# F1



## hors limite (Apr 8, 2018)

Have always been interested in motorsport but rather less interested in F1 in recent years.For example, the emphasis on the optimisation of pit stops, the artificial obligation to use different tyres and the domination of technology have all blunted my interest. It seems that the new owners are planning to make changes. What do you think that these should be?
Incidentally, it seems that a lot of circuits do not make overtaking easy. I only recently became aware that the present cars are wider than the widest Rolls Royce, could this be a factor?


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## chrisd (Apr 9, 2018)

I would have the drivers negotiating the price for a change of tyres when they arrive in the pits just like I do when the car fails an MOT on 2 front tyres. That'd add a bit more variation to the 5 second pit stop


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## MegaSteve (Apr 9, 2018)

I'd be looking at a major reduction of aero... Limiting the number of elements to front and rear wings and no barge boards for starters...


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## Orikoru (Apr 9, 2018)

I haven't watched it for absolutely years. Probably not since the days of Michael Schumacher. I remember it used to be the top six getting points - 10 for 1st, 6 for 2nd etc. Now it seems like everyone who finishes gets points, counting down from 25. Which seems silly to me. Surely increasing the number of places that get points is only going to decrease the motivation to try and overtake?

I think in Schumacher's time the best driver would have a good chance of winning, but from what I've seen of it now, it seems like whoever builds the best car wins it and the drivers are much of a muchness. Also it's very hard to get behind Lewis Hamilton when he seems like a complete and total prat.


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## USER1999 (Apr 9, 2018)

It does not really matter how wide the car is, as in reality there is only one racing line, with room for one car on it.

Reducing the aero package would help, as cars could be closer, without losing grip. Narrower tyres, and manual gear changes might help to. When did F1 steering wheels start to look like computer entry systems?


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## MegaSteve (Jul 7, 2018)

Lewis at his absolute best today...

Hopefully he can deliver tomorrow...
Think Seb is up for it also...

So, hoping for a great race...


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## Dellboy (Jul 8, 2018)

Building up to be a good race, both Vettel and Hamilton showing well yesterday, let's just hope Vettel has the edge later today and if Hamilton decides to put it into the gravel or into the tyre wall, then all the better.


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## bobmac (Jul 8, 2018)

So you don't want a Brit to win the British grand prix?
You must really hate Hamilton


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## Dellboy (Jul 8, 2018)

Can't stand him, always hoping for him to mess up, it's never his fault and someone else must be to blame, so I find it even funnier when the teams at fault and he loses points, poor little petal runs off and sulks on his own, brilliant :thup:


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## Captainron (Jul 8, 2018)

bobmac said:



			So you don't want a Brit to win the British grand prix?
You must really hate Hamilton
		
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Heck no! Hate Hamilton.


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## MegaSteve (Jul 8, 2018)

For balance...

I hate 'the finger' ...


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## Dellboy (Jul 8, 2018)

What a dream start for Vettel, fantastic to see Hamilton taken off on the first lap.


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## Captainron (Jul 8, 2018)

Hope this safety car doesnâ€™t mean a Hamilton gets a win :angry:


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## MegaSteve (Jul 8, 2018)

If not the result I wanted a top race...

Great drive from LH...
Not quite making top spot from being dead last after being taken out...


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## ger147 (Jul 8, 2018)

Great overtake from Vettel to win the race. Also a great drive from Hamilton to recover and limit the damage after getting taken off at the start.

Poor call from Mercedes not to pit Bottas for tyres under the 1st safety car.


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## SaintHacker (Jul 8, 2018)

Just back from Silverstone, normally stay sunday night but it was so hot I just wanted to come home. Best race I've seen in a long time, not sure the safety car helped Lewis, I think it gave Seb a free pitstop whereas had it not happened Lewis would have passed him when he came in later in the race, still a great drive from Lewis to go last to 2nd. Also some great racing in the support races, if you sometimes watch a bit of F1 have a look at the F2/GP3 races, its quite often better than the main event.
Right, I'm off to nurse my sunburn


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## MegaSteve (Jul 9, 2018)

Does anyone do a better post race interview than the 'Honey Badger'?
The bloke is a breath of fresh air...
Probably the best advert for F1...


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## Robster59 (Jul 9, 2018)

I just have lost total interest in F1.  They have pit stops as it is so difficult for cars to overtake if on equal tyres.  
On the reverse, I watched the MotoGP race at Assen last week.  If you haven't seen that race I strongly suggest you do.  The number of riders racing for the win, and the number of overtakes made for a truly breathtaking race.  
Unless Formula 1 actually gets back to racing rather than a tactical techno fest then I may consider watching it again.  But at the moment, no thanks.  I may watch the highlights but not the full race.


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## MegaSteve (Jul 9, 2018)

Robster59 said:



			I just have lost total interest in F1.  They have pit stops as it is so difficult for cars to overtake if on equal tyres.  
On the reverse, I watched the MotoGP race at Assen last week.  If you haven't seen that race I strongly suggest you do.  The number of riders racing for the win, and the number of overtakes made for a truly breathtaking race.  
Unless Formula 1 actually gets back to racing rather than a tactical techno fest then I may consider watching it again.  But at the moment, no thanks.  I may watch the highlights but not the full race.
		
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I totally agree the race at the cathedral of speed was a great spectacle...
However, the previous handful or so were borefests...


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## MegaSteve (Aug 5, 2018)

DannyRic to Renault who'd have thunked it?


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## Lincoln Quaker (Aug 5, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			DannyRic to Renault who'd have thunked it?
		
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Now that is a surprise, he must think Red Bull are going to be really pants with Honda engines next year.


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## ScienceBoy (Aug 5, 2018)

Formula E is where it is at.

It is where F1 needs to be close to in about 5-8 years time.


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## Bunkermagnet (Aug 5, 2018)

Lincoln Quaker said:



			Now that is a surprise, he must think Red Bull are going to be really pants with Honda engines next year.
		
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I seem to remeber reading that Adrian Newey was going to be cutting back his involvement and input into the team and car, Perhaps thats part of his thinking, along with not being Verstappens no2.


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## Cherry13 (Aug 5, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			DannyRic to Renault who'd have thunked it?
		
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Thought he may have been convinced to stay  and see at least 1 year with Honda, but looks like heâ€™s been spooked. Renault I imagine have made some pretty serious commitment to get him to sign. 

More importantly, hope force India can get sorted and get the support needed to see the season out.  Then I suspect an American group may come in for them.


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## Cherry13 (Aug 5, 2018)

Bunkermagnet said:



			I seem to remeber reading that Adrian Newey was going to be cutting back his involvement and input into the team and car, Perhaps thats part of his thinking, along with not being Verstappens no2.
		
