# 2 questions for Foxholer



## JustOne (Jul 6, 2012)

1) Should the toe of the club point upwards early on in the backswing when the club gets parallel to the ground at approx thigh level?

2) Should we cup the left wrist through impact/release?


...just wondering.


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## JustOne (Jul 7, 2012)

Whilst you're reading this (whoever you are...) ....anyone else care to dive in with their thoughts?


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## Doh (Jul 7, 2012)

I always believed  that the face should be slightly closed when it gets to thigh level, and you should have a flat left wrist through impact.

Correct me if I am wrong.


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## jdchelsea (Jul 7, 2012)

I'm with doh - slightly closed at parallel. At impact I actually thought the left wrist should be straight or even slightly bowed.

Be interested to hear what's correct.


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## kid2 (Jul 7, 2012)

No the toe doesnt have to be pointing to the sky in the takeaway....

But i do think that it may come down to swing plane.....For instance.....In the one plane swing because you have a more bent over posture the club face will be slightly closed in the backcswing at thigh level.....It may look closed but its actually mirroring the angle of the spine...

So in actual fact its square to the spine angle...
So if everything stays the same in the downswing then you'll be square through impact....
Its explained little better here..... 

[video=youtube;ddz-Pxj5WTU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddz-Pxj5WTU&feature=player_detailpage[/video]


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## RGDave (Jul 7, 2012)

Doh said:



			I always believed that the face should be slightly closed when it gets to thigh level
		
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I remember years ago being encouraged to get the toe pointing directly up. Since then, that seems to have become less popular.

The way I see it (not that this is educated work, mind you) is that IF you stood bolt upright and swung the club like a baseball bat (off a 3 foot tee!) , the toe would be pointing directly up. If you could swing with your whole body suspended in the air totally horizontal (I know it's impossible) then the toe/sole would be pointing horizontal with the ground....i.e. the face would point at the grass.

So where's the point of reference with all this?

It's got to be the SPINE, since that's what we are swinging around.

Look at our skeleton-man here. He's standing, leaning over in golf posture so his spine angle (the green line) can be clearly drawn over. 







I would expect the sole of the club to match that line as he moves from his takeaway to setting/cocking the wrists.

Surely, if the toe was pointing skywards, he would have manipulated the face open during the first move?

I must have rehearsed this move 10,000 times.....I'm never going back to the "old-style" now.


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## RGDave (Jul 7, 2012)

Thanks Kid.

I like that video, although I can't see me going down that route, looks a bit scary to me. I definitely seem stuck permanently two-plane.

(or knowing me, 3 planes and an extra one for luck!)

Anyway, here's another photo.

Self explanatory


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## SocketRocket (Jul 7, 2012)

Pointing the toe directly upwards is a 'Big No Go' :lol:  It should ideally be parallel with the forward spine tilt. It will then be square to the swingplane.

I like to keep the same cup in the left wrist at address to the top of the backswing so there is no unnecessary manipulation going on.  Through impact the forces on the left wrist will tend to straighten or even bow it forward a little.


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## JustOne (Jul 7, 2012)

^
^
^
What about on the through swing?


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## SocketRocket (Jul 7, 2012)

JustOne said:



			^
^
^
What about on the through swing?
		
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I try and keep the clubface square to the swingpath and my spine tilt as long as possible so that no manipulations need to be made to square it up.     So, halfway into the through swing the clubface will be leaning to the right like my spine.   As I lift up towards the end it will become more up and down, still matching my spine tilt.    I tend to drop the club back down infront of me at the end of the swing and check that the clubface is still in a square position.


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## USER1999 (Jul 7, 2012)

RGDave said:









.
		
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This guy really needs to eat more?

Not built like any golfer I know.


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## RGDave (Jul 7, 2012)

murphthemog said:



			This guy really needs to eat more?

Not built like any golfer I know.
		
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If you went on the worlds most fierce diet, you never know 

Actually, he's like me, except I have 30 years of puppy fat.


