# Howard Webb,.... above his own station!!!!!?



## stevelev (Feb 16, 2014)

Is it just me or did anyone else just seen this idiot look at Sterlings hand like he had left dog muck on his shirt.

Now before you ask I support united, but webb needs to get back on a level since reffing the world cup games he is way above his own station. 

What a spanner, does himself no favours


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 16, 2014)

Didn't his attitude bother you when he was on UTDs books? 

I know what you mean tho,he is a bit of a Diva.


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## Tashyboy (Feb 16, 2014)

Got a feeling Howard webbs gonna be one of those transfer listed at the end of the season by the rags.. Not played to his potential this year


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## Old Skier (Feb 16, 2014)

Getting above himself at times but he is the ref and you don't touch the ref and Stirling needs to know it. Lucky not to have been booked at the very least.


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## Stuey01 (Feb 16, 2014)

Hands on the ref... Should have been sent off.


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## G1BB0 (Feb 16, 2014)

shocking refereeing then, he is not the ref he was tbh!!!

talk about a stonewall pen and the ref 5 yards away grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


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## stevelev (Feb 16, 2014)

And I suppose that tsckle by chamberlain was not a pen


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 16, 2014)

He isn't the best ref but is more than competent compared to a couple of others I've seen this year. You shouldn't be touching the official in any sport and I'd be tempting to book him for ungentlemanly conduct but then again I don't like Sterling!


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## Old Skier (Feb 16, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I don't like Sterling!
		
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This needs moving to the Scottish Independence thread me thinks


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## fundy (Feb 16, 2014)

clear penalty (albeit Suarez looked like he'd taken three rounds to the side lol) and Gerrard should have been off for a clear 2nd bookable

shocking ref, always has been


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## chrisd (Feb 16, 2014)

The refereeing in the Premiership at the games I've been to has been pretty shocking to be honest.


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## Tashyboy (Feb 16, 2014)

What does me and am no fan of Howard's is that who is he and actually every referee answerable to. Managers get sacked every week through results and let's be right this shocking performance affected the result. 
Any other ref would next week be in the championship, but MR Webb seems untouchable?

shocking decisions from a shocking ref.  should not come as a surprise.

in webs defence he probably never gave a penalty against goofy because the other 20 players were in his sight of vision.


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## BTatHome (Feb 16, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



			in webs defence he probably never gave a penalty against goofy because the other 20 players were in his sight of vision.
		
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im assuming you didn't actually see the match then !


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

Big game - big decision and once again Webb fails poorly

If I kept making mistakes like he does then I would be fired 

How he didn't give that pen I will never know - right in front of him - no excuse


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

So can anyone let me know why Webb decided this wasn't a penalty 

https://vine.co/v/M79g6hw1T0I


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

Guys on SSN were equally baffelled by that , he should be made explain , be interesting if SSN have the guy over the referees on this week , even he couldnt explain that one id say


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			Guys on SSN were equally baffelled by that , he should be made explain , be interesting if SSN have the guy over the referees on this week , even he couldnt explain that one id say
		
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It's truly unexplainable - refs get dropped for clangers like that - will Webb ?


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			So can anyone let me know why Webb decided this wasn't a penalty 

https://vine.co/v/M79g6hw1T0I

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Even Wenger couldn't have missed that one.


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			It's truly unexplainable - refs get dropped for clangers like that - will Webb ?
		
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He should , wiil he ? i dont think so,  he is their top man , isnt he ? I think Brendan Rodgers has a right to an answer tho , it not a sunday morning knockabout , its big bucks  .. im not for a second saying refs should have to explain every poor decision , BUT that is shocking beyond belief .. yards away , clear view .. has to be easiest decision ever ..

i suppose Arsen didnt see it


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			He should , wiil he ? i dont think so,  he is their top man , isnt he ? I think Brendan Rodgers has a right to an answer tho , it not a sunday morning knockabout , its big bucks  .. im not for a second saying refs should have to explain every poor decision , BUT that is shocking beyond belief .. yards away , clear view .. has to be easiest decision ever ..

i suppose Arsen didnt see it
		
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He won't get dropped - he is the golden boy

He has had multiple mistakes like that and still not been dropped


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## Tashyboy (Feb 16, 2014)

BTatHome said:



			im assuming you didn't actually see the match then !
		
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Oh I saw the game and I would imagine his Missis has made him an appointment to go to specsavers tomorrow. Am no fan of goofys but that was nailed on.


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## jp5 (Feb 16, 2014)

Suarez... the boy that cried wolf


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## USER1999 (Feb 16, 2014)

A cracking game of end to end stuff.

Sterling and gerrard could have been sent off. Webb didn't. Suarez should have had a penalty, but then so should ozil, and no ones milking that one. Sky et al just seem to have ignored it (about five minutes after the suarez non event).

May be if Suarez had just fallen over, he might have got it, but theatrical?

Oh, and if agger wanted sanogos shirt that badly, he should have asked, instead of trying to take it off him all game.


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## the hammer (Feb 16, 2014)

Why, with the finances available, can footy  refereeing not be on an equal par to Rugby. the reffing in the six nations etc. is fantastic.
you may not agree with the ref, but at least you know his thinking /reasoning for the decision.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

the hammer said:



			Why, with the finances available, can footy  refereeing not be on an equal par to Rugby. the reffing in the six nations etc. is fantastic.
you may not agree with the ref, but at least you know his thinking /reasoning for the decision.
		
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Respect is a big difference 

Rugby players show respect to the officials regardless of the decision 

Footballers don't and never will


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## G1BB0 (Feb 16, 2014)




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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Respect is a big difference 

Rugby players show respect to the officials regardless of the decision 

Footballers don't and never will
		
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If its not given then it should be imposed , just lay the law down at the start of a season , take the choice out of the players hands , have retrospective punishment for cheating etc 

people say its not at grass roots so its not at senior level , i think its the other way around , if kids see their idols respecting refs and each other they will follow suit


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## G1BB0 (Feb 16, 2014)

I always had hands behind my back and called a ref sir....


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## the hammer (Feb 16, 2014)

If reffing was like rugby, the endless "hasbeens" who are paid lots of money to give their biased opinion would be unemployed, which would be a step in the right direction. 
The amount of money involved, speed of the game, now is far far too much for one mans naked eye and his two gimps to be able to officiate without outside help.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			If its not given then it should be imposed , just lay the law down at the start of a season , take the choice out of the players hands , have retrospective punishment for cheating etc 

people say its not at grass roots so its not at senior level , i think its the other way around , if kids see their idols respecting refs and each other they will follow suit
		
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Totally agree but the governing body haven't got the bottle to impose themselves 

Certainly not against the big teams 

Too much money riding on it ( and the FA get a big chunk of that money )


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## the hammer (Feb 16, 2014)

G1BB0 said:








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That's poor.


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## G1BB0 (Feb 16, 2014)

haha, its light hearted


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

not poor just a giggle , use to be a utd shirt ha


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## JCW (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpool fans mourning again ,Liverpool are  not as good as the fans think they are , few goods games then a few not so just like the Ref Howard Webb , but TBH he is a ref to a load  of cheating footballers every week who do anything to gain an edge, by the way check the score tomorrow in the paper , its the same as today , every game has if only this if only that , truth is , its now history and set in stone , as for the pen that was not given , the player concern is a well known diver and that played a part in the ref not giving it and he only gets one look not like us on telly ...............................EYG


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## the hammer (Feb 16, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			not poor just a giggle , use to be a utd shirt ha
		
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Is it that obvious im a UTD supporter

Must try harder


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

JCW said:



			Liverpool fans mourning again ,Liverpool are  not as good as the fans think they are , few goods games then a few not so just like the Ref Howard Webb , but TBH he is a ref to a load  of cheating footballers every week who do anything to gain an edge, by the way check the score tomorrow in the paper , its the same as today , every game has if only this if only that , truth is , its now history and set in stone , as for the pen that was not given , the player concern is a well known diver and that played a part in the ref not giving it and he only gets one look not like us on telly ...............................EYG
		
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Well im not a red and i agree there is alot of diving / cheating etc in most if not all clubs , if a ref / any ref cant see and give that pen , he is not fit to ref a prem game


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

JCW said:



			Liverpool fans mourning again ,Liverpool are  not as good as the fans think they are , few goods games then a few not so just like the Ref Howard Webb , but TBH he is a ref to a load  of cheating footballers every week who do anything to gain an edge, by the way check the score tomorrow in the paper , its the same as today , every game has if only this if only that , truth is , its now history and set in stone , as for the pen that was not given , the player concern is a well known diver and that played a part in the ref not giving it and he only gets one look not like us on telly ...............................EYG
		
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Totally missed the point 

Regardless of the team and the player - that was as blatant a penalty as you can get and right under the nose of the ref 

If he can't spot that is a penalty then he is clearly incapable of doing the job 

To turn the focus onto the player is poor and just giving people an opportunity to once again have a dig at the player - despite his behaviour being impeccable this season


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## G1BB0 (Feb 16, 2014)

doh, now I get it


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

G1BB0 said:



			doh, now I get it 

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Keep up Steve


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## JCW (Feb 16, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			Well im not a red and i agree there is alot of diving / cheating etc in most if not all clubs , if a ref / any ref cant see and give that pen , he is not fit to ref a prem game
		
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Be honest , have you seen everything in your life ..................EYG


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## bladeplayer (Feb 16, 2014)

Not sure of the relevance of the question ,, but i will answer you 

no but ive seen most things that are a few feet in front of me, suposadley a world class referee .. and a copper to boot ,, as i say not a pool fan but he should have got that one ..


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## JCW (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Totally missed the point 

Regardless of the team and the player - that was as blatant a penalty as you can get and right under the nose of the ref 

If he can't spot that is a penalty then he is clearly incapable of doing the job 

To turn the focus onto the player is poor and just giving people an opportunity to once again have a dig at the player - despite his behaviour being impeccable this season
		
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He is a diver , every ref knows that , like I said he has one sec to make up his mind and the player concern is a known diver , its like when I played cricket , scored not a lot of runs and given out  LBW , moaned like mad in the dressing room and was told to check the score book , it says out LBW , that's life ...........................EYG


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Totally missed the point 

Regardless of the team and the player - that was as blatant a penalty as you can get and right under the nose of the ref 

If he can't spot that is a penalty then he is clearly incapable of doing the job 

To turn the focus onto the player is poor and just giving people an opportunity to once again have a dig at the player - despite his behaviour being impeccable this season
		
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Have to agree that it was definitely a penalty but given his previous and the fact that he put in an Oscar winning performance probably went against him.

As for impeccable behaviour, does that include his attempts to get a penalty and Fabianski sent off by trying to persuade Webb that Agger had been punched by the keeper when in fact Fabianski missed everyone?


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## Dodger (Feb 16, 2014)

Saurez was looking for it mind.


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## JCW (Feb 16, 2014)

Blue in Munich said:



			Have to agree that it was definitely a penalty but given his previous and the fact that he put in an Oscar winning performance probably went against him.

As for impeccable behaviour, does that include his attempts to get a penalty and Fabianski sent off by trying to persuade Webb that Agger had been punched by the keeper when in fact Fabianski missed everyone?
		
