# F1 Race



## golfbluecustard (Sep 6, 2020)

Anyone watching today's F1 ?

 Yellow Flags / Safety Car and now Red Flag not to mention time penalties 

 This has all the drama that we love about sport !

 GBC


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## ger147 (Sep 6, 2020)

Great race, and nice to see David beating Goliath for once.  Brilliant drive from Gasly, taking advantage of other's mistakes to score his first ever win. Also nice to see McLaren and Racing Point on the podium.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 6, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Great race, and nice to see David beating Goliath for once.  Brilliant drive from Gasly, taking advantage of other's mistakes to score his first ever win. Also nice to see McLaren and Racing Point on the podium.
		
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 Just wish there was this much excitement from F1 every time  !!! 

 GBC


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## NearHull (Sep 6, 2020)

Great race.  Bottas didn’t seem to get as much out of his Mercedes as did Hamilton.  Well done Gasly.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 6, 2020)

Great race, but what a ridiculous rule being allowed to change tyres while under the red flag, means some cars basically gained 25 seconds for free!


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 6, 2020)

SaintHacker said:



			Great race, but what a ridiculous rule being allowed to change tyres while under the red flag, means some cars basically gained 25 seconds for free!
		
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understand that you need rules but the ones in F1 sometimes really don't make sense, with as you say tyre changes under a red flag being one of them !!!

 GBC


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## HomerJSimpson (Sep 6, 2020)

Best race for ages. I imagine Hamilton and the team bosses will be having a few words about the decision to pit. Surely the onus is on the driver to be aware of the signs/flags and react accordingly


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## Smiffy (Sep 7, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Best race for ages. I imagine Hamilton and the team bosses will be having a few words about the decision to pit. Surely the onus is on the driver to be aware of the signs/flags and react accordingly
		
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He was told to pit by the team. Try working that one out whilst your doing 150mph......


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## HomerJSimpson (Sep 7, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			He was told to pit by the team. Try working that one out whilst your doing 150mph......


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I agree Smiffy. Clearly a bad call by the team but even at 150mph would he not have been able to see the two set of lights saying the pit lane was closed and overridden the decision. Could the team also not know the pit lane was closed and told him to stay out.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 7, 2020)

Never mind Mercedes 'normal' efficiency going to pot... I am just pleased the Tifosi were not in the house witnessing, first hand, the absolute debacle Ferrari have morphed into...


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

There was no reason to close the pit lane, big error by the FIA


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			There was no reason to close the pit lane, big error by the FIA
		
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They were wheeling a broken down car back along it, you cant have pit stops happening while thats going on.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			They were wheeling a broken down car back along it, you cant have pit stops happening while thats going on.
		
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Not while Hamilton went past




Magnusson parked his car right in front of an exit in the barrier, why did they not just push it back or why didn't Mugnusson carry on into the pits


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## Slime (Sep 7, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			Anyone watching today's F1 ?

Yellow Flags / Safety Car and now Red Flag not to mention time penalties

*This has all the drama that we love about sport !*

GBC
		
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Yeah, shame it's the best way to make a motor race exciting.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			Not while Hamilton went past

View attachment 32294


Magnusson parked his car right in front of an exit in the barrier, why did they not just push it back or why didn't Mugnusson carry on into the pits
		
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The pit lane was closed when Lewis went past, in readiness to bring the stricken car in.

It was To wide to fit through the barrier gap.
Its a multi million pound machine and additional running can cause extensive damage running in to hundreds of thousands.....


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## Robster59 (Sep 7, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			Anyone watching today's F1 ?

Yellow Flags / Safety Car and now Red Flag not to mention time penalties

This has all the drama that we love about sport !

GBC
		
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If you want drama, and excellent racing, look at all the MotoGP races that have taken place since they re-started.  Knocks F1 into a cocked hat!


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

Robster59 said:



			If you want drama, and excellent racing, look at all the MotoGP races that have taken place since they re-started.  Knocks F1 into a cocked hat!
		
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They seem to crash a lot... bit on the slow side too


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			They seem to crash a lot... bit on the slow side too
		
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And they don't pop into KwikFit after a few laps.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			The pit lane was closed when Lewis went past, in readiness to bring the stricken car in.

It was To wide to fit through the barrier gap.
Its a multi million pound machine and additional running can cause extensive damage running in to hundreds of thousands.....
		
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An escape route too narrow to get a car through?


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## Robster59 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			They seem to crash a lot... bit on the slow side too
		
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Well, if you consider speeds of 200mph on two wheels slow......  And speed isn't everything.  Try watching a Moto 3 race sometime.  250cc and brilliant racing.  
True, they do crash but there are crashes in most form of motor sport.  It happens when people drive/ride on the edge.  However, they also *RACE* against each other with lots more overtaking, close action and not reliant on pit-stops or red flags and safety cars to overtake.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 7, 2020)

Robster59 said:



			If you want drama, and excellent racing, look at all the MotoGP races that have taken place since they re-started.  Knocks F1 into a cocked hat!
		
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Until as such a time MM returns...

Some great racing from both BSB & WSB this week end... 

Love motorsport... Two and four wheeled... Most recent Speedway GP featured some top drawer racing... Shame Woofie couldn't quite take the final to top the night...


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 7, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			Until as such a time MM returns...

Some great racing from both BSB & WSB this week end...

Love motorsport... Two and four wheeled... Most recent Speedway GP featured some top drawer racing... Shame Woofie couldn't quite take the final to top the night...
		
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I share your love of most forms of both two and four wheels sport.

