# Anxiety and mental health - help me understand



## adam6177 (Aug 9, 2019)

Two subjects that are plastered everywhere at the moment and something that I've been thinking about, but I'll be honest I find myself struggling to have sympathy for/understand if the issues are real. 

Don't get me wrong, I fully comprehend those with "real" mental issues that affect learning, movement, brain function etc....but when did "I'm a bit stressed at work at the moment" turn into "I suffer from anxiety about work" ?

We seem to have a generation of people that now have mental health issues, which I believe are strongly linked to our way of "always being plugged in" and have changed our perception of our own happiness.  Or is it that we're now more aware of these kind of issues and they have in fact always been there?

Please note that I am asking these questions because I am questioning my own views on the subject.


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## williamalex1 (Aug 9, 2019)

adam6177 said:



			Two subjects that are plastered everywhere at the moment and something that I've been thinking about, but I'll be honest I find myself struggling to have sympathy for/understand if the issues are real.

Don't get me wrong, I fully comprehend those with "real" mental issues that affect learning, movement, brain function etc....but when did "I'm a bit stressed at work at the moment" turn into "I suffer from anxiety about work" ?

We seem to have a generation of people that now have mental health issues, which I believe are strongly linked to our way of "always being plugged in" and have changed our perception of our own happiness.  Or is it that we're now more aware of these kind of issues and they have in fact always been there?

Please note that I am asking these questions because I am questioning my own views on the subject.
		
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Retirement is the answer , or just don't give a toss, it's only a job.


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## MegaSteve (Aug 9, 2019)

I've been advised its about coping mechanisms... Different levels of stress/anxiety can bring about differing responses... Stress/anxiety may create a 'chemical reaction' within your brain... Been advised about 90% of the population will experience a level of depression at some time in their life...


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## Hobbit (Aug 9, 2019)

I don't think your questions are unreasonable. The simple answer, albeit a clumsy one, is when someone is asked to operate outside of their comfort zone they will experience a level of anxiety. It might be that a boss asks an employee to perform a task that although they are more than competent in accomplishing there is the added pressure of a time deadline. The employees can control how the task is completed but not the clock running down. Once the task is completed the anxiety abates.

However, what happens if its a daily occurrence? The employee experiences lengthy periods of anxiety. Periods of anxiety that might extend beyond the working day can impact on their home life. And if the impact causes issues at home, more anxiety. Potentially, you're now into the area of impacting sleep, which leads to the individual going into work the following day not at their best. Bearing in mind they're already carrying a heightened level of anxiety from a target that has extended beyond day one, they'll be anxious about their performance levels due to tiredness.

Extended periods of anxiety lead to irrational decisions, which leads to more anxiety which leads to more irrational decisions which leads to anxiety...

There's a process wired into the brain about frontal lobe and the lobe at the back, i.e. the filing cabinet. If issues/tasks stay too long in the frontal lobe area it can lead to anxiety and a form of PTSD. Some people can compartmentalise very well, others can't. Some people can be taught to compartmentalise, in some cases all it is is being trained the complete the task more competently.


And a little humour too which exaggerates stress??


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## Mudball (Aug 9, 2019)

IMO, there are multiple facetes to this, but the most important bit of it is that we are now talking about it. This is a massive step forward.  My Dads generation (and to a large mine too), we dont talk about it - esp the men folks.. we are told to man up. I see a lot of stress around me.. people burning up at a ridiculous rate.   I make a half-decent pay, but money is my number one worry which means i cant do certain things that help me 'let-go'... 
I would encourage professional help as well as talking to friends and loved ones.  It will be surprising how many more people open up when you reach out.


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## robinthehood (Aug 9, 2019)

Anxiety , panic are things that have a place in our lives, its when they start to happen when they shouldn't , it becomes a real and sometimes terrifying issue for who is suffering.


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## Doon frae Troon (Aug 9, 2019)

This simple little task may help you.

Write down a list of the 5 things that are most important to you.

Who does your job when you are not there.

Which of these three jobs do you think would be the most stressful.
Brain surgeon
Ambulance driver.
Hospital cleaner.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Aug 9, 2019)

Hobbit said:



			I don't think your questions are unreasonable. The simple answer, albeit a clumsy one, is when someone is asked to operate outside of their comfort zone they will experience a level of anxiety. It might be that a boss asks an employee to perform a task that although they are more than competent in accomplishing there is the added pressure of a time deadline. The employees can control how the task is completed but not the clock running down. Once the task is completed the anxiety abates.

However, what happens if its a daily occurrence? The employee experiences lengthy periods of anxiety. Periods of anxiety that might extend beyond the working day can impact on their home life. And if the impact causes issues at home, more anxiety. Potentially, you're now into the area of impacting sleep, which leads to the individual going into work the following day not at their best. Bearing in mind they're already carrying a heightened level of anxiety from a target that has extended beyond day one, they'll be anxious about their performance levels due to tiredness.

Extended periods of anxiety lead to irrational decisions, which leads to more anxiety which leads to more irrational decisions which leads to anxiety...

There's a process wired into the brain about frontal lobe and the lobe at the back, i.e. the filing cabinet. If issues/tasks stay too long in the frontal lobe area it can lead to anxiety and a form of PTSD. Some people can compartmentalise very well, others can't. Some people can be taught to compartmentalise, in some cases all it is is being trained the complete the task more competently.


And a little humour too which exaggerates stress??







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Absolutely - then add into the mix where individuals under such work stress may actually have low self-esteem and a fear, almost an expectation, of failure.   This mindset might not show by their presenting, as best they can, a positive demeanor, and indeed being at least pretty good at their job, but when things get difficult as @Hobbit describes then fear leading to utter panic can result.  And we just cannot live or function when we are consumed by fear and such panic.


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## TheDiablo (Aug 9, 2019)

My wife suffers from very bad anxiety at times, and it is completely debilitating for her. She's someone more than capable of rational thought and holds a first class degree in psychology, so it's not as if she is unaware what's going on, she just struggles to stop it! 

Her trigger is significant change, even good change and in fact her worse episodes have been at times that should have been great - eg going to uni, when we first moved in, when she got pregnant and right now as she is starting her dream job. 

She's had CBT and that really helped, and also uses light medication daily, but still at times gets into cycles of irrational and negative thought spirals. She's someone without any other mental illness, and in normal times you'd never have a clue. 

I'm someone fortunate to never having suffered from anything like it, pride myself on being very rational and act with thought and positive intent whatever I do. So much so that if I hadn't lived with it I would definitely have the same questions as the OP. 

However, it really is a world away from a 'but of stress at work'. 

My opinion is that it has always been there - we now have better awareness but also lives are busier and therefore triggers are more common.


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## Orikoru (Aug 9, 2019)

Unfortunately it is nigh-on impossible to tell the difference between someone who suffers genuinely from anxiety, and those who are chancers trying it on. The positive is that more gets done to help those who are genuine these days, the sad side effect is that more chancers will jump on that to get free days off and whatever else.


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## MegaSteve (Aug 9, 2019)

When I used to get super stressed I'd come out in rashes/hives... If people asked I'd tell them it was dermatitis... Which was wholly believable as my work involved using chemical processes...


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## Italian outcast (Aug 9, 2019)

My life changed completely when I realised it was ok for me to be anxious (even if the anxieties were mad - and some were)


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## TheDiablo (Aug 9, 2019)

Orikoru said:



			Unfortunately it is nigh-on impossible to tell the difference between someone who suffers genuinely from anxiety, and those who are chancers trying it on. The positive is that more gets done to help those who are genuine these days, the sad side effect is that more chancers will jump on that to get free days off and whatever else.
		
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No difference to a headache then? Or tonsillitis? Or numerous other illnesses


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## Orikoru (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			No difference to a headache then? Or tonsillitis? Or numerous other illnesses
		
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Huh?


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## TheDiablo (Aug 9, 2019)

Orikoru said:



			Huh?
		
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Mainstream awareness of anxiety hasn't led to the creation of people trying it on for a day off work. You can't see if someone has a headache, or many other illnesses. Not sure what you meant by 'whatever else' either.


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## Orikoru (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			Mainstream awareness of anxiety hasn't led to the creation of people trying it on for a day off work. You can't see if someone has a headache, or many other illnesses. Not sure what you meant by 'whatever else' either.
		
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Headache gets you out of an afternoon, whereas claiming you have anxiety or stress could get you out for longer. Physical illnesses can be proven quite simply, mental health problems, not so easy. I was just saying it's a shame that there will always be people looking to abuse the great strides that are made in helping people with genuine issues.


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## Hobbituk (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			My wife suffers from very bad anxiety at times, and it is completely debilitating for her. She's someone more than capable of rational thought and holds a first class degree in psychology, so it's not as if she is unaware what's going on, she just struggles to stop it!
		
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Same.  I would hazard a guess at saying that the phrase, "ignorance is bliss" stems from this kind of thing.  Meditation is also quite good at being able to train the conscious mind to accept the fact that the unconscious mind will constantly throw out 'thoughts', and they just need to be seen for what they are - unconscious 'noise'.  Often, focusing on tasks helps them subside... then they'll creep back in to our consciousness.





			My opinion is that it has always been there - we now have better awareness but also lives are busier and therefore triggers are more common.
		
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I think it's also to do with something close to Maslow's model.  We have fewer "obvious" stresses in modern life.

If you're faced with life or death scenarios - battling malaria, hunting for food, living in war-torn areas, then you don't really say, "i'm stressed".  Obviously you're stressed.  If you weren't stressed, you'd die. 

Survival of the fittest - by very definition.

