# What is going on in the UK?



## Sharktooth (Dec 23, 2013)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...cklash-from-customers-over-Muslim-policy.html


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

Happy Holidays


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## Doon frae Troon (Dec 23, 2013)

Is that not a bit like Catholics selling condoms.
I don't have a problem with it and respect the decision of the individual and the store.


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## Imurg (Dec 23, 2013)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Is that not a bit like Catholics selling condoms.
I don't have a problem with it and respect the decision of the individual and the store.
		
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As long as it's made clear before you load up the till and put your wine and pork scratchings at the back....
Simple - if they have issues serving certain products, move them elsewhere in the shop.
It could also be questioned why get a job in a supermarket if your beliefs restrict you from serving certain products...


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## PhilTheFragger (Dec 23, 2013)

So when M&S say that only staff who are happy to touch pork or alcohol can work on the till, and those who don't are on floor sweeping duties, or if M&S stop employing people from certain religions,  there isn't going to be a backlash?

If I'm in a shop and I've queued, I would be very miffed if I was told to go to another till

If you work for a company, you need to be happy with what that company does, if not go work somewhere else!

We are getting Too PC , too namby pamby in my opinion


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## Sharktooth (Dec 23, 2013)

I've worked in Saudi a few times. Try going there and expressing any kind of 'rights.'


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## Captainron (Dec 23, 2013)

This is ridiculous!


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 23, 2013)

Imurg said:



			As long as it's made clear before you load up the till and put your wine and pork scratchings at the back....
Simple - if they have issues serving certain products, move them elsewhere in the shop.
*It could also be questioned why get a job in a supermarket if your beliefs restrict you from serving certain products...*

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Exactly.


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## chrisd (Dec 23, 2013)

It'll be interesting if all supermarkets introduce the same rules and what about when you do home delivery!


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

You know, i'am convinced that these idiots actually know what kind of reaction decisions like this are going to generate.
Surely no one who has risen to the point of creating policy in a buisness like M&S can be this stupid. :angry:


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## Birchy (Dec 23, 2013)

Sums up the way this country has gone, complete joke. Its beyond repair now though, we are too far gone. Everything is some form of discrimination.

If you are so strict to a religion then you need to either adapt it to living in a Christian country or piss off to somewhere that is a muslim/an other religion country imo.


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## Sharktooth (Dec 23, 2013)

Birchy said:



			Sums up the way this country has gone, complete joke. Its beyond repair now though, we are too far gone. Everything is some form of discrimination.

If you are so strict to a religion then you need to either adapt it to living in a Christian country or piss off to somewhere that is a muslim country imo.
		
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Have to agree. I couldn't ever see myself moving back now. Our country has changed man. And from what I hear, it's getting worse


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## Birchy (Dec 23, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



			Have to agree. I couldn't ever see myself moving back now. Our country has changed man. And from what I hear, it's getting worse
		
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Its unbelievable now what happens. I know a few people of different religions who just cant understand it either so where it comes from is beyond me.

If I moved to another country with a different culture I would not go there and make my own rules up, I would embrace that countries beliefs along with my own and anything that goes against my own religion I would just avoid.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Dec 23, 2013)

Oh dear - if all muslim home delivery packers and drivers demanded this then they and the supermarkets are going to have a bit of a problem. The former are tempting the shopper with alcohol - the latter with plonking (sorry) it on their doorstep.  Interesting that this is nothing to do with the individual's consumption of pork or alcohol.


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## BTatHome (Dec 23, 2013)

There would be a big queue behind me if this happened to me, I'd simply refuse to budge until someone sorted it, and quite a few people in the store would have heard me too


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Dec 23, 2013)

Maybe M&S will have 'No Alcohol, No Pork' tills.  But what about chocolate liqueurs, bacon crisps, sherry trifle - indeed any food that includes alcohol or pork as an ingredient.  This seems to me to be a re rather unconscionable demand that M&S have given in to in a bit of PC pandering.  It's just daft - as most muslims will agree.


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## Rooter (Dec 23, 2013)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			bacon crisps
		
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Typically they are ok for veggies, so should be fine with your bag of frazzles.


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## BTatHome (Dec 23, 2013)

Rooter said:



			Typically they are ok for veggies, so should be fine with your bag of frazzles.
		
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Try finding marshmallow for veggies .... nightmare, everything these days seems to contain gelatine !


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## patricks148 (Dec 23, 2013)

Rooter said:



			Typically they are ok for veggies, so should be fine with your bag of frazzles.
		
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So if you are a Racist can you go and get a Job a M&S and say you won't serve non whites?


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## Rooter (Dec 23, 2013)

patricks148 said:



			So if you are a Racist can you go and get a Job a M&S and say you won't serve non whites?
		
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Depends, a jamiacan comes in and asks for beer cans. would a muslim help him? as it may sound like he is after Bacon...


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## patricks148 (Dec 23, 2013)

Rooter said:



			Depends, a jamiacan comes in and asks for beer cans. would a muslim help him? as it may sound like he is after Bacon...
		
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Sounds like he wouldn't be on either count


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## Rooter (Dec 23, 2013)

patricks148 said:



			Sounds like he wouldn't be on either count

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true, poor bloke. no beer or bacon!


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

This really is a complete non story getting far too much air time than it deserves. 

I applaud M&S for having a policy that provides employees with a choice where it comes to their religious or personal beliefs, but the store in question screwed up and put her in situation. I suspect the cashier was more embarrassed than the customer. A mistake was made, but it's hardly the end of the world.

The world isn't ending, the country isn't going to the dogs and it's nothing to do with the PC brigade gone mad. I'm astounded that I'm still surprised by the complete over reaction of people to stories like this.


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## CMAC (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			This really is a complete non story getting far too much air time than it deserves. 

I applaud M&S for having a policy that provides employees with a choice where it comes to their religious or personal beliefs, but the store in question screwed up and put her in situation. I suspect the cashier was more embarrassed than the customer. A mistake was made, but it's hardly the end of the world.

The world isn't ending, the country isn't going to the dogs and it's nothing to do with the PC brigade gone mad. I'm astounded that I'm still surprised by the complete over reaction of people to stories like this.
		
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well said.

Looks like the instore Manager misinterpreted M&S's own policies, simple rules error and mild embarrassment for employee and customer.

Just shows the power of social media as this wouldn't have got further than 3 local people talking about it in the past.


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## Sharktooth (Dec 23, 2013)

CMAC said:



			well said.

Looks like the instore Manager misinterpreted M&S's own policies, simple rules error and mild embarrassment for employee and customer.

