# You have to pick now...



## Imurg (Jul 23, 2016)

A month to go on the RC qualification saga..
Current team..

Rory
Danny
Henrik
Sergio
Chris W
Andy Sully
Matt Fitz
Rafa CB
Rosie...

Now, 3 Captain's picks.

Me...?
I'll have Kaymer, Lowry and Westwood


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Imurg said:



			A month to go on the RC qualification saga..
Current team..

Rory
Danny
Henrik
Sergio
Chris W
Andy Sully
Matt Fitz
Rafa CB
Rosie...

Now, 3 Captain's picks.

Me...?
I'll have Kaymer, Lowry and Westwood
		
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Exactly the same three picks you have 

And think that will be the team that will go 

Good mix and a lot on form


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## Norrin Radd (Jul 23, 2016)

no arguments from me with that team ,weather its a winning team is another matter ,but it will sure give the yanks a run for their money.
Soren K possibly getting a pick if he has a good pga


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## Pin-seeker (Jul 23, 2016)

Boring answer,but I'd also go with your picks. 

PS. I also fancy USA to beat us &#128547;


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## Lord Tyrion (Jul 23, 2016)

Not convinced by Kaymer, possibly by Westwood either although I could well be wrong there. Kjeldsen in for Kaymer. How much fun would it be if Beef was picked? Too soon I know but go on, so much fun with the crowds in the US.


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## Hobbit (Jul 23, 2016)

Lowery, Noren and Tyrell Hatton. That's on current form. Who knows who might come to form in the next 4 weeks.


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## Slime (Jul 23, 2016)

Westy, Kaymer and *The Beef* ........................ he just has to go!


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## RustyTom (Jul 23, 2016)

Beef, Kjeldsen and lowry for me.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Kjeldsen is one that could sneak into the automatic - with the amount of rookies in the automatic slots currently I would be surprised to see many getting a captains pick


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## selwood90 (Jul 23, 2016)

Hatton, Lowery, Westwood for me. If Westwood wasn't a local lad then I'd have gone Noren. Love to see beef go but too early realisticly.


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## Pathetic Shark (Jul 23, 2016)

Imurg, Doon frae Toon and Homer.     The Americans would concede before that trio started over Brexit and Scottish Independence ....  ;-)

Seriously, Westwood (experience), Kaymer (experience) and Kjeldsen.


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## One Planer (Jul 23, 2016)

Hatton, Beef and Kaymer for me.


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## Doon frae Troon (Jul 23, 2016)

Pathetic Shark said:



			Imurg, Doon frae Toon and Homer.     The Americans would concede before that trio started over Brexit and Scottish Independence ....  ;-)

Seriously, Westwood (experience), Kaymer (experience) and Kjeldsen.
		
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Strewth, you can't even get that bit correct.

The Americans gained independence from the UK. 
They would probably give me a few tips, dumping tea etc.


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## Val (Jul 23, 2016)

Tyrell Hatton? Seriously? I wouldn't have him near as a pick, he'd have to make it outright.

Lowry, Dubuisson, Westwood for me.


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## Tongo (Jul 23, 2016)

Westwood, Lowry and McDowell. 

I'm not sure about Kaymer. Ryder Cup record is okay but i think GMAC might just raise his game for the RC.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jul 23, 2016)

Beef, Hatton and Westwood


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## Val (Jul 23, 2016)

That's a few picked Hatton, am I missing something?


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Val said:



			That's a few picked Hatton, am I missing something?
		
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He is doing ok at the moment - just outside the top 20 , same with Johnston - don't expect either would be picked but a good finish to the season could see them creep into the automatic places but agree with your thinking about him - not seen anything yet to suggest RC material in regards Hatton.


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## Hobbit (Jul 23, 2016)

Val said:



			That's a few picked Hatton, am I missing something?
		
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He is well up the European rankings in 9th place, having played about the same or less tournaments than other European tour players that have been suggested. For example, Â£400k ahead of Fitzpatrick who has played 2 more tournaments and Â£150k above Sullivan who has played 2 more tournaments. He Â£400k ahead of Kaymer, having played the same number of tournaments. Numbers don't lie.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Hobbit said:



			He is well up the European rankings in 9th place, having played about the same or less tournaments than other European tour players that have been suggested. For example, Â£400k ahead of Fitzpatrick who has played 2 more tournaments and Â£150k above Sullivan who has played 2 more tournaments. He Â£400k ahead of Kaymer, having played the same number of tournaments. Numbers don't lie.
		
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Is that the Ryder Cup points or the Race to Dubai ?

Edit - just checked that's RTD 

http://www.europeantour.com/rydercup/points/

In the Ryder Cup points he is behind most who have been mentioned but not too far away that if he finally got a win could see him get in


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## Lord Tyrion (Jul 23, 2016)

Dubuisson? Cracking player a year or two ago but he's dropped off a cliff this year, or have I missed something? I'd love to be wrong by the way.


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## Val (Jul 23, 2016)

Hobbit said:



			He is well up the European rankings in 9th place, having played about the same or less tournaments than other European tour players that have been suggested. For example, Â£400k ahead of Fitzpatrick who has played 2 more tournaments and Â£150k above Sullivan who has played 2 more tournaments. He Â£400k ahead of Kaymer, having played the same number of tournaments. Numbers don't lie.
		
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Sullivan and Fitzpatrick have wins under their belt and you can't teach that experience. Hatton just happens to have had two good big money tournaments in a row recently. He got almost half a million euros at the Scottish Open.


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## Val (Jul 23, 2016)

Lord Tyrion said:



			Dubuisson? Cracking player a year or two ago but he's dropped off a cliff this year, or have I missed something? I'd love to be wrong by the way.
		
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Must be doing something right, he's no 9 on the European Tour points list


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## Fish (Jul 23, 2016)

Not sure what the love in is with lowry, he's missed 2 cuts recently I think, I know because I had him in my Fantasy League for a few weeks and he returned zilch, nowt, zero, nuffin!


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Val said:



			Must be doing something right, he's no 9 on the European Tour points list
		
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Must mainly be from the win last year because this year he is having a poor year - best result is tied 38th


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## Tongo (Jul 23, 2016)

Fish said:



			Not sure what the love in is with lowry, he's missed 2 cuts recently I think, I know because I had him in my Fantasy League for a few weeks and he returned zilch, nowt, zero, nuffin!
		
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Whilst finishing tied 2nd the event before. (Although it was only some small, nondescript tourney in the States)


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## Val (Jul 23, 2016)

The next few weeks will give us a clearer idea


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## SammmeBee (Jul 23, 2016)

Has potential for the worst European Ryder Cup team ever - maybe the worst Captain ever also (worse than Faldo yes!!!)........


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## Hobbit (Jul 23, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Is that the Ryder Cup points or the Race to Dubai ?

Edit - just checked that's RTD 

http://www.europeantour.com/rydercup/points/

In the Ryder Cup points he is behind most who have been mentioned but not too far away that if he finally got a win could see him get in
		
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I'd consider a form horse than someone who amassed their points 6 months ago. For example, Sullivan went very quiet from The Masters until a couple of weeks ago. Not suggesting not taking Sullivan, just using him as an example.

If Hatton maintains form I'd consider him at number 12.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 23, 2016)

Hobbit said:



			I'd consider a form horse than someone who amassed their points 6 months ago. For example, Sullivan went very quiet from The Masters until a couple of weeks ago. Not suggesting not taking Sullivan, just using him as an example.

If Hatton maintains form I'd consider him at number 12.
		
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But it's only been two comps for Hatton though ? And even then it's not a win - half his winnings were from a second place, also has had issues with temperament . I think looking at the list there will be quite a few rookies making the automatic slots so is Clarke going to add on more of those with more rookies in his pick ? Very risky move when there are a number of players around the points list that have the expirence both in RC and winning major comps. If he was up and challenging week in week out then could see the call for him - same with Johnston. A good showing in the PGA could push both up - certainly would need to see Hatton win a comp before the teams get announced


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## ScienceBoy (Jul 24, 2016)

Is there enough time to duplicate (certainly not enough time to clone) Stenson? Maybe we need a dimensional anomaly or something?