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Rest My case ..........you get what you reap , cheat a lot and in the end nobody trusts you anymore no matter what you do , does not matter what was or is the correct decision , the ref did not give it


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## USER1999 (Feb 16, 2014)

Why haven't I seen 50 odd replays of Ozil being fouled in liverpools box? Or 50 odd replays of sterling handling the ref, and swearing at him? Or Sanogo getting fouled at every corner?

Because its more news worthy to look at the Suarez thing.

It's footy. You get rubbish decisions.

Apparently they even out. 

They probably did.


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## Foxholer (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Totally agree but the governing body haven't got the bottle to impose themselves 

Certainly not against the big teams 

Too much money riding on it ( and the FA get a big chunk of that money )
		
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Actually, Dyke has tried to do that - with limited success. Even Ref's Association are not keen - probably a respect/ego thing.

http://news.sky.com/story/1152257/fa-chief-greg-dyke-wants-tougher-action

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-FA-chairman-Greg-Dyke-wins-rules-battle.html

However, by doing too many of these, the authority of Refs is actually being chipped away, which is probably why their association wasn't keen on it when he first proposed it.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 16, 2014)

Let's be honest Skrtel gets away with murder every single game.Just watch him on corners & free kicks he's defending.
No doubt today's incident was a penalty & Webb should have to explain his actions. But quite a few incidents went against Arsenal aswell.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

I guess shouldn't be surprised that it would turn into another thread to slag of Suarez 

Plenty players have been booked for diving this season - Chelsea players , Arsenal players , Man Utd players , City players 

Suarez hasn't 

The thread I'm sure was/is about the poor decision making from Howard Webb as opposed to an opportunity to slate Liverpool or Suarez or Skrtel etc. 

"REGARDLESS OF THE PLAYER OR TEAM" - Howard Webb is not competent enough to be a top level ref - too many big decisions are missed by him and not just in games with Liverpool and Suarez.


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I guess shouldn't be surprised that it would turn into another thread to slag of Suarez 

Plenty players have been booked for diving this season - Chelsea players , Arsenal players , Man Utd players , City players 

Suarez hasn't 

The thread I'm sure was/is about the poor decision making from Howard Webb as opposed to an opportunity to slate Liverpool or Suarez or Skrtel etc. 

"REGARDLESS OF THE PLAYER OR TEAM" - Howard Webb is not competent enough to be a top level ref - too many big decisions are missed by him and not just in games with Liverpool and Suarez.
		
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I haven'y got any points for speeding on my driving licence; doesn't alter the fact that I have exceeded the speed limit.  There's a big difference between not doing it & not getting caught, as the fact that he was neither booked nor sent off for biting anyone last season proves.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

Blue in Munich said:



			I haven'y got any points for speeding on my driving licence; doesn't alter the fact that I have exceeded the speed limit.  There's a big difference between not doing it & not getting caught, as the fact that he was neither booked nor sent off for biting anyone last season proves.
		
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Howard Webb ?


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 16, 2014)

Not really surprised that we've got yet another '"Poor us" thread after a Liverpool game. 
Come on Phil even you've got to be getting bored of it now


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Not really surprised that we've got yet another '"Poor us" thread after a Liverpool game. 
Come on Phil even you've got to be getting bored of it now

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You can point out the poor us part if you so wish 

*"REGARDLESS OF TEAM OR PLAYER"*


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## JCW (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			You can point out the poor us part if you so wish 

*"REGARDLESS OF TEAM OR PLAYER"*

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This is my last take on this , you don't always get what you should in life , that's how it is , many an honest person has had this but still stayed  honest , this guy is a great player but everyone sees that talent and also all the cheating he tries at every game , that is a factor in him not getting the pen and everyone has a bad day but it don't make him or her a bad ref , thanks


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Howard Webb ?
		
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On the whole does a pretty good job, probably better than most, considering that he gets one look at it real time and a number of the players he has to deal with are trying to have him over.  That said he did miss a penalty this afternoon but was probably confused by the fact that the player fouled did a headstand immediately after the contact.  Maybe if said player, who cannot be named because of his immaculate disciplinary record, had just fallen over like he'd been fouled rather than thrown from a speeding motorcycle then he might have got the penalty.


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## Oxfordcomma (Feb 16, 2014)

Every time a ref makes an error we get this, I do wonder sometimes how many of you have tried it? I have, I'm a qualified ref, have been for a few years now. Now I'm a level 7 ref, only ref youth football, and although I think I do a decent job I know I'm not really a great referee. The guys like Webb when you compare them to me are worlds apart just like Clichy or Cole are worlds apart from me when I (used to) put on the shinpads and play as a left back. But world class fullbacks screw things up sometimes, and so do world class refs. 


Before anyone says anything, no I didn't see the game (I was playing golf!) but from the link to the gif you can see how the mistake might come, with the challenge being read as a shoulder to shoulder followed by Suarez falling over.As he does on occasion. IF, that is, you're standing where Webb is, and seeing it all in real time rather than on an endless replay with 3 camera angles. It's a really bad error, definitely, and Webb will be angry with himself just like a keeper is when they let in a soft near-post goal. But some of the comments boys, seriously?


"The refereeing in the Premiership at the games I've been to has been pretty shocking to be honest."
"shocking ref, always has been"
"shocking decisions from a shocking ref. should not come as a surprise."
"Howard Webb is not competent enough to be a top level ref"


Really??? Come on gents, I've played and coached enough football to know that all of the pro players are really very very good, even if they're playing rubbish that day. I've played enough golf to know that every single tour pro is really very very good, even when they're missing cuts or choking. I bet most guys on here can say both of those too. But I've also reffed enough games that I know every PMGO ref is really very very good, even when they miss things. I go to watch live football regularly and since I qualified, I haven't shouted abuse at officials in anywhere near the same manner. Not because of wanting to stick together with other refs, but just because now I actually understand what I'm watching.


On the slightly different tangent of the rugby/respect thing, I and every other grassroots ref in the country would LOVE IT TO BITS if they clamped down on it. You'd only have to send Rooney or Terry off a couple of times for swearing at a ref before every kid and hungover sunday league player in the country got the message.


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## Foxholer (Feb 16, 2014)

Blue in Munich said:



			Have to agree that it was definitely a penalty but given his previous and the fact that he put in an Oscar winning performance probably went against him.
		
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My thoughts pretty much exactly. No way was it Oscar winning though - which was the problem.

Yes I'm certain Webb got it wrong. But looking for it and then flailing around like he did certainly didn't help his cause. He's stuck with the label of a diver now - and there's a touch of justice to that imo!



Oxfordcomma said:



			On the slightly different tangent of the rugby/respect thing, I and every other grassroots ref in the country would LOVE IT TO BITS if they clamped down on it. You'd only have to send Rooney or Terry off a couple of times for swearing at a ref before every kid and hungover sunday league player in the country got the message.
		
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A sin-bin is the best solution to that imo.

That way it can be applied directly at all levels and eliminated straight away.


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## the hammer (Feb 16, 2014)

Foxholer said:



			Actually, Dyke has tried to do that - with limited success. Even Ref's Association are not keen - probably a respect/ego thing.

http://news.sky.com/story/1152257/fa-chief-greg-dyke-wants-tougher-action

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-FA-chairman-Greg-Dyke-wins-rules-battle.html

However, by doing too many of these, the authority of Refs is actually being chipped away, which is probably why their association wasn't keen on it when he first proposed it.
		
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I haven't read your links but what I was trying to say was not chip the ref/ linesmens authority away, but , where the finances/ technology allow, the authority could be shared. would this not help beat the cheats?


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## Hobbit (Feb 16, 2014)

JCW said:



			Liverpool fans mourning again ,Liverpool are  not as good as the fans think they are ,
		
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Coffee over the keyboard moment for me - lol. I'm no Liverpool fan by any stretch but... 4pts off the top, only 3 goals scored less than City, the 2nd best goal diff. Stats don't lie. Maybe take your blinkers off...


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 16, 2014)

Hobbit said:



			Coffee over the keyboard moment for me - lol. I'm no Liverpool fan by any stretch but... 4pts off the top, only 3 goals scored less than City, the 2nd best goal diff. Stats don't lie. Maybe take your blinkers off...
		
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It's saying something JCW when a Boro fan(Hobbit) and an Evertonian(bladeplayer) are as flabbergasted by someone's bile and utter rubbish to comment ahead of the Liverpool fans. Congratulations.

Enjoy your chip on each shoulder.


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## Foxholer (Feb 16, 2014)

the hammer said:



			I haven't read your links but what I was trying to say was not chip the ref/ linesmens authority away, but , where the finances/ technology allow, the authority could be shared. would this not help beat the cheats?
		
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I don't quite understand what you mean, but if it's a case of using TV replays/5th Official to determine whether a foul or a dive, then it's likely to be unworkable unless play is stopped for the time it takes to determine - no small period - and, imo, the penalty for diving in those circumstances is a Red card!

Those links were regarding post match disciplinary action from video evidence - whether or not the Ref handled it during the game.


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## clubchamp98 (Feb 16, 2014)

Oxfordcomma said:



			Every time a ref makes an error we get this, I do wonder sometimes how many of you have tried it? I have, I'm a qualified ref, have been for a few years now. Now I'm a level 7 ref, only ref youth football, and although I think I do a decent job I know I'm not really a great referee. The guys like Webb when you compare them to me are worlds apart just like Clichy or Cole are worlds apart from me when I (used to) put on the shinpads and play as a left back. But world class fullbacks screw things up sometimes, and so do world class refs. 


Before anyone says anything, no I didn't see the game (I was playing golf!) but from the link to the gif you can see how the mistake might come, with the challenge being read as a shoulder to shoulder followed by Suarez falling over.As he does on occasion. IF, that is, you're standing where Webb is, and seeing it all in real time rather than on an endless replay with 3 camera angles. It's a really bad error, definitely, and Webb will be angry with himself just like a keeper is when they let in a soft near-post goal. But some of the comments boys, seriously?


"The refereeing in the Premiership at the games I've been to has been pretty shocking to be honest."
"shocking ref, always has been"
"shocking decisions from a shocking ref. should not come as a surprise."
"Howard Webb is not competent enough to be a top level ref"


Really??? Come on gents, I've played and coached enough football to know that all of the pro players are really very very good, even if they're playing rubbish that day. I've played enough golf to know that every single tour pro is really very very good, even when they're missing cuts or choking. I bet most guys on here can say both of those too. But I've also reffed enough games that I know every PMGO ref is really very very good, even when they miss things. I go to watch live football regularly and since I qualified, I haven't shouted abuse at officials in anywhere near the same manner. Not because of wanting to stick together with other refs, but just because now I actually understand what I'm watching.


On the slightly different tangent of the rugby/respect thing, I and every other grassroots ref in the country would LOVE IT TO BITS if they clamped down on it. You'd only have to send Rooney or Terry off a couple of times for swearing at a ref before every kid and hungover sunday league player in the country got the message.
		
