# Andy Murray



## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

Is he Scotland's greatest athlete?


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

OOps sorry mods......can you move.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 30, 2014)

Wow that's some claim :rofl:


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Jun 30, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Is he Scotland's greatest athlete?
		
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Ever or right now?

Some contenders (off the top of my head)

Kenny Dalgleish
Sir Chris Hoy
Allan Wells
Eric Liddell


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## User20205 (Jun 30, 2014)

Probably, maybe Monty just pips him in terms of pure athleticism!!

It's a shallow pool, though a bit like me claming to be the greatest golfer in my family


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

Sir Chris Hoy
Ken Buchanan
Willie Anderson
Jim Clark

Would be my short list.


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Jun 30, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Sir Chris Hoy
Ken Buchanan
Willie Anderson
Jim Clark

Would be my short list.
		
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Forgot about Jim Clark, he would have to be a strong contender.


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## CheltenhamHacker (Jun 30, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Is he Scotland's greatest athlete?
		
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I enjoy some of your posts DfT, but IMO this is a very shallow attempt to spark a Scotland vs UK debate. I may be wrong, but people seem to always bring up Andy Murray and use it for a Scot vs Brit argument. Apologies if this is not your intention, but I think you're switched on enough to know it would push some peoples buttons


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## c1973 (Jun 30, 2014)

Rowdy Roddy Piper?


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## Piece (Jun 30, 2014)

Jimmy Krankie?


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 30, 2014)

You cant leave out Hamish Balfour


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## c1973 (Jun 30, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			You cant leave out Hamish Balfour 

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Winner.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 30, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Sir Chris Hoy
Ken Buchanan
Willie Anderson
Jim Clark

Would be my short list.
		
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Jim Clark - athlete ?!


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			I enjoy some of your posts DfT, but IMO this is a very shallow attempt to spark a Scotland vs UK debate. I may be wrong, but people seem to always bring up Andy Murray and use it for a Scot vs Brit argument. Apologies if this is not your intention, but I think you're switched on enough to know it would push some peoples buttons 

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It is a talking point up here since Chris Hoy's great medal display.
I think Murray's win last year has lifted him close to Hoy.

google Willie Anderson and you will see why he is on my list.


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## Rumpokid (Jun 30, 2014)

Jocky Wilson must be in with a shout surely...


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

Rumpokid said:



			Jocky Wilson must be in with a shout surely...

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No, nowhere near


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## CliveW (Jun 30, 2014)

Old Tom Morris.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 30, 2014)

Stephen Hendry


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 30, 2014)

decent sportsmen, but you cant class darts or snooker as "athletic"


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## Rooter (Jun 30, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			decent sportsmen, but you cant class darts or snooker as "athletic"
		
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I would like to see you take on a long red with your leg cocked on the table at full stretch! (well i wouldn't! LOL)


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## Dodger (Jun 30, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Jim Clark - athlete ?! 

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Jackie Stewart blows Clark out the water.

Fin Calder?

Still Jocky Wilson for me though,great Darter and a hell of a scooper. Proper athlete.


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

Finlay Calder is a good call.
Clark and Stewart's records are very similar. Experts say Clark had greater competition.


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## chrisd (Jun 30, 2014)

Adam Scott??


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## 6inchcup (Jun 30, 2014)

the bloke of the QUAKER oats box.


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## Doon frae Troon (Jun 30, 2014)

6inchcup said:



			the bloke of the QUAKER oats box.
		
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No ...Geoff Capes was a better heavyweight hammer thrower.


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## Dodger (Jun 30, 2014)

Doon frae Troon said:



			No ...Geoff Capes was a better heavyweight hammer thrower.
		
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And he wasn't a Scot.


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## c1973 (Jun 30, 2014)

Shouldn't it be the guy on the Scott's porridge oats packet? Is the guy on the Quakers one not an auld git wae a daft hat and clay pipe or something?


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## Pathetic Shark (Jun 30, 2014)

Alex Salmond.   After all he's been going on for ages and ages and ages and ages ....


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Jun 30, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			decent sportsmen, but you cant class darts or snooker as "athletic"
		
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I once saw Jocky Wilson run to the bar when they called last orders


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## chrisd (Jun 30, 2014)

drive4show said:



			I once saw Jocky Wilson run to the bar when they called last orders  

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Do you know, I find that difficult to believe!


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 30, 2014)

Gavin Hastings?

Maybe not tops but surely up there with his inspiration as well as delivery.

Ken Buchanan anyone?


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## pbrown7582 (Jun 30, 2014)

Yvonne Murray


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Jun 30, 2014)

chrisd said:



			Do you know, I find that difficult to believe!
		
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OK, I made it up for dramatic effect


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## NWJocko (Jun 30, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Gavin Hastings?

Maybe not tops but surely up there with his inspiration as well as delivery.

Ken Buchanan anyone?
		
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Hastings isn't in the same league as Finlay Calder. In my view of course.

Denis Law, Kenny?


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 30, 2014)

Irrespective of whether he's the best Scot ever (Hoy for me) he seems to be making serene progress so far.


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## MegaSteve (Jul 1, 2014)

Joe Baker... Played for England but was a Scot... During his time at Highbury got a 100 goals in a 150 games [or thereabouts]... Some say he should have been in the '66 squad... Remember getting his autograph and noticing the toe end of his boots had pimples on similar to those on table tennis bats from the same era... Happy days...