But I would have to draw the line at Speedway. Have been to the old style World Final and regular at Perry Barr back in the seventies (wife was keen!) but I am afraid the first out of the gate wins didn't do it for me.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

Robster59 said:



			Well, if you consider speeds of 200mph on two wheels slow......  And speed isn't everything.  Try watching a Moto 3 race sometime.  250cc and brilliant racing. 
True, they do crash but there are crashes in most form of motor sport.  It happens when people drive/ride on the edge.  However, they also *RACE* against each other with lots more overtaking, close action and not reliant on pit-stops or red flags and safety cars to overtake.
		
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I've no interest in bikes in any form, an F1 car could give a moto GP a 30 second head start on most tracks and still beat them hands down.
But even more to the point, why does every F1 thread end up with some biker telling us how great Moto GP is and is so much better than F1?  

I really dont care, go and start a motorbike thread.


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## Robster59 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			I've no interest in bikes in any form, an F1 car could give a moto GP a 30 second head start on most tracks and still beat them hands down.
But even more to the point, why does every F1 thread end up with some biker telling us how great Moto GP is and is so much better than F1? 

I really dont care, go and start a motorbike thread.
		
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Actually, retired biker, but I have friends who don't and have never rode a bike and stay the same.  As does my partner.  She has no interest in F1 but loves MotoGP.  No harm in making a comparison.  
I used to enjoy F1 but nowadays it's just too processional and reliant on outside forces to make it interesting.  
And the thread is about how exciting the racing was, not how fast the cars are.  Maybe they could go around a track 30 seconds faster, but I know which is the more interesting to watch.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			I've no interest in bikes in any form, an F1 car could give a moto GP a 30 second head start on most tracks and still beat them hands down.
But even more to the point, why does every F1 thread end up with some biker telling us how great Moto GP is and is so much better than F1? 

I really dont care, go and start a motorbike thread.
		
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As far as I can see there has been  no claim  as to which is  better, only which has the closer more exciting racing.

There's no dispute that the lap times are quicker in F1 although the straight line speed isn't. 

The technology is greater in F1.

But races are rarely if ever close, on some tracks overtaking is virtually impossible and results are often predictable.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			As far as I can see there has been  no claim  as to which is  better, only which has the closer more exciting racing.

There's no dispute that the lap times are quicker in F1 although the straight line speed isn't.

The technology is greater in F1.

But races are rarely if ever close, on some tracks overtaking is virtually impossible and results are often predictable.
		
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😂😂 And Marc Márquez winning every week isn't predictable? 
Let's not pretend MotoGP isn't dominated by a select few drivers.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			😂😂 And Marc Márquez winning every week isn't predictable?
Let's not pretend MotoGP isn't dominated by a select few drivers.
		
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Not this year😉

And the riders are generally more closely bunched.

Unfortunately most forms of motorsport are likely to be heavily influenced by budget.


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## DanFST (Sep 7, 2020)

Bring back prime BTCC.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			Not this year😉

And the riders are generally more closely bunched.

Unfortunately most forms of motorsport are likely to be heavily influenced by budget.
		
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Mercedes spent over 300mil last year! thats a lot of dosh..
Im looking forward to the new regs and see if closes the bunch up, but there are still plenty of exciting races to be had as well.
Red flags, safety cars etc are all part and parcel of what makes an F1 weekend and always will be.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

DanFST said:



			Bring back prime BTCC.
		
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Its live on ITV these days....


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## ger147 (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			There was no reason to close the pit lane, big error by the FIA
		
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The broken down car was broken down in the pit lane entrance with stewards on the track pushing the car out of the way, hence the pit lane being closed.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

Err no.
When Hamilton went past, nobody was on the track doing anything. They were obviously waiting for instructions.
I don't know why they didn't just push the car back 12 feet behind the barrier




Even DC in the commentary said there was no reason for the safety car


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## ger147 (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			Err no.
When Hamilton went past, nobody was on the track doing anything. They were obviously waiting for instructions.
I don't know why they didn't just push the car back 12 feet behind the barrier

View attachment 32296


Even DC in the commentary said there was no reason for the safety car
		
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Err yes...

You can clearly see marshalls out from behind the barrier only feet from the edge of the track that makes up the pit lane entrance next to the stricken car as Hamilton drives past. Open and shut case.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

ger147 said:



			The broken down car was broken down in the pit lane entrance with *stewards on the track pushing the car out of the way*, hence the pit lane being closed.
		
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ger147 said:



			Err yes...

You can clearly see marshalls out from behind the barrier *only feet from the edge of the track* that makes up the pit lane entrance next to the stricken car as Hamilton drives past. Open and shut case.
		
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They were indeed feet from the track but still behind the barrier as the on-board clearly shows
So not on the track pushing the car out of the way as the car was still on the grass.



I know they did eventually push the car down the pit lane but that was after Hamilton went past. At that point there was no danger and no need for the safety car as DC confirmed on the CH4 coverage.


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## ger147 (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			They were indeed feet from the track but still behind the barrier as the on-board clearly shows
So not on the track pushing the car out of the way as the car was still on the grass.

View attachment 32297

I know they did eventually push the car down the pit lane but that was after Hamilton went past. At that point there was no danger and no need for the safety car as DC confirmed on the CH4 coverage.
		
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DC is not the race steward, he's just giving his opinion.

The marshalls were out from behind the barriers on the edge of the track next to the stricken car (as the photo you posted clearly shows), the race steward decided it was dangerous, called a safety car and closed the pit lane. All this took place BEFORE Hamilton arrived, hence the penalty.