When you're working down a mine or out fishing in order to feed the family, who depend upon your income, and most others are in the same situation, you don't really say, "i'm stressed".  Obviously you're stressed - what's the alternative?  Not go to work and let everyone starve?  

Again - survival of the fittest.  Weak immune systems soon get culled in a world of manual labour

It's now changed considerably.  You could be super intelligent and need to live in a bacteria-free cell, but do work that progresses science beyond all imagination, but at the same time have sleepless nights over climate change, and then decide it's all too much and commit suicide at the age of 30.  You'd have died at birth a hundred years ago, but maybe made the biggest contribution to society in modern times.


Anyway, back to the OP...

Should you have sympathy for others?  Yes absolutely - 100%, no question.  Life is luck, all the way down.  You didn't choose your parents, your genes, the continent you were born into, the fact you're wealthy (by global standards) etc.    Every day we should try and celebrate / be thankful that we won the lottery of life.  We aren't in Africa, Syria, Iraq etc.  You weren't born disabled.  You weren't born with a mental illness, and perhaps have a higher threshold for becoming distressed at a situation, as opposed to dealing with stress as a positive stress and being motivated to deal with the situation.

That's all luck.  People don't "choose" to be stressed, and if someone was trying it on in order to avoid work, again that's just the nature of who they are.  They didn't "choose" to be a chancer - they're going to be like that whether it's "anxiety", or "bad stomach" being cited as a reason.

The question is...

Should we provide the same help for those that are mentally or physically weaker?  I guess we will be judged in the process of time, and it's a much wider question about what life is all about.

If the future success of our civilisation depends upon the minds with the greatest empathy, but are equally the most stressed and concerned about things, then we need more of those people...

If it actually turns out that in helping the sick, we reverse thousands of years of natural selection and end up re-introducing diseases and exhaust our available resources on caring for others and become extinct... well, that's not the worst way to die out as a civilisation.  Certainly an easier choice than culling the 'weak', however that is measured.


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## Hacker Khan (Aug 9, 2019)

Isn't suicide the biggest killer of males under 45?  So the more we as a society make it OK and normal to talk about these issues the better.  I know my daughters school does a lot of work around mental health and the pressures on kids nowadays and indeed more schools are covering this (instagram is by far the worst culprit for this).  But there are also many other causes and reasons why it is being more recognized and it is not just social media.


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## jim8flog (Aug 9, 2019)

The company I used to work for issued a 'declaration'
it went something like

Stress is considered to be a very normal part of the job you do and the company will not have any sympathy for any body taking time of work due to work stress related issues.

 I was glad that I was already on long term sick leave due to mental issues before the declaration was made.


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## TheDiablo (Aug 9, 2019)

Orikoru said:



			Headache gets you out of an afternoon, whereas claiming you have anxiety or stress could get you out for longer. Physical illnesses can be proven quite simply, mental health problems, not so easy. I was just saying it's a shame that there will always be people looking to abuse the great strides that are made in helping people with genuine issues.
		
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And I think it's a shame that your first thought goes to those you feel take advantage, rather then focus on the positive aspect of the strides being made or the effect such issues can have on people's lives. It really doesn't effect you too much if you think a colleague is taking the odd sickie. 

It's like the benefit system. Yes, there's plenty of people abusing it. But the good it does to society far outweighs this.


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## Orikoru (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			And I think it's a shame that your first thought goes to those you feel take advantage, rather then focus on the positive aspect of the strides being made or the effect such issues can have on people's lives. It really doesn't effect you too much if you think a colleague is taking the odd sickie.

It's like the benefit system. Yes, there's plenty of people abusing it. But the good it does to society far outweighs this.
		
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I just went with that because that was the premise of the OP and how he doubts if it's all real. I think we're getting our wires crossed here. I literally said it was positive that more help is being given these days.


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## Dando (Aug 9, 2019)

jim8flog said:



			The company I used to work for issued a 'declaration'
it went something like

Stress is considered to be a very normal part of the job you do and the company will not have any sympathy for any body taking time of work due to work stress related issues.

I was glad that I was already on long term sick leave due to mental issues before the declaration was made.
		
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that's awful and I am not sure how that will go down in an employment tribunal. 

I am lucky that my firm has mental health first aiders and run quarterly breakfast meetings for those with mental health issues so we can all sit and talk about the issues affecting us and what we do to try and combat them.


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## pauljames87 (Aug 9, 2019)

adam6177 said:



			Two subjects that are plastered everywhere at the moment and something that I've been thinking about, but I'll be honest I find myself struggling to have sympathy for/understand if the issues are real.

Don't get me wrong, I fully comprehend those with "real" mental issues that affect learning, movement, brain function etc....but when did "I'm a bit stressed at work at the moment" turn into "I suffer from anxiety about work" ?

We seem to have a generation of people that now have mental health issues, which I believe are strongly linked to our way of "always being plugged in" and have changed our perception of our own happiness.  Or is it that we're now more aware of these kind of issues and they have in fact always been there?

Please note that I am asking these questions because I am questioning my own views on the subject.
		
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As someone who has bi polar disorder I can try and shed some light. 

So many people just donâ€™t understand and thatâ€™s just through years of â€œtoughenâ€ up attitude , men told to not show emotion and just â€œman upâ€ in most situations. (Not exclusive to men of course)

Speaking from personal experience my bipolar (or to give its correct name, manic depression) I am subject to extreme mood swings over a period of time. Cause by chemical imbalance inside my mind (the most powerful tool). I would have a few week period of the manic stage. where I would be invincible, nothing could stop me doing what I wanted to do, eating 5 meals a day due to the pure energy levels running around like an idiot everywhere. Couple weeks later would be the depression stage, scared of what I had done when manic (checking my phone and thinking jesus did I really say that. Scared of what people would think of me for my actions) not eating at all, just laying in bed paranoid.

Luckily my doctor spotted it after initially trying to put me on anti depressants (would have sent me super high) I told him it wasnâ€™t the depression that scared me it was the manic stage. So he put me on mood stabilisers.

Bit of trial and error but in end the dosage was sorted and been on them ever since. That was 2011, once stable it was a long fight to get to where i am today. Driving licence initially taken away for 6 months whilst my meds took affect (understandable) 3 years of 1 year licences and applying each year for a new one, then was a 3 year one. Now finally unrestricted licence like a normal person again (woo). Work took a while to get clearance for duties again, lots of trips to the work dr. I was cleared for promotion 5 years ago and for past 8 years have to  have yearly checks with them which is fine ðŸ‘Œ

In terms of depression and manic stages (touch wood) the meds have stabilised them. I donâ€™t get weeks of one or other. I might get the odd day where my head feels like itâ€™s spaced out and the world just passes by but I can snap out of that now. I do however snap easily at things and have to take myself off and tell myself that person isnâ€™t being a (bad word) that itâ€™s me and I need to calm myself.

One thing that really helps is golf, fresh air and something thatâ€™s impossible to master keeps the mind active!

A challenge is the best thing.

Any questions feel free to ask Iâ€™ve prob been asked them all before


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## adam6177 (Aug 9, 2019)

pauljames87 said:



			Any questions feel free to ask Iâ€™ve prob been asked them all before
		
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I worked for a while with someone who is bi-polar...I remember sometimes he'd not come to work for a couple of weeks, then just turn up like nothing had happened.  As I think I alluded to in my original post, I do understand more those who have been diagnosed with real issues - and thank god you and so many others are getting the support you need and deserve.  My feeling is though that some peoples self diagnosis are a bit feeble and then lead onto excuses..... and I dont just mean in the work place, I mean in life itself.

Maybe this means that I have little function for sympathy/empathy, maybe I am ingrained with the "man up" attitude that a few have mentioned.....I just have a feeling that some are taking this recent focus on the issues and turning it to their favour.  Maybe this is my own selfish issue.

Thanks for being so open an blunt, I appreciate it.


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## pauljames87 (Aug 9, 2019)

adam6177 said:



			I worked for a while with someone who is bi-polar...I remember sometimes he'd not come to work for a couple of weeks, then just turn up like nothing had happened.  As I think I alluded to in my original post, I do understand more those who have been diagnosed with real issues - and thank god you and so many others are getting the support you need and deserve.  My feeling is though that some peoples self diagnosis are a bit feeble and then lead onto excuses..... and I dont just mean in the work place, I mean in life itself.

Maybe this means that I have little function for sympathy/empathy, maybe I am ingrained with the "man up" attitude that a few have mentioned.....I just have a feeling that some are taking this recent focus on the issues and turning it to their favour.  Maybe this is my own selfish issue.

Thanks for being so open an blunt, I appreciate it. 

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No use sugar coating it tbh! Silly as it sounds, if Iâ€™m not blunt with myself I can just go back to hiding in self pity. 

My work have been getting people to volunteer as mental heath champions. Canâ€™t say I completely agree. Whilst itâ€™s great to talk about it and get that convo going these guys have no training in how to deal with mental health issues so is that safe? I donâ€™t know 

I do however (crazy as it sounds) feel lucky. Most people with bipolar struggle to hold down a regular employment. I have managed to keep the same employer for 16 years. 

The meds are alright just wish the side affects werenâ€™t increased appetite and hair loss! Massive bald spot and a fat gut at 32 isnâ€™t the best look! Lucky my wife sees past it ðŸ˜‚


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## User62651 (Aug 9, 2019)

jim8flog said:



*The company I used to work for issued a 'declaration'
it went something like*

*Stress is considered to be a very normal part of the job you do and the company will not have any sympathy for any body taking time of work due to work stress related issues.*

I was glad that I was already on long term sick leave due to mental issues before the declaration was made.
		