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## Hosel Fade (Jul 24, 2016)

Lowry, Kaymer, Kjeldsen for me

Slight concerns over Kjeldsen on that massive golf course but he does alright for himself normally

To be really harsh I wouldn't mind seeing Wood get overtaken by someone on the money list so it frees up a pick to then take Hatton realise he has been injured and therefore not played the Open or the Scottish. See how he does next week mind


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## TheDiablo (Jul 24, 2016)

I'm with the OP as well. Kjeldsen as the next in line should Wood not be fit. 

Really don't get the Hatton hype on here. Still yet to win on a major tour, no experience on US soil, a notoriously hot head and a couple of good weeks on Links doesn't jump out to me as Ryder Cup material (yet). The US would be delighted if he was included at the expense of any of the other 4 being mentioned.


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## BrizoH71 (Jul 24, 2016)

Kjeldsen and Lowry I think are shoe-ins... as to the third, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a slightly left-field pick the likes of GMAC, Westwood, Molinari, Donald or Harrington. The team currently is a bit light on experience, and while none of them are in particularly great form, they all have plenty of RC experience and could raise their game heading into the competition.


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## JT77 (Jul 24, 2016)

I think I would def take Westwood and kaymer, then most likely I'd opt for Beef, looks to me like he has the temperament for this sort of thing, and think everyone would enjoy watching him.  
It certainly won't be easy in the US though, they have some really good players in good form, but I'm looking forward to it for sure.


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## Beezerk (Jul 24, 2016)

Beeeeef, Lowry and Kaymer.


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## paddyc (Jul 24, 2016)

With potentially 5 rookies automatically qualifying I cant see Clarke taking anymore debutants as picks. He's defo going to take his pal Westwood. Will Probably take Kaymer. Lowry I would like to see go but may need to get in automatically to get a slot and he has gone off the boil a bit recently. will be interesting.


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## mikejohnchapman (Jul 24, 2016)

Russel Knox, Kaymer and Westwood for me.


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## Beel77 (Jul 24, 2016)

Westwood, Beef and Lowry


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## larmen (Jul 24, 2016)

Would the format suit Westwood? He is playing some really good golf, just can't keep it together for 4 rounds at a time.


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## Slab (Jul 25, 2016)

At the moment Iâ€™d be checking the family trees of some of the Asian & colonial lads... weâ€™re gonna get hosed!






Please please please let someone drag this post up in two months and throw it back in my face


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 25, 2016)

Why do people think we are going to get beaten ( general comment as seen it elsewhere as well ) 

It's the same everytime the RC comes


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## Imurg (Jul 25, 2016)

Probably because, sooner or later, it's gonna happen......


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## Slab (Jul 25, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Why do people think we are going to get beaten ( general comment as seen it elsewhere as well ) 

It's the same everytime the RC comes
		
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Clearly hope I'm wrong but several factors (admittedly formed using the very best in schoolboy logic)

There are 10 Americans in the worlds top 20 & only 5 Europeans
The winning streak can't last forever
They're at home (course set up etc)
We're speculating about European players just inside the top 50 to make up the team, while the US could have another 'B' team in the same criteria

What keeps me hoping is the very very recent form from key players in both camps


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## Tongo (Jul 25, 2016)

Slab said:



			Clearly hope I'm wrong but several factors (admittedly formed using the very best in schoolboy logic)

There are 10 Americans in the worlds top 20 & only 5 Europeans
The winning streak can't last forever
They're at home (course set up etc)
We're speculating about European players just inside the top 50 to make up the team, while the US could have another 'B' team in the same criteria

What keeps me hoping is the very very recent form from key players in both camps
		
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Traditionally the US team has always had the higher ranked players, more major winners and could, on paper, field a strong B team. However, in recent years none of that has mattered one jot. With the exception of 2008 Europe has consistently gelled better than the US. Being at home will obviously be an advantage but more of the European players play in the States now so it'll be how they cope with the potentially hostile crowds.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 25, 2016)

Slab said:



			Clearly hope I'm wrong but several factors (admittedly formed using the very best in schoolboy logic)

There are 10 Americans in the worlds top 20 & only 5 Europeans
The winning streak can't last forever
They're at home (course set up etc)
We're speculating about European players just inside the top 50 to make up the team, while the US could have another 'B' team in the same criteria

What keeps me hoping is the very very recent form from key players in both camps
		
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None of that is any different to any previous RC - we have beaten them before with just one player in the Top 10 and having players way down the list - individual performances throughout the year go out the window

The Europeans regardless of World Ranking etc always seem to come together as a team and work as a team - it's something the US team has managed once in nearly two decades at Valhalla where we had a captain who could gel his players together.

Until the US find a way to get their individuals playing as a team then I think Europe will always have the upper hand. 

The US team will again have a team full of people who have consistently lost the RC. 

They have even gone back to a captain who has previously lost ( even if it was close )

I think it will be very tight this time and think it could be a draw as a few younger guys for the US coming through who seems to gel together


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## Wilts (Jul 25, 2016)

Anyone think about Rahm? seems to always be near the top in the US comps.

Would have him with Westwood and Kaymer


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## Slab (Jul 25, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			None of that is any different to any previous RC - we have beaten them before with just one player in the Top 10 and having players way down the list - *individual performances throughout the year go out the window*

The Europeans regardless of World Ranking etc always seem to come together as a team and work as a team - it's something the US team has managed once in nearly two decades at Valhalla where we had a captain who could gel his players together.

Until the US find a way to get their individuals playing as a team then I think Europe will always have the upper hand. 

The US team will again have a team full of people who have consistently lost the RC. 

They have even gone back to a captain who has previously lost ( even if it was close )

I think it will be very tight this time and think it could be a draw as a few younger guys for the US coming through who seems to gel together
		
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I get what you're saying (& hope it turns out to be true again) although gotta pick up the point on individual performances going out the window 

I don't think it can be dismissed so easily. Isn't this the very criteria used for picking 3/4 of the European team that's yielded so much success 

Plus I think the snippets we hear of Jordan/Rickie etc etc going of on golf trips and guys bunking up together at tour events might suggest that when it comes to team spirit... the times, they are a changing!


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## Hobbit (Jul 25, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Why do people think we are going to get beaten ( general comment as seen it elsewhere as well ) 

It's the same everytime the RC comes
		
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I think the European team is in transition. There's more (almost) unknowns qualifying automatically, and some of the recognised top players are getting on a bit. 

I'd say Europe are where the US was at the last RC, i.e. a young-ish inexperienced team. And that US team is now older and wiser.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 25, 2016)

Slab said:



			I get what you're saying (& hope it turns out to be true again) although gotta pick up the point on individual performances going out the window 

I don't think it can be dismissed so easily. Isn't this the very criteria used for picking 3/4 of the European team that's yielded so much success 

Plus I think the snippets we hear of Jordan/Rickie etc etc going of on golf trips and guys bunking up together at tour events might suggest that when it comes to team spirit... the times, they are a changing!
		
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What I meant by the comment is that when the RC starts what the player has done individually throughout the year is irrelevant - in 2008 Harrington for example won two majors but was poor , Woods is a perfect example of dominating the tour then when playing in RC doesn't. It's all down to how players play together and for each other - the US team always has loners and even players who just don't get on and can't get past that 

The US do have a few younger guys who are enjoying holidays together and that is what will make it a bit tighter but right now only Spieth is in the top 8 automatic


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## Liverpoolphil (Jul 25, 2016)

Hobbit said:



			I think the European team is in transition. There's more (almost) unknowns qualifying automatically, and some of the recognised top players are getting on a bit. 

I'd say Europe are where the US was at the last RC, i.e. a young-ish inexperienced team. And that US team is now older and wiser.
		