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He already has, certainly on a week to week basis anyway. But you're correct in that it may be even further from next season too.  Although again the challenge of a new engine and new specs soon to come may keep his interest.


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## MegaSteve (Aug 6, 2018)

ScienceBoy said:



			Formula E is where it is at.

It is where F1 needs to be close to in about 5-8 years time.
		
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I would rather suggest Formula E would like to be where F1 is in 5-8 years time...


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## MegaSteve (Aug 6, 2018)

Bunkermagnet said:



			â€¦. along with not being Verstappens no2.
		
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Dr Helmut only seems to have enough love for one driver at a time...
And, currently, that's definitely Max...


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## MegaSteve (Aug 6, 2018)

Cherry13 said:



			More importantly, hope force India can get sorted and get the support needed to see the season out.  Then I suspect an American group may come in for them.
		
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Believe Stroll Snr is looking to buy the team and install son as a driver...

Oh to have had a rich Daddy...


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## SaintHacker (Aug 6, 2018)

ScienceBoy said:



			Formula E is where it is at.

It is where F1 needs to be close to in about 5-8 years time.
		
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What, 80mph and changing cars at a pitstop? OK. Formula E has its place but as the pinnacle of motorsport? No...


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## SaintHacker (Aug 6, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			Believe Stroll Snr is looking to buy the team and install son as a driver...

Oh to have had a rich Daddy...
		
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Possible. its reported that Sergio Perez triggered the teams administration so there's a good chance he won't be there next season, assuming there is a next season for them. I really hope there is, definitely the 'fan friendliest' team on the grid


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## Paperboy (Aug 6, 2018)

SaintHacker said:



			Possible. its reported that Sergio Perez triggered the teams administration so there's a good chance he won't be there next season, assuming there is a next season for them. I really hope there is, definitely the 'fan friendliest' team on the grid
		
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Apparently Force India asked him to do it so they could stay in business/racing. Read this on the BBC somewhere.


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## SaintHacker (Aug 6, 2018)

Yep, looks like he did it to save the workforce for the time being at least

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...n-administration-sergio-perez-explains-action


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## Beedee (Aug 6, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			DannyRic to Renault who'd have thunked it?
		
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On the bright side (for him anyway) at least he won't have to do any more shoey's after this season for a while


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## MegaSteve (Aug 6, 2018)

Beedee said:



			On the bright side (for him anyway) at least he won't have to do any more shoey's after this season for a while 

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Don't believe he was too fussed... 
But, I suspect those he expected to join him in the 'experience' will be mightily relieved...
Hopefully we'll get to see him on the top step after he's moved on...
Top bloke!


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## MegaSteve (Aug 14, 2018)

Fernando calls it a day...

Jeepers... Know he's got other ambitions but thought F1 was still his main interest...


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## ger147 (Aug 14, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			Fernando calls it a day...

Jeepers... Know he's got other ambitions but thought F1 was still his main interest...
		
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Bored driving round nowhere near the sharp end. Verstappen will be No.1 at Red Bull next year and no vacancies at Mercedes or Ferrari for him so no opportunity for him to get a competitive car in the near to medium term.

Totally understandable, assuming he already has an Indy Car contract lined up for next season which will be announced in due course.


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## ger147 (Sep 2, 2018)

Another quality drive from Hamilton today, deserves his win. Vettel and Verstappen melting as usual.


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## Foxholer (Sep 2, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Another quality drive from Hamilton today, deserves his win.
		
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Certaiinly agree with this.



ger147 said:



			Vettel and Verstappen melting as usual.
		
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But not this.

Mercedes had the benefit of 'Team' with Bottas to hold up Kimi, though I don't think he actually needed it - I think he would have passed Kimi eventually anyway with Kimi's tyre degredation.

Actually the best F1 race I've watched in quite some time!


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## MegaSteve (Sep 2, 2018)

After the borefest, at Spa, F1 was at it's best today...
Lewis laying down some strong markers for serious consideration for the GOAT...


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## MegaSteve (Sep 3, 2018)

Another Brit [Lando Norris] in F1 next year...
Second seat at McLaren...


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## Siren (Sep 3, 2018)

By far the best GP in recent memory

An incredible drive by Lewis and pure excitement from Vettel coming through the field.

Vettel will never give up an inch on the race track and its cost him one title so far and possibly this one as well. Even with four titles I do feel as though he hasnt lived up to the potential he showed with Sauber


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## bobmac (Sep 4, 2018)

Max V once again showing his arrogance and total disregard for the hundreds of people who work hard to give him the best car they can.
As D.C. said after the race, drivers come and go but the team comes first.
I'd sack him in a heartbeat


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## SaintHacker (Sep 4, 2018)

bobmac said:



			Max V once again showing his arrogance and total disregard for the hundreds of people who work hard to give him the best car they can.
As D.C. said after the race, drivers come and go but the team comes first.
I'd sack him in a heartbeat
		
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I said exactly the same to my lad while we were watching it. He needs bringing down a peg or 3, if I was in charge at RB he'd be finding himself driving a Toro Rosso again for a few races..


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## Crazyface (Sep 5, 2018)

Er, why is no one moaning on about there being no women drivers in F1. No women presenters in F1? No women camera men in F1? Don't hear anyone whining on about this. Yet everyone jumps in to defend them being in football. eh? eh?


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## SaintHacker (Sep 5, 2018)

Crazyface said:



			No women presenters in F1? ?
		
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Natalie Pinkham and Rachel Brookes not female enough for you?


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## Crazyface (Sep 5, 2018)

Awww, nuts. I don't follow it and am 9/10 down  a bottle of wine...... oh well tee hee


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 6, 2018)

Jenny Gow, and how can you forget Susie Wolf............


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## andycap (Sep 6, 2018)

Things are  finally looking better for Mclaren , every team Alonso has left have improved after he's gone . Ta da and good riddance to him . No team has ever prospered with him


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## ScienceBoy (Sep 6, 2018)

I think the rulebook needs to be re-written from scratch, massivly simplifying and removing contradictions.

It also needs to abandon the protection of the "old" teams and bring everyone back to stage one.

The thing it MUST retain, 100% is the drive for innovation, the most innovative team should win, not the highest spender.


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## ger147 (Sep 16, 2018)

Hamilton wins in Singapore, now 40 points clear of Vettel.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 16, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Hamilton wins in Singapore, now 40 points clear of Vettel.
		
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Great result for Lewis at a track Ferrari should've had the upper hand...
Max/Red Bull showing some decent form also...
Checo's turn to adopt petulant teenager mode today...


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## bobmac (Sep 17, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			Checo's turn to adopt petulant teenager mode today...
		