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## RGDave (Jul 7, 2012)

JustOne said:



			^
^
^
What about on the through swing?
		
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Through swing.....is that the bit where it all goes wrong?


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## SocketRocket (Jul 7, 2012)

RGDave said:



			I remember years ago being encouraged to get the toe pointing directly up. Since then, that seems to have become less popular.







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I think this guy has connection problems. His head bone is not connected to his neck bone and his back bone is not connected to his hip bone.   Oh! hear the words of the Lord.


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## DaveM (Jul 7, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I think this guy has connection problems. His head bone is not connected to his neck bone and his back bone is not connected to his hip bone. Oh! hear the words of the Lord.
		
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Sounds a bit like me. Only this guy has more meat on his bones, than me


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 7, 2012)

kid2 said:



			No the toe doesnt have to be pointing to the sky in the takeaway....

But i do think that it may come down to swing plane.....For instance.....In the one plane swing because you have a more bent over posture the club face will be slightly closed in the backcswing at thigh level.....It may look closed but its actually mirroring the angle of the spine...

So in actual fact its square to the spine angle...
So if everything stays the same in the downswing then you'll be square through impact....
Its explained little better here..... 

[video=youtube;ddz-Pxj5WTU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddz-Pxj5WTU&feature=player_detailpage[/video]
		
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This is exactly what I've been working on. Still across the line more than technically correct but better than it was. These two positions will help me get it better


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## kid2 (Jul 7, 2012)

HomerJSimpson said:



			This is exactly what I've been working on. Still across the line more than technically correct but better than it was. These two positions will help me get it better
		
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Its what im working on too Homer...The good thing about this chap is its easy to follow and he has just 2 videos...1 for the 1PS Backswing and one for the 1PS downswing......


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## kid2 (Jul 7, 2012)

RGDave said:



			Thanks Kid.

I like that video, although I can't see me going down that route, looks a bit scary to me. I definitely seem stuck permanently two-plane.

(or knowing me, 3 planes and an extra one for luck!)

Anyway, here's another photo.

Self explanatory






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Thats the Video im working off Dave.....Slowly but getting there.....
My swing has bits closer to that than a 2 plane swing...
Thats why it feels more natural to me.


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## kid2 (Jul 7, 2012)

JustOne said:



			^
^
^
What about on the through swing?
		
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James at a guess i would think ideally that the through swing at that same point ie. thigh high....The club head would still mirror the spine angle....
And all things being correct there would be no rising out of the posture , no early extension, and very little forearm rotation if none at all...
I would think that if everything in the through swing was a mirror image of the backswing we'd all be hitting straight shots....
Technically i know its a very hard thing to repeat.


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## JustOne (Jul 9, 2012)

C'mon Foxy.... where are you pal?


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## jdchelsea (Jul 10, 2012)

JustOne said:



			C'mon Foxy.... where are you pal? 

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Seeing as foxholer isn't going to reply are you going to give us your thoughts on this?


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## JustOne (Jul 10, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Seeing as foxholer isn't going to reply are you going to give us your thoughts on this?
		
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Sure. The essence of the post followed on from the thread pertaining to rolling the wrists.. should you or shouldn't you. From the information Trackman provides about ballflight laws it's clear that the clubface to draw the ball is open to the target... so rolling your wrists would (at least) risk the clubface closing too much and you hitting hooks all day. If you think about rolling the wrists you have to ask WHEN it would occur... if it's before the ball then you're in trouble, if it's as the ball is hit then how on earth do you get that spot on every time (and what effect would it have) and if it's after the ball the does it matter at all?

....and yet you can find 1,000's of instruction pieces on the web/forums/youtube all talking about the necessity to roll your wrists, when it clearly isn't necessary, if any rolling occurs it's down to the the PHYSICAL need and the way our joints work that the clubhead may turn over, if at all.

The questions I posed were not just tongue in cheek but great examples of misinformation and how we interpret them... wrongly in most instances.