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Don't think modern companies that do well and attract the best people would get far with that attitude. A happy employee is a more productive employee. Glad to hear you* used* to work for them, I imagine they'll have a high staff turnover which is costly and demoralising, it's an old school attitude that is both self defeating and pointless as they cant enforce it or could be done legally if their lack of sympathy went as far as trying to sack someone on that basis of illness.


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## Dando (Aug 9, 2019)

I have been in a really horrible, dark, bad place for the past few weeks - almost like a train tunnel but with no light at the end of it and it just consumes you. 

I have lost count of the number of times I have sat and cried - it happened at both the Forest Pines and Sunningdale meets so that makes me anxious and I try to avoid being around people which then makes me feel even worse as I don't want to come across as being unsocial.

walking my dog has given me space and time to switch off and chill (until the little fcuker runs off!). 

In all honesty I'd rather have a physical impairment (being left handed doesn't count) as at least then people could tell what was wrong with me and I wouldn't be judged.

I am about to start different medication so it could be fun while I adjust to those!


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## chrisd (Aug 9, 2019)

Dando said:



			I have been in a really horrible, dark, bad place for the past few weeks - almost like a train tunnel but with no light at the end of it and it just consumes you. 

I have lost count of the number of times I have sat and cried - it happened at both the Forest Pines and Sunningdale meets so that makes me anxious and I try to avoid being around people which then makes me feel even worse as I don't want to come across as being unsocial.

walking my dog has given me space and time to switch off and chill (until the little fcuker runs off!). 

In all honesty I'd rather have a physical impairment (being left handed doesn't count) as at least then people could tell what was wrong with me and I wouldn't be judged.

I am about to start different medication so it could be fun while I adjust to those!
		
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To be fair mate, you dont come across as anything but a really nice guy, some problems I know, but a good guy to be around. I'm just sorry that other than encouragement to stay out and try to enjoy the walk that there was little more I could do.


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## Dando (Aug 9, 2019)

chrisd said:



			To be fair mate, you dont come across as anything but a really nice guy, some problems I know, but a good guy to be around. I'm just sorry that other than encouragement to stay out and try to enjoy the walk that there was little more I could do.
		
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your encouragement made a big difference to how I felt on the new course.
it took my mind off how crap I was playing and despite a few poor shots the back 9 was very enjoyable.


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## ScienceBoy (Aug 9, 2019)

adam6177 said:



			We seem to have a generation of people that now have mental health issues.?
		
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I don't believe this to be true, there is no "modern cause", its always been there. It's only now we are talking about it due to mediums like social media and media itself going with the hot topics.

I've been managing my mental health for over  a decade.

If we think its just a modern illness we will fail to deal with it.


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## User62651 (Aug 9, 2019)

No particular fan of royalty (can take em or leave em) but I'm pleased to see Wiils and Harry use their high public profiles to show steady support for mental health causes, particularly in men. Not just a one off either, keep returning to it so fair play to them for that. 
Losing their mother in the fashion they did at that young age and under such public scrutiny must have left some psychological scars.


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## virtuocity (Aug 9, 2019)

I work with lots of families who experience multifarious problems.

Itâ€™s a national shame how pitifully funded mental health services are, especially in the childrenâ€™s sectors.  Truth is, funding mental health isnâ€™t as much of a vote winner than putting more police on the beat and other such social issues.

Weâ€™ve come a long way but still huge stretches to go in terms of breaking stigma.  However, for every brave person who publicly talks about their own issues, there will be a similar amount of people querying those who â€˜fakeâ€™ symptoms- this is NOT a helpful discussion.

One of the most gratifying parts of my job is giving hardened west of Scotland dads the â€˜permissionâ€™ to be an emotional, imperfect, nurturing and silly human being.  Undoing the manyfold generational assertion that men are designed to graft, drink and be a scary or intimidating figure at home and the community. I get some real lightbulb moments.

A measure of success in this area will be when declaring the existence of a mental illness becomes as accepted as a broken leg- in itself an issue given youâ€™re probably 100 times more likely to experience the former.

So, a couple of billion pound investment needed as well as 100 billion of investment to tackle poverty- a key indicator in poor mental health will do me for starters.  Iâ€™m not convinced thereâ€™s  political party in existence who would give such a damn.


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## GaryK (Aug 9, 2019)

Anxiety & Depression are VERY real - I should know as I went through some very dark times just over 10 years ago.
However, to me, the younger generation (millennials / snowflakes) suffer for reasons that just don't make sense. Whether they are carrying a FEW extra pounds or aren't getting enough social media "likes" and I struggle to have any sympathy for them. How are they going to cope when REAL WORLD challenges start hitting them....paying the mortgage / rent, paying other bills, having to provide for a family, etc.

My story is that I was struggling with workloads and change at work. One day my boss called me into a meeting to express his dissatisfaction with my performance without asking why I was struggling. It was at this point I burst into tears - I was in my late 30's around the time. I simply said that I think that I'd better speak to my GP. Got an appointment within a couple of days and my GP advised me that I was suffering anxiety & depression.
Back then, there was very little talk, support or understanding of the mental issues.
I was put on meds (the first type made things worse) and ended up being off work for 4 months.

To this day I am still on the meds (reduced dose) and do have the occasional "moment", but on the whole am able to live a "normal" life.

I am very concerned that despite mental health getting more recognition, how the hell are the younger generation going to cope when they start facing "grown up" challenges?


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## Hacker Khan (Aug 9, 2019)

GaryK said:



			Anxiety & Depression are VERY real - I should know as I went through some very dark times just over 10 years ago.
However, to me, the younger generation (millennials / snowflakes) s*uffer for reasons that just don't make sen*se. Whether they are carrying a FEW extra pounds or aren't getting enough social media "likes" and* I struggle to have any sympathy for them*. How are they going to cope when REAL WORLD challenges start hitting them....paying the mortgage / rent, paying other bills, having to provide for a family, etc.

My story is that I was struggling with workloads and change at work. One day my boss called me into a meeting to express his dissatisfaction with my performance without asking why I was struggling. It was at this point I burst into tears - I was in my late 30's around the time. I simply said that I think that I'd better speak to my GP. Got an appointment within a couple of days and my GP advised me that I was suffering anxiety & depression.
Back then, there was very little talk, support or understanding of the mental issues.
I was put on meds (the first type made things worse) and ended up being off work for 4 months.

To this day I am still on the meds (reduced dose) and do have the occasional "moment", but on the whole am able to live a "normal" life.

I am very concerned that despite mental health getting more recognition, how the hell are the younger generation going to cope when they start facing "grown up" challenges?
		
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Isn't it dangerous though to say that one type of mental illness makes sense and another doesn't so we then make judgements on who deserves sympathy? Who is to judge what is a proper reason and what is not?  Is an issue not in the mind of the person so is personal to them, and what might seem as an anxiety inducing situation to one person may not be to another?  So the younger generation may react to certain things bring on stress in their minds (for example social media likes) where as they may not see other things such as workloads, that an older generation may feel is stress inducing and a grown up challenge, as particularly stressful?


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## PhilTheFragger (Aug 9, 2019)

I am the most â€œtogetherâ€ bloke I know, I always thought that anxiety and depression were a bit of a cop out, â€œyou arenâ€™t depressed, you are just a bit down, pull yourself togetherâ€ the thought of me suffering any sort of mental disorder was laughable.

Then

16 months ago I had a medical procedure go very badly wrong, I had to undergo hours of invasive treatment while awake or on ketamine, I saw stuff, I shouldnâ€™t have seen, huge amounts of blood etc , 3 operations, someone doing chest compressions while I was awake. 23 units of blood transfusions 

I very nearly didnâ€™t make it, 

After 6 days in Intensive care I went to a ward and in the wee small hours, the night terrors started, they came to get me, I was surrounded, they started to eat me and then I woke up.

I had woken up the entire ward, screaming and fighting the demons. I couldnâ€™t get back to sleep.

Had the same dream each night , no counselling available, went home same Dreams , got sleep deprived, saw the doc who put me on sleeping tablets. They helped but I couldnâ€™t get up in the morning, after 2 weeks went back to the doc, I was in real trouble, physically weak and mentally exhausted, I got an urgent psych assessment, they quickly diagnosed Post traumatic stress. Said that because I wasnâ€™t in danger of killing myself that I would have to wait 3 months for treatment and sent me a leaflet.

I was in despair, my sleep was medically induced and I was still having the same dream each night, the dreams were so real, vivid and terrible.

After 3 months I was a wreck,anxiety, depression and PTSD. but I got treatment had 6 sessions of CBT, then my councillor left and I got moved to someone else, so started again.

Anyway a different therapy started to work and gradually the nightmares subsided and after 6 months of treatment, I stopped the medication and have been free of the dreams for about 6 months.

Ok mine was trauma induced, but if it can happen to me, it can happen to anybody.

Iâ€™ve learnt that bottling stuff up is the worst thing, it plays on the mind, it is also good to talk, the problem is that people judge, often subconsciously without realising and people get scared to talk in case others react badly.

It is a real problem, it is vastly underfunded and the number of young people with these problems is scary.

But Iâ€™m all better now ðŸ‘


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## Blue in Munich (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			And I think it's a shame that your first thought goes to those you feel take advantage, rather then focus on the positive aspect of the strides being made or the effect such issues can have on people's lives. *It really doesn't effect you too much if you think a colleague is taking the odd sickie.*

It's like the benefit system. Yes, there's plenty of people abusing it. But the good it does to society far outweighs this.
		
