# My swing



## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

Afternoon all, 

Just looking for some honest thoughts on my swing. Works on a couple things the last couple months and not sure where to go now. Been working on starting more centered and also flaring the feet slightly giving a better leg action. 

I'm currently a 19 handicap but would like to really improve on that over the winter so come April and the comp season again I am able to compete. I know it's not as simple as that but why not put the effort in to try. 

Thanks for reading and thanks in advance for any reply's, be as honest as you like. 

[video=youtube_share;0gxpZeSnHUE]https://youtu.be/0gxpZeSnHUE[/video]


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube_share;4EENtf2l3-s]https://youtu.be/4EENtf2l3-s[/video]


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## bobmac (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

I'm not playing you for money of 19 with a swing like that. 
Very nice.
One small point....
I'm sure you can see yourself there's still a little move to your right on the backswing, just keep working on staying centred as you are doing.
Do you fade the ball at all and if so, are you happy with it?


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



bobmac said:



			I'm not playing you for money of 19 with a swing like that. 
Very nice.
One small point....
I'm sure you can see yourself there's still a little move to your right on the backswing, just keep working on staying centred as you are doing.
Do you fade the ball at all and if so, are you happy with it?
		
Click to expand...

Thanks Bob, yes I do fade the ball. Sometimes too much, to say I'm happy with it, I'm not too sure. I wouldn't want to under go a major rehaul of the swing in order to hit a draw say but if I could make a couple changes to play a small fade consistently then id be happy with that. It's the ones that creep in that fade way to much that I don't like. Constency is what I'm after.


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## bobmac (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

If the big fades start a little right, I'd turn your right hand a smidgeon clockwise. It's a little weak at the moment.
If it starts left and then fades alot it's a much more difficult fix


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



bobmac said:



			If the big fades start a little right, I'd turn your right hand a smidgeon clockwise. It's a little weak at the moment.
If it starts left and then fades alot it's a much more difficult fix
		
Click to expand...

Id say it starts just left of target then goes right. Below is an older swing but the flight is what I don't like to see. 

[video=youtube_share;prwvrNgdAl4]https://youtu.be/prwvrNgdAl4[/video]

This one ended up about 5 yards short of the trees on the right hand side. To me it looks like with this one my turn was too flat but not too sure. I know I certainly came over the top more on this one.


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## bobmac (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Yeup, that swing was definitely more out to in.
Changing the path of your swing is not easy and can take months rather than weeks.
Try the grip change I suggested first and that should reduce the fade.
Keep us posted


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



bobmac said:



			Yeup, that swing was definitely more out to in.
Changing the path of your swing is not easy and can take months rather than weeks.
Try the grip change I suggested first and that should reduce the fade.
Keep us posted
		
Click to expand...

Thanks Bob will do. Just to clarify when you say turn it more clockwise is that clockwise as I look down on it so more under or clockwise looking on the video view so more on top?


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## the_coach (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

as said before with your other swing vid's you have a real good idea of motion & flow, with a pretty good set-up

my take on what's causing you too much consistency issues is swing sequence 'in time'
would say the biggest issue here is the overswing - if the overswing was there & you had not issues with shot outcomes that would be all good

but here it's leading to being arms/club out of sequence some on the ways back to the ball so body/shoulders return (with the problem shot outcomes) a ways too open with clubface open

would think the biggest bang for buck would be a bunch of practice on shortening down the backswing with all clubs - to what would feel do doubt like half a swing it wouldn't be at all - but everything getting ways past horizontal at the top is making it real difficult to successfully get back to impact in real good shape everytime

so feeling the hands go back to 10 o/clock with the body pivot
overswings feel powerful perhaps feel more of a 'flow' even but they often times generate less speed through the ball & lead to strike being applied inconsistently

some good practice with some rigor being applied to monitoring backswing length would pay some real dividends 
along the lines of this takeback distance as seen in this vid - know it's an 8i here but the same would hold true through the bag

would keep a tight eye that ball position never creeps a ways too far forwards too target, & the shoulder alignment at set-up especially with driver/metals is good & parallel square to target line

[video=youtube;TVDpvX2E5V0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVDpvX2E5V0[/video]


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## bobmac (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Garush34 said:



			Thanks Bob will do. Just to clarify when you say turn it more clockwise is that clockwise as I look down on it so more under or clockwise looking on the video view so more on top?
		
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More clockwise as you look down so a little more under the grip, but only a touch


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



bobmac said:



			More clockwise as you look down so a little more under the grip, but only a touch
		
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Great thanks Bob. I'll get to work on that, something easy to work on in the house.


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			as said before with your other swing vid's you have a real good idea of motion & flow, with a pretty good set-up

my take on what's causing you too much consistency issues is swing sequence 'in time'
would say the biggest issue here is the overswing - if the overswing was there & you had not issues with shot outcomes that would be all good

but here it's leading to being arms/club out of sequence some on the ways back to the ball so body/shoulders return (with the problem shot outcomes) a ways too open with clubface open

would think the biggest bang for buck would be a bunch of practice on shortening down the backswing with all clubs - to what would feel do doubt like half a swing it wouldn't be at all - but everything getting ways past horizontal at the top is making it real difficult to successfully get back to impact in real good shape everytime

so feeling the hands go back to 10 o/clock with the body pivot
overswings feel powerful perhaps feel more of a 'flow' even but they often times generate less speed through the ball & lead to strike being applied inconsistently

some good practice with some rigor being applied to monitoring backswing length would pay some real dividends 
along the lines of this takeback distance as seen in this vid - know it's an 8i here but the same would hold true through the bag

would keep a tight eye that ball position never creeps a ways too far forwards too target, & the shoulder alignment at set-up especially with driver/metals is good & parallel square to target line

[video=youtube;TVDpvX2E5V0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVDpvX2E5V0[/video]
		
Click to expand...