Just shows the power of social media as this wouldn't have got further than 3 local people talking about it in the past.
		
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What about this one then... http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article3948391.ece


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## Rooter (Dec 23, 2013)

CMAC said:



			well said.

Looks like the instore Manager misinterpreted M&S's own policies, simple rules error and mild embarrassment for employee and customer.

Just shows the power of social media as this wouldn't have got further than 3 local people talking about it in the past.
		
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I don't agree, boycott M&S. I for one will not buy my copy of the daily mail in there anymore!!


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 23, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



			What about this one then... http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article3948391.ece

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Scum,if they don't like how we live then they can jump on a plane & go back to the dump they came from.


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## ADB (Dec 23, 2013)

Pin-seeker said:



			Scum,if they don't like how we live then they can jump on a plane & go back to the dump they came from.
		
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Luton?


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			This really is a complete non story getting far too much air time than it deserves. 

I applaud M&S for having a policy that provides employees with a choice where it comes to their religious or personal beliefs, but the store in question screwed up and put her in situation. I suspect the cashier was more embarrassed than the customer. A mistake was made, but it's hardly the end of the world.

The world isn't ending, the country isn't going to the dogs and it's nothing to do with the PC brigade gone mad. I'm astounded that I'm still surprised by the complete over reaction of people to stories like this.
		
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If it was that much of an issue for the poor little mite, why didn't they question it when they were posted to the tills in the food hall, rather than waiting to refuse the customers?  Or did they really think that given the traditional Christmas dinner in this country they would get away with not having to serve anyone with pork or alcohol?  In fact, if M & S's policy of selling pork and alcohol offends their sensibilities so much, why work there in the first place?


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

I'm offended....I'm offended by the fact the she was offended. I'm offended and disgusted by m&s.......but most of all I'm appalled by the fact anyone cares !!


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

Blue in Munich said:



			If it was that much of an issue for the poor little mite, why didn't they question it when they were posted to the tills in the food hall, rather than waiting to refuse the customers?  Or did they really think that given the traditional Christmas dinner in this country they would get away with not having to serve anyone with pork or alcohol?  In fact, if M & S's policy of selling pork and alcohol offends their sensibilities so much, why work there in the first place?
		
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Maybe they did question it? Maybe the manager said, don't worry if that happens let us know and we'll get someone else to serve them, so ask them to go to another till. But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of a good old xenophobic, anti-Islamic media spouted BS article designed to inflame and create division.

And it isn't about offending her sensibilities. It's about respecting her beliefs. I'm an Atheist and personally think religion is outdated and unnecessary in today's world, but if someone else wants to believe in a flying spaghetti monster and refuse to serve pasta because their religious book decrees it, then so be it. I'll respect that and M&S rightfully do that, but in this instance they put her in a situation they shouldn't have and now you have this pointless story and straw man arguments popping up all over the place because a manager misinterpreted the policy. It's laughable.


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

Pin-seeker said:



			Scum,if they don't like how we live then they can jump on a plane & go back to the dump they came from.
		
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Always one


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Maybe they did question it? Maybe the manager said, don't worry if that happens let us know and we'll get someone else to serve them, so ask them to go to another till. But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of a good old xenophobic, anti-Islamic media spouted BS article designed to inflame and create division.

And it isn't about offending her sensibilities. It's about respecting her beliefs. I'm an Atheist and personally think religion is outdated and unnecessary in today's world, but if someone else wants to believe in a flying spaghetti monster and refuse to serve pasta because their religious book decrees it, then so be it. I'll respect that and M&S rightfully do that, but in this instance they put her in a situation they shouldn't have and now you have this pointless story and straw man arguments popping up all over the place because a manager misinterpreted the policy. It's laughable.
		
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When you say "put her in a situation they shouldn't have" do you mean gave her a job? 
I'd guess a pork or alcohol product will go through with most peoples weekly shop.


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			Always one 

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Yep, try not to let it bother you tho :thup:


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

Pin-seeker said:



			Yep, try not to let it bother you tho :thup:
		
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Doesn't bother me, I'm not the one who wrote it just makes me grateful :thup:


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			Doesn't bother me, I'm not the one who wrote it just makes me grateful :thup:
		
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Always nice to make some one feel grateful


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## Durango (Dec 23, 2013)

I seem to be hearing far too much of Islam/Muslims, often in contraversial/dubious circumstances. I don't seem to hear anywhere near as much with regards to issues facing other religious groups. Surely it would be better in the long run, and these people would be far happier, if they were living in an Islamic state somewhere, Pakistan for example. They seem so unhappy here and have never ending problems and issues, Islam just seems to be at odds with how we live in the West.  As for M&S they shouldn't be employing anybody that cannot handle/sell the products they stock, it is sheer lunacy.


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## Hacker Khan (Dec 23, 2013)

Rooter said:



			I don't agree, boycott M&S. I for one will not buy my copy of the daily mail in there anymore!!
		
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Me neither


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

Pin-seeker said:



			When you say "put her in a situation they shouldn't have" do you mean gave her a job? 
I'd guess a pork or alcohol product will go through with most peoples weekly shop.
		
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No, I mean put her on a till selling food. Not all people who work in Marks work in the food hall you know. Believe it or not, there are other roles that can be fulfilled.


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## Hacker Khan (Dec 23, 2013)

Durango said:



			I seem to be hearing far too much of Islam/Muslims, often in contraversial/dubious circumstances. I don't seem to hear anywhere near as much with regards to issues facing other religious groups. Surely it would be better in the long run, and these people would be far happier, if they were living in an Islamic state somewhere, Pakistan for example. They seem so unhappy here and have never ending problems and issues, Islam just seems to be at odds with how we live in the West.  As for M&S they shouldn't be employing anybody that cannot handle/sell the products they stock, it is sheer lunacy.
		
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Meanwhile in an office in London The Daily Mail editor sits down in a comfy chair, lights up a cigar, pours himself a G&T and thinks to himself, my work here is done, people think that most Muslims are at best unhappy,at worst potential terrorists and they would all be better off living in somewhere like Pakistan.  Mission accomplished....


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## Birchy (Dec 23, 2013)

Hacker Khan said:



			Meanwhile in an office in London The Daily Mail editor sits down in a comfy chair, lights up a cigar, pours himself a G&T and thinks to himself, my work here is done, people think that most Muslims are at best unhappy,at worst potential terrorists and they would all be better off living in somewhere like Pakistan.  Mission accomplished....