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I would put it more strongly than that, looked to me like he was trying to kill his team mate and Sirotkin

If I was team boss, Perez would be signing on the dole this morning.
Nutter


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## MegaSteve (Sep 17, 2018)

bobmac said:



			If I was team boss, Perez would be signing on the dole this morning.
		
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Unlikely to happen though...
As he brings many Peso's to the teams budget...


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## Bunkermagnet (Sep 17, 2018)

Thought Checo might have been black flagged after that deliberate steer into Sirotkin


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## Tashyboy (Sep 18, 2018)

Crazyface said:



			Er, why is no one moaning on about there being no women drivers in F1. No women presenters in F1? No women camera men in F1? Don't hear anyone whining on about this. Yet everyone jumps in to defend them being in football. eh? eh?
		
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The only reason I watched F1 was women, then they took them off the grid. 

Only jokingðŸ˜


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## SaintHacker (Sep 19, 2018)

Time they got rid of blue flags. If you're one of the best drivers in the world you should be able to get through traffic unaided, why should one of the slower cars compromise their race just to let a faster car through?


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## Beedee (Sep 19, 2018)

SaintHacker said:



			Time they got rid of blue flags. If you're one of the best drivers in the world you should be able to get through traffic unaided, why should one of the slower cars compromise their race just to let a faster car through?
		
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While I agree that it can be a bit annoying, just think how it would go with teams that have 2 teams - Red Bull/Torro Rosso and Ferrari/Sauber (I know that ones unofficial).  The leaders shouldn't have their race ruined by someone they're 3.5 miles ahead of, and isn't even part of their real competitor's team.


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## bobmac (Sep 30, 2018)

Assuming a clean start today, should Bottas allow Hamilton past given the length of his contract with Mercedes ?


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## LIG (Sep 30, 2018)

Unlikely that Hamilton will have the ability/speed differential to do the pass on his own.


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## LIG (Sep 30, 2018)

ScienceBoy said:



*I think the rulebook needs to be re-written from scratch, massivly simplifying and removing contradictions.*

It also needs to abandon the protection of the "old" teams and bring everyone back to stage one.

The thing it MUST retain, 100% is the drive for innovation, the most innovative team should win, not the highest spender.
		
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SaintHacker said:



*Time they got rid of blue flags. If you're one of the best drivers in the world you should be able to get through traffic unaided, why should one of the slower cars compromise their race just to let a faster car through?*

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Just ADD a rule that says a driver can have an ADJUSTABLE Aero package that makes the car easier to drive in turbulent air and skill-based overtaking could be back on the menu. The drivers are forever fiddling with settings on the steering wheel anyway so not much change/difference there!!!

SB - the trouble with innovation is that it is usually the highest spenders who make the innovations - R&D in manufacturing is a "bottomless pit" I've been told.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 30, 2018)

bobmac said:



			Assuming a clean start today, should Bottas allow Hamilton past given the length of his contract with Mercedes ?
		
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If a request to move aside is required...
Then I believe the team should be asking it...
After all, their main rival aren't afraid of asking Kimi the same...


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## bobmac (Sep 30, 2018)

The question was should Bottas let him through.
He said on yesterdays coverage he was there to win.


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## MegaSteve (Sep 30, 2018)

bobmac said:



			The question was should Bottas let him through.
He said on yesterdays coverage he was there to win.
		
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Not sure any sportsman [as part of a team] would/should let anyone through unless requested or planned...


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## Dellboy (Sep 30, 2018)

Should he let him through, no, but I bet he does as team orders will make it happen.


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## ger147 (Sep 30, 2018)

Bottas drives for Mercedes. I can guarantee if Hamilton doesn't get passed on his own and Bottas is asked to move aside he will let Hamilton get past. That will already have been discussed and agreed no matter what is said in public.

F1 has always been a team sport first.


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## bobmac (Sep 30, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Bottas drives for Mercedes. I can guarantee if Hamilton doesn't get passed on his own and Bottas is asked to move aside he will let Hamilton get past. That will already have been discussed and agreed no matter what is said in public.

F1 has always been a team sport first.
		
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There's always the exception


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## ger147 (Sep 30, 2018)

bobmac said:








There's always the exception
		
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Senna was the exception in his day, Verstappen reminds me of him from that point of view...


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## ger147 (Sep 30, 2018)

Another race and another win for Hamilton. Passed Vettel fair and square on the track and Mercedes doing the necessary to maximise the gap in the driver's championship.


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## bobmac (Sep 30, 2018)

Thanks for the spoiler alert


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## dewsweeper (Sep 30, 2018)

bobmac said:



			Thanks for the spoiler alert 

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Bob, bit daft to come on the F1 thread if you don't want to hear the result.


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## bobmac (Sep 30, 2018)

dewsweeper said:



			Bob, bit daft to come on the F1 thread if you don't want to hear the result.
		
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At 12.41 I didn't even know the race had started never mind finished.


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## MegaSteve (Oct 1, 2018)

bobmac said:



			There's always the exception
		
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Must be a Red Bull 'thing'...
Who can forget Multi 21...


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## Bunkermagnet (Oct 1, 2018)

bobmac said:



			At 12.41 I didn't even know the race had started never mind finished.
		
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The beauty of only having F1 on Sky.


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## Cherry13 (Oct 1, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Another race and another win for Hamilton. Passed Vettel fair and square on the track and Mercedes doing the necessary to maximise the gap in the driver's championship.
		
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Was a great pass by Hamilton, showing why many regard him as the much superior driver to Vettel. 

In terms of the switch by Merc, I think they ballsed it up in the pit sequence.  If Lewis had pitted lap before it would have been same time as Vettel and then his release could have been compromised due to gap.  So they didnâ€™t risk it but obviously got it wrong.


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## Bunkermagnet (Oct 2, 2018)

I fully understand the swap in places between LH and VB, and it makes total sense. At least he wasnâ€™t told to slow up on the finish straight to let him pass.


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## SaintHacker (Oct 2, 2018)

Not a fan of what happened but I can see the reasons why, Mercedes do seem to have a complete team ethic compared to some of the others who are two teams in one. I hope and expect Lewis to wrap the title up and then if there's any remaining races to play wingman to Valterri as payback for his selflessness this season.


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## ger147 (Oct 2, 2018)

SaintHacker said:



			Not a fan of what happened but I can see the reasons why, Mercedes do seem to have a complete team ethic compared to some of the others who are two teams in one. I hope and expect Lewis to wrap the title up and then if there's any remaining races to play wingman to Valterri as payback for his selflessness this season.
		
