# What would you do with Rooney?



## ColchesterFC (Jun 15, 2014)

Simple question. After the first England game, if you were Roy Hodgson, what would you do about Wayne Rooney? Play him or drop him?


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

Drop him


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## Piece (Jun 15, 2014)

We need mobility, pace and creativity in the number 10 role. Rooney's lost most of these years ago.

Incidentally, with Van Gaal at United now, RVP will be central so can't see where Roo will fit in. Perhaps be dropped, threaten to leave and then get another pay rise?


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

I think he has a place as a pivotal central striker. He still gets goals and *should* be able to play in others around him more effectively than last night. I don't think Hodgson can continue to play him wide. It didn't work. Striker or bust, and striker (just) wins...for the moment


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I think he has a place as a pivotal central striker. He still gets goals and *should* be able to play in others around him more effectively than last night. I don't think Hodgson can continue to play him wide. It didn't work. Striker or bust, and striker (just) wins...for the moment
		
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And drop Sturridge ?


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 15, 2014)

I'm really not sure, definitely not left or right. If he plays it has to be central. It isn't going to be in place of Sturridge so that leaves him or Sterling. Maybe swapping the pair of them might work? However, I would really love to see Barkley given a chance.

I'm glad I'm not Roy Hodgson 

I haven't voted yet as I really don't know.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

Just my opinion. I think in a more conventional position Rooney would have more goal scoring chances than last night (he should still have scored) and will play others in more effectively from a more familiar position


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Just my opinion. I think in a more conventional position Rooney would have more goal scoring chances than last night (he should still have scored) and will play others in more effectively from a more familiar position
		
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So that's a yes to dropping someone who has out scored Rooney over the last 12 months for both club and country ?


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Just my opinion. I think in a more conventional position Rooney would have more goal scoring chances than last night (he should still have scored) and will play others in more effectively from a more familiar position
		
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You can't drop Sterling or Sturridge, but you need Rooney central if he's gonna play


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## Liverbirdie (Jun 15, 2014)

Enter him in a Mr. Potatohead competition, at least we might win something then.


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			So that's a yes to dropping someone who has out scored Rooney over the last 12 months for both club and country ?
		
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Homer didn't say that, he was talking about Rooney notwithstanding other players


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			So that's a yes to dropping someone who has out scored Rooney over the last 12 months for both club and country ?
		
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Another thread which is imminently going to descend into a Liverpool bias. Doesn't have to be him that's dropped at all. It depends what Hodgson sees as the best side. I don't care who do what for whom over the season. I just want my country to do well. As I think this will go the way of other threads and to not risk any infractions, I've made my point and I'm out


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Homer didn't say that, he was talking about Rooney notwithstanding other players
		
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Hence why I asked for clarification.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Another thread which is imminently going to descend into a Liverpool bias. Doesn't have to be him that's dropped at all. It depends what Hodgson sees as the best side. I don't care who do what for whom over the season. I just want my country to do well. As I think this will go the way of other threads and to not risk any infractions, I've made my point and I'm out
		
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I just asked a question that's all ? 

It doesn't have to descend into anything for goodness sake


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Homer didn't say that, he was talking about Rooney notwithstanding other players
		
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In Phil's defence, I read it as though Homer was suggesting dropping Sturridge.


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Hence why I asked for clarification.
		
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You didn't, you were inferring something that simply wasn't there.

Im keen to keep you two sparring partners apart


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

I didn't say who to drop. I just said play Rooney in his familiar role and he'd be better at bringing the others around him in dangerous areas into the game. Others made that assumption


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I didn't say who to drop. I just said play Rooney in his familiar role and he'd be better at bringing the others around him in dangerous areas into the game
		
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And I asked drop Sturridge because it appears you are suggesting play him as the central striker which is where Sturridge is playing


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			You didn't, you were inferring something that simply wasn't there.

Im keen to keep you two sparring partners apart
		
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Suggesting to play Rooney in a central striker role 

England currently play one player in a central striker role - Sturridge 

So hence why I asked the question - Drop Sturridge ? 

And it appears I'm not the only one who thought the same 

There was no issue no descending into anything no need for anything ?I asked a simple question


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

Not prepared to argue further. Given my opinion. It's possible Sturridge could play alongside. I'm not saying who should or shouldn't play. No guarantee Hodgson will play Rooney at all. Said my piece but still you keep chipping away. I'm trying to follower Phil's suggestion and step away so please accept my point and don't ask me to verify anymore. I understand you see it differently and I'll leave it at that and leave you to it now


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I think he has a place as a pivotal central striker. He still gets goals and *should* be able to play in others around him more effectively than last night. I don't think Hodgson can continue to play him wide. It didn't work. Striker or bust, and striker (just) wins...for the moment
		
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Liverpoolphil said:



			And drop Sturridge ?
		
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HomerJSimpson said:



			Just my opinion. I think in a more conventional position Rooney would have more goal scoring chances than last night (he should still have scored) and will play others in more effectively from a more familiar position
		
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Liverpoolphil said:



			So that's a yes to dropping someone who has out scored Rooney over the last 12 months for both club and country ?
		
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If you read the four posts in order, it reads to me like Homer was suggesting that he would drop Sturridge. That is certainly how I read it and so can see why Phil read it that way as well.

Anyhow, shall we just put this down as a misunderstanding and get back on topic rather than trying to psychoanalyse every post :thup:


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Suggesting to play Rooney in a central striker role 

England currently play one player in a central striker role - Sturridge 

So hence why I asked the question - Drop Sturridge ? 

And it appears I'm not the only one who thought the same 

There was no issue no descending into anything no need for anything ?I asked a simple question
		
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Just doing my job keeping the peace, I'm with Homer on this one, you are inferring things he didn't actually say.
You two have a bit of history and have both had warnings , so just trying to prevent any escalation before it happens


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			If you read the four posts in order, it reads to me like Homer was suggesting that he would drop Sturridge. That is certainly how I read it and so can see why Phil read it that way as well.

Anyhow, shall we just put this down as a misunderstanding and get back on topic rather than trying to psychoanalyse every post :thup:
		
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Just glad I'm not seeing things 

Think Hodgson will do the easy thing 

Put Sterling out wide then bring Rooney in behind Sturridge


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Just doing my job keeping the peace, I'm with Homer on this one, you are inferring things he didn't actually say.
You two have a bit of history and have both had warnings , so just trying to prevent any escalation before it happens
		
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Please read Hawkeyes timeline of posts to see how clear it is. 

It's only got like this because of the reaction of homer to a simple question.


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## Papas1982 (Jun 15, 2014)

So would 



Liverpoolphil said:



			So that's a yes to dropping someone who has out scored Rooney over the last 12 months for both club and country ?
		
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I presume you'd be happy for rooney to replace sterling the hole then, been as he's assisted and scored more goals this season then?

fwiw, I'd drop rooney. I think his best performance is cf, I'd start sturridge and give him an hour. If he's not scored sub him. Bit of competition isn't a bad thing.


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## PhilTheFragger (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Please read Hawkeyes timeline of posts to see how clear it is. 

It's only got like this because of the reaction of homer to a simple question.
		
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Others would argue that it is your inability to accept that another member might have a different point of view that dares interfere with yours.

Let's move on


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

Papas1982 said:



			So would 

I presume you'd be happy for rooney to replace sterling the hole then, been as he's assisted and scored more goals this season then?

fwiw, I'd drop rooney. I think his best performance is cf, I'd start sturridge and give him an hour. If he's not scored sub him. Bit of competition isn't a bad thing.
		
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If Rooney is to play he needs to be in the centre - Sturridge has to play because as a goalscorer ( Central striker role ) then he is the form guy , Sterling also has to play because he is the form player but Sterling can play wide so Rooney can go in the centre 

But I would drop Rooney and bring in Lallana.


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## Papas1982 (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			If Rooney is to play he needs to be in the centre - Sturridge has to play because as a goalscorer ( Central striker role ) then he is the form guy , Sterling also has to play because he is the form player but Sterling can play wide so Rooney can go in the centre 

But I would drop Rooney and bring in Lallana.
		
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I've said already on other posts that I think the same as you've just stated there re line up.


 But I do feel there is a bit of a myth about rooneys form. Sterling was supeb last night. No question and did have a very good season. But he still scored less and assisted less in a far superior team last year with similar game time. 


Sturridge of course scored more so deserves the striker postion, but it think rooney gets a bad press, as will sterling and Barkley in 10 years as it's the way we are as supporters in this country.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Others would argue that it is your inability to accept that another member might have a different point of view that dares interfere with yours.