If you take the first question:




			1) Should the toe of the club point upwards early on in the backswing when the club gets parallel to the ground at approx thigh level?
		
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The answer is NO and yet you'll find 1,000's or even 10's of 1,000's of instruction pieces across all media stating that the clubhead should be vertical. As you can see from some of the pictures posted above in the replies it's clearly not the case that the toe is pointed upwards.... indeed it points at a tilted angle towards the line of the stance that the player has adopted... the 'assumed' target line.

This example clearly shows that rolling the wrists and 'toe up' are essentially misinformation.. take that as you will.

The second question:
2) Should we cup the left wrist through impact/release?

Actually refers to an interesting phenom (closely related to the rolling of the wrists question)..... and here's a picture...




As you can see McIlroy has a cupped left wrist at the top of his swing... when did that happen? Is it something we are supposed to play for? Do you swing through and ACTIVELY think "I need to make sure I cup my wrist on the follow through"?... I don't think so. It's something that we PHYSICALLY do, call it a comfort thing if you want.. we don't have to do it.. just like rolling the club/wrists in the follow through...we do it because it just happens sometimes (according to the shot we're playing sometimes).

As it happens we should NOT cup our left wrist through impact, it should remain as flat as possible... of course there are limits ranging from 'a bit cupped' to 'a bit bowed' but the point being we shouldn't actively try to cup our wrist through the ball.. if it happens AFTER we've struck the ball it's biomechanics that causes it and not a conscious 'timing' effort on our part.


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## Foxholer (Jul 10, 2012)

JustOne said:



			C'mon Foxy.... where are you pal? 

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Woops. Only just discovered this!

To answer the questions though.

1. Don't really care!
2. Don't really care!

It's what happening at impact that matters.

However:



SocketRocket said:



			Pointing the toe directly upwards is a 'Big No Go' :lol: It should ideally be parallel with the forward spine tilt. It will then be square to the swingplane.
		
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Square to the swing plane seems pretty sensible to me - though I'd replace the 'Big No Go' with 'Undesireable' though. Iffy (and not really qualified to comment) on relationship to spine angle - 1PS vs 2PS?

I believe wrist cupping, or not, is very personal. Hogan cupped. Tiger is flat. Cupping can help reduce hooks. Flat reduce slices (and the detrimental reverse of course).

BTW JO. It appears you didn't need m to reply anyway. You've answered your own question (again?)!


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## SGC001 (Jul 11, 2012)

Here's a couple of images (hopefully) from Cochran and Stobbs search for the perfect swing.

They identify 5 movements in a model backswing: 
a turn of the shoulders around the spine axis
raising the arm vertically from the shoulder and cocking the wrist 
arm swung across the chest putting the hand in plane 
roll of the left forearm putting the clubhead into plane 

Images 1 and 2 show these 5 movements

http://img6.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/16337/16337588-100x100-40d78e12db5ad2ae7d3f1d886b148cee.jpg

http://img8.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/16337/16337589-100x100-6bafdd1cb191b7fa57489bcdbc65b1e6.jpg

They identify roll of the left forearm as movement enabling the backswing of the left arm to follow the model.

Image 3 gives may help to picture forearm roll, by imaging the relationship of the forearm bones

http://img2.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/16337/16337590-100x100-b26f9d7eca5cc32ac5db65d8f851377d.jpg

Image 4 illustrates the discussion on takeaway they had

http://img7.uploadhouse.com/fileuploads/16337/16337601-100x100-bfd970f811a74a916abf185007beef36.jpg

As for roll they discuss what they term squares and rollers and write: There is always roll; but the amount, and timing, of roll which a player uses can vary widely.

Of the earlier images in the thread with the skeleton (where are they from I like them) it's interesting to note the left hand position at the top and where the club would point in relation to that hand position. It seems similar to the last 2 drawings in image 2 here (with and without left arm roll).