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Assuming Lewis goes on to wrap up the driver's championship, and after Mercedes have wrapped up the Constructor's title, the 2 drivers will then be free to race each other, but do NOT expect Lewis to hand over any victories just for the sake of it at the end of the season.  He's after Schumacher's win record as well as his 7 world titles record so he won't be giving away any wins to Bottas.


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## bobmac (Oct 2, 2018)

Well I finally watched the Max Verstappen  grand prix last night.
Can someone sack Ben Edwards please.
Either that or tell him that he's there to comment on TV not radio.
He doesn't have to tell us what has just happened, or repeat every radio transmission or tell us AGAIN how brilliant Max is and it's his birthday you know.
Birthday boy in fast car overtakes men in slower cars. Wow. I didn't see him overtake any men in fast cars.
Little mention of his team mate who did the same thing with a broken nose cone.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 2, 2018)

bobmac said:



			Well I finally watched the Max Verstappen  grand prix last night.
Can someone sack Ben Edwards please.
Either that or tell him that he's there to comment on TV not radio.
He doesn't have to tell us what has just happened, or repeat every radio transmission or tell us AGAIN how brilliant Max is and it's his birthday you know.
Birthday boy in fast car overtakes men in slower cars. Wow. I didn't see him overtake any men in fast cars.
Little mention of his team mate who did the same thing with a broken nose cone.
		
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You really have it in for Verstappen don't you.

His drive on Sunday was excellent and devoid of the silly mistakes that he has sometimes made in the past. 

It had as much to do with his racing ability as the performance of his car.


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## IanM (Oct 2, 2018)

My Mrs was a major F1 Fan..... I used to get dragged along to GPs.....not just in UK either.   Visually and socially a great day out....

She doesnt even bother watching on TV now... "not proper racing" she says... and therin lies the issue.


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## bobmac (Oct 2, 2018)

MetalMickie said:



*You really have it in for Verstappen don't you.*

His drive on Sunday was excellent and devoid of the silly mistakes that he has sometimes made in the past.

It had as much to do with his racing ability as the performance of his car.
		
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I admit he's not my cup of tea, ever since he refused to follow team orders in 2015, and nothing in his recent behaviour (including him ignoring yellow flags during practice this weekend) has convinced me to change my mind.

He's a spoilt brat who is getting paid millions to do what he loves doing and does nothing but winge.
No respect


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## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 2, 2018)

bobmac said:



			I admit he's not my cup of tea, ever since he refused to follow team orders in 2015, and nothing in his recent behaviour (including him ignoring yellow flags during practice this weekend) has convinced me to change my mind.

He's a spoilt brat who is getting paid millions to do what he loves doing and does nothing but winge.
No respect
		
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Red Bull only pay him those millions because of his ability not, unlike some, because he has "bought" the drive with sponsorship. 

I agree that he has, at times, displayed poor judgement but there's no doubting his ability as a racer.

I don't think there is a driver on the grid who hasn't made or continues to make similar errors of judgment.


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## Bunkermagnet (Oct 2, 2018)

MetalMickie said:



			Red Bull only pay him those millions because of his ability not, unlike some, because he has "bought" the drive with sponsorship.

I agree that he has, at times, displayed poor judgement but there's no doubting his ability as a racer.

I don't think there is a driver on the grid who hasn't made or continues to make similar errors of judgment.
		
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Theres no arguement that MV has talent, and bundles of it, but it's his petulance that irritates.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 2, 2018)

Bunkermagnet said:



			Theres no arguement that MV has talent, and bundles of it, but it's his petulance that irritates.
		
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I understand that but then the same could be said about Hamilton, Vettel, Alonso and others.

To be an F1 driver requires phenomenal levels of self belief, otherwise they wouldn't take the risks.

Sometimes that self belief manifests itself as arrogance but  as I said, that charge could be levelled at every driver on the grid.


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## MegaSteve (Oct 2, 2018)

Well, I thoroughly enjoyed watching Max's 'climb' through the field... 
Showed a great deal of maturity that's not been seen much of before from him...

Also, loved the determination to be seen from Lewis in getting past Seb...


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## ger147 (Oct 6, 2018)

Another great job by Mercedes and Hamilton in qualifying, a complete disaster for Ferrari and Vettel.


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## bobmac (Oct 6, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Another great job by Mercedes and Hamilton in qualifying, a complete disaster for Ferrari and Vettel.
		
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Nice try but I won't be fooled twice.
Welcome to my very short ignore list of one


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## ger147 (Oct 7, 2018)

Great drive by Hamilton, another 1-2 for Mercedes and a very poor day at the office for Vettel.

A 1-2 for Mercedes in Austin with Hamilton winning and Lewis is WC for  5th time.


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## Old Skier (Oct 7, 2018)

Once again Vettel escapes a penalty. Looks like officials in all sports suffer from inconsistency.


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## ger147 (Oct 7, 2018)

Old Skier said:



			Once again Vettel escapes a penalty. Looks like officials in all sports suffer from inconsistency.
		
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Yip, pretty much the same thing Verstappen got penalised for on Vettel but no penalty for Vettel this time.  But then he does drive for Ferrari...


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## ger147 (Oct 21, 2018)

Great drive from Kimi, thoroughly deserved his win. Hamilton will have to wait till next time to clinch his 5th WC.


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## MegaSteve (Oct 21, 2018)

Ferrari/Kimi got it perfectly right today ðŸ‘...


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## bobmac (Oct 22, 2018)

I think Ferrari must have a mole in the Mercedes strategy team......they couldn't have got it more wrong if they'd tried.
Nice to see Kimi win at last.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 22, 2018)

bobmac said:



			I think Ferrari must have a mole in the Mercedes strategy team......they couldn't have got it more wrong if they'd tried.
Nice to Kimi win at last.
		
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Whoever wins the Championship this year, Hamilton or Vettel, it won't be thanks to the strategists. 

Can't remember a season when the leading teams have made so many wrong calls.


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## ger147 (Oct 22, 2018)

Hamilton


MetalMickie said:



			Whoever wins the Championship this year, Hamilton or Vettel, it won't be thanks to the strategists.

Can't remember a season when the leading teams have made so many wrong calls.
		
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Hamilton will deffo win, 70 point lead with 3 races left.

On the wrong calls, I agree altho in defence of the teams, there is now hardy any tyre testing compared to what there used to be and they change the tyre compounds every year.  The tyres are so marginal these days that it's easy to get things slightly wrong that have a massive impact on the results.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Oct 22, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Hamilton


Hamilton will deffo win, 70 point lead with 3 races left.

On the wrong calls, I agree altho in defence of the teams, there is now hardy any tyre testing compared to what there used to be and they change the tyre compounds every year.  The tyres are so marginal these days that it's easy to get things slightly wrong that have a massive impact on the results.
		
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I agree about Hamilton winning,  just didn't want to tempt fate. 

