# Suspension of membership - handicap question



## 3offTheTee (Jun 17, 2013)

At our Club there is the facility to pay monthly by standing order. Someone ha s injured the self and wanted to suspend membership. The Club has stated that he has entered into a contract and is liable for the 7 months payments although I am unsure how they can enforce it other than through the small claims court.

Someone else has said that if he has outstanding monies due to our Club his handicap could be suspended and he would not be able to join another Club with monies outstanding. 

Has anyone else heard of this. Please forget the lack of empathy as that is not the question


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## GB72 (Jun 17, 2013)

The approach by the club makes sense as the ability to pay monthly is normally coupled with a contractual obligation to pay the full amount. If you could just stop paying when injured I am sure that you would see a number of members picking up long term injuries in November that suddenly get better in April.


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## fundy (Jun 17, 2013)

GB72 said:



			The approach by the club makes sense as the ability to pay monthly is normally coupled with a contractual obligation to pay the full amount. If you could just stop paying when injured I am sure that you would see a number of members picking up long term injuries in November that suddenly get better in April.
		
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Cant say I agree with this, dont see why you have to contract to 12 months in advance, why not 1 month in advance?

One of the key reasons for me when I joined my club is if I had a reoccurrence of previous knee injuries that I wouldnt be liable for outstanding fees (having already wasted 2 yrs at Â£1k+ with previous injuries). Obviously they monitor to ensure that no one takes the proverbial. Even when injured last yr I didnt pause my membership as it was only a shortish term thing, if my knee goes again then I expect to be able to suspend my membership with immediate effect and dont see why you should have to commit to 12 months of payment even if you cant take advantage of it. 

Clubs need to be more flexible in these situations for me, and despite being asked not to comment on the lack of empathy I have to as personally I think the club is bang out of order. Thankfully Im at a forward thinking club, I feel for the guy in the OP who sadly isnt


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## Colin L (Jun 17, 2013)

I expect the club could suspend his handicap under CONGU rules which allow for the suspension of the handicap of a player who has

_conducted himself in a manner prejudicial to the interests of his Union, Area Authority or Home Club or to the Game of Golf._ [24.1 (b)]

It doesn't take a QC to argue that not paying your dues is prejudicial to the interests of your club!


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## 3offTheTee (Jun 17, 2013)

[I said:
			
		


			conducted himself in a manner prejudicial to the interests of his Union, Area Authority or Home Club or to the Game of Golf.[/I] [24.1 (b)]

It doesn't take a QC to argue that not paying your dues is prejudicial to the interests of your club!
		
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Not sure why this is the case as he obviously has a valid reason. I am surprised that The Club can ensure he cannot join another Club until he pays his money.

Thought there was some Company tha take over the payments, something Credit, and I would be interested to know what they do in these circumstances as I understand they gibe The Club a percentage o there's upfront.


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## DCB (Jun 17, 2013)

We've debated this before and didn't get anywhere.  Forget the DD thing for a moment, if player had paid his subs by cheque at the start of the year and became injured during the season, as a result, missing part of the season, then tough titty. It happens, get over it.

So, if paying by DD, you still have a contractual obligation, as GB72 says, to pay the club the years fees.

Suspension of handicap may well be a last resort. You may also find, thinking of going to another club instead is out of the question as there is still an issue with your initial club and your suspension there. It happened to someone at a club up here last year.


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## Colin L (Jun 17, 2013)

3offTheTee said:



			Not sure why this is the case as he obviously has a valid reason.
		
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He has a reason but  not necessarily a  valid one:  it would depend, would it not,  on the terms and conditions of his membership.  If the contract is for a year's membership but with a facility to pay the sub monthly,  it is he, not the club who is out of order.

But without knowing the contractual set-up at this particular club, it is impossible to decide what the situation is.


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Jun 17, 2013)

Who has he taken out this contract with? My club allow you to pay monthly but it uses a credit company so I have taken out a loan agreement with them. They pay the money to the club up front then I pay it back to them. Is this the case with this chap? If so, he can't suspend his membership.