As I said above, open and shut case.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

ger147 said:



			The marshalls were out from behind the barriers on the edge of the track next to the stricken car (as the photo you posted clearly shows),
		
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I don't know how you see that from the photo, I see them behind the barrier, no-where near the car, but whatever.


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I don't know how you see that from the photo, I see them behind the barrier, no-where near the car, but whatever.
		
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The pit lane was closed 12 seconds before Hamilton arrived.. You make it sound like it was split second stuff.


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## CliveW (Sep 7, 2020)

It doesn't matter where the car or marshalls were. The pit lane was closed, Hamilton was wrong. End of!


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## ger147 (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I don't know how you see that from the photo, I see them behind the barrier, no-where near the car, but whatever.
		
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The first photo you posted clearly shows the marshalls on the grass right at the edge of the track next to the stricken car, not behind a barrier.


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## bobmac (Sep 7, 2020)

CliveW said:



			It doesn't matter where the car or marshalls were. The pit lane was closed, Hamilton was wrong. End of!
		
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Totally agree.
I just think the decision to close the pit lane and deploy the SC was wrong and the car should have been pushed back. Or even better, KM should have free wheeled into the pits.


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## ger147 (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			Totally agree.
I just think the decision to close the pit lane and deploy the SC was wrong and the car should have been pushed back. Or even better, KM should have free wheeled into the pits.
		
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The car could not be pushed back, the gap in the barrier was a marshall's post not a car access point so there was no room to push the car back there...

https://the-race.com/formula-1/fia-clarifies-four-points-of-contention-over-closed-pitlane/


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## Old Skier (Sep 7, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Err yes...

You can clearly see marshalls out from behind the barrier only feet from the edge of the track that makes up the pit lane entrance next to the stricken car as Hamilton drives past. Open and shut case.
		
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The marshals did appear from behind the barrier only to be radioed and told to get back, presumably to wait for the SC. Hamilton acknowledges the mistake and took responsibility although with the flash to bang time receiving the indication in the car of the deployment he was probably already committed.


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 7, 2020)

Old Skier said:



			The marshals did appear from behind the barrier only to be radioed and told to get back, presumably to wait for the SC. Hamilton acknowledges the mistake and took responsibility although with the flash to bang time receiving the indication in the car of the deployment he was probably already committed.
		
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As DC said at the time, there should be a much more obvious indicator showing the driver, perhaps a big red light above the pit lane.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 7, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			As DC said at the time, there should be a much more obvious indicator showing the driver, perhaps a big red light above the pit lane.
		
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This. Those signs on the outside of the track are useless, there's no way adriver doing 150+ round the parabolica would be able to see them, let alone actually read what is on them. The commentators were on about a red cross but to me on the slow mo it looked like they just said SC for safety car


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## jim8flog (Sep 7, 2020)

DanFST said:



			Bring back prime BTCC.
		
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 I thought that was still on but shown mainly on ITV 4 so easy to miss.


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## jim8flog (Sep 7, 2020)

bobmac said:



			An escape route too narrow to get a car through?  

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 The trouble was the marshalls had erected their picnic table across the escape route


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## Old Skier (Sep 7, 2020)

jim8flog said:



			The trouble was the marshalls had erected their picnic table across the escape route
		
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It’s Italy, were else would you put your pizza and vino


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 7, 2020)

Old Skier said:



			It’s Italy, were else would you put your pizza and vino
		
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👏👏👏


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## MegaSteve (Sep 7, 2020)

Absolutely no surprise to be reading rumours about the Gasly/Albon swop being reversed...


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## Old Skier (Sep 7, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			Absolutely no surprise to be reading rumours about the Gasly/Albon swop being reversed...
		
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Albon not doing the business and going by his interviews I think he knows it.


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## Blue in Munich (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			I've no interest in bikes in any form, an F1 car could give a moto GP a 30 second head start on most tracks and still beat them hands down.
But even more to the point, *why does every F1 thread end up with some biker telling us how great Moto GP is and is so much better than F1? *

I really dont care, go and start a motorbike thread.
		
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Because bikes are better than cars.


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## Blue in Munich (Sep 7, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			I share your love of most forms of both two and four wheels sport.

But I would have to draw the line at Speedway. Have been to the old style World Final and regular at Perry Barr back in the seventies (wife was keen!) but *I am afraid the first out of the gate wins didn't do it for me.*

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Then I suspect you either had a poor trackman or not enough shale, a former regular at Wimbledon says.  On a decent track there should always be alternative lines & the opportunity to catch up.  I fully agree that on a poor track it's a bit of a borefest.


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## Beedee (Sep 7, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			Absolutely no surprise to be reading rumours about the Gasly/Albon swop being reversed...
		
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If it happens (and I could well believe it) I wouldn't be surprised to suddenly see Gasly suddenly struggling and Albon driving well.  The Red Bull car and team is totally bult around Verstappen's preferences.  Gasly couldn't drive Max's car last time.  Albon can't drive it now.  But the Toro Rosso / Alpha Tauri seems much more neutral.  Plus the pressure in the main team will be so much more than in the underlings team.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 7, 2020)

Blue in Munich said:



			Then I suspect you either had a poor trackman or not enough shale, a former regular at Wimbledon says.  On a decent track there should always be alternative lines & the opportunity to catch up.  I fully agree that on a poor track it's a bit of a borefest.
		
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Four laps only makes it even less exciting for me, but then my real favourite was old school moto cross. 