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This is all wrong this has been a great day for Howard Webb Treat a little player like dog dirt just because he had the temerity to ask him why no foul was given did you see the look just because he put his hand on him shocking.    Then gets his name all over the papers tomorrow perfect day!   The technology is there to sort this sort of thing out but the refs don't want it because it shows how many big decisions they get wrong ,The thing is though that TV replays show they get them wrong anyway so they may as well use it to at least get the result right. I am a reds fan and do agree Suarez looked like a mummy falling out of a crypt but do you ever wonder why they do this as most footballers do if you cant get a pen for a tackle like that then you have to make it look good but it always looks like a sniper has shot them from the stands


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## Oxfordcomma (Feb 17, 2014)

clubchamp98 said:



			This is all wrong this has been a great day for Howard Webb Treat a little player like dog dirt just because he had the temerity to ask him why no foul was given did you see the look just because he put his hand on him shocking.    Then gets his name all over the papers tomorrow perfect day!   The technology is there to sort this sort of thing out but the refs don't want it because it shows how many big decisions they get wrong ,The thing is though that TV replays show they get them wrong anyway so they may as well use it to at least get the result right. I am a reds fan and do agree Suarez looked like a mummy falling out of a crypt but do you ever wonder why they do this as most footballers do if you cant get a pen for a tackle like that then you have to make it look good but it always looks like a sniper has shot them from the stands
		
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Sorry, which bit is wrong again? I said it was a bad mistake but easy to see why it was made, and said that anyone who wants to have a bash at refs needs to give it a go themselves. 

To answer the general point about replays, yup, they would make everything perfect. Maybe. Or perhaps quite often they'd be inconclusive, and like cricket it would be "on-field decision stands". But stuff that, I'm a football fan first and a junior ref second. If I wanted to watch three hour games with 60 minutes of playing time I'd be a fan of American Football. TV replays work well in stop-start games where there is likely to be a dead ball immediately after a contentious decision. Rugby only uses them for tries I think, and for our equivalent of that, we now have the general acceptance of goal-line technology. Beyond that - well, when would you stop play? What if there's a breakaway goal at the other end during the review? Or a bad tackle which needs a red? Or the fouled person complains so much in the meantime, he gets a second yellow?


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## jp5 (Feb 17, 2014)

Can't remember the last time I ended up on my head when someone made contact with me playing footie. So given the player, his previous cheating actions and the completely unnatural reaction, can understand Webb's decision completely.

He may be a decent player but he is a disgrace for the game.

Surprised (not really) that Skrtel on Cazorla hasn't been examined to the same degree. 

Typical Liverpool fan behaviour.


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## MegaSteve (Feb 17, 2014)

With regard the original question... Perhaps 'the look' is an indication of how he deals with 'customers' working his day time job...

Having said that... You don't touch officials and neither should yelling obscenities at them be deemed acceptable as seems to be the case nowadays... Once officialdom has dealt with the true scourge of the modern day game [all the touchy feely stuff in the penalty area] then perhaps the next task would be getting players to respect the game... Not just by wearing a worthless armband...


As for Mr Suarez... In modern terms he won a penalty[first incident]... In old terms he failed to get a penalty awarded[second incident]... In a week an all time great passed away I am getting more and more sick and tired with the attitude "he was entitled to go down to win a penalty"....  If Tom Finney or any other player from his era had been awarded a penalty from a mere tap on the ankle they'd have held their heads in shame and embarrassment...


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## brendy (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpool didnt play to their full potential yesterday and in open play didnt do enough to beat Arsenal, plain and simple. Arsenals keeper played a blinder and the main talking point is Howard Webbs inability to spot a genuine foul being less than 10 yards from it.
Was Suarez fouled in the box, yes he was,
Was it dramatic, yes it was,
Was that necessary, probably not,
Does being dramatic lessen the fact that he was fouled plain and simple, no it doesnt, it was still a penalty which wasn't given.

The sooner technology is brought in, the better.


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## MegaSteve (Feb 17, 2014)

brendy said:



			The sooner technology is brought in, the better.
		
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'Technology' fails when a 'human' is still required to make the final decision...

At a recent[ish] rugby match I attended despite play being held up whilst the officials reviewed an 'incident' several times over their final decision was still totally wrong...


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## jp5 (Feb 17, 2014)

Technology wouldn't be required if players weren't so keen to cheat their opponent at whatever cost. I am increasingly finding myself detesting the modern day values of football.


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## Foxholer (Feb 17, 2014)

MegaSteve said:



			....  If Tom Finney or any other player from his era had been awarded a penalty from a mere tap on the ankle they'd have held their heads in shame and embarrassment...
		
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I for one am rather glad that Football has changed even if there is cheating and needling going on - as there always was. I don't want to watch some sort of battle being played out by guys hacking each others ankles and legs, on a quagmire where you can't see any green, with a ball that has doubled or more in weight in the first half. That said, there were some players of real genius around then from both attacking and defending points of view. 

Not sure whether it was the attitude of Sir Tom, who was just before my memory, but it's certainly the attitude if Sir Bobby Charlton, that you play the game according to the Rules and style of the time.


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## jimbob.someroo (Feb 17, 2014)

Some absolute tripe in this thread again as per usual when we get onto Suarez.

Fact is, that was as clear a penalty as you're every likely to see. It wasn't given and it cost Liverpool dearly. 

Howard Webb either didn't see it, which mean's he was poorly positioned. Or, saw it and decided it wasn't a penalty. Or, saw it and based on Suarez's supposed history decided he's probably diving. 

None of these reasons are good enough for the country's 'best referee' to not give that decision. But like others have said, nothing will happen, nothing will change. Unfortunately, it's just tough luck this time around. Webb needs some serious scrutiny from the powers that be. He's liable to make the nation a laughing stock if he refs like that at the World Cup.


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## In_The_Rough (Feb 17, 2014)

Was a penalty yes. However there were things that Arsenal did not get given as well. The reaction from LS was laughable the arching of the back and twirls through the air were pathetic. Do LFC ever lose a match fair and square? there always seems to be some arguments over disallowed goals/penalties or such like. The nation is already a laughing stock with refs anyway so doubt even the poor Howard Webb will make much difference.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

In_The_Rough said:



			Was a penalty yes. However there were things that Arsenal did not get given as well. The reaction from LS was laughable the arching of the back and twirls through the air were pathetic. Do LFC ever lose a match fair and square? there always seems to be some arguments over disallowed goals/penalties or such like. The nation is already a laughing stock with refs anyway so doubt even the poor Howard Webb will make much difference.
		
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 Yes Liverpool have lost matches this year fairly. However in the "big" matches against Chelsea away (Webb again), City away and Arsenal (away) yesterday we have by far and away been on the worst end of refereeing decisions. The main hullabaloo was by the press, echoed by Liverpool fans, and lots of neutral fans/journalists and non LFC ex-players have also said the same. Blame moaning LFC fans all you like, but when most of the neutrals are also saying the same, look at your own agenda first. Suarez's histrionics are laughable and poor - doesn't mean it wasn't a penalty from less than 10 yards away, and with the best view in the house. I don't know what LFC's losing percentage is, but 8 losses out of 8 for our last 8 matches from Webb. You don't need to be a mathematician to work out the differences in probabilities.


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## Foxholer (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			I don't know what LFC's losing percentage is, but 8 losses out of 8 for our last 8 matches from Webb. You don't need to be a mathematician to work out the differences in probabilities.
		
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So are you saying Webb's a cheat?

Or that Liverpool are slow learners!


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## Stuey01 (Feb 17, 2014)

Far and away the worst end of refereeing decisions?

Not sure about that one. Yes it should have been a penalty. But there were a couple of decent penalty shouts waved away for Arsenal, Gerard should have been off for a second yellow, and Sterling laying hands on the ref could easily have been sent off.

So it seems to me that there were decisions going for and against both sides.


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## Cheifi0 (Feb 17, 2014)

stevelev said:



			Is it just me or did anyone else just seen this idiot look at Sterlings hand like he had left dog muck on his shirt.

Now before you ask I support united, but webb needs to get back on a level since reffing the world cup games he is way above his own station. 

What a spanner, does himself no favours
		
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I can't stand a lot of the referees in the Premier League.  Always feels like they are putting on a show and that they are the centre of attention, always making exaggerated facial expressions and dramatic hand and arm movements.  The less we notice them the better they are.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

Foxholer said:



			So are you saying Webb's a cheat?

Or that Liverpool are slow learners!
		
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I don't see what we can learn when a team with a 1 in 7 or 8 losing rate (I'm guessing) loses 8 out of 8 with Webb as the referee, with lots of spurious decisions against you in there. Points more towards the former.



Stuey01 said:



			Far and away the worst end of refereeing decisions?

Not sure about that one. Yes it should have been a penalty. But there were a couple of decent penalty shouts waved away for Arsenal, Gerard should have been off for a second yellow, and Sterling laying hands on the ref could easily have been sent off.

So it seems to me that there were decisions going for and against both sides.
		
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 I'll be totally honest and say that I missed the first half (due to garyinderry driving a ball like a 24 h/capper in the last 4 holes, and driving like miss daisy afterwards), so bookings/accumulation of fouls/sending offs etc I can't fully comment on. Nailed on penalty - yes, Agger punched in the head nailed on penalty yes, Cazorla/Skrtel - Cazorla followed onto Skrtel, but if we had received 3 pens, I couldn't have moaned about that one. The "far and away on the receiving end" was aimed at all 3 games, not just yesterday's.


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## USER1999 (Feb 17, 2014)

Agger and fabianski went for the same ball. They were both entitled to attack it. Can't see why any one would think that was a penalty.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

murphthemog said:



			Agger and fabianski went for the same ball. They were both entitled to attack it. Can't see why any one would think that was a penalty.
		
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  Fabianski punched Agger on the side of the head, Agger got the ball. To be fair you could put this alongside the Cazorla/Skrtel one as very similar. There are no excuses for the 2nd Suarez one though. I've not seen Arsenal players so relieved at the end of a match in the recent past. The one thing I will take this season, no matter where we finish, is the entertainment value we have provided. It is not only down to our fantastic attack, but our woeful defending also.  Seeing City muller people is one form of entertainment, but I think most of our games have been great to watch from a neutral perspective.


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## MegaSteve (Feb 17, 2014)

Foxholer said:



			Not sure whether it was the attitude of Sir Tom, who was just before my memory, but it's certainly the attitude if Sir Bobby Charlton, that you play the game according to the Rules and style of the time.
		
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In all sincerity can't really see Sir Bobby advocating going to ground at the merest touch to 'win a penalty'.... Or shirt tugging in the box just because that's what everyone else does...


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## jp5 (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			I don't see what we can learn when a team with a 1 in 7 or 8 losing rate (I'm guessing) loses 8 out of 8 with Webb as the referee, with lots of spurious decisions against you in there. Points more towards the former.
		
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Webb (rightly or wrongly) is regarded as a top referee, so will take charge of the higher profile matches, which Liverpool are more likely to lose. Huge skewing on your stats, and there were decisions for and against both teams yesterday. Whilst the Suarez/Chamberlain clash was a pen, Pool lucky not to have finished with 9 men and conceded a couple of pens themselves.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

jp5 said:



			Webb (rightly or wrongly) is regarded as a top referee, so will take charge of the higher profile matches, which Liverpool are more likely to lose. Huge skewing on your stats, and there were decisions for and against both teams yesterday. Whilst the Suarez/Chamberlain clash was a pen, Pool lucky not to have finished with 9 men and conceded a couple of pens themselves.
		