Let's move on
		
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PtF, I know LP has a reputation for being a little argumentative, but in this case I think you are being unfair. Anyhow, as you say, let's move on.


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## DCB (Jun 15, 2014)

Play Rooney at no9,  have him run and hustle and harry for 60 mins at full tilt. That should bring a goal or two. Take him off after 60min and bring on fresh legs.

Rooney on the rampage is just too much for many a defender to handle. You've got to use him and play to his strengths.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Others would argue that it is your inability to accept that another member might have a different point of view that dares interfere with yours.

Let's move on
		
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I'm sorry but believe you are being extremely unfair in this case.

But will,move on


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## Foxholer (Jun 15, 2014)

As a neutral, I'd say...

The thread asks 'What would you do with Rooney' nothing more or less - about how that would be accomplished! 

So Phil, you are out of order suggesting anyone would have to be dropped to allow that to happen, as that's not what it's about - yet!

As it happens, I agree with Phil's suggested role!


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 15, 2014)

Foxholer said:



			As a neutral, I'd say...

The thread asks 'What would you do with Rooney' nothing more or less - about how that would be accomplished! 

So Phil, you are out of order suggesting anyone would have to be dropped to allow that to happen, as that's not what it's about - yet!

As it happens, I agree with Phil's suggested role!
		
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As i said and just asked the question 

One of the options is to play as a central striker - Woy plays with one at the moment - Sturridge , so if Rooney is to play as a central striker does that mean Sturridge is then relegated to the bench ?


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## LanDog (Jun 15, 2014)

Another neutral here but I think that Rooney would be best deployed as a number 9 by himself, it's the position that he arguably had his best season with United and his physicality means he is more suited to deal with the likes of Godin or other physical defenders.

As for Sturridge, I would play him on the right, coming inside where I think he is very dangerous.

He'll be given a lot more freedom there and can run at defences rather than playing with his back to them


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## Slime (Jun 15, 2014)

This is better than The US Open    !


*Slime*.

P.S. I'd have Rooney at the top with Sturridge just behind & running off him.
Welbeck & Sterling out wide, but swapping at regular intervals, maybe even with Sturridge for a few minutes at a time ................. that'd keep the defenders on thier toes!
The power & pace up there should keep things interesting.


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## Liverbirdie (Jun 15, 2014)

You could have an Ox on the right, doubt Roy would play him there again though after his performance last night.


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## Andy808 (Jun 15, 2014)

This is outstanding entertainment.


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## peterlav (Jun 15, 2014)

Imo, Rooney should be dropped, but won't be. For years the England manager has ducked dropping big name players, Shilton, Beckham, Lampard immediately spring to mind.
When Rooney burst onto the scene, a smile would spread across your face whenever he picked up the ball, you knew something was going to happen (similar to Barkley and Sterling now), very direct, quick, strong and fearless. I cannot remember the last time I saw him collect the ball and drive at a defence and beat a man.
Honestly think he is in a similar position to Michael Owen, burst onto International scene at 18, going to be a World Beater, but unfortunately, by the age of 24/25 his best days were behind him


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## SocketRocket (Jun 15, 2014)

Rooney is not capable of playing intelligent football.   Drop him as he's overrated!


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## Siren (Jun 15, 2014)

I dont know why your even bothering to argue, lets be honest youll be out Thursday night and the world will be a better place


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

Down but not mathematically out should we lose.


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## ColchesterFC (Jun 15, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Down but not mathematically out should we lose.
		
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That would depend on the other result. If Italy and Costa Rica draw and England lost then we would be out.


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## Foxholer (Jun 15, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			As i said and just asked the question 

One of the options is to play as a central striker - Woy plays with one at the moment - Sturridge , so if Rooney is to play as a central striker does that mean Sturridge is then relegated to the bench ?
		
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No. This!



Liverpoolphil said:



			..
Think Hodgson will do the easy thing 

Put Sterling out wide then bring Rooney in behind Sturridge
		
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Liverpoolphil said:



			If Rooney is to play he needs to be in the centre - Sturridge has to play because as a goalscorer ( Central striker role ) then he is the form guy , Sterling also has to play because he is the form player but Sterling can play wide so Rooney can go in the centre
		
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Wouldn't be surprised to see him sub-ed though, either shortly after half-time or after 60-65 - for Lallana


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 15, 2014)

ColchesterFC said:



			That would depend on the other result. If Italy and Costa Rica draw and England lost then we would be out.
		
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Good point well made but was pinning my hopes on an Italian win. I take your point though


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## chrisd (Jun 16, 2014)

I'd leave Rooney out and  play Lallana


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

I'd play him as the main striker to get the best out of him.


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## Andy808 (Jun 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			I'd play him as the main striker to get the best out of him.
		
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Why because of his almost legendary world cup scoring record?


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## Slab (Jun 16, 2014)

God leave him in please, put him in goal even just keep him in 

I can see the young portion of this team being a pretty lethal combination in 2-3 years with a real push for 2016 and the longer it takes for England to become a force in football the better!









Edit: is it just me that's really really bored now with the bickering on the forum, it does the protagonists no favours


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## Crazyface (Jun 16, 2014)

DCB said:



			Play Rooney at no9,  have him run and hustle and harry for 60 mins at full tilt. That should bring a goal or two. Take him off after 60min and bring on fresh legs.

Rooney on the rampage is just too much for many a defender to handle. You've got to use him and play to his strengths.
		
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THIS. Just tell him to go out and play football like a kid in the playground for as long as he can. When he runs out of steam, bring on Stirling to run at a tiring defence that will surely give up penalties by sticking out a tired leg that he can fall over


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

If Rooney gets dropped then who's going to take our corners?


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## sawtooth (Jun 16, 2014)

I cant understand the anti-Rooney vibe he is still a great player and is always capable of producing a bit of magic. 

Actually I thought he did OK against Italy, popped up with a pin point cross that led to the goal. OK he scuffed his shot later on but he will produce if left in the team.


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## Slime (Jun 16, 2014)

sawtooth said:



*I cant understand the anti-Rooney vibe* he is still a great player and is always capable of producing a bit of magic. 

Actually I thought he did OK against Italy, popped up with a pin point cross that led to the goal. OK he scuffed his shot later on but he will produce if left in the team.
		
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Sssshhhh, don't tell anyone, but I think a lot of it is because he plays for Man Utd .................... although no-one will admit that!


*Slime*.


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## Birchy (Jun 16, 2014)

Rooney looked old against Italy. Barkley when he came on was like a firecracker bombing all over the place like Rooney used to be.

I would either drop Rooney for Barkley or play Rooney behind Sturridge and put Sterling wide as he is fast enough to cause trouble from anywhere.

I suspect Roy will stick with same team though.

In an effort to stay balanced I think Gerrard was poor against Italy too. Gave the ball away far too easily at times imo.


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Slime said:



			Sssshhhh, don't tell anyone, but I think a lot of it is because he plays for Man Utd .................... although no-one will admit that!


*Slime*.
		
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I can't speak for anyone else but whatever club any player plays for has no significance when it comes to the national team.


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## Slab (Jun 16, 2014)

Birchy said:



			Rooney looked old against Italy. Barkley when he came on was like a firecracker bombing all over the place like Rooney used to be.

I would either drop Rooney for Barkley or play Rooney behind Sturridge and put Sterling wide as he is fast enough to cause trouble from anywhere.

I suspect Roy will stick with same team though.
*
In an effort to stay balanced I think Gerrard was poor against Italy too. Gave the ball away far too easily at times imo*.
		
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Agree with this, everyone can have a below par game but he (& Rooney) might be there more for their experience and past endeavors rather than current ability when compared to the rising crop of players


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 16, 2014)

Slime said:



			Sssshhhh, don't tell anyone, but I think a lot of it is because he plays for Man Utd .................... although no-one will admit that!


*Slime*.
		
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Has zero to do with him playing for man Utd and more about him performances for England in major tournaments


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## Rooter (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			I can't speak for anyone else but whatever club any player plays for has no significance when it comes to the national team.
		
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what he said!


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			I can't speak for anyone else but whatever club any player plays for has no significance when it comes to the national team.
		
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Agreed :thup:


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## DCB (Jun 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Has zero to do with him playing for man Utd and more about him performances for England in major tournaments
		
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You could actually make a list as long as my arm of players who fall into that category. Too many under perform on the big stage.

Forget the forward line, it's the defence that should be seriously questioned and re jigged for the next game. Balotelli won't get an easier goal at this level than the one he got on Saturday.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 16, 2014)

DCB said:



			You could actually make a list as long as my arm of players who fall into that category. Too many under perform on the big stage.

