# English Girl arrested for causing earthquake



## bladeplayer (Jun 11, 2015)

Just saw on Sky News that an English girl and some others were arrested in Malaysia because locals believe that when the group posed naked on a holy mountain they caused an Earthquake that killed some people (18 i think,  hikers)

Now i think even the most sceptical of us can accept they "probably" werent the cause of the earthquake , Right ?
They are still possibly facing 3 months in jail & a big fine .. 


But the bigger issue is people saying they were silly (no doubt) and should have respected local traditions & beliefs .

Are we here in Eire & UK gone too soft ? should we be as strict on people who visit our countries ..

Or is it like most cases its one extreme to another , i know for a fact of an Irish woman been arrested in Teheran [sp] for showing her ankles outside the compound they were allowed western values inside   .. they just wont tolerate breaking their rules .. 

Thoughts ?


----------



## ADB (Jun 11, 2015)

Got a link to the photos? 

I appreciate the tolerance of the West to others, that is what makes us a civilized society. I don't think we have any such 'local rules' that visitors would need to be aware on these shores - maybe not ordering red wine with fish??


----------



## bladeplayer (Jun 11, 2015)

snaphookwedge said:



			Got a link to the photos? 

I appreciate the tolerance of the West to others, that is what makes us a civilized society. I don't think we have any such 'local rules' that visitors would need to be aware on these shores - maybe not ordering red wine with fish??
		
Click to expand...

Ha ha it did show a vague pic on sky news web page , seemingly the girl was travelling alone & met some backpackers in the hostel , hostel owner said she seemed quiet , but one older German & 2 canadians seemed trouble 
Blaming the Germans again ha


----------



## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2015)

The earthquake aspect is apparently a bit of local political point scoring that has been seized on by British red tops. Non story. Taking your clothes off with a bunch of strangers on a mountain that holds certain religious powers for locals is however very stupid. When you go to another country you do your homework and find out what is and is not acceptable. Not tough and basic to do. She has to take her medicine now. The reality is, I suspect, she will get a small fine, a slap on the wrists and told to leave the country. Unfortunately for her she will be forever on google as the naked mountain girl. Good luck at your next job interview!


----------



## User62651 (Jun 11, 2015)

We're not that tolerant either - naked rambler is in jail for 8 years I think.

Try and follow local dress codes and behaviour expectations where I can i.e wear long trousers/shirt in islamic countries or in Italian cathedrals etc. 
When you go to climb Ayers rock in central Oz there is a sign saying the local Aboriginal tribe don't want you climbing it but i did, which may have upset someone somewhere (I doubt it), but that's the only time I can recall going against some religious or cultural guidance.

You need to have your head on when travelling in far flung places, pretty silly thing for that girl to do and whilst I agree it wasn't 'seismic' I think it was foolish and she may end up paying for it. When in Rome.......


----------



## BoadieBroadus (Jun 11, 2015)

are they still making episodes of "banged up abroad" ?


----------



## USER1999 (Jun 11, 2015)

More to the point, if you don't want to be arrested, don't put the evidence on Facebook until you get home.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Jun 11, 2015)

It's probably a bit of a stretch to say that we have gone too soft and we need to be more strict based on an extremely rare and isolated incident. And call my cynical, but I imagine that the version of events that was reported in the paper was only one side of the story.  By no means saying that she deserved it, but in stories like this the nuances are often lost in rush to make headlines by whatever means.  With fear and/or distrust of jonny foreigner being the usual methods.


----------



## Pin-seeker (Jun 11, 2015)

If she's fit I can't see the problem tbh.


----------



## Paul_Stewart (Jun 11, 2015)

Did the male members of the party wear a tie in the bar afterwards?  If not, then they deserve all they get.


----------



## Hobbit (Jun 11, 2015)

I have been known to make the earth move for the odd English girl... admittedly, 30+yrs ago. 

I'll get my coat.... flashing mac...

