# Soft Ground - Tips



## TheCaddie (Oct 23, 2014)

Hi All,

I started playing golf this summer and went from being a complete beginner, to shooting around 40 over now consistently. Still a long way to go.

I played recently with very soft ground and found that my shots were completely different, my short game in particular seemed very difficult to have any form or sense of control! 

Any advice for what changes are required for soft ground / wet british weather.

I have the BUG!


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## pokerjoke (Oct 23, 2014)

TheCaddie said:



			Hi All,

I started playing golf this summer and went from being a complete beginner, to shooting around 40 over now consistently. Still a long way to go.

I played recently with very soft ground and found that my shots were completely different, my short game in particular seemed very difficult to have any form or sense of control! 

Any advice for what changes are required for soft ground / wet british weather.

I have the BUG!
		
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I play on a very wet course during the winter months.
I will always take an extra club when the grounds wet for 2 reasons.

1. Wet grounds gives way easier so your not actually hitting against a firm bit of turf,so
it doesn't seem like your compressing the ball so much.
2 Also you sometimes cant see the water that is just below the surface which generally
means you can get plenty of water and mud between the ball and club head thus leading
to a poorer struck shot.

With the short game for chips around the green I will try and fly it further towards the flag
as obviously the roll out will be a lot less.

Imo of course.


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 23, 2014)

You will lose distance, as described above. You will also lose roll after the ball has landed on fairways. Don't worry about either thing during winter. You may hear people talking about winter golf and that is how to think of it. Take one or two clubs more to allow for the distance changes, enjoy yourself and see any golf you can play in the winter as a bonus.


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## TheCaddie (Oct 23, 2014)

OK, that's really useful. So if you were to use a 7 iron for example, when it's really wet you'd take a 6? 

Sorry, still getting up to speed with my terminology.


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## HawkeyeMS (Oct 23, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			I play on a very wet course during the winter months.
I will always take an extra club when the grounds wet for 2 reasons.

1. Wet grounds gives way easier so your not actually hitting against a firm bit of turf,so
it doesn't seem like your compressing the ball so much.
2 Also you sometimes cant see the water that is just below the surface which generally
means you can get plenty of water and mud between the ball and club head thus leading
to a poorer struck shot.

With the short game for chips around the green I will try and fly it further towards the flag
as obviously the roll out will be a lot less.

Imo of course.
		
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Mostly I concur, but I don't see what the ground has to do with compression as you aren't actually compressing the ball against the turf.

I would say the issue with soft ground is that you are less likely to get away with hitting it a little bit fat.

To the OP. You should also resist the temptation to try hitting it harder that won't help, especially into wind. If you have to hit 5i where you would normally hit 8i then so be it.


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## duncan mackie (Oct 23, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Mostly I concur, but I don't see what the ground has to do with compression as you aren't actually compressing the ball against the turf.

I would say the issue with soft ground is that you are less likely to get away with hitting it a little bit fat.

To the OP. You should also resist the temptation to try hitting it harder that won't help, especially into wind. If you have to hit 5i where you would normally hit 8i then so be it.
		
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This I concur with!

Generally handicap golfer hit the ground before the ball most of the time, especially with shorter shots - softer ground will suddenly make their shots look really bad (the corollary is that most range mats positively encourage hitting a tiny bit fat as the mat event squares up the club face for you doing that!


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## TheCaddie (Oct 23, 2014)

So how do you remedy the situation Duncan?


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## garyinderry (Oct 23, 2014)

You might enjoy using the stableford scoring system over the winter. Shooting 40 over or worse as the conditions get really bad will get to you eventually.


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## TheCaddie (Oct 23, 2014)

Unless I get lessons and improve I suppose? ha ha....


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## the_coach (Oct 23, 2014)

if the ground is very wet & your chipping & pitching around the green don't just reach for the club you'd normally use. 
when real wet you're better off taking the wedge you have with the most bounce- usually that will be your sand wedge (fattest sole) as that will give you more chance of taking the ball & not digging the leading edge of a pitching wedge or lob wedge deep in the wet ground - normally unless spec-ed specifically these 2 will have less bounce.

with these shots then with the ground condition real wet, the highest route, so shots that are mostly carry to the hole are the best option. not good conditions for lower traj shots with run.

tee shots off a tee, make sure the face of the club is dry as well as the ball. wet kills spin, in the wet conditions you want height so the ball carries in the air the furthest possible to maximize distance as you'll get no roll. so you'll need some spin on the ball to get the height.

shot from the fairway, club up a club more but just grip down the handle a fraction. you want control good smooth swing important from the top the weight is on the lead leg so you get ball first, ground second, hit it anyways fat & your toast.

if you naturally have a tendency to hit a lot of fat shots you might even need to put the ball back a tad to help eliminate the fats. but only one ball max & double check it hasn't affected you aim, body alignment - particularly the shoulders if you do move the ball back.

shots from heavy rough going to be even more troublesome, so probably need 2 clubs more if real wet, to get the distance - but only if that is sensible - first thing you have to know you have enough loft to get out - often just take the medicine use the sand wedge & get back on the short stuff & then re-group from there, so you don't turn a bogey or double, into a triple or quad over.

plastic bag with some clean dry towels in the bag.