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Oh here we go, the Daily Mails number one enemy is here 

Anybody who disagrees will be bored into submission so just throw the towel in, its a lot easier :rofl:


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## Durango (Dec 23, 2013)

Hacker Khan- just out of interest, do you believe in the tooth fairy?...


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

Birchy said:



			Oh here we go, the Daily Mails number one enemy is here 

Anybody who disagrees will be bored into submission so just throw the towel in, its a lot easier :rofl:
		
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Not really, it's a non story blown up out of proportion to appeal to a pseudo right wing agenda. It's a misunderstanding, a mistake. It's not m&s policy and not typical of Muslims. It's an isolated case and doesn't deserve closer examination!


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## Durango (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			Not really, it's a non story blown up out of proportion to appeal to a pseudo right wing agenda. It's a misunderstanding, a mistake. It's not m&s policy and not typical of Muslims. It's an isolated case and doesn't deserve closer examination!
		
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It's not a non-story therod though is it, it's part of a much bigger and more complicated story. Living in Dorset though you can be forgiven for having your eyes partially closed


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## Hobbit (Dec 23, 2013)

"I'd like a job with M&S but I don't want work in certain areas of the store..." Since when did employees get allowed to be fussy? And before any of the PC boys jump up and down, it's got nowt to do with religious discrimination. If you take the job you should do ALL of the job, not twist your employer's arm up their back and tell them what you won't do.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			Not really, it's a non story blown up out of proportion to appeal to a pseudo right wing agenda. It's a misunderstanding, a mistake. It's not m&s policy and not typical of Muslims. It's an isolated case and doesn't deserve closer examination!
		
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I'am sorry, but i don't believe it is a non story, because the policy shouldn't exist.
What would happen if all the employees born christian refused to work Sundays or Easter?
I don't think M&S would be so accommodating.
Without the policy the issue doesn't arise, and the DM don't get their headline.
If you can't see you don't drive for a living, if your pro-life you don't work for Marie Stopes and if you can't handle certain foods you don't work in a supermarket.
I know they could have worked in the clothing department, but the tills in the food hall are different, why didn't they raise the matter when being trained on said tills and why not raise the matter when they were asked to work on said tills?


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

Durango said:



			It's not a non-story therod though is it, it's part of a much bigger and more complicated story. Living in Dorset though you can be forgiven for having your eyes partially closed 

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I think you have a point, Dorset is hardly a melting pot of racial tension if I lived in Bradford I may feel differently, however it doesn't mean you can't buy your frazzles in m&s anymore, or that all Muslims disapprove of your taste for special brew. That's why it's a non story, actions are extrapolated and prejudices realised based on a one off event.


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			I'am sorry, but i don't believe it is a non story, because the policy shouldn't exist.
*What would happen if all the employees born christian refused to work Sundays or Easter?*
*I don't think M&S would be so accommodating.*
Without the policy the issue doesn't arise, and the DM don't get their headline.
If you can't see you don't drive for a living, if your pro-life you don't work for Marie Stopes and if you can't handle certain foods you don't work in a supermarket.
I know they could have worked in the clothing department, but the tills in the food hall are different, why didn't they raise the matter when being trained on said tills and why not raise the matter when they were asked to work on said tills?
		
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Well you think wrongly. This policy isn't anti-christian anymore than it is pro Islam.


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

Hobbit said:



			"I'd like a job with M&S but I don't want work in certain areas of the store..." Since when did employees get allowed to be fussy? And before any of the PC boys jump up and down, it's got nowt to do with religious discrimination. If you take the job you should do ALL of the job, not twist your employer's arm up their back and tell them what you won't do.
		
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M&S have the policy that allows their employees not to partake in activities within their job role that they don't want to do for personal or religious reasons, not the other way around. The employees aren't being "fussy" they are making use of a policy within their rights as laid out in their terms of contract.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Well you think wrongly. This policy isn't anti-christian anymore than it is pro Islam.
		
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But as of yet the matter asn't arisen.
I stand my assertion, if the policy doesn't exist then there is no problem.
You don't make an integrated society by highlighting peoples differencies.
Just my opinion. :thup:


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			But as of yet the matter asn't arisen.
I stand my assertion, if the policy doesn't exist then there is no problem.
You don't make an integrated society by highlighting peoples differencies.
Just my opinion. :thup:
		
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it does help if you respect peoples differences though eh? 

A total non story that is being pushed by a right wing agenda. I'm sure that both parties are embarrassed that it's gone so far.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			it does help if you respect peoples differences though eh?
		
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Are you saying i don't.?

This isn't about peoples differences, its about religion, any religion not race or disability, and it has no place in the modern work environment.


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			But as of yet the matter asn't arisen.
I stand my assertion, if the policy doesn't exist then there is no problem.
You don't make an integrated society by highlighting peoples differencies.
Just my opinion. :thup:
		
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Perhaps it has arisen, but as it's not anti Muslim it's not deemed to be so newsworthy


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			Are you saying i don't.?

This isn't about peoples differences, its about religion, any religion not race or disability, and it has no place in the modern work environment.
		
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I'm saying that M&S respected the difference, but that a media agenda is highlighting the difference. And that it's up to the company in question as to whether they choose to respect religion in the workplace. If they change their policy then the staff will have a decision to make. They don't have to make that decision yet though do they?


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Perhaps it has arisen, but as it's not anti Muslim it's not deemed to be so newsworthy
		
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Perhaps, but like you i've never heard of an example, except for the BA employee who was forced to remove her crucifix, but that was a health and safety issue i believe.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			I'm saying that M&S respected the difference, but that a media agenda is highlighting the difference. And that it's up to the company in question as to whether they choose to respect religion in the workplace. If they change their policy then the staff will have a decision to make. They don't have to make that decision yet though do they?
		
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No they don't, and i appoligise for my aggresive tone. It wasn't intended that way.


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## woody69 (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			Perhaps, but like you i've never heard of an example, except for the BA employee who was forced to remove her crucifix, but that was a health and safety issue i believe. 

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Well there was this story. Notice the slightly different slant on the article - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ork-Sundays-mounts-fresh-legal-challenge.html

And this is the crucifix story about H&S - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ifix-row-nurse-loses-discrimination-case.html

But here is a different one and the employer didn't respect her beliefs and she won - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21025332 I wonder if we had a load of people around the country saying some of the things that have been raised in this thread?


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

blackpuddinmonster said:



			No they don't, and i appoligise for my aggresive tone. It wasn't intended that way. 

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Didn't read it as aggressive mate. I know you're posting style enough to know that you wouldn't do that. :thup:


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## Hacker Khan (Dec 23, 2013)

Durango said:



			Hacker Khan- just out of interest, do you believe in the tooth fairy?... 