Thanks coach, the video makes sense certainly. And it is something I have been looking at trying to work on. It is a lot shorter than I used to be, used to be way past. 

One thing I picked up on in the video is that he mentions the right elbow in going back being low and still pointing down when doing the half swing. I notice that my right elbow points a little behind me at that position, is that an issue? I feel that the right arm breaks down too much in the swing.


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## the_coach (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Garush34 said:



			Thanks coach, the video makes sense certainly. And it is something I have been looking at trying to work on. It is a lot shorter than I used to be, used to be way past. 

One thing I picked up on in the video is that he mentions the right elbow in going back being low and still pointing down when doing the half swing. I notice that my right elbow points a little behind me at that position, is that an issue? I feel that the right arm breaks down too much in the swing.
		
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would not worry or labor over the right elbow position on the ways back 

working to a shorter top position so the swing motion arms/club can be a ways better in sequence to the body would be a good ways forwards

your right arm feels that ways more because of the issue in sequence as on the ways back to the ball the angles between lead hand/wrist trail hand/wrist to shaft breaks down some so then release happens nearer the trail thigh - not enough forwards in the swing arc (something spoke too on an earlier post & swing vid of yours little while back)

would work to a 'feel' of all full swings any club hands only go back to 10 - back stays looking to target a 'beat' as simultaneously the transition starts with weight into the leadside, lead hip rotates- feeling then of the upper body staying centered as it rotates through with a feeling of 85%+ on a strong lead leg through impact


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## Garush34 (Nov 23, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			would not worry or labor over the right elbow position on the ways back 

working to a shorter top position so the swing motion arms/club can be a ways better in sequence to the body would be a good ways forwards

your right arm feels that ways more because of the issue in sequence as on the ways back to the ball the angles between lead hand/wrist trail hand/wrist to shaft breaks down some so then release happens nearer the trail thigh - not enough forwards in the swing arc (something spoke too on an earlier post & swing vid of yours little while back)

would work to a 'feel' of all full swings any club hands only go back to 10 - back stays looking to target a 'beat' as simultaneously the transition starts with weight into the leadside, lead hip rotates- feeling then of the upper body staying centered as it rotates through with a feeling of 85%+ on a strong lead leg through impact
		
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Great thanks. I'll get to work on it after looking at the grip change first.


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## Garush34 (Dec 2, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Been reviewing some swing, mine and some pro swings. And one thing I noticed was the depth of my hands. I notice mine seem too be seem to be behind my shoulder and behind the heel line, whereas the pros seem to be more in line with the shoulder and in line with the middle of the foot. 

I have uploaded a picture but not sure if it worked or not. The yellow line is where I am and the blue where I see most pros being.  Is this something to work on or not? Would it help at all with the length of my swing. It certainly feels a better position at the top.


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## the_coach (Dec 2, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

how's contact at impact been goin & what's been goin down with general shot shapes etc

would not say the hands/handle were ways back of you - although you got to keep an eye on what's happening position-wise you have to be careful not to overdo it

sometimes better thinking of the whole of the swing - all your really doing in a swing motion is swinging back, little inside & up all provided by the arms with the body rotation plus the wrist set 'up' - so if you imagine that on an inclined hoop you stand in at set-up the hands/handle would end up, as a general guide, moving up on a line to the lateral distal part (end/tip) of the shoulder if the turn is bigger so swing just a little longer then they are roughly vertically over top of the distal end of shoulder 

so it's in an ok range (there isn't just one position that works)

{folks on Tour are sometimes more vertical atop the swing so nearer over the neck than the shoulder tip - Furyk, Bubba, even Tom Watson - others hands/handle further 'behind & deeper' atop they all just make the adjustments at transition to hit good impact conditions}

gotta be careful over changing too much at once 

- but if your experimenting through the off season maybes one ways to look at it takeback uo to the top (as well as the lead hand/wrist so thumb setting upwards as the trail arm hinges & folds - given the forwards spine angle at set-up which is pretty much 'kept' to the top then the shoulders again pretty much rotate at 90Âº to the spine angle so the lead shoulder rotates down a little as you turn - so you could keep an eye on that so the lead shoulder doesn't just turn/rotate back level as that's gets little ways too flat
so if the shoulders turned at approx 90Âº to spine with 'connected' arms the hands/handle would be moving somewhere towards the tip of the shoulder so atop the tip of the shoulder not back behind

so would look at shoulders nearer 90Âº to spine my take, & not stress over the hands/handle that pic it's in an acceptable kinda range


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## Garush34 (Dec 3, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			how's contact at impact been goin & what's been goin down with general shot shapes etc

would not say the hands/handle were ways back of you - although you got to keep an eye on what's happening position-wise you have to be careful not to overdo it

sometimes better thinking of the whole of the swing - all your really doing in a swing motion is swinging back, little inside & up all provided by the arms with the body rotation plus the wrist set 'up' - so if you imagine that on an inclined hoop you stand in at set-up the hands/handle would end up, as a general guide, moving up on a line to the lateral distal part (end/tip) of the shoulder if the turn is bigger so swing just a little longer then they are roughly vertically over top of the distal end of shoulder 

so it's in an ok range (there isn't just one position that works)