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jp5 said:



			Can't remember the last time I ended up on my head when someone made contact with me playing footie. So given the player, his previous cheating actions and the completely unnatural reaction, can understand Webb's decision completely.

He may be a decent player but he is a disgrace for the game.

Surprised (not really) that Skrtel on Cazorla hasn't been examined to the same degree. 

Typical Liverpool fan behaviour.
		
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Forgive me my reticence on accepting your views from an completely unbiased perspective. Sounds like we were lucky not to have been 5-1 then, glad I didn't see the 1st half.


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## jimbob.someroo (Feb 17, 2014)

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-involving-liverpool-and-referee-howard-webb/


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## cookelad (Feb 17, 2014)

Problem you have here is that the FA need ref's to be infallible, in the same way a ref can't change his mind based on a players say-so, if the FA decide that Howard Webb has made a mistake they can't pin it on him publicly without damaging his ability to take charge of further premier league games and being questioned on every decision made during games!


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## bladeplayer (Feb 17, 2014)

My 2p worth on the Agger & Gerrard incidents 

Agger i appreciate you would probably get a free out the field if you get hit just after you hit it , i dont think you are ever getting a pen for that guys sorry 

Gerrard sending off , i dont buy this one again i appreciate if you go to ground you risk being sent off , in my opinion  IF oxladechambelain (sp) had continued on a straight line after the ball , then yes second yellow , but he didnt he completely went away from the ball and over gerrard .

No Pen .. No Second Yellow for me


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 17, 2014)

Skrtel is a disgrace - should be sent off every match for his wrestling.  He brings the game into disrepute - why is he not charged with doing so?  

And the fact HW didn't send Skrtel off makes him just as much at fault as all the rest.  Mind you - too many exaggerated gestures from HW and many refs these days - all in the guise of 'giving clarity' which would be OK if they weren't so obviously 'showy'.  And no-one does showy gestures and a bit of preening here and there quite like Mr Webb.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Skrtel is a disgrace - should be sent off every match for his wrestling.  He brings the game into disrepute - why is he not charged with doing so?  

And the fact HW didn't send Skrtel off makes him just as much at fault as all the rest.  Mind you - too many exaggerated gestures from HW and many refs these days - all in the guise of 'giving clarity' which would be OK if they weren't so obviously 'showy'.  And no-one does showy gestures and a bit of preening here and there quite like Mr Webb.
		
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Totally agree about  Skrtel. Surely between the ref & other officials they should be picking up on it.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

cookelad said:



			Problem you have here is that the FA need ref's to be infallible, in the same way a ref can't change his mind based on a players say-so, if the FA decide that Howard Webb has made a mistake they can't pin it on him publicly without damaging his ability to take charge of further premier league games and being questioned on every decision made during games!
		
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 Probably the way Gerrard, Rooney and latterly Terry always had more leeway given by refs, mainly due to their England duties, the FA wont sanction Webb as he is their pick for the world cup.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Skrtel is a disgrace - should be sent off every match for his wrestling.  He brings the game into disrepute - why is he not charged with doing so?  

And the fact HW didn't send Skrtel off makes him just as much at fault as all the rest.  Mind you - too many exaggerated gestures from HW and many refs these days - all in the guise of 'giving clarity' which would be OK if they weren't so obviously 'showy'.  And no-one does showy gestures and a bit of preening here and there quite like Mr Webb.
		
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Someone being called a disgrace for shirt pulling ? Is that really a "disgraceful" action ? Bringing the game into disrepute !!

what utter tosh !

If so then there is a lot of "disgraceful" people in football


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Someone being called a disgrace for shirt pulling ? Is that really a "disgraceful" action ? Bringing the game into disrepute !!

what utter tosh !

If so then there is a lot of "disgraceful" people in football
		
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He wrestles - and you know he does. It is disgraceful behaviour - it is not the end of the world and it is not scandalous - but it is law breaking 100%  It's not disgraceful in itself - it's doing it week in week out that is.

And yes you are correct - many if not all do it but he is so blatant, judging at the moment quite correctly that no ref will dare send him off.  Well someone should call his bluff.  And the very fact that the commentators and pundits are forever highlighting him doing it - and he - always he - yes you may feel he is being picked upon - but tough - he brings players into disrepute by doing it and having it highlighted week in week out.  If he doesn't want to be picked upon then he should stop.

btw - Liverpool are my EPL team.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			Probably the way Gerrard, Rooney and latterly Terry always had more leeway given by refs, mainly due to their England duties, the FA wont sanction Webb as he is their pick for the world cup.
		
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Bryan Robson & Shearer got away with murder aswell.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

I thought I'd post this link I was sent earlier by a mate that knows my feelings on Suarez.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFPmt5FHanc

I like Liverpool but I really hate Suarez. I know hate is a strong word but I think he is a good footballer but a truly despicable human being. The thing I most noticed about the video was that on several occasions he made a shocking challenge that could have caused serious injury and then went down as if he'd been on the receiving end.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Someone being called a disgrace for shirt pulling ? Is that really a "disgraceful" action ? Bringing the game into disrepute !!

what utter tosh !

If so then there is a lot of "disgraceful" people in football
		
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Lots of players do it I agree,but come on Phil surely you've got to admit that Skrtel is by far the worst offender. How many penalties have been awarded against him for it? 
If refs started giving penalties for it(not just against Skrtel) then it would stop.
No consistency with Refs.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Lots of players do it I agree,but come on Phil surely you've got to admit that Skrtel is by far the worst offender. How many penalties have been awarded against him for it? 
If refs started giving penalties for it(not just against Skrtel) then it would stop.
No consistency with Refs.
		
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I agree that Skrtel is awful at contact with oppo players and he will be punished if he doesnt stop ( gives away a penalty etc )

But the issue i have is calling him a "disgrace" and "bringing the game into disrepute" etc - utter ridiculous comments


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I agree that Skrtel is awful at contact with oppo players and he will be punished if he doesnt stop ( gives away a penalty etc )

But the issue i have is calling him a "disgrace" and "bringing the game into disrepute" etc - utter ridiculous comments
		
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Yeah fair enough. If the refs don't do anything about it then obviously he'll carry on.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Lots of players do it I agree,but come on Phil surely you've got to admit that Skrtel is by far the worst offender. How many penalties have been awarded against him for it? 
If refs started giving penalties for it(not just against Skrtel) then it would stop.
No consistency with Refs.
		
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As was suggested when Skrtel did the neat back flick on his 6yd box that presented Fulham with a tap in - Skrtel's problem was that he was so busy looking for a Fulham player to manhandle he ended up with his back to the player crossing the ball.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			I thought I'd post this link I was sent earlier by a mate that knows my feelings on Suarez.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFPmt5FHanc

I like Liverpool but I really hate Suarez. I know hate is a strong word but I think he is a good footballer but a truly despicable human being. The thing I most noticed about the video was that on several occasions he made a shocking challenge that could have caused serious injury and then went down as if he'd been on the receiving end.
		
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He does seem to have sorted him self out since the Ivanovic incident tho Tbf. 
PS I'm not a Suarez fan.


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## bladeplayer (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			I thought I'd post this link I was sent earlier by a mate that knows my feelings on Suarez.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFPmt5FHanc

*I like Liverpool but I really hate Suarez. I know hate is a strong word but I think he is a good footballer but a truly despicable human being.* The thing I most noticed about the video was that on several occasions he made a shocking challenge that could have caused serious injury and then went down as if he'd been on the receiving end.
		
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Just curious .. Do you really know him well enough or even enough about him to say that tho ? what do you know of him apart from football ?


Ive really gotta stop defending this red lot in public


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			He does seem to have sorted him self out since the Ivanovic incident tho Tbf. 
PS I'm not a Suarez fan.
		
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would also like for anyone to prove "intent" 

You could make many compilation videos for lots of players. You could also see one of Suarez being smashed regulary

Suarez is feisty little fecker that at times has gone too far and has been punished for it.

Suarez as a "human being" shouldnt be judged unless people have personally met him - only have to watch the Liverpool show to see that he is a quiet person off the field and hasnt had one single issue off the field


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			Just curious .. Do you really know him well enough or even enough about him to say that tho ? what do you know of him apart from football ?


Ive really gotta stop defending this red lot in public 

Click to expand...

I don't need to know more about him than what he does on a football pitch to be able to judge him. In my view anyone that has twice been banned for biting an opponent, has been shown to dive to try to cheat the ref and opposition and puts in some of the tackles that could end a fellow players' career can be classed as a despicable human being. I don't care if he helps old ladies cross the road or rescues kittens stuck in trees, it doesn't negate the other stuff he does.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			would also like for anyone to prove "intent"
		
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Think it's fairly easy to prove intent on the two occasions he bit an opponent. He may be orthodontically enhanced but it's very difficult even with teeth that size to bite someone without meaning to.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			I don't need to know more about him than what he does on a football pitch to be able to judge him. In my view anyone that has twice been banned for biting an opponent, has been shown to dive to try to cheat the ref and opposition and puts in some of the tackles that could end a fellow players' career can be classed as a despicable human being. I don't care if he helps old ladies cross the road or rescues kittens stuck in trees, it doesn't negate the other stuff he does.
		
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Seriously mate you have no idea what you've started here!
Hope you're comfortable as it could be a LOOOOOOOONG night.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Seriously mate you have no idea what you've started here!
Hope you're comfortable as it could be a LOOOOOOOONG night.
		
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No problem, I'm all sorted and ready to sit back and enjoy.........


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			I don't need to know more about him than what he does on a football pitch to be able to judge him. In my view anyone that has twice been banned for biting an opponent, has been shown to dive to try to cheat the ref and opposition and puts in some of the tackles that could end a fellow players' career can be classed as a despicable human being. I don't care if he helps old ladies cross the road or rescues kittens stuck in trees, it doesn't negate the other stuff he does.
		
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Their is a clear difference between how people act on the football pitch to how people act off the field to judge their character as a human being

You can judge people as "footballers" from what you see - but you have no idea how he is off the field to judge him as a human being 

Clear difference

Giggs is a perfect example - as a footballer - white as white - as a person of the field who sleeps with his brothers wife etc ?


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			Think it's fairly easy to prove intent on the two occasions he bit an opponent. He may be orthodontically enhanced but it's very difficult even with teeth that size to bite someone without meaning to.
		
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Yes he did bite someone and was rightly punished by the authorities for the incidents. Do you want to keep punishing him every single day ?


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			No problem, I'm all sorted and ready to sit back and enjoy.........

View attachment 9162

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Pahahaha he will drain the life out of you,he just never gets bored/tired.
No offence Phil:thup:


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## Stuart_C (Feb 17, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			As was suggested when Skrtel did the neat back flick on his 6yd box that presented Fulham with a tap in - Skrtel's problem was that he was so busy looking for a Fulham player to manhandle he ended up with his back to the player crossing the ball.
		
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I think the 2nd goal that you're referring to was the direct result of the goalkeeper hogging his line and being too scared to come for the cross. Keeper comes and catches that no goal scored.

Back OT, Webb didn't give the pen so it doesn't really matter now. 

Liverpool Should've had that game wrapped up before that incident anyway.