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## Doon frae Troon (Jul 1, 2014)

MegaSteve said:



			Joe Baker... Played for England but was a Scot... During his time at Highbury got a 100 goals in a 150 games [or thereabouts]... Some say he should have been in the '66 squad... Remember getting his autograph and noticing the toe end of his boots had pimples on similar to those on table tennis bats from the same era... Happy days...
		
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Watched him play for Hibs, he was a great old fashioned centre forward.
You are right  he should have been selected for the 1966 England squad, better player than Hurst but not Greaves.


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## Adi2Dassler (Jul 1, 2014)

MegaSteve said:



			Joe Baker... Played for England but was a Scot... During his time at Highbury got a 100 goals in a 150 games [or thereabouts]... Some say he should have been in the '66 squad... Remember getting his autograph and noticing the toe end of his boots had pimples on similar to those on table tennis bats from the same era... Happy days...
		
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Amen Brother!

Cannae be Chris Hoy, he's a jambo.Andy Murray is clearly the finest athletic Scotland has produced, and a fine Hibernian too.


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## c1973 (Jul 1, 2014)

Surprised Alan Wells hasn't been mentioned or Eric Liddell. 

Edit: 

David Wilkie perhaps.


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## 6inchcup (Jul 1, 2014)

c1973 said:



			Shouldn't it be the guy on the Scott's porridge oats packet? Is the guy on the Quakers one not an auld git wae a daft hat and clay pipe or something? 

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thats the one i was referring to,he was only 16 but living on a diet of fags n fried everything made him look older.


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## bladeplayer (Jul 2, 2014)

Struggling a bit today is Andy ..


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## AmandaJR (Jul 2, 2014)

bladeplayer said:



			Struggling a bit today is Andy ..
		
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He doesn't look himself ot there at all. He has been in stunning form. Hope he turns this around and if so a good test will stand him in good stead for the semi final. Hope he hasn't been close to Serena Williams and caught owt!


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## AmandaJR (Jul 2, 2014)

Well that was disappointing - he looked like a man in a hurry to get back to the locker room. Have to wonder if he is unwell or something and actually hope so as that lack of fight is hard to comprehend otherwise.


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## USER1999 (Jul 2, 2014)

I guess he is Scottish again!


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## c1973 (Jul 2, 2014)

I said to the boss that Andy parting company with Ivan Lendl was going to have a detrimental effect on his game and I genuinely think it has. Ivan had him fully focused on the next point and not lamenting the one gone. He's good enough to beat anyone, but his focus can be suspect and is quite possibly the weakest part of his game and loses him too many points. Imo.


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## AmandaJR (Jul 2, 2014)

c1973 said:



			I said to the boss that Andy parting company with Ivan Lendl was going to have a detrimental effect on his game and I genuinely think it has. Ivan had him fully focused on the next point and not lamenting the one gone. He's good enough to beat anyone, but his focus can be suspect and is quite possibly the weakest part of his game and loses him too many points. Imo.
		
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That's a fair point as it was the old Andy - waiting for an opponent to miss rather than taking it on.


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## Hacker Khan (Jul 2, 2014)

Have to say it's a great summer of sport for GB.  What with the football, tennis, Rugby Union and Cricket.  Go team GB....


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## AmandaJR (Jul 2, 2014)

Hacker Khan said:



			Have to say it's a great summer of sport for GB.  What with the football, tennis, Rugby Union and Cricket.  Go team GB....
		
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Le Tour starts soon - perhaps success for a Kenyan born Brit


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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

Re op. NOPE!


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## Doon frae Troon (Jul 2, 2014)

Hacker Khan said:



			Have to say it's a great summer of sport for GB.  What with the football, tennis, Rugby Union and Cricket.  Go team GB....
		
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I think something is happening at Glasgow as well.
Bolt confirmed he is running.


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Well done Dimitrov.Gave Andy a tennis lesson on his fave surface and venue..Good luck


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## delc (Jul 2, 2014)

I see that the Scottish git lost again!


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## c1973 (Jul 2, 2014)

delc said:



			I see that the Scottish git lost again!
		
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:rofl:


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 2, 2014)

Unlucky for Murray today - Dimitriov is on fire at the moment and Murray is still building himself back up - think we will see a strong US Open on the hard court ( which is his favourite surface )


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Unlucky for Murray today - Dimitriov is on fire at the moment and Murray is still building himself back up - think we will see a strong US Open on the hard court ( which is his favourite surface )
		
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What is his favourite ice cream then Pedanticphil?


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 2, 2014)

Murray looked way out of sorts this afternoon and was efficiently put away


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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

Rumpokid said:



			What is his favourite ice cream then Pedanticphil?
		
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To be fair, Phil is right. Murray has always favoured us hard courts since he won as a junior. Not pentantic to correct someone on something that's obviously incorrect.


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Papas1982 said:



			To be fair, Phil is right. Murray has always favoured us hard courts since he won as a junior. Not pentantic to correct someone on something that's obviously incorrect.
		
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Not into googling ATP stats...So i guess Wimbledon grass is soft as mush this time of year innit??..Keep the bromance going you 2..It is fast surface's he favours by the way...