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## JustOne (Jul 11, 2012)

SGC001, the pics are too small to see precisely the message they are trying to convey. Are they discussing the 'toe up' position?

That said there is arguement for whether or not there is roll in relation to how well you turn your shoulders, if you turn well then there's little/no roll, however if you use what can be described as a FAKE TURN (where the left arm practically lays across the shoulder plane and you THINK you're turning whereas you haven't really turned your upper body at all) you can end up with huge amounts of forearm roll.... not really the advised way to swing a club though 

In club golfers there's probably a very high % of players that in reality use a fake turn so the forearms DO roll. Not ideally the thing to be taught though.


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## jdchelsea (Jul 11, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			I believe wrist cupping, or not, is very personal. Hogan cupped. Tiger is flat. Cupping can help reduce hooks. Flat reduce slices (and the detrimental reverse of course).
		
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Hogans book says "every good golfer has his left wrist in this supinating position" why do you think he cupped it?


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## Foxholer (Jul 11, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Hogans book says "every good golfer has his left wrist in this supinating position" why do you think he cupped it?
		
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I think you are confused about what supination/pronation actually is. It doesn't actually involve the wrist at all, though position of the wrist (or palm of hand) can show it happening. It's certainly different to cupping/bowing them!. The early part of this vid has a good explanation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rj7azIXTHIE 

As stated, Hogan was 'obsessed' with avoiding hooking and had a cupped left wrist at the top of his back-swing. However, virtually his first move in the down-swing was to flatten (or even slightly bow) it.  At impact, his wrist was slightly bowed - heading to flat, 'hinging' into being cupped as part of the release. I'm pretty sure that position (bowed left wrist at impact) is now out of favour with teachers.

Check this vid out - noting the 'description' of Hogan's 'supinating' term! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zguHdt_d86o

Here's a better vid of Hogan's swing. Check left wrist/hand position at start, top of backswing and impact (1:16).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=UXkYzjoO09A


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## jdchelsea (Jul 11, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			I think you are confused about what supination/pronation actually is. It doesn't actually involve the wrist at all, though position of the wrist (or palm of hand) can show it happening. It's certainly different to cupping/bowing them!. The early part of this vid has a good explanation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rj7azIXTHIE 

As stated, Hogan was 'obsessed' with avoiding hooking and had a cupped left wrist at the top of his back-swing. However, virtually his first move in the down-swing was to flatten (or even slightly bow) it.  At impact, his wrist was slightly bowed - heading to flat, 'hinging' into being cupped as part of the release. I'm pretty sure that position (bowed left wrist at impact) is now out of favour with teachers.

Check this vid out - noting the 'description' of Hogan's 'supinating' term! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zguHdt_d86o

Here's a better vid of Hogan's swing. Check left wrist/hand position at start, top of backswing and impact (1:16).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=UXkYzjoO09A

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Was just checking because the question was at impact and I knew cupping was probably a major no no at impact and wondered how Hogan got away with it ha ha at least I know it's straight or bowed again.
.
Ps does anybody not cup their wrist in the follow thru? otherwise would it not be virtually impossible to get the club finishing behind your head?!


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## Foxholer (Jul 11, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Ps does anybody not cup their wrist in the follow thru? otherwise would it not be virtually impossible to get the club finishing behind your head?!
		
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From JO's vid of Luke. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7O7gDTVCygo

Not much cupping in that swing/follow through.

And, indeed, no rolling of wrists (pronation/supination). But that's not what THIS thread is about.


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## bladeplayer (Jul 11, 2012)

Crikey .. i just put the ball down & try hit it ... couldnt tell ya where the clubhead is pointing or what plane im on.. Half tempted to go out and get a club to check where its pointing .. only plane i care about is the one taking me to Lanzarote on monday 

Do all these plnes & where the club is pointing change per person  depending on age , height,  build etc ?