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Does it not?  Our office has daily deadlines, work that has to be cleared.  When you have members of staff perpetually taking the proverbial, their works falls to the remainder of the office to deal with.  I don't have any issue with that when someone has a genuine health or welfare issue, but the mickey takers cause pressures on the remaining staff, meaning they will come in when they should be off to try and assist the remainder of the team then it does affect me when other members of staff abuse the system.


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## williamalex1 (Aug 9, 2019)

PhilTheFragger said:



			I am the most â€œtogetherâ€ bloke I know, I always thought that anxiety and depression were a bit of a cop out, â€œyou arenâ€™t depressed, you are just a bit down, pull yourself togetherâ€ the thought of me suffering any sort of mental disorder was laughable.

Then

16 months ago I had a medical procedure go very badly wrong, I had to undergo hours of invasive treatment while awake or on ketamine, I saw stuff, I shouldnâ€™t have seen, huge amounts of blood etc , 3 operations, someone doing chest compressions while I was awake. 23 units of blood transfusions

I very nearly didnâ€™t make it,

After 6 days in Intensive care I went to a ward and in the wee small hours, the night terrors started, they came to get me, I was surrounded, they started to eat me and then I woke up.

I had woken up the entire ward, screaming and fighting the demons. I couldnâ€™t get back to sleep.

Had the same dream each night , no counselling available, went home same Dreams , got sleep deprived, saw the doc who put me on sleeping tablets. They helped but I couldnâ€™t get up in the morning, after 2 weeks went back to the doc, I was in real trouble, physically weak and mentally exhausted, I got an urgent psych assessment, they quickly diagnosed Post traumatic stress. Said that because I wasnâ€™t in danger of killing myself that I would have to wait 3 months for treatment and sent me a leaflet.

I was in despair, my sleep was medically induced and I was still having the same dream each night, the dreams were so real, vivid and terrible.

After 3 months I was a wreck,anxiety, depression and PTSD. but I got treatment had 6 sessions of CBT, then my councillor left and I got moved to someone else, so started again.

Anyway a different therapy started to work and gradually the nightmares subsided and after 6 months of treatment, I stopped the medication and have been free of the dreams for about 6 months.

Ok mine was trauma induced, but if it can happen to me, it can happen to anybody.

Iâ€™ve learnt that bottling stuff up is the worst thing, it plays on the mind, it is also good to talk, the problem is that people judge, often subconsciously without realising and people get scared to talk in case others react badly.

It is a real problem, it is vastly underfunded and the number of young people with these problems is scary.

But Iâ€™m all better now ðŸ‘
		
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If giving out a few infractions will help , i'll take one or two  , well said Phill


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## Swinglowandslow (Aug 9, 2019)

TheDiablo said:



			And I think it's a shame that your first thought goes to those you feel take advantage, rather then focus on the positive aspect of the strides being made or the effect such issues can have on people's lives. It really doesn't effect you too much if you think a colleague is taking the odd sickie.

It's like the benefit system. Yes, there's plenty of people abusing it. But the good it does to society far outweighs this.
		
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Hmmm, until the plenty become the majority, and the general view becomes that you're a mug for working when you can do better pulling a few strokes etc.
Diablo may have had a too early thought on this than you feel comfortable with, but how many of us are concerned at your apparent readiness to tolerate too easily the sickie throwers and shirkers.?


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 9, 2019)

Dando said:



			I have been in a really horrible, dark, bad place for the past few weeks - almost like a train tunnel but with no light at the end of it and it just consumes you.

I have lost count of the number of times I have sat and cried - it happened at both the Forest Pines and Sunningdale meets so that makes me anxious and I try to avoid being around people which then makes me feel even worse as I don't want to come across as being unsocial.

walking my dog has given me space and time to switch off and chill (until the little fcuker runs off!).

In all honesty I'd rather have a physical impairment (being left handed doesn't count) as at least then people could tell what was wrong with me and I wouldn't be judged.

I am about to start different medication so it could be fun while I adjust to those!
		
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Speaking from someone who has suffered and been through CBT plus medication anytime you just need to chat just call out ðŸ‘


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## Tashyboy (Aug 9, 2019)

To the OP. Flippin eck where do you start and before I do, some fantastic personal responses on here and quite frankly the forum at its very very best.
That said, for me theres a massive differance between anxiety and mental health. For me anxiety/ stress is streets away from mental health which could border on dementia. But but aside from nit picking the OP must pour himself a drink for opening up to this and wanting to educate himself and others.
Which points to pick up on. When I was at the Pit. I kinda learned that no one suffers with stress or bad backs. Why? Because physically you cannot see them. Like Ori says re headaches. But the only people that sympathise with people who have had a bad back or stress is the very people that have had both/ either conditions.
Stress, anxiety etc. Bless any of you who have had it. I remember one day a good pal of mine had lost it. A grown man roaring his eyes out. It was heart breaking. His manager came in and said " I was the same one day, crying at the bottom of the garden talking to the fairies. Me dad said if I don't man up al crack you at the back of the head with this shovel. Tim, ( my pal ) needs cracking at the back of the head with a shovel". I could of knocked the twat out. I told my boss I wanted to knock him out as well. Six months later he was in my bosses office roaring his eyes out, he had a relapse of his own stress issues. I told my boss I will be back in five mins. She asked where I was going. I said " to find a shovel and smack the twat over the back of the head". I was joking and knew what he was going through but I was not a happy bunny. 
Bottom line is we are all differant, why do we act differently. Daughter went to a job last week as a copper. A guy had blown his brains out with a magnum 44. One of the other girls who attended had to go home. But others had to stay and deal with it. What makes us so differant. I don't know but, one thing I will say is if anyone is suffering with stress, anxiety etc etc.. As has been said TALK ABOUT IT. Talk talk talk. A problem shared is a problem halvd.


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## Kellfire (Aug 9, 2019)

Anxiety is absolutely a mental health issue and not to be taken lightly.


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## Dando (Aug 10, 2019)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Speaking from someone who has suffered and been through CBT plus medication anytime you just need to chat just call out ðŸ‘
		
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Thanks Phil, and also to the others who have said similar.

Despite the bickering and difference of opinion on some subjects there are some great people on this forum.


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## Blue in Munich (Aug 10, 2019)

Dando said:



			Thanks Phil, and also to the others who have said similar.

Despite the bickering and difference of opinion on some subjects *there are some great people on this forum*.
		
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Never forget that you are one of them James


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## anotherdouble (Aug 10, 2019)

Blue in Munich said:



			Never forget that you are one of them James 

Click to expand...

Donâ€™t forget he is a left hooker thoughðŸ¤«ðŸ‘ðŸ˜œðŸ¤£


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## Fish (Aug 10, 2019)

My depression, in reality, is this....

Itâ€™s pretending like nothing is wrong. 

Itâ€™s not anyone screaming for help, itâ€™s actually the person staying silent.

Itâ€™s the tears I cry without anyone knowing because I have no other way to express the overwhelming amount of emotions. 

Itâ€™s the plans canceled last minute because I canâ€™t seem to muster up the strength and energy to go do anything. 

Itâ€™s the two days off spent in bed instead of doing something fun because Iâ€™m too exhausted from pretending all week. 

Itâ€™s that dark cloud that hangs over my head and never seems to go away.

 It creeps up on me during the most unexpected times, so I sneak away and hide. 

It lurks and waits for something great to happen, just so it can ruin it and convince me itâ€™s actually something terrible.

 Itâ€™s the fear of happiness because I know that at some point, itâ€™s bound to fade away just like the memories. 

Itâ€™s faded memories and a cloudy mind, unable to recall important things that have occurred in my life. 

It is numbing and leaves me unable to function on the really bad days.

The truth is, Iâ€™m not happy with my lifeâ€¦ at all. 

Nothing inside of me wants to continue living a life riddled with anxiety and consumed by depression and trauma.

 I think about death on a regular basis, yet Iâ€™m not technically suicidal.

I have those few genuine moments in which my laugh or smile is real. 

But for the most part, even when Iâ€™m smiling or laughing, Iâ€™m actually breaking on the inside. 

Even when I try to have those moments of happiness and pureness, depression still lingers, reminding me that the sadness is greater. 

I wish I could just tell people that sometimes. 

I wish I didnâ€™t have to pretend and wear my mask.  

In all honesty, itâ€™s the most exhausting thing I have ever done. 

Iâ€™m so tired when I get home each day and itâ€™s not because of lack of sleep or working all day. Itâ€™s from pretending to be happy and bubbly all day long.

No one understands what itâ€™s like to be trapped in such darkness, with no way out and appear to be happy, the drugs donâ€™t always work in a positive way. 

No one understands how exhausting it is to put that mask on every single day. 

No one understands how badly I just want them to genuinely ask how Iâ€™m doing â€” and be ready to listen to me talk about sad I am, because sometimes, talking about it and sulking in it arenâ€™t always the same thing.

On the bright side, smiling depression has its benefits. 

Iâ€™m not the stereotypical depressed person that you see on the commercials for antidepressants. 

People normally have a positive view of me instead of judging me for constantly being sad. 

Very small margins keep me going, but the mask is becoming harder to wear everyday....


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## Liverpoolphil (Aug 10, 2019)

There is a lot of talk in the media about mental health and as someone has already said itâ€™s great that people like William and Harry are using their standing to highlight it 

One of my sporting heroâ€™s is Marcus Trescothick and over a decade ago he left an England tour due to mental health issues and it hurt his career but he wrote a brilliant autobiography about it all and i recommend it to anyone - it shows that his anxiety and mental health can hit anyone regardless of how great your life can seem on the outside


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## ScienceBoy (Aug 10, 2019)

I always quote CBT as being fantastic help. It gives you great tools to work with.