45 minutes + 2 laps.👍


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## HomerJSimpson (Sep 7, 2020)

For me some of the best racing is British Touring Cars


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## robinthehood (Sep 7, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			For me some of the best racing is British Touring Cars
		
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Great, start a new thread about it then.


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## Blue in Munich (Sep 7, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			Four laps only makes it even less exciting for me, but then my real favourite was old school moto cross.

45 minutes + 2 laps.👍
		
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Each to their own, but 15 lots of 4 laps on a good track is a decent nights entertainment for me, especially as you can see all the track & al the action.  Makes me wonder about the IoM TT, because as much as I admire them & fancy trying it, I'm not sure how much racing you actually see.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 7, 2020)

HomerJSimpson said:



			For me some of the best racing is British Touring Cars
		
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Glorified bumper cars


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## Robster59 (Sep 7, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Great, start a new thread about it then.
		
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Ooh! Get the unofficial mod. 😄


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## MegaSteve (Sep 7, 2020)

Blue in Munich said:



			Each to their own, but 15 lots of 4 laps on a good track is a decent nights entertainment for me, especially as you can see all the track & al the action.  Makes me wonder about the IoM TT, because as much as I admire them & fancy trying it, I'm not sure how much racing you actually see.
		
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IoM TT is a bit like Le Mans... Not necessarily about the racing but the craic of being there... Soaking up the atmosphere... Being amongst lots of like minded folk... Won't find many from Team Prawn Sandwich in attendance...


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 7, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			IoM TT is a bit like Le Mans... Not necessarily about the racing but the craic of being there... Soaking up the atmosphere... Being amongst lots of like minded folk... Won't find many from Team Prawn Sandwich in attendance...
		
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Been to Le Mans, and one F1 race and for all the reasons you outline above would love to go to the IoM TT 

GBC


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## SaintHacker (Sep 7, 2020)

Robster59 said:



			Ooh! Get the unofficial mod. 😄
		
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It happens every time someone starts an F1 thread though. Within a few posts tje 'f1 is boring' crew come on and try to tell those of us who like it how much better moto gp, or btcc, or tiddlywinks is. If you don't like the sport why even open the thread?


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## Robster59 (Sep 7, 2020)

It's an opinion.  We're all entitled to one.


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## Smiffy (Sep 8, 2020)

bobmac said:



			Even DC in the commentary said there was *no reason for the safety car*

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Hamilton out on his own with a 10 second lead and extending it was good enough reason Bob.


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 8, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			Hamilton out on his own with a 10 second lead and extending it was good enough reason Bob.


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Perhaps when you see him climb up the field after his penalty when his team mate was unable to make any moves just shows why he was clear out front and will be WC this year again.


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## bobmac (Sep 8, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			Hamilton out on his own with a 10 second lead and extending it was good enough reason Bob.


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I don't know what you're suggesting


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## Smiffy (Sep 8, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I don't know what you're suggesting 

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I do mate. I'll explain it one day.......
Nelson Piquet Jr didn't understand at first.


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## robinthehood (Sep 9, 2020)

Perez to leave tracing point at the end of the season. Makes way for vettle,  although he's hoping Hamilton doesn't extend at Merc 

https://www.planetf1.com/news/sergio-perez-racing-point-exit/


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 9, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Perez to leave tracing point at the end of the season. Makes way for vettle,  although he's hoping Hamilton doesn't extend at Merc

https://www.planetf1.com/news/sergio-perez-racing-point-exit/

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 and the merry go round continues... 

 Be interesting when the music stops who hasn't got a drive

 GBC


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## KenL (Sep 9, 2020)

I find f1 SO boring.  Suggest mods ban this discussion. 🤣


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## robinthehood (Sep 9, 2020)

KenL said:



			I find f1 SO boring.  Suggest mods ban this discussion. 🤣
		
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I'd like to get into to the politics at Ferrari but sadly....


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## Deleted member 18588 (Sep 9, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Perez to leave tracing point at the end of the season. Makes way for vettle,  although he's hoping Hamilton doesn't extend at Merc

https://www.planetf1.com/news/sergio-perez-racing-point-exit/

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Some of Vettel's problems in recent times seem to have stemmed from his driving rather than just the failings of Ferrari.

Is he still motivated enough to merit  anything approaching a top drive?

It would be  a shame to see him just hanging around in uncompetitive cars like Kimi.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 9, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			Some of Vettel's problems in recent times seem to have stemmed from his driving rather than just the failings of Ferrari.

Is he still motivated enough to merit  anything approaching a top drive?

It would be  a shame to see him just hanging around in uncompetitive cars like Kimi.
		
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 Kimi i just find sad like a former Champions League winner now playing Pub football which is not what you want your legacy to be


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## robinthehood (Sep 9, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			Some of Vettel's problems in recent times seem to have stemmed from his driving rather than just the failings of Ferrari.

Is he still motivated enough to merit  anything approaching a top drive?

It would be  a shame to see him just hanging around in uncompetitive cars like Kimi.
		
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Aston Martin will have good backing from stroll,  maybe he thinks it will like Lewis at Merc 
1 year of the current cars and then hope the new regs make a big difference.


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## Smiffy (Sep 10, 2020)

MetalMickie said:



			Some of Vettel's problems in recent times seem to have stemmed from his driving rather than just the failings of Ferrari.
		
