# bernhard langer still anchoring?



## Thexindi (Apr 9, 2016)

During the 3rd round I'm sure I saw him still anchoring did anyone else see?

I'm sure the commentators mentioned it and I'm sure they will maybe looked into it

I hope it gets looked into


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## HomerJSimpson (Apr 9, 2016)

Thexindi said:



			During the 3rd round I'm sure I saw him still anchoring did anyone else see?

I'm sure the commentators mentioned it and I'm sure they will maybe looked into it

I hope it gets looked into
		
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One assumes as he's on tour still (Champions) it has been looked at but it does look wrong


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## USER1999 (Apr 9, 2016)

It must be close, but how do you prove it.

Poor rule in my view. Either ban long putters, or rule that the hands have to be together.


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## Imurg (Apr 9, 2016)

I would be very surprised if he was, plus I suspect the powers that be have been having a good look at it...


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## Hobbit (Apr 9, 2016)

I think he is. But they only way to stop it is to limit putter length to, say, 35".


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## palindromicbob (Apr 9, 2016)

I'll bet they have the HD high zoom on him.  


http://www.golfdigest.com/story/the...langers-new-putting-stroke-has-people-talking


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## ger147 (Apr 9, 2016)

It's been thoroughly investigated i.e. he's been checked in person and via TV footage at several tournaments from multiple angles and he's been interviewed by tour officials a number of times.

The conclusion is he's not and that's good enough for me.


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## 3565 (Apr 9, 2016)

You can see on certain camera angles he's not anchoring.


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## Green Bay Hacker (Apr 9, 2016)

Alliss just said it was nowhere near anchored.


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## NWJocko (Apr 9, 2016)

Azinger just made a good point on this that his left hand and the top of the putter move during the stroke so he isn't anchoring. Watched him after he'd mentioned it and he's right.


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## ger147 (Apr 9, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			Azinger just made a good point on this that his left hand and the top of the putter move during the stroke so he isn't anchoring. Watched him after he'd mentioned it and he's right.
		
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Yip, spot on.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 9, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			Azinger just made a good point on this that his left hand and the top of the putter move during the stroke so he isn't anchoring. Watched him after he'd mentioned it and he's right.
		
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    it didnt move when he putted out on the last hole .

i say he is cheating.


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## Tongo (Apr 9, 2016)

The poacher said:



			it didnt move when he putted out on the last hole .

i say he is cheating.
		
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Yes it did.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 9, 2016)

no it didnt


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## NWJocko (Apr 9, 2016)

The poacher said:



			it didnt move when he putted out on the last hole .

i say he is cheating.
		
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Well it did to me as that's when he mentioned it!

You crack on if the countless interviews/reviews etc aren't good enough for you :thup:


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## 3565 (Apr 9, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			Azinger just made a good point on this that his left hand and the top of the putter move during the stroke so he isn't anchoring. Watched him after he'd mentioned it and he's right.
		
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Saw the same thing myself. I've just read an article where he won couple weeks ago and they've looked into it, he addresses the ball anchored but before he makes his stroke his hand is only slightly away from his chest which is enough for it to be not anchored.


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## craigstardis1976 (Apr 9, 2016)

Both his hands clearly moved on the putt on #18. Just watched an interview he gave to CBS. Langer seems to know the challenge ahead, looks at it realistically but if young Jordan Speith stays at -4 K can see Bernhard seriously contending tomorrow.


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Bernhard apparently makes his practice swings with his top hand anchored to his chest, but moves it just away from his chest for the actual stroke at the ball. It is still effectively pendulum putting in my opinion, and that should also have been banned! It is difficult to tell if a player is cheating or not as it stands. Perhaps the long putter should be banned by restricting putter length to something like 36". I can't imagine anybody with a conventional putting stroke needing anything longer than that.


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Apr 10, 2016)

I have argued many times that it is almost impossible to police anchoring. Either allow it as it used to be or limit the length of the putter are the only 2 workable solutions.