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Certainly a very valid point and there will be a few more rookies , which is why I think Clarke will pick guys who have played RC - Hence Westwood and Kaymer being picked and players like Hatton , Johnston and Co missing out - think it's looking like there will be 5 rookies 

Sullivan
Wood
Willett
Rafa
Fitzpatrick 

That's a strong lineup of rookies who have won big comps or challenged in them 

It might mean Lowry misses out unless he makes it automatically 

But yep you're right about a few of the older stagers struggling - GMac for one even Rose isn't have a great time ( mainly because of injury )


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## drewster (Jul 25, 2016)

There's a lot of "bubbling under" Europeans playing in the USPGA this week after which it should all become much clearer !!!!!  Johnston, Hatton, F Molinari and Pieters all spring to mind. If I had to pick now i'd go Westwood, F Molinari and Thomas Pieters but I think the safe bets as others have stated are Westwood, Kaymer , Lowry.


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## PieMan (Jul 25, 2016)

No way Lowry will miss out given how well he and Sullivan gelled in that Royal Cup (or whatever it's called) thingy against the Asian players; and given his performance at the US Open (for 3 rounds) and his WGC win.

Cannot see Westwood not getting a pick either - the teams 'elder statesman' (been there, seen it, done it etc). If Kaymer and GMac come anywhere close to a wildcard - unless either of them win the USPGA - then we'll be in trouble!


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## richart (Jul 25, 2016)

PieMan said:



			No way Lowry will miss out given how well he and Sullivan gelled in that Royal Cup (or whatever it's called) thingy against the Asian players; and given his performance at the US Open (for 3 rounds) and his WGC win.

Cannot see Westwood not getting a pick either - the teams 'elder statesman' (been there, seen it, done it etc). If Kaymer and GMac come anywhere close to a wildcard - unless either of them win the USPGA - then we'll be in trouble!
		
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 Would you not take into account experience playing in the States Paul ? Russell Knox is a good call on this basis.

I would go with Westwood, Lowry and Kaymer.


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## Spuddy (Jul 26, 2016)

Wilts said:



			Anyone think about Rahm? seems to always be near the top in the US comps.

Would have him with Westwood and Kaymer
		
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I don't think he's a European Tour member


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## PieMan (Jul 26, 2016)

richart said:



			Would you not take into account experience playing in the States Paul ? Russell Knox is a good call on this basis.
		
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I don't think experience of playing in the States matters that much Rich. Russell Knox is an interesting one though. Personally I wouldn't pick him but you never know. I think another one who, if he has a very good USPGA could possibly get in.


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## Fish (Jul 30, 2016)

PieMan said:



			No way Lowry will miss out given how well he and Sullivan gelled in that Royal Cup (or whatever it's called) thingy against the Asian players; and given his performance at the US Open (for 3 rounds) and his WGC win.!
		
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But he hasn't made the cut AGAIN!  

He's not consistent enough for me irrelevant of what he's achieved recently, I really don't  get the love for Lowry &#129300;


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## Pin-seeker (Jul 30, 2016)

Kaymer is nailed on. 
Good to see him playing well again.


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## BrianM (Aug 7, 2016)

Russell Knox will be a definite now in my opinion &#128512;


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## GMAC88 (Aug 8, 2016)

Looks like a fairly weak European team! Matt Fitz doesn't seem like the streaky low man that you often need to be to win RC matches! 

Lowry would be in there definitely, Beef and Knox maybe.


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## PhilTheFragger (Aug 9, 2016)

Don't see Beef there yet, but he would be entertaining, Hatton is playing well, 
The problem is players who qualified early then play poorly or streaky in the summer.
Fitz is a worry for me, wood has a bad neck at the mo and should be resting it.

Alex Noren would be on my list of wild card candidates


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## Norrin Radd (Aug 22, 2016)

well what now ,Luke puts in a good performance at the Wyndham along with G Mac. Pieters also at the Czech masters . so who is going to get the pick now ,have any of those three put themselves in the frame ,after all they are showing good form at the right time ,unlike Westwood who again finishes in the top 30 but dosent flatter .
 is Clarke going to go with form or heart?


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## 351DRIVER (Aug 22, 2016)

Not sure about the picks, but i think this is going to the year the USA get it together, NO Tiger equals more of a team


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## Sports_Fanatic (Aug 22, 2016)

Norrin Radd said:



			well what now ,Luke puts in a good performance at the Wyndham along with G Mac. Pieters also at the Czech masters . so who is going to get the pick now ,have any of those three put themselves in the frame ,after all they are showing good form at the right time ,unlike Westwood who again finishes in the top 30 but dosent flatter .
 is Clarke going to go with form or heart?
		
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Interesting how you describe Luke as showing good form due to a T2, but his other 6 since US Open is 3 MC, and 3 around cT45. Westwood has played in higher quality events and starting with US open has T32, T11, T22 (The Open), 85 and T27. Surely Westwood has better form (and must be a pick) than Donald at this stage, all be it I think Donald could be a good pick as well given his iron game and previous Ryder Cup wins.

For the record Mcdowell has 3 MC and and a T63 out of his seven tournaments starting at the US Open.


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## Sports_Fanatic (Aug 22, 2016)

351DRIVER said:



			Not sure about the picks, but i think this is going to the year the USA get it together, NO Tiger equals more of a team
		
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Not so sure about no Tiger, particularly as he's a Vice Captain, but agree I think we'll see a very strong and different style team for the US on home soil. Think youngsters could now bring a new momentum for them.


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## njrose51 (Aug 22, 2016)

Good team!

Kaymer, Westwood and BEEF to make up the Wildcards. 

As we don't have Poulter on the Course, BEEF will get the crowd going.

Unfortunately though, I think our run has to end and it will end this year.


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## User62651 (Aug 22, 2016)

3 picks - Knox, Kaymer and Beef. Lowry's arse fell out at the PGA = possible choker.

Hope its another 'War on the Shore' or 'Miracle at Medinah' - match  needs some serious needle to make it interesting again. Any squirrel  huntin' flag wavin' rednecks in the US team this time? - Boo Weekley was great value  a few years back.


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## fundy (Aug 22, 2016)

Kaymer, Westwood and Knox for me, wouldnt be shocked if Knox missed out for someone more experienced (ie GMAC)


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## JamesR (Aug 22, 2016)

With so many rookies I would look to some experience so I imagine Westwood is a definate, then add 2 players on really good form leading up to the event. Maybe someone who does well in the Fedex playoffs.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 22, 2016)

Team already has 5 rookies so can see Clarke picking Westwood and Kaymer for sure but the third pick will be between Knox and Lowry. Knox is playing at the moment but Lowry has shown in the past he can work well with some of the players in the team environment - going to be tough choice.


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## JamesR (Aug 22, 2016)

I'd like to see Luke Donald start to show some real late season form and push his way in. Not many better foresomes players than him, when on form.


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## drewster (Aug 22, 2016)

Westwood, Pieters and Knox for me . Westwood because he was always going to play. Pieters will be a beast in the 4 balls and Knox becuase of his WGC win and great form actually in the US. Can't see why GMAC or Donald would even be in the conversation. Addditionally 3 months ago it was Lowry's to lose and he hasn't been ableto hit a cows backside consistently with a banjo since.


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 22, 2016)

Westwood and Kaymer for sure. Not sure about the third. Beef would get the crowd going but not sure he's quite the finished product yet and up to the intensity of the RC. Not sure we'd need another rookie either. Tough call for DC


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## SammmeBee (Aug 22, 2016)

Worst team ever.....doesn't matter who the other 2 picks are.....


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## paddyc (Aug 22, 2016)

I would guess that Clarke does not want to pick a rookie but Russell Knox must be in the reckoning after a excellent season.


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 22, 2016)

paddyc said:



			I would guess that Clarke does not want to pick a rookie but Russell Knox must be in the reckoning after a excellent season.
		
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I agree but I can't help thinking that it isn't the strongest looking side we've ever had and one that's definitely in transition. If the US want to stop the European winning streak they won't have a better chance than this


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## Dan2501 (Aug 25, 2016)

Thomas Pieters really wants in. Playing with Darren Clarke and is currently -9 through 15! That's the way to make an impression.


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## Faldono1fan (Aug 25, 2016)

Cannot agree with most of the comments on here.