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The problem with Vettel is he is trying to extract 100% out of a car that is only delivering 80%. Hamilton is extracting 100% out of a car that is delivering 100%.
That 20% is the difference between success and failure.
Vettel is on the ragged edge almost every time he goes out. Le Clerc is going the same way, hence his accident on Sunday. Driver error.
I like Vettel. He has a great sense of humour, and is a good racer. I still feel he has a couple of WC's in him. I still think he has the passion, he certainly has the ability.
I wouldn't write him off just yet.


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## Smiffy (Sep 10, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			Kimi i just find sad like a former Champions League winner now playing Pub football which is not what you want your legacy to be
		
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Sadly to be joined by the whinger Alonso next year.


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## robinthehood (Sep 10, 2020)

Vettel confirmed for Aston Martin for 2021.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 10, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			The problem with Vettel is he is trying to extract 100% out of a car that is only delivering 80%. Hamilton is extracting 100% out of a car that is delivering 100%.
That 20% is the difference between success and failure.
Vettel is on the ragged edge almost every time he goes out. Le Clerc is going the same way, hence his accident on Sunday. Driver error.
I like Vettel. He has a great sense of humour, and is a good racer. I still feel he has a couple of WC's in him. I still think he has the passion, he certainly has the ability.
I wouldn't write him off just yet.


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Great analysis and be good to see him in a car that delivers 100% 

Appreciate that like the Premiership there are going to be different levels of teams but really want there to be a closer level of racing 

I'm not up to speed on the new rule changes next season but hopefully they go some way to achieve this.

 GBC


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 10, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Vettel confirmed for Aston Martin for 2021.
		
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Great news that Vettel will no longer just be making up the numbers and will be back on the podium again 🏆


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## robinthehood (Sep 10, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			Great news that Vettel will no longer just be making up the numbers and will be back on the podium again 🏆
		
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Maybe, although the big regulation changes have been pushed out to the 2022 season, so it may well not be next year.


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## Beedee (Sep 10, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			The problem with Vettel is he is trying to extract 100% out of a car that is only delivering 80%. Hamilton is extracting 100% out of a car that is delivering 100%.
That 20% is the difference between success and failure.
Vettel is on the ragged edge almost every time he goes out. Le Clerc is going the same way, hence his accident on Sunday. Driver error.
I like Vettel. He has a great sense of humour, and is a good racer. I still feel he has a couple of WC's in him. I still think he has the passion, he certainly has the ability.
I wouldn't write him off just yet.


Click to expand...

I agree the car is a dog this year and both drivers are clearly struggling with it.  Don't agree about the car being the only difference tho.  At the beginning of last season (before Ferrari got caught cheating with their engine) the car was very fast.  But Vettel kept making silly mistakes against the Mercedes, and he kept being beaten by the relative rookie of Le Clerc.

I read Adrian Newey's autobiography a couple of years ago (very good read btw).  He was blown away by Vettel's talent when he arrived at Red Bull and thought he was clearly something special.  But that was a long time ago now.


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## Beedee (Sep 10, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			I'm not up to speed on the new rule changes next season but hopefully they go some way to achieve this.
		
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Thanks to covid, the rules are relatively stable next season.  The big changes have been put off till 2022.  So the Ferrari will be a dog for at least one more year.  And Carlos Sainz is kicking himself.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 10, 2020)

Beedee said:



			I read Adrian Newey's autobiography a couple of years ago (very good read btw).  He was blown away by Vettel's talent when he arrived at Red Bull and thought he was clearly something special.  But that was a long time ago now.
		
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As someone who is massively interested in the technical side of the sport I found that book fascinating


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## SaintHacker (Sep 10, 2020)

Sad to see Checo lose a good seat, I can see Kimi retiring this year though, with Perez taking his seat


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## robinthehood (Sep 10, 2020)

Beedee said:



			Thanks to covid, the rules are relatively stable next season.  The big changes have been put off till 2022.  So the Ferrari will be a dog for at least one more year.  And Carlos Sainz is kicking himself.
		
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Meanwhile Vettel will be in a Merc Powered Aston Martin, so will fancy a podium or 2 i'd say.


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## ger147 (Sep 10, 2020)

Hopefully Red Bull sign Perez for 2021, he deserves a good car and could deffo give Max a run for his money.


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## bobmac (Sep 10, 2020)

I hope Hulkenberg gets signed up somewhere.
It's madness (or money) why the likes of Magnusson and Kvyat are still racing and Hulk isn't.


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## Smiffy (Sep 10, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Hopefully Red Bull sign Perez for 2021, he deserves a good car and could deffo give Max a run for his money.
		
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There's something I don't like about Perez. Can't quite put my finger on it. He comes across as a bit vindictive both on and off the track. He was trying his best to bully Ocon a couple of seasons ago. I don't trust him.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 10, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I hope Hulkenberg gets signed up somewhere.
It's madness (or money) why the likes of Magnusson and Kvyat are still racing and Hulk isn't.
		
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Think it's still the case that certain drivers bring certain sponsors hence why it's not always the best drivers sat on the grid


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 10, 2020)

I thought Aston Martin were aligned to Red Bull now?


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## robinthehood (Sep 10, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			I thought Aston Martin were aligned to Red Bull now?
		
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Nah that's alphatauri 

Tracing point are rebranding as AstonMartin.


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 10, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Nah that's alphatauri

Tracing point are rebranding as AstonMartin.
		
Click to expand...

Aston Martin Red Bull


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## robinthehood (Sep 10, 2020)

I thought you were talking about the other red bull team,  which is alphatauri. 
The AM Red bull tie up end this year so, AM will be a team in their own right. Owned by stroll,  but just tracing point underneath 😉


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 12, 2020)

Ferrari 's 1,000 G.P this weekend, sadly don't think it'll be a happy one ....