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No, but I believe the vast majority of Muslims in this country are here to work and try and better themselves.  And the constant scare stories by my favourite paper that paint Muslims as people who want Sharia law as the standard in the UK, hate preachers and potential, if not actual terrorists, is not doing the country much good.  

I am sure that there are a very small number of Muslims who basically hate the west and want to do it harm, and to those I say bugger off then. Just as there are a very small proportion of white Britains who want a purely white British society.  But I know they do not speak for me, as hate preachers do not speak for the vast majority of Muslims.  Every Muslim I have come across is a decent hard working person, despite what certain papers would have you believe. And this constant attempt at inflaming the situation by certain sections of the media will only push more of them further against the west.  Which will only end in tears.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Well there was this story. Notice the slightly different slant on the article - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ork-Sundays-mounts-fresh-legal-challenge.html

And this is the crucifix story about H&S - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ifix-row-nurse-loses-discrimination-case.html

But here is a different one and the employer didn't respect her beliefs and she won - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21025332 I wonder if we had a load of people around the country saying some of the things that have been raised in this thread?
		
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The problem is that a lot of people make the mistake of associating religion with race, hence some of the more extreme posts on this thread.
Thats the problem i have with these sorts of work place policies. All they do is fuel the fire of ignorence.
As you may have guessed, i'am totally anti religion of any sorts(except Bury FC of course), so i have trouble understanding why anyone would choose to work in an enviroment that would bring them into conflict with any beliefs they may hold, and when you get companies trying to accomodate these conflicts your bound to get trouble. You can't please everyone. The BA story is a prime example of this.
I work for a company were except for wedding bands, all jewelry is barred, end of, no exceptions. We also work shifts and again everyone must adhere to this policy. If its your turn to work Saturday or Sunday its your turn simples.
Basically, these are the rules, your beliefs are your buisness so please keep them at home, this is work.
I think we would all get on much better if this was the case everywhere.
Keep the workplace secular. :thup:
Should i get a t-shirt..:mmm:


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

This  issue was probably due to a mistake in applying correct policy at the store but it does not distract from the situation where a Muslim employee didn't want to handle pork or alcohol.   This type of issue is becoming a growing problem in the 'Multi Cultural' society that was hoisted on us by the Political Elite.   None of us were asked if we wanted to live in such a society, it was what they decided we needed.

Should it be acceptable for a Vegan to decide not to handle animal products in a Supermarket, a Christian Halal and so forth?   These type of issues have never been a problem in the past so why now?  I guess our enlightened members will say its a 'Storm in a tea cup'   In my opinion (which I am sure I am no longer entitled to) its inverted discrimination.

Happy Holidays.


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## blackpuddinmonster (Dec 23, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			Didn't read it as aggressive mate. I know you're posting style enough to know that you wouldn't do that. :thup:
		
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Phew...cheers :thup:


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## DAVEYBOY (Dec 23, 2013)

I'm not even getting involved in this one &#128545;


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## User20205 (Dec 23, 2013)

DAVEYBOY said:



			I'm not even getting involved in this one &#128545;
		
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please do Davey, I remember you views were quite interesting last time a similar subject came up :thup:

I don't understand why people are upset. Unless you are at the front of the queue, and get refused service or the direct manager of the cashier, who would have to make allowance, why are you upset/offended ???


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			I don't understand why people are upset. Unless you are at the front of the queue, and get refused service or the direct manager of the cashier, who would have to make allowance, why are you upset/offended ???

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Because we are a nation of the professionally offended mate. And if we can't find something to be offended by, then we'll have a damn good go at making something up...


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

therod said:



			please do Davey, I remember you views were quite interesting last time a similar subject came up :thup:

I don't understand why people are upset. Unless you are at the front of the queue, and get refused service or the direct manager of the cashier, who would have to make allowance, why are you upset/offended ???

Click to expand...

Theres a difference between being upset/offended and just fed up with stupidity creeping into society.


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 23, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			Theres a difference between being upset/offended and just fed up with stupidity creeping into society.
		
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Agreed. It's the same with Health & safety. People lack common sense these days


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 23, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Maybe they did question it? Maybe the manager said, don't worry if that happens let us know and we'll get someone else to serve them, so ask them to go to another till. But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of a good old xenophobic, anti-Islamic media spouted BS article designed to inflame and create division.

And it isn't about offending her sensibilities. It's about respecting her beliefs. I'm an Atheist and personally think religion is outdated and unnecessary in today's world, but if someone else wants to believe in a flying spaghetti monster and refuse to serve pasta because their religious book decrees it, then so be it. I'll respect that and M&S rightfully do that, but in this instance they put her in a situation they shouldn't have and now you have this pointless story and straw man arguments popping up all over the place because a manager misinterpreted the policy. It's laughable.
		
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If the employee believes so strongly that on religious grounds they shouldn't handle pork and alcohol, then how do they reconcile themselves with the fact that their wages are paid by a company that makes no small amount of profit from pork and alcohol, thus making the profits to pay the said employee.  Or do beliefs conveniently go out of the window on payday?

I find it hard to believe that the employee couldn't sort the issue out behind closed doors with a manager that knows them they could raise the matter with complete strangers in full public view.


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## JustOne (Dec 23, 2013)

M&S have changed their mind...




			Customers at Marks and Spencer will not be refused alcohol or pork by Muslim staff after the store reacted to a massive backlash by customers.
Thousands of shoppers threatened to boycott the retailer after Marks and Spencer said it would allow Muslim staff to refuse to sell pork and alcohol because it was against their religious beliefs.
But now Marks and Spencer has apologised and said that *Muslim staff who did not want to handle these products would not man tills and would work in other roles* such as in clothing or in the bakery.
		
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...4/MandS-apology-over-Muslim-staff-policy.html


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## Big_Rick78 (Dec 23, 2013)

So when a Christian tells them they cant work on a sunday as its their holy day will they be let off? I highly doubt it.


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## palindromicbob (Dec 23, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			This  issue was probably due to a mistake in applying correct policy at the store but it does not distract from the situation where a Muslim employee didn't want to handle pork or alcohol.   This type of issue is becoming a growing problem in the 'Multi Cultural' society that was hoisted on us by the Political Elite.   None of us were asked if we wanted to live in such a society, it was what they decided we needed.

Should it be acceptable for a Vegan to decide not to handle animal products in a Supermarket, a Christian Halal and so forth?   These type of issues have never been a problem in the past so why now?  I guess our enlightened members will say its a 'Storm in a tea cup'   In my opinion (which I am sure I am no longer entitled to) its inverted discrimination.

