# 6 Nations 2020



## GB72 (Jan 23, 2020)

Nearly time for my favourite sporting tournament to start again and it is already interesting. 

England seem to have forgotten to pick a number 8 or that Exeter have any decent players plus a number of the squad have to face their team mates having been branded cheats. 

Depending on what report you read, Finn Russell seems to have stomped out of the Scotland camp and is not playing in the tournament. 

Ireland and Wales have first outings under new managers.

At least we can rely on the Italians for the wooden spoon (maybe).


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## User62651 (Jan 23, 2020)

6N has come too soon after the world cup - that was the big one that 'got away' - too recently for 6N to matter. 

Is Finn Russell a bit of a diva - does he have form for this kind of thing? Of all the players Scotland could ill afford to lose, they lose their best one.


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## Doon frae Troon (Jan 24, 2020)

Drinking in camp and missed a training session according to SRU...…..might also be a bit of afters from the England draw when Finn seemed to defy Townsend's orders and played how he wanted to in the second half.
 Clash of two egos and Scotland loses out, Well done lads.
Mind you, no man is bigger than the team and Hastings is not a bad replacement, sometimes these things can gel a team.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jan 24, 2020)

Doon frae Troon said:



			Drinking in camp and missed a training session according to SRU...…..might also be a bit of afters from the England draw when Finn seemed to defy Townsend's orders and played how he wanted to in the second half.
Clash of two egos and Scotland loses out, Well done lads.
Mind you, no man is bigger than the team and Hastings is not a bad replacement, sometimes these things can gel a team.
		
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We have history in this sort of stuff.  Willie Johnston springs to mind - maybe not our best player in the 1978 World Cup squad but a heck of a player - and had he not been sent home after the Peru game Scotland would probably have won the damn thing...


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## IanM (Jan 24, 2020)

Two months of the year when my neighbours lose all sense of reality!      I used to enjoy the 6 Nations, now it's too much like hard work!


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## GB72 (Feb 1, 2020)

Scotland lost that rather than Ireland winning. Hard to tell about the Welsh, clinical but Italy poor again


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## Old Skier (Feb 1, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Scotland lost that rather than Ireland winning. Hard to tell about the Welsh, clinical but Italy poor again
		
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Being Welsh I worry about our pack but the way Scotland showed how they can throw away a win and Ireland were poor we might get away with it.


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 1, 2020)

Ireland got it done but not convincing. Would it be different had Hogg not had that howler

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/rugby-union/51344633


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## Doon frae Troon (Feb 2, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Ireland got it done but not convincing. Would it be different had Hogg not had that howler

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/rugby-union/51344633

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Best Scottish performance since that disappointing draw at Twickenham.
Played with vigour but och those wee mistakes


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 2, 2020)

Jeez - ah well nothing new there yesterday...😣


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## PieMan (Feb 2, 2020)

So yesterday saw Italy's 23rd consecutive loss in the 6N, a run stretching back to 2015 I believe - surely getting to the stage where their continued inclusion cannot be justified?


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2020)

The worst thing about Hoggs mistakes was he knew that he had dropped the ball yet he wheeled away in celebration , that’s pretty poor and on the levels of what footballers do - I’m sure he was the one that also took a dive and was given a bollocking from Owens with him even stating “this is not soccer “


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## JamesR (Feb 2, 2020)

Ben Youngs has to be retired soon


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## PieMan (Feb 2, 2020)

England shambolic at the moment - perhaps not all doom and gloom for Italy.......!! 😡😭

France with their tails up going to be difficult to beat today. Hopefully they'll implode at in the second half!!


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## AmandaJR (Feb 2, 2020)

Looks like the dip in form is more than just the world cup final...frustrating to watch.


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## Piece (Feb 2, 2020)

Second half step up needed...


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## User62651 (Feb 2, 2020)

AmandaJR said:



			Looks like the dip in form is more than just the world cup final...frustrating to watch.
		
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World Cup hangover? Losing a final can last a long time mentally.
Time yet of course but without Tuilagi, doubly hard.
Think this one has gone.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 2, 2020)

What sport is Six Nations....association, fifteens, or thirteens?


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## fundy (Feb 2, 2020)

Far more to it than just losing a world cup final hangover for me, the constant soundbites that the Saracens situ wouldnt affect anything, yeah of course nothing would change lol, no none of the resentment and friction would spill over!

Rugby wise, serious lack of ball carrying options and a confused backrow selection not helping (seems people only realise the value of the Vunipolas when theyre not playing!). Still think 9-10-12 not right either


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2020)

It’s poor from England - really poor , should have scored in the first minute and too many times trying to muscle their way through when they have multiple overlaps - really poor execution

A blind TMO doesn’t help as well

Ford Farrell axis not working at all


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## Stuart_C (Feb 2, 2020)

Liverpoolphil said:



			It’s poor from England - really poor , should have scored in the first minute and too many times trying to muscle their way through when they have multiple overlaps - really poor execution

A blind TMO doesn’t help as well

Ford Farrell axis not working at all
		
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Stick to hockey Phil.


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## User62651 (Feb 2, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			What sport is Six Nations....association, fifteens, or thirteens?
		
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Rugby Union, 15s .


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## Liverpoolphil (Feb 2, 2020)

Why is it not getting the cards out ? He has already warned the players


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## PieMan (Feb 2, 2020)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Why is it not getting the cards out ? He has already warned the players
		
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Sometimes it would be nice to go back to the good old days and let them throw a few punches to get it out of their system!!! 😉😂😂😂


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## fundy (Feb 2, 2020)

PieMan said:



			Sometimes it would be nice to go back to the good old days and let them throw a few punches to get it out of their system!!! 😉😂😂😂
		
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pretty sure Cowan Dickie wouldve taken a few sly digs in years gone by!


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## JamesR (Feb 2, 2020)

Is Sinkler still concussed?
Seems to have lacked any energy all day, scrums excepted.


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## PieMan (Feb 2, 2020)

Rubbish from England. Credit to the French for a fantastic first half display.


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## AmandaJR (Feb 2, 2020)

JamesR said:



			Is Sinkler still concussed?
Seems to have lacked any energy all day, scrums excepted.
		
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Every carry he just seemed to nose dive into the turf!


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## JamesR (Feb 2, 2020)

AmandaJR said:



			Every carry he just seemed to nose dive into the turf!
		
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Thank god Genge bought a bit of nasty into the pack!
Stuart has been good for Bath this season, so it’d be interesting to see how how would do if required at tighthead


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## Val (Feb 2, 2020)

Scotland mugged by Ireland imo, a few real key penalties conceded in Ireland's 22 which were debatable. That is definitely a game that got away. Gutted.


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## HomerJSimpson (Feb 2, 2020)

Honest assessment from Eddie Jones https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51350420


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## fundy (Feb 3, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Honest assessment from Eddie Jones https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51350420

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honest assessment? we were a bit slow out of the blocks? WALOFS

where was the absolute brutality he promised in the build up? should be a football manager the amount of bull**** he speaks.


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## fundy (Feb 3, 2020)

Val said:



			Scotland mugged by Ireland imo, a few real key penalties conceded in Ireland's 22 which were debatable. That is definitely a game that got away. Gutted.
		
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the only people who mugged Scotland Val were Scotland, Hogg at the front of the queue


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## Captainron (Feb 3, 2020)

England were terrible BUT they still stayed in the hunt with a couple of tries. It’s not all doom and gloom.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 3, 2020)

Val said:



			Scotland mugged by Ireland imo, a few real key penalties conceded in Ireland's 22 which were debatable. That is definitely a game that got away. Gutted.
		
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But every cloud...😊


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## GB72 (Feb 3, 2020)

England always seem to have a poor 6 Nations after the world cup. That said, this is where we should start planning for the next one. Few players needed putting out to pasture but we are sticking with the same old group. No excuse for not picking a recognised number 8 especially with a couple playing so well in the premiership. 

France already reaping the benefits of getting Sean Edwards on board. Defence so much stronger than it has been in previous years and stopped England getting any ball moving forward. 

As a I mentioned earlier, Scotland should have won that one, we will see how Farrell does going forward but not convinced that he was the right choice. 