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## Fyldewhite (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			Bernhard apparently makes his practice swings with his top hand anchored to his chest, but moves it just away from his chest for the actual stroke at the ball. It is still effectively pendulum putting in my opinion, and that should also have been banned! It is difficult to tell if a player is cheating or not as it stands. Perhaps the long putter should be banned by restricting putter length to something like 36". I can't imagine anybody with a conventional putting stroke needing anything longer than that.
		
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pendulum
_noun - _a weight hung from a *fixed point* so that it can swing freely, especially a rod with a weight at the end that regulates the mechanism of a clock

So, it's not fixed, it's not (by definition) pendulum putting. His left hand is clearly not pressed against his chest but free to move so whatever our thoughts on the rule he is not "cheating", his action isn't "suspect", he is clearly within the rules. Many rules in golf are hard to police...it doesn't mean they are all bad rules. If he says he isn't anchoring that's good enough for me tbh.

That said, I too feel that the rule change was an attempt to find some middle ground when an outright ban on long putters would have put all these issues to bed.


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## Tashyboy (Apr 10, 2016)

Fyldewhite said:



pendulum
_noun - _a weight hung from a *fixed point* so that it can swing freely, especially a rod with a weight at the end that regulates the mechanism of a clock

So, it's not fixed, it's not (by definition) pendulum putting. His left hand is clearly not pressed against his chest but free to move so whatever our thoughts on the rule he is not "cheating", his action isn't "suspect", he is clearly within the rules. Many rules in golf are hard to police...it doesn't mean they are all bad rules. If he says he isn't anchoring that's good enough for me tbh.

That said, I too feel that the rule change was an attempt to find some middle ground when an outright ban on long putters would have put all these issues to bed.


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Fylde, that kind of fact based arguement supported by nouns has no place on this forum. &#128513;&#128077; well putt.


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Fyldewhite said:



pendulum
_noun - _a weight hung from a *fixed point* so that it can swing freely, especially a rod with a weight at the end that regulates the mechanism of a clock

So, it's not fixed, it's not (by definition) pendulum putting. His left hand is clearly not pressed against his chest but free to move so whatever our thoughts on the rule he is not "cheating", his action isn't "suspect", he is clearly within the rules. Many rules in golf are hard to police...it doesn't mean they are all bad rules. If he says he isn't anchoring that's good enough for me tbh.

That said, I too feel that the rule change was an attempt to find some middle ground when an outright ban on long putters would have put all these issues to bed.


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His top hand doesn't seem to move much, if at all, during his putting stroke, so it is in effect a fixed pivot point for a pendulum stroke. I agree that a limit on putter length would have stopped this sort of thing altogether.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

A mate of mine still uses the long putter and anchors his top hand on the practice stroke. BUT his trigger now to take the putter back on the stroke proper is a small, but noticeable, push away from his chest with the anchored hand. 

I can barely see that from 20 feet away, but I know he does it. And yet some of you are calling one of the most consistent golfers Europe has ever produced, and an honourable man into the bargain, a cheat because of what you think you can or can't see on TV? Have a word with yourselves.

I'm quite sure he's been watched at very close quarters by rules officials and playing partners since January. If they're satisfied then give the man a break.


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Billysboots said:



			A mate of mine still uses the long putter and anchors his top hand on the practice stroke. BUT his trigger now to take the putter back on the stroke proper is a small, but noticeable, push away from his chest with the anchored hand. 

I can barely see that from 20 feet away, but I know he does it. And yet some of you are calling one of the most consistent golfers Europe has ever produced, and an honourable man into the bargain, a cheat because of what you think you can or can't see on TV? Have a word with yourselves.

I'm quite sure he's been watched at very close quarters by rules officials and playing partners since January. If they're satisfied then give the man a break.
		
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Agreed that he is not breaking any rules, but his putting style seems contrary to what was intended by the anchoring ban. At least it has finished the awful belly putting method, but not the broomhandle!


