# Wentworth going even more "upscale"



## Duckster (Oct 19, 2015)

Not content on being one of the priciest (note, I said one of) clubs in England, it appears that they are now going to usurp the "ordinary golfer" from Wentworth's membership.

Is there such a thing at Wentworth?

On the flip side, I do actually feel sorry for the current membership, especially those who have been there for years.  Get the feeling that Sunningdale's waiting list is about to get a lot longer. 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...Surrey-club-by-Chinese-billionaire-owner.html


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

The PGA will go soon as well - as will the ability for guests to play etc. It will turn into an "exclusive club" 

No big loss tbh as its nice but there is a lot better in the area. 

Shame about the members though but im sure most can afford elsewhere.


----------



## chrisd (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The PGA will go soon as well - as will the ability for guests to play etc. It will turn into an "exclusive club" 

No big loss tbh as its nice but there is a lot better in the area. 

Shame about the members though but im sure most can afford elsewhere.
		
Click to expand...

I bet the PGA goes to The London Club !


----------



## Duckster (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The PGA will go soon as well - as will the ability for guests to play etc. It will turn into an "exclusive club" 

No big loss tbh as its nice but there is a lot better in the area. 

Shame about the members though but im sure most can afford elsewhere.
		
Click to expand...

Will be interesting to see which clubs in the area soak up the people who don't pay the debenture. Estimating 2750 people looking for a new club, lot of people, but also a lot of money in membership fees.


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

chrisd said:



			I bet the PGA goes to The London Club !
		
Click to expand...

Certainly a possible venue - wouldnt surprise me to see it travel around the UK and into Ireland


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

Duckster said:



			Will be interesting to see which clubs in the area soak up the people who don't pay the debenture. Estimating 2750 people looking for a new club, lot of people, but also a lot of money in membership fees.
		
Click to expand...

Lots of clubs in the area and outside that will take them all - some will bypass waiting lists some won't , power of money


----------



## Duckster (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Certainly a possible venue - wouldnt surprise me to see it travel around the UK and into Ireland
		
Click to expand...

Plus there's also the European Tour HQ being at Wentworth.  Can't see that staying there, but no idea where'd they go to.


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

Duckster said:



			Plus there's also the European Tour HQ being at Wentworth.  Can't see that staying there, but no idea where'd they go to.
		
Click to expand...

Belfry would be a good bet


----------



## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Belfry would be a good bet
		
Click to expand...

The Belfry is already the home of the Professional Golfers' Association (PGA).

It is the European Tour that is based at Wentworth.


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

MetalMickie said:



			The Belfry is already the home of the Professional Golfers' Association (PGA).

It is the European Tour that is based at Wentworth.
		
Click to expand...

I know


----------



## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I know 

Click to expand...

Not according to posts #2 & #5 but forgive me for implying criticism of your extensive knowledge of the golfing world!


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

MetalMickie said:



			Not according to posts #2 & #5 but forgive me for implying criticism of your extensive knowledge of the golfing world!
		
Click to expand...

Umm in post 2 I was saying the PGA "Champs" would be leaving Wentworth - thought that would be self explanatory and it appears the next response from Chris showed it was by his suggestion that it would move to the London Club 

And again post 5 is suggesting the event could move around


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

MetalMickie said:



			Not according to posts #2 & #5 but forgive me for implying criticism of your extensive knowledge of the golfing world!
		
Click to expand...

Phil wasn't wrong about anything though, was he?

The PGA he referred to is the tournament, The BMW PGA Championship, you may be aware of it, it's quite important!


----------



## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			Phil wasn't wrong about anything though, was he?

The PGA he referred to is the tournament, The BMW PGA Championship, you may be aware of it, it's quite important!
		
Click to expand...

Another pompous post!

Yes I have heard of the *BMW PGA Championship *which was not obviously being referred to .

The *PGA *is the acronym for a professional trade body and when used in relation to tournaments would more usually be considered to mean US PGA, a "major" rather than "quite important" event.


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

Thanks, I try!



MetalMickie said:



*Another pompous post!*

Yes I have heard of the *BMW PGA Championship *which was not obviously being referred to .

The *PGA *is the acronym for a professional trade body and when used in relation to tournaments would more usually be considered to mean US PGA, a "major" rather than "quite important" event.
		