Happy Holidays.
		
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Yes it should be acceptable for a Vegan to decide not to handle animal products. As long as they make this requirement clear prior to accepting the job and signing the contract. 

I see no reason why a Christian would refuse to handle Halal on religious grounds. I could see them refusing to handle alcohol though (Free Presbyterian for example). Again if made clear prior to contract being agreed and signed. 

This case they didn't need specifications in the contract because the policies and procedures in place at M&S would have covered this. 

Then again if a company can not reasonably implement the requirements into a contract or policy then they should not be labelled as discriminatory.  

This case forgets the countless who are deeply religious but not so fundamental as to refuse to handle the products although they will refuse to consume them.


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

palindromicbob said:



			Yes it should be acceptable for a Vegan to decide not to handle animal products. As long as they make this requirement clear prior to accepting the job and signing the contract. 

I see no reason why a Christian would refuse to handle Halal on religious grounds. I could see them refusing to handle alcohol though (Free Presbyterian for example). Again if made clear prior to contract being agreed and signed. 

This case they didn't need specifications in the contract because the policies and procedures in place at M&S would have covered this. 

Then again if a company can not reasonably implement the requirements into a contract or policy then they should not be labelled as discriminatory.  

This case forgets the countless who are deeply religious but not so fundamental as to refuse to handle the products although they will refuse to consume them.
		
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Maybe to make sure no one is offended then it would be better to sack them all and have a robotic checkout system.


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## garyinderry (Dec 23, 2013)

it should never have got that far.  It should have been brought up before the shift started. 

I know plenty that would have said, ''never worry my dear, ill run it through the scanner here, you bring it up with your manager in an hours time when you are on your break''.   

Problem solved! :thup:


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## palindromicbob (Dec 23, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			Maybe to make sure no one is offended then it would be better to sack them all and have a robotic checkout system.
		
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Ahh but even they refuse to sell you alcohol until a person comes along and confirms your age.


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

palindromicbob said:



			Ahh but even they refuse to sell you alcohol until a person comes along and confirms your age.
		
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So you need to take your Mum with you now?


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## Durango (Dec 23, 2013)

Having thought about this for a few hours it would surely be simpler to just have a total ban on alcohol and pork produce in this country.  Oh.. and no women outside in daylight hours.

Oops nearly forgot


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## palindromicbob (Dec 23, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			So you need to take your Mum with you now?
		
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Nah, my fake ID works just fine.


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## vkurup (Dec 23, 2013)

When the Saturday underage kids at the Morrisons till can't sell me my alcohol, they just get another colleague to run it thru.  Have never been hassled by it., maybe they just do the same with anyone who can't serve these things.


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## stevelev (Dec 23, 2013)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Maybe M&S will have 'No Alcohol, No Pork' tills.  But what about chocolate liqueurs, bacon crisps, sherry trifle - indeed any food that includes alcohol or pork as an ingredient.  This seems to me to be a re rather unconscionable demand that M&S have given in to in a bit of PC pandering.  It's just daft - as most muslims will agree.
		
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Or anything with Gelatin in, no jelly babies, not many sweets, no gum, bet the staff member has served that in the past


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## JCW (Dec 23, 2013)

What can I say , PC gone mad ?   If we are not careful we could have people just using this sort of thing to not do any work , every work place have guys doing their level best to do little or no work now ...................you should be told what you are expected to do and do it if not get find another job


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

JCW said:



			What can I say , PC gone mad ?   If we are not careful we could have people just using this sort of thing to not do any work , every work place have guys doing their level best to do little or no work now ...................you should be told what you are expected to do and do it if not get find another job
		
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You keep forgetting the EYG at the end of your posts...


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## Vice (Dec 23, 2013)

What next? Christians at B&Q refusing to sell nails and wood?



JCW said:



			What can I say , PC gone mad ?   If we are not careful we could have people just using this sort of thing to not do any work , every work place have guys doing their level best to do little or no work now ...................you should be told what you are expected to do and do it if not get find another job
		
Click to expand...


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

JCW said:



			What can I say , PC gone mad ?   If we are not careful we could have people just using this sort of thing to not do any work , every work place have guys doing their level best to do little or no work now ...................you should be told what you are expected to do and do it if not get find another job
		
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That is the policy in most workplaces. M&S have decided to do something different. That is their decision, not yours, or mine, or anyone elses.


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## palindromicbob (Dec 23, 2013)

stevelev said:



			Or anything with Gelatin in, no jelly babies, not many sweets, no gum, bet the staff member has served that in the past
		
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Hehe the Percy Pigs would be a double whammy. Unless it's the Veggie ones with greens ears.


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## SocketRocket (Dec 23, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			You keep forgetting the EYG at the end of your posts...

Click to expand...

Enjoy Your Gin.   If you can get it.


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			Enjoy Your Gin.   If you can get it.
		
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I shall be Enjoying My Whisky from tomorrow afternoon. The Gin can wait till early Christmas Day...:thup:


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## JCW (Dec 23, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			You keep forgetting the EYG at the end of your posts...

Click to expand...


It best to say nothing so you don't offend , I don't tell you what to write or do I comment if you have your own style , that's your thing ,  I used to win lots of matches in golf , just because others don't like it , don't mean I have to change my style to suit them ........................just for  you  .............ENJOY YOUR GOLF >>>>>>> EYG  y:fore:


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## bluewolf (Dec 23, 2013)

JCW said:



			It best to say nothing so you don't offend , I don't tell you what to write or do I comment if you have your own style , that's your thing ,  I used to win lots of matches in golf , just because others don't like it , don't mean I have to change my style to suit them ........................just for  you  .............ENJOY YOUR GOLF >>>>>>> EYG  y:fore:  

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Oooommphh... Thats told me then.... It never bothered me. I just wanted you to keep it to annoy the curmudgeonly whingers who moaned about it...:thup:


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## Liverbirdie (Dec 24, 2013)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Maybe M&S will have 'No Alcohol, No Pork' tills.  But what about chocolate liqueurs, bacon crisps, sherry trifle - indeed any food that includes alcohol or pork as an ingredient.  This seems to me to be a re rather unconscionable demand that M&S have given in to in a bit of PC pandering.  It's just daft - as most muslims will agree.
		
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I think I'd go in this lane, it may help with my diet.......


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## doublebogey7 (Dec 24, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



			I've worked in Saudi a few times. Try going there and expressing any kind of 'rights.'
		
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So two wrongs do make a right then,  must tell mum!