I know my triggers now and can avoid most situations, sadly wandered into one earlier this year that I am still dealing with! Will sort it soon but having children around diverts me away from sorting as it needs a good few hours work, itâ€™s only that last 10% but I am coping with it.

Back when I first got it in 2009 I also credit golf with helping me through the worst of it. It gave me something to focus on and work at, diverting my mind away.

Itâ€™s harder now I have children as I often have anxiety more about them than me.


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## pauljames87 (Aug 10, 2019)

Itâ€™s so hard to help people sometimes aswell

A very good friend of mine at work currently suffering. Heâ€™s signed off and in a very bad way

We all rallying round but he doesnâ€™t open up. 

Just been talking to one the managers who been put in charge of managing him coming to work just to get busy , she now knows everything from my side because Iâ€™m in contact with him personally as we go way back and his mum and wife always txt me about their concerns 

Iâ€™m hoping together we can get him back on track


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## PhilTheFragger (Aug 11, 2019)




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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Sep 5, 2019)

Mrs SiLH has just been assessed as suffering mild anxiety but severe depression.  The depression is having a terrible effect on her - and is very very real. Very dark place, and I am really struggling to know how to help and support - it seems that everything I do, say or don't say is wrong 

This has only really triggered in big time since we got back from travelling and she is now retired with nothing to do.  A nurse and mother since the age of 17 she has never had time or energy to develop interests, and without work....she feels that her life is pointless - but try telling her it's not or suggest what she might try and do - all wrong of course 

But I'll look back through this thread as I recall some thoughtful and caring advice.  The Very Ugly poem read top down really does hit the mark for her at the moment.  Bottom Up - I'd love her to read but don't know how I'd make that happen.


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## Dando (Sep 5, 2019)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Mrs SiLH has just been assessed as suffering mild anxiety but severe depression.  The depression is having a terrible effect on her - and is very very real. Very dark place, and I am really struggling to know how to help and support - it seems that everything I do, say or don't say is wrong 

This has only really triggered in big time since we got back from travelling and she is now retired with nothing to do.  A nurse and mother since the age of 17 she has never had time or energy to develop interests, and without work....she feels that her life is pointless - but try telling her it's not or suggest what she might try and do - all wrong of course 

But I'll look back through this thread as I recall some thoughtful and caring advice.  The Very Ugly poem read top down really does hit the mark for her at the moment.  Bottom Up - I'd love her to read.
		
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that's sad to hear. 

the dark place is a horrible place to be as it just consumes you and takes away your ability to ability to be rational so everything you do will be wrong in Mrs SILH's eyes - I used to blame Mrs D for everything when I was in my dark place.

all you can do is talk to her, listen to what she say's, support her and be there for her - it might not feel like your helping but it will.  

you can self refer to mind for counselling and that might help as she wont feel she is being judged by talking to a stranger.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Sep 5, 2019)

Dando said:



			that's sad to hear.

the dark place is a horrible place to be as it just consumes you and takes away your ability to ability to be rational so everything you do will be wrong in Mrs SILH's eyes - I used to blame Mrs D for everything when I was in my dark place.

all you can do is talk to her, listen to what she say's, support her and be there for her - it might not feel like your helping but it will.

you can self refer to mind for counselling and that might help as she wont feel she is being judged by talking to a stranger.
		
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Thankyou for your thoughtful words and support.  She has been speaking with NHS Talking Therapy counselling service and is gong to be referred for concentrated CBT (I think)...


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## Hobbit (Sep 5, 2019)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Mrs SiLH has just been assessed as suffering mild anxiety but severe depression.  The depression is having a terrible effect on her - and is very very real. Very dark place, and I am really struggling to know how to help and support - it seems that everything I do, say or don't say is wrong 

This has only really triggered in big time since we got back from travelling and she is now retired with nothing to do.  A nurse and mother since the age of 17 she has never had time or energy to develop interests, and without work....she feels that her life is pointless - but try telling her it's not or suggest what she might try and do - all wrong of course 

But I'll look back through this thread as I recall some thoughtful and caring advice.  The Very Ugly poem read top down really does hit the mark for her at the moment.  Bottom Up - I'd love her to read but don't know how I'd make that happen.
		
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If she's been assessed, and accepts that assessment, that's a huge step forward.

As a long time sufferer of PTSD I can recommend Cognitive Behaviour Therapy. The coping strategies that they will develop together can have a great, positive impact.

One suggestion, if you're having an argument, make sure its worth having, i.e. let her win if its trivial and only opinion based. She needs to feel she has some control of the drift in her life. Confronting it can make it worse.

As for retiring and being at a loose end. I know the feeling but, equally, I'd created a bucket list long before I retired - all the things I'd put off, like really getting into astronomy and astrophotography.

Good luck Hugh, and best wishes to your better half.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Sep 5, 2019)

Hobbit said:



			If she's been assessed, and accepts that assessment, that's a huge step forward.

As a long time sufferer of PTSD I can recommend Cognitive Behaviour Therapy. The coping strategies that they will develop together can have a great, positive impact.

One suggestion, if you're having an argument, make sure its worth having, i.e. let her win if its trivial and only opinion based. She needs to feel she has some control of the drift in her life. Confronting it can make it worse.

As for retiring and being at a loose end. I know the feeling but, equally, I'd created a bucket list long before I retired - all the things I'd put off, like really getting into astronomy and astrophotography.

Good luck Hugh, and best wishes to your better half.
		
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Many thanks Brian.  Her first year after retiring was filled with prep'ing for some Autumn hols - and planning for us travelling.  Then we went.  And now we are back - and I am back at work (though trying to wind down).  So for that first year she and we were busy and travelling to new and wonderful places.  Now........

Your suggestion about arguments is spot on.  We had one last night over me trying to find and failing to find her job description in a folder in our loft.  I couldn't understand and got hugely frustrated over why she wanted a specific few pieces of A4 paper that could almost be anywhere in the house, when she could easily get on-line a job description for her last job.  She was not interested and was angry with me for not looking further and telling her what she knew.  What she *didn't *tell me was that she and her boss had drafted a JD completely specific to her own role in the team.  I was frustrated and my voice was raised, and she got angry with me for not listening, shouting - and trying to control her needs...yes - quite...

And then this morning she mentioned it would have been with stuff she brought home when she had finished work - and it would be with a coloured stripy folder.  And with that new info I knew exactly where to find her JD.  And I did.

But the argument last night...


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## Piece (Sep 5, 2019)

This is a great thread that I missed as I was on holiday. It is certainly right to get these items out in the open and discuss.

I want to write something that will hopefully give a different and accurate perspective, something to consider that may help understanding or give you a new viewpoint. It will be mainly about anxiety, a topic I know inside out, having attended curative seminars and workshops, and lived and breathed the wrong and right treatments for 30+ years. Before I go any further, I am not a qualified physician or physiologist, just someone who has suffered and accumulated a large library of knowledge on anxiety.

First up, we have to be very clear on what the condition is to allow the right treatment. Mis-diagnosis and misunderstanding is a primary reason why sufferers continue to suffer. Depression, stress, anxiety and clinical depression are separate issues. Also, some of these are NOT mental illnesses. Clinical depression is a mental illness caused by a chemical imbalance, treatable by the right medication. Anxiety is the disorder of the emotion of fear, brought about by *your behaviour*, therefore it is a behavioural condition - this is important to understand. Depression is the opposite of anxiety; again it is behavioural condition, not a mental illness. Stress is a normal human reaction to pressure or focus. It is similar to anxiety, but different in that anxiety is abnormal or irrational thoughts on even trivial items. I firmly believe that depression and anxiety do not co-exist because they are opposite ends of the emotional spectrum - this will cause a stir and I know people will disagree. Anxious people are always on edge whereas depressed people aren't. It is like being happy and sad at the same time - it doesn't happen. You either have a form of anxiety or you have depression, not both. Anxious people feel sad and down, but that's not the same as depression. Get the right diagnosis and you have a chance at the right treatment.

Anxiety. The first step to curing anxiety is understanding what it. As I've said above, anxiety is the disorder of the fear emotion. Fear is normal and we need it to survive. Anxiety is not normal, noting the difference between stress and anxiety mentioned above. Anxiety is a learned condition, brought about by our behaviour and all our human senses. Who gets anxiety? Not all of us do, around 10-20% of the population. It is thought that those with a creative mind, minds that need constant stimulation and distraction, will suffer, in varying degrees.

There are quite a few forms of anxiety - PTSD, OCD, General Anxiety Disorder, PureO, Phobias, to name but a few. They are all related, can be mild or severe, but ALL have one thing in common in that they are all part of the anxiety family, caused by our behaviour, and therefore eminently treatment by a change in behaviour. When I say "behaviour", it is how we react and think, based on the human senses information given to one part of the brain, the amygdala. Anxiety sufferers' behaviour is irrational, particularly the thoughts we have. There's loads of risk assessment going on, usually on trivial, irrelevant and irrational things; also know at the "What Ifs". You give the subconscious mind irrational data, then it will respond with irrational symptoms. It is a self-perpetuating cycle: continue with this behaviour and the benchmark for anxiety rises and the brain looks for new ways to keep raising it. The cycle continues, until something breaks...panic attacks, crying, breakdown, etc. Just an aside =>Panic attacks. Did you know it is the body's way of eliminating high levels of adrenaline? It's a normal response if you have very high levels and are continuing to add to it with your anxiety condition. It is like the body wanting to do some physical exercise. Once you know this and you know that it CANNOT, in any way, harm you, despite being unpleasant, then it helps recovery.