Click to expand...

So Phil, Chris, Duckster & I all understood what was being talked about, but you didn't, so Phil was wrong?

I think not!


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

MetalMickie said:



			Another pompous post!

Yes I have heard of the *BMW PGA Championship *which was not obviously being referred to .

The *PGA *is the acronym for a professional trade body and when used in relation to tournaments would more usually be considered to mean US PGA, a "major" rather than "quite important" event.
		
Click to expand...

The PGA champs was exactly what I was referring too and everyone else clearly understood what I was referring too

Wentworth is famous for hosting the PGA Champs and it's normally called the PGA by everyone I know and regualry on here l.


----------



## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			Thanks, I try!



So Phil, Chris, Duckster & I all understood what was being talked about, but you didn't, so Phil was wrong?

I think not!
		
Click to expand...

You not only try but continue to be very trying,

As I have said the PGA is an organisation based at The Belfry not a tournament played at Wentworth. Ask a meber of the former.

Adieu to the forum.


----------



## Norrin Radd (Oct 19, 2015)

i thought posts 2 and 5 were talking about the PGA not the event.nothing in either post relates to the event.imo.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Oct 19, 2015)

Well done forum, this thread took a very a mature and sensible path.  Time of the month or something?


----------



## Curls (Oct 19, 2015)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FONN-0uoTHI


----------



## Smiffy (Oct 19, 2015)

MetalMickie said:



			You not only try but continue to be very trying,

As I have said the PGA is an organisation based at The Belfry not a tournament played at Wentworth. Ask a meber of the former.

Adieu to the forum.
		
Click to expand...

I take it you won't be coming to the Old Farts v Whippersnappers in June then?????


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

Proper flounce 

Just to clear up a few things 

The PGA I was referring to in the original post was the champs - a number of posters seemed to understand that

Hence why people suggested that it might move around etc

Then someone questioned about the Head of ET being there and I suggested it might go to the Belfy 

And that's when MM arrived and then it took a sour turn based on someone being extremely pedantic about an acronym - when the reference was pretty clear 

MM could have easily approached the question in regards the PGA and clarified what I was meaning in a more "friendly" manner maybe and then there would have been no need for what happened after that


----------



## Oxfordcomma (Oct 19, 2015)

Is it this time of year already? Seems earlier than usual, we haven't played the last qualifier yet at my club .

I personally thought it was obvious that Phil was talking about the competition not the organization, but I also don't think it's worth arguing about. Seriously, does it matter?


----------



## Hacker Khan (Oct 19, 2015)

Oxfordcomma said:



			Is it this time of year already? Seems earlier than usual, we haven't played the last qualifier yet at my club .

I personally thought it was obvious that Phil was talking about the competition not the organization, but I also don't think it's worth arguing about. Seriously, does it matter?
		
Click to expand...

In a world of social media, strong opinions and having the last word, it all matters.


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

Back to the OP,
For those that have actually played Wentworth, is it worth the money - from what I have heard I understand not.

Perhaps the new owners will plough all the monies into improvements?


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			Back to the OP,
For those that have actually played Wentworth, is it worth the money - from what I have heard I understand not.

Perhaps the new owners will plough all the monies into improvements?
		
Click to expand...

I don't think it's worth the green fee

Think there a lot better courses for less money around london and further out.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Oct 19, 2015)

Didn't think that much of the West course when I played there earlier this year in any case so had already decided against joining


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

I never quite understand Wentworth. It gets a decent placing on the Top 100 lists, but no one you speak to who's played the West course rates it. Certainly not since Ernie's changes!


----------



## Tongo (Oct 19, 2015)

How much of the appeal and lure of Wentworth is down to how famous it is though? would the new owner have even heard of the course had it not been home to the European Tour and the PGA Championship? Get rid of those and where is the kudos of being a member? (Which is surely what it will be for the fattest of cats. Surely they don't intend on actually playing golf?!)


----------



## Doon frae Troon (Oct 19, 2015)

Not really a members club is it, more of a posh Muni.
It has always had some 'interesting' members.

Looks like Trump will be doing the same to Turnberry. I bet the fact that he has to keep the club on board to organise the Open sticks in his craw.


----------



## MendieGK (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			but no one you speak to who's played the West course rates it. Certainly not since Ernie's changes!
		