Forget the forward line, it's the defence that should be seriously questioned and re jigged for the next game. Balotelli won't get an easier goal at this level than the one he got on Saturday.
		
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Certainly can 

The problem with the back line though - would you pick Jones and Smalling in there ? Without Terry or even Lescott the options at CB are very limited


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## One Planer (Jun 16, 2014)

Tough call with Rooney.

Capable of sheer brilliance, but also abject crap.

He knows he has a poor record in big tournaments and, I feel, he's trying too hard rather than just letting his game flow.

Personally, I'd bench him (... And Welbeck) and try something a little different.


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Certainly can 

The problem with the back line though - would you pick Jones and Smalling in there ? Without Terry or even Lescott the options at CB are very limited
		
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Don't forget right back. That's where we're weakest at the back


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			Don't forget right back. That's where we're weakest at the back
		
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Most certainly - but again would you put Jones and Smalling at right back ?


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## chrisd (Jun 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Certainly can 

The problem with the back line though - would you pick Jones and Smalling in there ? Without Terry*OR EVEN LESCOTT*the options at CB are very limited
		
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Aggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh ! no no no no!


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Most certainly - but again would you put Jones and Smalling at right back ?
		
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That like asking if you'd prefer kicked or punched in the face


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

Hodgson is quoted as saying...

"We want him in the area more," said Hodgson, whose side face Uruguay on Thursday in their second Group D game. "There is no question we will get him in the box."

Which clearly means he plays on Thursday but you can't get him in the box more when he's on the left so he must be tinkering with the lineup. I can only think this means Sterling and Rooney swap positions but we'll see


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Loads of Man U fans saying his best seasons are when he's played as a centre forward and not as a no. 10.


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## adam6177 (Jun 16, 2014)

I think Rooney has no right to be in the first team, he should be dropped.  Historically he disappears in big games against big teams and it was the case again on Saturday night.  

If he's as world class as people believe he is then he should be able to play slightly out of position for 90 minutes.


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## pokerjoke (Jun 16, 2014)

sawtooth said:



			I cant understand the anti-Rooney vibe he is still a great player and is always capable of producing a bit of magic. 

Actually I thought he did OK against Italy, popped up with a pin point cross that led to the goal. OK he scuffed his shot later on but he will produce if left in the team.
		
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Very well said.
Hes a threat going forward and he is a striker who scores goals.
Rooneys not a left midfielder or left back and he should never be asked to help
out the fullback.
I think Roy will probably start with the same team.
However I would bring in Barkley for Henderson and leave Gerrard as the holding player.


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## adam6177 (Jun 16, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			and he should never be asked to help
out the fullback.
		
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No I in team.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

adam6177 said:



			I think Rooney has no right to be in the first team, he should be dropped.  Historically he disappears in big games against big teams and it was the case again on Saturday night.  

If he's as world class as people believe he is then *he should be able to play slightly out of position for 90 minutes*.
		
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He did, and setup the goal. He's not and never has been world class, but is still very good.


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## Liverbirdie (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			I can't speak for anyone else but whatever club any player plays for has no significance when it comes to the national team.
		
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We'll only know if a mackem plays for them, it may be some time before we can test your theory...


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

adam6177 said:



			No I in team.
		
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No but if you look closely there is a 'me'


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## richart (Jun 16, 2014)

Good to see that no one has voted to play him out wide. Proves Roy is not on the forum.


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## Stuart_C (Jun 16, 2014)

Its a shame Hodgson is reverting to type and accommadating  a player in a side just because of the players reputation.

Personally, drop Sturridge and play Rooney up front.

I'd also drop Welbeck.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

Do we also drop Baines & Gerrard?? 
Both were far from impressive against Italy.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Do we also drop Baines & Gerrard?? 
Both were far from impressive against Italy.
		
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Baines was exposed due to Rooneys inability to help out on the left

And Gerrard should have come off when he was tiring.


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## c1973 (Jun 16, 2014)

It's a tough call for your manager. I think it could be a physical contest against Uruguay and Rooney might handle that better than others. 

Without a doubt Rooney is better as an out and out striker, the problem is he isn't the best one you have at the moment going by form, but he's the bigger name and that may sway any decision.  If the gaffer benches Rooney and you flop against Uruguay he gets slaughtered, and if he shifts the front line around to accommodate him and he doesn't perform........well, he gets slaughtered. 

Personally I think Rooney is a very good player, but his best days (I believe) are behind him, he isn't world class imo and hasn't performed on the biggest stage at international level. 
I'd be using him off the bench with 20 - 30 minutes to go, if the pace and flowing football evident against Italy isn't working, stick him on and use him as a battering ram against a tired defence.


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## Marshy77 (Jun 16, 2014)

I'd play 442 with Rooney and Sturridge up top. Sterling and Welbeck outwide, drifting in when needed and Henderson and Gerrard sitting. Back 5 as it is and put if needed Barkley and Lambert from half time onwards if we need them.

Rooney set up the goal which is what he was out there to do, ok he didn't have a decent game but I didn't think he had a shocker either, didn't think any England player played poorly.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

Surely we should be starting with players who are fit enough to last longer than 60mins


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## AmandaJR (Jun 16, 2014)

I think it's time to rest him! He's a good player...not world class imo but a decent international standard player. If we assume his number 1 position is as a central striker then he has to be dropped as Sturridge is playing much better. I don't think Rooney is good enough to be played out of position wide. Playing just behind Sturridge is an option and if it's not working sub in Barkley or ideally start with him and leave Wayne on the bench.

I think Rooney tries to hard in World Cup games and have thought before he just needs a goal to relax and settle but it's not happening so time to try something/someone new.

I was also surprised at the amount of players tiring and getting cramp. The temperature and humidity wasn't as bad as feared so how come they couldn't last 90 mins...


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## Rooter (Jun 16, 2014)

What would i do with Rooney?

Wash and hoover my car
Mow the lawn
clear the garage and take junk to the tip


thats about it, wouldn't trust him to look after my kids while i golfed, and wouldn't trust him not to get knocked out by Mrs Rooter if he tried any funny business.

As for football? nah, he should take a Kagawa role for the next match.


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## Fish (Jun 16, 2014)

Drop him


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## DanFST (Jun 16, 2014)

Have him playing behind Sturridge. Had a decent game despite the miss.


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## bladeplayer (Jun 16, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Baines was exposed due to Rooneys inability to help out on the left

.
		
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Exactly even if they played Milner on the left it would free up Bainseys attacking abilities , i think England shot themselves in foot and have restricted Baines doing what he does best 


Liverpoolphil said:



			Certainly can 

The problem with the back line though - would you pick Jones and Smalling in there ? Without Terry or even Lescott the options at CB are very limited
		
Click to expand...

I would have Lescott miles before them 2 , id have him back at goodison in a heartbeat aswell as he is on a free


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 16, 2014)

Always easier to see what a player doesn't do than what he does - so play him in his preferred position - then judge him.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

It really doesn't matter who or where we play them,as soon as we meet the Germans were out. Very good team.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			It really doesn't matter who or where we play them,as soon as we meet the Germans were out. Very good team.
		
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That's the spirit!


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			That's the spirit!
		
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:rofl::rofl:
Sorry mate


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## Andy808 (Jun 16, 2014)

Stuart_C said:



			Its a shame Hodgson is reverting to type and accommadating  a player in a side just because of the players reputation.

Personally, drop Sturridge and play Rooney up front.

I'd also drop Welbeck.
		
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Really?
Rooney has ONE goal in world cup finals from 9 or 10 games whereas Sturridge has ONE goal in world cup finals from ONE game. 
Great plan, lets have to guy who can't hit a barn door that the horses have left open for the guy who's already matched his all time record.


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			It really doesn't matter who or where we play them,as soon as we meet the Germans were out. Very good team.
		
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Never surprises me when people champion the latest high scoring team. They've only played one game. Bet you said the same thing about the dutch as well?


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			Never surprises me when people champion the latest high scoring team. They've only played one game. Bet you said the same thing about the dutch as well?
		
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It was a bit of a tongue in cheek comment tbh. 
& no I didn't say it after the Dutch game.


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## richy (Jun 16, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			It was a bit of a tongue in cheek comment tbh. 
& no I didn't say it after the Dutch game.
		
Click to expand...

OK I'll let you off


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			OK I'll let you off 

Click to expand...