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Murray looked way out of sorts this afternoon and was efficiently put away
		
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Exactly,not unlucky,as some say.That dilutes Dimitrovs achievements.And i am not anti Murray.He has done great things for British Tennis.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 2, 2014)

Rumpokid said:



			Exactly,not unlucky,as some say.That dilutes Dimitrovs achievements.And i am not anti Murray.He has done great things for British Tennis.
		
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Totally agree. He had looked good and efficient himself prior to today. Well out of touch and put away by a player very much on the up


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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

Rumpokid said:



			Not into googling ATP stats...So i guess Wimbledon grass is soft as mush this time of year innit??..Keep the bromance going you 2..It is fast surface's he favours by the way...
		
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Innit, what are we twelve? Agreeing with Phil puts me in a bromance. Got play on a grass court then a us court and see if they play the same.......

i dont one generally use google either, but here you go:

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Andy-Murray.aspx

Favourite surface hard (not fast) and best venue he's played at is us open. His words btw.

now where is my BFF?


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Papas1982 said:



			Innit, what are we twelve? Agreeing with Phil puts me in a bromance. Got play on a grass court then a us court and see if they play the same.......

i dont one generally use google either, but here you go:

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Andy-Murray.aspx

Favourite surface hard (not fast) and best venue he's played at is us open. His words btw.

now where is my BFF?
		
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Well done that man..Red Nose is in the post..Bet there are no shortcuts to your house eh?


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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

So let me get this straight, you can call Phil or myself out. Tell us we're full of crap or in a bromance etc. But even when the findings look you square in the face you won't accept it?

ok mate, you enjoy your evening. 

Ddnt not quite get your red nose comment, but post code is ct4 6sl if ya wanna send it signed for.


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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Papas1982 said:



			So let me get this straight, you can call Phil or myself out. Tell us we're full of crap or in a bromance etc. But even when the findings look you square in the face you won't accept it?

ok mate, you enjoy your evening. 

Ddnt not quite get your red nose comment, but post code is ct4 6sl if ya wanna send it signed for.[/QUOTe
Good lad..Now you get it.I haven't said anyone is full of crap,facts right eh,
You were the one calling people 12,eh..No?
Called a regional accent, innit, it is well known around my area.Bit like Na then..But i guess this is incorrect too.
Might be able to stretch it to a striped suit and face paint to go with red nose.
		
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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

Rumpokid said:





Papas1982 said:



			So let me get this straight, you can call Phil or myself out. Tell us we're full of crap or in a bromance etc. But even when the findings look you square in the face you won't accept it?

ok mate, you enjoy your evening. 

Ddnt not quite get your red nose comment, but post code is ct4 6sl if ya wanna send it signed for.[/QUOTe
Good lad..Now you get it.I haven't said anyone is full of crap,facts right eh,
You were the one calling people 12,eh..No?
Called a regional accent, innit, it is well known around my area.Bit like Na then..But i guess this is incorrect too.
Might be able to stretch it to a striped suit and face paint to go with red nose.
		
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Awesome can you send it for Tuesday as got the day off. Am only size 10 though so make sure the shoes aren't too big. 

Anyways I'm off to practice my animal balloons. 
Then make jump on some nice soft grass see just whybmurray loves it so. 

Still not seen my bff, probably interrupting theology in between about 20 on here if me agreeing with him us anything to go by then there's a lot of loving shared between a fee of you on here.
		
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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Papas1982 said:





Rumpokid said:



			Awesome can you send it for Tuesday as got the day off. Am only size 10 though so make sure the shoes aren't too big. 

Anyways I'm off to practice my animal balloons. 
Then make jump on some nice soft grass see just whybmurray loves it so. 

Still not seen my bff, probably interrupting theology in between about 20 on here if me agreeing with him us anything to go by then there's a lot of loving shared between a fee of you on here.
		
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Erm..You been on the sauce tonight?..Just askin...
		
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## Papas1982 (Jul 2, 2014)

Rumpokid said:





Papas1982 said:



			Erm..You been on the sauce tonight?..Just askin...
		
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No just fat fingers and not easy typing with my big white gloves on. 

My point however badly written was that if me n Phil are in a bromance for agreeing you were wrong then there's close to a gang bang going on in the Liverpool thread between all those that are giving him grief. 

Anyways off for the nite. 

Didn't see your thoughts on op. But fully agree that too much was made of murray performance and Not enough credit given to Dimitrov
		
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## Rumpokid (Jul 2, 2014)

Papas1982 said:





Rumpokid said:



			No just fat fingers and not easy typing with my big white gloves on. 

My point however badly written was that if me n Phil are in a bromance for agreeing you were wrong then there's close to a gang bang going on in the Liverpool thread between all those that are giving him grief. 

Anyways off for the nite. 

Didn't see your thoughts on op. But fully agree that too much was made of murray performance and Not enough credit given to Dimitrov
		
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Nice on Papas..I'm off too,glad all that is sorted..Don't like confrontation.That was my main point, Dimitrov playing really well,and it kinda went haywire..Anyway, all the best
		
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## USER1999 (Jul 3, 2014)

Murrays footwork was terrible, and that wasn't down to dmitrov. He's a bit like mcilroy. His A game is ace, but when it's off, he just gives up and behaves like a sulky teenager. I don't get why he split with Lendl.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 3, 2014)

murphthemog said:



			Murrays footwork was terrible, and that wasn't down to dmitrov. He's a bit like mcilroy. His A game is ace, but when it's off, he just gives up and behaves like a sulky teenager. I don't get why he split with Lendl.
		
