# closing threads grrr



## bigslice (Mar 26, 2013)

thats the last few days threads get locked, why? someone got banned for a week fine, but then we cant talk about it, mental. so for a week we've to not mention his name. cant have a laugh about him incase the thread gets closed
then the orka thread closed why?  so now we cant talk about that. 
personally i think alex being  at orka took things to heart to quickly. if he was just another orka club player he may have stayed longer. i ve posted that if rick had said 'ping' the thread without alex would have went the same way. only typing as ive found it frustrating and annoying the way threads are shut down. and please whats with all 'are you pleased with yourself 'stuff
. its a forum anything (within reason ) is up for debate, laugh, noise folk up etc.

the fight club idea is a gud yin but thats me broken the first rule dam


----------



## SocketRocket (Mar 26, 2013)

Who got banned?   I must of missed that, a certain Asparagus person has been quiet lately, was it him?


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 26, 2013)

Yes within reason

its a commercially based forum in that it is representative of GM Magazine and its partners. when posts decend into petty squabbles or crusades by individuals and go way off topic then they either get edited, locked or removed.

hence the rules on language, sexism etc etc. If a thread or post is reported or deemed no longer of benefit to the forum then it will be moderated accordingly.

if it was just a private forum then yes anything would go but it isnt!


----------



## SocketRocket (Mar 26, 2013)

G1BB0 said:



			Yes within reason

its a commercially based forum in that it is representative of GM Magazine and its partners. when posts decend into petty squabbles or crusades by individuals and go way off topic then they either get edited, locked or removed.

hence the rules on language, sexism etc etc. If a thread or post is reported or deemed no longer of benefit to the forum then it will be moderated accordingly.

if it was just a private forum then yes anything would go but it isnt!
		
Click to expand...

If someone reports a post as offending them is that enough to close it or discipline the poster, or is it a matter of the Mods using their initiative on the matter?   Just interested how it works.


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

When a post gets reported, all the mods get an email

it is looked at, often discussed with other mods, and action taken if necessary, not all reports are upheld, quite a few are allowed to stand.

its down to mod discretion and experience.


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

bigslice said:



			thats the last few days threads get locked, why? someone got banned for a week fine, but then we cant talk about it, mental. so for a week we've to not mention his name. cant have a laugh about him incase the thread gets closed
then the orka thread closed why?  so now we cant talk about that. 
personally i think alex being  at orka took things to heart to quickly. if he was just another orka club player he may have stayed longer. i ve posted that if rick had said 'ping' the thread without alex would have went the same way. only typing as ive found it frustrating and annoying the way threads are shut down. and please whats with all 'are you pleased with yourself 'stuff
. its a forum anything (within reason ) is up for debate, laugh, noise folk up etc.


the fight club idea is a gud yin but thats me broken the first rule dam
		
Click to expand...

I agree with you Big Fella, it all got out of hand rather quick and it seems that there was a breach of the rules and that the members who were only pointing out the breach are now getting blamed for it all going (.) (.)'s up

Anyway onwards and upwards.


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

if it is against the rules its dealt with if not then no action taken. theres numerous reasons a thread may be locked but its never done without consultation or on a whim!

We are only trying to maintain the forum inline with GM's rules and requirements nothing more nothing less (despite the impression others may have!!!)


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			I agree with you Big Fella, it all got out of hand rather quick and it seems that there was a breach of the rules and that the members who were only pointing out the breach are now getting blamed for it all going (.) (.)'s up

Anyway onwards and upwards.
		
Click to expand...

Yes you are, because you didnt report the breach like the rules say, you took it upon yourselves to deal with the situation and with all due respect, that isnt your job,

Further discussion on this subject, really isnt helpful


----------



## Scottjd1 (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			I agree with you Big Fella, it all got out of hand rather quick and it seems that there was a breach of the rules and that the members who were only pointing out the breach are now getting blamed for it all going (.) (.)'s up

Anyway onwards and upwards.
		
Click to expand...

ZZZZzzzzzzzzz


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Yes you are, because you didnt report the breach like the rules say, you took it upon yourselves to deal with the situation and with all due respect, that isnt your job,

Further discussion on this subject, really isnt helpful
		
Click to expand...

Sorry Boss.

I will now revert to sending PM's from now on, anyway the matter is now concluded as far as I am concerned.


----------



## SocketRocket (Mar 27, 2013)

Thanks for the clarifications.


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

G1BB0 said:



			A thread may be locked but its never done without consultation or on a whim!
		
Click to expand...

What a load of crap!
I had a thread removed. Nothing racist or sexual, just a gentle "pop" at our Scottish friends. A wind up, nothing more. It hadn't deteriorated into a slanging match, and nothing posted on it even remotely suggested that it would.
A mod (and I use the singular here) said he had received a complaint about it. One complaint (so he said). And it was removed. No "ifs" no "buts" just removed and a warning issued. He was the only mod online at the time. But he took it upon himself to remove it. Where was the consultation there then???? Another mod actually PM'd me to say that he wouldn't have removed it.
And if you complain???? You get a response like Fraggers......further discussion is pointless. So stop. Or else. It's worse than being at school.
I've received two infractions over the last couple of months. One, quite rightly I guess, for having a go at a moderator via PM. I called him something maybe I shouldn't have. But I would have called it him to his face. 
The other??? God knows. Just somebodies ego.


----------



## chrisd (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			What a load of crap!
I had a thread removed. Nothing racist or sexual, just a gentle "pop" at our Scottish friends. A wind up, nothing more. It hadn't deteriorated into a slanging match, and nothing posted on it even remotely suggested that it would.
A mod (and I use the singular here) said he had received a complaint about it. One complaint (so he said). And it was removed. No "ifs" no "buts" just removed and a warning issued. He was the only mod online at the time. But he took it upon himself to remove it. Where was the consultation there then???? Another mod actually PM'd me to say that he wouldn't have removed it.
And if you complain???? You get a response like Fraggers......further discussion is pointless. So stop. Or else. It's worse than being at school.
I've received two infractions over the last couple of months. One, quite rightly I guess, for having a go at a moderator via PM. I called him something maybe I shouldn't have. But I would have called it him to his face. 
The other??? God knows. Just somebodies ego.
		
Click to expand...


I have to say that the forum is going to be weaker if the moderating is heavy handed. The "Ice Man Colin" thread didn't seem to get out of hand to me, yes there were strong opinions but no more strong than you might have at work or in the clubhouse. I personally wouldn't like to be on a forum that condoned swearing, threats etc but the mods seem to pull threads rather than lock them at times. A warning that certain posts are ott would help and you could delete those posts. I understand, and agree with the GM wish for the forum to be conducted properly but I also like to be treated like an adult.


----------



## Oddsocks (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			What a load of crap!
I had a thread removed. Nothing racist or sexual, just a gentle "pop" at our Scottish friends. A wind up, nothing more. It hadn't deteriorated into a slanging match, and nothing posted on it even remotely suggested that it would.
.
		
Click to expand...

It is funny how our northern counterparts Seem to be the most offended at the most slightest of "pops", yet the southerners are often referred to as fairies:rofl:


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

Oddsocks said:



			It is funny how our northern counterparts Seem to be the most offended at the most slightest of "pops", yet the southerners are often referred to as fairies:rofl:
		
Click to expand...

I'm not saying that it was a "Northern Counterpart" that complained Oddsocks. I have always found the Scottish lads up for a laugh and personally couldn't give two hoots what they say about me personally. Water off a ducks back as far as I am concerned. What I was annoyed about was the fact that one complaint was apparently received, and one moderator took it upon himself to make the decision to close the thread without warning. And then you get G1BBO saying that a thread is never locked without consultation or on a whim! Total rubbish.
An "active" thread receives one complaint and it's closed????? Who was the complainant??? Must have been somebody very, very important.

And this thread is heading for lockdown too. Guaranteed. Yet nobody has said anything racist or made sexual innuendos. We are just "chatting" but unfortunately we are chatting about the "wrong" things......in some peoples eyes at least.


----------



## Oddsocks (Mar 27, 2013)

The problem is people chat about things, It's a forum, so people will talk even about stuff like this, it's like online councelling 

Like you I'm thick skinned, sticks and stones and all that, but with some people getting so easily offended, it really does worry me how they live their day to day life, boy in a bubble springs to mind.