"The worst team ever?" Really? What about the days when Europe and previously GB&I were losing heavily? What about the Mark James team where there was no strength in depth and we had the likes of Andrew Coltart, Jean Van De Velde ETC? We have the current Open Champion,Masters Champion, Olympic Champion. We also have a winner of 3 majors in Mcilroy, one of the best ball strikers in Garcia. We are very likely to have a double major champion in Kaymer. Wood,Fitzy,Carbrera Bello and Sullivan are all ranked in the top 50. Not sure why this is the worst team ever?

Let's look at the US team shall we?

Speith cannot keep the ball on the fairway, DJ has a poor RC record, Kuchar has lost his consistency, Walker came from nowhere to win the USPGA and had no form previously. Fowler is likely to be picked, but has had a poor season so far. Europe will not exactly be quaking in their boots.

Fully expecting another win for Europe. The Tiger situation is irrelevant. They are still not as good as gelling together as Europe. It's just the nature of the respective tours.


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## TheDiablo (Aug 25, 2016)

Faldono1fan said:



			Cannot agree with most of the comments on here.

"The worst team ever?" Really? What about the days when Europe and previously GB&I were losing heavily? What about the Mark James team where there was no strength in depth and we had the likes of Andrew Coltart, Jean Van De Velde ETC? We have the current Open Champion,Masters Champion, Olympic Champion. We also have a winner of 3 majors in Mcilroy, one of the best ball strikers in Garcia. We are very likely to have a double major champion in Kaymer. Wood,Fitzy,Carbrera Bello and Sullivan are all ranked in the top 50. Not sure why this is the worst team ever?

Let's look at the US team shall we?

Speith cannot keep the ball on the fairway, DJ has a poor RC record, Kuchar has lost his consistency, Walker came from nowhere to win the USPGA and had no form previously. Fowler is likely to be picked, but has had a poor season so far. Europe will not exactly be quaking in their boots.

Fully expecting another win for Europe. The Tiger situation is irrelevant. They are still not as good as gelling together as Europe. It's just the nature of the respective tours.
		
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Whilst I agree with some of what you say, that has to be 1 of the most biased posts I've read! You can't say all the great things about the European guys and then all the negative about the US and come to a logical conclusion!!

Spieth has had some ball striking problems but is still a top 10 short game and top 5 putter on tour - great for unexpected holes on matchplay
DJ 2016 is a different beast to previous years
Kuchar  - Most definitely has not lost any consistency! 9 T10s in his last 15 events and 1 MC. I think only Day and DJ have more T10s over that time.
Fowler hasnt been great this year but personally I'd only take 5 of our team over him.

Too close to call at this stage IMO, bring it on!


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## Faldono1fan (Aug 25, 2016)

Not sure my post is any more biased then saying the European team is the worst ever and not giving any reasons why? The aim was to put a different point of view across because I don't believe all this negativity is justified. The Ryder Cup is not somewhere to find form and I think Fowler and Speith will struggle personally. Take your point on Kuchar and DJ, but I still maintain it's about the team NOT individuals and our stars gel better and will work with the rookies better.In my view.


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## Imurg (Aug 25, 2016)

Pieters giving DC something to think about - unfortunately Lowry isn't......


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## TheDiablo (Aug 25, 2016)

Faldono1fan said:



			Not sure my post is any more biased then saying the European team is the worst ever and not giving any reasons why? The aim was to put a different point of view across because I don't believe all this negativity is justified. The Ryder Cup is not somewhere to find form and I think Fowler and Speith will struggle personally. Take your point on Kuchar and DJ, but I still maintain it's about the team NOT individuals and our stars gel better and will work with the rookies better.In my view.
		
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Agreed, but that's just a post from a troll. I was just saying you have some of the most EU tinted spectacles I've come across in a while in a long post and there's no harm in balance and then still concluding we will win!

Spieth still has 2 PGA tour wins this season and was arguably 1 swing away from the Masters - sure he hasn't reached the heights he set in 2015 but still highly formidable. Rickie Fowler has a very good birdie percentage - this season he has chucked in too many doubles and worse, he will be a very tough fourball player. But you're right, they're not in the best of form but they'll be in 4 highly competitive fields in the next 4 weeks and have the chance to find some (or looking at it the other way get fatigued).

Also agree there's a large element of team play required. It's widely accepted that we tend to perform greater than the sum of our parts and the Yanks worse, and it's usually enough to secure victory (in recent history) and long may that continue!


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## Faldono1fan (Aug 25, 2016)

Ah Ok. Not posted in a while so not sure who is trolling. 

Take your point. No doubt the Americans do have quality players, but so do Europe and I don't think there is as huge a gulf in quality that people are making out. Add to that the better team spirit that exists and in my view I expect to see Europe win again.(hopefully!)


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## Backsticks (Aug 25, 2016)

Westwood, Knox, and Kaymer for me. Westwood wouldnt have made it in other recent cup years, but concerned about the number of rookies in the team. Only consolation is that the US team will look weakish in its bottom half as well.
Rors has to be on a good week rather than an ah-shucks-throw-in-the-towel week for us to have a chance I think.


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## DCB (Aug 26, 2016)

Think we need a bit of experience and knowledge of the american style courses.

Going by form up until today, I'd take Westwood, Kaymer and Donald. Think Donald is just currently a little more in form than McDowell and Knox.


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## Dan2501 (Aug 26, 2016)

Thought about it, and I'd be going Knox, Westwood and Pieters. Forget having so many rookies, they're not true rookies anymore. These are experienced, top players. You pick your best team, and for me, those three have to be picked.


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## Hacker Khan (Aug 27, 2016)

Westwood is in as Chubby Chandler (possibly accidentally) gave the game away on a Golf Digest podcast last week. After that I'd go Knox and Kaymer.


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## paddyc (Aug 27, 2016)

DCB said:



			Think we need a bit of experience and knowledge of the american style courses.

Going by form up until today, I'd take Westwood, Kaymer and Donald. Think Donald is just currently a little more in form than McDowell and Knox.
		
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Donald in better from than Knox, you are having a laugh!! For me Knox has to go on his consistent form over the season. a WGC win and a PGA tour victory, along with Westwood and Kaymer


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## Norrin Radd (Aug 27, 2016)

Hacker Khan said:



			Westwood is in as Chubby Chandler (possibly accidentally) gave the game away on a Golf Digest podcast last week. After that I'd go Knox and Kaymer.
		
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with Westwood not playing in Denmark this week must have told you that he is playing in the RC as a pick


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## Dan2501 (Aug 28, 2016)

Pieters has to be picked now, surely? He's in exceptional form.


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## Whydowedoit (Aug 28, 2016)

Excellent form & win from Pieters. Playing well at the moment. Westwood has been very consistent & with his experience has to have a pick. Kaymer has become more consistent recently which says he is on the up & again offers experience. Knox has had a good couple of years in the US & would be a good pick also. Between those four. But here's a question. What about Chris Wood? Has a recurring neck injury. Can he actually make the team? Perhaps those four will all get in? Another question, & I should really know the answer, but what happens in the Ryder Cup if in say foursomes, one player gets an injury & cannot continue? What's the protocol? Can a replacement be called in or is the match over? Seriously cant remember!


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## Imurg (Aug 28, 2016)

It's going to be hard on whoever misses out but I have a feeling DC's going to go with form....
Kaymer. Knox and Pieters now.
Pieters, I think has to go after the last month he's had...
Knox has played well in America this year
Kaymers's run into better form than he took into Medinah....
Westy could be in trouble........


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 28, 2016)

Imurg said:



			It's going to be hard on whoever misses out but I have a feeling DC's going to go with form....
Kaymer. Knox and Pieters now.
Pieters, I think has to go after the last month he's had...
Knox has played well in America this year
Kaymers's run into better form than he took into Medinah....
Westy could be in trouble........
		
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Believe Westwood is a shoe in and has been for a long time especially when DC knew there was going to be a big number of rookies making the automatic team

With 5 already in the team would be amazed if he picked two more so can see Kaymer getting one

The last space imo will be between Lowry , Pieters ( who has put himself in the mix ) and Knox 

Right now i would lean towards Pieters but could see him picking Lowry


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 28, 2016)

Imurg said:



			It's going to be hard on whoever misses out but I have a feeling DC's going to go with form....
Kaymer. Knox and Pieters now.
Pieters, I think has to go after the last month he's had...
Knox has played well in America this year
Kaymers's run into better form than he took into Medinah....
Westy could be in trouble........
		