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Their is a clear difference between how people act on the football pitch to how people act off the field to judge their character as a human being

You can judge people as "footballers" from what you see - but you have no idea how he is off the field to judge him as a human being 

Clear difference

Giggs is a perfect example - as a footballer - white as white - as a person of the field who sleeps with his brothers wife etc ?
		
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But does Giggs's personal life really have anything to do with us?


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			But does Giggs's personal life really have anything to do with us?
		
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It doesnt but its used to judge people away from the football field and what sort of person they are

How people act on a football pitch shouldnt be used to judge how they are as people only how they are as footballers(sportsmen)


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

So Giggs is whiter than white on the pitch,but a dirty cheat off the pitch. & Suarez is the opposite
Only winding you up phil


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			So Giggs is whiter than white on the pitch,but a dirty cheat off the pitch. & Suarez is the opposite
Only winding you up phil

Click to expand...


And John Terry has it sorted both on and off the pitch


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			And John Terry has it sorted both on and off the pitch 

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And Joey Barton?


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			And John Terry has it sorted both on and off the pitch 

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That's because he's a Pro


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Their is a clear difference between how people act on the football pitch to how people act off the field to judge their character as a human being

You can judge people as "footballers" from what you see - but you have no idea how he is off the field to judge him as a human being 

Clear difference

Giggs is a perfect example - as a footballer - white as white - as a person of the field who sleeps with his brothers wife etc ?
		
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Are you suggesting that I shouldn't be judging Suarez as a person based on the fact that on a football pitch he's been banned for racially abusing an opponent and biting an opponent (twice) and has also been shown to be a cheat (diving and feigning injury) and has put in some potentially career threatening challenges on opponents?

EDIT - Apologies meant to quote this one of your's "How people act on a football pitch shouldnt be used to judge how they are as people only how they are as footballers(sportsmen)"


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

I checked the paper today and Liverpool still lost 2-1 and its was a pen not given , as for Ryan Giggs , well his brother`s wife should have known better , men are men ok , if its on a plate most of us will have it , she is married to his brother and she should have respected that otherwise why get married . As for the diver, and whatever else he does , that's him ok , that's the way he is , when you are in public life your every move is there for everyone to see , every one can be super nice in public , but is that really them , there is a guy on HDIDO forum who everyone who knows him says he is a really nice guy and do anything for you , yet this same guy gets behind a keyboard and is then like a troll posting bile , so which is the real him , I say the troll because if he was a decent person he would not change when he is on a keyboard .......................it was a penalty and Webb should have given it , so why the double flip and roll that would get a score of 10 ,10,10 from the judges and sterling & stevie G should have seen Red and Arsenal should have had a few penalties too , look at the pen they did get , LS did not do his back flip and roll , mind he did drop to his knees like a lorry had hit him , I recalled him doing this once before and got a yellow ...............Results stands and the whole thing gave us something to debate ...........


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## Pin-seeker (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			I checked the paper today and Liverpool still lost 2-1 and its was a pen not given , as for Ryan Giggs , well his brother`s wife should have known better , men are men ok , if its on a plate most of us will have it , she is married to his brother and she should have respected that otherwise why get married . As for the diver, and whatever else he does , that's him ok , that's the way he is , when you are in public life your every move is there for everyone to see , every one can be super nice in public , but is that really them , there is a guy on HDIDO forum who everyone who knows him says he is a really nice guy and do anything for you , yet this same guy gets behind a keyboard and is then like a troll posting bile , so which is the real him , I say the troll because if he was a decent person he would not change when he is on a keyboard .......................it was a penalty and Webb should have given it , so why the double flip and roll that would get a score of 10 ,10,10 from the judges and sterling & stevie G should have seen Red and Arsenal should have had a few penalties too , look at the pen they did get , LS did not do his back flip and roll , mind he did drop to his knees like a lorry had hit him , I recalled him doing this once before and got a yellow ...............Results stands and the whole thing gave us something to debate ...........
		
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Natasha Giggs is quite tasty tho


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			Are you suggesting that I shouldn't be judging Suarez as a person based on the fact that on a football pitch he's been banned for racially abusing an opponent and biting an opponent (twice) and has also been shown to be a cheat (diving and feigning injury) and has put in some potentially career threatening challenges on opponents?

EDIT - Apologies meant to quote this one of your's "How people act on a football pitch shouldnt be used to judge how they are as people only how they are as footballers(sportsmen)"

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Yes - judge him as a footballer as opposed to a human being - many people are known to be different characters on and off the field 

Suarez is reputed to be a very quiet shy humble person off the pitch who does a lot for charity especially homeless children in his home country. As a footballer he has done things that are wrong and been punished for those - he isn't the perfect person on the pitch and has at times gone beyond what is acceptable

Stuff happens on a sports pitch - it's dealt with by the sports authorities and it should be left within the sporting arena.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			I checked the paper today and Liverpool still lost 2-1 and its was a pen not given , as for Ryan Giggs , well his brother`s wife should have known better , men are men ok , if its on a plate most of us will have it , she is married to his brother and she should have respected that otherwise why get married . As for the diver, and whatever else he does , that's him ok , that's the way he is , when you are in public life your every move is there for everyone to see , every one can be super nice in public , but is that really them , there is a guy on HDIDO forum who everyone who knows him says he is a really nice guy and do anything for you , yet this same guy gets behind a keyboard and is then like a troll posting bile , so which is the real him , I say the troll because if he was a decent person he would not change when he is on a keyboard .......................it was a penalty and Webb should have given it , so why the double flip and roll that would get a score of 10 ,10,10 from the judges and sterling & stevie G should have seen Red and Arsenal should have had a few penalties too , look at the pen they did get , LS did not do his back flip and roll , mind he did drop to his knees like a lorry had hit him , I recalled him doing this once before and got a yellow ...............Results stands and the whole thing gave us something to debate ...........
		
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 I'm guessing there is a point hidden in that incoherent blob of words ?


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## fundy (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yes - judge him as a footballer as opposed to a human being - many people are known to be different characters on and off the field 

Suarez is reputed to be a very quiet shy humble person off the pitch who does a lot for charity especially homeless children in his home country. As a footballer he has done things that are wrong and been punished for those - he isn't the perfect person on the pitch and has at times gone beyond what is acceptable

*Stuff happens on a sports pitch - it's dealt with by the sports authorities and it should be left within the sporting arena*.
		
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Within reason I agree but when assessing a footballers character, biting opponents (yes thats plural) and racism on the pitch are very validly considered when considering a footballers character, and doing work for charity doesnt negate them imo


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

fundy said:



			Within reason I agree but when assessing a footballers character, biting opponents (yes thats plural) and racism on the pitch are very validly considered when considering a footballers character, and doing work for charity doesnt negate them imo
		
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Again it's on the football pitch ( not saying it's right )

If he was biting people and abusing them away from the pitch then yes it's going to reflect on him as a whole 

Not excusing his behaviour but people do act different on a sporting field than they do away from the sporting arena - characters differ.


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Their is a clear difference between how people act on the football pitch to how people act off the field to judge their character as a human being

You can judge people as "footballers" from what you see - but you have no idea how he is off the field to judge him as a human being 

Clear difference

Giggs is a perfect example - as a footballer - white as white - as a person of the field who sleeps with his brothers wife etc ?
		
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So on that basis you presumably have no issue with someone who behaves like a perfect gentleman at home and at work but cheats to win the club championship?  After all it's only on the sports field, so it's no basis on which to judge anyone.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Blue in Munich said:



			So on that basis you presumably have no issue with someone who behaves like a perfect gentleman at home and at work but cheats to win the club championship?  After all it's only on the sports field, so it's no basis on which to judge anyone.
		
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When did I say I had "no issue"

I would call him a cheat in golf - zero relevance to what he does at home


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## fundy (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Again it's on the football pitch ( not saying it's right )

If he was biting people and abusing them away from the pitch then yes it's going to reflect on him as a whole 

Not excusing his behaviour but people do act different on a sporting field than they do away from the sporting arena - characters differ.
		
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They do but there is still a line and I personally am not happy to explain away everything as "on the sports field" when it has clearly crossed the line and is part of the persons character imo, and in Suarez case he has crossed that line


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## Blue in Munich (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			When did I say I had "no issue"

I would call him a cheat in golf - zero relevance to what he does at home
		
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So integrity is negotiable then?  Sorry not in my book, goodnight.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Blue in Munich said:



			So integrity is negotiable then?  Sorry not in my book, goodnight.
		
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When did i say integrity is negotiable ?


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

fundy said:



			They do but there is still a line and I personally am not happy to explain away everything as "on the sports field" when it has clearly crossed the line and is part of the persons character imo, and in Suarez case he has crossed that line
		
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Can you point to any issues you have ever heard about from Suarez away from the football pitch ?


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## fundy (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Can you point to any issues you have ever heard about from Suarez away from the football pitch ?
		
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Why?

I dont need to, he has committed acts on the football pitch, that are part of his overall character, that are enough for me to make at least a partial assessment of him. You can't completely separate the 2, yes there are certain things that fall into the category of staying on the pitch but you cant blanket everything that happens on the football field as not part of his overall character, or at least I cant (for the record ive heard almost nothing about him off the field, i dont really care too much for what sports stars are doing when not playing)


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## freddielong (Feb 17, 2014)

I know Liverpool want to blame Howard Webb but the reason IMHO they were not given the penalty is a lot closer to home Suarez, it is a modern day adaptation of the boy who cried wolf. I think because its Suarez there is automatically doubt then he launches into some bizarre re enactment  of Michael Thomas's Goal celebration from 1989.

And if Webb hates Liverpool so much why didn't he send Gerrard and Sterling Off he would have been well with in the law to


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## fundy (Feb 17, 2014)

freddielong said:



View attachment 9182



I know Liverpool want to blame Howard Webb but the reason IMHO they were not given the penalty is a lot closer to home Suarez, it is a modern day adaptation of the boy who cried wolf. I think because its Suarez there is automatically doubt then he launches into some bizarre re enactment  of Michael Thomas's Goal celebration from 1989.
		
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oh Freddie, one of the great nights  Who puts the ball in the scousers net........


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## freddielong (Feb 17, 2014)

Micky T and Smudger


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## Stuart_C (Feb 17, 2014)

This thread has run its course now those links have been put up


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## BTatHome (Feb 17, 2014)

Whats strange is that Webb has already made his decision before that acrobatics, you can already see his finger wagging to say no.


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## freddielong (Feb 17, 2014)

Nights like that are why we watch football like Liverpool Milan or Man Utd Bayern munich


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## freddielong (Feb 17, 2014)

because its Suarez he has Doubts


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

fundy said:



			Why?

I dont need to, he has committed acts on the football pitch, that are part of his overall character, that are enough for me to make at least a partial assessment of him. You can't completely separate the 2, yes there are certain things that fall into the category of staying on the pitch but you cant blanket everything that happens on the football field as not part of his overall character, or at least I cant (for the record ive heard almost nothing about him off the field, i dont really care too much for what sports stars are doing when not playing)
		
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Well i separate the two - believe sportsman can display two types of characters and we can judge them as sportsmen and how they act on the field but privately away from the field and as human beings I don't believe we can. I know Suarez is not a nice person on the pitch - he has done some disgraceful things and as a footballer he has gone beyond what is acceptable and been rightly punished - there is no excuse for some of the things he has done.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

freddielong said:



			because its Suarez he has Doubts
		
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And that's wrong - every challenge should be judged on it's own merit regardless of what has happened 

Webb missed a clear penalty in front of him - regardless of what has happened before. 