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

chrisd said:



			I have to say that the forum is going to be weaker if the moderating is heavy handed. The "Ice Man Colin" thread didn't seem to get out of hand to me, yes there were strong opinions but no more strong than you might have at work or in the clubhouse. I personally wouldn't like to be on a forum that condoned swearing, threats etc but the mods seem to pull threads rather than lock them at times. A warning that certain posts are ott would help and you could delete those posts. I understand, and agree with the GM wish for the forum to be conducted properly but I also like to be treated like an adult.
		
Click to expand...

The Ice Man thread had at least 7 warnings on it. The 1 sentence replies which were made to goad, back and forth is not pro-active for ANY forum, let alone a commercial forum. 

The thread is locked and still in The Lounge and already I have received a PM commenting on how bad it was, and that was after I had removed 35 posts from it of what can only be described as posting for the same of it. That's 3 and a 1/2 pages for people to see and think what kind of forum is this. 

None of the moderator team enjoy having to close or remove threads or posts, already we have had 2 quit and others considering it. 

If you want to be treated as adults then perhaps its time to start acting like adults. I've 3 kids of 10 and under and they and their multitude of friends don't behave in the way some here have done over the past few days. 

MikeH wrote a post just before Xmas 




			Back in April 2009 I had to post a long message about the state of play as the forum had rather lost its way with too many petty squabbles being played out online, lots of bad language being used and in general forum rules, as they were at the time, being ignored.

Although I havenâ€™t been as regular a visitor (and contributor) as I'd like to be of late I do still stop by to catch up on the chat. I also get emails from forumers flagging up stuff (good and bad)

From what I have seen (and been sent) it's time I posted again.

Almost all of the original post (reprinted below) is still relevant so please read it especially if youâ€™re a newbie but in short the forum exists to provide a platform for golfers to chat about the game and also off topic stuff in the OOB section. However the following is not acceptableâ€¦

1 Posts that contain any sexist, racist, homophobic or sectarian content
2 Posts or PMs that are abusive to another forum member
3 Posts that contain swearing. This includes the use of asterisked out swear words or other thinly disguised swear words i.e. â€˜fookedâ€™. It might sound draconian but at least it leaves no room for confusion or what is and isnâ€™t OK. I think everyone on here is smart enough to be able to find non-offensive ways of expressing themselves without having to resort to swearing and offending other forumers.
4 Posts that are offensive or in poor taste.
5 Posts that are spam - i.e. posts or messages that are purely posted in a bid to trying to promote or sell services or products.
6 Deliberately posting off topic messages in the wrong forum.
7 Using the for sale forum as an ebay style shop. The for sale forum is for the sale of your own kit you no longer want. (Please see stickied post in the for sale section for definitive rules regarding that section

The rules are the rules - no exceptions no matter who you are. If you transgress you can expect sanctions.

Humour, banter and lively debate are great and what makes the forum enjoyable to use â€“ abuse isnâ€™t. I accept this isnâ€™t a black and white issue but as a rule of thumb donâ€™t post stuff that you wouldnâ€™t be happy to say to someoneâ€™s face.

Remember what you say to someone you know will (or should) be different in tone to what youâ€™d say to a complete stranger. If some of the stuff on here â€“ especially of late - was said to a stranger in a pub those whoâ€™d uttered it would likely get chinned.

The moderators are appointed by me and act on behalf of GM to try to ensure the forum runs to the guidelines as set down by GM.

A lot of stuff the mods have to deal with is a case of judgement â€“ we ask them to act on the side of caution so even if you think its OK then that doesnâ€™t mean they and GM will.

The mods donâ€™t get it right everytime but the like everyone on here bar spambots they are human so prone to mistakes. If they make one itâ€™s in good faith.

Over the last couple of years a few mods have retired as they donâ€™t have the time get involved anymore so I'm looking to recruit some fresh blood to help out the stalwarts. Please email me if you are interested. Itâ€™s a thankless task, you donâ€™t get paid but I might send you a dozen balls now and then. Please form an orderly queue.

As of now if a forum users PMs another forum user any personal abuse there will be no quiet words in your ear, pep talks or even stern warnings I will immediately ban you, your email and IP address â€“ if I see fit that ban will be permanent. 

The bottom line is if â€˜the forumâ€™ cant exercise a better degree of self-policing and/or accept moderator decisions with better grace then I will shut down the out of bounds section and make this a forum that solely focuses on golf with little room for banter.

*I will also stop posting equipment-fitting opportunities on the forum and run them via another channel.

Itâ€™ll be dull as you like but itâ€™ll be easy to manage and wonâ€™t risk compromising the reputation of Golf Monthly and its parent companies (IPC Media/Time Inc).

If you donâ€™t like the above (or below) its probably time to find another golf forum to get involved in. Iâ€™d be confident youâ€™d miss us more than weâ€™ll miss you.*


Mike Harris
(GM editor)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
		
Click to expand...


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

I'm sorry Smiffy , but your above post is simply mod bashing 
If you don't like a mod decision or our interpretation of the rules then you should email MikeH

The constant sniping about mod decisions is bringing the forum down, it will turn off prospective new members and it also damages the image of GM . Also there are members of the mod team who are considering their futures as a result.

Every action the mods take is a reaction to posts written by members.  we are not proactive , if everybody played nice, then there wouldn't be a need for any mods.

However it is getting to the point where every mod decision is publicly criticised , this simply must stop
Otherwise we are going to have to clamp down further

On Other forums the mods are quite heavy handed, criticise a mod and you are banned
If you want this forum to go down that route then keep doing what you are doing

In golf if you break a rule you are a cheat. On the forum if you break a rule you get an infraction which some are wearing as a badge of honour . Go figure


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			On the forum if you break a rule you get an infraction which some are wearing as a badge of honour . Go figure
		
Click to expand...

My comment about the "badge of honour" wasn't aimed at the member holding the infraction. It was aimed at the mod giving it out. Some mods egos are bigger than their responsibilities. If you think that is "mod bashing" you are wrong. It's "certain mod bashing". We will continue to differ on our interpretation of moderating Fragger, so least said soonest mended.


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

So I repeat , got a problem with a mod or mod decision, refer it to MikeH
Otherwise stop bleating


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			So I repeat , got a problem with a mod or mod decision, refer it to MikeH
Otherwise stop bleating
		
Click to expand...

Oh dear.


----------



## drawboy (Mar 27, 2013)

I've been on here a while now but it seems to me that the forum has got worse for posts been taken the wrong way and getting out of hand and descending into petty squabbles, posts get hijacked and run at tangents as in my recent UKIP post in the OOB section. No where in the post was Scottish independence mentioned but 50% of posts on it where about Scottish independence. Mods have the right to protect people from attack and should be allowed to vet and stop any post that they deem fit. They are there to protect the reputation of GM and I feel they do a good job especially in the OOB section which I feel should be policed more than it is. I'm personally not too bothered what people think of me as Smiffy says water off a ducks but GM have to protect their product and reputation.


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

drawboy said:



			I've been on here a while now but it seems to me that the forum has got worse for posts been taken the wrong way and getting out of hand and descending into petty squabbles, posts get hijacked and run at tangents as in my recent UKIP post in the OOB section. No where in the post was Scottish independence mentioned but 50% of posts on it where about Scottish independence. Mods have the right to protect people from attack and should be allowed to vet and stop any post that they deem fit. They are there to protect the reputation of GM and I feel they do a good job especially in the OOB section which I feel should be policed more than it is. I'm personally not too bothered what people think of me as Smiffy says water off a ducks but GM have to protect their product and reputation.
		
Click to expand...

Where's the like button?


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

I do find it rather amusing/sad/hypocritical that most golfers are so upset if someone suggests playing golf without a collar on their shirt or with an untucked shirt as it offends their sense of tradition and etiquette .  Yet can not manage to have sensible conversations on a forum without the need for it to be moded, with posts descending into insults and petty squabbles.


----------



## deanobillquay (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			So I repeat , got a problem with a mod or mod decision, refer it to MikeH
Otherwise stop bleating
		
Click to expand...

You have an attitude problem.


----------



## chrisd (Mar 27, 2013)

Phil2511 said:



			The Ice Man thread had at least 7 warnings on it. The 1 sentence replies which were made to goad, back and forth is not pro-active for ANY forum, let alone a commercial forum. 