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

you lot can tell that his hand isnt touching his chest but is still touching his clothing . 
 sorry but the man is cheating .


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

People are always going to find their own way of getting round rule changes like this. The bottom line is that anchoring has been banned, and if Langer is no longer anchoring he is playing within the rules.

The mate I refer to says the change has made a significant difference to his confidence on the greens, but he just doesn't like a short putter. That's no different to me not liking to putt with a conventional putting grip which is why I use a claw grip. It's ways and means, but with no rule breaking.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			you lot can tell that his hand isnt touching his chest but is still touching his clothing . 
 sorry but the man is cheating .
		
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Without looking at the rule I don't know if touching clothing is banned, but I suspect not. It's anchoring to the body which was outlawed. 

As I say, if rules officials, playing partners and their caddies have no issue with it, then referring to him here as a cheat is a bit rich in my opinion. Sorry.


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## Fyldewhite (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			you lot can tell that his hand isnt touching his chest but is still touching his clothing . 
 sorry but the man is cheating .
		
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Sorry, but he isn't.....and you have just explained why. :thup:


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			you lot can tell that his hand isnt touching his chest but is still touching his clothing . 
 sorry but the man is cheating .
		
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Officials have looked at his grip and are satisfied it's ok, why do you think he is cheating?


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## TheJezster (Apr 10, 2016)

Yea in a game based on self governance and integrity, let's go right out and without questioning just call one of the most honest players we've seen in the last x number years an outright cheat! Have a word with yourself man, it's embarrassing! It might 'look' suspect but it's been looked into and he's been questioned and the facts are it's not. Case closed.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

Not sure why there is a discussion because he is being watched by officials and not one of them have pulled him up. Everytime he puts his high hand moves which shows he isn't anchoring


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

the man is taking the piddle , he says he is just moving his hand away but there is no gap that is able to be seen ,and there isnt anyone in authority gonna gall him out as they dont want to be seen as the bad man .
 emperors new clothes people.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			the man is taking the piddle , he says he is just moving his hand away but there is no gap that is able to be seen ,and there isnt anyone in authority gonna gall him out as they dont want to be seen as the bad man .
 emperors new clothes people.
		
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So you're not so much questioning his breaking of the rules but his integrity?

I dont know which is worse.


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## Deleted Member 1156 (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			the man is taking the piddle , he says he is just moving his hand away *but there is no gap that is able to be seen* ,and there isnt anyone in authority gonna gall him out as they dont want to be seen as the bad man .
 emperors new clothes people.
		
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You can tell this from TV pictures whereas officials up close can't?


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## sawtooth (Apr 10, 2016)

Common  sense needed, do you really think Langer would risk DQ by doing something illegal?

The whole world is watching and scrutinising his putting action and as already been said, not one official has picked him up on it.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

On Masters Breakfast they've discussed this very point and the consensus is that his putting style is similar to how it was before, but different enough to be legal. They are in no doubt he is putting within the rules. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me and it should really be good enough for all the armchair experts.

The view was that the likes of Adam Scott simply couldn't find a way of using the long putter without anchoring whilst Langer has, and all agree it's legal. End of.


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Billysboots said:



			So you're not so much questioning his breaking of the rules but his integrity?

I dont know which is worse.
		
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I am not questioning Langer's integrity, just that he is allowed to putt this way at all within the rules. To me his new method looks exactly the same as what he was doing before, albeit with a tiny gap between his top hand and his sternum.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			the man is taking the piddle , he says he is just moving his hand away but there is no gap that is able to be seen.
		
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Sorry, but that is questioning his integrity. I really can't view it any other way. You clearly don't believe him when he says he's not anchoring.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			I am not questioning Langer's integrity, just that he is allowed to putt this way at all within the rules. To me his new method looks exactly the same as what he was doing before, albeit with a tiny gap between his top hand and his sternum.  