Webb should be penalised for his glaring mistake - just like everyone else is penalised when they make mistakes


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

fundy said:



			oh Freddie, one of the great nights  Who puts the ball in the scousers net........
		
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Broke my heart that night 

Was the most emotional season in my life - full of heartache. We did amazing just to get it down to that final match.

Drama that couldn't be written


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Well i separate the two - believe sportsman can display two types of characters and we can judge them as sportsmen and how they act on the field but privately away from the field and as human beings I don't believe we can. I know Suarez is not a nice person on the pitch - he has done some disgraceful things and as a footballer he has gone beyond what is acceptable and been rightly punished - there is no excuse for some of the things he has done.
		
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But where do you draw the line on what someone can do on a sports pitch before you start judging them as a person? What if it was proved beyond any doubt that a footballer deliberately went in over the ball with the intention to break an opponents leg and end their career? Or if a cricketer deliberately threw a ball to hit a batsman causing him injury? Or if a baseball player attacked another player with a baseball bat and left them in intensive care? Can you really write those off just because they happened on a sports pitch?


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## freddielong (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			And that's wrong - every challenge should be judged on it's own merit regardless of what has happened 

Webb missed a clear penalty in front of him - regardless of what has happened before. 

Webb should be penalised for his glaring mistake - just like everyone else is penalised when they make mistakes
		
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I don't agree if some one usually dives you have to be aware of that and it has to be part of the decision that you make for me if that happens to any other player on the pitch Howard Webb doesn't even think about it - IMO Suarez's past cheating cost Liverpool the chance of an  equaliser


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			But where do you draw the line on what someone can do on a sports pitch before you start judging them as a person? What if it was proved beyond any doubt that a footballer deliberately went in over the ball with the intention to break an opponents leg and end their career? Or if a cricketer deliberately threw a ball to hit a batsman causing him injury? Or if a baseball player attacked another player with a baseball bat and left them in intensive care? Can you really write those off just because they happened on a sports pitch?
		
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Who is "writing them off" ? 

When people start getting hurt badly and deliberately then yes you are starting to draw a line - that's when police etc get involved.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

freddielong said:



			I don't agree if some one usually dives you have to be aware of that and it has to be part of the decision that you make for me if that happens to any other player on the pitch Howard Webb doesn't even think about it - IMO Suarez's past cheating cost Liverpool the chance of an  equaliser
		
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Wrong IMO - you judge each challenge on merit not reputation. Judge on reputation then lots of player will never get a decision and that makes the situation worse.

Webb incompetence cost us the chance to gain a goal - simple as that.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Who is "writing them off" ? 

When people start getting hurt badly and deliberately then yes you are starting to draw a line - that's when police etc get involved.
		
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You're writing them off by saying that Suarez shouldn't be judged as a person by how he behaves on the pitch.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

freddielong said:



			I don't agree if some one usually dives you have to be aware of that and it has to be part of the decision that you make for me if that happens to any other player on the pitch Howard Webb doesn't even think about it - IMO Suarez's past cheating cost Liverpool the chance of an  equaliser
		
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A bit like Ashley Young for Man Utd not getting decisions presumably based on his reputation as a diver.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			You're writing them off by saying that Suarez shouldn't be judged as a person by how he behaves on the pitch.
		
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That's not writing them off - that's understanding that people can have two different characters - one when they are playing and one when they are with their family or living their normal life

Suarez has made mistakes on a football field - he has been punished for those mistakes and now he moves on.

Every time a thread about football appears he is becomes a target for on here regardless of what the thread is about - in this case Suarez is actually the victim of a shockingly poor ref decision - yet somehow it ends up being his fault - it's getting tiresome now and it's the same old story every time. 

Yes he has fecked up in the past but is it not time to move on now and get passed the "disgraceful human being" etc comments


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## fundy (Feb 17, 2014)

Phil

do you think his reaction to the foul is right? (and i deliberately say foul not tackle as it clearly was)


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## Imurg (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Webb should be penalised for his glaring mistake - just like everyone else is penalised when they make mistakes
		
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So is the next striker who misses a penalty or an open goal going to get penalised?


People make mistakes. They always have and they always will.
It's not the Referee's fault that so much money is at stake in the game yet they get the most abuse when they get something wrong, with many a cry of "that cost us 3 points" or whatever...
The Ref makes a decision
Agree or disagree - move on. Get on with it. It was a mistake. Nobody died.

Years ago, while playing Cricket, a batsman hit the ball straight back to me( the bowler). The appeal went up, the Umpire didn't give it, saying he hit the ball into the ground ( he didn't). While everyone else started complaining I was on my way back to my mark to bowl the next ball.....

The sooner Football understands that mistakes are ALWAYS going to be made and stops bleating about it the better.


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I'm guessing there is a point hidden in that incoherent blob of words ?
		
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Yes and you can`t  see it sadly so you are trying to be clever ....................  Liverpool lost , get over it and move on , a lot of you Liverpool fans thought after winning 5-1 the week before that all you had to do was turn up , to be fair so did I but life is not that way , you had all the breaks the week before .........................EYG


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

fundy said:



			Phil

do you think his reaction to the foul is right? (and i deliberately say foul not tackle as it clearly was)
		
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No it's not right - any over reaction is wrong


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Imurg said:



			So is the next striker who misses a penalty or an open goal going to get penalised?


People make mistakes. They always have and they always will.
It's not the Referee's fault that so much money is at stake in the game yet they get the most abuse when they get something wrong, with many a cry of "that cost us 3 points" or whatever...
The Ref makes a decision
Agree or disagree - move on. Get on with it. It was a mistake. Nobody died.

Years ago, while playing Cricket, a batsman hit the ball straight back to me( the bowler). The appeal went up, the Umpire didn't give it, saying he hit the ball into the ground ( he didn't). While everyone else started complaining I was on my way back to my mark to bowl the next ball.....

The sooner Football understands that mistakes are ALWAYS going to be made and stops bleating about it the better.
		
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If players make mistakes they get dropped , if managers make mistakes they get fired , if clubs make mistakes they get relegated or lose trophies - in football or any sport a mistake is punished in some way 

Football refs get relegated or rested when they make mistakes that cost teams 

Webb made a mistake that potentially costs a great deal to a team - a trophy , a route into a Europe etc - there is a price to pay for that mistake 

Yes it's not life or death etc but that doesn't mean that mistakes can be ignored


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			Yes and you can`t  see it sadly so you are trying to be clever ....................  Liverpool lost , get over it and move on , a lot of you Liverpool fans thought after winning 5-1 the week before that all you had to do was turn up , to be fair so did I but life is not that way , you had all the breaks the week before .........................EYG
		
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The point of the thread is clearly missed by you - oh well


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## Imurg (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			people can have two different characters - one when they are playing and one when they are with their family or living their normal life
		
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No, that's 2 facets of the same Character. Unless you've been medically diagnosed otherwise you have one Character.


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## Imurg (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			If players make mistakes they get dropped , if managers make mistakes they get fired , if clubs make mistakes they get relegated or lose trophies - in football or any sport a mistake is punished in some way 

Football refs get relegated or rested when they make mistakes that cost teams 

Webb made a mistake that potentially costs a great deal to a team - a trophy , a route into a Europe etc - there is a price to pay for that mistake 

Yes it's not life or death etc but that doesn't mean that mistakes can be ignored
		
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Let's hope that all PL Refs don't make mistakes this weekend that mean they get "rested" coz there won't be any games the weekend after as there won't be any Refs to Ref them....


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

Imurg said:



			Let's hope that all PL Refs don't make mistakes this weekend that mean they get "rested" coz there won't be any games the weekend after as there won't be any Refs to Ref them....
		
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Plenty of refs to promote or use thankfully :thup:


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The point of the thread is clearly missed by you - oh well
		
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No I have not , you have , Liverpool fans moaning about the ref , not fit to ref and the rest , I say this to you,  that had it been any other Liverpool player it would have been given and it still has to be taken and scored , because it was LS,  it was a factor in why in was not given , LS on the pitch is LS off it , his make up in life is to win at any cost and he has proved it many times


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			No I have not , you have , Liverpool fans moaning about the ref , not fit to ref and the rest , I say this to you,  that had it been any other Liverpool player it would have been given and it still has to be taken and scored , because it was LS,  it was a factor in why in was not given , *LS on the pitch is LS off it *, his make up in life is to win at any cost and he has proved it many times
		
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How do you know ? Have you met him off the pitch away from football ?

And if Webb did judge the incident based on who it was then he deserves to be rested or demoted because he has failed to do his job correctly


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			How do you know ? Have you met him off the pitch away from football ?

And if Webb did judge the incident based on who it was then he deserves to be rested or demoted because he has failed to do his job correctly
		
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Why should Webb be any different to the rest of us just because he's a referee? If I played golf against someone that cheated then that would definitely be on my mind if I had to play against him again. Or if I did some work for someone that refused to pay then the next time I would want money up front. If you've been cheated before then it is obviously going to be on your mind or at the very least in your subconscious when it comes up again. He wouldn't be human if he didn't and Suarez is finally reaping what he has sown for all his antics over the last few seasons. It was a blatant foul but maybe in the back of Webb's mind he knew that Suarez had conned him before and he didn't want to get conned again.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			Why should Webb be any different to the rest of us just because he's a referee? If I played golf against someone that cheated then that would definitely be on my mind if I had to play against him again. Or if I did some work for someone that refused to pay then the next time I would want money up front. If you've been cheated before then it is obviously going to be on your mind or at the very least in your subconscious when it comes up again. He wouldn't be human if he didn't and Suarez is finally reaping what he has sown for all his antics over the last few seasons. It was a blatant foul but maybe in the back of Webb's mind he knew that Suarez had conned him before and he didn't want to get conned again.
		
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When did Suarez con Webb before ? 

You ref a game based on what is actually happening and not based on any reputation 

Each tackle is judge on merit regardless of the player. 

If a ref can't do that then he needs to do a different job


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			Why should Webb be any different to the rest of us just because he's a referee? If I played golf against someone that cheated then that would definitely be on my mind if I had to play against him again. Or if I did some work for someone that refused to pay then the next time I would want money up front. If you've been cheated before then it is obviously going to be on your mind or at the very least in your subconscious when it comes up again. He wouldn't be human if he didn't and Suarez is finally reaping what he has sown for all his antics over the last few seasons. It was a blatant foul but maybe in the back of Webb's mind he knew that Suarez had conned him before and he didn't want to get conned again.
		
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Well said , totally agree with you


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			How do you know ? Have you met him off the pitch away from football ?

And if Webb did judge the incident based on who it was then he deserves to be rested or demoted because he has failed to do his job correctly
		
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I can ask you the same , Have you met him and know him well and don't be clever and say you have because then you should know better ok ,  are you just having a wind up  and as for judging an incident or a person you have to look at everything and in this case he had to do it in an instance and as it was LS and his long list of incidents it was not hard , it may not have been a right one but like I said , anyone else and it would have been given


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			When did Suarez con Webb before ? 