Click to expand...

Disagree with this comment, 

Its a great golf course and the changes made were required to keep the course relevant. The greens are sub-par granted and its never worth Â£360 (Â£60 for the required caddy) but as a golf course, its a proper challenge.
 i think people who 'slate' it are often the same ones who knock the modern course (heaven forbid a great golf course not be a link or heathland). 

I would also say, that is a better golfers course, you have to hit it long and straight. so, your average Joe might find it too tough to really enjoy.

Are there other courses i'd rather play every day for the rest of my life? yes 100%. (Ganton, Alwoodley, Woodhall Spa, Saunton (East) and Notts of the courses i've played are definitely better). 

however, it doesnt deserve the criticism it gets by so many people (especially on here)


----------



## delc (Oct 19, 2015)

Duckster said:



			Not content on being one of the priciest (note, I said one of) clubs in England, it appears that they are now going to usurp the "ordinary golfer" from Wentworth's membership.

Is there such a thing at Wentworth?

On the flip side, I do actually feel sorry for the current membership, especially those who have been there for years.  Get the feeling that Sunningdale's waiting list is about to get a lot longer. 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...Surrey-club-by-Chinese-billionaire-owner.html

Click to expand...

I wonder how many Russian and Chinese billionaires there are who will want to play golf at Wentworth, at least on a regular basis?  A golf club without regular golfing members is not a golf club in my opinion!


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

MendieGK said:



			Disagree with this comment, 

Its a great golf course and the changes made were required to keep the course relevant. The greens are sub-par granted and its never worth Â£360 (Â£60 for the required caddy) but as a golf course, its a proper challenge.
 i think people who 'slate' it are often the same ones who knock the modern course (heaven forbid a great golf course not be a link or heathland). 

I would also say, that is a better golfers course, you have to hit it long and straight. so, your average Joe might find it too tough to really enjoy.

Are there other courses i'd rather play every day for the rest of my life? yes 100%. (Ganton, Alwoodley, Woodhall Spa, Saunton (East) and Notts of the courses i've played are definitely better). 

however, it doesnt deserve the criticism it gets by so many people (especially on here)
		
Click to expand...

None of those I've spoken to (not from this forum) particularly liked it - but you may well be correct in that none were really all that good, or long hitters.


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

MendieGK said:



			Disagree with this comment, 

Its a great golf course and the changes made were required to keep the course relevant. The greens are sub-par granted and its never worth Â£360 (Â£60 for the required caddy) but as a golf course, its a proper challenge.
 i think people who 'slate' it are often the same ones who knock the modern course (heaven forbid a great golf course not be a link or heathland). 

I would also say, that is a better golfers course, you have to hit it long and straight. so, your average Joe might find it too tough to really enjoy.

Are there other courses i'd rather play every day for the rest of my life? yes 100%. (Ganton, Alwoodley, Woodhall Spa, Saunton (East) and Notts of the courses i've played are definitely better). 

however, it doesnt deserve the criticism it gets by so many people (especially on here)
		
Click to expand...

I would compare it to other parkland modern courses within half hour of it - Woburn , Bearwood , Grove and Centurion 

The Grove for me is the only one below Wentworth - the rest IMO are all better than Wentworth


----------



## Rooter (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			None of those I've spoken to (not from this forum) particularly liked it - but you may well be correct in that none were really all that good, or long hitters.
		
Click to expand...

I am not a long hitter, nor very good. I loved Wentworth!


----------



## Deleted Member 1156 (Oct 19, 2015)

MendieGK said:



			Disagree with this comment, 

Its a great golf course and the changes made were required to keep the course relevant. The greens are sub-par granted and its never worth Â£360 (Â£60 for the required caddy) but as a golf course, its a proper challenge.
 i think people who 'slate' it are often the same ones who knock the modern course (heaven forbid a great golf course not be a link or heathland). 

I would also say, that is a better golfers course, you have to hit it long and straight. so, your average Joe might find it too tough to really enjoy.

Are there other courses i'd rather play every day for the rest of my life? yes 100%. (Ganton, Alwoodley, Woodhall Spa, Saunton (East) and Notts of the courses i've played are definitely better). 

however, it doesnt deserve the criticism it gets by so many people (especially on here)
		
Click to expand...