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I like Westwood,but no way should he be getting a pick.
I'd be happy with the 3 you mention. 

But I still can't see us winning this time tbh &#128547;


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 28, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Believe Westwood is a shoe in and has been for a long time especially when DC knew there was going to be a big number of rookies making the automatic team

With 5 already in the team would be amazed if he picked two more so can see Kaymer getting one

The last space imo will be between Lowry , Pieters ( who has put himself in the mix ) and Knox 

Right now i would lean towards Pieters but could see him picking Lowry
		
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Can't see Lowry getting the nod. Too inconsistent. If it's on form then Pieters would seem the obvious choice but I would suggest Knox as a player based in the US and playing well enough. Westwood Kaymer and Knox for me. Will definitely be an interesting choice.


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## Imurg (Aug 28, 2016)

I'm coming round to the theory of "Sod experience, pick form players".
Experience means nowt of you're not on form.
Knox - a WGC plus a PGA Tour win, Pieters - 3 wins in short order plus plenty of good finishes.
Who needs experience.....?


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 28, 2016)

Imurg said:



			I'm coming round to the theory of "Sod experience, pick form players".
Experience means nowt of you're not on form.
Knox - a WGC plus a PGA Tour win, Pieters - 3 wins in short order plus plenty of good finishes.
Who needs experience.....?
		
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You need it in the Ryder Cup - need to have the good mix - something Europe have done well to find. Form is a strange thing in golf - players can be untouchable one week then a mare the next. 

When coming into the foursomes and fourballs - having players like Westwood and Kaymer who have both performed within the highest pressure is invaluable , both have shown to be perfect partners for rookies in the past as well as off the course as well. Going in with 7 rookies would be a big risk that I just can't see him taking.


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## One Planer (Aug 28, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			You need it in the Ryder Cup - need to have the good mix - something Europe have done well to find. Form is a strange thing in golf - players can be untouchable one week then a mare the next. 

When coming into the foursomes and fourballs - having players like Westwood and Kaymer who have both performed within the highest pressure is invaluable , both have shown to be perfect partners for rookies in the past as well as off the course as well. Going in with 7 rookies would be a big risk that I just can't see him taking.
		
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On the flip side, why would you pick players purely on experience who are currently out of nick and struggling to piece together competitive scores?

No good being there if you're not going to be competitive.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 28, 2016)

One Planer said:



			On the flip side, why would you pick players purely on experience who are currently out of nick and struggling to piece together competitive scores?

No good being there if you're not going to be competitive.
		
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Because when it comes to the Ryder Cup the European players find a way to play as a team regardless of people's form before hand and gel together - even if one player is off form he still contributes in some way 

The US concentrate on single player form - the Europeans concentrate on the team environment and have to done for decades. Plenty of players have played despite form issues and provided an input or played their part


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## One Planer (Aug 28, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Because when it comes to the Ryder Cup the European players find a way to play as a team regardless of people's form before hand and gel together - even if one player is off form he still contributes in some way 

The US concentrate on single player form - the Europeans concentrate on the team environment and have to done for decades. Plenty of players have played despite form issues and provided an input or played their part
		
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So why not pick Faldo, Jiminez and Olazabal? 

I get your point Phil I really do, but I cannot understand why you would pick someone purely on experience over someone in form. 

To coin an example from another sport, why did the then England manager pick Wilshire ahead of Drinkwater in the previous Euros?

Experience vs form?

Mcilroy has great experience of the Ryder Cup, yet his current form (... And putting) is shocking. 

Europeans will always gel as a team regardless who is picked purely as there are less egos to clash.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 28, 2016)

One Planer said:



			So why not pick Faldo, Jiminez and Olazabal? 

I get your point Phil I really do, but I cannot understand why you would pick someone purely on experience over someone in form. 

To coin an example from another sport, why did the then England manager pick Wilshire ahead of Drinkwater in the previous Euros?

Experience vs form?

Mcilroy has great experience of the Ryder Cup, yet his current form (... And putting) is shocking. 

Europeans will always gel as a team regardless who is picked purely as there are less egos to clash.
		
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I don't think you can compare the England football team to picking a RC team - don't think it's anywhere near the same 

As for Faldo etc etc - do you really need to be told why not them despite their expirence 

The two players in discussion are Kaymer and Westwood - are both really that badly out of form ? Yes they aren't winning but both have had solid seasons with Westwood having a good season in the majors and clearly still a great person to be a foursomes partner with 

The RC pressure is unbelievably different compared to any other golf comp 

Form goes out of the window as soon as the team gets together 

I would pick Westwood right now over anyone - you can't put a value on the expirence he will bring to the team and how he works within a partnership. I'll take that over someone having a good run of form on the European Tour


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## One Planer (Aug 28, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I don't think you can compare the England football team to picking a RC team - don't think it's anywhere near the same 

As for Faldo etc etc - do you really need to be told why not them despite their expirence 

The two players in discussion are Kaymer and Westwood - are both really that badly out of form ? Yes they aren't winning but both have had solid seasons with Westwood having a good season in the majors and clearly still a great person to be a foursomes partner with 

The RC pressure is unbelievably different compared to any other golf comp 

Form goes out of the window as soon as the team gets together 

I would pick Westwood right now over anyone - you can't put a value on the expirence he will bring to the team and how he works within a partnership. I'll take that over someone having a good run of form on the European Tour
		
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As I say I see your point to and, to a point, agree. 

I would pick Kaymer over Westwood all day. To go with him I would pick Knox and Pieters.

If experience was that much of a key factor, I'm sure Clarke would pick Westwood, Kaymer and Donald. 

But experience isnt the only factor, merely one of a number.

You can't pick players who aren't currently, or havent been competitive. Confidence is a massive thing in golf and when your out of touch invariably your confidence will dip. 

While I agree that experience of Ryder Cups is something that should be considered, that isn't going to suddenly make somebody play better. If that player is paired with a rookie, the pressure again increases purely because of their experience. Pressure and low confidence aren't a great mix in golf. 

I would wager that Pieters confidence in his abilities is currently higher than Westwood/Donald et al.

I would rather see 2 rookies bang in form play together a's opposed to someone in form dragging a more experienced, out of form, player along. Look at the Spieth/Reid rookie pairing from the previous Ryder Cup in 2014. Both were in form and we're exceptional.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

One Planer said:



			As I say I see your point to and, to a point, agree. 

I would pick Kaymer over Westwood all day. To go with him I would pick Knox and Pieters.

If experience was that much of a key factor, I'm sure Clarke would pick Westwood, Kaymer and Donald. 

But experience isnt the only factor, merely one of a number.

You can't pick players who aren't currently, or havent been competitive. Confidence is a massive thing in golf and when your out of touch invariably your confidence will dip. 

While I agree that experience of Ryder Cups is something that should be considered, that isn't going to suddenly make somebody play better. If that player is paired with a rookie, the pressure again increases purely because of their experience. Pressure and low confidence aren't a great mix in golf. 

I would wager that Pieters confidence in his abilities is currently higher than Westwood/Donald et al.

I would rather see 2 rookies bang in form play together a's opposed to someone in form dragging a more experienced, out of form, player along. Look at the Spieth/Reid rookie pairing from the previous Ryder Cup in 2014. Both were in form and we're exceptional.
		
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Well Donald has been out of it for a good 3 years now so I don't think even despite recent form he will even be discussed 

I don't think confidence will be an issue for Westwood - he is still competive and had a decent season especially in the majors where he has challenged at times and had a great masters and a decent US and Open 

And plenty of rookies have also struggled over the years - Gallacher a prime example last time 

Right now there are already 5 out of 9 players who are rookies one more I think is the max they have had before ( 2010 ) and I think that's the limit DC will go for 

DC will see Westwood as his leader on the course  - the vice captain who is playing - it's the role the last three captains have had for him.