You ref a game based on what is actually happening and not based on any reputation 

Each tackle is judge on merit regardless of the player. 

If a ref can't do that then he needs to do a different job
		
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He may not have conned Webb directly, in fact I think it was Webb that didn't give Suarez a penalty in the Chelsea game earlier in the season, but he has definitely conned other refs. If you saw a colleague get conned by someone would you change your opinion of them if you had to do business with them? It's not just Suarez though, Young gets the same because of his reputation. If Suarez/Young didn't dive in the past then it wouldn't be in refs minds now and they might get more decisions now. And I'll repeat, they are reaping what they have sown. Both of them have reputations for very good reasons and that has to affect the way they are treated.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			I can ask you the same , Have you met him and know him well and don't be clever and say you have because then you should know better ok ,  are you just having a wind up  and as for judging an incident or a person you have to look at everything and in this case he had to do it in an instance and as it was LS and his long list of incidents it was not hard , it may not have been a right one but like I said , anyone else and it would have been given
		
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No I don't know him well - hence why I'm not judging him and saying he is the same off the field as he is on it - I'll judge him on the football field. 

No you don't have to look at everything - you judge the each incident on it's own merit - nothing else should come into it.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			No you don't have to look at everything - you judge the each incident on it's own merit - nothing else should come into it.
		
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And part of the incident is the players involved and if one of them has a reputation for diving without contact then that is part of the incident you are viewing.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			He may not have conned Webb directly, in fact I think it was Webb that didn't give Suarez a penalty in the Chelsea game earlier in the season, but he has definitely conned other refs. If you saw a colleague get conned by someone would you change your opinion of them if you had to do business with them? It's not just Suarez though, Young gets the same because of his reputation. If Suarez/Young didn't dive in the past then it wouldn't be in refs minds now and they might get more decisions now. And I'll repeat, they are reaping what they have sown. Both of them have reputations for very good reasons and that has to affect the way they are treated.
		
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Young still gets plenty of decisions go his way - just as other players like Robben , Drogba , Bale , Ronaldo , di Maria etc still get decisions go their way 

There is no excuse for what Webb did regardless of who the player is. It appears that because it's Suarez it's ok to not give him correct decisions. 

Suarez hasn't coned Webb before and Suarez has had many decisions not go his way - in fact I reckon he has more not go his way than go his way. He gets clattered from pillar to post and regularly doesn't get anything from refs.

I'm sure you can point out the blatant dives from Suarez in the last 12 months - in fact you can tell me when he last got a penalty when he dived.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			And part of the incident is the players involved and if one of them has a reputation for diving without contact then that is part of the incident you are viewing.
		
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Wrong - the incident is the act that is being committed - a clean tackle or a foul - it's a clear foul and every single pundit has said the same thing and said it's unexplainable that he didn't give the penalty.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Wrong - the incident is the act that is being committed - a clean tackle or a foul - it's a clear foul and every single pundit has said the same thing and said it's unexplainable that he didn't give the penalty.
		
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Total cobblers Phil. Without the people involved there will be no act and therefore it has to be considered. A player with a reputation for going down easily/diving/trying to win penalties will be judged due to this. Rightly or wrongly it will be considered. 

And I agree with the pundits in this case and have stated that it was a blatant foul and should have been a penalty. I don't think anyone on here has said that it wasn't a foul.


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## richart (Feb 17, 2014)

freddielong said:



View attachment 9182

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BTatHome said:



			Whats strange is that Webb has already made his decision before that acrobatics, you can already see his finger wagging to say no.
		
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I think you will find that Webb is giving his mark of one for artistic impression.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			Total cobblers Phil. Without the people involved there will be no act and therefore it has to be considered. A player with a reputation for going down easily/diving/trying to win penalties will be judged due to this. Rightly or wrongly it will be considered. 

And I agree with the pundits in this case and have stated that it was a blatant foul and should have been a penalty. I don't think anyone on here has said that it wasn't a foul.
		
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It's wrong to judge fouls on reputation - if they do then they are not doing their job correctly simple as that

People are making excuses for Webb because of who the player is - simple as that.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			It's wrong to judge fouls on reputation - if they do then they are not doing their job correctly simple as that

People are making excuses for Webb because of who the player is - simple as that.
		
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Maybe it's because Webb wasn't standing in the HNSP for judging fouls in the penalty area.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			Yes and you can`t  see it sadly so you are trying to be clever ....................  Liverpool lost , get over it and move on , a lot of you Liverpool fans thought after winning 5-1 the week before that all you had to do was turn up , to be fair so did I but life is not that way , you had all the breaks the week before .........................EYG
		
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What breaks did we have the week before - refereeing decisions? Dont think so, Liverpool schooled Arsenal last week, no dodgy decisions and blew them away in 19 minutes.

You are either the most Biased arsenal fan ever, the most bitterest anti-LFC fan, or you just speak cobblers to PHD level. Do you support Arsenal?

Just for the record - Skrtel is by far and away the worst at shirt pulling, and I hate seeing it. Skrtel isn't "disgraceful", but the fact that refs allow it is. The only reasons the refs dont punish him (and others) is because they must have been told to turn a blind eye to it. Understandable that they then do it as a matter of course. The thing is skrtel is good in the air - just bloody outjump your opponent instead!

Suarez - I understand the "cry wolf" reason given, as I would also expect the same when I see Ashley Young do the same (Bale last year,also) and I can also understand if 50/50 and even 60/40 decisions go against him (them), due to his reputation. However, when a penalty is as blatant as yesterdays second one, there is no excuse.


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			What breaks did we have the week before - refereeing decisions? Dont think so, Liverpool schooled Arsenal last week, no dodgy decisions and blew them away in 19 minutes.

You are either the most Biased arsenal fan ever, the most bitterest anti-LFC fan, or you just speak cobblers to PHD level. Do you support Arsenal?

Just for the record - Skrtel is by far and away the worst at shirt pulling, and I hate seeing it. Skrtel isn't "disgraceful", but the fact that refs allow it is. The only reasons the refs dont punish him (and others) is because they must have been told to turn a blind eye to it. Understandable that they then do it as a matter of course. The thing is skrtel is good in the air - just bloody outjump your opponent instead!

Suarez - I understand the "cry wolf" reason given, as I would also expect the same when I see Ashley Young do the same (Bale last year,also) and I can also understand if 50/50 and even 60/40 decisions go against him (them), due to his reputation. However, when a penalty is as blatant as yesterdays second one, there is no excuse.
		
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1st goal was offside last week  and yes it was a pen , not given because of the fish out of water antics of a known diver , no excuse for not giving the pen but the pundits have also said because it was LS and his fish out of water antics it when against him this time and will do again


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Young still gets plenty of decisions go his way - just as other players like Robben , Drogba , Bale , Ronaldo , di Maria etc still get decisions go their way 

There is no excuse for what Webb did regardless of who the player is. It appears that because it's Suarez it's ok to not give him correct decisions. 

Suarez hasn't coned Webb before and Suarez has had many decisions not go his way - in fact I reckon he has more not go his way than go his way. He gets clattered from pillar to post and regularly doesn't get anything from refs.

I'm sure you can point out the blatant dives from Suarez in the last 12 months - in fact you can tell me when he last got a penalty when he dived.
		
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LS should be on Rogue traders with all the other conman , those on there have been judged too because of what they have done in the past and will NEVER be trusted by anyone who knows about them again .


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			LS should be on Rogue traders with all the other conman , those on there have been judged too because of what they have done in the past and will NEVER be trusted by anyone who knows about them again .
		
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Who exactly do you support ?


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## JCW (Feb 17, 2014)

QUOTE=Liverpoolphil;1003173]Who exactly do you support ?[/QUOTE]

That has nothing to do with this thread to quote you , nobody says it was not a penalty , Howard Webb made one wrong call , does not make him a bad ref , photos of him in an Arsenal kit and all the other stuff is not either , LS being a known conman is and the fact that he just got a penalty is as well , sorry but that's how it is ............................:sbox:


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 17, 2014)

If you think Webb has made just one bad call then you must watch a different sport and the convo has ended


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## harpo_72 (Feb 18, 2014)

Its so easy to ref from one's armchair ....
the game doesn't allow time for in depth analysis of the offence, if it did LS would probably not complete a game as simulation would be red carded as well. Also the stars are the players and the money they draw affects decisions of refs with pressure from the team owners. Until this all changes and a rugby style of refereeing introduced will the game be cleaned up. The World Cup is going to be its usual rubbish with the Germans dishing it out and rolling around like they have been shot etc...


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## Fish (Feb 18, 2014)

I haven't read all the posts but for me the refs now need to be made full-time and totally accountable. They shouldn't have other interests that dominate their lives like Webb has, these are clear distractions and as stated in this piece, his focus on the job in hand is then affected.

An interesting stat; Liverpool have won just six of the last 22 games refereed by Howard Webb 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-available-for-4000-on-comedians-website.html


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## Hobbit (Feb 18, 2014)

Irrespective of what Webb may or may not have missed in last weekend's game, I don't think he's anywhere near as good as he was through '08/'09/10. In the run up to the 2010 World Cup finals he was easily in the top 3 in the world. I wouldn't put him in the top 3 in the EPL, let alone the world!


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			I haven't read all the posts but for me the refs now need to be made full-time and totally accountable. They shouldn't have other interests that dominate their lives like Webb has, these are clear distractions and as stated in this piece, his focus on the job in hand is then affected.

An interesting stat; Liverpool have won just six of the last 22 games refereed by Howard Webb  

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-available-for-4000-on-comedians-website.html

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    An objective point of view, by a rival - well done Fish :thup:- you'll be getting booted off here with an attitude like that.      Who JCW supports is a big secret, BTW.


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## Fish (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			An objective point of view, by a rival - well done Fish :thup:- you'll be getting booted off here with an attitude like that.      Who JCW supports is a big secret, BTW.
		
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No its not, he's a Gooner :smirk:


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## Fish (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			An objective point of view, by a rival - well done Fish :thup:- you'll be getting booted off here with an attitude like that.      Who JCW supports is a big secret, BTW.
		
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100% a foul so a penalty, but, it didn't make his body do this which is why it creates doubt, I think his feet are perfectly together and gets 10/10


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## MegaSteve (Feb 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			I haven't read all the posts but for me the refs now need to be made full-time and totally accountable. They shouldn't have other interests that dominate their lives like Webb has, these are clear distractions and as stated in this piece, his focus on the job in hand is then affected.

An interesting stat; Liverpool have won just six of the last 22 games refereed by Howard Webb 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-available-for-4000-on-comedians-website.html

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One after dinner speaking engagement in two months is hardly "dominating his life" though is it?


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## Foxholer (Feb 18, 2014)

A bit of this from Refs wouldn't go amiss!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd65g3hqJrk


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			No its not, he's a Gooner :smirk:
		
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 Get outa town!!!!!! Shocked and stunned - I'll have to get some of them totally biased glasses, although LiverpoolPhil may be able to tell me......:whoo:The Suarez aftermath was a beautiful,balletic piece of gymnastic excellence. A triple salco with pike in footy boots is a sight to behold, and very hard to do....