As for the tyres from what I heard it sounds like it will again be a voyage into the unknown next season.


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## ger147 (Oct 22, 2018)

Compl


MetalMickie said:



			I agree about Hamilton winning,  just didn't want to tempt fate.

As for the tyres from what I heard it sounds like it will again be a voyage into the unknown next season.
		
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Yep, 3 new compounds for next season and with the ban on in season testing it's basically guesswork for the teams from race to race w.r.t. tyres.

Not like it was in Schumacher's day for example when a Ferrari F1 car was lapping Fiorano day in day out back at the factory.


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## ger147 (Oct 28, 2018)

Mercedes well beaten in Mexico today but 4th was enough for Hamilton to become a 5 time F1 world champion.


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## MegaSteve (Oct 30, 2018)

Mature drive from Max...
DannyRics 'luck' must change soon... Please!

Five times World Champion Lewis ðŸ‘...


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## Tashyboy (Nov 2, 2018)

My lad is telling me that F1 in a couple of years is going to Hanoi in Vietnam. It is a beautiful City in a beautiful country. However. Hanoi is not known for its quality of roads which tells me Mr Hamilton will either be racing in a Tut Tut or a tractor.


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## ger147 (Nov 2, 2018)

Tashyboy said:



			My lad is telling me that F1 in a couple of years is going to Hanoi in Vietnam. It is a beautiful City in a beautiful country. However. Hanoi is not known for its quality of roads which tells me Mr Hamilton will either be racing in a Tut Tut or a tractor.
		
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He'll still win...


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## jim8flog (Nov 2, 2018)

Tashyboy said:



			My lad is telling me that F1 in a couple of years is going to Hanoi in Vietnam. It is a beautiful City in a beautiful country. However. Hanoi is not known for its quality of roads which tells me Mr Hamilton will either be racing in a Tut Tut or a tractor.
		
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 I think Jeremy Clarkson suggested they have a racing track built.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Nov 2, 2018)

jim8flog said:



			I think Jeremy Clarkson suggested they have a racing track built.
		
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Does anybody still remember Jeremy Clarkson?


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## SaintHacker (Nov 11, 2018)

Congratulations Merc on another clean sweep. But the real talking point today was the Verstappen/Ocon incident. Lewis summed it up perfectly in the cool down room ' he had nothing to lose, you had everything'. Yes Ocon was a bit daft doing that but he was faster at the time and has every right to unlap himself. A better driver than Max would have given him room then got him back later, probably on the same lap. Max is just too hotheaded/petulant for his own good and until he learns to reign that in he will win nothing. As for the pushing match in the garage, I hope the FIA slap him with a ban that was completely out of order, as were Christian Horners comments about Ocon being lucky he got away with just a shove.


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## Reemul (Nov 11, 2018)

SaintHacker said:



			Congratulations Merc on another clean sweep. But the real talking point today was the Verstappen/Ocon incident. Lewis summed it up perfectly in the cool down room ' he had nothing to lose, you had everything'. Yes Ocon was a bit daft doing that but he was faster at the time and has every right to unlap himself. A better driver than Max would have given him room then got him back later, probably on the same lap. Max is just too hotheaded/petulant for his own good and until he learns to reign that in he will win nothing. As for the pushing match in the garage, I hope the FIA slap him with a ban that was completely out of order, as were Christian Horners comments about Ocon being lucky he got away with just a shove.
		
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You know i read a lot of rubbish on forums, this one is really a winner.

Lets reverse the roles, Hamilton is leading and needs a win for world championship and Ocon does the same. Yep Hamilton would be cool with it so would have Vettel if he would have needed a win to keep his hopes alive, nope because it's Verstappen people have this totally different attitude.. tunnel vision..

The reality is we had a nobody in 16th position, shoving his way up the inside of the race leader to gain zero race position, he would have still been 16th after doing it. I've watched F1 for the best part of 40 years and it's one of the most dickish moves I have seen in a long time.

It really was pathetic and while I can see Ocon and his boss backing him, why anyone else would is frankly unbelievable. Hence Ocon getting a 10 second stop and go (not even a drive through). We know Ocon has had issues with Verstappen going back to their early years and this definitely looked like Ocon getting his own back, i'd like to see him getting a race ban for the next one.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 11, 2018)

Reemul said:



			You know i read a lot of rubbish on forums, this one is really a winner.

Lets reverse the roles, Hamilton is leading and needs a win for world championship and Ocon does the same. Yep Hamilton would be cool with it so would have Vettel if he would have needed a win to keep his hopes alive, nope because it's Verstappen people have this totally different attitude.. tunnel vision..

The reality is we had a nobody in 16th position, shoving his way up the inside of the race leader to gain zero race position, he would have still been 16th after doing it. I've watched F1 for the best part of 40 years and it's one of the most dickish moves I have seen in a long time.

It really was pathetic and while I can see Ocon and his boss backing him, why anyone else would is frankly unbelievable. Hence Ocon getting a 10 second stop and go (not even a drive through). We know Ocon has had issues with Verstappen going back to their early years and this definitely looked like Ocon getting his own back, i'd like to see him getting a race ban for the next one.
		
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Good points but you'd expect the bosses to back Ocon. It was poor driving but I'd argue that Verstappen should have had the intelligence to be aware of the possibilities if he didn't yield.


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## User2021 (Nov 11, 2018)

Max shoving another driver for causing an accident - pot kettle.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 11, 2018)

jobr1850 said:



			Max shoving another driver for causing an accident - pot kettle.
		
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Understand the frustration as the race was there for him to win but having got involved in the incident to then act like that in the pit lane is unprofessional, petulant and poor. Plenty of other drivers have probably had the same feelings towards Verstappen over the years but never resorted to these sort of antics


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## ger147 (Nov 11, 2018)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Understand the frustration as the race was there for him to win but having got involved in the incident to then act like that in the pit lane is unprofessional, petulant and poor. Plenty of other drivers have probably had the same feelings towards Verstappen over the years but never resorted to these sort of antics
		
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Senna was an amateur boxer back in the day and Shuey also threw the odd punch or two.  A bit of pushing and shoving is very tame by comparison...


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## Smiffy (Nov 12, 2018)

Reemul said:



			You know i read a lot of rubbish on forums, this one is really a winner.

Lets reverse the roles, Hamilton is leading and needs a win for world championship and Ocon does the same. Yep Hamilton would be cool with it so would have Vettel if he would have needed a win to keep his hopes alive, nope because it's Verstappen people have this totally different attitude.. tunnel vision..

The reality is we had a nobody in 16th position, shoving his way up the inside of the race leader to gain zero race position, he would have still been 16th after doing it. I've watched F1 for the best part of 40 years and it's one of the most dickish moves I have seen in a long time.