Did not see much of the Wales match so cannot say whether that was a good Wales performance or a poor Italian one. On a similar subject, it really is time to reassess Italy's place in the tournament. No wins in years and no real signs of improvement after over a decade in the tournament. Maybe time to give another team a chance or put it back to 5 Nations to relieve some of the ever growing pressure on the players through the season.


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## MegaSteve (Feb 3, 2020)

France have nearly always had a great set of players... 
Just lacking in management/direction... 
They seem to have addressed that shortcoming...


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## SocketRocket (Feb 3, 2020)

What are lob kicks about?  They just seem an easy way to give away possession to me.


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## Robin Hood (Feb 3, 2020)

SocketRocket said:



			What are lob kicks about?  They just seem an easy way to give away possession to me.
		
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It's a risky tactic, trying to get the opposition to foul (eg knock-on)
Or to hopefully allow your forwards to get there first.
England didn't get any noticeable benefits from this. 
Very poor first half, but some positive signs in the second.
Keep the faith 😁🏉


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## SocketRocket (Feb 3, 2020)

Robin Hood said:



			It's a risky tactic, trying to get the opposition to foul (eg knock-on)
Or to hopefully allow your forwards to get there first.
England didn't get any noticeable benefits from this.
Very poor first half, but some positive signs in the second.
Keep the faith 😁🏉
		
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I rarely see an advantage from a lob kick, the ball is falling in the direction of the other side and away from your players, the fact that it travels a short distance makes it a rubbish decision to use.


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## Robin Hood (Feb 3, 2020)

SocketRocket said:



			I rarely see an advantage from a lob kick, the ball is falling in the direction of the other side and away from your players, the fact that it travels a short distance makes it a rubbish decision to use.
		
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It depends on the speed and tackling from the forwards.
South Africa were good at this in the World Cup.


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## JamesR (Feb 3, 2020)

When done well it’s a very effective tactic- working well for Saracens and SA.


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## SocketRocket (Feb 4, 2020)

JamesR said:



			When done well it’s a very effective tactic- working well for Saracens and SA.
		
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But in 90% of cases a give away ball.


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## GreiginFife (Feb 6, 2020)

Just passed Eddie Jones wandering along Princes Street in Edinburgh. Seemed to be just out for a sstroll think they are in the Balmoral.


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## Val (Feb 7, 2020)

GreiginFife said:



			Just passed Eddie Jones wandering along Princes Street in Edinburgh. Seemed to be just out for a sstroll think they are in the Balmoral.
		
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Always are, I met him in Italy last year, decent enough fella


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## Imurg (Feb 8, 2020)

Wales have been poor today...
Ireland have been good...


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## CliveW (Feb 8, 2020)

What is the rectangular thing in the back of the strips, between the shoulder blades?


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## Imurg (Feb 8, 2020)

CliveW said:



			What is the rectangular thing in the back of the strips, between the shoulder blades?
		
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That's where they plug the chargers in at half time...


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## upsidedown (Feb 8, 2020)

CliveW said:



			What is the rectangular thing in the back of the strips, between the shoulder blades?
		
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GPS for stats and player performance


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

I've just happened upon and started watching a replay of an England-Scotland match.

I can't sit through a round ball football game (association?), but this rugby is really quite entertaining.

Without being an expert, or more to the point, even having a clue, the game going on seems to be union rules, am I right?

I say that because it looks more like the local school games, but at a much higher skill level, obviously, than the few league games I've seen on television.

And yet looking at the men, I would get the impression that they're professeionals, not amateurs, and I thought league was the professional version.

The gentlemen on the pitch are quite robust, looking more in physique like American football players than round ball football players.

I am amazed at the vertical leaps the receiver make on the inbound, two-handed passes from the side. They get up as high as any seven foot basketball player.

I don't understand the penalties, and the placekicking is very wind bothered, it appears.  

The difference in size from an American football is quite obvious, but is it any different from a "league" ball?

I know these are stupid questions, but I wouldn't mind learning a little more about this game.

Maybe I can find a book or something.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

So far, a field goal from each side.

No touchdowns or tries or whatever it is when one carries the ball across the goal line.


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## Tashyboy (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			I've just happened upon and started watching a replay of an England-Scotland match.

I can't sit through a round ball football game (association?), but this rugby is really quite entertaining.

Without being an expert, or more to the point, even having a clue, the game going on seems to be union rules, am I right?

I say that because it looks more like the local school games, but at a much higher skill level, obviously, than the few league games I've seen on television.

And yet looking at the men, I would get the impression that they're professeionals, not amateurs, and I thought league was the professional version.

The gentlemen on the pitch are quite robust, looking more in physique like American football players than round ball football players.

I am amazed at the vertical leaps the receiver make on the inbound, two-handed passes from the side. They get up as high as any seven foot basketball player.

I don't understand the penalties, and the placekicking is very wind bothered, it appears. 

The difference in size from an American football is quite obvious, but is it any different from a "league" ball?

I know these are stupid questions, but I wouldn't mind learning a little more about this game.

Maybe I can find a book or something.
		
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the innocence is so refreshing. 😁👍


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## fundy (Feb 8, 2020)

Utterly horrendous conditions but even that not enough just how unadaptably dumb and repetitive Englands approach is here in the 2nd half! Plan B? What plan B lol

And still Scotland trying to gift it to us


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## Captainron (Feb 8, 2020)

This is such a bad game of rugby. Both teams are bereft of ideas.


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## Dando (Feb 8, 2020)

Nice that the Scots ignore “respect   The kicker”


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

England makes a touchdown!  Don't know what the hell is going on.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Feb 8, 2020)

Blame the weather, move on to the next game!


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

What does the oxygen symbol mean on the English shirts?


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## User62651 (Feb 8, 2020)

A respectable defeat, bad game but the bigger pack was going to tell.
Just wondering if Russell would've helped, probably not in a gale.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

I thought that they spelled it "Kolkata" now.
And why were they playing for an Indian cup?


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

Nobody is going to answer any of my questions, right?

I'll have to do some research on my google machine.


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## fundy (Feb 8, 2020)

pauldj42 said:



			Blame the weather, move on to the next game!
		
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Think this is an awful approach personally, think this is the sort of game where you learn most about your players, tactics and approach, their adaptability, who has the ability to think on their feet and influence a game (the answer being very few) rather than the perfect conditions games that go to plan (and not too many emerged with that much credit)

Likewise the coaches appeared to have no directive or plan B, no address to repeatedly kicking the ball out on the full and a change of tactics (couldve taken off Ford moved Farrell to 10 and brought on a ball carrier), run the ball, kicked more centrally, kicked shorter, kicked on the floor etc etc


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## SocketRocket (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			What does the oxygen symbol mean on the English shirts?
		
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Its a phone company O2 who sponsor England.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Feb 8, 2020)

fundy said:



			Think this is an awful approach personally, think this is the sort of game where you learn most about your players, tactics and approach, their adaptability, who has the ability to think on their feet and influence a game (the answer being very few) rather than the perfect conditions games that go to plan (and not too many emerged with that much credit)

Likewise the coaches appeared to have no directive or plan B, no address to repeatedly kicking the ball out on the full and a change of tactics (couldve taken off Ford moved Farrell to 10 and brought on a ball carrier), run the ball, kicked more centrally, kicked shorter, kicked on the floor etc etc
		
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My comment is directed to the fans, I don’t disagree with anything you’ve put, it was very disappointing in just about every aspect.

I’d hope they will learn a lot from it and we turn up at Twickenham in a couple of weeks v Ireland.


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## fundy (Feb 8, 2020)

pauldj42 said:



			My comment is directed to the fans, I don’t disagree with anything you’ve put, it was very disappointing in just about every aspect.

I’d hope they will learn a lot from it and we turn up at Twickenham in a couple of weeks v Ireland.
		
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fair enough, thought you meant the England camp!


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## SocketRocket (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			I thought that they spelled it "Kolkata" now.
And why were they playing for an Indian cup?
		
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Here's a link that explains the history of the Calcutta cup
https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/The-Calcutta-Cup/


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## IanM (Feb 8, 2020)

Next year they are playing this on the deck of an aircraft carrier in the North Atlantic!


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## fundy (Feb 8, 2020)

IanM said:



			Next year they are playing this on the deck of an aircraft carrier in the North Atlantic!
		