So what's the treatment? Traditionally you go to the doctors and they diagnose a form of anxiety. You could then be prescribed some drugs. You could be sent on a counselling 6 sessions course. You may get a course of CBT. Even hypnosis. Some of these will help no doubt, provide temporary reassurance, but they will NOT cure fully and permanently. Looking at each one => [1] Medication is hit and miss, and often, make things worse when the dosage is increased or new drugs are changed. For some, they do provide stabilisation, reassurance and foundation to get better. As I've said though, anxiety is a behavioural condition, therefore medication can provide initial stability but not a cure. [2] Counselling. Talking about your problems and getting it out in the open is one thing. Continually talking about your anxiety in one-to-one sessions, only re-enforces your behaviour as an anxious person. Don't give it life! There really won't be one trigger that you need unearth when you were young or experienced that will suddenly be a light bulb moment and means you are cured. What happens after the session? You think about your anxiety - this is bad 'behaviour'. And then after the six sessions? You are own your own with no tools to cure. Back to square one. [3] CBT. Works on changing your conscious behaviour and thought processes. This does makes sense on the surface and will help some. However, CBT cannot alter subconscious behaviour, unless you consciously change your behaviour to alter what info goes to brain, via our senses. What I mean by this, as an example, is that when a dog runs out in the road, your subconscious takes over and either swerves the car or stops it; you don't think consciously, "there's a dog in the road, what do I do, not sure, shall I brake, stop, or what?". By this time, the dog is flat. Subconscious process here is a two-stager: see, then react. Crudely, CBT works on the principle of three stages: see, think, react. In summary, these three aforementioned treatments are geared to managing and relieving anxiety and not necessarily *curing* it.

What is the cure then? Simply put, it is understanding what anxiety is, why it happens and then *changing your behaviour* by using a set of anxiety 'life rules' that a non-sufferer does automatically. Life rules => There isn't a manual to walk - you learn it and it happens. Anxiety sufferers need to have this 'manual' to re-learn to become 'normal' again. Example of these life rules are: don't rely on medication; don't talk about your anxiety during recovery; bring in good structure to your daily life; give your brain new and interesting activities, plus others. The last two are essential. So many anxious people live sheltered lives, meaning that their brain is starved of stimulus that it needs and it looks internally and irrationally to feed on the 'junk food' info that it is currently getting. Like a non-anxious person, you want to think rational thoughts and not the continually negative "what if.." thoughts and you do this by changing behaviour and building what is called new neural pathways. Being clear, there isn't a magic pill to take that cures it. You have to put in the work to change your behaviour.

Why do I know the above works? I self-diagnosed myself with General Anxiety Disorder (GAD), mild PTSD and heavy Health Anxiety. Looking back I had this from when I was 10 or so. Developed PTSD when I was 29 after a traumatic incident and that fanned the fire of my GSAD and Health Anxiety. I went to my doctors years ago and went down the counselling route, medication, etc. etc. Revisit, repeat, etc. It didn't work and thought that was it. That was me and for life. It was only when I researched and researched that I came across a method that offered a cure and not just a treatment. This was a couple of year ago. Cut a long story sort, I did the (Linden) method and seminars; I am so much much better, have a far better understanding of anxiety and what it is, and importantly I'm pretty much cured. Occasionally, I do suffer mildly, but I know what it is and why it's occurred - bad behaviour, boredom, lack of structure and lack of stimulation!

Above is a brief and simplified walk-through. Details are missing and my explainers may not be great. It is designed to give people a different and more accurate viewpoint on anxiety, hopefully shedding some light and give you knowledge and power on a subject that is all too common, but one which can be cured and not just managed. Please ask me if you have any questions or want more info, and I can help where I can.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Sep 5, 2019)

Piece said:



			This is a great thread that I missed as I was on holiday. It is certainly right to get these items out in the open and discuss.

I want to write something that will hopefully give a different and accurate perspective, something to consider that may help understanding or give you a new viewpoint. It will be mainly about anxiety, a topic I know inside out, having attended curative seminars and workshops, and lived and breathed the wrong and right treatments for 30+ years. Before I go any further, I am not a qualified physician or physiologist, just someone who has suffered and accumulated a large library of knowledge on anxiety.
...

Above is a brief and simplified walk-through. Details are missing and my explainers may not be great. It is designed to give people a different and more accurate viewpoint on anxiety, hopefully shedding some light and give you knowledge and power on a subject that is all too common, but one which can be cured and not just managed. Please ask me if you have any questions or want more info, and I can help where I can.
		
Click to expand...

Great post Piece.  I myself have suffered pretty serious anxiety and panic attacks in the past - and your description of my thinking (washing machine head) is spot on - as is what you have said about sorting it - changing my way of thinking.  No point in just trying to not feel anxious.  Like telling an alcoholic that the way to stop drinking is, by will power, to not drink.

I have had to be taught and teach myself to identify my triggers and how I handle my thoughts - so what can I do; what is for me; what is none of my business; what can I do nothing about; what can I do today; what do I need to do today; what can wait for another day - and so on.  I have to keep my head as empty as I can of the rubbish of life the likes of which I used to carry around in my head - completely unnecessarily.  I see myself with a threshold to my anxieties - as I approach it fear will build up - over the littlest things - as I have too much in there; when I go over the threshold - panic attacks and all you describe.  It is not the size of the issue that would trigger me but everything else it was on top of.  I have changed my behaviour - I have changed my thinking.  A work in progress a day at a time.

But each and every day I have a different threshold and so I know I must keep my head as clear as possible and deal with things as they turn up - and get rid of as much as possible.  If I have a lot to do any one time I decide what one thing I will deal with today, and positively put the rest aside - for today.

And I recognise very much the difference between my anxiety and my wife's depression - her anxiety is mild - mainly over our son.  But that is as much general worry about him and it doesn't really bother her too much - she can cope OK with that,  But her assessment of severe depression rings true.  Very different feelings from those I felt 'back then' - and I am not sure that what I do to manage my anxiety will work for her depression - in fact I am pretty certain it won't, and even if it might I know that I am the wrong person to be working with her on it.

Many thanks again for sharing your thoughts


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## Mudball (Sep 19, 2020)

Wow... an old thread raises it head... could not be at a better time.

Both these subjects have been amplified x100 during lockdown.


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## PhilTheFragger (Sep 19, 2020)

Actually an old thread , regurgitated by a spammer, 
99% of resurrected threads are like this

However it is an important topic, so feel free to add to it 👍


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## Mudball (Sep 23, 2020)

This week I have hit a mental wall -
mostly work... last week, was down with fever et al. The whole lack of testing fiasco drove me up the wall. Luckily all negative. Was expecting a couple of deals but they got lost/deferred (due to Covid and Brexit related uncertainties)... so back to drawing board. I have a great team who pick each other up but somewhere in the back of my mind, I fear failure. 
So called up some of my old university mates and we all had a laugh. The great thing with old buddies is that we can be ourselves and laugh at ourselves and not judge. 
But I have an anxiety lurking at the back of my mind. Winter is coming


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## Tashyboy (Sep 23, 2020)

Mudball said:



			This week I have hit a mental wall -
mostly work... last week, was down with fever et al. The whole lack of testing fiasco drove me up the wall. Luckily all negative. Was expecting a couple of deals but they got lost/deferred (due to Covid and Brexit related uncertainties)... so back to drawing board. I have a great team who pick each other up but somewhere in the back of my mind, I fear failure.
So called up some of my old university mates and we all had a laugh. The great thing with old buddies is that we can be ourselves and laugh at ourselves and not judge.
But I have an anxiety lurking at the back of my mind. Winter is coming
		
Click to expand...

Had a lot of lads who “ fell off a cliff” when the pits shut. I know of two who got there mojo back playing golf with me, honest to god. It’s not good seeing your pals shedding tears on the course, not knowing what’s gonna happen to them. Then a minute later them hugging you and thanking you for listening. One of them is back to his old self and is living the dream.The other was living the dream until he started with Parkinson’s A couple of years ago.
One of the lads now laughs about his dark days. His description of his head going and sleeping rough in Nottingham for a couple of weeks “ the cheese fell off me cracker”.
working in the medical centre I kept it simple with the lads so they could understand. Everyone’s life is a plate, it will only only hold so much. Work out what is important on the plate. deal with that.The rest is not important, put It back on the plate at a later date.
Above all talk.


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## Mudball (Sep 24, 2020)




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## mamaliga (Nov 25, 2020)

This disturbing feeling often put me in a decadent state, as if I was falling from an airplane but without a parachute...


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## jim8flog (Nov 26, 2020)

Put simply I have enough personal experience of trauma through the years  to know if you are starting to suffer seek professional help.


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## BiMGuy (Nov 26, 2020)

Don't really talk about this much.
But. As the son of a northern builder in a vary working class family I was brought up very much in a men should be men, don't show emotion environment.

I had what is probably a typical attitude in that I thought anyone claiming to be suffering from stress and depression should cheer up and MtFU.
I worked in a reasonably stressful environment under pressure much of the time. Did a lot of study outside of work including starting an MSc.
I thrived under the pressure, I almost couldn't function normally without a deadline or multiple things going on at once. Playing golf I had to make every round competitive in some way. Even when playing on my own. 

Then over the space of about 7 months a series of unfortunate events occurred which I won't go into here. 

I found myself with increasingly less energy, sleeping was becoming patchy and my mood with the wife and kids, in fact pretty much everyone went down hill. I found myself angry at everyone and everything.

Sleep got worse to the point where I would wake up at 3 in the morning feeling anxious about something. Could be work, cutting the lawn, the guttering being blocked what might happen at the keds football at the weekend. It was a very strange experience for someone who had previously slept like a log.