{folks on Tour are sometimes more vertical atop the swing so nearer over the neck than the shoulder tip - Furyk, Bubba, even Tom Watson - others hands/handle further 'behind & deeper' atop they all just make the adjustments at transition to hit good impact conditions}

gotta be careful over changing too much at once 

- but if your experimenting through the off season maybes one ways to look at it takeback uo to the top (as well as the lead hand/wrist so thumb setting upwards as the trail arm hinges & folds - given the forwards spine angle at set-up which is pretty much 'kept' to the top then the shoulders again pretty much rotate at 90Âº to the spine angle so the lead shoulder rotates down a little as you turn - so you could keep an eye on that so the lead shoulder doesn't just turn/rotate back level as that's gets little ways too flat
so if the shoulders turned at approx 90Âº to spine with 'connected' arms the hands/handle would be moving somewhere towards the tip of the shoulder so atop the tip of the shoulder not back behind

so would look at shoulders nearer 90Âº to spine my take, & not stress over the hands/handle that pic it's in an acceptable kinda range
		
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Thanks coach. I haven't had the chance to get out yet as the course was closed last weekend and the ranges near me are closed at night. So just been working on slow swings in the house. 

I'll keep that in mind about the shoulders, I have been trying to turn just before 90 on the slow swings as I feel that sometimes I'm over turning. So trying to make a smaller turn to keep that hands/arms in front of the chest and stopping at the 10 o'clock position. Should be able to get to the course Monday and spend a bit of time on the practice area. Plan to spend a couple hours doing some work on this backswing.


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## Garush34 (Dec 19, 2015)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Managed to get out this morning for a bit of practice. Tried a few different feels to shorten the swing. Started with try to keep the arms straight, they still went to just before 12 position but were higher than normal so more width at the top. Tried this for a few swings. 

Then tried the feeling of a half swing stopping way short at about 9. This had much better results with arms stopping at 10 with width. Stuck with this feeling the rest of the session with good results. Now it's not full speed but I'd say probs about 60%. 

The grip change is feeling more comfortable too, feels like the hands work together better now. Also had a few shots with full flight instead of the nets. Was getting a nice wee draw with similar distance off the slower speed. Should be good for when up to full speed and better conditions. 

[video=youtube_share;2vGJyTAVbUc]https://youtu.be/2vGJyTAVbUc[/video]


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## Garush34 (Mar 1, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Just thought I'd update this thread with a couple new videos. Had a lesson just over a week ago, working on keeping the hands lower starting the takeaway and also working on trying to keep the left leg from straightening to start the downswing causing me to cut across the ball. The hands an easier fix and working well. The leg action proving to be a bit more difficult but I'm getting there. 

DTL - [video=youtube_share;bqhXAcLsvI0]https://youtu.be/bqhXAcLsvI0[/video]

Still need to work on swing length but that's a work in progress at the moment. 

Any thoughts or comments welcome.


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## Garush34 (Mar 1, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Face On - [video=youtube_share;Ojtn2I6QzR4]https://youtu.be/Ojtn2I6QzR4[/video]


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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

one of the biggest issues most folks of any playing standard come up  against one ways or another is how to get it all in the connected right  shape at impact - sync, connection, arms to body motion so the club gets  delivered in the 'right' bit of space at the right time - the further  this is off, speaking generally the nearer the handle & hands are to  the trail thigh (as opposed to ideally being opposite the lead thigh)  when the clubface contacts the ball

that 'connection' into impact  - the sync, timing of made a bunch more problematic to achieve if the  club getting to the top so arms to body motion is out of sync, this out  of sync can happen arms/club don't travel far enough with the body  motion - or arms/club travel a ways too far - either present a timing  issue in the downswing

this particular swing (only looking at  one, others could be different) arms & club traveling a bunch too  far to the turn - means arms/club start back just before the body motion  or at the same time - put the arms/club have a good ways further to  travel than the body does - instinctively compensation made in the  downswing to try to match it all back up - so tends to mean upper body  lower body has to 'hang back' some to get the clubhead to the ball -  means release happens early, angles lost some hands/handle at the trail  thigh clubhead infront bit off a scoop upwards - so missed contacts etc -  means the trail shoulder, trail part of the chest, trail hip isn't  really getiing 'through' the shot so a bit of a stand up early  release/flip motion

as said before there's a decent idea of  motion - just really about 'marrying' body to arms on the ways back to  then be in a little better shape to be able to transition well to be  able to get back to impact in a little ways more decent shape, hands  leading forwards leaning shaft to transfer the energy to ball better -  so common golf parlance - 'compress the ball'

to that, my take,  what would help a bunch would be linking the lead shoulder with the lead  arm/hands/handle/club in the first motion of the takeback

check  the face on vid by the time the club gets to horizontal there's  currently not much upper body rotation happened, then the chest rotates  some then the arms carrying on some more so club shaft a ways past  horizontal at the top - real difficult to then get all that back from  there consistently 

so a feeling of linking more the lead  shoulder (& with that obviously the chest & shoulders follow)  movement with the hands/handle/club (so the path or anything is not  being changed any) then by the time the lead arm is horizontal to the  ground the body will have rotated a bunch more and there will be only a  small amount of further rotation with the arms to get to a top position  where there will be more natural width (hands/handle a ways from the  trail ear) with shaft just short of horizontal

with good  sequencing to start down, lower then upper, everything has a much better  opportunity to be in sync back to impact, nothing has to 'hold' back  and the trail side can 'go through' the shot, _'trail shoulder through the middle of the ball' _kinda feeling
 hands lead forwards leaning shaft and the strike doesn't break down, no  flip, trail side comes through so there's extension through the follow  through - no feeling of standing up along with the upper body cramped  and trail arm angles gone before impact


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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

images just to visualize the previous post speaking to lead shoulder (so  turn of upper body) moving more with the arms & club when club in  similar position how ultimately it helps get the impact conditions in  better shape as the trail shoulder (trail side) gets little ways further  through the shot 

try a feeling of as you are coming down in the downswing the lead hand knuckles 'turn down' some as if they point to the ground so the lead wrist is a tad bowed






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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube;GaC4ze2OMHg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaC4ze2OMHg[/video]


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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube;KzzPWuuD6zk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzzPWuuD6zk[/video]


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## Garush34 (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Thanks coach. The points are clear and I see what your saying. I'll get to work on that and see where it takes me. 