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## robinthehood (Sep 12, 2020)

No, usual suspects a the top after FP2, both Ferraris in mid table.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 12, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			I thought Aston Martin were aligned to Red Bull now?
		
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Aston Martin have had a change of ownership since signing deal to contribute to cost of developing the Honda powerplant... 
Can't see that continuing now Stroll owns/controls AM...


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## robinthehood (Sep 12, 2020)

MegaSteve said:



			Aston Martin have had a change of ownership since signing deal to contribute to cost of developing the Honda powerplant...
Can't see that continuing now Stroll owns/controls AM...
		
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It's ending this year.

ALso Bottas must wonder what he has to do to beat Lewis! Fastest in all FP then get's pipped to the pole when it matters.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 13, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			It's ending this year.

ALso Bottas must wonder what he has to do to beat Lewis! Fastest in all FP then get's pipped to the pole when it matters.
		
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 He is the perennial bridesmaid currently, but what's the alternative try and move teams in a full 2021 driver allocation or wait till 2022 and then potentially be in an inferior car

Am out all day so going to miss the race so will settle for highlights later, just hope it's as exciting and drama filled as last week, great to watch and helps to also break down the 'boring F1' tag a lot of people have 

 GBC


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## Smiffy (Sep 13, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			Am out all day so going to miss the race so will settle for highlights later, just *hope it's as exciting and drama filled to break down the 'boring F1' tag a lot of people have*
GBC
		
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Looking at the track layout sadly I think it's going to be Monaco without the shops...........


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## robinthehood (Sep 13, 2020)

golfbluecustard said:



			He is the perennial bridesmaid currently, but what's the alternative try and move teams in a full 2021 driver allocation or wait till 2022 and then potentially be in an inferior car

Am out all day so going to miss the race so will settle for highlights later, just hope it's as exciting and drama filled as last week, great to watch and helps to also break down the 'boring F1' tag a lot of people have

GBC
		
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Interesting article about Mercedes and a potential sale. 

https://www.planetf1.com/news/ineos-buy-mercedes/


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## SaintHacker (Sep 13, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			Looking at the track layout sadly I think it's going to be Monaco without the shops...........

Click to expand...

Not so sure about that, the F2 and F3 races were decent, and given there is virtually zero run off I think we might see a good race


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## ger147 (Sep 13, 2020)

Will be interesting to see if Max can hang it out around the outside of the first few turns and get in about the Mercedes at the start.


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## ger147 (Sep 13, 2020)

Safety car re-start procedure deffo needs looked at. Guys at the back passing massive flashing green lights while Bottas still doing 60mph and weaving back and forth at the front before crossing the start finish line.

Just glad no-one was seriously hurt, that was VERY dangerous.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 13, 2020)

Madness😂 Mugello needs to be a permanent race!


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## robinthehood (Sep 13, 2020)

SaintHacker said:



			Madness😂 Mugello needs to be a permanent race!
		
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Crazy.  🤣😂


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## Reemul (Sep 13, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Safety car re-start procedure deffo needs looked at. Guys at the back passing massive flashing green lights while Bottas still doing 60mph and weaving back and forth at the front before crossing the start finish line.

Just glad no-one was seriously hurt, that was VERY dangerous.
		
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To be fair he never slowed down, some idiot in the midfield dropped back too far and then gunned it causing the other muppets to do the same. From so called professional drivers it really was poor from the back end, they just made an assumption.

However I do think that swerving should not be allowed once the safety car had gone in, stay on line no swerving like other forms of racing.


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## ger147 (Sep 13, 2020)

Reemul said:



			To be fair he never slowed down, some idiot in the midfield dropped back too far and then gunned it causing the other muppets to do the same. From so called professional drivers it really was poor from the back end, they just made an assumption.

However I do think that swerving should not be allowed once the safety car had gone in, stay on line no swerving like other forms of racing.
		
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I wasn't blaming Bottas, it's the lights that don't match the rules. There is no safety car line there as it's not a regular F1 track so Bottas doesn't have to drop the hammer until he crosses the start finish line. However, all you can see on both sides of the track as soon as you come onto the start finish straight is flashing green lights. Those same lights would have been flashing with the Safety Car warning symbol before so as soon as a driver sees them flashing green they are obviously gonna floor it as they are racing again. The lights should not have been flashing green IMO.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 13, 2020)

I missed the lot, including the highlights show due to the M4 being shut un two different places followed by Sunday tailbacks and then the race track that's the M25 so will watch it on catch up, I know the overall winner, thank you Capital FM ! but it sounds like wacky races for the 2nd week running 

 GBC


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## bobmac (Sep 14, 2020)

I thought the chat with Toto Wolff was very interesting.
A 3 year old son, a gorgeous wife, a bank full of money and the stress from the job giving him migraines, who would blame him for calling it a day at the end of the season.


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 14, 2020)

Personally, I thought Mugello to be rather mickey mouse TBH.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 15, 2020)

Bunkermagnet said:



			Personally, I thought Mugello to be rather mickey mouse TBH.
		
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 I'd love to see more street circuits personally but at the same time want lots of passing opportunities as well..... and the two don't always come together 

 Mugello was 'different' and for me would take some getting used to if it were to be a regular circuit 

 GBC


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## Beedee (Sep 15, 2020)

For me one of the highlights of this year has been the lack of street circuits.  Can't stand them.  The old school real circuits like spa and silverstone are best.  Most of the Tilka-drome circuits are dull too.  There's been a couple of good modern circuits but it's a pity Turkey and Malaysia didn't survive commercially.