It really was pathetic and while I can see Ocon and his boss backing him, why anyone else would is frankly unbelievable. Hence Ocon getting a 10 second stop and go (not even a drive through). We know Ocon has had issues with Verstappen going back to their early years and this definitely looked like Ocon getting his own back, i'd like to see him getting a race ban for the next one.
		
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Ocon didn't "shove it up the inside". He had overtaken Max (as he had every right to do) and Max turned in on him. Watch the replay.
Ocon was in the faster car at the time and had Max not done what he did, Ocon would have disappeared into the distance.
I like Max. But sometimes he's his own worst enemy.


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## bobmac (Nov 12, 2018)

Smiffy said:



			Ocon didn't "shove it up the inside". He had overtaken Max (as he had every right to do) and Max turned in on him. Watch the replay.
Ocon was in the faster car at the time and had Max not done what he did, Ocon would have disappeared into the distance.
I like Max. But sometimes he's his own worst enemy.
		
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Completely agree....except the ''I like Max'' bit.
If Max had given him a cars width, he would have won the grand prix

Arrogant, petty and now potentially violent if he doesn't get his own way ..........just like his dad.
What's worrying for me is he thinks he's always right and everyone else is wrong.


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## Imurg (Nov 12, 2018)

Only seen the clip on news reports - how far ahead was MV when this happened? Seems he'd only just got past LH...
Seems to me that he didn't need to get back in front of Oncon and could actually have to a bit of a tow if Oncon was a bit faster at the time.
He does come across as hot headed and of he can control that passion he's hitnthe makings of a world beater.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Well, a great race for me... Lots of drama and controversy with ample overtaking topped of with Samba girls... What more could we ask for?


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## Hobbit (Nov 12, 2018)

Verstappen got it wrong. But that isn't how the stewards see it. As race leader they felt he had right of way. But surely, Verstappen knew there was history between himself and Ocon and should have picked a better place to do his overtake. Verstappen was quicker than Hamilton, and he could have defended from Hamilton behind and picked a better place to overtake.

Yes, Ocon had better tyres, and was quicker in the bends because of that but Verstappen had by far the faster car in a straight line, hence why Ocon had been caught by Hamilton and Verstappen. Stupid by Ocon, and stupid by Verstappen.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Max will need to mature in the manner Lewis has or he'll be left in the wake of the next group of drivers coming through the ranks...


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

Hobbit said:



			Verstappen got it wrong. But that isn't how the stewards see it. As race leader they felt he had right of way. But surely, Verstappen knew there was history between himself and Ocon and should have picked a better place to do his overtake. Verstappen was quicker than Hamilton, and he could have defended from Hamilton behind and picked a better place to overtake.

Yes, Ocon had better tyres, and was quicker in the bends because of that but Verstappen had by far the faster car in a straight line, hence why Ocon had been caught by Hamilton and Verstappen. Stupid by Ocon, and stupid by Verstappen.
		
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Verstappen wasn't overtaking anyone, Ocon was the one attempting the overtake. He had just pitted for fresh tyres and was attempting to unlap himself by passing Max around the outside of T1. He never got in front of Max and was rightly punished by the stewards for slamming into the side of the Red Bull on the exit of T2. Ocon drove like a complete tool.

Max wasn't racing Ocon as he was a lap down so tbh should just have let him go. Not sure if his team warned him he was coming or not but Max also drove like a tool by slamming the door shut on the exit of T2 when it really wasn't necessary and cost himself his first ever F1 GP victory.


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## robinthehood (Nov 12, 2018)

? Who's first ever victory


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## Dibby (Nov 12, 2018)

To me, the Max incident comes down to being right and being in one piece.

I believe the rules require Ocon give Max the right of way as he was lapping, hence the steward's decision, however that doesn't mean Max should just assume Ocon will back out of his move.

It's the same as when you are crossing the road, as a pedestrian, you have right of way, but would you step in front of a moving car to assert that right?


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

robinthehood said:



			? Who's first ever victory
		
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Apologies, the word Brazilian is missing from my post above i.e. Max's 1st ever F1 Brazilian GP win...ðŸ™ˆðŸ™ˆðŸ™ˆ


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## Hobbit (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Verstappen wasn't overtaking anyone, Ocon was the one attempting the overtake. He had just pitted for fresh tyres and was attempting to unlap himself by passing Max around the outside of T1. He never got in front of Max and was rightly punished by the stewards for slamming into the side of the Red Bull on the exit of T2. Ocon drove like a complete tool.

Max wasn't racing Ocon as he was a lap down so tbh should just have let him go. Not sure if his team warned him he was coming or not but Max also drove like a tool by slamming the door shut on the exit of T2 when it really wasn't necessary and cost himself his first ever F1 GP victory.
		
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Ocon did get his nose in front of Verstappen as they were entering the bend, and the curve of the bend put Verstappen in front but, equally, only by half a car as Ocon had been. Verstappen turned into Ocon. Ocon would have had to go off the track to give Verstappen room. 6 of 1 and half a doz of the other. I don't disagree with the steward's ruling from the point of view of Verstappen "having the honour" because of race position. Both could have backed off till after the bend. Both stupid.


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## bobmac (Nov 12, 2018)

For anyone who missed it, here is what happened


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## Lord Tyrion (Nov 12, 2018)

I don't follow F1 but based on those pictures the pink car has been taken out by the fiery one.


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I don't follow F1 but based on those pictures the pink car has been taken out by the fiery one.
		
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The stewards got it spot on i.e. Ocon (the pink car) caused the collision.


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## Beezerk (Nov 12, 2018)

Lord Tyrion said:



			I don't follow F1 but based on those pictures the pink car has been taken out by the fiery one.
		
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Indeed, that's how I saw it live, Verstappen really cut across with an aggressive move, almost an arrogant "what the heck are you doing in my way" sort of move.


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## Beezerk (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			The stewards got it spot on i.e. Ocon (the pink car) caused the collision.
		
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So black car drives into pink car and it's pinks fault lol.
Had it been any other drivers bar the leaders they would have ruled it differently.


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

Beezerk said:



			So black car drives into pink car and it's pinks fault lol.
Had it been any other drivers bar the leaders they would have ruled it differently.
		
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The pink car drove into the blue car, the end...


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## Beezerk (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			The pink car drove into the blue car, the end...
		
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Obviously.


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## Lord Tyrion (Nov 12, 2018)

Mmmmm. Looking at those pictures, I didn't watch the race, the pink car is holding its line. The other car cuts into it. 

The pink car looks far enough up the inside for the other car to know it is there and for the other car to know the outcome of cutting across at that moment. Had the pink car been further back then it would be a different story.