I assume that due to lack of upper body turn when the club is parallel to the group my trail arm is breaking down earlier than it should? I notice in the pictures Adams trail arm looks quite straight.


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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Garush34 said:



			Thanks coach. The points are clear and I see what your saying. I'll get to work on that and see where it takes me. 

I assume that due to lack of upper body turn when the club is parallel to the group my trail arm is breaking down earlier than it should? I notice in the pictures Adams trail arm looks quite straight.
		
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think it's possibly more to do with the lead shoulder being connected in movement from the off - so rotating/turning _down & back_ more connected in 'time' to the arm/hands/handle moving from the get-go of takeback

for sure the the trail arm doesn't fold straightways - that said you gotta guard against it being 'held' artificially real straight as that too disconnects the arms and turn - general guide when the shaft 1st horizontal to the ground there's normally a tad of space between trail elbow and side maybes couple inches, so it's not tucked tight into the side
one thing fairly crucial to this at set up is a 'soft' trail arm (so not dead straight at address) with the inside of the elbow facing more to the ball/target line (or someone watching from face on view) & not the inside of the elbow facing more to target - that ways the trail arm when it folds will function little ways better


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## Garush34 (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			think it's possibly more to do with the lead shoulder being connected in movement from the off - so rotating/turning _down & back_ more connected in 'time' to the arm/hands/handle moving from the get-go of takeback

for sure the the trail arm doesn't fold straightways - that said you gotta guard against it being 'held' artificially real straight as that too disconnects the arms and turn - general guide when the shaft 1st horizontal to the ground there's normally a tad of space between trail elbow and side maybes couple inches, so it's not tucked tight into the side
one thing fairly crucial to this at set up is a 'soft' trail arm (so not dead straight at address) with the inside of the elbow facing more to the ball/target line (or someone watching from face on view) & not the inside of the elbow facing more to target - that ways the trail arm when it folds will function little ways better
		
Click to expand...

Thanks coach, makes sense. I'll get to work on it this week.


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## the_coach (Mar 2, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

may help some 'feeling -wise" as the takeback & turn puts the shaft at 1st horizontal it's more the continued upper body turn that 'folds' the trail arm - rather than the turn stopping and a more actively independent 'bending at the trail elbow' neither with any 'lift' of the lead arm or lift of the lead shoulder to get the arms/club to the top - so 'feeling' of the turn controlling the arms and the 'folding, hinging' of the trail arm, when the upper body turn stops (the hip turn stopping around 45Âº restricts any upper body 'overturn' - but the hips need to turn to allow the upper body to turn well - trail hip not turning deep but kept from turning has the tendency to over-straighten the trail leg - unless tour flexible!) the hands/arms/club stop at the same time -there's no further lifting or pushing of the arms alone to continue on


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## Garush34 (Mar 3, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			may help some 'feeling -wise" as the takeback & turn puts the shaft at 1st horizontal it's more the continued upper body turn that 'folds' the trail arm - rather than the turn stopping and a more actively independent 'bending at the trail elbow' neither with any 'lift' of the lead arm or lift of the lead shoulder to get the arms/club to the top - so 'feeling' of the turn controlling the arms and the 'folding, hinging' of the trail arm, when the upper body turn stops (the hip turn stopping around 45Âº restricts any upper body 'overturn' - but the hips need to turn to allow the upper body to turn well - trail hip not turning deep but kept from turning has the tendency to over-straighten the trail leg - unless tour flexible!) the hands/arms/club stop at the same time -there's no further lifting or pushing of the arms alone to continue on
		
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Thanks coach. I tried it in the house last night, and it feels different but could see it working. I started with the feel of moving the lead shoulder and arms at the same time, certainly seems to work well.


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## Garush34 (Mar 6, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Got out yesterday for a few holes. Worked on just go using on starting the backswing with shoulders. Feels better after a few holes. Driver swing getting better focusing on this. Overall better shots. Obviously it's not 100% there yet but can see improvement straight away which is good. Couple of videos from yesterday. 

[video=youtube_share;EyjE-cbUZv0]https://youtu.be/EyjE-cbUZv0[/video]


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## Garush34 (Mar 6, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube_share;iVpXOKR_ZHw]https://youtu.be/iVpXOKR_ZHw[/video]


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## the_coach (Mar 6, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Garush34 said:



			Got out yesterday for a few holes. Worked on just go using on starting the backswing with shoulders. Feels better after a few holes. Driver swing getting better focusing on this. Overall better shots. Obviously it's not 100% there yet but can see improvement straight away which is good. Couple of videos from yesterday.
		