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Lendl said he wanted to have more time to work on his own projects and couldn't commit the time to Murray that he deserves.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 3, 2014)

Rumpokid said:



			What is his favourite ice cream then Pedanticphil?
		
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Not sure why you needed to throw a little strop at myself and Papa - I was just stating what is very well known within tennis that Murray's favourite surface is the hard courts and he will do well at Flushing Meadows.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jul 3, 2014)

Nearly had Djokovic joining Murray and Nadal out yesterday - so Murray not alone in succumbing to 'new' guys.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 3, 2014)

If Murray turns up at the US Open playing like that it makes no difference what surface he's on. You can't get away with that lack of technique at the top level. Hopefully a bad day and nothing more. Not sure what this new coach is going to be adding though and thought he looked a better player for having Lendl in his corner


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## pokerjoke (Jul 3, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Unlucky for Murray today - Dimitriov is on fire at the moment and Murray is still building himself back up - think we will see a strong US Open on the hard court ( which is his favourite surface )
		
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I disagree Murray was unlucky,IMO he was flat and
Had no fire in his belly and went out with a whimper.
Honestly who heard of Dimitrov before.
As for the surface excuse I also don't agree as he
Won last year and smashed all before him.
I put it down to a very bad day at the office.
Who would have said Nadal hates grass and only
Wins on clay,yet he has learnt to adapt.
In fact Murray himself has improved on clay.
Yesterday Audley Harrison would have put up
More of a fight.
As has been said Murray sulks when it starts going wrong.
In the first week he looked a finalist at least.
Not directed at anyone just my thoughts.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 3, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			I disagree Murray was unlucky,IMO he was flat and
Had no fire in his belly and went out with a whimper.
Honestly who heard of Dimitrov before.
As for the surface excuse I also don't agree as he
Won last year and smashed all before him.
I put it down to a very bad day at the office.
Who would have said Nadal hates grass and only
Wins on clay,yet he has learnt to adapt.
In fact Murray himself has improved on clay.
Yesterday Audley Harrison would have put up
More of a fight.
As has been said Murray sulks when it starts going wrong.
In the first week he looked a finalist at least.
Not directed at anyone just my thoughts.
		
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Yeah it was a bad day at the office - only seen extended highlights and he just looked down from the start

But Murray will be back - of that there is no doubt


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## pokerjoke (Jul 3, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			If Murray turns up at the US Open playing like that it makes no difference what surface he's on. You can't get away with that lack of technique at the top level. Hopefully a bad day and nothing more. Not sure what this new coach is going to be adding though and thought he looked a better player for having Lendl in his corner
		
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Totally agree about Lendl,he had Murray focused
And probably took no crap either.
Probably told Murray it was his way or no way.
Murray has to find that killer instinct.
That 2nd serve needs sorting too.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jul 3, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			I disagree Murray was unlucky,IMO he was flat and
Had no fire in his belly and went out with a whimper.
*Honestly who heard of Dimitrov before.*
As for the surface excuse I also don't agree as he
Won last year and smashed all before him.
I put it down to a very bad day at the office.
Who would have said Nadal hates grass and only
Wins on clay,yet he has learnt to adapt.
In fact Murray himself has improved on clay.
Yesterday Audley Harrison would have put up
More of a fight.
As has been said Murray sulks when it starts going wrong.
In the first week he looked a finalist at least.
Not directed at anyone just my thoughts.
		
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You seriously suggesting Dimitrov is a nobody that has come from nowhere?


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 3, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			You seriously suggesting Dimitrov is a nobody that has come from nowhere?
		
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This year is his break through year - if people follow tennis a lot then they would have prob heard of him last year but he was still finding his feet. 

If tennis isn't followed too much then he would have come from nowhere over the last couple of months.

His OH isn't too bad as well


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## jp5 (Jul 3, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			I disagree Murray was unlucky,IMO he was flat and
Had no fire in his belly and went out with a whimper.
*Honestly who heard of Dimitrov before.*
As for the surface excuse I also don't agree as he
Won last year and smashed all before him.
I put it down to a very bad day at the office.
Who would have said Nadal hates grass and only
Wins on clay,yet he has learnt to adapt.
In fact Murray himself has improved on clay.
Yesterday Audley Harrison would have put up
More of a fight.
As has been said Murray sulks when it starts going wrong.
In the first week he looked a finalist at least.
Not directed at anyone just my thoughts.
		
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:mmm: pretty much anyone who takes any note of tennis for more than 2 weeks a year?!


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## pokerjoke (Jul 3, 2014)

jp5 said:



			:mmm: pretty much anyone who takes any note of tennis for more than 2 weeks a year?!
		
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That me then.
Will be watching the women today though just
To get a glimpse of their undies.


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## Jensen (Jul 3, 2014)

Anyway, back to the original post. The finest Scottish athlete without doubt was Alan Rough, what a goalkeeper he was. He had a fantastic 1978 World Cup. Can't understand why Scottish goalkeepers have a bad reputation.