Cheers


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## Tashyboy (Jun 16, 2014)

Whatever Roy does with him playing him on the left wing is not the answer for England, Rooney or anyone come to that matter. For Rooney to be an impact he has to be played in his best position and if Roy thinks that there is someone else better for that position then keep the bench warm shriek.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



			Whatever Roy does with him playing him on the left wing is not the answer for England, Rooney or anyone come to that matter. For Rooney to be an impact he has to be played in his best position and if Roy thinks that there is someone else better for that position then keep the bench warm shriek.
		
Click to expand...

Hodgson isn't going to drop Rooney


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## Tashyboy (Jun 16, 2014)

If he does and it's a massive if, then as a team we will kick on. Strange thing is that if we can get out of the group then we could do well in the comp. I think the team could get stronger. But not with shrek playing.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 16, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



			If he does and it's a massive if, then as a team we will kick on. Strange thing is that if we can get out of the group then we could do well in the comp. I think the team could get stronger. But not with shrek playing.
		
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I agree that if we do get out of the group we will get better and better. However I don't think Rooney will get dropped, certainly not for the Uruguay game. Maybe the Costa Rica game when I think we'll need to improve goal difference and need speed and guile upfront


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## G_Mulligan (Jun 16, 2014)

richy said:



			Never surprises me when people champion the latest high scoring team. They've only played one game. Bet you said the same thing about the dutch as well?
		
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The Germans did not need to put 4 past Portugal for people to champion them, just look at their team! They are probably the best all round team on paper with quality in every position including the bench.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 16, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



			If he does and it's a massive if, then as a team we will kick on. Strange thing is that if we can get out of the group then we could do well in the comp. I think the team could get stronger. But not with shrek playing.
		
Click to expand...

Hodgson has already said we will be looking to get him in the box more, he isn't getting dropped.


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## Tashyboy (Jun 16, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Hodgson has already said we will be looking to get him in the box more, he isn't getting dropped.
		
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Well I would like to know how that's going to happen when hes stuck out wide left, and even when he did get in the box it was like watching Torres in an England shirt.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



			Well I would like to know how that's going to happen when hes stuck out wide left, and even when he did get in the box it was like watching Torres in an England shirt.
		
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Of course it was


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## Hobbit (Jun 17, 2014)

Sturridge and Rooney together, with Sterling playing down the right. Maybe make Welbeck the waterboy.


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## bobmac (Jun 17, 2014)

Considering he earns Â£42,857 a day...EVERY DAY, I doubt he gives a monkeys what anyone thinks.
(Plus what he earns playing for England)


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## Beezerk (Jun 17, 2014)

Gary Neville sounded quite bullish about Rooney in an interview I've just seen. He won't be getting dropped at all, they wouldn't dare.


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## Tashyboy (Jun 17, 2014)

bobmac said:



			Considering he earns Â£42,857 a day...EVERY DAY, I doubt he gives a monkeys what anyone thinks.
(Plus what he earns playing for England)
		
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And that has just ruined my day


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## Fish (Jun 17, 2014)

bobmac said:



			Considering he earns Â£42,857 a day...EVERY DAY, I doubt he gives a monkeys what anyone thinks.
(Plus what he earns playing for England)
		
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They don't get paid (wages) playing for their country.


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## bobmac (Jun 17, 2014)

Fish said:



			They don't get paid (wages) playing for their country.
		
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They used to....as far back as 2012
Â£1500 for a win
Â£1000 far a draw
Â£750 for losing


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 17, 2014)

bobmac said:



			They used to....as far back as 2012
Â£1500 for a win
Â£1000 far a draw
Â£750 for losing
		
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So that's why Woy got the job - cheaper payouts


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## Birchy (Jun 17, 2014)

Ive been thinking about this over last couple of days and for me Rooney HAS to play. I would play him behind Sturridge where Sterling played against Italy. Rooney is still a big threat and our best player whether people like it or not.

Too many rose tinters out there for me. Sterling had a decent game against Italy but lets be honest where was the end product? He never created that killer pass or had a shot on target IIRC. Rooney played like a dog according to most yet he laid on a plate our goal for Sturridge and still got into the position to have a great chance even though he missed it.

If we had a chance one on one with the keeper on Thursday to win the game who would you want on the end of it in our squad? It would be Rooney every time for me as he is still our best and most clinical player.

I think most peoples dislike for him as a person is clouding their judgement.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 17, 2014)

Just seen Gary Neville talking Rooney up and so I think he'll be in, probably in the central role. As for Sturridge and Sterling, I think it isn't a bad thing to have them wider. Get the ball to their feet and isolate a full back or centre half and they'll kill them for speed, draw a foul, ideally in the box and get the balls in. It sounds like the perfect plan to deal with the Uruguay back four.


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## Rooter (Jun 17, 2014)

Andy808 said:



			Rooney has ONE goal in world cup finals from 9 or 10 games
		
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Sorry dude, i think you will find Rooney has scored the same amount of world cup goals as me!


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

While we're all having a go at Rooney, it might be interesting for people to note the following...

*Ronaldo World Cup Record*
Appearances: 11
Goals: 2 (1 penalty against Iran in 2006 and the 7th in a 7-0 win over North Korea in 2010)

*Messi World Cup Record*
Appearances: 9
Goals: 2 (The 6th in a 6-0 win over Serbia & Montenegro in 2006 and the one against Bosnia the other night)

Now, accepting as we all do that those two players are far superior to our Wayne, they've hardly lit up the world cup have they?


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## Andy808 (Jun 17, 2014)

Rooter said:



			Sorry dude, i think you will find Rooney has scored the same amount of world cup goals as me!
		
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So he hasn't! 
He does score well in qualifiers but never done it on the biggest stage in the world. 
Maybe he gets stage fright?


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## Foxholer (Jun 17, 2014)

Beezerk said:



			Gary Neville sounded quite bullish about Rooney in an interview I've just seen....
		
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Well he would be! He's full of bull!


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## Stuart_C (Jun 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Do we also drop Baines & _*Gerrard*_?? 
Both were far from impressive against Italy.
		
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Yes.


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## Slime (Jun 17, 2014)

Englandphil said:



			So that's why *Woy* got the job - cheaper payouts 

Click to expand...

Actually, his name's Roy. Try and show some respect please, *Englandphil* .


*Slime*.


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## Stuart_C (Jun 17, 2014)

Andy808 said:



			Really?
Rooney has ONE goal in world cup finals from 9 or 10 games whereas Sturridge has ONE goal in world cup finals from ONE game. 
Great plan, lets have to guy who can't hit a barn door that the horses have left open for the guy who's already matched his all time record. 

Click to expand...

" Forms temporary, Class is permanent" springs to mind. 

It's only an opinion.

Sturridge should be banned for dancing like a Pratt after scoring.


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## Fish (Jun 17, 2014)

Slime said:



			Actually, his name's Roy. Try and show some respect please, *Englandphil* .


*Slime*.
		
Click to expand...

Yes I agree, mocking the afflicted is a form of bullying, doesn't like being called Phillipa though  :smirk:


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## Rooter (Jun 17, 2014)

Stuart_C said:



			" Forms temporary, Class is permanent" springs to mind. 

It's only an opinion.

Sturridge should be banned for dancing like a Pratt after scoring.
		
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Form is temorary, yes i agree, however this is rooneys 3rd world cup!

Sturridge's dance is class! would love to see more of it on Thursday night!


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Rooter said:



			Form is temorary, yes i agree, however this is rooneys 3rd world cup!

Sturridge's dance is class! would love to see more of it on Thursday night!
		
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I refer you to post #113


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## Rooter (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			I refer you to post #113
		
Click to expand...

noted. Ronaldo i will pick out, he is a big fish in a pretty poor quality pond, there was a joke flowchart on twitter with the portugese tactics,

Kick off - Pass to ronaldo - Did we score? if yes, kick off again, if no, pass to ronaldo.

there are plenty of "hyped" players that have done very well at the world cup:

I refer you to:

15 Ronaldo (the fat one)
14 Klose
8 david villa
6 Thierry Henry
6 Diego Forlan


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Rooter said:



			noted. Ronaldo i will pick out, he is a big fish in a pretty poor quality pond, there was a joke flowchart on twitter with the portugese tactics,

Kick off - Pass to ronaldo - Did we score? if yes, kick off again, if no, pass to ronaldo.

there are plenty of "hyped" players that have done very well at the world cup:

I refer you to:

15 Ronaldo (the fat one)
14 Klose
8 david villa
6 Thierry Henry
6 Diego Forlan
		
Click to expand...

There are indeed, my point however is that if you gave any England fan the chance to swap Rooney with either Ronaldo or Messi they'd do it despite the fact that they have both failed at World Cups in better, higher scoring teams than Rooney has.