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## fundy (Jun 17, 2013)

DCB said:



			We've debated this before and didn't get anywhere.  Forget the DD thing for a moment, if player had paid his subs by cheque at the start of the year and became injured during the season, as a result, missing part of the season, then tough titty. It happens, get over it.

So, if paying by DD, you still have a contractual obligation, as GB72 says, to pay the club the years fees.

Suspension of handicap may well be a last resort. You may also find, thinking of going to another club instead is out of the question as there is still an issue with your initial club and your suspension there. It happened to someone at a club up here last year.
		
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pretty big assumptions in there DCB, i pay by DD and I can guarantee you that I dont have the contractual obligation you seem to think is compulsory. Ultimately it will depend on the paper work he signed at some point


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## Colin L (Jun 17, 2013)

I'm not a lawyer, so this is just a layman's thinking.  I pay an annual sub to my club in return for membership.  The contract is that I pay and the club provides what I have paid for - a managed golf course to play on, other facilities like my locker, trolley shed etc.  If I fail to pay my sub the club can withdraw the services including my handicap and if the club fails to provide the services, I shouldn't have to pay.


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## DCB (Jun 17, 2013)

fundy said:



			pretty big assumptions in there DCB, i pay by DD and I can guarantee you that I dont have the contractual obligation you seem to think is compulsory. Ultimately it will depend on the paper work he signed at some point
		
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Clubs obviously differ in their approach then. It's business madness not to have a mechanism to protect all monies due for that years membership IMO.  A years membership is a years membership however you pay it.


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## chrisd (Jun 17, 2013)

I have to pay Â£750 next week for 9 months membership (doing 2 x 9 months to change date of subscription) if I can't play due to, say, surgery then the club is unlikely to refund any money. So , is it fair that a monthly DD payer can jut stop paying with impunity ?


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## fundy (Jun 18, 2013)

chrisd said:



			I have to pay Â£750 next week for 9 months membership (doing 2 x 9 months to change date of subscription) if I can't play due to, say, surgery then the club is unlikely to refund any money. So , is it fair that a monthly DD payer can jut stop paying with impunity ?
		
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Ultimately its your choice to join a club with that contract where you are committed to it, personally am not prepared to and hence found a club where I was only "contracted" to a month in advance. 4 yrs on, despite my now 2nd shortish break for injury I havent stopped my membership, but appreciate having the option to do so if i get a reoccurrence of my knee injury. I just dont understand why you all seem to think the only option is for a 12 month contract. Like anything these days, flexible contracts often exist, and often to the benefit of both parties


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## pbrown7582 (Jun 18, 2013)

each indivdual club will have different terms and if you have 12 month obligation the only way out would be for the club to agree a suspension.
Like most things there are any number of ways these agrements are worded and if your obligation is only 1 month then thats good to see from a members perspective but could leave the club in a tricky situation should a large number of members opt to leave part way through the year.
We had our DD payments changed so they werent equal and weighted to pay 70% through april-oct the main playing season.


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## chrisd (Jun 18, 2013)

fundy said:



			Ultimately its your choice to join a club with that contract where you are committed to it, personally am not prepared to and hence found a club where I was only "contracted" to a month in advance. 4 yrs on, despite my now 2nd shortish break for injury I havent stopped my membership, but appreciate having the option to do so if i get a reoccurrence of my knee injury. I just dont understand why you all seem to think the only option is for a 12 month contract. Like anything these days, flexible contracts often exist, and often to the benefit of both parties
		
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I am happy where I am, but I don't know any club within driving distance that offers the terms you get.


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## Siren (Jun 18, 2013)

fundy said:



			pretty big assumptions in there DCB, i pay by DD and I can guarantee you that I dont have the contractual obligation you seem to think is compulsory. Ultimately it will depend on the paper work he signed at some point
		
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I have the same agreement with my club.

Why a golf club would not suspend the membership is typical of the silly behavior we see almost every day. Suspend the membership, lose out in the short term but keep the member happy and keep the member for a good few years or force him/her to pay while injured, they leave and club loses out in the long term. No brainer really.