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How it "looks" is irrelevant 

He isn't anchoring the putter - it can't be any simpler than that


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## Deleted member 18588 (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			the man is taking the piddle , he says he is just moving his hand away but there is no gap that is able to be seen ,and there isnt anyone in authority gonna gall him out as they dont want to be seen as the bad man .
 emperors new clothes people.
		
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Conspiracy theory, people!

The PGA Champions Tour and the Masters have colluded and told the Rules Officials from the USGA, R&A, PGA Tour, European Tour (they all provide referees etc; for the event) to ignore a blatant breach of a well publicised Rule.

Really??????

Perhaps you need to sit closer to your TV as I can see the left-hand come away from the chest prior to making the stroke.


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## freddielong (Apr 10, 2016)

Billysboots said:



			A mate of mine still uses the long putter and anchors his top hand on the practice stroke. BUT his trigger now to take the putter back on the stroke proper is a small, but noticeable, push away from his chest with the anchored hand. 

I can barely see that from 20 feet away, but I know he does it. And yet some of you are calling one of the most consistent golfers Europe has ever produced, and an honourable man into the bargain, a cheat because of what you think you can or can't see on TV? Have a word with yourselves.

I'm quite sure he's been watched at very close quarters by rules officials and playing partners since January. If they're satisfied then give the man a break.
		
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I haven't and wouldn't call him a cheat, I think the R and A and the USPGA have left him exposed with their botched rule, it should have been a maximum length rule.


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

Totally agree.


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## drdel (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			I am not questioning Langer's integrity, just that he is allowed to putt this way at all within the rules. To me his new method looks exactly the same as what he was doing before, albeit with a tiny gap between his top hand and his sternum.  

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I agree. It may be 'legal' but its hardly within the principle of the rule. In my view he is gaining the stability of the long handle because his upper arm (perhaps not his hand) is held against the chest and so it just permits a small amount of movement and therefore helps prevent the yip.

I'd think more of him as a sportsman if he had accepted the spirit of the rule rather than just try a small variation to stay 'legal'.


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## guest100718 (Apr 10, 2016)

5 pages talking about something that isnt happening.....


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

But he's putting within the rules, that's the point under discussion. Whether it's in the spirit of the game is subjective. 

The claw grip takes wrist and hand action out of the putting stroke, and as a consequence gives an advantage to those who struggle with a conventional grip. Should that be outlawed as well?

What about utility clubs? Easier to hit than irons, or that's the theory. Shall we ban those because they give an advantage to those who struggle with their irons? The list could go on and on.

Bottom line is what he is doing is legal.


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## drdel (Apr 10, 2016)

Billysboots said:



			But he's putting within the rules, that's the point under discussion. Whether it's in the spirit of the game is subjective. 

The claw grip takes wrist and hand action out of the putting stroke, and as a consequence gives an advantage to those who struggle with a conventional grip. Should that be outlawed as well?

What about utility clubs? Easier to hit than irons, or that's the theory. Shall we ban those because they give an advantage to those who struggle with their irons? The list could go on and on.

Bottom line is what he is doing is legal.
		
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The basic tenet of golf is the 'swinging' a club held in two hands; so I don't think your examples are well chosen.


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## guest100718 (Apr 10, 2016)

I saw it last night and at first you think he cant dso that, but then you realise he must have a small gap at the top and his action is fine.


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## timd77 (Apr 10, 2016)

What makes anyone think that a multiple tournament not to mention twice masters champion, and Ryder cup legend, but  now in the twilight of said legendary career would knowingly cheat?

He's been interviewed, he knows the rules, says he doesn't anchor, the powers that be say he doesn't,  that's good enough for me.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

drdel said:



			The basic tenet of golf is the 'swinging' a club held in two hands; so I don't think your examples are well chosen.
		