P.S. All of those players were playing for better teams than England except maybe Forlan


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## Birchy (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			There are indeed, my point however is that if you gave any England fan the chance to swap Rooney with either Ronaldo or Messi they'd do it despite the fact that they have both failed at World Cups in better, higher scoring teams than Rooney has.

P.S. All of those players were playing for better teams than England except maybe Forlan
		
Click to expand...

And have also played many more games possibly bar Forlan again.


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## Stuart_C (Jun 17, 2014)

Rooter said:



			Form is temorary, yes i agree, however this is rooneys 3rd world cup!

*Sturridge's dance is class! would love to see more of it on Thursday night*!
		
Click to expand...

Oh dear 

Rooney imo is a better player than Sturridge.

So on the above theory, if Rooney is played as a striker then he should start above Sturridge.

Or the simplest solution would be for the experienced England Manager to devise a setup/tactic/formation and play the strongest team where players play in their best position.


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## Rooter (Jun 17, 2014)

Stuart_C said:



			Rooney imo is a better player than Sturridge.

So on the above theory, if Rooney is played as a striker then he should start above Sturridge.
		
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Great thing about football is it divides opinion! I think we will have the agree to disagree on the above point!!!


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## 6inchcup (Jun 17, 2014)

how come there is no SELL HIM TO LIVERPOOL option??


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Jun 17, 2014)

Rooney has to be in the team - likes of Sturridge, Welbeck and Sterling are great - but I really don't think they have the all round skills and vision of Rooney.  Just because England can't work out how to utilise his skills integrated with the rest doesn't mean you drop him.  When you play smarter teams who will work out how to neutralise most players you need someone like Rooney who can see and do the vision.

Like Kenny Dalglish in the Scotland team - when many wanted him dropped for not delivering - Rooney's problem may actually be the rest of the team.


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## Rooter (Jun 17, 2014)

SwingsitlikeHogan said:



			Rooney's problem may actually be the rest of the team.
		
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Think you are getting Rooney confused with Ronaldo.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 17, 2014)

If Rooney gets dropped do we then discuss other players that don't perform? 
It was pretty obvious before a ball was kicked that Rooneys performances was going to be scrutinized. 
A few other players also got pretty low marks next to their names after the Italy game 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...Italy-Scorer-Daniel-Sturridge-stands-out.html


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## JCW (Jun 17, 2014)

Get rid , he has had so many chances its time others had a chance , man u are only club stupid enough to pay him big wages , if he was that good the other big clubs would have come calling by now , he has grown fat on his wages that he is no longer got the hunger, give the others a chance


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

JCW said:



			Get rid , he has had so many chances its time others had a chance , man u are only club stupid enough to pay him big wages , if he was that good the other big clubs would have come calling by now , he has grown fat on his wages that he is no longer got the hunger, give the others a chance
		
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No hunger? Is that why he turned up to the training camp a week early to make sure he was ready and went out on his own after all the others had gone in to do extra training yesterday?

Maybe, just maybe, if everyone got off his back and tried supporting him (strange concept for many England fans I know) we might see the best of him.


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## quinn (Jun 17, 2014)

Play him where he plays for his club for a start, 39 goals for England's a good reason not to drop him, England fans always look for somebody to blame, didn't here anybody slating him when he dropped that cross onto sturridges foot from 30 yards, he's not a defender so you can't blame him for the second goal, if you watch the game again, baines doesn't do a lot to help him, play him down the middle behind Sturridge, guarantee he'll create chances


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## Slime (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			No hunger? Is that why he turned up to the training camp a week early to make sure he was ready and went out on his own after all the others had gone in to do extra training yesterday?

*Maybe, just maybe, if everyone got off his back and tried supporting him (strange concept for many England fans I know) we might see the best of him.*

Click to expand...

Quality comment, spot on :thup:.


*Slime*.

Ain't gonna happen though. Even if he scores a hat-trick in the next game, people will still be slagging him off for something or other!


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			No hunger? Is that why he turned up to the training camp a week early to make sure he was ready and went out on his own after all the others had gone in to do extra training yesterday?

Maybe, just maybe, if everyone got off his back and tried supporting him (strange concept for many England fans I know) we might see the best of him.
		
Click to expand...

Well said that man.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 17, 2014)

What is said on here makes zero difference to how Rooney or in fact any player performs 

The fans at the stadium supported him as they have done in every major tournament 

Rooney is a decent player that there is no doubt but he can be replaced - he hasn't been that main player in the tournaments - he has failed to deliver when it matters for England during the tournaments - he isn't that only

Woy can persevere with him in the hope he gives a performance soon or he can try something else and maybe the dropping him to the bench might be a wake up call - remember this is the same player who when England had qualified already into 2012 EC decided to lash out getting himself banned for two games in the tournament I think it was. Build a team - Rooney isn't good enough to have a team built around him - and if Rooney can't perform in the team created then give other players a chance.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			What is said on here makes zero difference to how Rooney or in fact any player performs 

The fans at the stadium supported him as they have done in every major tournament 

Rooney is a decent player that there is no doubt but he can be replaced - he hasn't been that main player in the tournaments - he has failed to deliver when it matters for England during the tournaments - he isn't that only

Woy can persevere with him in the hope he gives a performance soon or he can try something else and maybe the dropping him to the bench might be a wake up call - remember this is the same player who when England had qualified already into 2012 EC decided to lash out getting himself banned for two games in the tournament I think it was. Build a team - Rooney isn't good enough to have a team built around him - and if Rooney can't perform in the team created then give other players a chance.
		
Click to expand...

It's Roy you %*!#*^


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## Slime (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			It's Roy you %*!#*^
		
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Leave it mate, he's obviously got no qualms about mocking people with afflictions.


*Slime*.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 17, 2014)

http://m.skysports.com/article/sports//9352380
Pretty much spot on. 
At least we won't have Pirlo out classing our Midfielders on Thursday.


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## richy (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			What is said on here makes zero difference to how Rooney or in fact any player performs 

The fans at the stadium supported him as they have done in every major tournament 

Rooney is a decent player that there is no doubt but he can be replaced - he hasn't been that main player in the tournaments - he has failed to deliver when it matters for England during the tournaments - he isn't that only

Woy can persevere with him in the hope he gives a performance soon or he can try something else and maybe the dropping him to the bench might be a wake up call - remember this is the same player who when England had qualified already into 2012 EC decided to lash out getting himself banned for two games in the tournament I think it was. Build a team - Rooney isn't good enough to have a team built around him - and if Rooney can't perform in the team created then give other players a chance.
		
Click to expand...

Why do you insist on calling him Woy? His name is Roy, or can you not read. Maybe we should take the mick out of you for not being able to read like you are with Roy's speech condition


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 17, 2014)

richy said:



			Why do you insist on calling him Woy? His name is Roy, or can you not read. Maybe we should take the mick out of you for not being able to read like you are with Roy's speech condition
		
Click to expand...

Makes zero difference what I call him 

Called him that for years ever since he slated Liverpool fans when he was supposed to be our manager.

What I call him has nothing to do with the thread and the point I was making about Rooney 

It's a nickname for him - simple as that.


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## richy (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Makes zero difference what I call him 

Called him that for years ever since he slated Liverpool fans when he was supposed to be our manager.

What I call him has nothing to do with the thread and the point I was making about Rooney 

It's a nickname for him - simple as that.
		
Click to expand...

Something is simple.......and it's isn't your nickname for Roy


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Makes zero difference what I call him 

Called him that for years ever since he slated Liverpool fans when he was supposed to be our manager.

What I call him has nothing to do with the thread and the point I was making about Rooney 

It's a nickname for him - simple as that.
		
Click to expand...

It's an insult that's what it is. If you can't show the England manager the respect of using his proper name, why should anyone here have any respect for anything you say?


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## Slime (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Makes zero difference what I call him 

Called him that for years ever since he slated Liverpool fans when he was supposed to be our manager.

What I call him has nothing to do with the thread and the point I was making about Rooney 

It's a nickname for him - simple as that.
		
Click to expand...

Do you not think that other people who have speech impediments may find it offensive?
Would you mock someone in a wheelchair, or is it just speech defects that you choose to ridicule?
*

Slime*.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 17, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			It's an insult that's what it is. If you can't show the England manager the respect of using his proper name, why should anyone here have any respect for anything you say?
		
Click to expand...


The manager showed zero respect to fans of a club he was managing after they spent their hard earned money going to watch the team

Again this thread is about Rooney 

If you don't want to respect my opinion on Rooney then don't.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The manager showed zero respect to fans of a club he was managing after they spent their hard earned money going to watch the team

Again this thread is about Rooney 

If you don't want to respect my opinion on Rooney then don't.
		