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## Doon frae Troon (Jul 3, 2014)

Jensen said:



			Anyway, back to the original post. The finest Scottish athlete without doubt was Alan Rough, what a goalkeeper he was. He had a fantastic 1978 World Cup. Can't understand why Scottish goalkeepers have a bad reputation.
		
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Probably stems from 9 past Haffie.


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## Rumpokid (Jul 3, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Not sure why you needed to throw a little strop at myself and Papa - I was just stating what is very well known within tennis that Murray's favourite surface is the hard courts and he will do well at Flushing Meadows.
		
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I am sure it is because you are always nit picking,micro managing what people post.Wasn't a strop, just an observation..For the rec, squared it up with Papas, if you read earlier threads..He favours FAST surfaces


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## Rumpokid (Jul 3, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yeah it was a bad day at the office - only seen extended highlights and he just looked down from the start

But Murray will be back - of that there is no doubt
		
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I do not think he will be back winning, regarding majors..Hope he will,but he does not have the same make up compared to the likes of Nadal,Federer (earlier years), or Jokovic..Seems a little fragile in comparison.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jul 3, 2014)

Jensen said:



			Anyway, back to the original post. The finest Scottish athlete without doubt was Alan Rough, what a goalkeeper he was. He had a fantastic 1978 World Cup. Can't understand why Scottish goalkeepers have a bad reputation.
		
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Great fan of Roughie - though why he wore gardening gloves in the '78 WC I have no idea.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jan 25, 2015)

Impressive first set from Murray - Dimitrov started like a train but Murray just waited 

Starting to look the player he was in 2013


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## Foxholer (Jan 25, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Impressive first set from Murray - Dimitrov started like a train but Murray just waited 

Starting to look the player he was in 2013
		
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Some strange decisions in the 2nd though - and lost in a breaker!


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## Liverpoolphil (Jan 25, 2015)

Thats a pretty good win from Murray - not far from the Murray of old - great energy


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## MegaSteve (Jan 25, 2015)

Got a bit 'lucky' at the end...

Could be an 'interesting' next match against the 'local hero'...


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## Liverpoolphil (Jan 25, 2015)

MegaSteve said:



			Got a bit 'lucky' at the end...

Could be an 'interesting' next match against the 'local hero'...
		
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Yeah its not nice to win on a net cord


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## Foxholer (Jan 25, 2015)

Defo good to get through in 4.

Murray just didn't to seem to want/be able to dominate as much as he has in the past. Depth was rarely good enough and it was only when he went back to his 'Mr Angry' style that he seemed to really want it! First serve was a bit predictable and he definitely needs to improve the second!

Will be quite a match next. Kyrgios has shown he can last, though that may have sapped his energy/concentration too!


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## chrisd (Jan 25, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yeah its not nice to win on a net cord
		
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It never worried me when I played!


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## HomerJSimpson (Jan 25, 2015)

Good win but a tough game against a home crowd favourite. Think Murray should have enough but you never know. Not sure he's quite back to 2013 standards but moving forward again which is good to see


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## MegaSteve (Jan 29, 2015)

Superb tennis today... And on the Beeb...


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## richart (Jan 29, 2015)

Played well after the first eight games, when it looked like he would be hit off court. I like his new sliced serve, and the bit of needle at the end of the first set seemed to get him going.

Good to have him back in a major final. First one since Wimbledon 2013.


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## Foxholer (Jan 29, 2015)

richart said:



			Played well after the first eight games, when it looked like he would be hit off court. I like his new sliced serve, and the bit of needle at the end of the first set seemed to get him going.

Good to have him back in a major final. First one since Wimbledon 2013.
		
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Excellent result!

Unfortunately, I can't see anyone beating Djokovic. But really good progress by Murray!


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## richart (Jan 29, 2015)

Foxholer said:



			Excellent result!

Unfortunately, I can't see anyone beating Djokovic. But really good progress by Murray!
		
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 Hopefully Stan can, or at least keep him on court for six hours or so.


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## pokerjoke (Jan 29, 2015)

Imo he has the game but mentally im not sure.
After the first set today it was plain sailing.
Great first set


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## sawtooth (Jan 29, 2015)

MegaSteve said:



			Superb tennis today... And on the Beeb...
		
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Still the best place for sport IMO

Well done Murray:thup:


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## FairwayDodger (Jan 29, 2015)

Foxholer said:



			Excellent result!

Unfortunately, I can't see anyone beating Djokovic. But really good progress by Murray!
		
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I was worried after the first set but he got his act together, still served very poorly compared to his match against Kyrios so hopefully he can sort that out.

Now all we need is Novak and Stanford to play themselves to a standstill!


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## HomerJSimpson (Jan 29, 2015)

Got an inkling the final will go to four sets but Murray won't win


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## Hacker Khan (Jan 30, 2015)

I see in the paper that his Mrs was caught swearing after the match.  So can I just say that posh attractive women that swear like troupers make me horny, and I thoroughly approve of her behavior. You go girl.


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## Tongo (Jan 30, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



*I see in the paper that his Mrs was caught swearing after the match*.  So can I just say that posh attractive women that swear like troupers make me horny, and I thoroughly approve of her behavior. You go girl.