Ba-dum tsch!!:ears:


----------



## Crazyface (Jun 11, 2015)

I cannot believe some of the responses to this on here. Even my misses was amazed when heard this on the TV this morning. Do they have an actual law covering this over there. My guess is they don't. It just goes to show how backward these people are in other countries. It beggars belief it really does. It caused an earthquake? Really, is that what you think? Jesus H !!!!!!


----------



## Lord Tyrion (Jun 11, 2015)

The earthquake story is a smokescreen. The charge is gross indecency. The mountain is a sacred place to many of the locals and they stripped off for a jolly. Imagine 10 people stripping off in St Pauls and taking pictures. Wouldn't you expect them to be hauled off on decency charges?


----------



## Pin-seeker (Jun 11, 2015)

Crazyface said:



			I cannot believe some of the responses to this on here. Even my misses was amazed when heard this on the TV this morning. Do they have an actual law covering this over there. My guess is they don't. It just goes to show how backward these people are in other countries. It beggars belief it really does. It caused an earthquake? Really, is that what you think? Jesus H !!!!!!
		
Click to expand...

Spot on.


----------



## Pin-seeker (Jun 11, 2015)

Lord Tyrion said:



			The earthquake story is a smokescreen. The charge is gross indecency. The mountain is a sacred place to many of the locals and they stripped off for a jolly. Imagine 10 people stripping off in St Pauls and taking pictures. Wouldn't you expect them to be hauled off on decency charges?
		
Click to expand...

Not if no one else was at St Paul's at the time. 
If I was at St Paul's & people stripped,as long as they're female & attractive I'd be more than happy to hold the camera.


----------



## c1973 (Jun 11, 2015)

I personally couldn't give a toss if folk walked around with bugger all on, let alone topless, wouldn't  bother me at all. 

But it's pissed off some tribe somewhere, it's their land and their rules, so pay the fine of ten bison and stop whingeing, or go to jail if that's the sentence they deem acceptable.


----------



## Fish (Jun 11, 2015)

Lord Tyrion said:



			The earthquake story is a smokescreen. The charge is gross indecency. The mountain is a sacred place to many of the locals and they stripped off for a jolly. *Imagine 10 people stripping off in St Pauls and taking pictures. Wouldn't you expect them to be hauled off on decency charges?*

Click to expand...

If they were, why don't we prosecute those that burn English flags and poppies and have banners stating death to soldiers over here etc, why are those not hauled off and prosecuted, Oh I know.... excuse me.......no comparison....we can't upset _them_ can we...


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Jun 11, 2015)

Lets not expand the topic too much.

Lets say a group of tourists got naked and urinated on a war memorial here, there would be uproar, its the same thing, the mountain is the place where their ancestors spirits live.

Its a case of not knowing what they were doing and now having to face the consequences, the earthquake thing is just silly, I think the image it portrays of the local people makes them look backward and i wouldnt be surprised if their government try to kill the story quickly, the main protagonists have already left the country,


----------



## Odvan (Jun 11, 2015)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Lets not expand the topic too much.

Lets say a group of tourists got naked and urinated on a war memorial here, there would be uproar, its the same thing, the mountain is the place where their ancestors spirits live.
		
Click to expand...

They wouldn't get put in jump suits and handcuffed 23hrs a day, though, facing 3 months jail. So it isn't the same thing.

All being well she'll be made to pay a fine and perhaps make a national public apology.

And yes, she's pretty, probably had a great set. That's more to the point, really


----------



## pbrown7582 (Jun 12, 2015)

pleaded guilty to an obscene act and facing 3 months clink.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 12, 2015)

Crazyface said:



			I cannot believe some of the responses to this on here. Even my misses was amazed when heard this on the TV this morning. Do they have an actual law covering this over there. My guess is they don't. It just goes to show how backward these people are in other countries. It beggars belief it really does. It caused an earthquake? Really, is that what you think? Jesus H !!!!!!
		
Click to expand...

So totally wrong.  So we in the 'West' know it all and understand the world, the universe and all - and our way is the civilised way - the one way - the only way.  And anyone who's belief system doesn't square with ours is an uncivilised backward numbskull?  