The thread is locked and still in The Lounge and already I have received a PM commenting on how bad it was, and that was after I had removed 35 posts from it of what can only be described as posting for the same of it. That's 3 and a 1/2 pages for people to see and think what kind of forum is this. 

None of the moderator team enjoy having to close or remove threads or posts, already we have had 2 quit and others considering it. 

If you want to be treated as adults then perhaps its time to start acting like adults. I've 3 kids of 10 and under and they and their multitude of friends don't behave in the way some here have done over the past few days. 

MikeH wrote a post just before Xmas
		
Click to expand...

The trouble is Phil, if the threads that are the most interesting are over modded ( in the members view) then you just end up with the "what's the best rain suit" threads. I accept its a very fine line and the rules are rightly set by GM but whilst we arnt allowed to veer from the rules and have a real debate then regular posters will just disappear in time if the posts just get sterile and boring.

I have to say that I am stunned sometimes by the views that some people express here, even over what I would call trivial matters, but reading and reacting to them is what makes a thread more interesting. No, I don't want swearing, shear rudeness etc etc but if like the Ice Man thread, I do want to read everyone's views and be allowed to state my own in, as much as possible, a free press situation. Also, it was, in my view, the OP who was ott in his replies at times but I read nothing that was overly offensive


----------



## Captainron (Mar 27, 2013)

We all need to relax a bit here guys. Step back, reflect on things and work through them like adults. Too often are we getting into an us and them argument with the mods.


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

deanobillquay said:



			You have an attitude problem.
		
Click to expand...

No mate, I'm the moderate mod, we have a proceedure in place for dealing with mod complaints, that proceedure is to contact MikeH

It really is that simple


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

Captainron said:



			. Step back, reflect on things and work through them like adults.
		
Click to expand...

Internet forum?  Act like adults?  You are naive and have a lot to learn my son.


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

Captainron said:



			We all need to relax a bit here guys. Step back, reflect on things and work through them like adults. Too often are we getting into an us and them argument with the mods.
		
Click to expand...

A "good" mod is one that you don't even realise is a mod. There when needed, but sits in the background. Unfortunately, one or two (in my opinion of course) see fit to throw their weight around when it's usually unnecessary instead of sitting back and seeing how a thread develops. The fact they they "think" it is going to go the wrong way is seen as an excuse to wield the axe. 
That's the bit I don't like.


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

chrisd said:



			The trouble is Phil, if the threads that are the most interesting are over modded ( in the members view) then you just end up with the "what's the best rain suit" threads. I accept its a very fine line and the rules are rightly set by GM but whilst we arnt allowed to veer from the rules and have a real debate then regular posters will just disappear in time if the posts just get sterile and boring.

I have to say that I am stunned sometimes by the views that some people express here, even over what I would call trivial matters, but reading and reacting to them is what makes a thread more interesting. No, I don't want swearing, shear rudeness etc etc but if like the Ice Man thread, I do want to read everyone's views and be allowed to state my own in, as much as possible, a free press situation. Also, it was, in my view, the OP who was ott in his replies at times but I read nothing that was overly offensive
		
Click to expand...

The thing is that people ARE leaving or participating less than before. 

Snelly is an example, Greg just quit as a moderator and Bobmac hardly posts at all these days all due to the behaviour of others. 

The biggest disgrace recently has to be yesterday in Ricks Orka thread, I just read the last page and once its drawn to the attention of MikeH, which I'm sure he will see it, is hardly going to be positive for the forum.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			No mate, I'm the *moderate* mod,
		
Click to expand...

Cool, do the mods all have different characters?  Like the Spice Girls?  Sporty, Posh, Moderate, Intolerant and Fascistic?


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

Hacker Khan said:



			Cool, do the mods all have different characters?  Like the Spice Girls?  Sporty, Posh, Moderate, Intolerant and Fascistic?
		
Click to expand...

Oh yes, you missed out Terminator and Sarcastic 

Don't ask Phil2511 which one he is, just don't go there


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			Oh yes, you missed out Terminator and Sarcastic 

Don't ask Phil2511 which one he is, just don't go there 

Click to expand...

I know who they are lol. 

And Fragger you will pay for that comment. Lol


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

Ahh mutual mod love
Ain't life grand


----------



## ScienceBoy (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			My comment about the "badge of honour" wasn't aimed at the member holding the infraction.
		
Click to expand...

People with infractions should be locked out of the "Out of Bounds" section as punishment! Would also be a good deterrent.


----------



## chrisd (Mar 27, 2013)

Phil2511 said:



			The thing is that people ARE leaving or participating less than before. 

Snelly is an example, Greg just quit as a moderator and Bobmac hardly posts at all these days all due to the behaviour of others. 

The biggest disgrace recently has to be yesterday in Ricks Orka thread, I just read the last page and once its drawn to the attention of MikeH, which I'm sure he will see it, is hardly going to be positive for the forum.
		
Click to expand...

I was offline yesterday whilst switching Internet providers so didn't see the Orka thread develop. I agree, people do come and go but there is little evidence that they are being driven away by the behaviour of others. Yes, Bob posts much less but that's because, largely, of a disagreement between him and Justone over teaching methods and not concerted abuse or anything like. I don't think Greg quit for any other reason than those I read this morning and particularly the fact he had done 5 years in the post.

All I am saying is that if the forum is over modded then it will get sterile, the threads boring and people will not spend so muh time here. I am not saying that this has been happening too much but just pointing out the danger of over reacting to the odd pm with a complaint and pulling a thread that 99% of the members wouldn't take offence to.


----------



## bobmac (Mar 27, 2013)

I dont think forumers have a problem most of the time and life is grand but every now and then, some folk may feel that one or two mods go over the top and abuse their position and they just want to discuss it. That's the way I see it.


----------



## Hobbit (Mar 27, 2013)

Mod away guys. Its a tough job and no doubt done with the best interests of the forum and GM at heart. I might not agree with some of modding but I accept why its been done.


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

bobmac said:



			I dont think forumers have a problem most of the time and life is grand but every now and then, some folk may feel that one or two mods go over the top and abuse their position and they just want to discuss it. That's the way I see it.
		
Click to expand...

And that's the way it is Bob. But no, you aren't allowed to discuss it. You are told to "stop bleating" and are accused of "mod bashing". 
The mods that I am talking about know who they are. But they are sitting there safe in their ivory towers laughing as they get away with it time and time again. I know for a fact that complaints have been aired about them before. But nothing is done.
It's a two way street this moderating lark.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

ScienceBoy said:



			People with infractions should be locked out of the "Out of Bounds" section as punishment! Would also be a good deterrent.
		
Click to expand...

So that would mean anyone with an infraction would be reduced to commenting on the best rain suit.  That is harsh, and speaking as someone with a few infractions I do not second that motion.


----------



## Val (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			So I repeat , got a problem with a mod or mod decision, refer it to MikeH
Otherwise stop bleating
		
Click to expand...

And you say not heavy handed?

Some mods do appear to have huge egos now whereas before they were decent posters


----------



## Ethan (Mar 27, 2013)

It is pretty easy to say that there is over-Modding. I have done so myself in the past.

Things look slightly different when you see PMs with various descriptions of yourself that the sender would not have the Pro V1s to say to your face in a pub, not even north of the border. We do not respond in open fora to those, but sometimes action is needed. It is never taken lightly and there is always discussion before a ban or infraction, and if an infraction is given unnecessarily, it can be reversed after discussion. 

The fact is that GM set the rules and we simply do our best to enforce them sensibly. Is that always done perfectly? No, but most of us have day jobs and lives to get on with rather than spending hours pouring over every post that used a certain term, or in sending multiple PMs to investigate something.

If anyone has an issue or thinks there is an inconsistency or unfairness, they can send a PM to any or all Mods and they will get a response. Better to do that than to have a case of handbags with another member.


----------



## User20205 (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			So I repeat , got a problem with a mod or mod decision, refer it to MikeH
Otherwise stop bleating
		
Click to expand...




Valentino said:



			And you say not heavy handed?

Some mods do appear to have huge egos now whereas before they were decent posters
		
Click to expand...

sorry Phil I agree, that sounds terrible


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

therod said:



			sorry Phil I agree, that sounds terrible 

Click to expand...

I did comment. But removed it. You see, I can moderate myself sometimes.
I received an infraction for something not much worse than that.


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

Once again The Forum descends towards oblivion....