Click to expand...

Its ridiculous how much media attention this has got. Absolutely pathetic. People get caught up in the moment / situation and say things they probably wouldnt if they were calm. So what? 

Maybe the media cant cope with Murray reaching another final. Maybe they would prefer a player like Henman, the gallant loser and his prim and proper entourage.


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## Foxholer (Jan 30, 2015)

Foxholer said:



			Unfortunately, I can't see anyone beating Djokovic. But really good progress by Murray!
		
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Well! That was encouraging!

Djok still favourite, but some weaknesses apparent!


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## Hacker Khan (Jan 30, 2015)

Tongo said:



			Its ridiculous how much media attention this has got. Absolutely pathetic. People get caught up in the moment / situation and say things they probably wouldnt if they were calm. So what? 

Maybe the media cant cope with Murray reaching another final. Maybe they would prefer a player like Henman, the gallant loser and his prim and proper entourage.
		
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I think to be honest it's more basic than that and they don't need much of an excuse to print a picture of a pretty lady on the front page.  Not sure why they can't cope with him reaching another final as surely that would sell more papers if he wins it?


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## Tongo (Jan 30, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



*I think to be honest it's more basic than that and they don't need much of an excuse to print a picture of a pretty lady on the front page*.  Not sure why they can't cope with him reaching another final as surely that would sell more papers if he wins it?
		
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Hadn't thought of that!


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 1, 2015)

Some stunning tennis from both players - all tied up - this could be a long one !

Edit: and now Murray breaks in the firstgame of the third - Djokovic doesnt look happy out there - looks knackered


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## Foxholer (Feb 1, 2015)

Great Tiebreaker by Murray too, though the miss off the net-cord had the potential for disaster!

Still think Djok will prevail, but hoping for Murray! Keeping it deep and straight which is a good strategy and his serve is performing!


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## Siren (Feb 1, 2015)

Shame there has to be a loser, absolute classic this one.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 1, 2015)

Siren said:



			Shame there has to be a loser, absolute classic this one.
		
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Djokovic has flicked a switch again - playing impreious tennis again


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 1, 2015)

Cant see anything but a Novak win now - superb effort from Murray though


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## guest100718 (Feb 1, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Cant see anything but a Novak win now - superb effort from Murray though
		
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A poor effort and and finishing with a whimper.


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## Foxholer (Feb 1, 2015)

guest100718 said:



			A poor effort and and finishing with a whimper.
		
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Good to see 'Mr Positive' being consistent! 

Certainly a disappointing final set though!


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## pokerjoke (Feb 1, 2015)

Shame he just quit and gave up.
Great player but just mentally weak.


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## Beezerk (Feb 1, 2015)

Ouch that was a painful to watch, looked like he just wanted to go home in the final set. Shame as he should have won the 1st set and been in control.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Feb 1, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



			I think to be honest it's more basic than that and they don't need much of an excuse to print a picture of a pretty lady on the front page.  Not sure why they can't cope with him reaching another final as surely that would sell more papers if he wins it?
		
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Think it was a bit more than that, it was during the match and aimed at his opponent, if a family member of a Golfer did it during the Ryder Cup or a matchplay event to the opposition, they'd want the person thrown off the course.


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## Tongo (Feb 1, 2015)

Good to see Kim Sears has got a sense of humour regarding her outburst and the t-shirt!


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## Foxholer (Feb 1, 2015)

Tongo said:



			Good to see Kim Sears has got a sense of humour regarding her outburst and the t-shirt!
		
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:rofl: :thup:


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## User62651 (Feb 1, 2015)

Watched a great match until it went 2-2 in set 3, it was so close and then Murray's mind went again like it used to. Disappointing over the piece, did appear to give up. Murray was playing great but there is a mental weakness there that Djokovic just doesn't have, man's a machine!


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 1, 2015)

Murray was tough to start with but losing that third set seemed to sap the will and he melted. Not sure it's a weakness he'll ever lose. Djokovich played some great stuff though and compelling, for three sets at least


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## delc (Feb 1, 2015)

See that the Scottish git lost again!


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 1, 2015)

delc said:



			See that the Scottish git lost again!
		
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Attempt at humour ?


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 1, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:





Attempt at humour ?
		
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Nearly :thup:


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## Rumpokid (Feb 1, 2015)

Temper tantrums and a better player beat Murray today.The lad needs to find some peace with himself.He could be a far better player if he can sort out his temperament.


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## hovis (Feb 1, 2015)

Glad he lost. What an unlikeable bloke.  He's such a cry baby.

I'd rather spend the day with tiger woods (and that's saying something)


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## USER1999 (Feb 1, 2015)

He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 1, 2015)

murphthemog said:



			He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.
		
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Sorry but that's rubbish - you don't win as much as he has including grand slams and coming back from back surgery by being a quitter 

He got beat by the better player today when Murray let his guard

The desire to kick people when they lose is quite embaressing


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## Foxholer (Feb 1, 2015)

Rumpokid said:



			Temper tantrums and a better player beat Murray today.The lad needs to find some peace with himself.He could be a far better player if he can sort out his temperament.
		
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H'mm! Unlike Golf, in the intensely physical game that tennis is, short bursts of anguish are quite reasonable imo. Murray's grimaces are hardly temper tantrums! Djokovic is indeed simply a better player, which is why he now has 8 Grand Slam titles!



murphthemog said:



			He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.
		