And so such as Brunei is an islamic state; considering implementing Sharia law, and has no time for homosexuals.  If you don't like then don't go there.  No-one forced these folks to travel to Malaysia; no-one forced them to climb a sacred mountain;no-one told them to be abusive and disrespectful.  They made their bed.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Jun 12, 2015)

Crazyface said:



			I cannot believe some of the responses to this on here. Even my misses was amazed when heard this on the TV this morning. Do they have an actual law covering this over there. My guess is they don't. It just goes to show how backward these people are in other countries. *It beggars belief it really does. It caused an earthquake? Really, is that what you think? Jesus H* !!!!!!
		
Click to expand...

Not sure if you were being deliberately being ironic with ending your post Jesus H.  But you could argue that the villagers believing this caused an earthquake is just as scientifically sound and has as much proven evidence as people believing that there is a God. Or Jesus did all the miracles. 

People can believe what they want, and the western world is not really in a great position to talk about other cultures being backwards if you are basing it on what you believe or not and how a small minority interpret those beliefs and use them to justify their 'dubious' actions.  

And this is not intended to open up a debate on the existence of God/Jesus or not, just trying to make a comparison of societal beliefs.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 12, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



			Not sure if you were being deliberately being ironic with ending your post Jesus H.  But you could argue that the villagers believing this caused an earthquake is just as scientifically sound and has as much proven evidence as people believing that there is a God. Or Jesus did all the miracles. 

People can believe what they want, and the western world is not really in a great position to talk about other cultures being backwards if you are basing it on what you believe or not and how a small minority interpret those beliefs and use them to justify their 'dubious' actions.  

And this is not intended to open up a debate on the existence of God/Jesus or not, just trying to make a comparison of societal beliefs.
		
Click to expand...

Yes - I think it amusing how so many folks who disbelieve in 'religious spiritualism' will casually use religious references - when by their own assertion what they represent is meaningless rubbish


----------



## vkurup (Jun 12, 2015)

Ignoring the media in this case and having lived in various parts of the world, I can say one thing.. follow and respect the local custom. If you are in the middle east, then cover up but if you are in France, don't cover up. 
I lived in Malaysia for sometime and once mentioned the word 'Allah' and I was told that I should not say the word as I am not a Muslim... It was a sweet Jesus moment... 
Equally it is a tolerant society, we were having a meal in a bar during the Holy month of Ramadan. The culture police walked in, checked out passport and left us alone, no such luck for the locals. It is a fantastic place and would definitely go back again. 
I am sure the media will blow it up, but I am sure the local laws will give them a fine, slap on the wrist and deport them back - will be very surprised if they do anything else.


----------



## Pin-seeker (Jun 12, 2015)

3 day prison sentence.


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Jun 12, 2015)

Didn't they get off "for time already served"?


----------



## Doon frae Troon (Jun 12, 2015)

Public school education as well.........that was money wasted.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Jun 13, 2015)

vkurup said:



			Ignoring the media in this case and having lived in various parts of the world, I can say one thing.. follow and respect the local custom. If you are in the middle east, then cover up but if you are in France, don't cover up. 
I lived in Malaysia for sometime and once mentioned the word 'Allah' and I was told that I should not say the word as I am not a Muslim... It was a sweet Jesus moment... 
Equally it is a tolerant society, we were having a meal in a bar during the Holy month of Ramadan. *The culture police walked in*, checked out passport and left us alone, no such luck for the locals. It is a fantastic place and would definitely go back again. 
I am sure the media will blow it up, but I am sure the local laws will give them a fine, slap on the wrist and deport them back - will be very surprised if they do anything else.
		
Click to expand...

They have culture police??? Cool, we should replicate that here.  They can then have the power look at anyone's viewing habits and if they watch Britain's Got Talent then you get deported.  Or if you have Sting in your record collection then you're out as well.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

My daughter is off to Thailand next month for a month - good warning for her...and we have reminded her of what her Uncle Dave tells us - he has lived in Bangkok for 15 years.  The Thais are nice and smiley to westerners when they are getting our money - but get on their wrong side or insult them and they can be really vindictive and harsh.