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## TheCaddie (Oct 24, 2014)

Unbelievably helpful! Thank you so much! 




the_coach said:



			if the ground is very wet & your chipping & pitching around the green don't just reach for the club you'd normally use. 
when real wet you're better off taking the wedge you have with the most bounce- usually that will be your sand wedge (fattest sole) as that will give you more chance of taking the ball & not digging the leading edge of a pitching wedge or lob wedge deep in the wet ground - normally unless spec-ed specifically these 2 will have less bounce.

with these shots then with the ground condition real wet, the highest route, so shots that are mostly carry to the hole are the best option. not good conditions for lower traj shots with run.

tee shots off a tee, make sure the face of the club is dry as well as the ball. wet kills spin, in the wet conditions you want height so the ball carries in the air the furthest possible to maximize distance as you'll get no roll. so you'll need some spin on the ball to get the height.

shot from the fairway, club up a club more but just grip down the handle a fraction. you want control good smooth swing important from the top the weight is on the lead leg so you get ball first, ground second, hit it anyways fat & your toast.

if you naturally have a tendency to hit a lot of fat shots you might even need to put the ball back a tad to help eliminate the fats. but only one ball max & double check it hasn't affected you aim, body alignment - particularly the shoulders if you do move the ball back.

shots from heavy rough going to be even more troublesome, so probably need 2 clubs more if real wet, to get the distance - but only if that is sensible - first thing you have to know you have enough loft to get out - often just take the medicine use the sand wedge & get back on the short stuff & then re-group from there, so you don't turn a bogey or double, into a triple or quad over.

plastic bag with some clean dry towels in the bag.
		
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## TheCaddie (Oct 24, 2014)

As an extra point of note. I definitely agree regarding the SW. I have Cleveland 52 and 58 and felt like I was really doing quite well with them through the summer. Then in the real wet I struggled and my SW became the new weapon of choice... 

Appreciate all the messages and I am enjoying this forum massively.


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## MadAdey (Oct 24, 2014)

Lots of good advice for you so far. As has been highlighted already, one of the biggest problems is catching the ground before the ball, you just don't get away with it on soft wet ground and the ball does not go as far in winter.

Best tip I ever got for in these conditions is to put the ball back a little bit in your stance, take an extra club and hit it with an easier swing. This will make sure you get the ball before the turf and also take some spin off so it doesn't balloon up into the wind.

Also teeing it down for the driver when going into the wind I find has the opposite effect, as I start to hit down on it generating more backspin and ballooning it. I just tee it up normally and concentrate on a good strike with a slower swing to take spin off, I find this keeps it down and stops it ballooning and so the wind does not affect it too much.


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## Lord Tyrion (Oct 24, 2014)

One thing to add. Don't have an ego about the club you take to hit a ball. I play with one bloke who simply refuses to take the correct club for his talent/conditions because his ego wont let him. I don't care if everyone else in my group is taking a 9 iron, if I need a 7 to reach then that is what I take. You would be amazed how many golfers mess up through stubborn choices. Play your game, not anyone elses. Most shots end up short of a flag, not past and that increases in winter as people stick to their summer clubbing choices. (great choice of thread by the way, there are some excellent tips which I will use as my course is also soggy in the winter)


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## garyinderry (Oct 24, 2014)

Of you are planning to buy or your wedges say low bounce, don't bother with them over winter. 

Recipe for disaster!


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## TheCaddie (Oct 24, 2014)

Cheers Tyrion! 

If i am being honest, I am still getting my head around club selection but rest assured I am working out what suits me best. I learnt my lesson when a friend of mine at the same level told me he was taking a 7, when I was thinking I should take  a 9. Decided to listen to him, took a 7, and pumped it over the green. He then started laughing.... a lot. 

Lesson learnt!


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## Liverbirdie (Oct 24, 2014)

TheCaddie said:



			Cheers Tyrion! 

If i am being honest, I am still getting my head around club selection but rest assured I am working out what suits me best. I learnt my lesson when a friend of mine at the same level told me he was taking a 7, when I was thinking I should take  a 9. Decided to listen to him, took a 7, and pumped it over the green. He then started laughing.... a lot. 

Lesson learnt!
		
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In the early days just learn to enjoy the game, them early years are great.

If in time you decide to buy a distance measuring device, these can help you to learn what distances you hit with each club, but only when you have a bit of consistency in your game.

Don't be scared to club up even 2 or 3 clubs, especially in winter, and don't take too much notice as to what others are hitting, unless they hit similar distances to you. In winter when cold, it is normally one club more (take an 8i where you used to take a 9i) just due to colder air. If its reasonably windy (say 12-15 mph), it can be another iron again (now a 7i), and if blowing a gale (say 25 plus mph)can even be 3 or more irons different (6 or 5i).