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He is "swinging the club held in two hands" 

There is nothing wrong with what he is doing - it's not against any principles or spirit and it's perfectly acceptable within the rules 

The rule forbids anchoring the club against the body - he isn't anchoring the club against the body - it really can't be any more simple than that


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## Billysboots (Apr 10, 2016)

Thanks, Phil. You saved me the bother!


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## freddielong (Apr 10, 2016)

Can we be absolutely confident that the gap is there on every single putt, even on a tiddler when he is finishing off and leans over someone else's line to tap in, to me the rules bodies have created the doubt.

It will be interesting to see what some of the others come up with


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

im saying that the call is way to close to call as touching clothing dosent give a definite gap that can be seen to be 100% not touching body ,thus i say its cheating,weather the ruling bodies say it is or not. Opinions are like a holes everyone has one and this is mine ,you dont have to like it ,but it is what it is .


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## NWJocko (Apr 10, 2016)

freddielong said:



			Can we be absolutely confident that the gap is there on every single putt, even on a tiddler when he is finishing off and leans over someone else's line to tap in, to me the rules bodies have created the doubt.

It will be interesting to see what some of the others come up with
		
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Given golf is a self policing sport id expect him
To call a foul on himself.

Unless you're suggesting he may break other rules knowingly and keep quiet about it aswell? 

You can see his hands move.

Everyone's entitled their opinion, absolutely, but opinions can be wrong


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			im saying that the call is way to close to call as touching clothing dosent give a definite gap that can be seen to be 100% not touching body ,thus i say its cheating,weather the ruling bodies say it is or not. Opinions are like a holes everyone has one and this is mine ,you dont have to like it ,but it is what it is .
		
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It's not an opinion though - it's an accusation , you can't call him a cheat without factually backing it up and so far that hasn't happened. 

The putter is not anchored against the body - it can't be anymore clearer than that

Sorry but you are wrong - both his hands move when he putts so he is clearly not anchoring


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

phil i have tried the method he is using and i have tried the illegal method .my hands can move using both ,and until i see a gap between hands and clothing i say it is cheating.
its an opinion that you obviously and others on here dont like ,but thats tough ,i have an opinion and i say he is cheating .
 you are entitled to your opinion as is everyone else ,but we all dont have to be in agreement of them .


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			phil i have tried the method he is using and i have tried the illegal method .my hands can move using both ,and until i see a gap between hands and clothing i say it is cheating.
its an opinion that you obviously and others on here dont like ,but thats tough ,i have an opinion and i say he is cheating .
 you are entitled to your opinion as is everyone else ,but we all dont have to be in agreement of them .
		
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The rule says you cannot anchor the putter against the body - not clothing but body. You can't say someone is cheating without him actually breaking a rule or not - calling it an opinion doesn't change it being factually incorrect.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

i need more than someone saying he isnt touching his body .you can see his upper arm is locked against his side and the top hand is way too close to be 100% sure it isnt touching . 
if you say im calling him a liar so be it ,i dont agree with what you say but i will defend your right to say it.


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## Colin L (Apr 10, 2016)

On the one hand we have a player of great distinction and known integrity whose putting has by now been scrutinised first hand (including at his own request) by many referees many of whom are themselves of some distinction.

On the other hand, we have a punter on an internet forum who knows better having looked at a few videos.

Not a difficult one, I would say.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			i need more than someone saying he isnt touching his body .you can see his upper arm is locked against his side and the top hand is way too close to be 100% sure it isnt touching . 
if you say im calling him a liar so be it ,i dont agree with what you say but i will defend your right to say it.
		
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Golf is a self governing game - Langer is one of the most respected golfers in the game and his level of accuracy playing the game is legendary. If Langer felt he had even come anywhere close to possibly anchoring he would call a penalty on himself. 

Your are questioning a legends honestly and integrity - it's not just calling him a liar - you are suggesting he is going against his own personal beliefs about the game of golf.