----------



## Crazyface (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			So totally wrong.  So we in the 'West' know it all and understand the world, the universe and all - and our way is the civilised way - the one way - the only way.  *And anyone who's belief system doesn't square with ours is an uncivilised backward numbskull? * 

And so such as Brunei is an islamic state; considering implementing Sharia law, and has no time for homosexuals.  If you don't like then don't go there.  No-one forced these folks to travel to Malaysia; no-one forced them to climb a sacred mountain;no-one told them to be abusive and disrespectful.  They made their bed.
		
Click to expand...

For believing the group caused an earthquake......oh yes !!!!!


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

Crazyface said:



			For believing the group caused an earthquake......oh yes !!!!!
		
Click to expand...

The group didn't - the group upset the spirit of of the sacred mountain.  That is their belief.  Some of us in this country don't believe in a God - can you believe *that?*


----------



## c1973 (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			My daughter is off to Thailand next month for a month - good warning for her...and we have reminded her of what her Uncle Dave tells us - he has lived in Bangkok for 15 years.  The Thais are nice and smiley to westerners when they are getting our money - but get on their wrong side or insult them and they can be really vindictive and harsh.
		
Click to expand...

Yep, you need to watch yourself over there.... one night in Bangkok makes a hard man humble, not much between despair and ecstasy, one night in Bangkok and the tough guys tumble, can't be too carefull with your company.....


----------



## Hacker Khan (Jun 15, 2015)

c1973 said:



			Yep, you need to watch yourself over there.... one night in Bangkok makes a hard man humble, not much between despair and ecstasy, one night in Bangkok and the tough guys tumble, can't be too carefull with your company..... 

Click to expand...

Thank you Mr Head.


----------



## gdunc79 (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			My daughter is off to Thailand next month for a month - good warning for her...and we have reminded her of what her Uncle Dave tells us - he has lived in Bangkok for 15 years.  The Thais are nice and smiley to westerners when they are getting our money - but get on their wrong side or insult them and they can be really vindictive and harsh.
		
Click to expand...

My daughter is only 7 but I can't imagine how I will deal with it if she says to me in late teens / early twenties that she is off to Thailand or Australia etc for a month. I know you should see as much of the world as you can, life experiences blah blah but imagine as a parent I would be worried sick rather than being pleased for her when she tells me this given all the bad things which are reported on the news these days. How do you feel about it?


----------



## c1973 (Jun 15, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



			Thank you Mr Head.
		
Click to expand...

You're very welcome.


----------



## CheltenhamHacker (Jun 15, 2015)

gdunc79 said:



			My daughter is only 7 but I can't imagine how I will deal with it if she says to me in late teens / early twenties that she is off to Thailand or Australia etc for a month. I know you should see as much of the world as you can, life experiences blah blah but imagine as a parent I would be worried sick rather than being pleased for her when she tells me this given all the bad things which are reported on the news these days. How do you feel about it?
		
Click to expand...

What bad things? One unfortunate couple were killed, this incident, and two girls caught drug smuggling. Other than that, think of the thousands (hundreds of thousands?) that have done this over the years.

If you raise a sensible girl, she'll be fine. Probably a lot safer to go and do this, than teach her to drive!


----------



## FairwayDodger (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			So totally wrong.  So we in the 'West' know it all and understand the world, the universe and all - and our way is the civilised way - the one way - the only way.  And anyone who's belief system doesn't square with ours is an uncivilised backward numbskull?  

And so such as Brunei is an islamic state; considering implementing Sharia law, and has no time for homosexuals.  If you don't like then don't go there.  No-one forced these folks to travel to Malaysia; no-one forced them to climb a sacred mountain;no-one told them to be abusive and disrespectful.  They made their bed.
		
Click to expand...

This is a bit of a tangent from the OP but it needs to be challenged. It's simply not good enough to bury our heads in the sand about these countries that deny basic human rights to parts of their own population such as women or gay people and say "just don't go there". Their religious beliefs _are _backward, I'm afraid, and should not be pandered to.