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## Sharktooth (Dec 24, 2013)

doublebogey7 said:



			So two wrongs do make a right then,  must tell mum!
		
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No, because there you have no rights


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## USER1999 (Dec 24, 2013)

But no one on the til is handling pork, or pork based products. Every thing is shrink wrapped, so all they are handling is plastic. Ditto for alcohol, it's just glass and cans.

I can understand it if the job involves getting contaminated hands, but not if it's just packaging.


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## Sharktooth (Dec 24, 2013)

I worked on an Texas owned drilling platform a few years ago and the dive team were mainly Muslim Malay. Anyhoo,  they had bacon in the mess for breakfast and I sat down  with it at the table with my colleagues, but apologised to them if I caused offence. The reply was an overwhelming "no offence mate, in fact we are allowed to eat pork in times of emergency." Some of the biggest beer monsters I know are Singaporean Muslim Divers.

My original post was, what is going on in the UK?


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## doublebogey7 (Dec 24, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



			No, because there you have no rights
		
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So what exactly was your point?


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## Sharktooth (Dec 24, 2013)

doublebogey7 said:



			So what exactly was your point?
		
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*exactly* the point of explaining the differences in cultures, history, working conditions in all the continents and races I have worked in and lived in and accepted without spitting the dummy, would take up rather a few more sentences than could possibly be allowed on this forum. P.s I could do it in four languages.


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## woody69 (Dec 24, 2013)

Blue in Munich said:



			If the employee believes so strongly that on religious grounds they shouldn't handle pork and alcohol, then how do they reconcile themselves with the fact that their wages are paid by a company that makes no small amount of profit from pork and alcohol, thus making the profits to pay the said employee.  Or do beliefs conveniently go out of the window on payday?

I find it hard to believe that the employee couldn't sort the issue out behind closed doors with a manager that knows them they could raise the matter with complete strangers in full public view.
		
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What are you talking about? It is nothing to do with making money from the sale of these items? Muslims don't handle pork because they believe it to be unclean. They understand that as animals, pigs they have a purpose as scavengers and cleaning up muck, but they don't want to touch it. Again with alcohol it is all about the negatives it brings over any potential benefits and they don't want to be seen encouraging others to consume it, which is why some (not all) Muslims decide not to help sell it. It's not about refusing to work for a company simply because they sell it and get a pay cheque, so forget their "beliefs".

And regarding your other point, as has been stated many times the manager was fully aware of the employees beliefs, but because they misunderstood the policy they told the employee to just ask the customer to go to another till, which is where this complete non-story has come from.


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## woody69 (Dec 24, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



*exactly* the point of explaining the differences in cultures, history, working conditions in all the continents and races I have worked in and lived in and accepted without spitting the dummy, would take up rather a few more sentences than could possibly be allowed on this forum. P.s I could do it in four languages.
		
Click to expand...

Just because you decide to live in another culture, it doesn't mean you should be forced to drop your own beliefs and traditions. If I lived in another country, I would still want to get a Christmas tree and celebrate Christmas (as an atheist!) even if the country I lived in didn't have that. 

You talk about "not spitting the dummy", but I'd be interested to hear if you actually have any deep seated religious or personal beliefs that you were happy to let slide because you were in a different country. I would hazard a guess that you don't have any at all.


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## Pin-seeker (Dec 24, 2013)

woody69 said:



			What are you talking about? It is nothing to do with making money from the sale of these items? Muslims don't handle pork because they believe it to be unclean. They understand that as animals, pigs they have a purpose as scavengers and cleaning up muck, but they don't want to touch it. Again with alcohol it is all about the negatives it brings over any potential benefits and they don't want to be seen encouraging others to consume it, which is why some (not all) Muslims decide not to help sell it. It's not about refusing to work for a company simply because they sell it and get a pay cheque, so forget their "beliefs".

And regarding your other point, as has been stated many times the manager was fully aware of the employees beliefs, but because they misunderstood the policy they told the employee to just ask the customer to go to another till, which is where this complete non-story has come from.
		
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But they do know the Pork is in airtight packaging don't they?


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## Sharktooth (Dec 24, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Just because you decide to live in another culture, it doesn't mean you should be forced to drop your own beliefs and traditions. If I lived in another country, I would still want to get a Christmas tree and celebrate Christmas (as an atheist!) even if the country I lived in didn't have that. 

You talk about "not spitting the dummy", but I'd be interested to hear if you actually have any deep seated religious or personal beliefs that you were happy to let slide because you were in a different country. I would hazard a guess that you don't have any at all.
		
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Entirely correct, I have zero deep seated religious beliefs after being dragged through a Christian upbringing in Scotland. My personal beliefs however... who are you to judge me?


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 24, 2013)

woody69 said:



			What are you talking about? It is nothing to do with making money from the sale of these items? Muslims don't handle pork because they believe it to be unclean. They understand that as animals, pigs they have a purpose as scavengers and cleaning up muck, but they don't want to touch it. Again with alcohol it is all about the negatives it brings over any potential benefits and they don't want to be seen encouraging others to consume it, which is why some (not all) Muslims decide not to help sell it. It's not about refusing to work for a company simply because they sell it and get a pay cheque, so forget their "beliefs".

And regarding your other point, as has been stated many times the manager was fully aware of the employees beliefs, but because they misunderstood the policy they told the employee to just ask the customer to go to another till, which is where this complete non-story has come from.
		
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So, they're not happy to handle to pork or the alcohol (not that they are, as murphthemog said, they are handling shrink wrap or glass or tin cans) but they are happy to handle the cash that these unclean products produce.  That doesn't sound like much of a belief to me, sounds very much closer to double standards.  And how are they encouraging anyone to consume alcohol?  Customer enters store of own free will, customer chooses to purchase alcohol of own free will, customer attempts to pay for said alcohol, customer is prevented by employee from buying the alcohol.  That is not a case of not encouraging someone to buy alcohol, this is clearly a case of imposing your religious beliefs on someone else regardless of their point of view, and that is why this has become a story.  

I really am not bothered what religion people choose to follow, if any.  I am quite happy to respect their religious views within reason.  I am bothered when they try to impose their religious beliefs on my lifestyle, and as far as I am concerned, refusing to sell me a product that I am quite entitled to buy when they are employed to sell that product to me is overstepping the mark.


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 24, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Just because you decide to live in another culture, it doesn't mean you should be forced to drop your own beliefs and traditions. If I lived in another country, I would still want to get a Christmas tree and celebrate Christmas (as an atheist!) even if the country I lived in didn't have that. 