Some people are taking this far too seriously - so a thread is locked, so an infraction is handed out, maybe even a ban - in the great scheme of things this is not a big deal.

Yes it may be annoying when a thread gets locked but ususally by the time it is the thread's either a slanging match or it's got boring anyway.
Life's too short to get wound up about this. 
I come here to chat - not much more, not much less.

If someone appointed by Mike wants to "change the conversation" then it gets changed.
Big Deal - move on
Think of something else to say

This isn't Real Life Guys - it's a Chat Room!

Another dose of perspective required all round......


----------



## Val (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			I did comment. But removed it. You see, I can moderate myself sometimes.
I received an infraction for something not much worse than that.
		
Click to expand...

Smiffy, I'm not saying you are suggesting one but if I got it for that general comment it would prove a point.

And for mods that think its was aimed at them individually in particular, you should ask yourself why you think that way. Some mods are very good on here and go about it very well but not all.


----------



## AmandaJR (Mar 27, 2013)

I think it's a bit chicken and egg - are the mods being heavy handed OR in fact are forum users pushing the limits more often and in some cases almost goading a moderator to respond?

For me, in my time here, I'd say it's the latter and can't believe how threads deteriorate into a slanging match from nothing...

Maybe we all need some sunshine, warmth and decent golf conditions!


----------



## Val (Mar 27, 2013)

Imurg said:



			Once again The Forum descends towards oblivion....

Some people are taking this far too seriously - so a thread is locked, so an infraction is handed out, maybe even a ban - in the great scheme of things this is not a big deal.

Yes it may be annoying when a thread gets locked but ususally by the time it is the thread's either a slanging match or it's got boring anyway.
Life's too short to get wound up about this. 
I come here to chat - not much more, not much less.

If someone appointed by Mike wants to "change the conversation" then it gets changed.
Big Deal - move on
Think of something else to say

This isn't Real Life Guys - it's a Chat Room!

Another dose of perspective required all round......
		
Click to expand...

Of course it is and the reason we all come back more than anything is the enjoyment of what we read here

BUT

When this enjoyment gets eroded then surely its better to ask why?


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

Imurg said:



			Some people are taking this far too seriously - so a thread is locked, so an infraction is handed out, maybe even a ban - in the great scheme of things this is not a big deal.
		
Click to expand...

It is a big deal when you see the Forum you have been a member of for a fair number of years lose members because of over moderating. The forum now is just a pale imitation of what it once was. For somebody with a passion for the forum, thats such a shame.


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

Valentino said:



			Of course it is and the reason we all come back more than anything is the enjoyment of what we read here

BUT

When this enjoyment gets eroded then surely its better to ask why?
		
Click to expand...

And the way to do that is through PM to the Mods or MIkeH not starting threads like "why was my thread removed"
That's how things begin to deteriorate and it spreads to other threads.
Constant reference to someone on Holiday fuels things. Why is he on Holiday? Rule breaking?
There have been great debates and discussions here that haven't needed any Modding at all.
They seem fewer and further between - and if they need to be Modded then Rules must have been broken........
I can't get my head round it.


----------



## Ethan (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			It is a big deal when you see the Forum you have been a member of for a fair number of years lose members because of over moderating. The forum now is just a pale imitation of what it once was. For somebody with a passion for the forum, thats such a shame.
		
Click to expand...

Smiffy, unfortunately you are contributing to that demise by keeping on and on on threads like this. Guests and new members just so some oldies moaning about the past, so they clear off and go to GolfWRX instead.

Why don't you post about golf? That would help the forum.

The fact is that as these fora get bigger, they need more management. That becomes complex when you have members then challenging every decision and sending links to multiple similar posts since the start of the forum. Also, people tire of fora after a while and sometimes sign off by being disruptive and stirring the pot as they leave. That has happened here. 

The Mods get little thanks from members, and this year the GM Mods Masters trip to Augusta is going to be in Business rather than First and not even going to include the final round!* 

We do get a lot of abuse, though, some in the fora and some in PMs and whines to MikeH. We mostly don't/can't respond to it as we would like. 








* That is a joke if anyone has their SOH switched right off.


----------



## Val (Mar 27, 2013)

Imurg said:



			And the way to do that is through PM to the Mods or MIkeH not starting threads like "why was my thread removed"
That's how things begin to deteriorate and it spreads to other threads.
Constant reference to someone on Holiday fuels things. Why is he on Holiday? Rule breaking?
There have been great debates and discussions here that haven't needed any Modding at all.
They seem fewer and further between - and if they need to be Modded then Rules must have been broken........
I can't get my head round it.
		
Click to expand...

Maybe so, but why should you personally PM a mod when someone else's thread gets removed, its a massive vicious circle and mods would have a far harder job than they do now.

I said it months ago, the forum is potentially in danger of having more lurkers than posters and some of the moderating is heavy handed and not needed.

I'm not suggesting a free for all, far from it and realise the negative exposure that GM potentially could get but surely a wind up on a forum between "friends" doesn't need locking or moving. 

If it gets close to the bone then yes do it but does it really ever get that close?


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

Hobbit said:



			Mod away guys. Its a tough job and no doubt done with the best interests of the forum and GM at heart. I might not agree with some of modding but I accept why its been done.
		
Click to expand...

Finally a post of common sense. Thank you Hobbit.

I normally read threads such as this, and do not post. I bite my tongue and move on. I think those that know me well enough know I'm pretty mild mannered at the best of times.

Not  today.

I'm sorry gentlemen, but this is well and truly pathetic.

Moderators are here to enforce the rules of the forum. Rules set out by GM and it's staff. We don't make the rules.

If it is beyond your ability to post in a polite, civil and *adult, I.E grown up mannor*, then, quite frankly, don't post.

As for those who say "certain" moderators "Abuse" their powers, I'm sorry but you have absolutely zero idea what goes on on in the back ground.

Posts are not just pulled, there is no, one mod on the moderator panel in overall control. Any decision to pull/ammend/delete a thread is a collective decision taken after private consultation in the moderator section of the forum.

I class myself as one of those "Power hungry" moderators as I contribute to the discussions that result, sometimes, in action being taken. If you would like to discuss this with me further, drop me a PM.

What I will add is that not every thread that gets reported gets actioned. There have been plenty of threads on here in recent memory (Over the last week) that have been reported, discussed, and allowed to run. If they eventually have to become locked or removed as it's decended into a petty and argumementative thread, it is discussed *again* prior to it being locked.

As Hobbit says. You may not agree with some of the moderator decisions on here, and that is your right. However at least try and understand why a decision has been taken. If you can't understand why, drop one of us a PM and you will receive clarification.

It really is as simple as that. Keep it civil, on topic and in good humor and the thread will run. If you can't do these most basic of things, I suggest you look for another forum.

Edit: I also forgot to mention that non of the moderators here get paid, kick backs or preferential treatment from GM for the work they do. It's done out of our own time. Do you really think we want more work than we already have in our lives!


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

OK, GM host this forum, their name and image are the figurehead

Posts on a manufacturer end up negative and going nowhere, its bad for GM. regardless what individuals think.

Now if you were Overseeing it and saw something degenrating and potentially harming your name would you not then remedy that?

This is the point that needs to come across. Its not about mods being over zealous, individuals overstepping the mark etc etc.

Its about the forum being a benefit to GM and an asset to its brand and image. Not something that becomes a possible rotten egg!

think on that please, personal opinions, past debates aside.


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

Ethan said:



			Why don't you post about golf? That would help the forum.
		
Click to expand...

Because I am not playing as much golf now so have nothing really to contribute.
My interest in golf is waning of late...I'm not blaming the forum for that, but my general golfing "apathy" seems to have coincided with the way things have gone on here for the past 6 months or so. A lot of the regular posters don't post anymore. I used to organise loads of meets for the forum. Now? I can't be arsed. 
Trying to introduce new ideas I put it to the forum about starting up a "for sale" section for non golf related items. Not for my benefit, but it seemed silly for members to miss out on items from other members that would have just gone on ebay. 
The idea was "generally" well received and I was informed that the idea would be given more thought.
About two or three months later I posted, asking if any more thought had been given to the idea. Harmless post, not controversial in any way.
Response? A smart Alec mod just replied "No".  No further explanation, or attempt to rekindle the idea. Just a simple "no".
And don't try to justify the response. It was a smart Alec reply. Nothing less. And I can imagine he had a grin on his face when he posted it.
So an attempt to try something different was dismissed out of hand. Why bother?


