there’s a huge leap from making a minor comment on a forum to investing x hours watching races lol.
I’m the same, not a massive F1 fan at all but I haven’t watched any this season after last year’s debacle.


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## Jason.H (Oct 10, 2022)

Don’t get annoyed at Merc for designing a pig of a car.


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## Swango1980 (Oct 10, 2022)

Neilds said:



			But you still care enough to comment on a forum?

Click to expand...

Have you seen the LIV thread? There are plenty of people that clearly have no interest in watching LIV at all, but they write book loads of comments on how bad it is.

It is the sort of thing that happens in many forums. People complain about what they do not like. Not every thread is made up of people just saying how wonderful that particular subject is.


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## SteveW86 (Oct 10, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Have you seen the LIV thread? There are plenty of people that clearly have no interest in watching LIV at all, but they write book loads of comments on how bad it is.

It is the sort of thing that happens in many forums. People complain about what they do not like. Not every thread is made up of people just saying how wonderful that particular subject is.
		
Click to expand...

Theres a reason the random irritations thread has 4 times as many posts in it than the things that gladden the heart thread,  even though it was started a year later.


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## Tashyboy (Oct 10, 2022)

Oh dear, last years infringements over expenditure rolls into this years. 
Watch this space for nowt to happen.


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## ger147 (Oct 10, 2022)

As has been widely reported over the last few weeks, the FIA have confirmed that both Red Bull and Aston Martin were in breach of the spending cap for the 2021 season.

The breach in Red Bull's case is a minor breach. The FIA have not published a figure but the rumour is it is around £1.8m over. No punishments have yet been announced.

Aston Martin's breach was also minor.


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## Swango1980 (Oct 10, 2022)

If the FIA were to determine it was a major breach, it would look very bad for the FIA as well. The team of their new hero (Max Verstappen) caught breaking the rules after his second Championship win. As such, I'm sure they made every effort to ensure only a minor breach was ever announced, and they can simply apply a slap on the wrist.

I wonder if it will encourage other teams to overspend in the future?


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## ger147 (Oct 10, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			If the FIA were to determine it was a major breach, it would look very bad for the FIA as well. The team of their new hero (Max Verstappen) caught breaking the rules after his second Championship win. As such, I'm sure they made every effort to ensure only a minor breach was ever announced, and they can simply apply a slap on the wrist.

I wonder if it will encourage other teams to overspend in the future?
		
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Whether it's a Minor or Major is based simply on the amount of overspend. It is deemed to be Minor if it's less than 5% of the budget cap.


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## theoneandonly (Oct 10, 2022)

It's still a potential overspend over several million dollars. You could buy a lot with that...


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## Neilds (Oct 10, 2022)

Are people so blind to think that it is just Red Bull and Aston Martin at it and the rest are squeaky clean? They will all be ‘bending‘ the rules here and there to offset spending and claiming it is for something else.  Just as football clubs use things like image rights to try and claim they are within the Financial Fair Play rules.


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## Swango1980 (Oct 10, 2022)

Neilds said:



			Are people so blind to think that it is just Red Bull and Aston Martin at it and the rest are squeaky clean? They will all be ‘bending‘ the rules here and there to offset spending and claiming it is for something else.  Just as football clubs use things like image rights to try and claim they are within the Financial Fair Play rules.
		
Click to expand...

So, are Red Bull and Aston Martin just the idiots that were caught?


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## Neilds (Oct 10, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			So, are Red Bull and Aston Martin just the idiots that were caught?
		
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Probably 🤪


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## Tashyboy (Oct 10, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			It's still a potential overspend over several million dollars. You could buy a lot with that...
		
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Unless you are Man City. 😉 oops wrong thread.


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## Wabinez (Oct 11, 2022)

Aston Martin only found guilty of, essentially, filling in some forms incorrectly.

Eyes on FIA for the reaction, however, the guy in charge used to work for Red Bull, so the big brushes to sweep it all under the carpet will be out.  Unless they come down relatively hard, a lot of teams will just start overspending and hope the results mean any penalty will be negligible


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## cliveb (Oct 11, 2022)

From the moment Red Bull started overspending last year, any new part was illegal so the cars should have failed scrutineering and been DQ'd.
The FIA won't have the balls to enforce that, though.


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## Tashyboy (Oct 28, 2022)

Re the “ punishment “ for Red Bull,This is the top comment on the BBC Have your say. Sums it up perfectly for me.

Quote:
imagine the uproar if a 100m runner failed a drugs test but paid £1000 to keep his gold medal and 1st place.

The FIA to F1 is what VAR Is to football.


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## Piece (Oct 28, 2022)

Tashyboy said:



			Re the “ punishment “ for Red Bull,This is the top comment on the BBC Have your say. Sums it up perfectly for me.

Quote:
imagine the uproar if a 100m runner failed a drugs test but paid £1000 to keep his gold medal and 1st place.

The FIA to F1 is what VAR Is to football.
		