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cool good it's going better

just couple of things to be aware of watch that with the turn there's very little lateral movement back off of the ball (upper body/head) - with ball on a tee it's a little ways easier to accommodate lateral (if minor) but ball on the ground becomes pretty untenable for sound contact - so the turn is still around a pretty centered spine/head (though there'll be a tad of movement) 

just watch that lead hand hold on the handle doesn't get too weak & too high up in the palm (so seeing only 1 knuckle) - so little ways too rotated anti-clockwise on the handle - looks a tad weak from the face on vid so just monitor the lead hand hold some
so handle lying diagonally in the bottom of the palm & the base of the fingers - looking down seeing around 2&1/2 knuckles on the lead hand at set-up
hope it goes good


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## Garush34 (Mar 6, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			cool good it's going better

just couple of things to be aware of watch that with the turn there's very little lateral movement back off of the ball (upper body/head) - with ball on a tee it's a little ways easier to accommodate lateral (if minor) but ball on the ground becomes pretty untenable for sound contact - so the turn is still around a pretty centered spine/head (though there'll be a tad of movement) 

just watch that lead hand hold on the handle doesn't get too weak & too high up in the palm (so seeing only 1 knuckle) - so little ways too rotated anti-clockwise on the handle - looks a tad weak from the face on vid so just monitor the lead hand hold some
so handle lying diagonally in the bottom of the palm & the base of the fingers - looking down seeing around 2&1/2 knuckles on the lead hand at set-up
hope it goes good
		
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Thanks coach, I'll look out for those, next time I'm out.


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## Garush34 (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Just a further update here on my swing. 

Been working on the leg action on the downswing and trying not to extend early. Been seeing some good results with this and it has completely changed my path on the way down. Hitting some nice wee draws now. 

[video=youtube_share;AvaTIVVQ7vs]https://youtu.be/AvaTIVVQ7vs[/video]

Left the face open on this one but as the round progressed I adjusted my grip and was hitting it better.

First comp of the year on Saturday, looking forward to it and hopefully these changes will help shoot a lower score.


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## Garush34 (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Driver face on: 

[video=youtube_share;rfN3-4ojfIM]https://youtu.be/rfN3-4ojfIM[/video]


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## Garush34 (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

8 iron DTL: 

[video=youtube_share;OWqd-g-v-Q4]https://youtu.be/OWqd-g-v-Q4[/video]


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## Simbo (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

I don't know what the rest of your games like to get the 19 cap, that looks a fairly solid swing jeez, I don't fancy having to give you a load of shots. Sorry I have no real advice as I'm no expert just thought I'd let you know you have a nice decent swing.


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## Garush34 (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Simbo said:



			I don't know what the rest of your games like to get the 19 cap, that looks a fairly solid swing jeez, I don't fancy having to give you a load of shots. Sorry I have no real advice as I'm no expert just thought I'd let you know you have a nice decent swing.
		
Click to expand...

Thanks, it's more just not being able to put all part together on the day for the high handicap. Have put a lot of work in since August last year so hopefully this year will be different. First comp on Saturday so here's hoping for a cut.


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## the_coach (Mar 30, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

one shot at a time, stay in the present, and keep a hold on your emotional reactions .... let got of the 'past' immediately and no 'future' until the card is signed ..... check the card good before you sign it


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## Garush34 (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Been playing some good golf the last couple weeks but have been struggling a bit with some blocks off the tee, which have been affecting scoring. 

Anyone see in the swing below that could be causing the blocks? 

[video=youtube_share;s7AZnUVkhaE]https://youtu.be/s7AZnUVkhaE[/video]


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## One Planer (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Where is the ball positioned in relation to your stance/body?

How confident are you that the ball is where you think it is?


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## Garush34 (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



One Planer said:



			Where is the ball positioned in relation to your stance/body?

How confident are you that the ball is where you think it is?
		
Click to expand...

For that shot it is middle of stance, driver is just inside left heal. Fairly confident it is where it should be. I did previously have a tendency to have it too far forward but have made an effort to ensure it doesn't creep forward.


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## One Planer (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Could be you've over done the change and moved it too far back.

That said.

In your latest video your path through the ball is still left. You ball also 'appears' to start left of your alignment.

The reason I suggest ball position is the issue as opposed to grip is your path into and through the ball.

Your path is to the left into and through the ball so If your grip had gone a touch weak, with the same path, I would say you would see more of a fade (Starting left and curving back).

In the image your face appears to match the left moving path and starts left into the net. I could have curved but we'll never know. The downside of hitting into a net and not seeing the flight

Bob will no doubt correct me on this 

My path has changed dramatically through having lessons. So much so that I play everything significantly more forward of what's considered "Standard" and still get the ball to draw.

Ball position is massive for me.

One cause for your blocking the ball could be a lack of rotation in your downswing.

Here's an image of you at impact:




Your hips 'appear' to have returned to there address alignment and are pretty much square to the target.

Look at the picture below of Luke Donald. Notice how his hips have opened:




From your position you 'could' hit a block, but you could also hit a shank!

Again, Bob and Coach will give better diagnosis and info than me.


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## garyinderry (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Do you also hit fades too Gareth?


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## One Planer (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



garyinderry said:



			Do you also hit fades too Gareth?
		
Click to expand...

Can't hit a 'proper' fade for toffee.

I can hit a push fade, but not a left to righter. Mines a right to righter :rofl:


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## garyinderry (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

don't go chasing it.  I got rid of my strong draw now struggle to hit anything but weak slices.  


Plenty of work to do again this summer as I didn't do a tap all winter.


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## Garush34 (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



One Planer said:



			Could be you've over done the change and moved it too far back.

That said.

In your latest video your path through the ball is still left. You ball also 'appears' to start left of your alignment.

The reason I suggest ball position is the issue as opposed to grip is your path into and through the ball.

Your path is to the left into and through the ball so If your grip had gone a touch weak, with the same path, I would say you would see more of a fade (Starting left and curving back).

In the image your face appears to match the left moving path and starts left into the net. I could have curved but we'll never know. The downside of hitting into a net and not seeing the flight

Bob will no doubt correct me on this 

My path has changed dramatically through having lessons. So much so that I play everything significantly more forward of what's considered "Standard" and still get the ball to draw.