----------



## gdunc79 (Jun 15, 2015)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			What bad things? One unfortunate couple were killed, this incident, and two girls caught drug smuggling. Other than that, think of the thousands (hundreds of thousands?) that have done this over the years.

If you raise a sensible girl, she'll be fine. Probably a lot safer to go and do this, than teach her to drive!
		
Click to expand...

I know majority of young people that go travelling are absolutely fine but when it is your own child on the other side of the world experiencing different cultures and people for the first time, there must be a sense of worry as a parent. Will see what happens, but can't imagine I will be encouraging her to do it just to build her "life experience".


----------



## Lord Tyrion (Jun 15, 2015)

What right do we have to dictate to other countries? It is up to them how they behave in their country. How do you know people in Malaysia are not looking at the UK now and think we are immoral and appalling for how British people behave on a Saturday night in city centres? How can we allow British people to act as they do in Magaluf? Should Malaysia take action against Britain? We can not act as the world judge and jury.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

gdunc79 said:



			My daughter is only 7 but I can't imagine how I will deal with it if she says to me in late teens / early twenties that she is off to Thailand or Australia etc for a month. I know you should see as much of the world as you can, life experiences blah blah but imagine as a parent I would be worried sick rather than being pleased for her when she tells me this given all the bad things which are reported on the news these days. How do you feel about it?
		
Click to expand...

She's just turned 20 and is a sensible young lady and going with two of her girl friends (both also sensible) - two weeks voluntary working - two weeks holiday.  That said my wife is a bit worried - I am trusting she will not expose herself to risk.  Importantly we know that her uncle is in Bangkok and well tuned to the Thais and Thai living - and is there if they need help or advice.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

FairwayDodger said:



			This is a bit of a tangent from the OP but it needs to be challenged. It's simply not good enough to bury our heads in the sand about these countries that deny basic human rights to parts of their own population such as women or gay people and say "just don't go there". Their religious beliefs _are _backward, I'm afraid, and should not be pandered to.
		
Click to expand...

Sorry - you've lost me there - a countries religious beliefs are their own and until they change - either through internal change or change influenced from outside - then you go to these countries and you accept their rules and beliefs.  If you don't like it you don't go.  In this instance these young people knew exactly what they were doing and that what they were doing was an insult and upsetting to the locals.  What 'beliefs' that insult was based upon are not really ours to question - the simple fact is that they caused serious insult and upset to the locals and were pulled up for it.

Also to conflate a religious or spiritual belief of the sort we're talking about here with gay or women's rights is taking this to somewhere it isn't.  Oh that we in the west were so utterly civilised, beyond reproach and knowingly in possession of the 'right way'.  

In this country it seems the vast majority have largely dumped any spiritual or religious belief - unfortunately they don't seem to have been replaced it with anything that provides any great moral basis or direction and so it is hardly surprising that the spiritual beliefs of another culture will seem alien and bizarre.


----------



## FairwayDodger (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Sorry - you've lost me there - a countries religious beliefs are their own and until they change - either through internal change or change influenced from outside - then you go to these countries and you accept their rules and beliefs.  If you don't like it you don't go.  In this instance these young people knew exactly what they were doing and that what they were doing was an insult and upsetting to the locals.  What 'beliefs' that insult was based upon are not really ours to question - the simple fact is that they caused serious insult and upset to the locals and were pulled up for it.

Also to conflate a religious or spiritual belief of the sort we're talking about here with gay or women's rights is taking this to somewhere it isn't.  Oh that we in the west were so utterly civilised, beyond reproach and knowingly in possession of the 'right way'.  

In this country it seems the vast majority have largely dumped any spiritual or religious belief - unfortunately they don't seem to have been replaced it with anything that provides any great moral basis or direction and so it is hardly surprising that the spiritual beliefs of another culture will seem alien and bizarre.
		
Click to expand...