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game will end after 25 minutes after England have kicked every single ball into the sea lol


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## SocketRocket (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			England makes a touchdown!  Don't know what the hell is going on.

View attachment 29137

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A rugby union ball is wider than a rugby league ball, but they are the same in length. -A rugby union ball is rounder. -A league ball is less aerodynamic. -A league ball bounces more unpreddictably -A league ball is lighter


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

SocketRocket said:



			Here's a link that explains the history of the Calcutta cup
https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/The-Calcutta-Cup/

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thanks


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

SocketRocket said:



			A rugby union ball is wider than a rugby league ball, but they are the same in length. -A rugby union ball is rounder. -A league ball is less aerodynamic. -A league ball bounces more unpreddictably -A league ball is lighter
		
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Thanks again.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 8, 2020)

I would imagine, without knowing for sure, that rugby balls at one time must have been leather with an internal inflatable bladder and laces on the outside.

American footballs are still made that way, but the rugby ball seems to be made differently now from its appearance.


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## Dando (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			I would imagine, without knowing for sure, that rugby balls at one time must have been leather with an internal inflatable bladder and laces on the outside.

American footballs are still made that way, but the rugby ball seems to be made differently now from its appearance.
		
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American footballs are made of cotton wool so the big Jessie’s don’t hurt themselves


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## Robin Hood (Feb 8, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			What does the oxygen symbol mean on the English shirts?
		
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It shows that they have been training at high altitude - hence the oxygen sign.
The training camp was in the mountains of Norfolk.


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## Robin Hood (Feb 8, 2020)

Not the best of games today. Last years Calcutta cup was excellent.
Wind and rain played a huge part.
Take the points and move on.


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## Bunkermagnet (Feb 8, 2020)

I thought the refereeing was very inconsistant for Scotland-England.
And as usual, the England brains appear to go to mush at times. I don't think Farrell should be captain without question.


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## spongebob59 (Feb 8, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			I thought the refereeing was very inconsistant for Scotland-England.
And as usual, the England brains appear to go to mush at times. I don't think Farrell should be captain without question.
		
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Can only think of two other  candidates who would stay of for most of the game  and that's George or Itoje.  In the future O think Curry might do the job. Would like to see a back row of curry, Underhill and earl against ireland with earl at 8. Not gonna happen though.


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## Bunkermagnet (Feb 9, 2020)

spongebob59 said:



			Can only think of two other  candidates who would stay of for most of the game  and that's George or Itoje.  In the future O think Curry might do the job. Would like to see a back row of curry, Underhill and earl against ireland with earl at 8. Not gonna happen though.
		
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Itoje all day long.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 9, 2020)

Dando said:



			American footballs are made of cotton wool so the big Jessie’s don’t hurt themselves
		
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Yet, the seven foot, twenty-five stone Jessies get hurt anyway. What wimps!  You should call them on it, Dando.


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## Dando (Feb 9, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			Yet, the seven foot, twenty-five stone Jessies get hurt anyway. What wimps!  You should call them on it, Dando.

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At least 15 stone is all that padding they have to wear!


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 9, 2020)

Dando said:



			At least 15 stone is all that padding they have to wear!
		
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It's essentially the same padding that we wore as 8-year-olds in Pop Warner League...can't weigh that much.

On a more serious note, fewer and fewer parents are allowing their young boys to play youth-football, especially in more progressive Blue states.
My state is contemplating banning the game for kids under fourteen. Things can only progress from there.
[I was quite relieved that my own son was an accomplished_ baseball_ player.]
Some locals schools are having trouble fielding a team and dropping the game.

This serves well for the American future of boring-ass association football which currently thrives as a youth activity albeit not as sports entertainment.
Easier on spinal cords and brains (if you don't hit too many headers).  

While the professional game will endure as a money-making, colosseum-gladiator-like attraction, all of the players will eventually come from the same few socially-regressive states.


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## hairball_89 (Feb 9, 2020)

Dando said:



			American footballs are made of cotton wool so the big Jessie’s don’t hurt themselves
		
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Whilst I understand, and assume, this is a largely tongue in cheek comment, it is simply not true and one of the most ridiculous of the criticisms the sport faces in this country and one trotted out time and time again by those who don't understand it at all. Fabulous sport, wonderful to watch... Just not so much if you're a Washington fan, as I am!

Back to the rugby, I actually really enjoyed the game and at 3-3 couldn't remember a low scoring game I'd enjoyed as much at all. England's kicking game was simply stupid. Heinz showed himself up as a distinctly average non-thinking no9 constantly kicking out on the full and not adjusting at all. Were they brilliant? No, not at all - big areas to improve on across the pitch. I'm not sure France and then Scotland away are the games to blood a new full back and 2 squads in a row without a recognised no8 aren't brilliant signs. But tbh, any England win at Murrayfield will do!


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## Dando (Feb 9, 2020)

hairball_89 said:



			Whilst I understand, and assume, this is a largely tongue in cheek comment, it is simply not true and one of the most ridiculous of the criticisms the sport faces in this country and one trotted out time and time again by those who don't understand it at all. Fabulous sport, wonderful to watch... Just not so much if you're a Washington fan, as I am!

Back to the rugby, I actually really enjoyed the game and at 3-3 couldn't remember a low scoring game I'd enjoyed as much at all. England's kicking game was simply stupid. Heinz showed himself up as a distinctly average non-thinking no9 constantly kicking out on the full and not adjusting at all. Were they brilliant? No, not at all - big areas to improve on across the pitch. I'm not sure France and then Scotland away are the games to blood a new full back and 2 squads in a row without a recognised no8 aren't brilliant signs. But tbh, any England win at Murrayfield will do!
		
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not sure I’d call it a wonderful sport to watch unless you have a weak bladder then the stops in play every 5 seconds  are useful.


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## Leftie (Feb 9, 2020)

Ye Olde Boomer said:



			I would imagine, without knowing for sure, that rugby balls at one time must have been leather with an internal inflatable bladder and laces on the outside.
		
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Correct, and when wet they doubled in weight.  Trying to kick a conversion (Field goal to you) could seriously damage one's knee and foot.

Footballs (soccer) were the same and heading those was not a good idea.


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## Val (Feb 12, 2020)

Dando said:



			Nice that the Scots ignore “respect   The kicker”
		
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Let he who is without sin and all that


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## JamesR (Feb 12, 2020)

Val said:



			Let he who is without sin and all that
		
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<Throws stone>
👍
😉


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Feb 12, 2020)

Leftie said:



			Correct, and when wet they doubled in weight.  Trying to kick a conversion (Field goal to you) could seriously damage one's knee and foot.

Footballs (soccer) were the same and heading those was not a good idea.
		
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Interesting.  We (American football) still use the old technology.  
I would suspect that a smaller, pointier rugby-style-constructed ball would work well for our game too. 
I suppose we didn't absolutely have to change is because the ball is indeed smaller, and with more natural stoppages in play, new balls are regularly substituted in foul weather.
This is fine for the highly prosperous NFL, but for amateur teams, not so practical when the balls cost roughly a hundred bucks apiece.


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## Val (Feb 13, 2020)

JamesR said:



			<Throws stone>
👍
😉
		
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__ https://www.facebook.com/1237041632977916/posts/3250755454939847



🤣🤣


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## Doon frae Troon (Feb 24, 2020)

All a bit quiet on the 6 nations this year.
Seems like a walk in the park for the French now with the four home nations not playing at their best.


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## GB72 (Feb 24, 2020)

Doon frae Troon said:



			All a bit quiet on the 6 nations this year.
Seems like a walk in the park for the French now with the four home nations not playing at their best.
		
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In all honesty, the schedule has meant that I have not really got into the 6 Nations as much as I would normally. 2 Sunday matches out of the first 3 has meant that I cannot follow my usual routines and traditions and as such it has felt a bit flat. Add to that a final match against Italy meaning that the tournament for England as far as being a spectacle ends in 2 weeks and the tournament has not been the same to me this year. Really cannot see anyone beating the French in any event, especially as they play Ireland in Paris in the last match. May have been a chance if it was in Ireland.  Edwards has added some grit and organisation to the team whilst Wales and Ireland have taken steps backwards this year as new coaches and players bed in. Aside from the first half against Ireland, England are not showing the form that they showed in parts of the World Cup and some of Eddie Jones' selections still confuse. 