Does the pic in the avatar show anything bout my swing ? prob not just asking out of curiosity , must get my swing analysed some time ,   it was a PW to a par 3 , 135 yards to the middle ,


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## Foxholer (Jul 11, 2012)

bladeplayer said:



			Crikey .. i just put the ball down & try hit it ... couldnt tell ya where the clubhead is pointing or what plane im on.. Half tempted to go out and get a club to check where its pointing .. only plane i care about is the one taking me to Lanzarote on monday 

Do all these plnes & where the club is pointing change per person  depending on age , height,  build etc ?

Does the pic in the avatar show anything bout my swing ? prob not just asking out of curiosity , must get my swing analysed some time ,   it was a PW to a par 3 , 135 yards to the middle ,
		
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Far and away the best thing to do imo!

If you are hitting a PW 135 in the right direction consistently, there doesn't seem a huge need to be thinking much about cupping, bowing, pronation, supination or the like.

Planes might be different for individuals. Ball flight laws are 'universal'.

Just let the swing flow!


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## jdchelsea (Jul 11, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			From JO's vid of Luke. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7O7gDTVCygo

Not much cupping in that swing/follow through.

And, indeed, no rolling of wrists (pronation/supination). But that's not what THIS thread is about.
		
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Watched 6 minutes of that I couldn't see if there was cupping or not but in this video at 14-16 seconds of Donald when the wrists first appear over his shoulder there is cupping.

Don't know I really care that much but I imagine most golfers would have a cupped left wrist in the follow through

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08rpqW2Z9Vw&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## kid2 (Jul 11, 2012)

bladeplayer said:



			Does the pic in the avatar show anything bout my swing ? prob not just asking out of curiosity , must get my swing analysed some time ,   it was a PW to a par 3 , 135 yards to the middle ,
		
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Dont do anything foolish Pal.....
If your off 7.8 then your swing cant be all that bad!
You must be doing something half right at least.

Enjoy the Hols.:thup:


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## SocketRocket (Jul 11, 2012)

Back to wrist cup.   I think that you need to cup the left wrist so that it can hinge correctly.  If you keep it flat you will reduce the range the wrists can hinge and this will reduce the power of your swing.

The attached Video from Shawn Clements shows this nicely:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFGrmHocmjM&feature=relmfu


Regarding Cochran & Stubbs and Hogans wrist roll: This was something that allowed the clubface to sit under the plane at the top of the swing.  If you consider Hogan's imaginary plane of glass sitting over his shoulders and his idea of not letting the clubhead pass through it then you will have to roll the wrists clockwise at the top.. This is something that is not so popular these days as it is thought more desirable to keep the clubface square to the swingpath, reducing the manipulation to get it back square at impact.   Hogan's suppination where the left palm pointed upwards through impact was something he needed to do to square the clubface after dropping it under plane at the top.   It also created the big forward bow in his left wrist.


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## Foxholer (Jul 11, 2012)

Interesting commentary from 2:50 to about 3:00. 

As stated a couple of times before, that wasn't supination; that was bowing, pure and simple.


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## jdchelsea (Jul 11, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			Interesting commentary from 2:50 to about 3:00. 

As stated a couple of times before, that wasn't supination; that was bowing, pure and simple.
		
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Am I missing something?! At 2:50 he talks about Donald recocking his wrist! What's that got to do with the price of fish?


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## bladeplayer (Jul 11, 2012)

kid2 said:



			Dont do anything foolish Pal.....
If your off 7.8 then your swing cant be all that bad!
You must be doing something half right at least.

Enjoy the Hols.:thup:
		
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Will do mate ta , we must organise a knock before the year is over , im restricted in august with other guys holidays but we get something done , Limerick only 2 hours down the motor way from me , my niece in UL .. chat after the holidays


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## kid2 (Jul 11, 2012)

bladeplayer said:



			Will do mate ta , we must organise a knock before the year is over , im restricted in august with other guys holidays but we get something done , Limerick only 2 hours down the motor way from me , my niece in UL .. chat after the holidays
		
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No worries.:thup:


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## JustOne (Jul 11, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			Interesting commentary from 2:50 to about 3:00. 