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That could well have been in the days when his physical fitness was seriously suspect. Something snapped though and there's restoration work required!


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## Tommo21 (Feb 1, 2015)

Taylor, Lloyd, Rusedki, Henman. That's a few of the best British players I can remember. Not one of them came near to what Murray has done. Arguably Murray has came up against the best 3 or 4 players that the game has ever seen.......and all at the same time.


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## NWJocko (Feb 2, 2015)

murphthemog said:



			He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.
		
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Guessing that wasn't the Wimbledon he won then........:ears:


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## Tongo (Feb 2, 2015)

murphthemog said:



			He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.
		
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Didnt quit in the 5 hour, 5 set marathon of a US Open final a couple of years ago though did he? 

2 Grand Slams is not bad for a supposed quitter. Maybe winning Grand Slams is easier than i thought.


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## Tiger man (Feb 2, 2015)

murphthemog said:



			He's always been a quitter. Saw him at Wimbledon ages ago, and he quit then, and nothing has changed.
		
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I really dislike the man myself, but I don't think you can achieve what he has done by being a quitter. Just don't think he has got the mental strength the other top boys have for a 5 set match as it must be as mentally draining as physically.


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## c1973 (Feb 2, 2015)

Tongo said:



			Didnt quit in the 5 hour, 5 set marathon of a US Open final a couple of years ago though did he? 

2 Grand Slams is not bad for a supposed quitter. Maybe winning Grand Slams is easier than i thought.
		
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Pretty much what I think. 

He's proven he is a top player, but imo Djokovic is (usually) a better player. No shame in that. Only one player can be the best. 

Maybe he does have weaknesses in his game, physical and/or mental, but winning a couple of slams is something 99% of tennis players would love to achieve and he's done it! 

Do you think its a British thing that we build up our sporting greats just so we can knock them off their pedestal? 


99% is a guestimate btw,  before the pedants weigh in asking for proof of said figure.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2015)

c1973 said:



			Pretty much what I think. 

He's proven he is a top player, but imo Djokovic is (usually) a better player. No shame in that. Only one player can be the best. 

Maybe he does have weaknesses in his game, physical and/or mental, but winning a couple of slams is something 99% of tennis players would love to achieve and he's done it! 
*
Do you think its a British thing that we build up our sporting greats just so we can knock them off their pedestal? *


99% is a guestimate btw,  before the pedants weigh in asking for proof of said figure. 

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Its exactly this 

Murray has played tennis during a period when the 3 best players ever have played and has been right in the middle of them competing and beating them. 

Djokovic will IMO go on to be the best ever.


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## c1973 (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Its exactly this 

Murray has played tennis during a period when the 3 best players ever have played and has been right in the middle of them competing and beating them. 

*Djokovic will IMO go on to be the best ever.*

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He won't be far away, he's a fantastic player, but Sampras and Federer do have damned good records.


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2015)

c1973 said:



			He won't be far away, he's a fantastic player, but Sampras and Federer do have damned good records.
		
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They do - just think Djokovic will have it because he wins on all services

Certainly would put Murray in the Top Ten as best ever 

Mine would be 

Federer
Djokovic 
Sampras
Nadal
Borg
Agassi
Becker
Murray
McEnroe
Lendl
Edberg


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## Doon frae Troon (Feb 2, 2015)

Tommo21 said:



			Taylor, Lloyd, Rusedki, Henman. That's a few of the best British players I can remember. Not one of them came near to what Murray has done. Arguably Murray has came up against the best 3 or 4 players that the game has ever seen.......and all at the same time.
		
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Nice tough guy
Nice soft guy
Nice Canadian guy
Nice but Tim.

Andy Murray......not so nice guy but the first British male player to Wimbledon wearing shorts.


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## bladeplayer (Feb 2, 2015)

Andy Murray , great tennis player unfortunate to have at least 3 of the best ever players to grace the game around at the same time ..

But ya know what bugs me about him , and its a totaly far away observation on my behalf .

He is a quitter, mentally  , no or not enough fight in the guy when its going against him , his head goes down he starts looking up in the crowd etc.. 
I could be wrong and maybe it is  just that  he is good but not good enough , but watching him play most times you can see the change in him , the "ah im beaten" look coming across him , try something different at least , go down fighting not moaning


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## FairwayDodger (Feb 2, 2015)

Must be the best British tennis player ever?


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## Qwerty (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They do - just think Djokovic will have it because he wins on all services

Certainly would put Murray in the Top Ten as best ever 

Mine would be 

Federer
Djokovic 
Sampras
Nadal
Borg
Agassi
Becker
Murray
McEnroe
Lendl
Edberg
		
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You sure Phil??

Laver
Conners
Cash
Wilander
Courier
Safin
Hewitt
Roddick


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## Foxholer (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They do - just think Djokovic will have it because he wins on all services

Certainly would put Murray in the Top Ten as best ever 

Mine would be 

Federer
Djokovic 
Sampras
Nadal
Borg
Agassi
Becker
Murray
McEnroe
Lendl
Edberg
		
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Cor! That's some pretty exalted company! No way would I rate him above McEnroe or Lendl! And Edberg rates better too imo - his quiet approach seemingly diminishing his ability! All those guys have been World #1 against pretty solid opposition. Murray never has! 