I play reasonably regularly with a forummer who would take an 8 iron, where I would take a 5 or 6 iron. 

Enjoy the ride.


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## MadAdey (Oct 24, 2014)

TheCaddie said:



			Cheers Tyrion! 

If i am being honest, I am still getting my head around club selection but rest assured I am working out what suits me best. I learnt my lesson when a friend of mine at the same level told me he was taking a 7, when I was thinking I should take  a 9. Decided to listen to him, took a 7, and pumped it over the green. He then started laughing.... a lot. 

Lesson learnt!
		
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never be be afraid to take the extra club in winter when playing into the wind. I have found myself at time hitting a 6i where in summer it would have been a 9i. If your not sure about how far each club goes I always think that working on 7i=150 in the summer as a beginner and take it from there. Then add or subtract a club for every 10 yards so 6i=160 & 8i=140. With it now being winter I would change that to 6i=150, so 7i=140 & 5i=160.


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## garyinderry (Oct 24, 2014)

Don't beat yourself up about putting over the winter.  Some greens become worse than a joke.   at times ill go out and play holes by myself. The putter won't even come out of the bag.


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## Dave B (Oct 25, 2014)

My local course has already implemented winter rules. When in force, use it to your advantage by cleaning your ball and placing it every shot. It can make a big difference and makes the game much easier.

Regarding clubbing up, in last weeks stableford when faced with 150 yds to the green into the wind, I took a 7 wood after watching all of my playing partners land short with 7 and 6 irons. I landed on the front of the green and was left with a 6ft put for 4 points. Know your distances and if you are not sure if it's a 1 or 2 club wind always go for the bigger club as 75% of players usually land short.


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## TheCaddie (Oct 28, 2014)

MadAdey said:



			never be be afraid to take the extra club in winter when playing into the wind. I have found myself at time hitting a 6i where in summer it would have been a 9i. If your not sure about how far each club goes I always think that working on 7i=150 in the summer as a beginner and take it from there. Then add or subtract a club for every 10 yards so 6i=160 & 8i=140. With it now being winter I would change that to 6i=150, so 7i=140 & 5i=160.
		
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Thanks for that. I need to keep working on my distancing and also visually get a feel for yardage. I am not a million miles away, but it definitely needs work. I guess the more I play the easier that will become!


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## TheCaddie (Oct 28, 2014)

garyinderry said:



			Don't beat yourself up about putting over the winter.  Some greens become worse than a joke.   at times ill go out and play holes by myself. The putter won't even come out of the bag.
		
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Gary, I am presuming with your handicap you are a member of a club. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be paying around Â£1k membership and not being able to putt properly in the winter!!! Richmond Park so far has been pretty decent, but we'll see how that lasts, but another 9 holer I play at sometimes is a disgrace.


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## HawkeyeMS (Oct 28, 2014)

garyinderry said:



			Don't beat yourself up about putting over the winter.  Some greens become worse than a joke.   at times ill go out and play holes by myself. The putter won't even come out of the bag.
		
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Hmmm, it's very very easy during winter to blame greens for bad putting but the truth is often closer to home.


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## TheCaddie (Oct 28, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Hmmm, it's very very easy during winter to blame greens for bad putting but the truth is often closer to home.
		
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The 9-holer i refer to often has large puddles on the green.... .


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## ScienceBoy (Oct 28, 2014)

This has me thinking...

Should we switch to hybrid irons on really soft ground, all the way down to the PW?

Or just have a winter set with a fat sole, like the adams A12s or whatever?

Thoughts?


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## garyinderry (Oct 28, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Hmmm, it's very very easy during winter to blame greens for bad putting but the truth is often closer to home.
		
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I see no merit in putting on greens that are not true, don't roll anywhere need the speed they should and half the time on temps.

I'll putt if playing a bounce match, winter league etc but wouldn't entertain the idea when I am by myself. I get much more pleasure dropping a few balls and hitting a few chips or pitches at each green. With greens being eternally soft over winter I usually try and play little spiny chips right to the flag.  X10 more fun than hitting a bobbley putt.


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## garyinderry (Oct 28, 2014)

TheCaddie said:



			Gary, I am presuming with your handicap you are a member of a club. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be paying around Â£1k membership and not being able to putt properly in the winter!!! Richmond Park so far has been pretty decent, but we'll see how that lasts, but another 9 holer I play at sometimes is a disgrace.
		
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You must be a member of a club to have an official handicap. Seems a bit unfair on sporadic golfers but that is the rules.  Winter golf does annoy me but there is Nowt we can do but grin and bear it. After some sorry rounds in winter I say i might give it a miss the following week. Sure enough, a few days pass and I am chomping at the bit ready for another weather beaten round. Lol


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