Click to expand...

Those fans gave Hodgson zero respect from before he was even appointed manager. If Rodgers had the same speech impediment would you be calling him Bwendan Wodgers? I doubt it.


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The manager showed zero respect to fans of a club he was managing after they spent their hard earned money going to watch the team

Again this thread is about Rooney 

If you don't want to respect my opinion on Rooney then don't.
		
Click to expand...

The next time you feel like judging some one on here just remember YOU mock someone's speech impediment at every opportunity. It's pathetic!


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## Slime (Jun 17, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



*The manager showed zero respect to fans of a club he was managing* after they spent their hard earned money going to watch the team
		
Click to expand...

Did he take the piss out of those fans with afflictions ................. by publicly mocking them?



*Slime*.


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## rosecott (Jun 17, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			The next time you feel like judging some one on here just remember YOU mock someone's speech impediment at every opportunity. It's pathetic!
		
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It's not the first time he has shown less than pleasant attitudes.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 17, 2014)

Hodgson was nothing but the perfect manager for my team and I was sad that he decided to leave to go to Anfield. He was being written off before he got there and none of the fans wanted him. It's a shame he took the job the way he was treated and think if he'd stayed another season at Fulham we would have been much stronger and better for it. I doubt you'll find many England or Fulham fans mocking his speech. 

That's an aside though. I think Rooney did ok in the PL playing in a poor United squad and got a reasonable amount of goals and so he is definitely worth keeping in the side. As I have said, with Sturridge and Sterling coming in from the sides at pace and Rooney being able to play centrally and bring others into the game as well as take chances created, and I think we may have a good chance of winning


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## Piece (Jun 17, 2014)

I wonder if Brazil have a similar conversation about Fred?  He makes Carroll look like Robin van Persie


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## Liverbirdie (Jun 17, 2014)

Slime said:



			Did he take the piss out of those fans with afflictions ................. by publicly mocking them?



*Slime*.
		
Click to expand...

No that was Glenn Hoddle.


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## Fish (Jun 18, 2014)

Piece said:



			I wonder if Brazil have a similar conversation about Fred?  He makes Carroll look like Robin van Persie 

Click to expand...

I was giggling every time they mentioned his name, it sounded so funny and out of sorts, "their looking for Fred", "where's Fred" and so-on...and then, Jo replaced Fred, great Brazilian names :rofl:


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## pbrown7582 (Jun 18, 2014)

Fish said:



			I was giggling every time they mentioned his name, it sounded so funny and out of sorts, "their looking for Fred", "where's Fred" and so-on...and then, Jo replaced Fred, great Brazilian names :rofl:
		
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and linekers closing line.....

brazil with Fred, Jo and Bernard in the line up well they look just like,,,,,,,,, England


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## Imurg (Jun 18, 2014)

Don't forget Bernard......more English names than England!

Ha! beat me to it PB!!


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

Imurg said:



			Don't forget Bernard......more English names than England!

Ha! beat me to it PB!!
		
Click to expand...

They actually have...

Victor, Maxwell, Dani, David, Oscar, Bernard, Fred & Jo (and almost William )


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

pbrown7582 said:



			and linekers closing line.....

brazil with Fred, Jo and Bernard in the line up well they look just like,,,,,,,,, England 

Click to expand...

When Fred was taken off, The co-commentator (was it Mark Lawrenson?) said "someone has just told Fred to get warmed up as he's coming off"


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 18, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			When Fred was taken off, The co-commentator (was it Mark Lawrenson?) said "someone has just told Fred to get warmed up as he's coming off"
		
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It was - think it was Alan Green who used it towards Henderson a couple years back and heard Lawro say it towards Cleverly I think last season. It's a great line


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## pokerjoke (Jun 18, 2014)

It looks like Roy has made a decision to play Rooney behind Sturridge,although
not official.
This is a good decision as its what the player himself would like,and most England supporters.
That's the ones who don't want him dropped.
In my mind im sure Rooney will prove the doubters wrong,i just hope the media and supposedly 
England supporters have not hounded him so much the pressure gets to him.
Wayne did not have his best game for England,however he did set up the goal and had a great
chance to score himself.
What the media and unreal fans need to do is get off his back and start supporting the team.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			It looks like Roy has made a decision to play Rooney behind Sturridge,although
not official.
This is a good decision as its what the player himself would like,and most England supporters.
That's the ones who don't want him dropped.
In my mind im sure Rooney will prove the doubters wrong,i just hope the media and supposedly 
England supporters have not hounded him so much the pressure gets to him.
Wayne did not have his best game for England,however he did set up the goal and had a great
chance to score himself.
What the media and unreal fans need to do is get off his back and start supporting the team.
		
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That certainly seems to be the vibe coming out of Brazil doesn't it.


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## pokerjoke (Jun 18, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			That certainly seems to be the vibe coming out of Brazil doesn't it.
		
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Yes and I believe its what most people want.
Sturridge,sterling,wellbeck and Rooney have a lot of pace to burn,as we know
defenders hate pace.

One thing I noticed in the Brazil-Mexico match was how hot it was and what a fast
pace they were playing at,and not one went down with cramp.
All along the heat has worried me more than the team itself.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 18, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			Yes and I believe its what most people want.
Sturridge,sterling,wellbeck and Rooney have a lot of pace to burn,as we know
defenders hate pace.

One thing I noticed in the Brazil-Mexico match was how hot it was and what a fast
pace they were playing at,and not one went down with cramp.
All along the heat has worried me more than the team itself.
		
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Both teams are very much used to that sort of heat 

Lallana in that line up instead of Wellbeck for his creativity would be better IMO


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## pokerjoke (Jun 18, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Both teams are very much used to that sort of heat 

Lallana in that line up instead of Wellbeck for his creativity would be better IMO
		
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Wouldn't disagree with Lallana.
They are used to the heat.
I just wonder if we were playing Brazil in that heat would we cope?


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 18, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			Wouldn't disagree with Lallana.
They are used to the heat.
I just wonder if we were playing Brazil in that heat would we cope?
		
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Think they would certainly need a lot of fluids ( extra ) but could see a few cramping up


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			Yes and I believe its what most people want.
Sturridge,sterling,wellbeck and Rooney have a lot of pace to burn,as we know
defenders hate pace.

One thing I noticed in the Brazil-Mexico match was how hot it was and what a fast
pace they were playing at,and not one went down with cramp.
All along the heat has worried me more than the team itself.
		
Click to expand...

The thing I find a bit odd about this "They're used to the heat" line, is that all but one of the Brazilians plays outside of Brazil, mostly in Europe, it's hardly like they are playing in that heat every week so why would they be more used to it than the European teams?


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## jp5 (Jun 18, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			The thing I find a bit odd about this "They're used to the heat" line, is that all but one of the Brazilians plays outside of Brazil, mostly in Europe, it's hardly like they are playing in that heat every week so why would they be more used to it than the European teams? 

Click to expand...

Probably something in their genetics which makes running around for 90 mins in heat less arduous than for someone from a cold country?


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

jp5 said:



			Probably something in their genetics which makes running around for 90 mins in heat less arduous than for someone from a cold country?
		
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Or maybe an excuse used by the European countries?


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 18, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Or maybe an excuse used by the European countries?
		
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Human genetics do alter people's bodies to adjust to the climate they are born into 

South American people will be more able to deal with the climate and the air 

They did a lot testing with the African runners and the lung capacity they are born with compared to people in Northern Europe - the differences were very clear


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 18, 2014)

HawkeyeMS said:



			Or maybe an excuse used by the European countries?
		
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Are other European teams using it as an excuse,or is it just us? 
They're all playing in the same conditions so to say players are tired seems like a bit of a cop out to me.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 18, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Human genetics do alter people's bodies to adjust to the climate they are born into 

South American people will be more able to deal with the climate and the air 

They did a lot testing with the African runners and the lung capacity they are born with compared to people in Northern Europe - the differences were very clear
		
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Fair enough. I was just thinking that the "used to the conditions" thing made more sense in the past when players pretty much all played in their home country but these days when many South Americans play in Europe it is less of a reason? I do however stand corrected


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## RW1986 (Jun 18, 2014)

Use him as the number 10. If he's no good tomorrow then by all means, drop him for the final game. But I think he'll come good tomorrow.


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## G1BB0 (Jun 18, 2014)

RW1986 said:



			Use him as the number 10. If he's no good tomorrow then by all means, drop him for the final game. But I think he'll come good tomorrow.
		