Click to expand...

My issue is not necessarily with the penalty, is more about the lack of any remorse nor sniff of a Red Bull apology. Red Bull are playing the victim despite them being the only team that were caught with their trousers properly down. Not too dissimilar to the Conor Benn drugs test fiasco, where its not his fault at all, he says....


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## Tashyboy (Oct 28, 2022)

Piece said:



			My issue is not necessarily with the penalty, is more about the lack of any remorse nor sniff of a Red Bull apology. Red Bull are playing the victim despite them being the only team that were caught with their trousers properly down. Not too dissimilar to the Conor Benn drugs test fiasco, where its not his fault at all, he says....
		
Click to expand...

Exactly and my thoughts are they did even more that was not discovered.


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## Jason.H (Oct 29, 2022)

What was most surprising about this year was how well Ferrari started. Le Clerc seemed to lose his mojo thanks to strategy blunders. I wonder if next year will be more of the same.


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## SteveW86 (Oct 30, 2022)

Well that was a bit of a borefest


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## ger147 (Oct 30, 2022)

Best bit of the weekend was the F1 theme tune being played by a Mariachi band.


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## BrianM (Oct 30, 2022)

SteveW86 said:



			Well that was a bit of a borefest
		
Click to expand...

Was absolutely dire viewing, I don’t normally watch it but just no excitement today.


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## Swango1980 (Oct 30, 2022)

Yes, was a dull one. Are Ferrari going backwards?


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## Wabinez (Oct 31, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Yes, was a dull one. Are Ferrari going backwards?
		
Click to expand...

They were experiencing engine issues during practice sessions, so imagine they 'turned it down' for reliability sake.


Mexico normally brings a few engine issues, so surprised to only see ALO have to retire.  Mexico also seems to provide a drab race...it's not great viewing at all. Probably means they'll extend the contract for another 5 years


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## theoneandonly (Oct 31, 2022)

From Merc domination to red bull... What were the rule changes meant to do again?


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## srixon 1 (Oct 31, 2022)

I used to watch F1 religiously, but when one guy wins nearly every race in the season it just becomes a bore fest. Not just this season, but previously also when Hamilton was winning most of the races.


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## SaintHacker (Nov 1, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			From Merc domination to red bull... What were the rule changes meant to do again?
		
Click to expand...

Make it closer, assuming everyone sticks to them...


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## Dando (Nov 1, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			Make it closer, assuming everyone sticks to them...
		
Click to expand...

It’s amazing how much sandwiches cost these days


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## Beedee (Nov 13, 2022)

Cracking race in Brazil.  Well deserved win.

Nice to see that the new world champion* still has all the class of a fresh steaming  on top of a wedding cake.


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## BiMGuy (Nov 13, 2022)

Beedee said:



			Cracking race in Brazil.  Well deserved win.

Nice to see that the new world champion* still has all the class of a fresh steaming  on top of a wedding cake.
		
Click to expand...

It’s been a cracking weekends racing all round. 

Shame Lewis got taken out as we could have had a closer battle for the front. But, it’s a great to see George get his first win and a nice Mercedes 1, 2.

Max once again showing his true colours. Like his father and his team’s senior management. Utterly classless.


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## theoneandonly (Nov 13, 2022)

BiMGuy said:



			It’s been a cracking weekends racing all round.

Shame Lewis got taken out as we could have had a closer battle for the front. But, it’s a great to see George get his first win and a nice Mercedes 1, 2.

Max once again showing his true colours. Like his father and his team’s senior management. Utterly classless.
		
Click to expand...

The guy is a total dick. Great to see george get his first win. Can't believe le clerc wanted the team to get sainz to give up 3rd place, another knob.


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## SteveW86 (Nov 13, 2022)

Interlagos always seems to deliver! Another enjoyable race, great result for Mercedes and George in particular.

Leclerc and Verstappen just showing the selfishness at the core of pretty much all F1 drivers.


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## Swango1980 (Nov 13, 2022)

Always enjoy Brazil. May be my favourite race, but also like Canada and Silverstone.

Pity Mercedes have only really shown this pace now. Would have been interesting to see how things would have panned out if they improved earlier in season, and if Ferrari had done better to hang in there.

I suspect Hamilton was happy to come home in second place in the end, the 1-2 would have been huge for the team after such a long time being poor. Brilliant weekend from Russell, the sprint race really set things up for him.

Verstappen is clearly bigger than Red Bull, and he knows it. Has Perez ever helped Verstappen out? Didn't Perez drive superbly to slow down at Hamilton last year at Abu Dabi, purely to assist Verstappen in his title charge? 

I hope Perez never helps Verstappen again, and steps up a notch to directly challenge him next year.


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## SteveW86 (Nov 13, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Always enjoy Brazil. May be my favourite race, but also like Canada and Silverstone.

Pity Mercedes have only really shown this pace now. Would have been interesting to see how things would have panned out if they improved earlier in season, and if Ferrari had done better to hang in there.