You only have to read Montys book to know the sort of golfer and person Langer is - can't get anyone anymore straight and narrow. Anyone who knows the game of golf knows Langer wouldn't be anchoring.

He isn't anchoring - and until you can prove he is then he isn't cheating - it's not an opinion to call him a cheat , it's accusing a very well respected gentleman within our game.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

im sure his mummy says hes a very nice man.
 like i have already said .its an opinion ,am i not allowed one ?


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			He is "swinging the club held in two hands" 

There is nothing wrong with what he is doing - it's not against any principles or spirit and it's perfectly acceptable within the rules 

The rule forbids anchoring the club against the body - he isn't anchoring the club against the body - it really can't be any more simple than that
		
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He is putting with his top hand pretty much stationary, acting as a pivot point, and his bottom hand pushing the club through with a pendulum action.  Even if this is allowed under a technicality, it is hardly a classic golf swing and IMHO shouldn't be allowed! At the same time as banning anchoring, the R&A/USGA should have restricted the length of putters.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			Even if this is allowed under a technicality, it is hardly a classic golf swing and IMHO shouldn't be allowed
		
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On that basis Jim Furyk wouldn't be allowed to play at all, never mind putt.


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## KeeleDrivingRange (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			im sure his mummy says hes a very nice man.
 like i have already said .its an opinion ,am i not allowed one ?
		
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Your opinion is that he is cheating. The masters officials and PGA officials say he is not. What makes you think you are in a better position to not only call him a cheat but to then to be calling the course officials at best incompetent? 

You can have the opinion that the rule needs to be changed or even that he is not within the spirit of the game but you certainly cannot have an opinion that he is a cheat. That is disgraceful and I am quite shocked tbh.


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			On that basis Jim Furyk wouldn't be allowed to play at all, never mind putt.
		
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Jim Furyk's golf swing is a little bit unusual, but in no way comes even close to infringing the Rules of Golf!


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			He is putting with his top hand pretty much stationary, acting as a pivot point, and his bottom hand pushing the club through with a pendulum action.  Even if this is allowed under a technicality, it is hardly a classic golf swing and IMHO shouldn't be allowed! At the same time as banning anchoring, the R&A/USGA should have restricted the length of putters.
		
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It's not being allowed on a "technicality" - it's being allowed because it's legal 

He swings the club with both hands without anchoring the putter against the body - simple , his top hand moves when he putts 

As for not being a "classic golf swing etc " - the claw grip isn't exactly a classic is it


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## delc (Apr 10, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			It's not being allowed on a "technicality" - it's being allowed because it's legal 

He swings the club with both hands without anchoring the putter against the body - simple , his top hand moves when he putts 

As for not being a "classic golf swing etc " - the claw grip isn't exactly a classic is it
		
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Well it is at least a two handed grip using a normal length putter, without even a hint of anchoring!.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

delc said:



			Well it is at least a two handed grip using a normal length putter.  

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What's "normal" ?

Langer is using a 2 handed grip for a putter he considers normal.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

KeeleDrivingRange said:



			Your opinion is that he is cheating. The masters officials and PGA officials say he is not. What makes you think you are in a better position to not only call him a cheat but to then to be calling the course officials at best incompetent? 

You can have the opinion that the rule needs to be changed or even that he is not within the spirit of the game but you certainly cannot have an opinion that he is a cheat. That is disgraceful and I am quite shocked tbh.
		
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  you stay shocked mate and i will still say in my opinion he is cheating.:thup:


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## craigstardis1976 (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			you stay shocked mate and i will still say in my opinion he is cheating.:thup:
		
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Your opinion is wrong. It can be empirically proved it is wrong and instead of rationally looking at the situation you stick by your assertion that he is cheating when he is clearly is not. 

Quite bluntly Sir, that level of sustained willing ignorance says a lot more about you than the perfectly legal putting method used by Herr Langer.