I'd rate Hewitt, Wilander, Courier and Connors as obviously better too. And that doesn't go back all that far either. Stan Smith, Arthur Ashe, Newcombe and Laver would be candidates a bit further back too!

But certainly the best Britain has produced - now that's a misnomer, better 'in spite of being British!' - since Fred Perry.


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## c1973 (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They do - just think Djokovic will have it because he wins on all services

Certainly would put Murray in the Top Ten as best ever 

Mine would be 

Federer
Djokovic 
Sampras
Nadal
Borg
Agassi
Becker
Murray
McEnroe
Lendl
Edberg
		
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Hard to disagree with that (not including guys I've not seen play like Laver, Nastasi (sp?) ), but I'd have Sampras above Federer (he quit way too soon), just my opinion mind, after all Federer has won the most. Wasn't keen on Edberg either, so I'll give that slot to Navratilova....that was a bloke,yeah? 

Mac and Borg were using wooden racquets as well!! 

Lendl was always my favourite (and the best) though.......oh and Gabby Sabbatini. :;


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2015)

Qwerty said:



			You sure Phil??

Laver
Conners
Cash
Wilander
Courier
Safin
Hewitt
Roddick
		
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Yeah I'm sure - Murray has been very unfortunate that he has had to compete against 3 of the best ever - take away just one of them and his Grand Slam count would be a great deal higher - I know it's a bold statement 

Laver - not alive when he was playing so can't judge 
Conners - yeah can see him being in there but picked Edberg over him 
Cash - was a good grass player and decent player 
Wilander - same as Conners
Courier- again solid player 
Safin , Hewitt and Roddick - decent players no doubt but wouldn't have them up with the best


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## jp5 (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yeah I'm sure - Murray has been very unfortunate that he has had to compete against 3 of the best ever - take away just one of them and his Grand Slam count would be a great deal higher - I know it's a bold statement 

Laver - not alive when he was playing so can't judge 
Conners - yeah can see him being in there but picked Edberg over him 
Cash - was a good grass player and decent player 
Wilander - same as Conners
Courier- again solid player 
Safin , Hewitt and Roddick - decent players no doubt but wouldn't have them up with the best
		
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So it wasn't a list of the top 10 ever but rather top 10 you have seen. Which is fair enough, but they are different things!

By any account that you can read Laver is one of the all time greats.

Murray is a very decent player but not even being in the top 3 of his generation it would be hard to put him in an all time top 10.


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## Foxholer (Feb 2, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yeah I'm sure - Murray has been very unfortunate that he has had to compete against 3 of the best ever - take away just one of them and his Grand Slam count would be a great deal higher - I know it's a bold statement 

Laver - not alive when he was playing so can't judge 
Conners - yeah can see him being in there but picked Edberg over him 
Cash - was a good grass player and decent player 
Wilander - same as Conners
Courier- again solid player 
Safin , Hewitt and Roddick - decent players no doubt but wouldn't have them up with the best
		
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Hewitt ranks higher for me because he has been World #1 (at age 20!) - as well as winning a couple of Grand Slams. 
I'd put Murray at similar level as Safin and Roddick, even with plenty of his career to go. If he wants an example of mental toughness, Courier is the guy to show it! Even more-so than Connors, who would never acknowledge defeat until it happened!


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## MegaSteve (Feb 2, 2015)

Sadly, Andy reverted back to his old pre Lendl ways ...


For me, best player I've ever seen was Laver...


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## Tongo (Feb 2, 2015)

jp5 said:



			So it wasn't a list of the top 10 ever but rather top 10 you have seen. Which is fair enough, but they are different things!

By any account that you can read Laver is one of the all time greats.

*Murray is a very decent player but not even being in the top 3 of his generation it would be hard to put him in an all time top 10*.
		
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Yeah, but to be fair its some generation when you are behind (in no particular order) Fed, Nadal and Djokovic.


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## jp5 (Feb 2, 2015)

Tongo said:



			Yeah, but to be fair its some generation when you are behind (in no particular order) Fed, Nadal and Djokovic.
		
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Certainly a golden generation but for me each of those have a special quality which Murray doesn't have. Really like the guy though.


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## Tongo (Feb 2, 2015)

jp5 said:



			Certainly a golden generation but for me each of those have a special quality which Murray doesn't have. Really like the guy though.
		
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Very much so. But i'd imagine there weren't many generations where a player would have had 3 incredible players in front of him at the same time. One or two maybe, but three?


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2015)

jp5 said:



			Certainly a golden generation but for me each of those have a special quality which Murray doesn't have. Really like the guy though.
		
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Would say Murrays return of serve and two handed back hand is one of the best seen


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## guest100718 (Feb 2, 2015)

he's a decent tennis player, but if you use major wins as the measure of succes then I doubt he's even top 30.  I guess its because the british tennis watchers have been starved any real quality players for so long he gets rated so highly.


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 2, 2015)

Arguably the best player ever, certainly in the modern era for the two grand slams alone. He's been unfortunate in terms of the quality of the players he competes with but would that change? The next generation will be fitter and quicker and so there's no guarantee he'd be top of the tree if he had his time again


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