# Hitting Wedges of Soft lies



## MarkA (Nov 26, 2012)

Just starting on my winter leage campaign and we lost 2 holes ( and the match) due to ineptness with a wedge off a soft lie. Twice I went right under the ball  after nailing my drive. if anyone can give me a little help to stop making me look like a hacker id be grateful


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## duncan mackie (Nov 26, 2012)

as with all other shots you need to hit the small ball first....with the club going down.  with preferred lies, longer grass etc it's easy to get into a habit of trying to sweep shots all the time, and for wedges this leads to disaster...


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## SocketRocket (Nov 26, 2012)

In soggy lies you dont want to be hitting down too steep, you will end up chunking the wedge into the ground.

Use a wedge with some bounce like a sand wedge.   Take a level stance, dont lean too far forward, this way you will shallow out the swing.   Let the bounce on the club slide through the ground and under the ball.


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## MarkA (Nov 27, 2012)

I am more of a sweeper than a digger - the sand wedge idea isnt a bad one! the trouble is when hitting down is so easy when the course is so wet is its easy to get a big divot of mud.


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## Fish (Nov 27, 2012)

I was going under the ball with my wedges losing all kind of distance until I set up slightly different with the ball a little further back in my set-up making sure I struck the ball first and also using my 56 degree on most of those shots.

Took a while on the practice area to get used to slightly different distances achieved but I rarely flop them now.


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## JustOne (Nov 27, 2012)

MarkA said:



			Just starting on my winter leage campaign and we lost 2 holes ( and the match) due to ineptness with a wedge off a soft lie. Twice I went right under the ball  after nailing my drive. if anyone can give me a little help to stop making me look like a hacker id be grateful
		
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I do the same thing when I don't play much and it's caused by quitting on the shot... your hands stop turning then the club releases and the club slides under the ball, a form of 'flipping'.

The cure is to keep your hands moving towards the target all the way through the entire shot..... accelerating. As soon as you stop turning or your hands stop making progress around your body you'll flip the club under the ball..... good for getting out of some bunkers... rubbish from the fairway 



guilty as charged :angry:


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## garyinderry (Nov 27, 2012)

high bounce 54 wedge to the resuce!     54-14      life saver in winter


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## duncan mackie (Nov 27, 2012)

MarkA said:



			I am more of a sweeper than a digger - the sand wedge idea isnt a bad one! the trouble is when hitting down is so easy when the course is so wet is its easy to get a big divot of mud.
		
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the good news is that big divots go back almost easier than small ones...and as long as you got the ball before the ground it makes absolutely no difference to the shot. I'm not advocating huge divots just highlighting the issues.

I wasn't advovating steep, just highlighting how people drift into bad habits.

Round the green is completely different, and you can use the soft conditions in the same way as a bunker shot ie hit deliberately fat with a bounce soled club and get a soft consistent shot - but when looking for full shots from the fairway it's critical to get the ball first.

Wet mats at ranges are another area that leads people down this route - you can hit the mat some way, even inches, behind the ball on a wet mat with a wedge and the resultant shot will be fine as the mat offeres no resistance, squares up the club and delivers the middle of the face to the ball every time!  Same shot on the course will go nowhere.


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## SamQuirkePGA (Nov 28, 2012)

Weight 65% forward
Ball forward of centre.
Shaft vertical.
Stand tall with the belt buckle and sternum in a straight line from the ball.
Shallow AoA using the bounce.
Unlike in the full swing where the left wrist stays flat or palmar flexed the left wrist will bend or dorsi flex.
You want to pivot around a single axis, the left side, with minimal hip shift, but rotation.


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## MarkA (Nov 29, 2012)

Thanks it looks like this weekend will be soggy again so i'll report back


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 29, 2012)

That sounds a lot like the linear method Gary Smith advocate and I am trying. Lots of margin for error using the bounce


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## StrangelyBrown (Dec 5, 2012)

Having a sand wedge with 13* of bounce has helped me, along with a less wristy action.


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## Val (Dec 5, 2012)

SamQuirkePGA said:



			Weight 65% forward
Ball forward of centre.
Shaft vertical.
Stand tall with the belt buckle and sternum in a straight line from the ball.
Shallow AoA using the bounce.
Unlike in the full swing where the left wrist stays flat or palmar flexed the left wrist will bend or dorsi flex.
You want to pivot around a single axis, the left side, with minimal hip shift, but rotation.
		
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How do you know you are 65% forward and not 75%?

I understand you have to have weight more forward but this sort of exact stat just confuses people and has all sorts going through the mind, it's a hard enough game without adding variables like that.


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## ScienceBoy (Dec 5, 2012)

At things are soft it means the greens probably are soft too. I change my approach, instead of taking a high lofted club I hit a 7 or a 5 iron instead. It's run can be a little unpredictable but no less so than the backspin of a flushed wedge onto a soft green.

If I need a stopper then its out with the high bounce wedge instead and its almost a bunker shot!


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## Fish (Dec 5, 2012)

ScienceBoy said:



			At things are soft it means the greens probably are soft too. I change my approach, instead of taking a high lofted club I hit a 7 or a 5 iron instead. It's run can be a little unpredictable but no less so than the backspin of a flushed wedge onto a soft green.

If I need a stopper then its out with the high bounce wedge instead and its almost a bunker shot!
		
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This is an area I need to work on as I have always relied on my lofted wedges and like you say, you have to have another option in the locker when conditions warrant a change or a different aproach is needed so I need to learn to bump and run with a 7 iron or something similar.