I've been away on holiday so don't really know much about the incident in the OP. (Although, on the face of it, the suggestion that getting naked on a mountain caused an earthquake is insane.) I'm simply responding to the tangent you took it down with your "just don't go there" comment about countries that "don't like homosexuals". I am not content to ignore those nations that persecute sections of their population in the name of religion, whether that be gays or women or any other group.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

FairwayDodger said:



			I've been away on holiday so don't really know much about the incident in the OP. (Although, on the face of it, the suggestion that getting naked on a mountain caused an earthquake is insane.) I'm simply responding to the tangent you took it down with your "just don't go there" comment about countries that "don't like homosexuals". I am not content to ignore those nations that persecute sections of their population in the name of religion, whether that be gays or women or any other group.
		
Click to expand...

I never mentioned homosexuals...

you got wrong poster methinks...

not me...

Anyway - believing that the insult may have been the initiator of an earthquake is no more insane than you or I praying that Scotland will qualify for the next Euro Champs and if they do feeling that our prayers had been answered.  Unless that is you believe in God.


----------



## FairwayDodger (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			So totally wrong.  So we in the 'West' know it all and understand the world, the universe and all - and our way is the civilised way - the one way - the only way.  And anyone who's belief system doesn't square with ours is an uncivilised backward numbskull?  

And so such as Brunei is an islamic state; considering implementing Sharia law, and has no time for *homosexuals*.  If you don't like then don't go there.  No-one forced these folks to travel to Malaysia; no-one forced them to climb a sacred mountain;no-one told them to be abusive and disrespectful.  They made their bed.
		
Click to expand...




SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			I never mentioned homosexuals...

you got wrong poster methinks...

not me...
		
Click to expand...

lol


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

FairwayDodger said:



			lol
		
Click to expand...

Sorry - quite right - a few days back I think - I was simply stating a fact about Brunei as I understand it and saying that if you don't like that then don't go there.  And put pressure on the UK and EU government to state to Brunei our disagreement on such beliefs - limiting if you want trade etc with that country.  But we DO ourselves continue to go on holiday to countries that have laws that we believe are outdated and frankly unacceptable.  But that is their right - and our choice.


----------



## FairwayDodger (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Sorry - quite right - a few days back I think - I was simply stating a fact about Brunei as I understand it and saying that if you don't like that then don't go there.  And put pressure on the UK and EU government to state to Brunei our disagreement on such beliefs - limiting if you want trade etc with that country.  But we DO ourselves continue to go on holiday to countries that have laws that we believe are outdated and frankly unacceptable.  But that is their right - and our choice.
		
Click to expand...

And this is the point I was quibbling about. (Might have been a few days ago to you but I haven't been here over the last week so catching up.)

It is not the right (or should not be) of these countries to persecute sections of their population just for existing. People have to live in these backward countries and face persecution on a daily basis - they don't have the option to "just don't go there". 

I wish the "international community" would do more about these nations, for example ostracise them as they did with South Africa during apartheid. Instead we pander to them, make excuses for their religious and cultural beliefs and even, unbelievably, take major international events like the world cup there.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

FairwayDodger said:



			And this is the point I was quibbling about. (Might have been a few days ago to you but I haven't been here over the last week so catching up.)

It is not the right (or should not be) of these countries to persecute sections of their population just for existing. People have to live in these backward countries and face persecution on a daily basis - they don't have the option to "just don't go there". 

I wish the "international community" would do more about these nations, for example ostracise them as they did with South Africa during apartheid. Instead we pander to them, make excuses for their religious and cultural beliefs and even, unbelievably, take major international events like the world cup there.
		
Click to expand...

indeed - and if we are not to be hypocrites in these things we best stop going on holiday to a lot of countries that are rather 'behind the curve' in their thinking.

This incident was about respect for others cultures and beliefs, and western arrogance, when visiting a country where these are different to ours.  I am told that in Germany crossing a main road other than at a defined crossing point is a no-no.  May seem very very silly to me when the road is quiet - but when in Germany I adhere.


----------



## CheltenhamHacker (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			indeed - and if we are not to be hypocrites in these things we best stop going on holiday to a lot of countries that are rather 'behind the curve' in their thinking.

This incident was about respect for others cultures and beliefs, and western arrogance, when visiting a country where these are different to ours.  I am told that in Germany crossing a main road other than at a defined crossing point is a no-no.  May seem very very silly to me when the road is quiet - but when in Germany I adhere.
		