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

After reading thro this whole thread I do agree that the Mod's do have their work cut out and as they are human sometimes they will get it wrong, what I can't understand that after reading all the post not once has one of them accepted they have got anything wrong yet most of the members posts on this are saying that they do get it wrong and go in all guns blazing.

Maybe rather than defend and tell folk its "your" way or the highway you should all go to a dark room as discus where you could improve, surely all the members can't be wrong.

I maybe wrong but from where I am sitting it looks this way and your constant defending of your actions will only add fuel to the fire and then we know any member who questions it will get infractions or a holiday.


----------



## bluewolf (Mar 27, 2013)

Hey Gareth, you can take this as a good or a bad thing. But until you posted that explanation, I hadn't even realized that you were a Mod. Some of your colleagues are very easy to spot. 

I have no complaints about the moderation on this forum. It is what it is and I have no doubt that it's hard work and not very satisfying. Carry on lads...


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			After reading thro this whole thread I do agree that the Mod's do have their work cut out and as they are human sometimes they will get it wrong, what I can't understand that after reading all the post not once has one of them accepted they have got anything wrong yet most of the members posts on this are saying that they do get it wrong and go in all guns blazing.

Maybe rather than defend and tell folk its "your" way or the highway you should all go to a dark room as discus where you could improve, surely all the members can't be wrong.

I maybe wrong but from where I am sitting it looks this way and your constant defending of your actions will only add fuel to the fire and then we know any member who questions it will get infractions or a holiday.
		
Click to expand...

I agree, the actions of the mods is always 100% defended and justified and at _no time_ have I ever heard or read that "we got that one wrong but we've learnt from it".

I can't see why we can't have a section called "*The Bunker*". An area where you have to tic a box declaring your over 18 and that you accept their will be controversial discussions within it and possibly bad language etc. Topics from any section that a mod feels is pushing the open public boundaries could be simply moved to that area rather than it being closed or removed.

As this section would not be openly seen by the public it resolves so many issues being spoken about here, which is becoming like an old 33.5rpm record and will not resolve or take us forward.

The forum at times doesn't come across as proactive to resolve some issues, it just throw rules & regs at you and state "that's how it is, like it or find another forum", that's not very inclusive is it, its just dictatorial and inflamatory!


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

seriously, take a look in the mirror folks and get off the band wagon.

Keyboard warriors r us on here lately...

cya next week, off to get a life for a few days.


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

Here's an idea.
Lets continue bickering like schoolkids and see how long it takes for Mike to get so racked off with it that he just shuts the whole thing down......


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			it just throw rules & regs at you and state "that's how it is, like it or find another forum", that's not very inclusive is it, its just dictatorial and inflamatory!
		
Click to expand...

Much like golf dress codes.  Boom and indeed Zing. Way to go tying in 2 hot topics together. 

And by the way I am in no way endorsing what Fish said.  As I'd call it _Deep Rough_, a much better name.


----------



## stevie_r (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			I can't see why we can't have a section called "*The Bunker*". An area where you have to tic a box declaring your over 18 and that you accept their will be controversial discussions within it and possibly bad language etc. Topics from any section that a mod feels is pushing the open public boundaries could be simply moved to that area rather than it being closed or removed.
		
Click to expand...

It certainly works well on a number of other fora I use; a number of criteria to be fulfilled for access, e.g.  

Minimum membership period.
Minimum post count.
Specific Ts & Cs and a disclaimer.

Job done


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

Hacker Khan said:



			And by the way I am in no way endorsing what Fish said.  As I'd call it _Deep Rough_, a much better name.
		
Click to expand...

Along with a "place to go" like:

The Bunker
Deep Rough
[any more people]

infractions could be made to be more humorous to take on the chin as they accumulate and shown in your profile.

1 infraction = Air Shot
2 infractions = Bunker
3 Infractions = Water Hazard 
3 Day Ban = Lost Ball
7 Day Ban = Clubs Stolen

Just a warped idea


----------



## stevie_r (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			Along with a "place to go" like:

The Bunker
Deep Rough
[any more people]
		
Click to expand...

Lateral water hazard with ball attracting powers


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

stevie_r said:



			Lateral water hazard with Stepanie Powers
		
Click to expand...

She was nice once upon a time wasn't she


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			Maybe rather than defend and tell folk its "your" way or the highway you should all go to a dark room as discus where you could improve, surely *all* the members can't be wrong.
		
Click to expand...

Sorry, I didn'realise you spoke for *all* 15000+ members of the GM site. 

Have you visited, to use your words, a "Dark room " to consider your actions and posts on here........ No I didn't think so 



Bomber69 said:



			I maybe wrong but from where I am sitting it looks this way and your constant defending of your actions will only add fuel to the fire and then we know any member who questions it will get infractions or a holiday.
		
Click to expand...

Moderators have, on numerous threads, stated sometimes we make mistakes, were human. We, as a group, have openly admitted to previous failings that have been made, but made in the thought of keepng the forum a respectable place to be.

From where I'm sat, any fire that has been started, started a long time ago. All you are doing is fanning the flames.


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

Smiffy said:



			She was nice once upon a time wasn't she
		
Click to expand...

Did she have "ball attracting powers"? :mmm:


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			Hey Gareth, you can take this as a good or a bad thing. But until you posted that explanation, I hadn't even realized that you were a Mod. Some of your colleagues are very easy to spot. 

I have no complaints about the moderation on this forum. It is what it is and I have no doubt that it's hard work and not very satisfying. Carry on lads...
		
Click to expand...

Whether that is a good, or bad thing, I'll leave firmly up to you my man :thup:


----------



## Smiffy (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			Did she have "ball attracting powers"? :mmm:
		
Click to expand...


She did.
Many's the time I washed it/them rather furiously


----------



## North Mimms (Mar 27, 2013)

Here's a solution for the dissenters....

Long long ago on a forum far far away there was a group of posters (including me) who didn't like the rules.
We frequently got our knuckles rapped for overstepping the line, and many went on short holidays to places like Bognor.
We hated the fact that we were "overly modded"

So we flounced off and set up an alternate forum on Facebook.

All was happy for a while.
No one minded if we said ........... or ...............  or said that another forum member was a ................

Then it got boring.
We had nothing much to say anymore.

The original forum is the worse for our absence but the New Forum has died too.

Give it a go....





you'll be back here soon.


If it still exists.


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			Sorry, I didn'realise you spoke for *all* 15000+ members of the GM site. 

Have you visited, to use your words, a "Dark room " to consider your actions and posts on here........ No I didn't think so 



Moderators have, on numerous threads, stated sometimes we make mistakes, were human. We, as a group, have openly admitted to previous failings that have been made, but made in the thought of keepng the forum a respectable place to be.

From where I'm sat, any fire that has been started, started a long time ago. All you are doing is fanning the flames.
		
Click to expand...

Debate Gareth, it's called debating some of the issues and I never at any point said I was talking for the "15000+" members only talking about most of the members who have posted on this thread. Your trying to turn this into something not me.


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			Debate Gareth, it's called debating some of the issues and I never at any point said I was talking for the "15000+" members only talking about most of the members who have posted on this thread. Your are trying to turn this into something not me.
		
Click to expand...

I'm not trying to trun anything into anything else, hence me using a direct quote from you. It's now gone from all the members, to most of the members. Will the next step be "some" of the members 

I'll make it wasy for you. Here's your post.



Bomber69 said:



			After reading thro this whole thread I do agree that the Mod's do have their work cut out and as they are human sometimes they will get it wrong, what I can't understand that after reading all the post not once has one of them accepted they have got anything wrong yet most of the members posts on this are saying that they do get it wrong and go in all guns blazing.

Maybe rather than defend and tell folk its "your" way or the highway you should all go to a dark room as discus where you could improve, surely all the members can't be wrong.

I maybe wrong but from where I am sitting it looks this way and your constant defending of your actions will only add fuel to the fire and then we know any member who questions it will get infractions or a holiday.
		
Click to expand...

Tell me exactly from this post what are we debating?