JamesR said:



			None of those I've spoken to (not from this forum) particularly liked it - but you may well be correct in that none were really all that good, or long hitters.
		
Click to expand...

Wentworth is rated so highly because of the way the rankings are done. The actual course itself only accounts for 35% of the marks, the remainder is down to conditioning, facilities etc. I'm not particularly impressed with the course, it has been turned into another 'American' style course and lost a lot of it's original heathland feel. The West course isn't even the best course at Wentworth imo. 

Back to the OP, it is a real shame for the genuine golfing members. As stated, many of them are ordinary people who sacrifice a lot of their income for the privilige of playing there and are probably not well connected enough to get into the top neighbouring clubs instead.


----------



## KenL (Oct 19, 2015)

I find it disgusting that someone can buy an established course where long standing members play and wish to make such changes.

I trust, with all their money, that the new owners will refund joining fees already paid to those who can't afford to re-join.
I certainly would not stay on, even if I could afford it.


----------



## PieMan (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The Grove for me is the only one below Wentworth
		
Click to expand...

Blundell has asked me to punch you very hard on the nose on Wednesday for that comment................  

To be honest, my view is 'so what?' If the new owner wants to go down this route then fine - it's his club after all. I would imagine though that an Â£80,000 debenture giving access to 3 top-class golf courses and other leisure facilities that you would expect from an exclusive private members club would very much appeal to those who can afford it.

And Â£80k also money well spent if you ask me if it meant you didn't have to put up with Forsyth and Tarbuck as members any longer!!! 

If the PGA (Championship  ) moved around some of the great UK courses then that's a plus in my book. And as for the European Tour offices, given how few events are actually held in the UK then makes sense to move it abroad.

Anyway have just checked my lottery numbers and it looks like I can now afford the new membership so am filling in my application form now. Don't expect to be offering any of you riff-raff an invite any time soon!


----------



## Deleted Member 1156 (Oct 19, 2015)

PieMan said:



			Anyway have just checked my lottery numbers and it looks like I can now afford the new membership so am filling in my application form now. Don't expect to be offering any of you riff-raff an invite any time soon!
		
Click to expand...

How are you raising the other Â£79,990 Paul?


----------



## PieMan (Oct 19, 2015)

drive4show said:



			How are you raising the other Â£79,990 Paul?   

Click to expand...

:rofl: :thup:

Selling Blundell's liver to medical science should help raise a fair bit!!


----------



## Deleted Member 1156 (Oct 19, 2015)

PieMan said:



			:rofl: :thup:

Selling Blundell's liver to medical science should help raise a fair bit!!
		
Click to expand...


Seriously?!?!?  It must be pickled by now


----------



## JamesR (Oct 19, 2015)

Rooter said:



			I am not a long hitter, nor very good. I loved Wentworth!
		
Click to expand...

I suppose that's the issue with opinions - we all have them, & only mine are correct


----------



## Ethan (Oct 19, 2015)

MendieGK said:



			Disagree with this comment, 

Its a great golf course and the changes made were required to keep the course relevant. The greens are sub-par granted and its never worth Â£360 (Â£60 for the required caddy) but as a golf course, its a proper challenge.
 i think people who 'slate' it are often the same ones who knock the modern course (heaven forbid a great golf course not be a link or heathland). 

I would also say, that is a better golfers course, you have to hit it long and straight. so, your average Joe might find it too tough to really enjoy.

Are there other courses i'd rather play every day for the rest of my life? yes 100%. (Ganton, Alwoodley, Woodhall Spa, Saunton (East) and Notts of the courses i've played are definitely better). 

however, it doesnt deserve the criticism it gets by so many people (especially on here)
		
Click to expand...

The changes were made because the then owner, Richard Caring was obsessed with Sawgrass and water hazards and didn't mind the course looking as fake and contrived as his own face. 

Ghastly artificial changes which they had to start to correct almost immediately. 

Wentworth West was a fine course, with many traditional heathland values, although not as good as others nearby, but has been reduced by the changes.

It stays high in the rankings because it is indeed a decent course, but its ranking is inflated by the halo of the PGA in the same way that some people think The Belfry is better than a glorified goat track just because it had the Ryder Cup.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Oct 19, 2015)

Ethan said:



			The changes were made because the then owner, Richard Caring was obsessed with Sawgrass and water hazards and didn't mind the course looking as fake and contrived as his own face. 