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## Fish (Feb 18, 2014)

MegaSteve said:



			One after dinner speaking engagement in two months is hardly "dominating his life" though is it?
		
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He's a part-time policeman isn't he, I'd think that does?

He also does motivation classes, so, its not just the after dinner speaking I was on about, he has a diverse amount of other distractions, as such my point was, as a 'professional' referee, shouldn't that now be his main duty and shouldn't they make all referees full-time and although they could do other things, the refereeing should be their main responsibility.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

BTW JCW - I saw one thing last night which was on one of Sturridges early misses, Mertesacker done this massive swan dive up in the air after the ball had gone (without contact), how many out of 10 on the diving scale will you give that, he even done the tuck and roll thing afterwards. Amazing dexterity for a man of 6 foot 6, I think I even saw him put chalk on his hands before attempting it, but I may have had my biased glasses on momentarily. What say you?


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## Fish (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			BTW JCW - I saw one thing last night which was on one of Sturridges early misses, Mertesacker done this massive swan dive up in the air after the ball had gone (without contact), how many out of 10 on the diving scale will you give that, he even done the tuck and roll thing afterwards. Amazing dexterity for a man of 6 foot 6, I think I even saw him put chalk on his hands before attempting it, but I may have had my biased glasses on momentarily. What say you?
		
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That wasn't chalk, he'd just shook hands with Fowler 

:smirk:


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## Duckster (Feb 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			He's a part-time policeman isn't he, I'd think that does?
		
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Thought he was on sabbatical from the boys in blue whilst he does full time reffing.  What's wrong with him earning a few quid extra anyway?  So long as he wasn't doing an engagement the night before a match, what does it actually matter?  Should Steven Gerrard not be allowed to do promotional adverts for EA Sports?

Personally, I think it comes down to human error.  In the heat of the moment he missed something or he wasn't 100% sure that it was a foul.  You cannot, even using the multitude of camera's in today's game, see what he saw in that split second.

People tend to get on at the ref's due to the amount of video evidence and having time afterwards to show it in slow-mo etc.. but football has always been a sport which has the element of human error.  Be that by the ref, a goal keeper, a forward.  Ref's do get punished (they get knocked down to lower leagues for a match or so) and yes, every once in a while they will have a stinker, but by the same thought-train, why should a forward not get punished and lambasted if he has a shot which hits the crossbar?  He's a professional who should have full control over a football so he should have scored!  Or a keeper who lets in a soft goal if it bobbles in front of him.  It happens, it's horrible, get over it and move on.

It's arguments like this and ref's getting slaughtered in the press which stops younger people from actually becoming ref's which means you then have less ref's to chose from and obviously the standard will then diminish.

It's a part of the game and it's a game we all love.  If people want us to put in lots of camera's and allow video ref's for all incidents so that a game of football takes longer than sky's build up for it then that'll be the day I stop watching footy on TV and stick to watching the amateur stuff at my local park.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			I haven't read all the posts but for me the refs now need to be made full-time and totally accountable. They shouldn't have other interests that dominate their lives like Webb has, these are clear distractions and as stated in this piece, his focus on the job in hand is then affected.

*An interesting stat; Liverpool have won just six of the last 22 games refereed by Howard Webb* 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...-available-for-4000-on-comedians-website.html

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But isn't a lot of that to do with the fact that Webb will tend to referee the "big" games so it will be Liverpool v Man City/Chelsea/Arsenal/Man Utd (when they were good)/Spurs so the chances are that Liverpool will lose a higher percentage of them than against Norwich/Hull/West Brom etc.


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 18, 2014)

And again it's making the stats give you the answer that you want from them. For instance.....

Liverpool have only lost 2 of their last 21 matches with Andre Marriner in charge

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/liverpool-fc/schiedsrichterdetail/verein_31_471.html

or Liverpool have lost 4 of their 7 games that Mike Jones has refereed

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/liverpool-fc/schiedsrichterdetail/verein_31_628.html

or Liverpool have only lost 1 out of 14 games that Michael Oliver has refereed

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/liverpool-fc/schiedsrichterdetail/verein_31_902.html

I'm not trying to defend Webb as he made several poor decisions in the game but it does come down to lies, damned lies and statistics.


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			But isn't a lot of that to do with the fact that Webb will tend to referee the "big" games so it will be Liverpool v Man City/Chelsea/Arsenal/Man Utd (when they were good)/Spurs so the chances are that Liverpool will lose a higher percentage of them than against Norwich/Hull/West Brom etc.
		
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 That is a point that explains it a little bit. However, with the amount of bad decisions made by Webb from 5-10 yards away with a clear sight and slow-mo videos not needed, it smacks of something more than "just the way it is". The press and many neutrals also highlighted them as "how could he not give that" as well, not just LFC fans. The amount of decisions (not all) that were highlighted that Webb gave in favour of Man U, were the other end of the scale as well.  Not just Webb, but when they are getting clear cut decisions wrong, as often as they are nowadays, it is time do something. I was vehemently against video refs 10 years ago, I am now in favour of them for the last 3-4 years, due to the standard of top referees in England.


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## freddielong (Feb 18, 2014)

Everyone thinks the refs are biased there was a study done for a few seasons that was published before the start of last season that actually showed that Arsenal has lost the most points due to poor referees but it was fairly close


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## bladeplayer (Feb 18, 2014)

Interesting piece in todays Star over here , ex ref Mark Halsey reckons Howard has too much going on at present and needs to focus more on his paid job , seemingly he does alot of after dinner talks etc .. 

Tells ya what he thinks of his performances


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## MegaSteve (Feb 18, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			Interesting piece in todays Star over here , ex ref Mark Halsey reckons Howard has too much going on at present and needs to focus more on his paid job , seemingly he does alot of after dinner talks etc ..
		
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One such engagement in two months is hardly going to cause loss of focus...


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## JCW (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			Get outa town!!!!!! Shocked and stunned - I'll have to get some of them totally biased glasses, although LiverpoolPhil may be able to tell me......:whoo:The Suarez aftermath was a beautiful,balletic piece of gymnastic excellence. A triple salco with pike in footy boots is a sight to behold, and very hard to do....

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Yes I am a gooner , thanks Fish , since 1969 , was there last year in the FA Cup vs Blackburn , they had 1 shot and scored , we had the rest of the game and never look like scoring . I was at the KOK Burnham & Berrow so never watch the game till I got home , Webb had a bad day , Sterling and SG were lucky to be on the pitch as was the Arsenal left back NM , can anyone explain LS fish out of water antics for the 2nd penalty , anyway the result stands now and its history


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## bladeplayer (Feb 18, 2014)

MegaSteve said:



			One such engagement in two months is hardly going to cause loss of focus...
		
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No idea mate, didnt even know he did them,  but ref's & ex ref's , normally stick together & have very little negative to say about each other so even they must think he is slipping a bit


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

JCW said:



			Yes I am a gooner , thanks Fish , since 1969 , was there last year in the FA Cup vs Blackburn , they had 1 shot and scored , we had the rest of the game and never look like scoring . I was at the KOK Burnham & Berrow so never watch the game till I got home , Webb had a bad day , Sterling and SG were lucky to be on the pitch as was the Arsenal left back NM , can anyone explain LS fish out of water antics for the 2nd penalty , anyway the result stands now and its history
		
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 Good, the first step on the road to recovery is to admit it (being a gooner - why the big secret). I have already explained the LS dive, but how close do you think Mertersacker got to it, with his attempt? Come on now don't be biased......


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## Papas1982 (Feb 18, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			No idea mate, didnt even know he did them,  but ref's & ex ref's , normally stick together & have very little negative to say about each other so even they must think he is slipping a bit
		
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Pi wouldn't pay any attention to Halsey, even Bt had to stop him giving opinions mid games due to him just looking for his own headlines. The bloke took all their support when he was ill now stabs his colleagues in the back. Howard made a mistake, but to say he's not a top ref would be laughable been as he's rated highly by uefa and FIFA. lattenburg on the other hand........


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 18, 2014)

Papas1982 said:



			Pi wouldn't pay any attention to Halsey, even Bt had to stop him giving opinions mid games due to him just looking for his own headlines. The bloke took all their support when he was ill now stabs his colleagues in the back. Howard made a mistake, but to say he's not a top ref would be laughable been as he's rated highly by uefa and FIFA. lattenburg on the other hand........
		
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Is that the same FIFA who dropped him for a period of time after the World Cup Final after making a shocking error by not sending off De Jong for his assault on Alonso


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## cookelad (Feb 18, 2014)

Can't help but think that had Webb been stood in the HNSP rather than behind Suarez, he'd have had a far better view of the incident as it was the contact between boot and shin was obscured by Suarez's leg


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## Papas1982 (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Is that the same FIFA who dropped him for a period of time after the World Cup Final after making a shocking error by not sending off De Jong for his assault on Alonso
		
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That would be the same Webb who they've since chosen to take to the World Cup. If you can name me a ref in England who doesn't and never has made a mistake I'll hold my hands up. They're are all human and mistakes occur. He's no different.


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## Doon frae Troon (Feb 18, 2014)

cookelad said:



			Can't help but think that had Webb been stood in the HNSP rather than behind Suarez, he'd have had a far better view of the incident as it was the contact between boot and shin was obscured by Suarez's leg
		
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That's Â£5 please as I have copyright of HNSP.
Paypal accepted.


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## jp5 (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			Good, the first step on the road to recovery is to admit it (being a gooner - why the big secret). I have already explained the LS dive, but how close do you think Mertersacker got to it, with his attempt? Come on now don't be biased......
		
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Let's face it, a high percentage of footballers are cheats (some in more than one regard, Mr. Giroud). I don't recall Mertesacker ending up on his head though?


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## ColchesterFC (Feb 18, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			That's Â£5 please as I have copyright of HNSP.
Paypal accepted.
		
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As I also mentioned the HNSP Â© (DFT) earlier in the thread I am happy to pay you the Â£5 fee. If you would just like to send me your bank details I will get my Nigerian friend who is a prince to transfer the money directly to you. And if you help him get $10 million dollars out of the country he will reward you handsomely.


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## JCW (Feb 18, 2014)

Liverbirdie said:



			Good, the first step on the road to recovery is to admit it (being a gooner - why the big secret). I have already explained the LS dive, but how close do you think Mertersacker got to it, with his attempt? Come on now don't be biased......
		
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Its no secret , all my friends already know , only time I kept it quiet was when I was a Train Driver in Manchester and watch the Liverpool Vs Arsenal in 1989 in the mess room at Liverpool Lime street station , the room was full and standing watching the game and was a empty within a  min after it ended , telly switched off and I was left alone and I said yessssss and left the score on a toilet wall later . They called the ref all sorts that night and thought they should have won but they did not , best night as an Arsenal fan , By the way I am a football fan and also enjoy all liverpool`s European cup wins , Graham  sourness is a member at my club and I  have chatted to him about those games he played in and the last one under the spainish waiter ........................EYG


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## Liverbirdie (Feb 18, 2014)

jp5 said:



			Let's face it, a high percentage of footballers are cheats (some in more than one regard, Mr. Giroud). I don't recall Mertesacker ending up on his head though? 

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Only because he's 6 foot six, anyway Suarez has had more practice, so should be  better.:thup:


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