I worry a bit about F1 going to Portimao later this year.  Was there to watch world superbikes last year.  Decent track for the bikes but I think it may be too small and cramped for F1.


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## SaintHacker (Sep 15, 2020)

I'd agree about street circuits. Monaco is all about history and glitz, dreadful race circuit but the race is almost second fiddle to everything else gping on in the city. Baku is ok, quirky but with a couple of passing opportunities, Singapore is just crap end of


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## harpo_72 (Sep 18, 2020)

Loving Kimi’s tweets ...


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## Robster59 (Sep 18, 2020)

There seems to be a push amongst the F1 hierarchy towards street circuits which seems to be more to do with money than the racing.  Street circuits on the whole tend to offer too few opportunities for overtaking and really close racing.  There are some great circuit designs out there but not always chosen because of the cost of hosting the race.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 18, 2020)

Robster59 said:



			There seems to be a push amongst the F1 hierarchy towards street circuits which seems to be more to do with money than the racing.  Street circuits on the whole tend to offer too few opportunities for overtaking and really close racing.  There are some great circuit designs out there but not always chosen because of the cost of hosting the race.
		
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Do i want pretty, Monaco style, circuits or lots of overtaking, as the two don't come together

Would love them whilst we're without spectators to try some new tracks or one s that dropped off the calendar due maybe to the logistic s of 100,000 people on a race weekend

 GBC


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## bobmac (Sep 23, 2020)

I didn't see that coming

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12040/12079169/stefano-domenicali-to-replace-chase-carey-as-f1-ceo


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## ger147 (Sep 23, 2020)

The "F" in F1 clearly stands for Ferrari...


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## robinthehood (Sep 23, 2020)

ger147 said:



			The "F" in F1 clearly stands for Ferrari...
		
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Ferrari International Assistance


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## bobmac (Sep 23, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Ferrari International Assistance
		
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They need all the help they can get at the moment


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## SaintHacker (Sep 23, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I didn't see that coming

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12040/12079169/stefano-domenicali-to-replace-chase-carey-as-f1-ceo

Click to expand...

Blimey. Although once the initial surprise and the obvious Ferarri links have worn off its probably a very good thing for the sport. The guy knows F1 inside out, its history, traditions etc which worried me a bit with Carey in charge


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 26, 2020)

_and now to Russia ! _


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## robinthehood (Sep 26, 2020)

Crazy q2,  Hamilton showing once again why he's the best.


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## HomerJSimpson (Sep 26, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Crazy q2,  Hamilton showing once again why he's the best.
		
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I guess you can argue he rode his luck to get that chance but what a lap to put in under pressure


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## SaintHacker (Sep 27, 2020)

Far from a classic race today, pleased for Bottas though about time he had some luck go his way. Not sure why Verstappen got driver of the day, surely Gasly was more deserving.
Massive crash in the F2 again this morning, very glad to see both drivers walk away.


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## robinthehood (Sep 27, 2020)

Yeah, not the most exciting of races, the stewards put paid to any excitement there might have been.


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## ger147 (Sep 27, 2020)

robinthehood said:



			Yeah, not the most exciting of races, the stewards put paid to any excitement there might have been.
		
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Stewards had no option, it's their job is to enforce the rules.

And the only difference to the race is Hamilton not lapping round at the front keeping a gap to Bottas.

Stupid of Mercedes to miss the race director's instructions re. race starts and give Hamilton duff information.


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## golfbluecustard (Sep 27, 2020)

Very cutting comments from Hamilton after the race, emotional still no doubt, and rules are rules but if Mercedes and Hamilton aren't aware of them / or interpret them differently then they definitely need clarifying, just now too late 

 Hope the next race is more racing and less rules / time penalties

 GBC


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## Pathetic Shark (Sep 28, 2020)

I do actually feel bad for Hamilton for not winning -   we would have seen his "I'd like to apologise for my incorrect comments about the shooting of Breanna Taylor" T-shirt.


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## robinthehood (Sep 28, 2020)

Pathetic Shark said:



			I do actually feel bad for Hamilton for not winning -   we would have seen his "I'd like to apologise for my incorrect comments about the shooting of Breanna Taylor" T-shirt.
		
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What did he say about Breonna Taylor?


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## bobmac (Sep 28, 2020)

I think DC should come down off the fence and say what he really thinks of the stewards.
Interesting how the stewards changed their minds about giving Lewis's penalty points and fining the team instead.
So Lewis lost points, the team lost points and 25,000 Euros over a grey area in the rules. (DC's words, not mine)


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## ger147 (Sep 28, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I think DC should come down off the fence and say what he really thinks of the stewards.
Interesting how the stewards changed their minds about giving Lewis's penalty points and fining the team instead.
So Lewis lost points, the team lost points and 25,000 Euros over a grey area in the rules. (DC's words, not mine)
		
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Apparently the penalty points were rescinded and the penalty changed to a team fine as the team instructed Lewis to do his practice starts outside of the designated area. So it wasn't Hamilton doing it off his own back, the team gave him duff instructions.


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## bobmac (Sep 28, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Apparently the penalty points were rescinded and the penalty changed to a team fine as the team instructed Lewis to do his practice starts outside of the designated area. So it wasn't Hamilton doing it off his own back, the team gave him duff instructions.
		
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I know, so why punish Hamilton, the race hadn't even started.
The stewards basically said we aren't giving LH two penalty points on his license because Lewis wasn't at fault but because he was at fault, we have given him 2x5 second penalties.
The decision was announced on lap 7 of 53, hardly time to investigate thoroughly.