I agree it would be great to pick the form players and they would be Pieters and Knox but I don't see it happening - both will no doubt have a number of RC ahead of them 

Also i believe DC will have partnerships in his head already and will pair rookies with Westwood who enjoys that role and I can see him being in a partnership with anyone but there is someone about Knox ( only based on what I have seen ) that just make me feel he is more of a US type player - can't see who he would play with but Pieters though - well can see him playing really well with someone like Garcia or Sullivan

But there is every chance I could be very wrong and he will go for Knox and Pieters and Westwood is a VC


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## davemc1 (Aug 29, 2016)

It must be time for bed, 'cos I totally agree with Gareth's picks &#128561;


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## davemc1 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Well Donald has been out of it for a good 3 years now so I don't think even despite recent form he will even be discussed 

I don't think confidence will be an issue for Westwood - he is still competive and had a decent season especially in the majors where he has challenged at times and had a great masters and a decent US and Open 

And plenty of rookies have also struggled over the years - Gallacher a prime example last time 

Right now there are already 5 out of 9 players who are rookies one more I think is the max they have had before ( 2010 ) and I think that's the limit DC will go for 

DC will see Westwood as his leader on the course  - the vice captain who is playing - it's the role the last three captains have had for him.

I agree it would be great to pick the form players and they would be Pieters and Knox but I don't see it happening - both will no doubt have a number of RC ahead of them 

Also i believe DC will have partnerships in his head already and will pair rookies with Westwood who enjoys that role and I can see him being in a partnership with anyone but there is someone about Knox ( only based on what I have seen ) that just make me feel he is more of a US type player - can't see who he would play with but Pieters though - well can see him playing really well with someone like Garcia or Sullivan

But there is every chance I could be very wrong and he will go for Knox and Pieters and Westwood is a VC
		
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jeez, that's a lot of rambling. Make your mind up man &#128515;

Ps if you already have 10 pages back, sos &#128077;


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## davemc1 (Aug 29, 2016)

davemc1 said:



			It must be time for bed, 'cos I totally agree with Gareth's picks &#63025;
		
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Beef Johnston would be tremendous for atmosphere though.

****, I'm sounding like Phil &#128514;


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## Normal (Aug 29, 2016)

Considering choice will be between Westwood, Kaymer, Knox and Pieters.The easy one would probably be Westwood-Kaymer-Knox. Two experienced players and Knox (higher ranked than Pieters). But do you need two experienced players? And is experience not overrated? Both Knox and Pieters are just playing better (and for some months now) than the two older guys. Logical choice would be the two rookies and one experienced one. But can't imagine Clarke skipping Westwood or Kaymer. I predict the easy one with some nice words for Pieters (the future of European golf blablabla).


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## Imurg (Aug 29, 2016)

Surely having 'long in the tooth' VC's will help offset any lack of experience...


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## One Planer (Aug 29, 2016)

Imurg said:



			Surely having 'long in the tooth' VC's will help offset any lack of experience...
		
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Isn't that the point of the VC''s?


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## Imurg (Aug 29, 2016)

One Planer said:



			Isn't that the point of the VC''s?
		
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It is. So having 5-6 Rookies shouldn't be a problem.
Pick in-form players...


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

One Planer said:



			Isn't that the point of the VC''s?
		
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They aren't the one hitting the golf ball during the highest pressure within the sport.


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## Papas1982 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They aren't the one hitting the golf ball during the highest pressure within the sport.
		
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Whilst i think they ryder cup has massive appeal. 

I think most players whilst thoroughly enjoying the format would still take a major over it so i think the feel less pressure during it.


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## turkish (Aug 29, 2016)

Everybody saying if an experienced one dropped will be Westwood but is kaymer on a shoogly peg? He's not been great this year has he?


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			Whilst i think they ryder cup has massive appeal. 

I think most players whilst thoroughly enjoying the format would still take a major over it so i think the feel less pressure during it.
		
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Whilst I agree that all the players would take a major over a RC - the pressure is massively different because you aren't just playing for yourself - reading various books from golfers - Clark , Monty , Poulter and even stories about Faldo and Seve - all talk about the pressure in the RC and just being thankfully of getting the tee shot away , the books are state that the pressure in the RC is more because of the crowds and it's not just about them it's about another 11 guys as well.

This has also been posted on Twitter 

Looks like there has been a leak in the Ryder Cup wildcards picks, Westwood, Kaymer & Donald set for Captains picks! #STP


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## Papas1982 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Whilst I agree that all the players would take a major over a RC - the pressure is massively different because you aren't just playing for yourself - reading various books from golfers - Clark , Monty , Poulter and even stories about Faldo and Seve - all talk about the pressure in the RC and just being thankfully of getting the tee shot away , the books are state that the pressure in the RC is more because of the crowds and it's not just about them it's about another 11 guys as well.
		
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That's fair, I guess what i meant was whilst the pressure may crank up. They probably fear the consequences less. Yes they don't wanna let poeple down, but golf is a game where the players a trained and brought up to be single minded. I imagine long term they lose more sleep over missed putts during a final round at a major.

I cant envisage any player would give a major up for a ryder cup victory, but i'm sure monty would trade one of his for a major.


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## Sportlad (Aug 29, 2016)

Got to be Westwood given how successful he's been as a wildcard pick over the years. He's actually the joint most successful for Team Europe over the years, according to the article - http://www.thestatszone.com/articles/successful-wildcard-ryder-cup


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			That's fair, I guess what i meant was whilst the pressure may crank up. They probably fear the consequences less. Yes they don't wanna let poeple down, but golf is a game where the players a trained and brought up to be single minded. I imagine long term they lose more sleep over missed putts during a final round at a major.

I cant envisage any player would give a major up for a ryder cup victory, but i'm sure monty would trade one of his for a major.
		
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Again you only have to read the books and listen to what Langer has said about his missed putt at Kiawah Island - still haunts him to this day 

The RC is something the players just don't get every week - they aren't playing for money or a singles comp , they are playing for each other and a nation and if players like Faldo and Seve are nervous on the tee that shows you how different it is 

The RC and the Majors are two comps that I don't think you can compare. The players insights into it tell that story.


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## Papas1982 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Again you only have to read the books and listen to what Langer has said about his missed putt at Kiawah Island - still haunts him to this day 

The RC is something the players just don't get every week - they aren't playing for money or a singles comp ,* they are playing for each other and a nation* and if players like Faldo and Seve are nervous on the tee that shows you how different it is 

The RC and the Majors are two comps that I don't think you can compare. The players insights into it tell that story.
		
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Strange that they had so little interest in the olympics if that's a factor......

I fully accept there is massive pressure and cant claim to have read any golfers books, but 100's have played in both naming a few doesn't make it conclusive. 

The likes of Poulter, monty and westwood may claim they feel more pressure, maybe they just wanna big up their RC perfomances. Westwood seems to choke at majors when there is apparently less pressure.....

Poulter along with Bubba actively encouarged noise on the tee, that doesnt strike me as someone struggling with nerves...
Either way, re the picks. I'd probably still take westwood. But only bacuase i dont think there is much between him and kaymer. I wouldn't take both.


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## Hosel Fade (Aug 29, 2016)

Rumour has it that Luke shortball and can't hit a fairway Donald is in along with Westwood and Kaymer

Has to be Pieters + Knox + one of Kaymer, Lowry, Kjeldsen, Westwood for my money


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			Strange that they had so little interest in the olympics if that's a factor......

I fully accept there is massive pressure and cant claim to have read any golfers books, but 100's have played in both naming a few doesn't make it conclusive. 

The likes of Poulter, monty and westwood may claim they feel more pressure, maybe they just wanna big up their RC perfomances. Westwood seems to choke at majors when there is apparently less pressure.....

Poulter along with Bubba actively encouarged noise on the tee, that doesnt strike me as someone struggling with nerves...
Either way, re the picks. I'd probably still take westwood. But only bacuase i dont think there is much between him and kaymer. I wouldn't take both.
		
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In the Olympics you aren't playing in a team environment 

Any run up to the RC you have lots of programs on Sky and all the players talk about the "different" pressure faced when playing in the RC - no one is "playing it up" and I mentioned players like Faldo and Seve who mentioned the different pressure but then you start going on about Monty and Poulter and Westwood and talking about bottling ?! 