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## Hobbit (Jun 18, 2013)

We allow suspension of membership for illness and injury but it is a case of a 12 month membership. Having people come and go as they please could make budgeting difficult.

I do know of a club that uses the small claims court if a member up and leaves part way through the year without paying his full year's fees.


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## Colin L (Jun 18, 2013)

drive4show said:



			Who has he taken out this contract with? My club allow you to pay monthly but it uses a credit company so I have taken out a loan agreement with them. They pay the money to the club up front then I pay it back to them. Is this the case with this chap? If so, he can't suspend his membership.
		
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Again  a layman 's view, but I reckon you have two contracts there - one with your golf club and another, the loan agreement with the credit company.


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## Slab (Jun 18, 2013)

I recall a club where the option to _transfer _membership (& future monthly payments) to a new 'recruit' existed. It allows the injured player, the club & the new player to all get what they want


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## sev112 (Jun 18, 2013)

I resigned my club membership this month - not playing enough
How long does my handicap "last" and how can I get a handicap cert if I don't have a home club?


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## Colin L (Jun 18, 2013)

You can only hold a handicap as a member of a club: your handicap ended with your membership.  So no CONGU handicap certificate either.


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## sev112 (Jun 18, 2013)

That's what I thought, but everyone keeps telling me it's 3,4,6,12 months etc.
Do I get to join somewhere else at a bandit handicap?


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## DCB (Jun 18, 2013)

sev112 said:



			Do I get to join somewhere else at a bandit handicap?
		
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No, since you have previously held a handicap you are meant to tell them what it was and when it ended. A lot easier to trace with CDH as your CDH number should last you a lifetime


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## Colin L (Jun 18, 2013)

sev112 said:



			That's what I thought, but everyone keeps telling me it's 3,4,6,12 months etc.
Do I get to join somewhere else at a bandit handicap?
		
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If you join another club within 6 months your handicap must be restored at its present level.  If it is more than 6 months you must submit 3 cards for a new handicap but the club will take your present handicap into consideration - so perhaps no banditry!


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## duncan mackie (Jun 18, 2013)

3offTheTee said:



			At our Club there is the facility to pay monthly by standing order. Someone ha s injured the self and wanted to suspend membership. The Club has stated that he has entered into a contract and is liable for the 7 months payments although I am unsure how they can enforce it other than through the small claims court.

Someone else has said that if he has outstanding monies due to our Club his handicap could be suspended and he would not be able to join another Club with monies outstanding.
		
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you have had a lot of replies, and a little off topic discussion, but my understanding of the situation is as follows - 

1. the enforcement of the balance of payments will depend on the contracts entered into. it may be that he has entered into a loan agreement with a third party (Premium Credit being common) in which case such a financial issue rests with them. alternatively he may have a contract with the club, the terms of that contract covering enforcement. he needs to look at what he's signed, after which he will understand whether he's asking or telling whom what.

2. I disagree with my understanding of Colin's initial assesment of the ability of a club to suspend a handicap in the manner imlied. The handicap is suspended on leaving, and non payment will involve leaving, but there's noting beyond that handicap wise that can carry over to another clubs ability to take you on as a member and allocate/restore your handicap. CONGU doesn't require handicap committees to undertake financal, or other, background checks on members! Later posts seem to be more in line so I might have misinterpreted his initial comment.

Now the comment side - 

Increasingly clubs will go out of their way to help members, especially long term members, under a range of circumstances. Most common is to temporarily suspend membership and associated payments - not least because this should be best long term for all parties. However, if a third party is involved this may not be possible as far as the payments are concerned, but in such situations I have heard of clubs suspending playing rights over the period so that the player pays now but plays later ie he gets all the golf he's payed for eventually. Overall this stance maintains parity with those members paying a lump sum and being able to suspend playing for serious injury (which many do).  Such an approach also provides clubs (and their membership) some cover against people deciding they aren't using their membership enough and 'pulling a sickie'.
On the handicap bit - this isn't a handicap issue! 
Hope this helps.


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