Click to expand...

I think it's a bit of a push to compare crossing roads at the right point, with persecution of minorities in other countries.


----------



## FairwayDodger (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			indeed - and if we are not to be hypocrites in these things we best stop going on holiday to a lot of countries that are rather 'behind the curve' in their thinking.

This incident was about respect for others cultures and beliefs, and western arrogance, when visiting a country where these are different to ours.  I am told that in Germany crossing a main road other than at a defined crossing point is a no-no.  May seem very very silly to me when the road is quiet - but when in Germany I adhere.
		
Click to expand...

Indeed, I think this incident is a quite different matter than your somewhat throwaway comment that irked me.

Regardless of how silly a local superstition like this may seem, a tourist is stupid not to adhere to it. I would, however, put the actions of these backpackers down to the recklessness and naivety of youth rather than "western arrogance".

Oh, I often violated that German crossing rule but I did feel like a bit of a villain for doing so!


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 15, 2015)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			I think it's a bit of a push to compare crossing roads at the right point, with persecution of minorities in other countries.
		
Click to expand...

The young folk in Malaysia were not being persecuted - they were being disrespectful and arrogant to their hosts.  I simply make the point that something in one country can seem silly to folks from another not used to the restriction, habit or belief.  It's actually, as you say, a very different situation from the sorts of persecution (usually sexual or gender related) you mention.

The young folk should have not been so stupid and arrogant to think it was OK to disrespect the beliefs of their hosts, no matter how illogical and silly they might have thought these beliefs to be.


----------



## CheltenhamHacker (Jun 15, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			The young folk in Malaysia were not being persecuted - they were being disrespectful and arrogant to their hosts.  I simply make the point that something in one country can seem silly to folks from another not used to the restriction, habit or belief.  It's actually, as you say, a very different situation from the sorts of persecution (usually sexual or gender related) you mention.

The young folk should have not been so stupid and arrogant to think it was OK to disrespect the beliefs of their hosts, no matter how illogical and silly they might have thought these beliefs to be.
		
Click to expand...

Moving on from the bigger issues, and focusing on this one, I would be surprised if they actually knew about the religious beliefs around the mountain. Having been travelling briefly, I know of people who have stripped off halfway up mountains for pictures, who had no idea of not about the status of the mountain. I doubt that they deliberatly "disrespected the beliefs of their hosts", IMO


----------



## Baldy Bouncer (Jun 15, 2015)

She could`ve a least got her norks out on TV the other day, when she gave her statement to the press, so we could`ve seen what all the fuss was about!:thup:
Spoilsport.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2015)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			Moving on from the bigger issues, and focusing on this one, *I would be surprised if they actually knew about the religious beliefs around the mountain. *Having been travelling briefly, I know of people who have stripped off halfway up mountains for pictures, who had no idea of not about the status of the mountain. I doubt that they deliberatly "disrespected the beliefs of their hosts", IMO
		
Click to expand...

BiB - my understanding is that their guide was telling them all about how the mountain had strong spiritual meaning for the local people - and the travellers told the guide to get lost and not to be so stupid when he appealed to them to not strip off - when he was telling them very clearly that it was very disrespectful.  They knew.


----------



## Paul_Stewart (Jun 16, 2015)

Baldy Bouncer said:



			She could`ve a least got her norks out on TV the other day, when she gave her statement to the press, so we could`ve seen what all the fuss was about!:thup:
Spoilsport.

Click to expand...

Norks?   Is that posh for tits?