You either listen to some of the biggest names in golf in Europe who have faced both types of pressure whilst playing in majors and the RC and have stated how "different" ( highlighting different as I don't think it's less or more in either situation ) the pressure is 

Players like Watson and Poulter prob don't show nerves and have a different way of facing the pressure faced whilst playing in the RC 

Highly recommend reading the autobiographys or watching the stories of the RC and getting the feelings of the actual players who state exactly how it is


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## Papas1982 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



*In the Olympics you aren't playing in a team environment *

Any run up to the RC you have lots of programs on Sky and all the players talk about the "different" pressure faced when playing in the RC - no one is "playing it up" and I mentioned players like Faldo and Seve who mentioned the different pressure but then you start going on about Monty and Poulter and Westwood and talking about bottling ?! 

You either listen to some of the biggest names in golf in Europe who have faced both types of pressure whilst playing in majors and the RC and have stated how "different" ( highlighting different as I don't think it's less or more in either situation ) the pressure is 

Players like Watson and Poulter prob don't show nerves and have a different way of facing the pressure faced whilst playing in the RC 

Highly recommend reading the autobiographys or watching the stories of the RC and getting the feelings of the actual players who state exactly how it is
		
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So GB on the medal chart isn't part of a team??? 

My point about Monty, Westwood and Poulter is that their records in ryder cups are better than majors. So if the pressure is so great how to they handle it in one and not the other.

As i've already stated, I accept that there is massive pressure, and whilst i may not have read autobiographies, but I still watch most of the golf and I don't think I've ever seen a build up to any of the big comps where they aren't built up and heralded as the best. They're hardly gonna show some player sayings easy, whats all the fuss about. 
You've named 6/7 players saying its tough, and given their autobiographies as testament, but 6/7 out of 100's of players doesn't prove a point. 

We are on different sides here, so I'll simply say that i respect your opinion and have one that differs.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 29, 2016)

Papas1982 said:



			So GB on the medal chart isn't part of a team???
		
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I'm pretty sure that Rose picked up a medal on his own and its clearly not a team environment whilst he was playing - quite clearly - it's not even comparable to the RC 



			My point about Monty, Westwood and Poulter is that their records in ryder cups are better than majors. So if the pressure is so great how to they handle it in one and not the other.
		
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Because it's "different" - it's a totally different format - it's matchplay , it's foursomes and fourballs , singles  - it's not four rounds of stroke play - different 




			As i've already stated, I accept that there is massive pressure, and whilst i may not have read autobiographies, but I still watch most of the golf and I don't think I've ever seen a build up to any of the big comps where they aren't built up and heralded as the best. They're hardly gonna show some player sayings easy, whats all the fuss about. 
You've named 6/7 players saying its tough, and given their autobiographies as testament, but 6/7 out of 100's of players doesn't prove a point. 

We are on different sides here, so I'll simply say that i respect your opinion and have one that differs.
		
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I'm actually struggling to understand all this and what your actual point is to be honest 

I have just said that a good number of players have stated from their own expirence how "different" the pressure is playing in the RC compared to playing in a major - I haven't said that the pressure is more or less just different because it's a totally different way they play and it only happens once every two years and it's a massive rivalry - are you on the different side to the players ? 

So I'm not sure exactly what you are differing from ? Actual words from the players themselves who have stated how different the pressure is - how they have been physically shaking on the tee , even players like Woods and Mickleson have said the same sort of stuff - Langer still haunted by a missed putt , Mahan still haunted by the duff chip 

Do you not believe them ? Do you think players like Faldo , Seve , Monty , Poulter are not telling the truth and you differ from people who have actually played in the various comps ? 

No one has said that in the build up that the RC is the "best" - I'm not staying that the RC is bigger or better than a major and that the players would take a RC over a major so I'm not actually sure what your point is


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 29, 2016)

Standing over a 6ft putt to win the Masters or to win the RC. 
Give me the masters every time. 
If you miss it you've let yourself down,miss it in the RC & I'd feel like I'd let a full continent down,including my team mates.


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## One Planer (Aug 29, 2016)

It's amazing how people can get their OPINION  confused with FACT.

We all have our opinions, from which we are entitled. No one is right or wrong on this matter, it's all subjective.

Well know for sure soon enough and can debate Captain Clarke's decision.


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 29, 2016)

But I'd still go with form over experience. 
I'm actually glad Poulter is out of contention.


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## Papas1982 (Aug 29, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I'm pretty sure that Rose picked up a medal on his own and its clearly not a team environment whilst he was playing - quite clearly - it's not even comparable to the RC 


Because it's "different" - it's a totally different format - it's matchplay , it's foursomes and fourballs , singles  - it's not four rounds of stroke play - different 



I'm actually struggling to understand all this and what your actual point is to be honest 

I have just said that a good number of players have stated from their own expirence how "different" the pressure is playing in the RC compared to playing in a major - I haven't said that the pressure is more or less just different because it's a totally different way they play and it only happens once every two years and it's a massive rivalry - are you on the different side to the players ? 

So I'm not sure exactly what you are differing from ? Actual words from the players themselves who have stated how different the pressure is - how they have been physically shaking on the tee , even players like Woods and Mickleson have said the same sort of stuff - Langer still haunted by a missed putt , Mahan still haunted by the duff chip 

Do you not believe them ? Do you think players like Faldo , Seve , Monty , Poulter are not telling the truth and you differ from people who have actually played in the various comps ? 

No one has said that in the build up that the RC is the "best" - I'm not staying that the RC is bigger or better than a major and that the players would take a RC over a major so I'm not actually sure what your point is
		
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Im not gonna respond point by point. I've learned my lesson from that. But I will explain what I meant re "the best". 

Before each tournament, to tv shows will big up each respective event. Augusta is the most pristine, the us the hardest, the open the original, the us pga the widest field. The Ryder cup most unique.

my point was simply that now that it's the Ryder cup coming up, we will hear all the so called things that make it what is is as they are selling it. Pressure is just one selling point they try to use.


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 29, 2016)

One Planer said:



			It's amazing how people can get their OPINION  confused with FACT.

We all have our opinions, from which we are entitled. No one is right or wrong on this matter, it's all subjective.

Well know for sure soon enough and can debate Captain Clarke's decision.
		
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Surely Donald can't get a pick?


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## Hosel Fade (Aug 29, 2016)

Pin-seeker said:



			Surely Donald can't get a pick?
		
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Exactly, its the one pick that would really wind me up, don't care that he is 8-2-1. Last one was in 2010 and there are players in far better form available. Really don't need one of the shortest hitters on the US tour that is also 150 odd in driving accuracy on a course over 7600


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 29, 2016)

If we take out of form players just for experience we are basically preying that they all of a sudden find some form. 

And maybe the inform inexperienced players will do just fine with the pressure & continue to play well.


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 29, 2016)

I think if we didn't already have so many rookies, Peiters and Knox would get in without too many issues. However, especially in the US we are going to need some experience to compliment the new faces and I simply don't see how we can win with so many untried players in the RC format which is why I'd go Westwood, Kaymer and Knox, based on nothing more that while Pieters did well in Denmark, it wasn't the hardest and strongest filed of the year and that his time will come next time if he carries on progressing


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## Normal (Aug 29, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I think if we didn't already have so many rookies, Peiters and Knox would get in without too many issues. However, especially in the US we are going to need some experience to compliment the new faces and I simply don't see how we can win with so many untried players in the RC format which is why I'd go Westwood, Kaymer and Knox, based on nothing more that while Pieters did well in Denmark, it wasn't the hardest and strongest filed of the year and that his time will come next time if he carries on progressing
		
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If DC decided last week that Westwood-Kaymer-Donald (after his second place on the PGA tour) would be his picks, why was he paired with Pieters in Denmark?


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 29, 2016)

Normal said:



			If DC decided last week that Westwood-Kaymer-Donald (after his second place on the PGA tour) would be his picks, why was he paired with Pieters in Denmark?
		