Still, even a bad 6 Nations is better than most other tournaments in sport


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## MegaSteve (Feb 24, 2020)

Doon frae Troon said:



			All a bit quiet on the 6 nations this year.
Seems like a walk in the park for the French now with the four home nations not playing at their best.
		
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The oval ball really only matters in the valleys...
Where, even there, [after Saturday] I suspect it's gone quiet...


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 24, 2020)

GB72 said:



			In all honesty, the schedule has meant that I have not really got into the 6 Nations as much as I would normally. 2 Sunday matches out of the first 3 has meant that I cannot follow my usual routines and traditions and as such it has felt a bit flat. Add to that a final match against Italy meaning that the tournament for England as far as being a spectacle ends in 2 weeks and the tournament has not been the same to me this year. Really cannot see anyone beating the French in any event, especially as they play Ireland in Paris in the last match. May have been a chance if it was in Ireland.  Edwards has added some grit and organisation to the team whilst Wales and Ireland have taken steps backwards this year as new coaches and players bed in. Aside from the first half against Ireland, England are not showing the form that they showed in parts of the World Cup and some of Eddie Jones' selections still confuse.

Still, even a bad 6 Nations is better than most other tournaments in sport
		
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Not really getting that into it myself - usual watching from behind the sofa stuff for me on Saturday with Scotland - and I can't be bothered with the stupid 'look at me' garb and headwear of too many Welsh supporters in particular.  Is it me or is it that the female of the sexes who are the primary offenders on this front (though blokes also seem to suffer from the same malaise)- maybe they don't really get what they are watching (like a lot of blokes) and instead decide to go along for the craic and wear stupid gear for the best selfie photos and TV opportunities ...(and yes - I know that sounds a bit sexist but it is only an observation).  

In any case.  Male or female equally at fault and it irritates the bejeezus out of me...spoils my watching pleasure...(grump over)


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## USER1999 (Feb 24, 2020)

I thought England played ok, but the score line was a bit flattering, as without 2 lucky bounces they might not have scored much.


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## Doon frae Troon (Feb 24, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Not really getting that into it myself - usual watching from behind the sofa stuff for me on Saturday with Scotland - and I can't be bothered with the stupid 'look at me' garb and headwear of too many Welsh supporters in particular.  Is it me or is it that the female of the sexes who are the primary offenders on this front (though blokes also seem to suffer from the same malaise)- maybe they don't really get what they are watching (like a lot of blokes) and instead decide to go along for the craic and wear stupid gear for the best selfie photos and TV opportunities ...(and yes - I know that sounds a bit sexist but it is only an observation). 

In any case.  Male or female equally at fault and it irritates the bejeezus out of me...spoils my watching pleasure...(grump over)
		
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The low voice Eddie Butler monologues really peeve me off.
Utter USA imported rubbish


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## Imurg (Feb 24, 2020)

Is it me or is there much more backchat to the ref these days..?
Farrell, Bigger, Hogg and many others are always giving the ref an earbashing.
In my day that would have been a 10 yard penalty...
I know the Captain can ask reasons but didn't think they could argue...


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Feb 24, 2020)

Imurg said:



			Is it me or is there much more backchat to the ref these days..?
Farrell, Bigger, Hogg and many others are always giving the ref an earbashing.
In my day that would have been a 10 yard penalty...
I know the Captain can ask reasons but didn't think they could argue...
		
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Good point - I can't recall seeing any dissent 10yd penalties this last weekend?  Maybe I wasn't paying attention.


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## GB72 (Feb 24, 2020)

Imurg said:



			Is it me or is there much more backchat to the ref these days..?
Farrell, Bigger, Hogg and many others are always giving the ref an earbashing.
In my day that would have been a 10 yard penalty...
I know the Captain can ask reasons but didn't think they could argue...
		
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Agree, Farrell was like a petulant child. Held on to a leg in the ruck to try and draw a penalty from the player trying to push him off and was not happy when the ref told him he started it and got what he deserved.


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## Lord Tyrion (Feb 24, 2020)

Harder to get excited about this tournament as it comes so soon after a very good World Cup. After the Lord Mayors show etc


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 1, 2020)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1233892898799837185
Thought it worked well across BBC and ITV - would be a shame to see it go to Sky


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## sussexhacker (Mar 1, 2020)

Liverpoolphil said:




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1233892898799837185
Thought it worked well across BBC and ITV - would be a shame to see it go to Sky
		
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Embarrassingly this is how all sport will be eventually 

The likes of itv and bbc can’t keep up with the ridiculously rising costs of live sport broadcasting 

Cricket was my first love before golf and that’s gone downhill since sky took over (not the actual broadcast they do a very good job of it) 

There’s really not a lot of major sports events on free to air tv these days


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

Whats worse is how this is happening, basically a % of the tournament is being sold to CVC (private equity firm) who against the wishes of the home unions are then trying to sell the broadcast rights to the highest bidder, what did they expect to happen when they sold them a chunk for 300m lol

the other rumour is that South Africa will be joining the competition!!!


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 1, 2020)

My pp yesterday mentioned the south African story. I gave him an odd look and then spent 5 minutes telling him how it couldn't and shouldn't happen. I then ended with, however money talks 😕.

I hope it doesn't, it would wrong on a number of levels.


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## sussexhacker (Mar 1, 2020)

Purely from a spectator point seeing South Africa against the home nations would prove entertaining though no?


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 1, 2020)

sussexhacker said:



			Purely from a spectator point seeing South Africa against the home nations would prove entertaining though no?
		
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That is what the autumn internationals are for.

The tournament is a northern hemisphere one, fans can travel to away games in numbers without huge expense. The tournament is special,  don't mess with it.


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## GB72 (Mar 1, 2020)

Anyone else think the tournament will be abondoned after the weekend. Ireland v Italy already off, no chance of England playing Italy next week, suspect France v Ireland will go the same way and there is no room in the schedules to replay these games and as they would be outside of agreed windows, I suspect no obligation on clubs to release players


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

the argument from the saffers perspective at least is a time zone one, the 6 nations is far closer in time zone than the southern hemisphere comp

from the likes of CVC there argument is the Saffers are the biggest draw going right now so would be a great addition and would leave a space for Japan in the southern hemisphere comp

cant see it happening but see why theyre exploring the possibility


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## sussexhacker (Mar 1, 2020)

Lord Tyrion said:



			That is what the autumn internationals are for.

The tournament is a northern hemisphere one, fans can travel to away games in numbers without huge expense. The tournament is special,  don't mess with it.
		
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I understand that and don’t think it would work well but i would rather watch England vs South Africa than England vs Italy


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## sussexhacker (Mar 1, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Anyone else think the tournament will be abondoned after the weekend. Ireland v Italy already off, no chance of England playing Italy next week, suspect France v Ireland will go the same way and there is no room in the schedules to replay these games and as they would be outside of agreed windows, I suspect no obligation on clubs to release players
		
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Can’t they go down the Italian football route and play behind closed doors?


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Anyone else think the tournament will be abondoned after the weekend. Ireland v Italy already off, no chance of England playing Italy next week, suspect France v Ireland will go the same way and there is no room in the schedules to replay these games and as they would be outside of agreed windows, I suspect no obligation on clubs to release players
		
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sure i read that England players are contracted to be released by their English clubs if 6 nations games are rearranged, but probably only them, other nations dont have the same agreements

has to be every chance it gets fully cancelled or some games are played behind closed doors, going to affect a lot of bigger sport events surely. Cobra release tomorrow may give some more clues....


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

sussexhacker said:



			Can’t they go down the Italian football route and play behind closed doors?
		
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they have still cancelled some Serie A games this weekend rather than play behind closed doors as originally planned


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 1, 2020)

I can see the SA argument about time zones but does it detract the six nations, or give the sides to play a top southern hemisphere team more regularly and look to improve. Are SA contracted into their current tournament and if so when does this run out?


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I can see the SA argument about time zones but does it detract the six nations, or give the sides to play a top southern hemisphere team more regularly and look to improve. Are SA contracted into their current tournament and if so when does this run out?
		