You talk about "not spitting the dummy", but I'd be interested to hear if you actually have any deep seated religious or personal beliefs that you were happy to let slide because you were in a different country. I would hazard a guess that you don't have any at all.
		
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No you shouldn't be forced to drop your own beliefs and traditions, but by the same token just because the country you leave in allows you the freedom to practice them doesn't mean you have the right to impose your beliefs and traditions on everybody else.


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## doublebogey7 (Dec 24, 2013)

Sharktooth said:



*exactly* the point of explaining the differences in cultures, history, working conditions in all the continents and races I have worked in and lived in and accepted without spitting the dummy, would take up rather a few more sentences than could possibly be allowed on this forum. P.s I could do it in four languages.
		
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But it is the DT, DM and the likes of yourself who are splitting the dummy out over a policy of a private company, I here no complaining from anyone else.


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## woody69 (Dec 24, 2013)

Pin-seeker said:



			But they do know the Pork is in airtight packaging don't they?
		
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Airtight packaging from a factory/abattoir that slaughters pigs. But what does it matter anyway? They don't want to handle pork, why should that be a problem for anyone? 



Sharktooth said:



			Entirely correct, I have zero deep seated religious beliefs after being dragged through a Christian upbringing in Scotland. My personal beliefs however... who are you to judge me?
		
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Not sure I was judging you or where you got that assertion from. I was merely trying to highlight that perhaps as you have nothing you can compare such a deep seated belief to, that maybe you're not in the best position to judge someone who does. It's not just about sucking it up and getting on with it for them.



Blue in Munich said:



			So, they're not happy to handle to pork or the alcohol (not that they are, as murphthemog said, they are handling shrink wrap or glass or tin cans) but they are happy to handle the cash that these unclean products produce.  That doesn't sound like much of a belief to me, sounds very much closer to double standards.  And how are they encouraging anyone to consume alcohol?  Customer enters store of own free will, customer chooses to purchase alcohol of own free will, customer attempts to pay for said alcohol, customer is prevented by employee from buying the alcohol.  That is not a case of not encouraging someone to buy alcohol, this is clearly a case of imposing your religious beliefs on someone else regardless of their point of view, and that is why this has become a story.  

I really am not bothered what religion people choose to follow, if any.  I am quite happy to respect their religious views within reason.  I am bothered when they try to impose their religious beliefs on my lifestyle, and as far as I am concerned, refusing to sell me a product that I am quite entitled to buy when they are employed to sell that product to me is overstepping the mark.
		
Click to expand...




Blue in Munich said:



			No you shouldn't be forced to drop your own beliefs and traditions, but by the same token just because the country you leave in allows you the freedom to practice them doesn't mean you have the right to impose your beliefs and traditions on everybody else.
		
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Can I suggest you take a bit of time and do a little bit of reading on the subject to expand your mind, because you simply don't understand it. The employee wasn't trying to impose their religious beliefs on the customers. For Muslims, when something is made haraam, this means that thing is harmful to oneâ€™s health and contribution to the community. That also means Muslims arenâ€™t supposed to encourage others to consume in any haraam, irrespective of who they are. Dealing with the alcohol trade comes under the haraam category. The Prophet Muhammad forbade people from all actions related to the wine industry, including pressing wine, drinking it, serving it, selling it or buying it. This severity is to stop the expansion of harm caused by alcohol. So because the manager put the employee in a situation where they would be potentially selling alcohol, they refused and good for them.


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## Vice (Dec 24, 2013)

It's pretty simple.. If they don't want to handle pork or liquor, don't work in a store that sells pork or liquor. If she's so religious why is she working? Why is she leaving the house without being accompanied by man. 

Australia and France at least have the balls to stand against this nonsense, ban the hijab, if they want to live here, follow our rules.


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## doublebogey7 (Dec 24, 2013)

Vice said:



			It's pretty simple.. If they don't want to handle pork or liquor, don't work in a store that sells pork or liquor. If she's so religious why is she working? Why is she leaving the house without being accompanied by man. 

Australia and France at least have the balls to stand against this nonsense, ban the hijab, if they want to live here, follow our rules.
		
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But wasn't this lady following instructions given to her by her manager.  

Why would we want to ban the Hijab,  young boys have been wearing the balaclava for years.


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## Blue in Munich (Dec 24, 2013)

woody69 said:



			Airtight packaging from a factory/abattoir that slaughters pigs. But what does it matter anyway? They don't want to handle pork, why should that be a problem for anyone? 



Not sure I was judging you or where you got that assertion from. I was merely trying to highlight that perhaps as you have nothing you can compare such a deep seated belief to, that maybe you're not in the best position to judge someone who does. It's not just about sucking it up and getting on with it for them.






Can I suggest you take a bit of time and do a little bit of reading on the subject to expand your mind, because you simply don't understand it. The employee wasn't trying to impose their religious beliefs on the customers. For Muslims, when something is made haraam, this means that thing is harmful to oneâ€™s health and contribution to the community. *That also means Muslims arenâ€™t supposed to encourage others to consume in any haraam, irrespective of who they are. Dealing with the alcohol trade comes under the haraam category. The Prophet Muhammad forbade people from all actions related to the wine industry, including pressing wine, drinking it, serving it, selling it or buying it. This severity is to stop the expansion of harm caused by alcohol. So because the manager put the employee in a situation where they would be potentially selling alcohol, they refused and good for them.*

Click to expand...

So Muslims not encouraging other people not to indulge in what they consider to be _haraam_, regardless of the other party's view, is not Muslims forcing their religious beliefs on others?

If dealing with the alcohol trade is _haraam_ then how is working for a firm that should have the licencee's named over the door as per the Licensing Act, compatable with their religious beliefs?  You are working for a company that makes a not inconsiderable profit from something your religion considers harmful to people's health and taking your wages from that company, directly or indirectly from the money they make from a _haraam_ product. And there's absolutely no double standards in that whatsoever?  

Are you sure it's me that needs to expand my mind?  Merry Christmas.


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## Vice (Dec 24, 2013)

I'm pointing out that both France and Australia have (or at least put it forward), and that it sends a clear message. That nonsense like this won't be tolerated.



doublebogey7 said:



			But wasn't this lady following instructions given to her by her manager.  

Why would we want to ban the Hijab,  young boys have been wearing the balaclava for years.
		
Click to expand...


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## doublebogey7 (Dec 24, 2013)

Vice said:



			I'm pointing out that both France and Australia have (or at least put it forward), and that it sends a clear message. That nonsense like this won't be tolerated.
		