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I know why he was paired with Clarke. However, as I said, although Pieters won, it wasn't a stellar field. A win is a win and you can't do anymore than beat what's in front of you, but Knox with two wins in the US would seem to have a better shout, especially as he's familiar with the conditions over there too.


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## TheDiablo (Aug 29, 2016)

European Ryder Cup captain's picks since 2004:

Rookies: 4 picks, 3-7-3 record (W-L-T) 
Veterans: 10 picks, 24-9-6 record

Experience is key, backed up in the stats since we've been successful. There's a couple of rookies I'd trade out that have made the team for Knox and Pieters, but they've earned their spot so fair play I suppose. 

Would be surprised at Donald over Knox but looks that way now.


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## fundy (Aug 29, 2016)

TheDiablo said:



			European Ryder Cup captain's picks since 2004:

Rookies: 4 picks, 3-7-3 record (W-L-T) 
Veterans: 10 picks, 24-9-6 record

Experience is key, backed up in the stats since we've been successful. There's a couple of rookies I'd trade out that have made the team for Knox and Pieters, but they've earned their spot so fair play I suppose. 

Would be surprised at Donald over Knox but looks that way now.
		
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looks like Pieters over both if you believe the betting markets


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## Faldono1fan (Aug 29, 2016)

In my opinion it's more of a gamble picking Donald than someone like Pieters who is coming into form at the right time. How Tom Watson would like his pick over again and select Billy Ho above Rev Simpson. They were without the winner of the Fedex Cup. Rookies when used correctly can perform very well. I know there are more than usual, but these players can perform and should not be underestimated. Look at 2014 and how Dubuisson and Donaldson performed. Play them with experienced Ryder Cuppers in the pairs, get the confidence up and that will continue into the singles. 

It will be close, but I do see a European Victory as a distinct possibility. I do think that selecting Donald could backfire.


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## Raesy92 (Aug 29, 2016)

For me it's got to be Kaymer, Westwood and then either Knox or Pieters. 

I'd probably go for Knox over Pieters as he has won twice this season against stronger fields. Especially the WGC event.


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 30, 2016)

TheDiablo said:



			European Ryder Cup captain's picks since 2004:

Rookies: 4 picks, 3-7-3 record (W-L-T) 
Veterans: 10 picks, 24-9-6 record

Experience is key, backed up in the stats since we've been successful. There's a couple of rookies I'd trade out that have made the team for Knox and Pieters, but they've earned their spot so fair play I suppose. 

Would be surprised at Donald over Knox but looks that way now.
		
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We're the veterans in form at the time when picked?


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## Slab (Aug 30, 2016)

Last month Darren Clarke said:

_*"At the very start I said it would be very, very difficult to pick a rookie. I still stand by that opinion."*_

Maybe suggesting there's no Knox, Kjeldsen or Pieters and the Westwood/Kaymer/Donald gossip is nearer the mark


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## TheDiablo (Aug 30, 2016)

Pin-seeker said:



			We're the veterans in form at the time when picked?
		
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Hard to tell. And 'form' is a pretty unquantifiable term. It would have been a mixture. 

But you can be pretty sure the rookies were in very good 'form' - or else they wouldn't have forced their way into the team as a pick. And yet they went on to get 4.5 points from 13. 34% Vs 75% for the rookies...


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## Pin-seeker (Aug 30, 2016)

TheDiablo said:



			Hard to tell. And 'form' is a pretty unquantifiable term. It would have been a mixture. 

But you can be pretty sure the rookies were in very good 'form' - or else they wouldn't have forced their way into the team as a pick. And yet they went on to get 4.5 points from 13. 34% Vs 75% for the rookies...
		
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Fair point.


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## Garush34 (Aug 30, 2016)

Westwood, Kaymer and Pieters are in.


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## Lord Tyrion (Aug 30, 2016)

Surprised Knox is not picked but pleased for Pieters. Maybe one for US based players to ponder for future. If you really want to play Ryder Cup then you need to be part of the European tour as well. If that is the message then it is a strong one.


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 30, 2016)

I think that's the best three he could have picked

Expect Knox was in until this week 

Good team IMO - some great partnerships could be formed


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## One Planer (Aug 30, 2016)

Garush34 said:



			Westwood, Kaymer and Pieters are in.
		
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Agree with two of the three.

Choices are made now. Lets see how they pan out.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Aug 30, 2016)

Garush34 said:



			Westwood, Kaymer and Pieters are in.
		
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Oh dear! Oh dear!! Oh dear!!!

Not just politics and business where the Old Pals Act comes into effect.


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## TheDiablo (Aug 30, 2016)

I'd personally have gone Knox over Pieters, but only just about so more than happy with the picks. Westwood was a shoe-in and Kaymer rightly picked IMO. Glad Donald and Gmac didnt get a look in.


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## patricks148 (Aug 30, 2016)

I wonder if Westwood would have been picked by any other RC Captain under the same circumstances??

Hard on Knoxx, I think his exp on the PGA tour and being a winner on it was good enough to get him in, but Pieters is fair enough after the last few weeks.


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## Sports_Fanatic (Aug 30, 2016)

patricks148 said:



			I wonder if Westwood would have been picked by any other RC Captain under the same circumstances??

Hard on Knoxx, I think his exp on the PGA tour and being a winner on it was good enough to get him in, but Pieters is fair enough after the last few weeks.
		
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Each to their own but I'd expect the majority of previous Ryder Cup captains would have picked Westwood. His case is clear on Ryder Cup experience, strengthened by the number of rookies. Shown he can still play during recent majors and in my opinion will improve as Ryder Cup player as some of his weaknesses are smoothed by matchplay format (e.g. bad holes, and putting where he'll normally know it's hole it or miss out so can be bold).

No point having Captains Picks if everybody just says those highest ranked should get it automatically. They are there to bring balance in the team and potentially accommodate form players, both of which Clarke has done.


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## TheJezster (Aug 30, 2016)

I agree, Westwood was a must pick.  No brainer from me.

I like the picks, I think he's pretty much got it spot on!

Whatever the outcome I think it'll be a great match up.


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## Faldono1fan (Aug 30, 2016)

Agree with all 3 picks. It will be a great match.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Aug 30, 2016)

Sports_Fanatic said:



			Shown he can still play during recent majors
		
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Keep hearing this but, The Masters aside, the performances were very ordinary. Either drifted away if in contention (US Open and, to a lesser extent, PGA) or never anywhere near (Open).

Hope he proves me wrong but to me it is as retrograde as would have been turning to Donald or McDowell.


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## Sports_Fanatic (Aug 30, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Keep hearing this but, The Masters aside, the performances were very ordinary. Either drifted away if in contention (US Open and, to a lesser extent, PGA) or never anywhere near (Open).

Hope he proves me wrong but to me it is as retrograde as would have been turning to Donald or McDowell.
		
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He didn't play great which would be contesting in them, but he did play well showing he is still fine at this level. Taking three players off the top of my head in Fowler, Bubba and Reed, then he beat the first two in three out of four majors, and Reed in two out of four. Given they are in top 10 it shows it is reasonable play to get the positions he did with some good rounds in amongst it.


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## SammmeBee (Oct 2, 2016)

SammmeBee said:



			Worst team ever.....doesn't matter who the other 2 picks are.....
		
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Told you......fair play for the 2 proper picks though aside from Clarke's mate!!


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## One Planer (Oct 2, 2016)

SammmeBee said:



			Told you......fair play for the 2 proper picks though aside from Clarke's mate!!
		
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You can't say that!

He's the most experienced


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## Crow (Oct 2, 2016)

Seems like there was a lot of support from a lot of people for Westwood being a Captain's pick on this thread.

Must have been a different set of people posting on the Official Ryder Cup thread.


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## TheJezster (Oct 2, 2016)

SammmeBee said:



			Told you......fair play for the 2 proper picks though aside from Clarke's mate!!
		
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You didn't "tell us" anything! No one knew what was going to happen, you didn't have a magic ball. This is such a lame claim of knowledge, it's just lazy and no one would accept it as an argument. The reasons for picking Westwood were valid, he's the most experienced and with 6 rookies it was needed. He didn't play well but he probably helped calm down a lot of the newbies. USA played some exceptional golf today and deserved to win.


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