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			....and yet you can find 1,000's of instruction pieces on the web/forums/youtube all talking about the necessity to roll your wrists, when it clearly isn't necessary
		
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.....


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## Smiffy (Jul 12, 2012)

Only roll I am worried about is a bacon one.


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## Foxholer (Jul 12, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Am I missing something?! At 2:50 he talks about Donald recocking his wrist! What's that got to do with the price of fish? 

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Yes you are. Try checking out the vid I was referring to - the Shawn Clements one in SR's post http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFGrm...feature=relmfu

Didn't think I needed to quote SR's post, as mine was directly below his!


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## jdchelsea (Jul 12, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			Yes you are. Try checking out the vid I was referring to - the Shawn Clements one in SR's post http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFGrm...feature=relmfu

Didn't think I needed to quote SR's post, as mine was directly below his! 

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Does that video deal with wrist position in the follow through? If not why put it up! You suggested the left wrist in the follow through is either flat or cupped. I asked the question has anyone got a flat wrist in the follow through to which you have put links up for videos that are either inconclusive (Donald) or completely irrelevant (Clement). I have shown a video that shows Donald does have a cupped wrist.

My point is every player has a cupped left wrist in the follow through because I have seen no evidence to suggest otherwise and videos describing the top of the backswing are irrelevant so please don't post any more links for that please


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## JustOne (Jul 12, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			My point is every player has a cupped left wrist in the follow through because I have seen no evidence to suggest otherwise and videos describing the top of the backswing are irrelevant so please don't post any more links for that please
		
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I agree the left wrist cups AT SOME POINT after you've hit the ball.... but do you intentionally try and make that happen? Do you think "Right, I've got to start cupping my wrist when the club is 2ft past the ball" or does it just 'happen'?

If we agree that it just happens then clearly there's no manipulation of the swing... you're not trying to 'control it' per se.

One thing we do know is that you shouldn't be cupping it BEFORE you've hit the ball


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## jdchelsea (Jul 12, 2012)

JustOne said:



			I agree the left wrist cups AT SOME POINT after you've hit the ball.... but do you intentionally try and make that happen? Do you think "Right, I've got to start cupping my wrist when the club is 2ft past the ball" or does it just 'happen'?

If we agree that it just happens then clearly there's no manipulation of the swing... you're not trying to 'control it' per se.

One thing we do know is that you shouldn't be cupping it BEFORE you've hit the ball 

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Agree with all of that i.e. it happens as a result of what's already happened


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## JustOne (Jul 12, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Agree with all of that i.e. it happens as a result of what's already happened
		
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So would you agree that it's the same for rolling the wrists?

You don't think "I've got to roll my wrists" it just happens (if at all) waaaaaay after the ball has left the clubface... i.e no manipulation


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## SocketRocket (Jul 12, 2012)

I thought Shawn's video was very clear on wrist cupping.  Your left wrist naturally cups as it hinges up.  If you try to stop it then it severely restricts the natural movement of the wrist.

The momentum of the follow through will re hinge the wrists (unless you forceably try to stop them)  This will naturally create a cupping.


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## JustOne (Jul 12, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I thought Shawn's video was very clear on wrist cupping.  Your left wrist naturally cups as it hinges up.  If you try to stop it then it severely restricts the natural movement of the wrist.

The momentum of the follow through will re hinge the wrists unless you forceably try to stop them.  This will naturally create a cupping.
		
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I agree... however that would assume that the ball is struck with the hands in a neutral position rather than being AHEAD of the ball? When the hands are ahead of the ball any cupping is 'neautralised' is it not?

(nb: just digging for an opinion) :thup:


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## Foxholer (Jul 12, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I thought Shawn's video was very clear on wrist cupping.  Your left wrist naturally cups as it hinges up.  If you try to stop it then it severely restricts the natural movement of the wrist.