All I see here is opinion, blatant guess work and an attempt, and a poor one at that, to deflect attention from yourself and your conduct on Ricks thread. Nothing in your post remotely looks like its up for debate.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

bluewolf said:



			Hey Gareth, you can take this as a good or a bad thing. But until you posted that explanation, I hadn't even realized that you were a Mod. Some of your colleagues are very easy to spot.
		
Click to expand...

Isn't the clue that it says *Global Moderator* under his name?


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

Hacker Khan said:



			Isn't the clue that it says *Global Moderator* under his name?  

Click to expand...


I think he was talking more about my posting style as opposed to anything else :thup:



But you are right :smirk:


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			I'm not trying to trun anything into anything else, hence me using a direct quote from you. It's now gone from all the members, to most of the members. Will the next step be "some" of the members 

I'll make it wasy for you. Here's your post.



Tell me exactly from this post what are we debating?

All I see here is opinion, blatant guess work and an attempt, and a poor one at that, to deflect attention from yourself and your conduct on Ricks thread. Nothing in your post remotely looks like its up for debate.
		
Click to expand...

Lets be clear Gareth and read what I said don't go making things up.

After reading thro this whole thread I do agree that the Mod's do have their work cut out and as they are human sometimes they will get it wrong, what I can't understand that after reading all the post not once has one of them accepted they have got anything wrong *yet most of the members posts on this are saying that they do get it wrong and go in all guns blazing.
*

As for Rick's post I wished him will with my first post and then later it was about an Rules Infringement that was getting pointed out so please don't go blaming the members for bringing it to the attention of the MOD's.

Maybe in future it can or will be done via PM if you guys missing some other breaking of the rules. You do now realize you have brought this up thread up again after it has been closed, or is that my fault also.


----------



## One Planer (Mar 27, 2013)

Bomber69 said:



			As for Rick's post I wished him will with my first post and then later it was about an Rules Infringement that was getting pointed out so please don't go blaming the members for bringing it to the attention of the MOD's.

Maybe in future it can or will be done via PM if you guys missing some other breaking of the rules. You do now realize you have brought this up thread up again after it has been closed, or is that my fault also.
		
Click to expand...

If we get it wrong so often, why have GM not acted to bring us to task? If we are doing such a poor job moderating their forum, surely this would have happened?

As fore the reporting of posts/threads/sigantures missed by moderators. I have no issue with users reporting posts/threads/signatures that are unsuitable or contain, as in this case a commercial siganture. Most people follow the correct channels.

In this instance did you? No! And this is exactly the point I'm making.

You know full well how to report posts to moderators attention using the report function, you have done so multiple times. 

Did you choose on that occasion to use the same function to report a commercial siganture to the moderator team by reporting the post? No.

You decided to post it out in the forum knowing full well the ramifications of what would follow. If you had reported the post, as you are fully capable, the thread would have unlikley decended to the level it did.

I fully realise I brought Ricks thread into this to prove a very specific point. 

You had the option to report the post through the correct channels. Did you? No. Yet you blame moderators for how the thread deteriorated. How's the view from your glass house?


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			You know full well how to report posts to moderators attention using the report function, you have done so multiple times.
		
Click to expand...


----------



## bigslice (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



 

Click to expand...


no one likes a grass lol


----------



## jimbob.someroo (Mar 27, 2013)

Gareth said:



			You know full well how to report posts to moderators attention using the report function, you have done so multiple times.
		
Click to expand...




Fish said:



 

Click to expand...

I know that it shouldn't be seen as a negative thing to report someone, but, personally, I don't think mod's should disclose when/if individuals have reported something.

I wont comment on the rest of the thread as I've not been here as long as some, and personally am ok with how things are running. But, I do like 'the bunker' idea :thup:

Hopefully when the weather's better and we get outside playing golf, we may have some more upbeat things to chat about!


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

After the initial mention about his Link by Steve I pointed out that Bob had to take his link out of his post, then there was a lot of debate from members & Mods, it took a while for anything to get done, don't you think the Mods at the initial point could have acted quicker and issued a post clarifying the position and maybe that would have save the post going the way it did. No rather than do that a few of the members got the blame for spoiling the post. 

Mods have the power to clean/delate posts so why could this not have been done and it would have saved it getting locked, all that was needed was a Mod to say there was a breach of the advertising rule and that it would be sorted and that a few posts have been removed to tidy the issue up.

Any way it all over and done with now so maybe lessons to be learnt on both sides........


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

bigslice said:



			no one likes a grass lol
		
Click to expand...

Its a well known fact that the biggest grasses are the villains themselves, to protect their empires :rofl:

Sam, I'm disappointed that you are a serial reporter


----------



## Bomber69 (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			Its a well known fact that the biggest grasses are the villains themselves, to protect their empires :rofl:

Sam, I'm disappointed that you are a serial reporter 

Click to expand...

Robin, I would not say a serial reporter I have only ever reported 3-4 things that were out with the GM Guidelines.

Doing my bit for the Forum is the way I see it:whoo:

I know the Mods are only human and can miss things on here so just helping out where I can.


----------



## BTatHome (Mar 27, 2013)

Feels a bit like groundhog day at the moment, pretty much everyday the same type of thread bemoaning a thread being removed/locked/moderated.

Personally if I don't like a thread,or even a whole forum, I ignore it. I think I have enough self restraint to not constantly post to antagonise or try to belittle people (whether that's normal members, or the Mods).

Mod actions are a necessary part of public forums, and if threads are removed (hidden) then many people wouldn't even know about them (except when people get upset and post all these threads complaining about said thread being removed), if threads are moderated and posts removed the thread can sometimes become difficult to follow, particularly if people make reference to posts that were removed.

Anyway I do follow the 'if you don't like it then you know where the door is' philosophy, there are lots of forums out there. I very much doubt you would find another one with the breadth of thread variety and traffic ... plus they all had moderation to one degree or another, personally the worst ones are the ones that take forever to perform mod actions.


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

http://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/showthread.php?52858-GM-forum-general-notice-Please-read


----------



## JustOne (Mar 27, 2013)

Shame Rick's thread got locked, didn't see what happened to make the thread get 'messy' but wish him the best with his new sticks and kudos to the mods for attempting to keep things clean/fair/within the rules.




(didn't realise Bomber was a snitch... but now we know)  LOLOL


----------



## bluewolf (Mar 27, 2013)

Well, I'm glad I missed most of this as I was out golfing. Just to let you know, Lahinch is every bit as good as its reputation. Even when the wind is blowing and the wind chill is down to about -10. That course has more places to lose balls than almost any other that i've played. It really is beautiful...

Oh, and Gareth, it was a comment about your posting style and not anything else. Yes I can read the little descriptions under the avatars, but I rarely bother to do so....:thup:


----------



## dufferman (Mar 27, 2013)

+1 to the bunker / deep rough / over 18's / 'GM not responsible for what goes on in this area' forum.

At least that way those who want to descend into the depths of hell can do so without ruining other posts


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

dufferman said:



			+1 to the bunker / deep rough / over 18's / 'GM not responsible for what goes on in this area' forum.

At least that way those who want to descend into the depths of hell can do so without ruining other posts 

Click to expand...

Such an idea is ok on a small forum, but the feasibility to operate such a thing is not so easy given the vast number of members who may request entrance. GM staff would be constantly approving entry to such an area. 

Also its all well and good in theory, but how I couldn't stand on a TeeBox at a forum meet if I'd said some of the things that are currently being said, so I don't know how anyone could do that if things become a free for all type area. 

That's if people use it, I have seen a few forums start such ideas and members just don't take it up for worry of becoming outcast or of offending others.


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

The amount of work needed to "vet" everyone who would try to enter the section would be more than considerable..
And as this place is supposed to be a virtual clubhouse then having a section like that suggested would be inappropriate.


----------



## PhilTheFragger (Mar 27, 2013)

I dont think that GM would sanction a "no holds barred" section, its a golf forum run by a golf magazine, its a commercial enterprise and they dont want the GM brand damaged or tarnished by the sort of stuff that would occur there

Just my humble opinion

Why dont you email Mike with the idea to get his take on it


----------



## Whereditgo (Mar 27, 2013)

Reading all these threads over the last few days and weeks has become tedious in the extreme, it seems that almost every thread descends into a petty squabble. Whatever happened to everyones sense of humour? When I joined the forum there was real wit and banter, rarely if ever was anyone so precious as to get upset over a bit of micky taking. Barely a day went by that Smiffy wasn't calling someone a 'device for opening doors' for e.g.