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rumours were they would join after the next world cup, so 2024 i think


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 1, 2020)

fundy said:



			rumours were they would join after the next world cup, so 2024 i think
		
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Is that when the current contract expires or because the WC is seen as a natural break? Would they look to replace SA (in terms of teams playing, not quality) or reduce it to a tri-nation event (Australia, NZ and Argentina?)


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## fundy (Mar 1, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Is that when the current contract expires or because the WC is seen as a natural break? Would they look to replace SA (in terms of teams playing, not quality) or reduce it to a tri-nation event (Australia, NZ and Argentina?)
		
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assume its probably both, the initial chatter was it would open up a space for Japan, how true that is who knows


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 2, 2020)

Putting the Six Nations behind a Sky or other paywall I think could severely damage the game in Scotland.  It's not (in my experience) a game that has a natural Scottish following - and the interest is only really generated by the Six Nations with casual interested viewers watching the the competition (mostly perhaps the England game... ) and getting enough enthusiasm from doing so to go to Murrayfield to see what the atmosphere is like in the ground - and then a small % of those that 'get it' then start going to Glasgow or Edinburgh matches. 

I fear putting the Six Nations behind a paywall will you lose so many of the very casual viewer.  After all has not putting The Open behind a paywall been cited as one factor that has led to a drop off in interest in golf in the country.


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## User62651 (Mar 2, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Putting the Six Nations behind a Sky or other paywall I think could severely damage the game in Scotland.  It's not (in my experience) a game that has a natural Scottish following - and the interest is only really generated by the Six Nations with casual interested viewers watching the the competition (mostly perhaps the England game... ) and getting enough enthusiasm from doing so to go to Murrayfield to see what the atmosphere is like in the ground - and then a small % of those that 'get it' then start going to Glasgow or Edinburgh matches.

I fear putting the Six Nations behind a paywall will you lose so many of the very casual viewer.  After all has not putting The Open behind a paywall been cited as one factor that has led to a drop off in interest in golf in the country.
		
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The 'greater good' doesn't come into anything sports related in 2020, money is all that matters to those that benefit most from it unfortunately.


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

I am in 2 minds about the paywall issue. Yes, there is a harm to the game with less people seeing those England matches but, as with other sports, the BBC does nothing to help the game outside of this tournament. Club matches are barely mentioned on the news, coverage on 5 live is bumped to sports extra for even the lowest of football matches, Rugby Special or any sort of highlights package is long gone and it is getting people to club games that is important, you can fill Twickenham very easily but it is away from international level that coverage is needed. I have always felt that any deal agreed to show the crown jewels should be tied to an agreement to cover the less prestigious areas of the sport.


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 2, 2020)

People think the next generation of rugby players are inspired by watching BBC1 for their sport? Not even close. They watch via websites around the world, youtube etc. People need to stop thinking along the lines of when they were young, how they watched sport back then. The current generation watch in an entirely different fashion. Most under 20 yr olds will barely touch BBC for their tv viewing.


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## sussexhacker (Mar 2, 2020)

Lord Tyrion said:



			People think the next generation of rugby players are inspired by watching BBC1 for their sport? Not even close. They watch via websites around the world, youtube etc. People need to stop thinking along the lines of when they were young, how they watched sport back then. The current generation watch in an entirely different fashion. Most under 20 yr olds will barely touch BBC for their tv viewing.
		
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But they still won’t be able to see a lot of what’s going on
I’m sure there’ll be 5 minute highlights on YouTube like we get for cricket or golf but that’s it


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 2, 2020)

GB72 said:



			I am in 2 minds about the paywall issue. Yes, there is a harm to the game with less people seeing those England matches but, as with other sports, the BBC does nothing to help the game outside of this tournament. Club matches are barely mentioned on the news, coverage on 5 live is bumped to sports extra for even the lowest of football matches, Rugby Special or any sort of highlights package is long gone and it is getting people to club games that is important, you can fill Twickenham very easily but it is away from international level that coverage is needed. I have always felt that any deal agreed to show the crown jewels should be tied to an agreement to cover the less prestigious areas of the sport.
		
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The same can be said about Sky and BT Sport.....none of them are going to encourage you to watch another provider.


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

I hope that this South Africa idea is wrong. Do they come in at the expense of Italy or are they a seventh team. if so, how do you firth that in with players needing more time away from clubs and more mandatory rest periods. Time will come when clubs stop wanting England players as they are not available enough and the RFU cannot afford central contracts. What about developing the game in Europe. What does that say to emerging nations like Georgia etc who we should be encouraging.


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 2, 2020)

sussexhacker said:



			But they still won’t be able to see a lot of what’s going on
I’m sure there’ll be 5 minute highlights on YouTube like we get for cricket or golf but that’s it
		
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My point is that not being on BBC is not going to stop them watching rugby, it will not impact on rugby going forward, as very few kids watch BBC anyway. It is not a channel they turn to in a way that I, probably we, would have done or do now. If my kids, 20 and 17, want to watch tv they go Netflix, Amazon, Sky as the first 3 options. 4th will be Youtube, will actually be higher to be fair. They don't think to look at BBC, never BBC 2. It will bother older people but not kids.

Ironically, rugby highlights may come up on their Youtube feed and bring it to their attention more than being on regular tv. As I said, we have to stop thinking the u20's watch tv in the same way we do because that is plain wrong.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 2, 2020)

Lord Tyrion said:



			My point is that not being on BBC is not going to stop them watching rugby, it will not impact on rugby going forward, as very few kids watch BBC anyway. It is not a channel they turn to in a way that I, probably we, would have done or do now. If my kids, 20 and 17, want to watch tv they go Netflix, Amazon, Sky as the first 3 options. 4th will be Youtube, will actually be higher to be fair. They don't think to look at BBC, never BBC 2. It will bother older people but not kids.

Ironically, rugby highlights may come up on their Youtube feed and bring it to their attention more than being on regular tv. As I said, we have to stop thinking the u20's watch tv in the same way we do because that is plain wrong.
		
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However there is a greater chance more people will see the advertising for the covereage because they are being shown on terrestrial TV.
I personally think that any sport that has a national team playing should be available to everyone who pays a tv license.


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## fundy (Mar 2, 2020)

GB72 said:



			I hope that this South Africa idea is wrong. Do they come in at the expense of Italy or are they a seventh team. if so, how do you firth that in with players needing more time away from clubs and more mandatory rest periods. Time will come when clubs stop wanting England players as they are not available enough and the RFU cannot afford central contracts. What about developing the game in Europe. What does that say to emerging nations like Georgia etc who we should be encouraging.
		
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the plans mooted were definitely as a 7th team not at italys expense, so potentially making an overcrowded calendar even more so


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 2, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



*However there is a greater chance more people will see the advertising for the covereage because they are being shown on terrestrial TV*.
I personally think that any sport that has a national team playing should be available to everyone who pays a tv license.
		
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That assumes they are watching terrestrial tv in the first place. That swings back to my original point, youngsters don't on the whole. One of the reasons ITV has gone nuts for Love Island is because it delivers 15-24 yr olds (approx), a group they often don't reach but advertisers love.

As to your second point that would leave the terrestrial channels only offering a token amount for rights and that then harms that particular sport. Rugby, like cricket, relies on the money gained from tv rights for internationals. If you restrict that it impacts throughout that sport.

Incidentally, I think it would be sad it went from free to air tv but I don't blame the rugby authorities for wanting the money. Why should they be different to other sports?


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## MegaSteve (Mar 2, 2020)

The rumour I heard/read was that the Springboks would play their 'home' games in Europe... France iirc ???

Also be a bloomin' shame to lose Italy...
Absolute great week-end away taking in the match as well as the sights ...


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 2, 2020)

I have to say, I'm not totally with SA joining the 6 Nations, but I think Georgia joining would be better for the long term growth and betterment of the game.


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

fundy said:



			the plans mooted were definitely as a 7th team not at italys expense, so potentially making an overcrowded calendar even more so
		
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That makes it a non starter for me. With breaks etc it would mean clubs losing their internationals at the end of the January and not seeing them before April. Once you take out the weeks lost for the Autumn internationals, rest periods etc you would be lucky to get half a dozen matches from an England international. You then have the salary cap meaning that you cannot have strength and depth in the squad and so sub standard teams go out for most of the season which harms the club's brand and may lose supporters etc. 