This all spiraled out of control to the point where I could sit at work for 8 hours and do absolutely nothing. And then come home and sit on the sofa and do absolutely nothing. This then breeds mot anxiety and so on.

The odd thing about it, was I knew what was happening, I could see it almost as if it was happening to someone else.

I'd find myself not wanting to go to work. Then not wanting to go home.

Things finally came to a head one day at work. There had been some issues with a particular part of a project and some of the other team members and another manager were trying to pin it on a few people who were in no way responsible, but were seen as an easy target to throw under the bus. I ended up having a stand up argument about it in the office wich resulted in me walking out. And never going back.

Luckily I got out of having to work my substantial notice and started another job pretty quickly. 

But I still wasn't right and questions started being asked of my ability at the new place. And back into the downwards spiral I went. 

The wife finally 'convinced' me to go to the Docs. Which was more like a therapy session. And I was prescribed some medication. Which was great once it started working, but I felt like shit for two weeks. 

For about three months I felt great and things were getting back to normal. Had regular trips to the Docs and dosage for the pills was tweaked. Then I started to realise that unlike before the meds when I was angry and anxious. I wasn't actually feeling anything anymore. Not sad or happy or angry. Just nothing. 

At that point without telling anyone I went cold turkey on the meds after realising that I would have to manage this myself. That was a hard few weeks. 

Since then I've been largely pretty normal (for me anyway 😂) and can spot the triggers of the stress or anxiety starting again so I can deal try to with it. I've had ups and downs, especially during lockdown like most people. 

I know some will say just man up or cheer up. I've had the same opinion myself. But as people say, you can't always tell what's going on in a person's head or why they are feeling the way they do. 

So now I would always give the benifits of the doubt. But I will also call people out for being negative unnecessarily all the time as that attitude drags other people down. I try my best to look for the good and opportunity wherever possible. Even in tough times. 
Never waste a good crisis as they say. 

Sorry for the long rambling post. But I hope it helps some people understand.


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## IanM (Nov 26, 2020)

BiMGuy said:



			The wife finally 'convinced' me to go to the Docs. Which was more like a therapy session. And I was prescribed some medication. Which was great once it started working, but I felt like shit for two weeks.
		
Click to expand...

All of your post is familiar to me... and the bit I've copied is the key bit.   If you break your arm, no one will tell you to "pull yourself together!" You'd expect to go for an x-ray and get it fixed up.   At some point you know (hopefully) that this is a bit more than "feeling a bit peed off" and something more is needed.  If you lucky, you have someone close who convinces you of the requirement.  There are other treatments than pills too... but you have to get to the GP first.

I had serious suffering with this in 2009, and again in 2012... but pretty much ok since. (expect for the odd feeling!    It can be managed, over come, and even beaten, with the right action.


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## Dando (Nov 26, 2020)

I’ve always said that I’d rather have an arm or leg missing than have depression as at least people would see that I’ve got something wrong with me.
I’m really struggling at the moment as we’ve not been able to escape to our caravan and still can’t next week as it’s in a tier 3 area but there are plenty of people who are in a much worse place than me


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## Dando (Nov 26, 2020)




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## Mudball (Nov 26, 2020)

BiMGuy said:



			Don't really talk about this much.
But. As the son of a northern builder in a vary working class family I was brought up very much in a men should be men, don't show emotion environment.

I had what is probably a typical attitude in that I thought anyone claiming to be suffering from stress and depression should cheer up and MtFU.
I worked in a reasonably stressful environment under pressure much of the time. Did a lot of study outside of work including starting an MSc.
I thrived under the pressure, I almost couldn't function normally without a deadline or multiple things going on at once. Playing golf I had to make every round competitive in some way. Even when playing on my own.

Then over the space of about 7 months a series of unfortunate events occurred which I won't go into here.

I found myself with increasingly less energy, sleeping was becoming patchy and my mood with the wife and kids, in fact pretty much everyone went down hill. I found myself angry at everyone and everything.

Sleep got worse to the point where I would wake up at 3 in the morning feeling anxious about something. Could be work, cutting the lawn, the guttering being blocked what might happen at the keds football at the weekend. It was a very strange experience for someone who had previously slept like a log.

This all spiraled out of control to the point where I could sit at work for 8 hours and do absolutely nothing. And then come home and sit on the sofa and do absolutely nothing. This then breeds mot anxiety and so on.

The odd thing about it, was I knew what was happening, I could see it almost as if it was happening to someone else.

I'd find myself not wanting to go to work. Then not wanting to go home.

Things finally came to a head one day at work. There had been some issues with a particular part of a project and some of the other team members and another manager were trying to pin it on a few people who were in no way responsible, but were seen as an easy target to throw under the bus. I ended up having a stand up argument about it in the office wich resulted in me walking out. And never going back.

Luckily I got out of having to work my substantial notice and started another job pretty quickly.

But I still wasn't right and questions started being asked of my ability at the new place. And back into the downwards spiral I went.

The wife finally 'convinced' me to go to the Docs. Which was more like a therapy session. And I was prescribed some medication. Which was great once it started working, but I felt like shit for two weeks.

For about three months I felt great and things were getting back to normal. Had regular trips to the Docs and dosage for the pills was tweaked. Then I started to realise that unlike before the meds when I was angry and anxious. I wasn't actually feeling anything anymore. Not sad or happy or angry. Just nothing.

At that point without telling anyone I went cold turkey on the meds after realising that I would have to manage this myself. That was a hard few weeks.

Since then I've been largely pretty normal (for me anyway 😂) and can spot the triggers of the stress or anxiety starting again so I can deal try to with it. I've had ups and downs, especially during lockdown like most people.

I know some will say just man up or cheer up. I've had the same opinion myself. But as people say, you can't always tell what's going on in a person's head or why they are feeling the way they do.

So now I would always give the benifits of the doubt. But I will also call people out for being negative unnecessarily all the time as that attitude drags other people down. I try my best to look for the good and opportunity wherever possible. Even in tough times.
Never waste a good crisis as they say.

Sorry for the long rambling post. But I hope it helps some people understand.
		
Click to expand...



Tnx for sharing..  I think i get this in waves.   and this lockdown is making me walk on the edges.  The number of times i have woken up blank at 3am... and then not going back to sleep.  As i posted on another thread, i have stopped listening to the news now.  I used to be on the road travelling to europe every week.  Absolutely loved it - meeting clients, our teams, food, culture - even though i never saw a place. it was usually Airport-office- dinner/hotel- office- airport. we do a lot of work with Europe with london being our HQ.  This lockdown has meant that I havent seen the inside of a plane since Feb.  By next Feb it will be first time in 20 years i haven been in a plane.  

Lockdown has proved that man is a social animal.. unlike the millennials, i need real people to talk to.  Unfortunately, even after the vaccine, we will get hit by the Bre**t Bus. I am sure we will adapt, but that road to adapting just gives me jitters.  We did some redundancies at the start of the year, and i can see more coming next year as we move HQ to europe.  How does one sleep.

I spoke to a school Bursary administrator the other day. He says they have a rising tide of applications from existing parents who need support for the next financial year (rather than a permanent one).  Next year my son is moving to secondary school.  i would like to private, which we could work towards, but now i have second thoughts.  All that contributes to lack of sleep, anxiety.  

I dont think I am at a stage for pills, but i do feel like throwing a remote at the TV when i see a two faced lying politician (of any party)


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## Fade and Die (Nov 26, 2020)

Mudball said:



			Tnx for sharing..  I think i get this in waves.   and this lockdown is making me walk on the edges.  The number of times i have woken up blank at 3am... and then not going back to sleep.  As i posted on another thread, i have stopped listening to the news now.  I used to be on the road travelling to europe every week.  Absolutely loved it - meeting clients, our teams, food, culture - even though i never saw a place. it was usually Airport-office- dinner/hotel- office- airport. we do a lot of work with Europe with london being our HQ.  This lockdown has meant that I havent seen the inside of a plane since Feb.  By next Feb it will be first time in 20 years i haven been in a plane. 

*Lockdown has proved that man is a social animal.. unlike the millennials, i need real people to talk to*.  Unfortunately, even after the vaccine, we will get hit by the Bre**t Bus. I am sure we will adapt, but that road to adapting just gives me jitters.  We did some redundancies at the start of the year, and i can see more coming next year as we move HQ to europe.  How does one sleep.

I spoke to a school Bursary administrator the other day. He says they have a rising tide of applications from existing parents who need support for the next financial year (rather than a permanent one).  Next year my son is moving to secondary school.  i would like to private, which we could work towards, but now i have second thoughts.  All that contributes to lack of sleep, anxiety. 

I dont think I am at a stage for pills, but i do feel like throwing a remote at the TV when i see a two faced lying politician (of any party)
		
Click to expand...

Some real truth in the highlighted bit... Since my wife went into hospital 10 weeks ago with Liver failure (autoimmune not drink related) I've been spinning plates on poles! Work is really busy and we are not big enough for me to withdraw, My teenage kids, god bless them but they are pretty useless. (our fault I know) So its shopping and housework when I get home or all weekend, Friends and family forever wanting updates so I am constantly re-living all the stuff that is going on at the Hospital. Trying to put a brave face on when I speak to my wife or a Doctor. TBH I feel like I am being stretched to breaking point but I am very aware that my "family" has no safety net so I will just carry on. But getting back to your highlighted bit, what I wouldn't give to just go to the pub with my brother, drink half a dozen stellas and then go for a curry and not talk about anything serious...just a bit of Bar Stool preaching.