Ghastly artificial changes which they had to start to correct almost immediately. 
*
Wentworth West was a fine course, with many traditional heathland values, although not as good as others nearby, but has been reduced|*

It stays high in the rankings because it is indeed a decent course, but its ranking is inflated by the halo of the PGA in the same way that some people think The Belfry is better than a glorified goat track just because it had the Ryder Cup.
		
Click to expand...

*This* - as I recall really enjoying it when I first played it (I've only played it twice mind) some 15yrs ago.


----------



## chrisd (Oct 19, 2015)

I played the West Course just before the changes and LOVED the course

What I meant to say earlier was that I think the European Tour HQ will move to the London Club where I understand they are going to build a hotel and, what they describe as "world class" practice facilities.


----------



## Deleted Member 1156 (Oct 19, 2015)

chrisd said:



			I played the West Course just before the changes and LOVED the course
		
Click to expand...

Haven't you played Royal Lydd Chris? Guess you would love Wentworth then


----------



## Ethan (Oct 19, 2015)

Richard Caring





Paul Whitehouse looking a bit like him


----------



## chrisd (Oct 19, 2015)

drive4show said:



			Haven't you played Royal Lydd Chris? Guess you would love Wentworth then  

Click to expand...

It's only called "Royal" because the holes are crowned! :smirk:


----------



## Liverpoolphil (Oct 19, 2015)

PieMan said:



*Blundell has asked me to punch you very hard on the nose on Wednesday for that comment................  *

To be honest, my view is 'so what?' If the new owner wants to go down this route then fine - it's his club after all. I would imagine though that an Â£80,000 debenture giving access to 3 top-class golf courses and other leisure facilities that you would expect from an exclusive private members club would very much appeal to those who can afford it.

And Â£80k also money well spent if you ask me if it meant you didn't have to put up with Forsyth and Tarbuck as members any longer!!! 

If the PGA (Championship  ) moved around some of the great UK courses then that's a plus in my book. And as for the European Tour offices, given how few events are actually held in the UK then makes sense to move it abroad.

Anyway have just checked my lottery numbers and it looks like I can now afford the new membership so am filling in my application form now. Don't expect to be offering any of you riff-raff an invite any time soon!
		
Click to expand...



I'm very much looking forward to the same drunken debate :rofl:


----------



## Foxholer (Oct 19, 2015)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I would compare it to other parkland modern courses within half hour of it - Woburn , Bearwood , Grove and Centurion 

The Grove for me is the only one below Wentworth - the rest IMO are all better than Wentworth
		
Click to expand...

Haven't played The Grove, but played all the others and would strongly disagree! Woburn (any of the 3) might be close, but there is something special about The West Course that the others just don't have. Worth noting though that Sunningdale members refer to it as 'the Pay and Play down the road'! and, as a 'Club', it probably leaves a lot to be desired - but that is not what the course is about!

It is certainly not worth the 360 Green Fee (including Caddie)!

Caring's folly on the 18th has now been corrected - though it took 2 sets of changes to put it right! The greens are still problematic and will be until they give up the idea of having BentGrass as the dominant content in such a sheltered environment - the greens on the other 2 courses are magnificent with Poa/Rye etc! It was really only the out of date drainage that was the problem - and then only because the 2 major tournaments were held in Spring and late Autumn!

I would not be surprised if the concept of Debenture membership hasn't been misquoted - and that it is, or at least ends up as, an option rather than a compulsion!


----------



## Ethan (Oct 19, 2015)

Foxholer said:



			Caring's folly on the 18th has now been corrected
		
Click to expand...

Really? Have they filled that nasty and obviously artificial water feature in?


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Oct 19, 2015)

Loads of big clubs around here that would snap them up and the extra revenue. Shame that an iconic place is now a rich mans playground and I agree that the Tour will surely not hang around there for too long.


----------



## Foxholer (Oct 19, 2015)

Ethan said:



			Really? Have they filled that nasty and obviously artificial water feature in?
		
Click to expand...

That was only part of the 'folly'!

As correction 1, they dropped the green 50cm and increased the green by 25%...but it still wasn't tempting enough.