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trouble is it might be too late by the final game!

Drop Rooney and Baines, play Shaw/Lallana down left, they do it for club so go with that imho, chemistry is da bomb in Fifa on xbox one so why not IRL


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 18, 2014)

Did G1BBO really just say "da bomb"???? 
:rofl: brilliant:thup:


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## quinn (Jun 18, 2014)

Uraguay will be to focused on stopping sterling and Sturridge tomorrow, perfect chance for Rooney to show what we know he can do, he'll start in behind Sturridge and sterling plays wide, he plays there for Liverpool so it's not going to be a problem for him, 3-1 England, hope we test out saurez's knee early on


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## wrighty1874 (Jun 18, 2014)

Put him out of his misery and drop him.


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## JCW (Jun 18, 2014)

wrighty1874 said:



			Put him out of his misery and drop him.
		
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Agreed with you , had so many chances , leave on the bench as it may wind him up enough to play when he comes on with 20 to go ............////////////////.........EYWC


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## quinn (Jun 18, 2014)

JCW said:



			Agreed with you , had so many chances , leave on the bench as it may wind him up enough to play when he comes on with 20 to go ............////////////////.........EYWC
		
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Who would you bring in that's better than Rooney, I think uraguay would be more pleased to see a team sheet without Rooney on it.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 18, 2014)

quinn said:



			Who would you bring in that's better than Rooney, I think uraguay would be more pleased to see a team sheet without Rooney on it.
		
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Would play either Lallana or Barkley


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## richart (Jun 18, 2014)

Baines looks like he is suffering from the heat more than most. Seems to have lost all pace, and looks permanently knackered I would go with Shaw before it is too late.

Same applies to Rooney, but seems he can not be dropped. Must be due his first World Cup finals goal though.:thup:


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## User20205 (Jun 18, 2014)

I'm not sure Rooney can win, apparently he covered the most ground of anyone on both teams, about 6k. He created the Sturridge goal with a cracking cross. He's wasted on the left, play him behind Sturridge and don't waste his talent carrying water:thup:

He's performed at the highest level for 10 years, he's won champions leagues, which is a higher standard of comp than the World Cup. You can't drop him for a kid that's played well for half a season.


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## quinn (Jun 18, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Would play either Lallana or Barkley
		
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Haven't seen lallana offer much, Barkley looks the part but gave the ball away a lot against italy they're not as good as Rooney yet, he'll do alright tomorrow


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## Liverbirdie (Jun 18, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Human genetics do alter people's bodies to adjust to the climate they are born into 

South American people will be more able to deal with the climate and the air 

They did a lot testing with the African runners and the lung capacity they are born with compared to people in Northern Europe - the differences were very clear
		
Click to expand...

My god, Phil, that was a very sloppy tightrope that you negotiated very well.

Good point, but I was wincing at one point.....


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## richart (Jun 18, 2014)

therod said:



			I'm not sure Rooney can win, apparently he covered the most ground of anyone on both teams, about 6k. He created the Sturridge goal with a crack in cross. He's wasted on the left, play him behind Sturridge and don't waste his talent carrying water:thup:
		
Click to expand...

He was a bit of a headless chicken out wide though, and I understand they cover a fair bit of ground. Prefer my players to keep the ball, so they don't need to have to keep tracking back.


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## User20205 (Jun 18, 2014)

richart said:



			He was a bit of a headless chicken out wide though, and I understand they cover a fair bit of ground. Prefer my players to keep the ball, so they don't need to have to keep tracking back.
		
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He's just following team orders. I'd be happy for him to stay up top. 

I understand you favouring quality possession football, being a reading fan :thup:have you found your missing Russian yet??


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## richart (Jun 18, 2014)

therod said:



			I'm not sure Rooney can win, apparently he covered the most ground of anyone on both teams, about 6k. He created the Sturridge goal with a cracking cross. He's wasted on the left, play him behind Sturridge and don't waste his talent carrying water:thup:

He's performed at the highest level for 10 years, he's won champions leagues, which is a higher standard of comp than the World Cup. You can't drop him for a kid that's played well for half a season.
		
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 So you keep someone in the team because they played well in the past ? We should have taken Bobby Charlton. He is a shadow of the player from eight years ago. Pace has gone, and should never be played out of position. There are players in the squad that can do the job better. For me he should only play his natural position or not at all, and i would prefer not at all.

Hopefully he will prove me wrong and score a couple.


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## richart (Jun 18, 2014)

therod said:



			He's just following team orders. I'd be happy for him to stay up top. 

I understand you favouring quality possession football, being a reading fan :thup:have you found your missing Russian yet??
		
Click to expand...

 He is being replaced by a Thai businessman. They know a lot more about football.


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## User20205 (Jun 18, 2014)

richart said:



			So you keep someone in the team because they played well in the past ? We should have taken Bobby Charlton. He is a shadow of the player from eight years ago. Pace has gone, and should never be played out of position. There are players in the squad that can do the job better. For me he should only play his natural position or not at all, and i would prefer not at all.

Hopefully he will prove me wrong and score a couple.
		
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Stop being silly

Maybe not bobby charlton, I'd bring back sheringham and shearer though. You know yourself rich, as an older chap, there's no substitute for experience :ears:


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## richart (Jun 18, 2014)

therod said:



			Stop being silly

Maybe not bobby charlton, I'd bring back sheringham and shearer though. You know yourself rich, as an older chap, there's no substitute for experience :ears:
		
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 When I played football there were no substitutes.  Real reason I don't want Rooney to play is he might beat Bobby's England scoring record.


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## quinn (Jun 19, 2014)

richart said:



			So you keep someone in the team because they played well in the past ? We should have taken Bobby Charlton. He is a shadow of the player from eight years ago. Pace has gone, and should never be played out of position. There are players in the squad that can do the job better. For me he should only play his natural position or not at all, and i would prefer not at all.

Hopefully he will prove me wrong and score a couple.
		
Click to expand...

He didn't do too bad for our goal though did he, if pirlo would have put that cross in every body would be raving about it, there were worse players than Rooney against Italy, England fans are always looking for somebody to blame,


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## Tashyboy (Jun 19, 2014)

Whatever we would do with Rooney, we will find out tonight What Roy has done with him. He tried summat the last game and it did not work hence the reason this topic is doing so well. I just hope we don't have the same scenario as Spain in that they tried to accommodate a big name player (Costa) who obviously was not at his best and it's cost them big style. Yes there were other issues with Spain, but if you don't score you won't win. they did it before with Torres and got away with it, but not this time.

what made me chuckle last night was that a massively struggling Costa was replaced by a massively struggling Torres. bet the Chelsea fans loved that one.


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## Slime (Jun 19, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Would play either Lallana or Barkley
		
Click to expand...

Are you serious ..................... I mean .................... are you?



therod said:



*I'm not sure Rooney can win*, apparently he covered the most ground of anyone on both teams, about 6k. He created the Sturridge goal with a cracking cross. He's wasted on the left, play him behind Sturridge and don't waste his talent carrying water:thup:

He's performed at the highest level for 10 years, he's won champions leagues, which is a higher standard of comp than the World Cup. You can't drop him for a kid that's played well for half a season.
		
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Rooney was set up as the scapegoat before the plane even landed in Brazil, he's hardly got a prayer.
Even if he scores tonight he'll probably still get criticised for something or other!
He'll have to do something really special to get certain people off his back, in fact there are certain people who will never applaud him ................ mostly myopic Liverpudlians.

*Slime*.


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## NWJocko (Jun 19, 2014)

Funny listening to folk talk about dropping Rooney, utter madness. He may be a tool as a person but he's one of you're best players!

Not sure why your top goalscorer in qualifying has suddenly become the target for this comp!? 

England fans and media never fail to make their lives unnecessarily awkward.....


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## gdunc79 (Jun 19, 2014)

Rooney should be playing the furthest up the field but the current trend of only playing with one striker prevents this as Sturridge is a far better finisher. I would drop him for Barkley. Bring him on last 30 mins.


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## HawkeyeMS (Jun 19, 2014)

gdunc79 said:



			Rooney should be playing the furthest up the field but the current trend of only playing with one striker prevents this as Sturridge is a far better finisher. I would drop him for Barkley. Bring him on last 30 mins.
		
Click to expand...

Sturridge isn't a better finisher than Rooney, that's just nonsense. Sturridge has been in better form than Rooney this season, whihc is why he has the number 9 shirt but he isn't a better finisher.