I suspect Hamilton was happy to come home in second place in the end, the 1-2 would have been huge for the team after such a long time being poor. Brilliant weekend from Russell, the sprint race really set things up for him.

Verstappen is clearly bigger than Red Bull, and he knows it. Has Perez ever helped Verstappen out? Didn't Perez drive superbly to slow down at Hamilton last year at Abu Dabi, purely to assist Verstappen in his title charge?

I hope Perez never helps Verstappen again, and steps up a notch to directly challenge him next year.
		
Click to expand...

Interesting words from Perez on his team radio after the finish. It would appear he isn’t that big a fan of Max.


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## bobmac (Nov 14, 2022)

I wish I had been at the Red Bull de-brief to hear why Max wouldn't let his team mate back through.

Max's Radio
''Don't ask me again, are we clear about that?''


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## Smiffy (Nov 14, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			I hope Perez never helps Verstappen again, and steps up a notch to directly challenge him next year.
		
Click to expand...

Which would unfortunately see him out of the door.


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## Wabinez (Nov 14, 2022)

Swango1980 said:



			Has Perez ever helped Verstappen out?
		
Click to expand...


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## Smiffy (Nov 22, 2022)

Sounds like Perez is on the way out by all accounts...


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## theoneandonly (Nov 22, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			Sounds like Perez is on the way out by all accounts...
		
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Looks like Danny ric is going back to RB as a reserve driver but I havent seen anything about Perez on the way out.


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## Smiffy (Nov 23, 2022)

theoneandonly said:



			Looks like Danny ric is going back to RB as a reserve driver but I havent seen anything about Perez on the way out.
		
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Might just have been clickbait, but I read an article somewhere yesterday that suggested Riciardo is going to be more than reserve.
😉😉😉


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## Wabinez (Nov 23, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			Might just have been clickbait, but I read an article somewhere yesterday that suggested Riciardo is going to be more than reserve.
😉😉😉
		
Click to expand...

ricciardo will be the 3rd driver. Doing the promo stuff etc. he won’t be racing, doing practice sessions etc.

checo has one year left on his contract…maybe after that, D-Ric slots in….but we’ve been there before


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## Smiffy (Nov 23, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			ricciardo will be the 3rd driver. Doing the promo stuff etc. he won’t be racing, doing practice sessions etc.

checo has one year left on his contract…maybe after that, D-Ric slots in….but we’ve been there before
		
Click to expand...

Mmmmm 
You read it here first
😉😉😉😉


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## Wabinez (Nov 23, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			Mmmmm
You read it here first
😉😉😉😉
		
Click to expand...

there’s lots of ’stuff’ that gets spouted in these hallowed forums 😂


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## Smiffy (Nov 23, 2022)

Wabinez said:



			there’s lots of ’stuff’ that gets spouted in these hallowed forums 😂
		
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Yeah, but Smiffy's got his finger on the pulse...


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## JRS7 (Dec 3, 2022)

I am still not over Masi robbing Hamilton of the title last season.


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## Smiffy (Dec 3, 2022)

JRS7 said:



			I am still not over Masi robbing Hamilton of the title last season.
		
Click to expand...

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔


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## JRS7 (Dec 3, 2022)

Smiffy said:



			🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
		
Click to expand...


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## bobmac (Dec 3, 2022)

JRS7 said:



			I am still not over Masi robbing Hamilton of the title last season.
		
Click to expand...

Hopefully next season, Lewis will have a better car, Red Bull won't cheat and as Masi got sacked, he won't be able to stop Lewis from winning his well deserved 8th world Championship that was stolen from him last season.


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## Asian Dawn (Dec 3, 2022)

And that whole squadron of flying pigs going in formation over Silverstone .....


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## JRS7 (Dec 3, 2022)

bobmac said:



			Hopefully next season, Lewis will have a better car, Red Bull won't cheat and as Masi got sacked, he won't be able to stop Lewis from winning his well deserved 8th world Championship that was stolen from him last season.
		
Click to expand...

Correct B


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## JRS7 (Dec 3, 2022)

Asian Dawn said:



			And that whole squadron of flying pigs going in formation over Silverstone .....
		
Click to expand...

A


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## bobmac (Dec 3, 2022)

Asian Dawn said:



			And that whole squadron of flying pigs going in formation over Silverstone .....
		
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He's done it 7 times before (should have been 8), why shouldn't he win next year?


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## SaintHacker (Dec 4, 2022)

bobmac said:



			He's done it 7 times before (should have been 8), why shouldn't he win next year?
		
Click to expand...

He was probably just referring to the bit about RB not cheating...


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## bobmac (Dec 5, 2022)

SaintHacker said:



			He was probably just referring to the bit about RB not cheating...
		
Click to expand...

Got you, apologies


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## JamesR (Dec 21, 2022)

This thread is boring and I don’t want to post on it !
👍


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