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## Hobbit (Nov 26, 2020)

Mudball said:



			Tnx for sharing..  I think i get this in waves.   and this lockdown is making me walk on the edges.  The number of times i have woken up blank at 3am... and then not going back to sleep.  As i posted on another thread, i have stopped listening to the news now.  I used to be on the road travelling to europe every week.  Absolutely loved it - meeting clients, our teams, food, culture - even though i never saw a place. it was usually Airport-office- dinner/hotel- office- airport. we do a lot of work with Europe with london being our HQ.  This lockdown has meant that I havent seen the inside of a plane since Feb.  By next Feb it will be first time in 20 years i haven been in a plane. 

Lockdown has proved that man is a social animal.. unlike the millennials, i need real people to talk to.  Unfortunately, even after the vaccine, we will get hit by the Bre**t Bus. I am sure we will adapt, but that road to adapting just gives me jitters.  We did some redundancies at the start of the year, and i can see more coming next year as we move HQ to europe.  How does one sleep.

I spoke to a school Bursary administrator the other day. He says they have a rising tide of applications from existing parents who need support for the next financial year (rather than a permanent one).  Next year my son is moving to secondary school.  i would like to private, which we could work towards, but now i have second thoughts.  All that contributes to lack of sleep, anxiety. 

I dont think I am at a stage for pills, but i do feel like throwing a remote at the TV when i see a two faced lying politician (of any party)
		
Click to expand...

I used to work with a Sales Director who, at times, used to get very frustrated with changing policies, especially when we got a new MD. Eventually, he went for counselling. One of the main things that he told me was don't get involved in big company issues. Whatever the staffing level is going to be won't be affected by what you think. Whatever new policies are being formulated you can't affect. Deal with what is yours. Don't give a second thought to things you can't affect because as you start second guessing them and making assumptions you will get further from the truth of what will happen and more wound up because of it. Leave big problems to the big people.

As for politicians on TV, switch it off. Seriously, switch it off or turn it over. I used to love Question Time. Mrs Hobbit has banned it, and I sleep better because of that.


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## Mudball (Nov 26, 2020)

Fade and Die said:



			Some real truth in the highlighted bit... Since my wife went into hospital 10 weeks ago with Liver failure (autoimmune not drink related) I've been spinning plates on poles! Work is really busy and we are not big enough for me to withdraw, My teenage kids, god bless them but they are pretty useless. (our fault I know) So its shopping and housework when I get home or all weekend, Friends and family forever wanting updates so I am constantly re-living all the stuff that is going on at the Hospital. Trying to put a brave face on when I speak to my wife or a Doctor. TBH I feel like I am being stretched to breaking point but I am very aware that my "family" has no safety net so I will just carry on. But getting back to your highlighted bit, *what I wouldn't give to just go to the pub with my brother, drink half a dozen stellas and then go for a curry and not talk about anything serious*...just a bit of Bar Stool preaching. 

Click to expand...

Before the latest fakedown, i went to the pub and curry with a couple of friends...  the first visit since March... absolutely brilliant night out.. we talked rubbish with no care in the world.   Got home and mrs asked 'what did you guys talked about'... she could not believe when i said 'nothing'... 




Hobbit said:



			I used to work with a Sales Director who, at times, used to get very frustrated with changing policies, especially when we got a new MD. Eventually, he went for counselling. One of the main things that he told me was don't get involved in big company issues. Whatever the staffing level is going to be won't be affected by what you think. Whatever new policies are being formulated you can't affect. Deal with what is yours. Don't give a second thought to things you can't affect because as you start second guessing them and making assumptions you will get further from the truth of what will happen and more wound up because of it. Leave big problems to the big people.

As for politicians on TV, switch it off. Seriously, switch it off or turn it over. I used to love Question Time. Mrs Hobbit has banned it, and I sleep better because of that.
		
Click to expand...

I agree with some of that... unfortunately, i do get involved in some of these issues - though there are always bigger issues out there.  
re the news... i agree, i switched off.... cant see buffoons shouting and changing policies every day.  I just work in PJs everyday, i order all my shopping.. i can go days without meeting a real person (other than family) and spend the day on Team/conference calls .. I could be working on the ISS space station without the spectacular views of the Earth..


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## Rooter (Nov 27, 2020)

Mudball said:



			Before the latest fakedown
		
Click to expand...

Its comments like that tell me that your opinions and conspiracy theories are not helping.


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## Kellfire (Nov 27, 2020)

Dando said:



View attachment 33729

Click to expand...

I used this service from the hospital room my girlfriend was dying in because I genuinely thought I might hurt myself when she died. 

It bought me the breathing space I needed to collect myself and reenergise myself to keep going. A brilliant service.


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## jim8flog (Nov 27, 2020)

BiMGuy said:



			The wife finally 'convinced' me to go to the Docs. Which was more like a therapy session. And I was prescribed some medication. Which was great once it started working, but I felt like shit for two weeks.

For about three months I felt great and things were getting back to normal. Had regular trips to the Docs and dosage for the pills was tweaked. Then I started to realise that unlike before the meds when I was angry and anxious. I wasn't actually feeling anything anymore. Not sad or happy or angry. Just nothing.

.
		
Click to expand...

That sounds like fluoxetine (Prozac , Sarafem) I saw it do the same for my wife. When I decided it was about time I took some meds I refused that as the med and had Doxepin instead. Easy to go on to and come off,   you still get the same shit first 2 weeks because all you want to do is sleep but for me that is major point. Sometimes I take it just to get my sleep back in to sensible pattern.


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## Mudball (Nov 27, 2020)

Rooter said:



			Its comments like that tell me that your opinions and conspiracy theories are not helping.
		
Click to expand...

no mate.. nothing to do with my theories... i am frustrated by the way we seem to be some many variations of the lockdown and so many covidiots and privilaged folks flouting it with no consequence.


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## Mudball (Nov 29, 2020)

What a day..  on Friday night, i thought i had enuf of the nonsense, so decided to take Sat off from whatever is going on...  

Had a lie in. Woke up when nipper crawled into the room with a book (dark material). He read it and i dozed off.   Woke up around 9:30am.. Made both of us breakfast. Potted around the house.  Put up new wifi mesh.. spent ages changing passwords and discovering new devices that are connect to the web.  Then we got some McD take aways for lunch. 

when the Mrs came home, told her not to talk to me about her patients or corona or what tier we are in. Then as a family we watched couple of episodes of Dark Material on iplayer.  Siesta.  Then potted around.  Spoke to old friends around the world on whatsapp.  A wee bit of Jura dram. Light dinner with the Mrs. 

Slept like a log last night.. 

Did not see the news, did not hyperventilate about things I cant fix. 
Moral of the story... staying away from the negativity, even for a day is good for your own sake.


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## ScienceBoy (Nov 29, 2020)

I’m really trying to get on top of my anxiety at the moment, it’s crippling me. Looking at talking therapies at the moment as a realistic option for just getting back to being myself.


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## Piece (Nov 29, 2020)

ScienceBoy said:



			I’m really trying to get on top of my anxiety at the moment, it’s crippling me. Looking at talking therapies at the moment as a realistic option for just getting back to being myself.
		
Click to expand...

If you are struggling with anxiety, suggest you look up The Linden Method. It will tell you all you need to know about anxiety and how you can cure it with the right plan and behaviour.


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## ScienceBoy (Nov 30, 2020)

Piece said:



			If you are struggling with anxiety, suggest you look up The Linden Method. It will tell you all you need to know about anxiety and how you can cure it with the right plan and behaviour.
		
Click to expand...

I’m pretty far on with my understanding, unfortunatly I am being the bottleneck, making that move to get help is one of the hardest bits. I have someone lined up and confirming this week, I’ve got to commit to it!


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## Tashyboy (Nov 30, 2020)

When I worked in the medical at the pit, two things that people never suffered with were bad backs and stress. You couldn’t see them so they were not there. But black your nail, coz it was a common injury and throbbed more, you got more sympathy.
The term “man up“ and “get on with it”. Was the normal treatment.
Some of the lads that suffered greatly with stress it was heart breaking. A lad who I knew from school days and helped me massively with bullying. 13 years after I left school I met him at the second pit I worked at. He was in the middle of a massive breakdown. His gaffer tipped him over edge and he was in my bosses office crying his eyes out. His gaffer came in and suggested he needed taking to the bottom of the garden and “ Twatting“ over the back of the head with a shovel to shake him out of it.
It is the closest I have ever come to losing my job by hitting someone.
Thankfully he came through his dark days by talking. He was at a stage where he had no Choice but to talk. But all cases where I have been involved with the lads who have suffered with stress and mental anxiety the common factor is to talk talk talk to someone.Strangely enough the gaffer who said me pal needs a shovel around the back of his head ended up on the same settee with the same boss crying his eyes out due to stress. God how I wanted to say to him” should I fetch a shovel.
Strange how some folk need different stimulation to recharge there batteries. 6 x Stella and a curry for some, grandkids for me and others. 
Stay safe everyone.


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## Piece (Nov 30, 2020)

ScienceBoy said:



			I’m pretty far on with my understanding, unfortunatly I am being the bottleneck, making that move to get help is one of the hardest bits. I have someone lined up and confirming this week, I’ve got to commit to it!
		
Click to expand...

If you haven't already, please my post 55 on this thread.

Changing your behaviour goes along way to curing anxiety. Simple as that. Start by getting the RIGHT help you deserve. Good luck.


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## aliceterme (Jun 22, 2021)

I can't even imagine how difficult it is for you right now. It's good that you spoke out on this forum. This is the right decision, you don't need to keep it to yourself. Try talking to a friend or see a psychologist.


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