The momentum of the follow through will re hinge the wrists (unless you forceably try to stop them)  This will naturally create a cupping.
		
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It also seemed to equally emphatic on allowing the 'wrists (hand) to roll'. Seems a bit odd/selective for SR to use that vid when he was so emphatic that 'rolling wrists is a No Go'.

Should we just all agree that anything that happens after impact is pretty insignificant - provided it's *allowed *to happen, rather than *made* to happen.


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## SocketRocket (Jul 12, 2012)

Foxholer said:



			It also seemed to equally emphatic on allowing the 'wrists (hand) to roll'. Seems a bit odd/selective for SR to use that vid when he was so emphatic that 'rolling wrists is a No Go'.

Should we just all agree that anything that happens after impact is pretty insignificant - provided it's *allowed *to happen, rather than *made* to happen.
		
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Yes, I can go with that (Well, unless you then say I have now capitulated to your thinking )


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## jdchelsea (Jul 12, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I thought Shawn's video was very clear on wrist cupping.  Your left wrist naturally cups as it hinges up.  If you try to stop it then it severely restricts the natural movement of the wrist.

The momentum of the follow through will re hinge the wrists (unless you forceably try to stop them)  This will naturally create a cupping.
		
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Yes so the wrist is NOT FLAT in the follow through as you said it might be.


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## SocketRocket (Jul 12, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Yes so the wrist is NOT FLAT in the follow through as you said it might be.
		
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When exactly did I say that??


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## jdchelsea (Jul 12, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			When exactly did I say that??
		
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Sorry socket my bad I thought your post I quoted was written by foxholer. Apologies.

Clements video is very good at what it describes. It just didn't describe what I'd been asking fh about namely wrist position in the follow through. That's why I questioned why he posted the link for that particular video.


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## SocketRocket (Jul 13, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Sorry socket my bad I thought your post I quoted was written by foxholer. Apologies.

Clements video is very good at what it describes. It just didn't describe what I'd been asking fh about namely wrist position in the follow through. That's why I questioned why he posted the link for that particular video.
		
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I think the Video from Shawn does answer your question but maybe indirectly.

He show that when you take your grip and hinge the left wrists it has to cup.  At impact the wrists become unhinged and this allows the left wrists to get into the flat position we see good players achieve.   Into the follow through the wrists will naturally rehinge due to the forces of the club on them, this will re-cup the left wrist as it moves towards the top of the swing.

You can try it by taking a club in your left hand grip, hinge the wrists upwards and see the cupping that will naturally form, push the wrists back down as at impact and the wrists will straighten, hinge it back up again as in the follow through and it will cup again.


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## jdchelsea (Jul 13, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I think the Video from Shawn does answer your question but maybe indirectly.

He show that when you take your grip and hinge the left wrists it has to cup.  At impact the wrists become unhinged and this allows the left wrists to get into the flat position we see good players achieve.   Into the follow through the wrists will naturally rehinge due to the forces of the club on them, this will re-cup the left wrist as it moves towards the top of the swing.

You can try it by taking a club in your left hand grip, hinge the wrists upwards and see the cupping that will naturally form, push the wrists back down as at impact and the wrists will straighten, hinge it back up again as in the follow through and it will cup again.
		
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Yeah it backs up what I said, that it's virtually impossible to not cup your wrist in the follow through. Foxholer on the other hand was telling me that players don't always cup their wrists in the follow through so it made absolutely no sense for him to post me the link.


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## SocketRocket (Jul 13, 2012)

jdchelsea said:



			Yeah it backs up what I said, that it's virtually impossible to not cup your wrist in the follow through. Foxholer on the other hand was telling me that players don't always cup their wrists in the follow through so it made absolutely no sense for him to post me the link.
		
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I think I posted the link.


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## jdchelsea (Jul 13, 2012)

SocketRocket said:



			I think I posted the link.
		
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I know you did but foxholer reposted the link when it was irrelevant to what I was asking him.


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