Ball position is massive for me.

One cause for your blocking the ball could be a lack of rotation in your downswing.

Here's an image of you at impact:

View attachment 19156


Your hips 'appear' to have returned to there address alignment and are pretty much square to the target.

Look at the picture below of Luke Donald. Notice how his hips have opened:

View attachment 19157


From your position you 'could' hit a block, but you could also hit a shank!

Again, Bob and Coach will give better diagnosis and info than me.
		
Click to expand...

Thanks Gareth, I see what you mean about my rotation. It is something I have been working on and obviously something I need to continue working on. As well as the path, thought I had gotten it to a place where it wasn't left anymore but clearly is. Better than it used to be but not where I'd like it, again further work needed.


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## One Planer (Apr 26, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



garyinderry said:



			don't go chasing it.  I got rid of my strong draw now struggle to hit anything but weak slices.  


Plenty of work to do again this summer as I didn't do a tap all winter.
		
Click to expand...

I'm not pal. It's just a consequence of a more efficient movement I'm now making.

If I slide my hips I get a block, when I turn I boom the draw.

Like most things, it's getting our of the old 'bad' habits.


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

would say that the areas to look over need to be along the lines spoken to earlier 

(so  keeping 'connection' going to the top to maintain the integrity of the  trail arm angle at the top to near or at 90Âº so the arms don't continue  to overrun, so long & sometimes across the line at top 
- as any  over run always means the arms got to start down first so shoulder so  little move out and over weight staying on the trailside some too long  and all that kind of stuff - with the arms/club coming from behind the  body then the rotation of the hips upper body has to slow some before it  should some of the reason hips are still pretty square on plus little  ways of a rise up etc
- from which it's possible to play pretty good  some of the time but is real difficult 'to time consistently' to get  'release' happening at the right place in the swing motion as it tend to  start to throw the angles away too early in the downswing so trail arm  straightens out too soon so that 'release' then taking place when hands  opposite trail thigh {not lead thigh) 
so there's a little ways of a flip release with the swing direction traveling rightfield to leftfield through the impact area
 it's then real easy to get strikes off center little too much loft and  depending where the face is looking plus where on the face the ball  comes off of as to how the ball flies)

those small hip punch  drills although a ways boring as I get folks want to always hit full  shots, are real important in feeling how the weight, hip clearance,  upper body rotation all have to work with the arms to have the 'release'  take place more at the lead thigh so the hands ahead slight forwards  lean shaft to deloft the face to get good dynamic loft and strike off of  the best height on the clubface and also square the face - to optimum  'compression' at strike etc

if the net get used a fair bit for  practice it's real important not to become to 'ball bound' (even though  the object is too improve strike) so the focus still has to be getting  ball out to target even if that target is an imagined one (given the  net) as with the target in mind it's a ways easier to see the path the  clubhead has to approach and leave the ball

so even if using net  would put a stick down to 'target' ball just inside of stick with an  allowance of 1/2 inch to toe of clubhead plus second stick halfways  between ball and toe line with a say 1' square piece of card and some  tape to attach at around midriff height on the net (which the stick by  the ball is pointing at) at the distance the net is from the strike  point then say with 8i,7i,6i (with full swings) the ball would be  contacting the net somewhere at or just under the 1' square and with  this the focus is moved away from the ball as it should be

if  through the smaller pelvic punch drills the feeling of weight left, hip  cleared hands ahead with chest rotation can be really experienced then  it's a ways easier to repeat this first through 60% full swings to keep  motion happening in sequence then up the speed to 80%


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

these drills (like the earlier one posted) all about having the sequence happen in good order so the hands release the shaft nearer the lead thigh to get that solid strike so all about finding and experiencing/feeling  where the release should be with the hip cleared weight solid on the lead side 

[video=youtube;f7z7psYQpM4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7z7psYQpM4[/video]


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube;O5xbC74wc4M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5xbC74wc4M[/video]


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

re the top of the swing here's a ways to feel where the trail arm is, the approx 90Âº angle and the 'air' between the hands and the trail ear - so that push aways with the trail arm from the drill position is crucial to 'feeling' the area the top of the swing is a deal better to be (though there's no such thing as overall 'perfect position' as mentioned in the audio)
so the hands/arms/club don't overrun and get overlong, so then a ways easier to start down in good sequence and not lose the angles too early so have the little ways 'flip release' take place around the trail thigh area

[video=youtube;qQMBmziWgPc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQMBmziWgPc[/video]


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube;Jdt-KQzzpeg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdt-KQzzpeg[/video]


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## Garush34 (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			would say that the areas to look over need to be along the lines spoken to earlier 

(so  keeping 'connection' going to the top to maintain the integrity of the  trail arm angle at the top to near or at 90Âº so the arms don't continue  to overrun, so long & sometimes across the line at top 
- as any  over run always means the arms got to start down first so shoulder so  little move out and over weight staying on the trailside some too long  and all that kind of stuff - with the arms/club coming from behind the  body then the rotation of the hips upper body has to slow some before it  should some of the reason hips are still pretty square on plus little  ways of a rise up etc
- from which it's possible to play pretty good  some of the time but is real difficult 'to time consistently' to get  'release' happening at the right place in the swing motion as it tend to  start to throw the angles away too early in the downswing so trail arm  straightens out too soon so that 'release' then taking place when hands  opposite trail thigh {not lead thigh) 
so there's a little ways of a flip release with the swing direction traveling rightfield to leftfield through the impact area
 it's then real easy to get strikes off center little too much loft and  depending where the face is looking plus where on the face the ball  comes off of as to how the ball flies)