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## Skypilot (Apr 10, 2016)

Langer is anchoring as defined in this link: 
https://www.usga.org/content/dam/usga/images/rules/anchoring/understanding-anchored-strokes.pdf

Look at the second picture down showing examples of prohibited techniques. The one called *Anchored Long Putter.
*I was wondering why it was going unmentioned but Butch Harmon raised it and said Langer was anchoring.


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

craigstardis1976 said:



			Your opinion is wrong. It can be empirically proved it is wrong and instead of rationally looking at the situation you stick by your assertion that he is cheating when he is clearly is not. 

Quite bluntly Sir, that level of sustained willing ignorance says a lot more about you than the perfectly legal putting method used by Herr Langer.
		
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  and who are you to question my opinion.i will not change my mind until i see evidence to the contrary .i see a locked upper arm and a very suspicious looking hand  being used . watching last night and the previous nights i am unconvinced he isnt abiding by the laws layed down by the governing bodies of the sport of golf . 
 as i have said earlier in this thread ,its my opinion ,if you dont agree tough ,i dont care ,i say he is cheating .


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## PhilTheFragger (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			you stay shocked mate and i will still say in my opinion he is cheating.:thup:
		
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On this forum, which is run by THE leading Golf Magazine in the UK, you simply cannot go around accusing people of cheating without very substantial proof, and you simply have none.
You have said your piece, so lets leave it at that.

Bernhard Langer is one of the most respected players ever, He will have had his putting style approved at the highest possible level and there is no doubt in my mind that he is NOT cheating, A Cheat is the worst thing you can call a golfer, so no more please.

That said, the continued use of the long putter was always going to raise the issue and it would have been better if he had moved to a standard putter like pretty much everyone else.


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## Liverpoolphil (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			and who are you to question my opinion.i will not change my mind until i see evidence to the contrary .i see a locked upper arm and a very suspicious looking hand  being used . watching last night and the previous nights i am unconvinced he isnt abiding by the laws layed down by the governing bodies of the sport of golf . 
 as i have said earlier in this thread ,its my opinion ,if you dont agree tough ,i dont care ,i say he is cheating .
		
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http://www.golfdigest.com/story/ber...r-stroke-has-him-in-contention-at-the-masters

Please provide evidence to back up your accusations that Langer is cheating - despite the fact fully qualified golf officials are watching and have confirmed its not anchoring. 

His putting has been scrutinised at his own request ( which should say exactly the person he is ) and had been cleared - so what is it exactly you have seen that all fully qualified golf officials have missed

Accusing someone of cheating in golf is one of the worst things you can do because it's a self governing game - at least provide factual proof to back up such a poor accusation


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## craigstardis1976 (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			and who are you to question my opinion.i will not change my mind until i see evidence to the contrary .i see a locked upper arm and a very suspicious looking hand  being used . watching last night and the previous nights i am unconvinced he isnt abiding by the laws layed down by the governing bodies of the sport of golf . 
 as i have said earlier in this thread ,its my opinion ,if you dont agree tough ,i dont care ,i say he is cheating .
		
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Who am I to question your opinion? Someone who is rational and capable of changing their opinion in the face of overwhelming evidence. 

There is ample video from multiple angles readily available, you have been shown the rules, his putting technique has been approved of by every rules official he has shown it too and you cannot produce evidence of one single time Mr. Langer has broken the rules. 

To call a player of such high caliber a cheat is insulting not only to Mr. Langer but also to those who try to uphold the rules of the game in their own conduct (and God knows I am sure I have got the rules wrong for myself sometimes) but also sets a bad example. There may be a youngster (or a person with a form of physical limitation)out there who decides to putt in a similar manner and may be put off the game from having to put up with people spouting the ignorant lines you are. 

Surely you are better than that?

Craig.


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## Tongo (Apr 10, 2016)

craigstardis1976 said:



			Who am I to question your opinion? Someone who is rational and capable of changing their opinion in the face of overwhelming evidence. 