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## patricks148 (Dec 5, 2012)

Fish said:



			This is an area I need to work on as I have always relied on my lofted wedges and like you say, you have to have another option in the locker when conditions warrant a change or a different aproach is needed so I need to learn to bump and run with a 7 iron or something similar.
		
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if its wet conditions the last shot you want to be playing is a bump and run!!!!


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## SamQuirkePGA (Dec 5, 2012)

"How do you know you are 65% forward and not 75%?

I understand you have to have weight more forward but this sort of exact stat just confuses people and has all sorts going through the mind, it's a hard enough game without adding variables like that."








I disagree. The problem with a lot of golf instruction is that it is neither measured enough or precise enough.

I believe its pretty simple to find 65% vs 75%. 

You know what 100% is, you know what 50% is  . . . . . . .

If you do want to find out definitively then use force plates.


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## Val (Dec 5, 2012)

SamQuirkePGA said:



			I disagree. The problem with a lot of golf instruction is that it is neither measured enough or precise enough.

I believe its pretty simple to find 65% vs 75%. 

You know what 100% is, you know what 50% is  . . . . . . .

If you do want to find out definitively then use force plates.
		
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Im not going to split hairs or argue with you but it's not easy, I dont think anyone could tell accurately know if their weight is split 65% - 35% for sure. Yes we can do 50% and maybe at a push 75%, but really 65%?

As for instruction I agree there is lots not measured or precise but as I said earlier sometimes too much info is as bad as not enough. We all know the old KISS theory. I'd rather have a pro teach me in the easiest terms rather than bamboozle with facts and figures.


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## SamQuirkePGA (Dec 5, 2012)

Valentino said:



			Im not going to split hairs or argue with you but it's not easy, I dont think anyone could tell accurately know if their weight is split 65% - 35% for sure. Yes we can do 50% and maybe at a push 75%, but really 65%?

As for instruction I agree there is lots not measured or precise but as I said earlier sometimes too much info is as bad as not enough. We all know the old KISS theory. I'd rather have a pro teach me in the easiest terms rather than bamboozle with facts and figures.
		
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Sure, nor do I wish to argue, I'm not here to do that. I respect your opinion and I still maintain it is easy to find 65%.

I also agree if a golfer wishes for the information to be layed out in the most simple terms it is for the coach to identify how much information the golfer can take. If you prefer to have simple instruction this is your choice, for many golfers this works. However many golfers enjoy knowing the minutia of the swing and find this helps with their overall understanding and ultimately their golf.

The original question was "How to hit of soft lies", it's my preference to provide detail rather than being vague. I would prefer to say 55% 65% 75% forward, whatever the number may be rather than weight forward. 
If a golfer were in front of me and didn't want this information, I'd have the benefit of watching a making sure they were correct with their weight at address. On a forum I do not have this luxury.


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## ScienceBoy (Dec 5, 2012)

patricks148 said:



			if its wet conditions the last shot you want to be playing is a bump and run!!!!
		
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I have not found that to be the case, however it does however depend on your greens. I would always aim to get the shot landing on the green or fringe and running out, landing it short is not a great idea at all and would end up most likely costing you shots.

Its two different approaches to the same thing, its best to experiment and find out what works for you and your technique. I always go for the lower lofted option unless I am in deep rough where the more loft the better! 

I have found that any low bounce short clubs and a soft lie DO NOT MIX with my average swing, when I switch to a lower lofted club and "putt" the ball I get a better contact and tend to end up closer to the hole as a result.


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## duncan mackie (Dec 5, 2012)

ScienceBoy said:



			I have not found that to be the case, however it does however depend on your greens. I would always aim to get the shot landing on the green or fringe and running out, *landing it short is not a great idea at all and would end up most likely costing you shots.*

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I think this is what Patick meant!  Bump and run implies landing it 'short' to me, and obviously Patrick as well.

Given the shot you describe, played with a 7 iron, implies that you are starting within 4 ft of the fringe for a 40ft overall shot, it's more of a chip than an approach shot. If you have nearly 40ft of green to work with I can't see any point in landing anywhere but on the green - unless you are playing a bump and run (which you wouldn't in these conditions....etc) the fringe is the most inconsistent place to land the ball in soft conditions!


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## garyinderry (Dec 6, 2012)

the percentage of weight forward doesnt matter. JUST MAKE SURE YOU DO IT !  imo


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## ScienceBoy (Dec 6, 2012)

duncan mackie said:



			I think this is what Patick meant!  Bump and run implies landing it 'short' to me, and obviously Patrick as well.

Given the shot you describe, played with a 7 iron, implies that you are starting within 4 ft of the fringe for a 40ft overall shot, it's more of a chip than an approach shot. If you have nearly 40ft of green to work with I can't see any point in landing anywhere but on the green - unless you are playing a bump and run (which you wouldn't in these conditions....etc) the fringe is the most inconsistent place to land the ball in soft conditions!
		
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Most of the time just getting on the green is the idea, rather than going close which could be too much of a risk. 

Its by far from my only shot BUT its one I always consider, I start off low and then see if I need a higher shot then choose the appropriate club. Even in wet conditions as a 7 iron can still get up and stop and I find less loft easier off soft lies as I clip them off the top more rather than risking going under them.

Maybe I just need to get better but its a way I had working when I needed it, its always only something to consider, not have it as the only way.


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