No one cared, no one got their delicate little feelings hurt and I didn't even know mods existed!

Nowadays it seems you can replace wit and banter with sarcasm and insults!

Then we wonder why so many of the original and oft missed characters left and regular posters rarely contribute any longer.

I've met and played golf with some great guys from this site and thanks to G.M. played some memorable courses, but......

Think I've seen enough - Happy Golfing All! :cheers:


----------



## bigslice (Mar 27, 2013)

no need for a no holds barred section, just think before you post.


----------



## patricks148 (Mar 27, 2013)

Whereditgo said:



			Reading all these threads over the last few days and weeks has become tedious in the extreme, it seems that almost every thread descends into a petty squabble. Whatever happened to everyones sense of humour? When I joined the forum there was real wit and banter, rarely if ever was anyone so precious as to get upset over a bit of micky taking. Barely a day went by that Smiffy wasn't calling someone a 'device for opening doors' for e.g.

No one cared, no one got their delicate little feelings hurt and I didn't even know mods existed!



Nowadays it seems you can replace wit and banter with sarcasm and insults!

Then we wonder why so many of the original and oft missed characters left and regular posters rarely contribute any longer.

I've met and played golf with some great guys from this site and thanks to G.M. played some memorable courses, but......

Think I've seen enough - Happy Golfing All! :cheers:
		
Click to expand...

Very true old boy, its just not what it used to be!


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

life rarely is chaps


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

PhilTheFragger said:



			I dont think that GM would sanction a "no holds barred" section, its a golf forum run by a golf magazine, its a commercial enterprise and they dont want the GM brand damaged or tarnished by the sort of stuff that would occur there

Just my humble opinion

Why dont you email Mike with the idea to get his take on it
		
Click to expand...

If its not in the public eye, it can't damage anything can it?

I'm sometimes disappointed with some of the responses to idea's put forward by forum members of which some I think are actually OK.  They are at times simply dismissed far too easily. 

I always told my staff that its far easier to find a reason (excuse) to not do something than it is to find out how to accomplish it. The reward though when you accomplish it is, it never rises its head again and is put to bed.  I wish this philosophy would be taken up at times rather than an easy dismissal as it takes things forward rather than standing still.

I would rather see some things tried and fail than not try them at all


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			I would rather see some things tried and fail than not try them at all 

Click to expand...

get a driver then


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

G1BB0 said:



			get a driver then 

Click to expand...

Got a 13* that does me fine thanks


----------



## Rooter (Mar 27, 2013)

WOW i have been out all day and just read this thread and MikeH's in the lounge..

unbelievable in all honesty, i have seen it on forums before where everyone goes a little off the rails, the mods get bashed and i have no idea why. I understand a lot of people here are frustrated with not playing golf due to recent rubbish weather, but sort it out chaps. life is way too short for this rubbish.

If it takes a number of high profile ISP bans, so be it. people might show each other, GM and the mods a little bit of respect.

time to grow up gents, anyone want a hug?


----------



## bluewolf (Mar 27, 2013)

Rooter said:



			time to grow up gents, anyone want a hug?
		
Click to expand...

Not from you... You'd only get a bit Rand......IER....


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

It would have to be hosted on a competely different website - IPC wouldn't look twice unless it was.
Plus who's going to Police it? It has to be Policed otherwise it would be open to any sort of illegal or immoral activity. If it has to be Policed, and please don't say it wouldn't need to be, how far are you going be able to go before crossing the line?
In the end it becomes like the forum is now except you can use swear words....not exactly a leap forward is it.


----------



## bladeplayer (Mar 27, 2013)

Tried to get through most of the posts durng the day , im a bit mistafied [sp]to be honest , this forum is a FREE service provided to us by GM,    CAN WE AGREE THAT BIT IS TRUE ? ? 

We pay to join the gym , we pay to join the golf club & we pay to join most other clubs aswell . CAN WE AGREE ON THAT ?

So we pay (often big  fees) to join a club/clubs , when we sign up we agree to obey the rules that are in place in that club & we do so no bother .. 

BUT when we join a FREE forum that gives us fittings , clothes, balls , days out , help & advice , one that also has rules in place,
 one that gives to,  rather than takes from us,  people choose that they dont want to obey the rules laid down ..? think about that 

Simple realy if you dont like it,  dont use it , if your not happy with the product , search for an alternative    

As for people geting personal or taking things personaly , i like ye lot on here but if you start geting personal i just wouldnt be bothered reacting to you , if we are having a debate on something & you get personal , that just means you ost the debate because you could no longer stick to the point .. 

If you cant debate or discuss properly without lowering the tone , then no forum is for you let alone this one .. 

Time to grow up and see the valuable forum we have , for free , what we get, and the chances we are given to win once in a lifetime oppertunities for just an email or post , 

So ok there maybe a few negatives on here in your eyes,  but when the positives far outweigh the negatives its something to be accepted ..and if after weighing it up you decide there are more negatives than positives for you , then this is not the place for you , take care,  play good golf , enjoy good health & feel free to pop back anytime you want 

Just my opinion on the subject tho ..


----------



## JustOne (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			If its not in the public eye, it can't damage anything can it?
		
Click to expand...

Yes... it would if I post the things I want to say about you 

Seriously though I was a member of a forum that had a private PAID FOR section and you didn't get in otherwise... was always awkward when someone joined it and realised what everyone else was saying about them before they joined the private bit 

I don't think there's a need to suddenly have an 18's area to let people get rude, obnoxious or vent at another individual rather than just having a bog standard, civil forum as this one is 'trying' to be. Learning to express your opinions in writing without having to swear should be considered an ADVANTAGE not a downfall.


----------



## LIG (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



*If its not in the public eye, it can't damage anything can it?*

I'm sometimes disappointed with some of the responses to idea's put forward by forum members of which some I think are actually OK.  They are at times simply dismissed far too easily.
		
Click to expand...

Do you seriously believe that GM would want to be in any way associated with what you are suggesting?  I doubt it!

IMHO it's quite sensible for GM to decide that they want a *Golf* forum to only about *Golf*, and they may even simply remove the OOB section we love so much as well. Something worth thinking about! 

Also, has anyone considered what the forum appears to a new lurker?  Not a pretty read at times, imo!


----------



## Phil2511 (Mar 27, 2013)

LIG said:



			Do you seriously believe that GM would want to be in any way associated with what you are suggesting?  I doubt it!

IMHO it's quite sensible for GM to decide that they want a *Golf* forum to only about *Golf*, and they may even simply remove the OOB section we love so much as well. Something worth thinking about! 

Also, has anyone considered what the forum appears to a new lurker?  Not a pretty read at times, imo!
		
Click to expand...

Well said.


----------



## bigslice (Mar 27, 2013)

JustOne said:



			Yes... it would if I post the things I want to say about you 

Seriously though I was a member of a forum that had a private PAID FOR section and you didn't get in otherwise... was always awkward when someone joined it and realised what everyone else was saying about them before they joined the private bit 

I don't think there's a need to suddenly have an 18's area to let people get rude, obnoxious or vent at another individual rather than just having a bog standard, civil forum as this one is 'trying' to be. Learning to express your opinions in writing without having to swear should be considered an ADVANTAGE not a downfall.
		
Click to expand...

lol dont take offence to this bit justone, but is this what you mean 'do you know your dad?'


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

LIG said:



			Do you seriously believe that GM would want to be in any way associated with what you are suggesting?  I doubt it!

IMHO it's quite sensible for GM to decide that they want a *Golf* forum to only about *Golf*, and they may even simply remove the OOB section we love so much as well. Something worth thinking about! 

Also, has anyone considered what the forum appears to a new lurker?  Not a pretty read at times, imo!
		
Click to expand...

I'm just debating both sides of the argument based on the replies given, nothing more, nothing less.


----------



## LIG (Mar 27, 2013)

Fish said:



			I'm just debating both sides of the argument based on the replies given, nothing more, nothing less.
		
Click to expand...

Sorry, thought your post #96 was clear about which side of the fence you were on!  

(Bloomin bband is givin me gyp! Can't seem to stay connected!)


----------



## Fish (Mar 27, 2013)

LIG said:



			Sorry, thought your post #96 was clear about which side of the fence you were on!  

(Bloomin bband is givin me gyp! Can't seem to stay connected!) 

Click to expand...