I'm only going off those pictures.


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## bobmac (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			The pink car drove into the blue car, the end...
		
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In the top pic, Ocon is 2 feet from the white line
In the 2nd pic, Ocon's tyre is on the white line
In the 3rd pic, Ocon's tyre is 2 feet right of the white line

Ocon was moving to the right to try and avoid Max.


In the top pic, Max is 10 feet from the white line
In the 2nd pic, Max is 4 ft from the white line
In the 3rd pic Max's tyre is on the white line

How do you see Ocon driving into Max when he was moving right?


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## Dibby (Nov 12, 2018)

Instead of looking at pictures, which only show a single moment in time, watch the incident itself (and the aftermath).


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

bobmac said:



			In the top pic, Ocon is 2 feet from the white line
In the 2nd pic, Ocon's tyre is on the white line
In the 3rd pic, Ocon's tyre is 2 feet right of the white line

Ocon was moving to the right to try and avoid Max.


In the top pic, Max is 10 feet from the white line
In the 2nd pic, Max is 4 ft from the white line
In the 3rd pic Max's tyre is on the white line

How do you see Ocon driving into Max when he was moving right?
		
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My opinion concurs with that of the race stewards.  Here is their official statemet:

*Official verdict: *'The driver of Car 31 (Esteban Ocon) was a lapped car. The Stewards noted that he had new Super Soft tyres. Ocon attempted a pass on the leader, Car 33 (Max Verstappen) to un-lap himself at the outside of turn one.  The Stewards determined that he failed to complete the pass at turn one, and as a lapped car, fought the leader for track position, causing the collision at turn 2 with the race leader.'

Open and shut case...

Could Max have avoided the collision?  Of course he could have, as I pointed out above (see my earlier posts in the thread).  But he did not cause the collision, Ocon did.  Ocon was driving towards a space that was not going to be there when he arrived i.e. the apex of the corner.  Verstappen took the normal racing line thru turn 2 and Ocon drove into the side of Verstappen.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Did Estaban cause the collision?   Absolutely...
Could it have been avoided had Max been a bit more savvy? Absolutely...


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## bobmac (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			Could Max have avoided the collision?  Of course he could have, as I pointed out above (see my earlier posts in the thread).  But he did not cause the collision,* Ocon did*.
		
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So Max could have avoided the collision but chose not to. Ocon did try to avoid the collision by moving right but had nowhere to go.


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## ger147 (Nov 12, 2018)

bobmac said:



			So Max could have avoided the collision but chose not to. Ocon did try to avoid the collision by moving right but had nowhere to go.
		
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Ocon could also have avoided the collision by backing out of his failed overtaking manoeuvre but instead chose to drive into the side of Verstappen's car on the apex of T2, hence causing the collision and being correctly penalised by the stewards.  Verstappen could have avoided the collision by not fighting Ocon in T1 and allowing him to go past.  Both of them drove like a pair of eejits and arguably Verstappen was the bigger eejit as he had a lot more to lose, BUT Ocon could also have avoided causing the collision, he did have another option but chose to cause the collision rather than back off.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Testosterone tends to cloud good decision making...


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## User62651 (Nov 12, 2018)

From video and stills seemed to me like Ocon went for the pass on the earlier corner (not sure why when you've been lapped) nearly got by but Verstappen defended and got to the next corner slightly ahead but not far enough ahead to cut across Ocon like that. Not sure what Ocon could do other than slam the brakes to avoid a collision as he's nowhere to go, no room to evade on his right hand side. Was he supposed to concede position and drop back earlier, is that the correct etiquette?  - that's not really racing though.
Verstappen should have stayed wider imo to allow both cars some room on the bend, chose not to so paid for it with a needless loss.
Surprised the stewards penalised Ocon tbh, even if you're way back in a race you can still compete, no?

Would a conspiracy theorist suggest Hamilton/Mercedes had Ocon tapped up?


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## Reemul (Nov 12, 2018)

maxfli65 said:



			From video and stills seemed to me like Ocon went for the pass on the earlier corner (not sure why when you've been lapped) nearly got by but Verstappen defended and got to the next corner slightly ahead but not far enough ahead to cut across Ocon like that. Not sure what Ocon could do other than slam the brakes to avoid a collision as he's nowhere to go, no room to evade on his right hand side. Was he supposed to concede position and drop back earlier, is that the correct etiquette?  - that's not really racing though.
Verstappen should have stayed wider imo to allow both cars some room on the bend, chose not to so paid for it with a needless loss.
Surprised the stewards penalised Ocon tbh, even if you're way back in a race you can still compete, no?

Would a conspiracy theorist suggest Hamilton/Mercedes had Ocon tapped up?

Click to expand...

Bit it wasn't really racing, Ocon was 16th and Verstappen 1st and Ocon a lap down, even taking Verstappen he would have still been 16th. So no racing then really.


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## Imurg (Nov 12, 2018)

What happened to the blue flags ( think they were blue) that got saved at you when the leader was coming up behind you?
You had to move aside and let him through...doesn't that happen anymore?


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

One of the best things that happened for Lewis was the arrival of Niki Lauda who has helped greatly with his decision making skills... Unfortunately for Max there's no one with a similar skill set at RB...


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## Dibby (Nov 12, 2018)

Imurg said:



			What happened to the blue flags ( think they were blue) that got saved at you when the leader was coming up behind you?
You had to move aside and let him through...doesn't that happen anymore?
		
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Max hadn't just caught Ocon. Max had lapped Ocon a while earlier. Ocon pitted, got fresh tyres and was then at that time going faster than Max, so he caught him up, and then attempted to unlap himself. I doubt Ocon particularly cared about the battle with Max, or whether he was lapped, but was more interested in going fast and catching those he was racing for position with whilst he had fresh rubber on his car. Equally, Max was leading by such a margin that a slight hold up with lapped traffic was of no consequence. 

As I said before, technically Ocon was in the wrong, but Max had more to lose and less to gain.


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## Slime (Nov 12, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			Well, a great race for me... Lots of drama and controversy with ample overtaking topped of with Samba girls... *What more could we ask for?*

Click to expand...

Hamilton's car breaking down!
Oh, and I'd blame Verstappen for the accident, he clearly turned into a piece of track occupied by another car.
Drivers are allowed to unlap themselves, it's supposed to be a race.


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Slime said:



			Hamilton's car breaking down!
Oh, and I'd blame Verstappen for the accident, he clearly turned into a piece of track occupied by another car.
Drivers are allowed to unlap themselves, it's supposed to be a race.
		
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Well, Bottas has proven wholly inadequate in challenging Lewis using same kit... Just leaving breakdowns for non-believers to hope for ðŸ˜‰...