Almost laughable how the RFU goes on about player welfare then looks to pack more international fixtures in. Basically player welfare is fine so long as the RFU get all the players they need for England at the expense of the clubs who have to deal with the rest periods or the times when England sends them back broken.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 2, 2020)

Lord Tyrion said:



			People think the next generation of rugby players are inspired by watching BBC1 for their sport? Not even close. They watch via websites around the world, youtube etc. People need to stop thinking along the lines of when they were young, how they watched sport back then. The current generation watch in an entirely different fashion. Most under 20 yr olds will barely touch BBC for their tv viewing.
		
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I myself wasn't thinking about players - folk start playing for very different reasons - often wanting to get fit and going along for a go with a friend already playing the game.  I'm thinking about spectators.  It was not that long ago that Murrayfield was rarely being filled.  It is these days - but I don't see that as a given in Scotland going forward if the game goes behind a Sky, BT, Amazon or whatever paywall.


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 2, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			I myself wasn't thinking about players - folk start playing for very different reasons - often wanting to get fit and going along for a go with a friend already playing the game.  I'm thinking about spectators.  It was not that long ago that Murrayfield was rarely being filled.  It is these days - but I don't see that as a given in Scotland going forward if the game goes behind a Sky, BT, Amazon or whatever paywall.
		
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I suspect whether murrayfield gets filled or not is more to do with the success, or not, of the Scottish team rather than free to air TV.


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## MegaSteve (Mar 2, 2020)

Feeling the RFU are now stretching out their lead over the FA in inept management...


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## fundy (Mar 2, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			Feeling the RFU are now stretching out their lead over the FA in inept management...
		
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ECB says hold my beer!!!!!


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## Lord Tyrion (Mar 2, 2020)

fundy said:



			ECB says hold my beer!!!!!
		
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LTA says hold my Pimms 🤣🤣


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

So no t safe for Italy to come to Ireland but ok for England and thousands of fans to go to Italy. Got to love that logic


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## fundy (Mar 2, 2020)

GB72 said:



			So no t safe for Italy to come to Ireland but ok for England and thousands of fans to go to Italy. Got to love that logic
		
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be amazed if that game goes ahead, think theyre trying to keep the semblance of a championship but expect they cancel it early next week personally


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

fundy said:



			be amazed if that game goes ahead, think theyre trying to keep the semblance of a championship but expect they cancel it early next week personally
		
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I agree, guessing they want this week's matches to appear normal before postponing the final round


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			I have to say, I'm not totally with SA joining the 6 Nations, but I think Georgia joining would be better for the long term growth and betterment of the game.
		
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I like the idea of England getting tested by another strong side but can see the arguments put up against it. As for long term growth, why not have some sort of two legged relegation play off and give the likes of Georgia and emerging European sides a chance to get up and mixing with the big boys.


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## GB72 (Mar 2, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I like the idea of England getting tested by another strong side but can see the arguments put up against it. As for long term growth, why not have some sort of two legged relegation play off and give the likes of Georgia and emerging European sides a chance to get up and mixing with the big boys.
		
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Because there are too many vested interests. Ok whilst Italy are the whipping boys but have one of the founding nations relegated and all hell would break loose. Ironic those who support keeping the 6 nations as it is are often against ring fencing the premiership.

South Africa have no place in a European tournament with such history anyway. Should we let Brazil etc into the football Euros. We play 2 or 3 of the southern hemisphere teams in autumn so one more match makes no difference. Rugby support is way down in South Africa and Australia and they are clutching at straws


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Because there are too many vested interests. Ok whilst Italy are the whipping boys but have one of the founding nations relegated and all hell would break loose. Ironic those who support keeping the 6 nations as it is are often against ring fencing the premiership.

South Africa have no place in a European tournament with such history anyway. Should we let Brazil etc into the football Euros. We play 2 or 3 of the southern hemisphere teams in autumn so one more match makes no difference. Rugby support is way down in South Africa and Australia and they are clutching at straws
		
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I take your point about Italy and relegation, but surely if rugby wants to grow the game as it said during the world cup, the little sides have to get more exposure, learn and develop. We've seen it in cricket especially one day games with the arrival of Bangladesh (also starting to grow as a test side) and Afghanistan. Yes they were both whipping boys for a long time but they learned. Similarly Italy have managed to produce the odd quality performance and win so they have got it in there.


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## Old Skier (Mar 3, 2020)

Where's this rubbish about wanting to grow the game, it's about money. If it's about growing the game why is funding at grassroots being reduced.


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## GB72 (Mar 3, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I take your point about Italy and relegation, but surely if rugby wants to grow the game as it said during the world cup, the little sides have to get more exposure, learn and develop. We've seen it in cricket especially one day games with the arrival of Bangladesh (also starting to grow as a test side) and Afghanistan. Yes they were both whipping boys for a long time but they learned. Similarly Italy have managed to produce the odd quality performance and win so they have got it in there.
		
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Yes but the test playing nations did not risk losing revenue as a result of these teams being included. You add relegation and one team is at risk of a serious hit to income and as it is these matches that, in the main, fund the RFU, it is not an affordable risk. Certainly no room for more teams on a player welfare level if nothing else. There is also an argument about whether it does develop the game. Italy have had years of being in top level matches and really have not pushed on at club or national level with Italian teams being the whipping boys in the 6 Nations and the Champions Cup. The odd win after over a decade of being in top competition is not really enough


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 3, 2020)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I suspect whether murrayfield gets filled or not is more to do with the success, or not, of the Scottish team rather than free to air TV.
		
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Quite possibly true - but I suspect that broader interest in rugby in Scotland may still be initiated by The 6 Nations on free to view.  And when it isn't filled that is most probably simply because there just isn't the depth of interest or demand in the country. 

Things may have changed massively in the last 30yrs but back then there was very little inherent grass roots interest in rugby - the interest many developed (including myself and my mates) came about from watching the 5 Nations.  Murrayfield would be packed before the redevelopment when the tickets were £10 or less.  As soon as the price went up following the redevelopment a lot of folk stopped going.  They went for the atmosphere and the cracking day to be had in Edinburgh - not really much interest in rugby tbh - and they could get a great atmosphere and cracking day in an Edinburgh pub.  Pretty much I guess how it is today.

Folk have to see Scotland playing well and winning to be encouraged to go along. Not going to happen so much behind a paywall.  Might be OK for England, Ireland and Wales - I've no doubt.  Not so sure about Scotland.


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## ger147 (Mar 3, 2020)

Murrayfield consistently sells out for any/every Scotland home match...

https://www.florugby.com/articles/6542855-scotlands-murrayfield-a-sellout-machine


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 3, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Murrayfield consistently sells out for any/every Scotland home match...

https://www.florugby.com/articles/6542855-scotlands-murrayfield-a-sellout-machine

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It does indeed.  Scotland have played attractive rugby for a good few years now and have been seen to be doing so by TV viewers.  It's also fortunate that Glasgow and Edinburgh have been successful on the club front and so have been attracting crowds way beyond anything historically - and Glasgow and Edinburgh aren't on free to view.  Hopefully a continuing healthy club scene will be what will mitigate any risk to Murreyfield crowds if the 6 Nations going behind a paywall.


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## GB72 (Mar 3, 2020)

It will happen. I believe that most of the Rugby Unions are pretty much skint and need the cash that Sky would bring. Would be surprised if BT did not come in as well as they have quickly become the channel for rugby at club level. It will be a shame as a lot of the social events that I have in place around the 6 nations will change based on who has sky sports.


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## GB72 (Mar 3, 2020)

I think that it is an often underappreciated fact by those that do not follow rugby in any detail is that the sport needs the money. Yes, the 6 Nations behind a paywall is not ideal but the various unions, the clubs at all levels, the national teams etc need funding. There are no billion pound TV deals and scant number of rich backers who want to be involved partly because the salary caps mean that spending their way to success and glory is not an option. The players, quite rightly bearing in mind the risks, want decent remuneration but player welfare means that clubs also need bigger squads (I think all bar 1 premiership club made a loss last year). Where rugby is concerned, the outcome may not be ideal but it may be necessary. 

I don't know so please correct me but is the situation similar with cricket. All of the funding at club and national level would simply not have been possible on what the BBC was willing to pay.