So they took the (hidden from the tee) bunker on right, 'trimmed' a tree and flattened the fairway to the first ditch.

And now it works fine as a risk/reward hole - for the 2nd shot - just as it used to be (or even more-so!).

And that artificial water feature was always there anyway - but just as a nasty, but useless from a golfing point of view, little creek/ditch anyway!

The same criticism - an artificial water feature - could be made about Sawgrass 17 or many of the other 'great' holes around - where something has either been manufactured or diverted in order to provide challenge or interest!


----------



## PNWokingham (Oct 19, 2015)

JamesR said:



			Back to the OP,
For those that have actually played Wentworth, is it worth the money - from what I have heard I understand not.

Perhaps the new owners will plough all the monies into improvements?
		
Click to expand...

Best value course I have ever played


----------



## backwoodsman (Oct 20, 2015)

Wentworth is already on borrowed time as regards the PGA championship as they have already been told they need to up the quality of the greens in order to retain it.  Wonder if the debenture scheme is a means to get the money? The owner may have a bob or two of his own, but you don't get that rich by spending your own money if you don't have to.


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Oct 20, 2015)

backwoodsman said:



			Wentworth is already on borrowed time as regards the PGA championship as they have already been told they need to up the quality of the greens in order to retain it.  Wonder if the debenture scheme is a means to get the money? The owner may have a bob or two of his own, but you don't get that rich by spending your own money if you don't have to.
		
Click to expand...

What time frame have they been given. Care to share the source as I don't recall anything being made public


----------



## backwoodsman (Oct 20, 2015)

HomerJSimpson said:



			What time frame have they been given. Care to share the source as I don't recall anything being made public
		
Click to expand...

Think I'll just have to leave it as my interpretation of what I've been told.


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Oct 20, 2015)

backwoodsman said:



			Think I'll just have to leave it as my interpretation of what I've been told.
		
Click to expand...

I'm not doubting it. Just wondered where it came from. Idle curiosity rather than a point scoring exercise (NO REALLY!!!!  :ears::thup::cheers


----------



## Dan2501 (Oct 21, 2015)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-34591272

Â£100,000 debentures going to come in in 2017 for current members, Â£125,000 for new members.


----------



## Piece (Oct 21, 2015)

Dan2501 said:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-34591272

Â£100,000 debentures going to come in in 2017 for current members, Â£125,000 for new members.
		
Click to expand...

Oooh, I can afford five digits of the Â£100,000....! 00,000


----------



## Alex1975 (Oct 21, 2015)

Its a lot like Bob Parsons did at Scottdale:

http://www.mygolfspy.com/bob-parsons-letter-to-members/


----------



## IanG (Oct 21, 2015)

Alex1975 said:



			Its a lot like Bob Parsons did at Scottdale:

http://www.mygolfspy.com/bob-parsons-letter-to-members/

Click to expand...

What an amazing letter - I presume it had the desired effect of getting rid of almost all the current members. !


----------



## Alex1975 (Oct 21, 2015)

IanG said:



			What an amazing letter - I presume it had the desired effect of getting rid of almost all the current members. !
		
Click to expand...


Outstanding isn't it. The mind of a billionaire.... I would have happily taken my full refund and moved on.


----------



## Tashyboy (Oct 21, 2015)

Just seen this on the news, disgusting. You can blame the new owners but the people who sold out have some responsibility as well.


----------



## drdel (Oct 21, 2015)

You can pay Â£1,000 for a starter at some 'elite' cafes so if you have the wealth then I guess the Â£100k is relatively cheap.

Personally since I'm not in that bracket and from what I saw the last time I was there I wont  be loosing any sleep at not playing the course(s).

Useful place for the super rich to stitch up some quiet deals away from us serfs.


----------



## Wilson (Oct 21, 2015)

Tashyboy said:



			Just seen this on the news, disgusting. You can blame the new owners but the people who sold out have some responsibility as well.
		
Click to expand...

People who have sold out?