No not really, the first line was simply in response to brand and image damage and the rest of the post was a general observation when people put idea's forward.


----------



## Hacker Khan (Mar 27, 2013)

LIG said:



			Do you seriously believe that GM would want to be in any way associated with what you are suggesting?  I doubt it!

IMHO it's quite sensible for GM to decide that they want a *Golf* forum to only about *Golf*, and they may even simply remove the OOB section we love so much as well. Something worth thinking about! 

Also, has anyone considered what the forum appears to a new lurker?  Not a pretty read at times, imo!
		
Click to expand...

It's not pretty to existing posters either at times.

But then again one could argue that any internet forum is mostly the same.  The internet allows anonymity which means people will generally exaggerate their personality.  It's all well saying that you should behave as you would do face to face.  But in the real world it's not going to happen as it's an internet forum, people behave differently on the internet (many studies prove this) and in a way it's a bit naive to expect people exhibit the same behaviours.  For example if I was in a crowd of golfers I did not know I would not saying this to your face.

Of course there's absolutely no need to resort to abuse and I am not justifying what has gone on (not that I have seen a lot of it but I can imagine), but people can and do hide behind a keyboard.  And some of this unfortunately comes with the territory.

I actually feel the the language on this one is a lot better than just about every other one I have been on.  Also if the OOB section went then it would be very boring very quickly.  As I've only been on the forum for a few months but I've seen the same posts in the golf section over and over again.

But totally agree a commercial organisation is not going to sanction a section where anything goes, no matter what you need to do to get into it.  It will still be under the GM banner and in todays corporate world, it understandably ain't going to happen.


----------



## SocketRocket (Mar 27, 2013)

Has anyone noticed how Ed Balls looks more like Kim Jong-un every week?  

This may be a little off topic but its about time something was.


----------



## USER1999 (Mar 27, 2013)

I can't believe I've just sat and read most of this. I am sooooo bored. And tired.

This is the same old guff, reheated. Did all this really need saying? Again? 

I think not.


----------



## Foxholer (Mar 27, 2013)

murphthemog said:



			I can't believe I've just sat and read most of this. I am sooooo bored. And tired.

This is the same old guff, reheated. Did all this really need saying? Again? 

I think not.
		
Click to expand...

How many times have you posted this? 

And I've told you a million time - don't exaggerate! 

But yes. Tediously repetitive!:mmm:


----------



## bluewolf (Mar 27, 2013)

Can't believe that some people are blaming the OOB section... People are at fault, not forum sub-sections.... You could take every sub section away except one, and people would still argue in the remaining one. Some people need to decide what they want. If they want to argue and rip the hell out of people then go somewhere else.


----------



## Scouser (Mar 27, 2013)

Wow what a thread.....










Any one fancy a game of golf :swing:




PS didnt read it except the last 2 posts which probably sum it up well


----------



## JustOne (Mar 27, 2013)

murphthemog said:



			This is the same old guff, reheated. Did all this really need saying? Again? 

I think not.
		
Click to expand...

They could save time by making it a 'sticky'.


----------



## Imurg (Mar 27, 2013)

Scouser said:



			Any one fancy a game of golf
		
Click to expand...

I would if the damn course was open.......


----------



## Scouser (Mar 27, 2013)

Imurg said:



			I would if the damn course was open.......
		
Click to expand...

Cabin fever


----------



## bigslice (Mar 27, 2013)

Scouser said:



			Wow what a thread.....










Any one fancy a game of golf :swing:




PS didnt read it except the last 2 posts which probably sum it up well
		
Click to expand...

i only started it to vent my frustration, think of it as road rage. felt better after posting it so it helped me. also my point being that no thread should be closed or removed unless there is something really really wrong . imo


----------



## the hammer (Mar 27, 2013)

This seems very reminiscent of of changes made at a local club,when, the olders members didnt agree, One comment made by the pro, for me put it into prospective  "THEY ARE MEMBERS of THE CLUB, NOT OWNERS OF THE CLUB"whether they like it or not.
seems a similar situation, there to be enjoyed by everybody, not just how a certain few want it.


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

:clap:


----------



## triple_bogey (Mar 27, 2013)

*''you hear about the grown men on forums crying over closed threads?''*


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

that wins post of the year, caption comp and anything else before and therafter

:thup:


----------



## Naybrains (Mar 27, 2013)

Grrrrrrr Would one of the wonderful Mods close this thread please....pretty please 

Move on.


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

I can't at the mo as still laughing over triples post


----------



## Liverbirdie (Mar 27, 2013)

bladeplayer said:



			Tried to get through most of the posts durng the day , im a bit mistafied [sp]to be honest , this forum is a FREE service provided to us by GM,    CAN WE AGREE THAT BIT IS TRUE ? ? 

We pay to join the gym , we pay to join the golf club & we pay to join most other clubs aswell . CAN WE AGREE ON THAT ?

So we pay (often big  fees) to join a club/clubs , when we sign up we agree to obey the rules that are in place in that club & we do so no bother .. 

BUT when we join a FREE forum that gives us fittings , clothes, balls , days out , help & advice , one that also has rules in place,
 one that gives to,  rather than takes from us,  people choose that they dont want to obey the rules laid down ..? think about that 

Simple realy if you dont like it,  dont use it , if your not happy with the product , search for an alternative    

As for people geting personal or taking things personaly , i like ye lot on here but if you start geting personal i just wouldnt be bothered reacting to you , if we are having a debate on something & you get personal , that just means you ost the debate because you could no longer stick to the point .. 

If you cant debate or discuss properly without lowering the tone , then no forum is for you let alone this one .. 

Time to grow up and see the valuable forum we have , for free , what we get, and the chances we are given to win once in a lifetime oppertunities for just an email or post , 

So ok there maybe a few negatives on here in your eyes,  but when the positives far outweigh the negatives its something to be accepted ..and if after weighing it up you decide there are more negatives than positives for you , then this is not the place for you , take care,  play good golf , enjoy good health & feel free to pop back anytime you want 

Just my opinion on the subject tho ..
		
Click to expand...

Well after reading through all of this and having various views, but not having a strong enough feeling to post either way, let me just say that the above is one of the most sensible perspectives. Everything isn't hunky dory, obviously, but looking at it from this perspective of "what if the GM forum closed tomorrow" - I think hundreds of us, if not more would be gutted. I would be.

Not perfect, but miles better than no forum at all. I do miss Craw though.

Well said bladeplayer! Hope your not practising too much, for our handicap challenge.


----------



## bigslice (Mar 27, 2013)

triple_bogey said:









*''you hear about the grown men on forums crying over closed threads?''*

Click to expand...

thats not funny, i was trying to put across a serious point stuff it that wins the caption contest


----------



## G1BB0 (Mar 27, 2013)

every time I see it I laugh.... timing is everything


----------



## HomerJSimpson (Mar 27, 2013)

Wow, another thread with a whole range of views. My take is simple. GM is a commercial activity and the forum is an extension of that. Therefore the behavious HAS to reflect this and not take the GM name and drag it through the mud. Loads of good ideas but I'm afraid I have to say the mod response of if you don't like it speak to MikeH is a recipe for disaster. He's in charge of the best magazine out there and his valuable time should be spent on making each edition as good as it can. If he ends up refereeing on petty squabbles the plug will get pulled PDQ.

There have been loads of petty squabbles over a whole gamut of topics and maybe it is cabin fever. Moderating is an unpaid and time consuming role. Yes I have been the victim of their actions and in the case of Homergate a whole apathy and could have handled that particular episode better. I have had posts removed and infractions. Whatever the rights and wrongs we are at a stage where mods are in place. I can't see them ever getting removed (aside from this weekend) and I have to say I fear for the long term future of the forum


----------



## bladeplayer (Mar 27, 2013)

Liverbirdie said:



			Well said bladeplayer! Hope your not practising too much, for our handicap challenge.
		
Click to expand...

Well it aint working mate @ 7.3 at present gone up .2 from 2 comps , i still have my dream of catching you tho :thup:,   keep looking over your shoulder


----------



## Liverbirdie (Mar 27, 2013)

bladeplayer said:



			Well it aint working mate @ 7.3 at present gone up .2 from 2 comps , i still have my dream of catching you tho :thup:,   keep looking over your shoulder 

Click to expand...

Possible putter fitting for me this week......... I must be scared.


----------