Am I right in thinking 3 of the 4 stewards aren't ex racing drivers?


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## ger147 (Sep 28, 2020)

bobmac said:



			I know, so why punish Hamilton, the race hadn't even started.
The stewards basically said we aren't giving LH two penalty points on his license because Lewis wasn't at fault but because he was at fault, we have given him 2x5 second penalties.
The decision was announced on lap 7 of 53, hardly time to investigate thoroughly.

Am I right in thinking 3 of the 4 stewards aren't ex racing drivers?
		
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The driver is often punished for team mistakes e.g. grid penalties for mechanical problems.

The time penalties were an open and shut case as soon as the stewards confirmed he had done his practice starts outside of the designated area and that broke whatever rule they were quoting. Not saying I agree with the ruling, just saying once they decided it was a rule breach then the penalties wouldn't take long to decide upon.

Since 2010, 1 of the 4 stewards at each F1 grand prix is an ex-racing driver.


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## cliveb (Sep 28, 2020)

ger147 said:



			The time penalties were an open and shut case as soon as the stewards confirmed he had done his practice starts outside of the designated area and that broke whatever rule they were quoting.
		
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But the core probloem here is that the "designated area" is ambiguously defined in the rules.
Hamilton did his practice starts in a place that could conceivably be interpreted as within the designated area. The stewards didn't think so, but it's down to interpretation.


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## bobmac (Sep 28, 2020)

cliveb said:



			But the core probloem here is that the "designated area" is ambiguously defined in the rules.
Hamilton did his practice starts in a place that could conceivably be interpreted as within the designated area. The stewards didn't think so, but *it's down to interpretation.*

Click to expand...

Hence DC's comment about the grey area and why Rule 19 will be rewritten before next season.


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## ger147 (Sep 28, 2020)

cliveb said:



			But the core probloem here is that the "designated area" is ambiguously defined in the rules.
Hamilton did his practice starts in a place that could conceivably be interpreted as within the designated area. The stewards didn't think so, but it's down to interpretation.
		
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Not at all, the designated area is defined for every track as part of the briefing the teams are given before every race...

https://drivetribe.com/p/hamiltons-...EC1TSJSzZNf_ppszfA?iid=NlM2U8QhTMSV1VFO2W-wUw


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## ger147 (Sep 28, 2020)

bobmac said:



			Hence DC's comment about the grey area and why Rule 19 will be rewritten before next season.
		
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Article 12.1.1, Article 36.1 and Note 8 of the Event Notes. Not sure what Rule 19 DC was on about...


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## ger147 (Sep 28, 2020)

In other Hamilton related news, the latest is he is about to put pen to paper on a new 3 year £120m contract with Mercedes. Nice work if you can get it.


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## robinthehood (Sep 28, 2020)

ger147 said:



			In other Hamilton related news, the latest is he is about to put pen to paper on a new 3 year £120m contract with Mercedes. Nice work if you can get it.
		
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Yeah , hed be mad to go anywhere else.


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## HomerJSimpson (Sep 28, 2020)

Thought it was harsh on Hamilton but poor from the team too. If I was principle I'd be looking for clarification on the rule before the next race


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## bobmac (Sep 28, 2020)

ger147 said:



			Not at all, the designated area is defined for every track as part of the briefing the teams are given before every race...

https://drivetribe.com/p/hamiltons-...EC1TSJSzZNf_ppszfA?iid=NlM2U8QhTMSV1VFO2W-wUw

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 "Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race". 
Lewis.....
_“If you look at every race that I have done this year, I always start further down. Never ever had a problem, done it for years. It says you have to be on the right after the lights. It doesn’t say how far._ 

To me that says you must keep right and after the lights, it doesn't say where the designated area finishes.
Anyway, it's irrelevant, it's all done now and Lewis has 2 weeks to cool off before the next race.


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## Smiffy (Sep 29, 2020)

ger147 said:



			In other Hamilton related news, the latest is he is about to put pen to paper on a new 3 year £120m contract with Mercedes. Nice work if you can get it.
		
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Circulate a race track at speeds of up to 200mph and you could get it too!!


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## ger147 (Sep 29, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			Circulate a race track at speeds of up to 200mph and you could get it too!!


Click to expand...

To be fair to Hamilton, there's a bit more to it than that. Dozens of guys all round the world are lapping race tracks at similar speeds and none of them get £40m a year to do so. 👍🏻👍🏻


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## cliveb (Sep 29, 2020)

bobmac said:



			"Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race".
Lewis.....
_“If you look at every race that I have done this year, I always start further down. Never ever had a problem, done it for years. It says you have to be on the right after the lights. It doesn’t say how far._

To me that says you must keep right and after the lights, it doesn't say where the designated area finishes.
Anyway, it's irrelevant, it's all done now and Lewis has 2 weeks to cool off before the next race.
		
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Quite so. The ambiguity is that although the start of the designated area is defined (after the pit exit lights), the end of it isn't. In the absence of any other clarification, it's reasonable to conclude that the designated area extends as far as there is space on the right of the pit lane.

Future races are going to have to place some sort of marker to explicitly show where the area ends.


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## Smiffy (Sep 30, 2020)

ger147 said:



*To be fair to Hamilton, there's a bit more to it than that*.
		
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And that is why he gets £40m a year.


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## ger147 (Sep 30, 2020)

Smiffy said:



			And that is why he gets £40m a year.


Click to expand...

It was you who inferred there wasn't


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