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## ger147 (Mar 3, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			It does indeed.  Scotland have played attractive rugby for a good few years now and have been seen to be doing so by TV viewers.  It's also fortunate that Glasgow and Edinburgh have been successful on the club front and so have been attracting crowds way beyond anything historically - and Glasgow and Edinburgh aren't on free to view.  Hopefully a continuing healthy club scene will be what will mitigate any risk to Murreyfield crowds if the 6 Nations going behind a paywall.
		
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And when crowds were low at Murrayfield in the past it was also on FTA TV. I personally see no connection between FTA TV coverage of the 6 Nations and the upsurge in demand for tickets to watch Scotland at Murrayfield in recent years.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 3, 2020)

ger147 said:



			And when crowds were low at Murrayfield in the past it was also on FTA TV. I personally see no connection between FTA TV coverage of the 6 Nations and the upsurge in demand for tickets to watch Scotland at Murrayfield in recent years.
		
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I don't disagree - but I am just wondering what happens if the 6Ns is lost to FTV TV given that rugby isn't exactly #1 sport of the young and under 25s in Scotland.  The fact that Glasgow and Edinburgh are successful clubs attracting relatively huge crowds without FTV TV coverage suggests that there is some groundswell in spectating outside of the 6Ns that will keep Scottish rugby healthy.  But that's a hope rather than expectation.


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## fundy (Mar 3, 2020)

Maku Vunipola not available for England this weekend having flown back from Tonga via Hong Kong and hence been asked to self isolate for 14 days.

Rumoured to have been at Saracens training in St Albans today!


Will Macpherson
@willis_macp
Mako Vunipola - in self-isolation as coronavirus precaution according to England - was in St Albans training with Saracens today. Interesting club and country row after his return from Tonga via Hong Kong.


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

fundy said:



			Maku Vunipola not available for England this weekend having flown back from Tonga via Hong Kong and hence been asked to self isolate for 14 days.

Rumoured to have been at Saracens training in St Albans today!


Will Macpherson
@willis_macp
Mako Vunipola - in self-isolation as coronavirus precaution according to England - was in St Albans training with Saracens today. Interesting club and country row after his return from Tonga via Hong Kong.
		
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Guessing an England call, Saracens can take that risk but England have players from a number of clubs to take into account. Still get the feeling that this weekend may be the end of the tournament this season anyway (unless France lose their Scotland then I can somehow see a few teams calling for matches to be played) with recent developments still not certain this weekend will go ahead


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## Rooter (Mar 4, 2020)

Why not have a second division 6 nations? each year one goes up, one goes down. Enough national teams in Europe to do this! get it on the TV box, i would watch it all!


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Rooter said:



			Why not have a second division 6 nations? each year one goes up, one goes down. Enough national teams in Europe to do this! get it on the TV box, i would watch it all!
		
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There is a second tier tournament on at the moment, just no promotion or relegation. All down to money. without the 6 Nations income I suspect rugby in Italy would pretty much collapse. Then you have the issue of what happens if one of the original 5 Nations had a bad season. They would have serious issues playing in a lower tier tournament.

Plus, as always the BBC (and Sky in this case as well) have no interest in showing anything but the prime events. I would be more than happy to see any contract to show the 6 nations obligating at least extended highlights coverage of the tier 2 matches. 

This is what wound me up about the post world cup outcry to have Japan involved in everything. Northern hemisphere needs to focus on involving Georgia, Germany, Spain, Russia etc first. England are bad for not playing many matches away from Tier 1 opponents but not as bad as New Zealand who want a guaranteed £1 million before they will even think about getting on a plane to play someone and the lack of support for the pacific island teams from whom they pinch a number of their best players is a disgrace.


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I can see the SA argument about time zones but does it detract the six nations, or give the sides to play a top southern hemisphere team more regularly and look to improve. Are SA contracted into their current tournament and if so when does this run out?
		
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The time zone is a red herring, there are already 2 SA clubs playing in the Pro14 and they make it work very easily


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Putting the Six Nations behind a Sky or other paywall I think could severely damage the game in Scotland.  It's not (in my experience) a game that has a natural Scottish following - and the interest is only really generated by the Six Nations with casual interested viewers watching the the competition (mostly perhaps the England game... ) and getting enough enthusiasm from doing so to go to Murrayfield to see what the atmosphere is like in the ground - and then a small % of those that 'get it' then start going to Glasgow or Edinburgh matches.

I fear putting the Six Nations behind a paywall will you lose so many of the very casual viewer.  After all has not putting The Open behind a paywall been cited as one factor that has led to a drop off in interest in golf in the country.
		
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Sorry, but that is absolute nonsense. The pro game is already behind a paywall on Premier sports and numbers of spectators in Scotland continue to grow.


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

Rooter said:



			Why not have a second division 6 nations? each year one goes up, one goes down. Enough national teams in Europe to do this! get it on the TV box, i would watch it all!
		
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That would be like turkeys voting for Christmas, Italy and Scotland would never agree to it. Georgia as a rugby nation are the best of the rest in European terms and are still a fair bit behind Italy


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

GB72 said:



			I am in 2 minds about the paywall issue. Yes, there is a harm to the game with less people seeing those England matches but, as with other sports, the BBC does nothing to help the game outside of this tournament. Club matches are barely mentioned on the news, coverage on 5 live is bumped to sports extra for even the lowest of football matches, Rugby Special or any sort of highlights package is long gone and it is getting people to club games that is important, you can fill Twickenham very easily but it is away from international level that coverage is needed. I have always felt that any deal agreed to show the crown jewels should be tied to an agreement to cover the less prestigious areas of the sport.
		
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BT do a magic job covering rugby. Enough to warrant my subscription money


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			BT do a magic job covering rugby. Enough to warrant my subscription money
		
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Totally agree. Great coverage and plenty of matches to choose from over the weekend, pretty much every European match on. It is superb. sky has so little rugby now that I ditched the sports channels. cannot see why BT do not go for the 6 nations, they are already building a reputation as the rugby channel and if they could get the 6 nations and autumn internationals, they would have enough to start a BT rugby channel and I would happily subscribe.


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Totally agree. Great coverage and plenty of matches to choose from over the weekend, pretty much every European match on. It is superb. sky has so little rugby now that I ditched the sports channels. cannot see why BT do not go for the 6 nations, they are already building a reputation as the rugby channel and if they could get the 6 nations and autumn internationals, they would have enough to start a BT rugby channel and I would happily subscribe.
		
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Was desperate for BT to pick up the Pro14 too, in saying that Premier sports do a decent job, every game shown live and on demand for 7 days afterwards. Also do a 1 hour review show. Not bad for £100 a year


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			Sorry, but that is absolute nonsense. The pro game is already behind a paywall on Premier sports and numbers of spectators in Scotland continue to grow.
		
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Part of that is, I suspect, because that means that the rugby is at least on somewhere. Not sure how it works with local TV up there but if it were not for BT/Sky, there would be no rugby at club level of TV in England. BBC ditched the Sunday evening rugby special and do not even mention results on the national news. At least with pay TV you can watch it somewhere and with BT perhaps convert a few who signed up to watch the football coverage but then catch the rugby as there is no live football at 3.00 on a Saturday.


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			Was desperate for BT to pick up the Pro14 too, in saying that Premier sports do a decent job, every game shown live and on demand for 7 days afterwards. Also do a 1 hour review show. Not bad for £100 a year
		
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I suppose the issue with picking up the Pro 14 as well without a dedicated rugby channel is that you would have to reduce some of the Premiership coverage due to timing of matches. That said, I would love to be able to watch some of Pro 14 (oh and is they could get super rugby as well for my Saturday morning fix as well, that would be great)


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			BT do a magic job covering rugby. Enough to warrant my subscription money
		
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Also love the BT sport app. Great that I can stick the Tigers match on my phone when I am out on a Saturday afternoon.


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

My BT sport sub is the app which I cast to Chromecast, get it for £5 a month as a broadband subscriber


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## Val (Mar 4, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Part of that is, I suspect, because that means that the rugby is at least on somewhere. Not sure how it works with local TV up there but if it were not for BT/Sky, there would be no rugby at club level of TV in England. BBC ditched the Sunday evening rugby special and do not even mention results on the national news. At least with pay TV you can watch it somewhere and with BT perhaps convert a few who signed up to watch the football coverage but then catch the rugby as there is no live football at 3.00 on a Saturday.
		