----------



## vkurup (Jun 16, 2015)

In many ways I think the young lady and her family were very grown up about it... it was a silly mistake to ignore the local customs, they admitted it and they went off with a wrap on the knuckles..  time to move on and return to normal life.. (unlike the Sun or mirror which ran something like.. 'my boobies caused an earthquake')


----------



## Fyldewhite (Jun 16, 2015)

All just over reported and sensationalised by the press. A bit of high jinx that went too far, that's all. Not really a story but bring the ridiculous earthquake scenario into it coupled with the threat of a 3 month jail term imposed by these backward people on innocent western tourists having a bit of fun and hey presto, the "it's an outrage, something must be done!" brigade are out in force. Can't believe so many get suckered in every time. The end result was very similar to what you'd expect anywhere for a public decency offence.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2015)

vkurup said:



			In many ways I think the young lady and her family were very grown up about it... it was a silly mistake to ignore the local customs, they admitted it and they went off with a wrap on the knuckles..  time to move on and return to normal life.. (unlike the Sun or mirror which ran something like.. 'my boobies caused an earthquake')
		
Click to expand...

I agree - I think they have dealt with it fine; the lass's contrition is obvious.  And that should be the end of it - sending out a warning to us all to respect local cultures and beliefs - no matter how archaic or bizarre these might seem.


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			BiB - my understanding is that their guide was telling them all about how the mountain had strong spiritual meaning for the local people - and the travellers told the guide to get lost and not to be so stupid when he appealed to them to not strip off - when he was telling them very clearly that it was very disrespectful.  They knew.
		
Click to expand...

Hearsay


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

Fyldewhite said:



			All just over reported and sensationalised by the press. A bit of high jinx that went too far, that's all. Not really a story but bring the ridiculous earthquake scenario into it coupled with the threat of a 3 month jail term imposed by these backward people on innocent western tourists having a bit of fun and hey presto, the "it's an outrage, something must be done!" brigade are out in force. Can't believe so many get suckered in every time. The end result was very similar to what you'd expect anywhere for a public decency offence.
		
Click to expand...


----------



## Hacker Khan (Jun 16, 2015)

Fish said:



			Hearsay
		
Click to expand...

Your wish is my command

[video]https://youtu.be/TgtdZaa01Ws[/video]


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2015)

Fish said:



			Hearsay
		
Click to expand...

As reported by the Daily Telegraph 11th June - and no mention in the report of the guide's word being doubted.

_â€œAround 7am, while the group were on their way back from the summit, they started to strip off their clothes â€“ ignoring their guide,â€ said the official complaint, obtained by The Telegraph. â€œThe guide warned them not to do so, but they replied: 'Stupid man, go to hell.â€™_


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

Hacker Khan said:



			Your wish is my command

[video]https://youtu.be/TgtdZaa01Ws[/video]
		
Click to expand...

Thanks, how I miss them :smirk:


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			As reported by the Daily Telegraph 11th June - and no mention in the report of the guide's word being doubted.

_â€œAround 7am, while the group were on their way back from the summit, they started to strip off their clothes â€“ ignoring their guide,â€ said the official complaint, obtained by The Telegraph. â€œThe guide warned them not to do so, but they replied: 'Stupid man, go to hell.â€™_

Click to expand...

Still hearsay!


----------



## CheltenhamHacker (Jun 16, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			As reported by the Daily Telegraph 11th June - and no mention in the report of the guide's word being doubted.

_â€œAround 7am, while the group were on their way back from the summit, they started to strip off their clothes â€“ ignoring their guide,â€ said the official complaint, obtained by The Telegraph. â€œThe guide warned them not to do so, but they replied: 'Stupid man, go to hell.â€™_

Click to expand...

Forgive me for being sceptical, but a) I doubt they would say that and b) the guide is hardly likely to say "i let them do it"


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			Forgive me for being sceptical, but a) I doubt they would say that and b) the guide is hardly likely to say "i let them do it"
		
Click to expand...



 :thup:


----------



## c1973 (Jun 16, 2015)

I haven't noticed any of them saying the guides talking crap though. You'd think they'd be denying that part of it, no?


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2015)

c1973 said:



			I haven't noticed any of them saying the guides talking crap though. You'd think they'd be denying that part of it, no?
		
Click to expand...

quite...


----------



## Fish (Jun 16, 2015)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			quite...
		
Click to expand...

Makes a refreshing change from, Indeed.


----------



## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2015)

Fish said:



			Makes a refreshing change from, Indeed.
		
Click to expand...

Indeed!


----------