those small hip punch  drills although a ways boring as I get folks want to always hit full  shots, are real important in feeling how the weight, hip clearance,  upper body rotation all have to work with the arms to have the 'release'  take place more at the lead thigh so the hands ahead slight forwards  lean shaft to deloft the face to get good dynamic loft and strike off of  the best height on the clubface and also square the face - to optimum  'compression' at strike etc

if the net get used a fair bit for  practice it's real important not to become to 'ball bound' (even though  the object is too improve strike) so the focus still has to be getting  ball out to target even if that target is an imagined one (given the  net) as with the target in mind it's a ways easier to see the path the  clubhead has to approach and leave the ball

so even if using net  would put a stick down to 'target' ball just inside of stick with an  allowance of 1/2 inch to toe of clubhead plus second stick halfways  between ball and toe line with a say 1' square piece of card and some  tape to attach at around midriff height on the net (which the stick by  the ball is pointing at) at the distance the net is from the strike  point then say with 8i,7i,6i (with full swings) the ball would be  contacting the net somewhere at or just under the 1' square and with  this the focus is moved away from the ball as it should be

if  through the smaller pelvic punch drills the feeling of weight left, hip  cleared hands ahead with chest rotation can be really experienced then  it's a ways easier to repeat this first through 60% full swings to keep  motion happening in sequence then up the speed to 80%
		
Click to expand...

Thanks coach. This video was taken from my warm up for the comp last week hence the net. I usually use the actual range when working on stuff where I can see ball flight, just use the net for warm up as it easier to collect balls. 

I really liked the explanations in the automatic hands/arms video, made a lot of sense will give it a try when I can. 

For keeping the trail arm from bending I have seen a drill where you put an inflatable band like a swimming band on the trail arm around the elbow to stop it from bending too much, is this something you think would benefit the connection or a waste of time?


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## the_coach (Apr 27, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

yep 
the swimming band can re real useful - thing is you really gotta make sure its a 'fit' that won't move around
and it's best placed so when the trail arm is almost at 90Âº it is just a fraction aways from touching the band - so not used as something you fold the arm right up up against and touch the band - that ways you get used to around 85Âº angle during regular every week sessions - so gradually over time of this kinda preventive practice use then when out in play the arm doesn't continue to break down past 90Âº

was at a tourney on the practice ground some weeks back warming up next to a Tour pro who was using a very same 'swim arm float' as well as a swingyde - something he said he did on a regular basis to remind him

know you not going to buy from here but it was this exact one

http://www.amazon.com/Lovely-Inflatable-Rollup-Floats-Armlets/dp/B00LPAR6M4

there's also a thing called a 'swing extender' that's a plastic triangle with a velcro belt
here's a vid of a teaching pro speaking of the placement  - as above

[video=youtube;81mf0BbS9yk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81mf0BbS9yk[/video]


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## Garush34 (Apr 28, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

I Stopped on the way home last night to get an armband and took a few swing out in the front with it and it certainly does the trick. Much better position at the top, obviously going to take some work to ingrain it full time. But I figure 10 mins a night swing a club can't be a bad thing.  

Here's some pictures of the top of back swing positions.


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## Garush34 (Apr 28, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			yep 
the swimming band can re real useful - thing is you really gotta make sure its a 'fit' that won't move around
and it's best placed so when the trail arm is almost at 90Âº it is just a fraction aways from touching the band - so not used as something you fold the arm right up up against and touch the band - that ways you get used to around 85Âº angle during regular every week sessions - so gradually over time of this kinda preventive practice use then when out in play the arm doesn't continue to break down past 90Âº

was at a tourney on the practice ground some weeks back warming up next to a Tour pro who was using a very same 'swim arm float' as well as a swingyde - something he said he did on a regular basis to remind him

know you not going to buy from here but it was this exact one

http://www.amazon.com/Lovely-Inflatable-Rollup-Floats-Armlets/dp/B00LPAR6M4

there's also a thing called a 'swing extender' that's a plastic triangle with a velcro belt
here's a vid of a teaching pro speaking of the placement  - as above

[video=youtube;81mf0BbS9yk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81mf0BbS9yk[/video]
		
Click to expand...

Thanks coach, I had seen that swing extender before but the price seemed quite steep considering the armband I got only cost 59p.


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## Garush34 (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

Just thought I'd update for a bit of advice. Been going along nicely this year with some good results. But the bad shot for me now seem to be a pull. Too tee shots yesterday is what cost me a cut, both pulls both into trees with one ending up in a ditch and one OOB. 

Here are my latest swings:

[video=youtube;nP3_ZL1XTJo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nP3_ZL1XTJo[/video]


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## Garush34 (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

[video=youtube;KpD9rLs2QZA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpD9rLs2QZA[/video]

Any reply's/advice greatly appreciated.


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## Foxholer (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

There doesn't seem to be very much (if any!) hip rotation in the backswing. It's quite possible that adding some of that could help reduce the brain's perception that a long(er) backswing is needed - which, as the vid shows is not the case anyway! The rotation on the through-swing is actually pretty good, so it doesn't appear to be a case of 'cannot rotate the hips'! 

Nice rhythm otherwise!


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## guest100718 (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*

to me your lower body looks to static and you look like youre casting the club.


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## the_coach (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Garush34 said:



			Just thought I'd update for a bit of advice. Been going along nicely this year with some good results. But the bad shot for me now seem to be a pull. Too tee shots yesterday is what cost me a cut, both pulls both into trees with one ending up in a ditch and one OOB.
		