----------



## PNWokingham (Oct 21, 2015)

Wow!! Queenwood is nearby and even more expensive - and so exclusive you need to be given a password to enter the "visitors" section of the website!! Then in a year or so (i am guessing) you will have the similarly exclusive Cherkley Court near Leatherhead (lord Beaverbrook's old home). That means moving from one "ultra expensive" course in Surrey to five in the next couple of years. Good luck to them - and glad I have already played Wentworth as it will be a lot to get a game going forward - maybe they will drop the matches against our club as we are way too common  Perhaps they will even frown on people sharing pictures and reviews like Queenwood.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Oct 22, 2015)

PNWokingham said:



			Wow!! Queenwood is nearby and even more expensive - and so exclusive you need to be given a password to enter the "visitors" section of the website!! Then in a year or so (i am guessing) you will have the similarly exclusive Cherkley Court near Leatherhead (lord Beaverbrook's old home). That means moving from one "ultra expensive" course in Surrey to five in the next couple of years. Good luck to them - *and glad I have already played Wentworth* as it will be a lot to get a game going forward - maybe they will drop the matches against our club as we are way too common  Perhaps they will even frown on people sharing pictures and reviews like Queenwood.
		
Click to expand...

That was my thought also - I very much doubt it will be seeing me again (or I - it). Shame for those who haven't played any of the Wentworth tracks and and now probably never will (whether you rate it or not - each to his own)


----------



## garyinderry (Oct 22, 2015)

Wentworth - Scientology, golf and country club.



Leave them to it :rofl:


----------



## Spear-Chucker (Oct 22, 2015)

Bad press for the game this. It's a shame a few mindless buffoons seek to perpetuate the myth of golf being so exclusive and the preserve of the weathy - usual case of the extreme minority getting press and not representing the larger population. Nothing new however, and not nearly as important as this effect in other walks of life but grates on me nevertheless.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Oct 22, 2015)

Spear-Chucker said:



			Bad press for the game this. It's a shame a few mindless buffoons seek to *perpetuate the myth of golf being so exclusive and the preserve of the weathy *- usual case of the extreme minority getting press and not representing the larger population. Nothing new however, and not nearly as important as this effect in other walks of life but grates on me nevertheless.
		
Click to expand...

One reason I not bothered about playing likes of Loch Lomond - these sorts of clubs put golf in a place in the minds of many of the public that I don't think does the game any good whatsoever.


----------



## Deleted member 16999 (Oct 22, 2015)

Alex1975 said:



			Its a lot like Bob Parsons did at Scottdale:

http://www.mygolfspy.com/bob-parsons-letter-to-members/

Click to expand...

Wow, Wow, their minds really do work on a different level.


----------



## Spear-Chucker (Oct 22, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			One reason I not bothered about playing likes of Loch Lomond - these sorts of clubs put golf in a place in the minds of many of the public that I don't think does the game any good whatsoever.
		
Click to expand...

Yup - especially as there's so much effort going in around the country to improve inclusiveness and level the field for everyone - not perfect, but getting there. At least there are still dozens of tremendous courses available to everyone (some at a steep price, some not) and we can leave these fools to it.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Oct 22, 2015)

Spear-Chucker said:



			Yup - especially as there's so much effort going in around the country to improve inclusiveness and level the field for everyone - not perfect, but getting there. At least there are still dozens of tremendous courses available to everyone (some at a steep price, some not) and we can leave these fools to it.
		
Click to expand...

And yet many non-golfers will read and hear about this at Wentworth and it will reinforce the prejudices in some.


----------



## FairwayDodger (Oct 22, 2015)

Alex1975 said:



			Its a lot like Bob Parsons did at Scottdale:

http://www.mygolfspy.com/bob-parsons-letter-to-members/

Click to expand...

OMG! That man should be banned from having anything to do with golf.


----------



## Foxholer (Oct 22, 2015)

Alex1975 said:





IanG said:



			What an amazing letter - I presume it had the desired effect of getting rid of almost all the current members. !
		
Click to expand...

Outstanding isn't it. The mind of a billionaire.... I would have happily taken my full refund and moved on.
		
Click to expand...

Of course, if the 65 (of around 150) members who left had 'called his bluff' an stayed, they'd not relly have noticed all that much difference!

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2014/02/04/bob-parsons-writing-own-rules-at.html


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Oct 23, 2015)

I don't think the owner will really care that the likes of me won't ever play there again. Mind you what do all these members do and where will they all go. I imagine the likes of Bearwood Lakes will be inundated with enquiries


----------



## PieMan (Oct 23, 2015)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I don't think the owner will really care that the likes of me won't ever play there again.
		