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Please explain what you mean by "nonsense like this"


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## MegaSteve (Dec 24, 2013)

The vast majority that come to these shores are perfectly happy to adapt to 'our values'... We should not, in any way, be having to pander to the few that have no wish to do so... Plenty of means available to them to leave....


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## Slime (Dec 24, 2013)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Is that not a bit like Catholics selling condoms.
I don't have a problem with it and respect the decision of the individual and the store.
		
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I think it's ridiculous. If someone gets a job they should be happy to do all of it, not just the bits they want to.



woody69 said:



			This really is a complete non story getting far too much air time than it deserves. 

I applaud M&S for having a policy that provides employees with a choice where it comes to their religious or personal beliefs, but the store in question screwed up and put her in situation. I suspect the cashier was more embarrassed than the customer. A mistake was made, but it's hardly the end of the world.

The world isn't ending, the country isn't going to the dogs and it's nothing to do with the PC brigade gone mad. I'm astounded that I'm still surprised by the complete over reaction of people to stories like this.
		
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I didn't realise it was all M&S's fault .



therod said:



			Always one 

Click to expand...

Make that two.


*Slime*.


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## hovis (Dec 24, 2013)

dont want to handle pork or alcohol (through sealed containers) ?  no problem we'll cater for that!!!!!P45 and sling your hook!


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## SocketRocket (Dec 24, 2013)

I guess the reason these people came here was that it's better than their previous countries.   Was it these outdated practices that made those countries worse than ours to live in?

Happy Holidays.


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## User20205 (Dec 24, 2013)

SocketRocket said:



			I guess the reason these people came here was that it's better than their previous countries.   Was it these outdated practices that made those countries worse than ours to live in?

Happy Holidays.
		
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Where did she come from to this utopia of free speech, free choice and free thinking ?? I didn't catch that in the article.

She should be grateful we let her serve us our pork based products 

Happy winter festival !!


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## upsidedown (Dec 24, 2013)

therod said:



			Where did she come from to this utopia of free speech, free choice and free thinking ?? I didn't catch that in the article.

She should be grateful we let her serve us our pork based products 

Happy winter festival !!

Click to expand...

Perhaps she was born here ?


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## User20205 (Dec 24, 2013)

upsidedown said:



			Perhaps she was born here ?
		
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Outrage! They're breeding!!(It's probably a safe bet, my sarcasm was too subtle.....must try harder!!):thup:


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## Liverpoolphil (Dec 24, 2013)

Can someone sum up the 11 pages please ?


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## palindromicbob (Dec 24, 2013)

therod said:



			Outrage! They're breeding!!(It's probably a safe bet, my sarcasm was too subtle.....must try harder!!):thup:
		
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It would seem that some people are confusing Religion (an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence) and Nationality (the legal relationship between a person and a nation state).


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## palindromicbob (Dec 24, 2013)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Can someone sum up the 11 pages please ?
		
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Apparently the latest Islamic jihad is a form of reverse psychology in which they begin by denying people access to pork products and alcohol. 

The goal is the hope that this will lead to massive increase in consumption due to the defiance. Ultimately this will result in mass infidel deaths related to heart attacks and liver disease. All those remaining will be too fat or drunk to fight and the take over shall be quick and easy. 

Unless I'm confused and this thread is actually about something that shouldn't be news but has ended up highlighting the increasing ignorance and bigotry that is present in our society. Ironically this is something that many people criticise "their countries" for having.


HAPPY KWANZA!


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## Liverpoolphil (Dec 24, 2013)

Anything a bit simpler ?

It appears that some won't sell alcohol and pork but were put in the position that it ended up happening 

So I would say that the company messed up by putting those people with those beliefs into a situation that they were uncomfortable with 

But I would also say it's not right that people apply for jobs and then won't do that job fully because it goes against beliefs - if that's the case then don't apply for the job


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## Slime (Dec 24, 2013)

palindromicbob said:



			HAPPY CHRISTMAS!
		
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Fixed that for you ............................. on the basis that this is Christmas and that this is England/GB/UK/British Isles, however you wish to call it.


*Slime*.

P.S. I'm not an African-American, in case you were wondering.


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## User20205 (Dec 24, 2013)

palindromicbob said:



			Apparently the latest Islamic jihad is a form of reverse psychology in which they begin by denying people access to pork products and alcohol. 

The goal is the hope that this will lead to massive increase in consumption due to the defiance. Ultimately this will result in mass infidel deaths related to heart attacks and liver disease. All those remaining will be too fat or drunk to fight and the take over shall be quick and easy. 

Unless I'm confused and this thread is actually about something that shouldn't be news but has ended up highlighting the increasing ignorance and bigotry that is present in our society. Ironically this is something that many people criticise "their countries" for having.


HAPPY KWANZA!
		
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Amen brother :thup:


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## palindromicbob (Dec 24, 2013)

Anyone else see the comedy that a story about refusing to handle pork due to religious reasons is in a shop that was part founded by a Jew?


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## Tashyboy (Dec 24, 2013)

Read about this on the bbc news website which also had a comments section similar to this.

A woman commented that she was lactose intolerant and could not drink milk but could touch a bottle of milk. In essence some Muslims don't allow alcohol to TOUCH there skin and this was in a bottle. 

Am all for respecting people's views but this is just pathetic.

UKIP must be laughing there heads off.


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## rosecott (Dec 24, 2013)

Tashyboy said:



			Read about this on the bbc news website which also had a comments section similar to this.

A woman commented that she was lactose intolerant and could not drink milk but could touch a bottle of milk. In essence some Muslims don't allow alcohol to TOUCH there skin and this was in a bottle. 

Am all for respecting people's views but this is just pathetic.

UKIP must be laughing there heads off.
		
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Where have you been all year while we were having sensible discussions?


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## Tashyboy (Dec 24, 2013)

rosecott said:



			Where have you been all year while we were having sensible discussions?
		
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Join date Dec 2013 does that answer your question


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## rosecott (Dec 24, 2013)

Tashyboy said:



			Join date Dec 2013 does that answer your question
		
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Oh yes.


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## Slime (Dec 24, 2013)

Tashyboy said:



			Join date Dec 2013 does that answer your question
		
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Quality. :rofl::rofl::rofl:


*Slime*.


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## Hacker Khan (Dec 24, 2013)

Tashyboy said:



			Read about this on the bbc news website which also had a comments section similar to this.

A woman commented that she was lactose intolerant and could not drink milk but could touch a bottle of milk. In essence some Muslims don't allow alcohol to TOUCH there skin and this was in a bottle. 

Am all for respecting people's views but this is just pathetic.

UKIP must be laughing there heads off.
		
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Oh yes we are.....


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