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## Slime (Nov 12, 2018)

MegaSteve said:



			Well, Bottas has proven wholly inadequate in challenging Lewis *using same kit*... Just leaving breakdowns for non-believers to hope for ðŸ˜‰...
		
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Are you sure?


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## Foxholer (Nov 12, 2018)

Dibby said:



			Max hadn't just caught Ocon. Max had lapped Ocon a while earlier. Ocon pitted, got fresh tyres and was then at that time going faster than Max, so he caught him up, and then attempted to unlap himself. I doubt Ocon particularly cared about the battle with Max, or whether he was lapped, but was more interested in going fast and catching those he was racing for position with whilst he had fresh rubber on his car. Equally, Max was leading by such a margin that a slight hold up with lapped traffic was of no consequence.

As I said before, technically Ocon was in the wrong, but Max had more to lose and less to gain.
		
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I'm inclined to think that the stewards figured Verstappen was penalised sufficiently by losing 1st for 2nd after a daft re-take maneuver (if he knew Ocon was 'such an idiot' he should have been a bit less agressive), while Ocon was a bit (if not more) of an idiot getting involved with the race leader as he did. But that's probably not the way F1 Drivers think!


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## MegaSteve (Nov 12, 2018)

Slime said:



			Are you sure?
		
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I believe Niki  insists on it...


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## Robster59 (Nov 12, 2018)

Winning is about making the right decisions at the right time. This season Vettel Haas been guilty of making bad decisions and in this instance so did Verstappen. A sensible choice would have been to let Ocon through. He was faster at that time and posed no threat to Verstappen. If Verstappen proved to be faster over the lap Ocon would have to let Verstappen through anyway. I admire Verstappen's skill as a driver but not his temperament or petulance.


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## HomerJSimpson (Nov 12, 2018)

ger147 said:



			My opinion concurs with that of the race stewards.  Here is their official statemet:

*Official verdict: *'The driver of Car 31 (Esteban Ocon) was a lapped car. The Stewards noted that he had new Super Soft tyres. Ocon attempted a pass on the leader, Car 33 (Max Verstappen) to un-lap himself at the outside of turn one.  The Stewards determined that he failed to complete the pass at turn one, and as a lapped car, fought the leader for track position, causing the collision at turn 2 with the race leader.'

Open and shut case...

Could Max have avoided the collision?  Of course he could have, as I pointed out above (see my earlier posts in the thread).  But he did not cause the collision, Ocon did.  Ocon was driving towards a space that was not going to be there when he arrived i.e. the apex of the corner.  Verstappen took the normal racing line thru turn 2 and Ocon drove into the side of Verstappen.
		
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Fairly clear explanation but it doesn't detract from the fact that Verstappen as a hugely experienced driver could easily have given Ocon more room and avoided contact at all which would have left him in prime position to go on and win.


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## robinthehood (Nov 15, 2018)

Still blaming Ocon?

https://streamable.com/fkpqj


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## Cherry13 (Nov 15, 2018)

robinthehood said:



			Still blaming Ocon?

https://streamable.com/fkpqj

Click to expand...

Both drivers got it wrong and unfortunately for max he suffered most. Firstly going into turn one max defends and moves over to the left, why he didnâ€™t let him then go at that point who knows.  He could have then towed behind to regain the lost time.  Max then makes the mistake of chopping across at turn 2, a move which was unnecessary and what caused the collision.

Ocon is well within his rights to unlap himself, something Lewis has done before. However he is not entitled to â€˜fightâ€™ for the position. The expectation is that you make one move, if it is unsuccessful you then back out. He clearly didnâ€™t do that as he fought into turn two. Maybe max knew this and hence why he cut across but I find it unlikely.

In the end itâ€™s come down to two inexperienced drivers bringing an old feud to the track.  Lewis made a point of telling max he should have backed out, but we all know no one would pull the same move on Lewis, certainly not Ocon.


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## robinthehood (Nov 16, 2018)

I think in the end verstappen has only himself to blame.


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## Slime (Nov 16, 2018)

robinthehood said:



			I think in the end verstappen has only himself to blame.
		
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Is correct, but I think we all know that deep down .................................. if we're totally honest.


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## Robster59 (Nov 20, 2018)

There's a very interesting five part article on Fernando Alonso on the BBC website. 
The F1 great who couldn't catch a break


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## Beedee (Nov 21, 2018)

The BBC article is interesting reading.  Doesn't come across as much of a team player - including the team of people that are building his car.

Never liked him after the 2003 Brazil GP when he ignored double waved yellows and had a big crash.  Don't care about him risking his own life, but double waved means there are probably marshals on the track.  And then the 2008 crashgate incident cemented my feelings.


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## andycap (Nov 21, 2018)

nearly every team he has been in has improved when he left , so things are looking up for Mclaren (i hope )


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## jim8flog (Nov 25, 2018)

Great comment from Alonso " I have 1800 points"  when his team asked him to try to gain 1 point with just 3 laps to go.


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## Cherry13 (Nov 25, 2018)

jim8flog said:



			Great comment from Alonso " I have 1800 points"  when his team asked him to try to gain 1 point with just 3 laps to go.
		
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Alonso is a great of the sport, and itâ€™s a shame heâ€™s not had the success his driving talent deserves. However I donâ€™t like the man; crashgate, spygate, Mclaren Honda, he just seems to drag teams down and never seems to be his fault. 

As for the races. Thank god that race is over, terrible circuit that should not be the season finale regardless of how much they pay.  What the commentators were going on about with regards to LH being at risk I donâ€™t know, but to my mind it never seemed in doubt.  We all know itâ€™s about track position and he was always going to end up back at the front for last 10/15 laps.  
The crash was pretty unlucky, shows how lucky MV was in Brazil as well. I think thatâ€™s the worst case scenario for the halo and Iâ€™d be surprised if it doesnâ€™t get looked at more closely, a burning f1 car with a driver â€˜trappedâ€™ is not good. Lucky it was the first lap so safety car was there and stewards bay was close by. Dread to think if that happened in spa. 

Another poor race by Bottas, he seems devoid of confidence. Ocon could be in with a shout half way through next season and it would be a good story if he did and went up against a resurgent red bull and max. 

Countdown on now until next season, hopefully the changes are a success, I doubt it will give people what they want but hopefully 3 competitive teams (maybe a 4th out of Renault/Mclaren) will provide excitement in the title race if not the individual races.


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## SammmeBee (Nov 25, 2018)

jim8flog said:



			Great comment from Alonso " I have 1800 points"  when his team asked him to try to gain 1 point with just 3 laps to go.
		
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And then it seemed he actually had 1899.....so 1 point would have made a difference!


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