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BBC have just introduced a highlights show for both Glasgow and Edinburgh games. 1 hour a week I believe


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			Sorry, but that is absolute nonsense. The pro game is already behind a paywall on Premier sports and numbers of spectators in Scotland continue to grow.
		
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That's actually what I have been saying subsequent to that initial post - I was thinking of how Scots international team casual support used to watch rugby back in the day (and it wasn't in grounds) - but reflected on how things have changed from back in the day - with Glasgow and Edinburgh strong clubs with a relatively huge (for Scottish club rugby) supporter base despite not having any FTV TV coverage - and that would hopefully provide mitigation to the risk to interest in the game rising from loss of 6N from FTV.


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

Val said:



			BBC have just introduced a highlights show for both Glasgow and Edinburgh games. 1 hour a week I believe
		
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You are kidding, we get an hour for the whole of the premiership on ITV (40 minutes with adds) and it is on about midnight.


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			That's actually what I have been saying subsequent to that initial post - I was thinking of how Scots international team casual support used to watch rugby back in the day (and it wasn't in grounds) - but reflected on how things have changed from back in the day - with Glasgow and Edinburgh strong clubs with a relatively huge (for Scottish club rugby) supporter base despite not having any FTV TV coverage - and that would hopefully provide mitigation to the risk to interest in the game rising from loss of 6N from FTV.
		
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I certainly suspect that you would get more interest in Scottish rugby by having Glasgow and Edinburgh matches on free TV than Scotland internationals. There you have 2 strong teams playing great rugby and competing against the best.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 4, 2020)

GB72 said:



			I certainly suspect that you would get more interest in Scottish rugby by having Glasgow and Edinburgh matches on free TV than Scotland internationals. There you have 2 strong teams playing great rugby and competing against the best.
		
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My Mrs likes the West End of Glasgow and the part we'd live in would find me not 45mins walk from  Scotstoun Stadium and I'd plan to be a regular.  But as much as Glasgow would be my preference, I am thinking we're more likely to be in Edinburgh West End - so instead it would be a short walk to Murrayfield for me...no need for FTV TV 

Certainly the crowd that Edinburgh v Glasgow gets in Murrayfield is almost beyond the wildest dreams of Scottish Club rugby of 30yrs ago.


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## fundy (Mar 4, 2020)

Italy v England confirmed to either be behind closed doors or cancelled, still be amazed if its anything other than cancelled by monday


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

fundy said:



			Italy v England confirmed to either be behind closed doors or cancelled, still be amazed if its anything other than cancelled by monday
		
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Agree, if Italy cannot go to Ireland how can it be safe to send the England team to Italy. I can see the whole final round being cancelled on Monday


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## fundy (Mar 4, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Agree, if Italy cannot go to Ireland how can it be safe to send the England team to Italy. I can see the whole final round being cancelled on Monday
		
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rumours its already off starting to come out tonight it seems (Ita v Eng that is)


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2020)

fundy said:



			rumours its already off starting to come out tonight it seems (Ita v Eng that is)
		
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The final round will be called off tomorrow I suspect.


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## fundy (Mar 8, 2020)

France self destructing, surely not lol


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## User62651 (Mar 8, 2020)

if last round cancelled are England champions on points diff if Scotland France stays as it is? How would France get a bonus point - what's the criteria pls?


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## fundy (Mar 8, 2020)

maxfli65 said:



			if last round cancelled are England champions on points diff if Scotland France stays as it is? How would France get a bonus point - what's the criteria pls?
		
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france would need to lose by 8 or less to get a bonus point (or score 4 tries)

as for champions, not sure how they are going to decide it, if at all, with games being cancelled


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## Doon frae Troon (Mar 8, 2020)

Call it off now, Scotland in 3rd place sounds about right.


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## Bunkermagnet (Mar 8, 2020)

Fairest way would be to annul the Italy games and call it over this year, then see what the table looks like then.


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## IanM (Mar 8, 2020)

Nice job Scotland


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## USER1999 (Mar 8, 2020)

France self destructed with the idiot throwing a punch, and Romain getting a head injury didn't help.


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## Ye Olde Boomer (Mar 8, 2020)

I'm not sure when it actually took place but I'm really enjoying the Scotland-France match.

The Scots seem to be playing beautifully to my inexperienced eyes.

As bored as I get by Association "round ball" football, this Union game is really fun to watch.  I wish we had more of it.


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## Bigfoot (Mar 8, 2020)

This result may mean that no attempt is made to complete the championship. If France still had a change of the Grand Slam , they had to play to a conclusion.


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

Bigfoot said:



			This result may mean that no attempt is made to complete the championship. If France still had a change of the Grand Slam , they had to play to a conclusion.
		
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I am guessing that they might delete all of Italy's results and decide it as a 5 nation tournament. That could allow for a great game in France v Ireland as a bonus point win for either would give them the title but a close match with no bonus point would see them hand it to England. Hope we do see the last 2 matches played but could also see it being cancelled on Monday


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 9, 2020)

I was in the car driving back from Norwich listening to the Scotland France game and whooping it up much to my wife's amusement as we scored.  We got home - I switched on the TV - and France almost immediately scored.  I really shouldn't watch Scotland play football or rugby.  I can listen - but watching ...


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

Rumour starting to float about that the whole last round of the 6 Nations will be postponed until 31st October.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 9, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Rumour starting to float about that the whole last round of the 6 Nations will be postponed until *31st October.*

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Scary!


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Scary!
		
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Not really. That is based more on gaps in the schedule and when matches can be played rather than anything else. After this international window we are looking at European Cup matches and Premiership games until then and so I guess they are going to add and extra  week into the release window for the Autumn internationals.


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

Ireland v France postponed now but Wales v Scotland apparently still going ahead. 

Personal thought now is to abandon the tournament for the year with no winner. If France were on for a grand slam or any team was clearly ahead then I would argue for finishing it off but with all teams pretty much level (assuming you give Ireland the 5 points they would get against Italy)  then it does not seem unfair to call it off now as no team would be real favourites to win.


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## spongebob59 (Mar 9, 2020)

With three teams with a chance of winning I see no harm in playing the final matches in October, when the autumn internationals are going ahead anyway.


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## fundy (Mar 9, 2020)

airlines trying to work out why people are suddenly buying cheap flights to Italy in the last weekend of October lol


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

spongebob59 said:



			With three teams with a chance of winning I see no harm in playing the final matches in October, when the autumn internationals are going ahead anyway.
		
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That is the problem, fitting them into an already tight club schedule. Potentially means clubs playing without their international players for another 2-3 weeks (the match may be on one day but the players will need to train at least a week before that).


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 9, 2020)

GB72 said:



			Not really. That is based more on gaps in the schedule and when matches can be played rather than anything else. After this international window we are looking at European Cup matches and Premiership games until then and so I guess they are going to add and extra  week into the release window for the Autumn internationals.
		
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31st October = scary


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## GB72 (Mar 9, 2020)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			31st October = scary 

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Ok penny drops now


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## SocketRocket (Mar 9, 2020)

Marlers fed up with the willy waving.


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## GB72 (Mar 13, 2020)

Ok why on earth is the Wales v Scotland match going ahead tomorrow. It really seems like an insane risk (possibly based on the WRFU need for funds) especially as there is going to have to be at least one more 6 Nations weekend for everyone else and 2 for Ireland. In all likelihood, the tournament will be abandoned. This to me seems like a pretty obvious cash grab as the result is highly unlikely to even have any impact on the final table. 

i would push this argument even further by expressing a bit of shock that all rugby is still going ahead this weekend. Money over safety I fear.


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## fundy (Mar 13, 2020)

Been postponed now


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## GB72 (Mar 13, 2020)

fundy said:



			Been postponed now
		
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Very late in the day so now going to be thousands of fans in the pubs are ckubs


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## IanM (Mar 13, 2020)

Sensible.... but M4 is already rammed from Magor to the Tunnels with folk heading to Cardiff for the weekend.


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## Val (Mar 16, 2020)

Correct decision to call off the game but way late, I was halfway to Cardiff on Friday when news came through. Managed to get my hotel cost back thankfully


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