Click to expand...

on your swing youtube pages under 'settings' there's the ability to  play the vid at 0.25 speed

so if poss then run the vids at that speed easy to see what's going down and also pause to get a  better picture of what's goin down at certain points - although swing motion is just that 'a whole motion' & not just a particular 'still frozen image frame' still it's good to understand exactly what 'points' that motion is goin through

pulls are to some extent goin  back to the stuff my posts mentioned earlier on in the thread - that  tendency for the angles on the downswing starting to get lost a ways too  early so happening tad before & opposite the trail thigh so the  arms/hands structure not transporting the hands/handle with 'angle' up  to the ball/lead thigh area - have a look at the face-on vid in that  youtube 0:25 speed setting as its a ways easier to see and understand  what's goin down

always check shoulder alignment. hip, feet this  one dtl swing shoulders look to be a tad open to start off while foot  line maybes a tad closed - would always train/practice and shoot on cell  with some alignment sticks down essential for really checking all that  stuff out

there's a point in the face-on vid when the top of the  swing looks pretty good shaft nicely short of parallel at the top there -  but then the arms/club carry on a ways  - so my take would be to  revisit the drills etc on all that stuff (small swing drills etc)

so  in that slow-mo setting goin back to the face-on vid in that swing  motion getting to halfways down when hands are past hip level and  hands/handle are at the area of the trail thigh there's no real 'angle'  remaining between club & lead arm their condition is already in a  straight line

so given that there's then a need for arms/club to  go through still in that more straight line relationship as there's no  angles left to release so then there will be some kind of a flip - by  that meaning extension of the lead wrist to a 'cup shape' through the  strike this is always going to point the face angle and loft leftfield  some ball will start were the face is looking

so get that no-one  much wants to do these but a tremendous help so really get some change  goin again my take would be  - back to those small swing drills, hip  punch etc to begin to get the hands handle more to the lead thigh with  those angles still thee that's a ways crucial as then with the angle the  hands hands can travel leftfield some as this 'sends' the clubhead down  and out to and through the strike

if it's possible to view swing  page in youtube slow-mo (.25) take a real close look at the actual top  of the swing (face-on vid) and the start down although the weight in the  lower body gets/transfers to the lower left side the upper body and the  head also goes also towards target so head is getting in-front of the  ball this a big part the reason the 'angles' disappear little ways too  early in the downswing

so another good reason to re-visit those  hip punch drills to be able to execute these at slower speed without the  upper body/head moving in front of the ball


----------



## Garush34 (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



Foxholer said:



			There doesn't seem to be very much (if any!) hip rotation in the backswing. It's quite possible that adding some of that could help reduce the brain's perception that a long(er) backswing is needed - which, as the vid shows is not the case anyway! The rotation on the through-swing is actually pretty good, so it doesn't appear to be a case of 'cannot rotate the hips'! 

Nice rhythm otherwise!
		
Click to expand...

Thanks, i have tried working on hip turn and it felt like it had been better. I can see that with limited turn there's just no space to come down so the club goes out a bit over the top. Found a couple drills to feel proper turn. Thanks again.


----------



## Garush34 (Aug 15, 2016)

*Re: Asses my swing*



the_coach said:



			on your swing youtube pages under 'settings' there's the ability to  play the vid at 0.25 speed

so if poss then run the vids at that speed easy to see what's going down and also pause to get a  better picture of what's goin down at certain points - although swing motion is just that 'a whole motion' & not just a particular 'still frozen image frame' still it's good to understand exactly what 'points' that motion is goin through

pulls are to some extent goin  back to the stuff my posts mentioned earlier on in the thread - that  tendency for the angles on the downswing starting to get lost a ways too  early so happening tad before & opposite the trail thigh so the  arms/hands structure not transporting the hands/handle with 'angle' up  to the ball/lead thigh area - have a look at the face-on vid in that  youtube 0:25 speed setting as its a ways easier to see and understand  what's goin down

always check shoulder alignment. hip, feet this  one dtl swing shoulders look to be a tad open to start off while foot  line maybes a tad closed - would always train/practice and shoot on cell  with some alignment sticks down essential for really checking all that  stuff out

there's a point in the face-on vid when the top of the  swing looks pretty good shaft nicely short of parallel at the top there -  but then the arms/club carry on a ways  - so my take would be to  revisit the drills etc on all that stuff (small swing drills etc)

so  in that slow-mo setting goin back to the face-on vid in that swing  motion getting to halfways down when hands are past hip level and  hands/handle are at the area of the trail thigh there's no real 'angle'  remaining between club & lead arm their condition is already in a  straight line

so given that there's then a need for arms/club to  go through still in that more straight line relationship as there's no  angles left to release so then there will be some kind of a flip - by  that meaning extension of the lead wrist to a 'cup shape' through the  strike this is always going to point the face angle and loft leftfield  some ball will start were the face is looking

so get that no-one  much wants to do these but a tremendous help so really get some change  goin again my take would be  - back to those small swing drills, hip  punch etc to begin to get the hands handle more to the lead thigh with  those angles still thee that's a ways crucial as then with the angle the  hands hands can travel leftfield some as this 'sends' the clubhead down  and out to and through the strike

if it's possible to view swing  page in youtube slow-mo (.25) take a real close look at the actual top  of the swing (face-on vid) and the start down although the weight in the  lower body gets/transfers to the lower left side the upper body and the  head also goes also towards target so head is getting in-front of the  ball this a big part the reason the 'angles' disappear little ways too  early in the downswing

so another good reason to re-visit those  hip punch drills to be able to execute these at slower speed without the  upper body/head moving in front of the ball
		
Click to expand...

Thanks coach, I'll revisit.


----------