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## richart (Jun 19, 2014)

quinn said:



			He didn't do too bad for our goal though did he, if pirlo would have put that cross in every body would be raving about it, there were worse players than Rooney against Italy, England fans are always looking for somebody to blame,
		
Click to expand...

 Difficult to think of much else he did though. As I said he should not play wide but in the number 10 position. If he is not the best player for that position he should not play. You can't just shuffle players around to find a place for him.

If we had no one better than Rooney fine, but I personally think Barkley is a better bet. More pace and has an eye for a pass, and has a great shot on him. Nothing personal against Rooney, just in my opinion he is not the best player for the position. What he has done in the best means nothing. It is what he does today that matters, and I hope he has a blinder and scores a couple of goals, but I fear not.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 19, 2014)

I think England have a glorious chance tonight, apart from Suarez being back, the officials being Spanish and so the Uruguayans can converse with them at ease, and the fact Rooney has the weight of a nation and a golf forum on his back. To be honest win lose or draw, Rooney will get slaughtered in the press. He's in the best position for him and with others around playing at speed we've as good a chance as we'll ever have against a side not looking great


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## Piece (Jun 19, 2014)

Rooney's been picked in his favourite position. I don't agree he should have been selected but as he has, I hope he delivers and proves quite a few people wrong, including me. If he fails, then that should be the end. IMHO.

Come on England.


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## pokerjoke (Jun 19, 2014)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I think England have a glorious chance tonight, apart from Suarez being back, the officials being Spanish and so the Uruguayans can converse with them at ease, and the fact Rooney has the weight of a nation and a golf forum on his back. To be honest win lose or draw, Rooney will get slaughtered in the press. He's in the best position for him and with others around playing at speed we've as good a chance as we'll ever have against a side not looking great
		
Click to expand...


So when we win if Rooney scores a hatrick he will get slaughtered.


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 19, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			So when we win if Rooney scores a hatrick he will get slaughtered.

Click to expand...

He will get the praise he would rightly deserve


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## pokerjoke (Jun 19, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			He will get the praise he would rightly deserve
		
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Thankyou,someone who understands football.
All these people who slate Rooney and want him hung are getting on my nerves.


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## Papas1982 (Jun 19, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			So when we win if Rooney scores a hatrick he will get slaughtered.

Click to expand...

Of course he won't, but if he doesn't score then he'll be the scapegoat!


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 19, 2014)

pokerjoke said:



			So when we win if Rooney scores a hatrick he will get slaughtered.

Click to expand...

We'll cross that bridge if and when it happens. I think he might get away with it!


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 19, 2014)

Seemed pretty obvious to me that it was Gerrard who should be dropped,not Rooney. 
Rooney scores a goal & Gerrard........
He's had a mare end to the season & WC.


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## pbrown7582 (Jun 20, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Seemed pretty obvious to me that it was Gerrard who should be dropped,not Rooney. 
Rooney scores a goal & Gerrard........
He's had a mare end to the season & WC.
		
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I thought he had 2 assists last night.........


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 20, 2014)

pbrown7582 said:



			I thought he had 2 assists last night.........
		
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Did he have the final touch 

Even though Gerrard didnt protect very well for those goals - the CB's were poor behind him - really poor positioning escpecillay from Jagelkia


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## richy (Jun 20, 2014)

Pin-seeker said:



			Seemed pretty obvious to me that it was Gerrard who should be dropped,not Rooney. 
Rooney scores a goal & Gerrard........
He's had a mare end to the season & WC.
		
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Gerrard has been the worst player over the first 2 games and that includes Johnson. Not only has he played terrible but he has shown a complete lack of leadership. I didn't see him trying to get the players up when we went behind. If anything he looked overawed by the occasion.


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## HomerJSimpson (Jun 20, 2014)

richy said:



			Gerrard has been the worst player over the first 2 games and that includes Johnson. Not only has he played terrible but he has shown a complete lack of leadership. I didn't see him trying to get the players up when we went behind. If anything he looked overawed by the occasion.
		
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I agree that Gerrard didn't look the leader he is for Liverpool and really didn't get hold of the side in those wobbly ten minutes after half time. Can you imagine a Tony Adams, Platt, Robson etc not rallying the troops especially when we scored. I think the youngsters need a leader they can look at and draw guidance from and I don't see it from Gerrard


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 20, 2014)

Seems 31 people were right.


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## callummcs (Jun 20, 2014)

Right now it should be through the middle playing in the hole behind Sturridge. This right now is the only position he should be playing for England in my opinion. If he is not in that role he shouldn't be in the team. 

In a few years however I think he will fall back into the middle of the park and control the game from there as he can make a tackle and his range of passing is excellent. He could do a real job in there.

He gets far too much stick and far too much pressure put on him from the media which I really just don't understand. He is not England's 'star player' in my opinion as to be honest you don't have any 'star players' you have a team of very good players with a very bright future in front of them.


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## Piece (Jun 22, 2014)

Am I seeing rumours that Rooney will be the next England captain? <face palm>


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## Liverpoolphil (Jun 22, 2014)

That's what I heard on 5 Live yesterday. - thought it was just journos


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## JCW (Jun 22, 2014)

Liverpoolphil said:



			That's what I heard on 5 Live yesterday. - thought it was just journos
		
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Stevie G is rubbish now , pass his best awhile back and they make him capt so he has to play , him, lampard, Phil J , Baines, Rooney , bunch of losers from the golden generation , get rid and start fresh , what we got to lose , I watch the Iran , Nigeria and Ghana play , they gave it all , no real big names there


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## Pin-seeker (Jun 22, 2014)

Piece said:



			Am I seeing rumours that Rooney will be the next England captain? <face palm>
		
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Seems like the obvious choice to me.


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## Fish (Jun 22, 2014)

Piece said:



			Am I seeing rumours that Rooney will be the next England captain? <face palm>
		
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Good job (although I don't think he's 'captain material') otherwise he'd go into an even bigger strop as he's not getting it at OT, Van Gaal will give that to his fellow countryman, RVP


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## JCW (Jun 23, 2014)

Man U should sell Rooney to chelsea ............thats wot they should do with him .........................EYF


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## Tashyboy (Jun 23, 2014)

Rooney says to woy, 'I don't know what's best for me, left right or the centre", woy says "shrek shut up, get up those stairs and get on the plane"


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## Slime (Jun 23, 2014)

Tashyboy said:



*Rooney says to woy*, 'I don't know what's best for me, left right or the centre", woy says "shrek shut up, get up those stairs and get on the plane"
		
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Rooney says to who?


*Slime*.


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## Piece (Aug 28, 2014)

Thought I'd resurrect an old thread, rather than start a new one...

It was only months ago that quite a few thought Rooney was past it - me included. Likely to be dropped by England, wasn't really fitting in at Man U, leaving him potentially in the wilderness. 

Turns out its another one of his master plans.   He's now Man U captain and England captain. 

Fair play, captain of two sinking ships


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## CheltenhamHacker (Aug 28, 2014)

Piece said:



			Thought I'd resurrect an old thread, rather than start a new one...

It was only months ago that quite a few thought Rooney was past it - me included. Likely to be dropped by England, wasn't really fitting in at Man U, leaving him potentially in the wilderness. 

Turns out its another one of his master plans.   He's now Man U captain and England captain. 

Fair play, captain of two sinking ships  

Click to expand...

Do England really count as a sinking ship?

Sunk ship, maybe!


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## HomerJSimpson (Aug 29, 2014)

CheltenhamHacker said:



			Do England really count as a sinking ship?

Sunk ship, maybe!
		
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Well the proof will be in the pudding but with only 25-30,000 expected next week fans are definitely voting with their feet post world cup fiasco


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## richy (Aug 30, 2014)

Heard on the radio the other day that we don't see the best of Wayne Rooney because he's always played out of position.

Surely if he was that good he'd be played in his best position. You don't see Messi Or Ronaldo being played out of position.


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## Papas1982 (Aug 30, 2014)

richy said:



			Heard on the radio the other day that we don't see the best of Wayne Rooney because he's always played out of position.

Surely if he was that good he'd be played in his best position. You don't see Messi Or Ronaldo being played out of position.
		
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Whilst he obv isn't in their league. I'd say his adaptability and work rate are his downfall. He played one full season up top as main man and scored 40 goals. 

But like Gerrard for England being sacrificed and played in wrong place constantly.


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## Beezerk (Sep 1, 2014)

So what does the Falcao signing mean for Rooney?
Drop back deeper as a number 10 maybe?
Dropped to the subs bench? (can't see that like).
That Falcao fella looks like a goal machine so someone needs to make room for him.


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