There is ample video from multiple angles readily available, you have been shown the rules, his putting technique has been approved of by every rules official he has shown it too and you cannot produce evidence of one single time Mr. Langer has broken the rules. 

To call a player of such high caliber a cheat is insulting not only to Mr. Langer but also to those who try to uphold the rules of the game in their own conduct (and God knows I am sure I have got the rules wrong for myself sometimes) but also sets a bad example. There may be a youngster (or a person with a form of physical limitation)out there who decides to putt in a similar manner and may be put off the game from having to put up with people spouting the ignorant lines you are. 

Surely you are better than that?

Craig.
		
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I wouldnt bother wasting your time. He / she clearly has made their mind up and doesnt appear interested in changing regardless of what evidence is produced. PTF's post says it all on the matter.


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## pokerjoke (Apr 10, 2016)

craigstardis1976 said:



			Who am I to question your opinion? Someone who is rational and capable of changing their opinion in the face of overwhelming evidence. 

There is ample video from multiple angles readily available, you have been shown the rules, his putting technique has been approved of by every rules official he has shown it too and you cannot produce evidence of one single time Mr. Langer has broken the rules. 

To call a player of such high caliber a cheat is insulting not only to Mr. Langer but also to those who try to uphold the rules of the game in their own conduct (and God knows I am sure I have got the rules wrong for myself sometimes) but also sets a bad example. There may be a youngster (or a person with a form of physical limitation)out there who decides to putt in a similar manner and may be put off the game from having to put up with people spouting the ignorant lines you are. 

Surely you are better than that?

Craig.
		
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Come on mate Mr Langer are you serious


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## Norrin Radd (Apr 10, 2016)

PhilTheFragger said:



			On this forum, which is run by THE leading Golf Magazine in the UK, you simply cannot go around accusing people of cheating without very substantial proof, and you simply have none.
You have said your piece, so lets leave it at that.

Bernhard Langer is one of the most respected players ever, He will have had his putting style approved at the highest possible level and there is no doubt in my mind that he is NOT cheating, A Cheat is the worst thing you can call a golfer, so no more please.

That said, the continued use of the long putter was always going to raise the issue and it would have been better if he had moved to a standard putter like pretty much everyone else.
		
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i am only going on what i have seen on the tv ,and i say its not right .yhus he is ch......
 but you dont like that word so i will say he isnt abiding by the rules.
there isnt enough evidence on my tv that proves otherwise .regardless of weather he is being watched or what he is saying .i still see a man who is getting away with bending the rules .


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## ruff-driver (Apr 10, 2016)

Oh dear oh dear oh dear


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## pokerjoke (Apr 10, 2016)

ruff-driver said:



			Oh dear oh dear oh dear






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Are we playing catchphrase?


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## ruff-driver (Apr 10, 2016)

pokerjoke said:



			Are we playing catchphrase?
		
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Why not


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## Tongo (Apr 10, 2016)

pokerjoke said:



			Are we playing catchphrase?
		
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If that's Mr Chips then he's definitely anchoring.


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## PhilTheFragger (Apr 10, 2016)

The poacher said:



			i am only going on what i have seen on the tv ,and i say its not right .yhus he is ch......
 but you dont like that word so i will say he isnt abiding by the rules.
there isnt enough evidence on my tv that proves otherwise .regardless of weather he is being watched or what he is saying .i still see a man who is getting away with bending the rules .
		
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So the analysis on screen by those who know cant convince you,The on site rules officials who will be watching him like a hawk?  nothing can in that case,   Perhaps you should take a look at your own signature and take something from that.

Needless to say GM cannot be seen to be associated with your views, so its time to stop

Thank you


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## pokerjoke (Apr 10, 2016)

ruff-driver said:



			Why not 

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Ok is it?

A day at the sea-side


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## Deleted member 18588 (Apr 10, 2016)

pokerjoke said:



			Ok is it?

A day at the sea-side

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It's good...........But it's not right!


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