Click to expand...

I think you should also have said "I don't think the owner will really care what the likes of us on this forum say about his plans"!! 

If I was the owner of Wentworth I certainly wouldn't! :ears:

Totally non-plussed by this. If that's what he wants to do fair play to him - it's his club. Certainly if I was a multi millionaire and could easily afford to join an ultra exclusive private members club and enjoy all the benefits that brings then I would!


----------



## backwoodsman (Oct 24, 2015)

If he wants to do it, then it's his perogative. But in doing what you want, you don't have to treat people like dog-mess on the way - not even if it's Jimmy Tarbuck. But that's the ultra rich for you.

I just can't help but think that the Saturday swindle won't be much fun? I think I'll stick with my place thanks ...


----------



## delc (Oct 24, 2015)

backwoodsman said:



			If he wants to do it, then it's his perogative. But in doing what you want, you don't have to treat people like dog-mess on the way - not even if it's Jimmy Tarbuck. But that's the ultra rich for you.

I just can't help but think that the Saturday swindle won't be much fun? I think I'll stick with my place thanks ...
		
Click to expand...

I assume that a fair proportion of the Wentworth members live on the Wentworth estate as a lifestyle choice.  If I was one of them I would be pretty miffed at what is proposed, because you will either have to pay through the nose to continue to play golf there, or else travel some distance to more affordable alternatives.


----------



## Fish (Oct 24, 2015)

I've always wanted to play the West Course, mainly because of its iconic history, but reading that it isn't as good a course as The Centurion I'm not too sure I'd like to shell out that much just to say I have :mmm:


----------



## PNWokingham (Oct 24, 2015)

what is a shame is I would love to see a properly renovated East course - for me, by far the nicest design, routing and the best land utilised on the property - but the bunkering does not have any Colt left and there needs to be some TLC on green surounds etc. If they do a good job here, it could sit easily alongside the better heathlands such as St George's Hill, The Berkshire and Swinley. I can't really think of any weak holes on the East apart from the renovation needs. I can't say that about the West, where I love the first and 7-13, actually 14 is also a decent par 3 - but not much love for the rest. Not matter what they do, I can't see that course becoming really special - it is still very much through a housing estate, with several roads crossing and often the need to wait for cars, apart from the much nicer feel of 7-13. In a list of the 10 best holes on the property at least half would be on the East


----------



## PNWokingham (Oct 24, 2015)

Fish said:



			I've always wanted to play the West Course, mainly because of its iconic history, but reading that it isn't as good a course as The Centurion I'm not too sure I'd like to shell out that much just to say I have :mmm:
		
Click to expand...

I agree with that about the Centurion and Phil's comments on the other courses. I would never have left Bearwood for Wentworth even if the fees were the same


----------



## Junior (Oct 24, 2015)

I've played the West and the Edinburgh.  Honestly, the courses were lovely.  I really enjoyed both, however, I didn't feel I was at a golf 'club'.  More a resort that had members.  

At at the end of the day, a lot is spoken about the 'spirit' of golf.  What the chap at Scottsdale did, and what Wentworth are doing is not in the 'spirit' of golf, which to me, is a working mans game that should be available to the masses.

That said........am I angry at Wentworth and Scottsdale? Absolutely not.  It's business.  It's about supply and demand and making money.  As long as people want that level of exclusivity, it will always be provided.


----------



## MendieGK (Oct 24, 2015)

PNWokingham said:



			what is a shame is I would love to see a properly renovated East course - for me, by far the nicest design, routing and the best land utilised on the property - but the bunkering does not have any Colt left and there needs to be some TLC on green surounds etc. If they do a good job here, it could sit easily alongside the better heathlands such as St George's Hill, The Berkshire and Swinley. I can't really think of any weak holes on the East apart from the renovation needs. I can't say that about the West, where I love the first and 7-13, actually 14 is also a decent par 3 - but not much love for the rest. Not matter what they do, I can't see that course becoming really special - it is still very much through a housing estate, with several roads crossing and often the need to wait for cars, apart from the much nicer feel of 7-13. In a list of the 10 best holes on the property at least half would be on the East
		
Click to expand...

The 1st on the east course is probably the worst on the entire resort.


----------

