# Football European super league.



## Tashyboy (Mar 2, 2016)

Don't know if this should of been in the "and we're off blog" and if it should then mods can you combine it, but.

I am proper bogged off, five big teams inc my own have had a meeting with an American billionaire with re to forming an European super league. Eh a flippin American? 

the American owners of Utd, Villa and Liverpool have shown they know diddly squat re the premier league, never mind European football.

Leicester and Spurs who for me are favourites for this years prem title have not been invited.

10 years ago, my club City would not of been invited, Utd as a club are one of the biggest in the world it will probably be not playing Champs league football next year, even Chelsea may struggle.

just read that Arsenal have said well " stick it up your jacksy" and good on them.

This is all about the rich getting richer, and it leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. Hope the fans tell them to get lost, coz I for one don't want it.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

There will always be a possibility of it happening - it came very close a while back but UEFA changed the CL to include more teams

Can see it happening and when it does Arsenal won't tell them to "stick it up their jacksy"

Can see it being a two league European League and it will include all the big teams and all the best players and will attract all the telly deals


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

How is the "Big 5" decided? I'd love to know the criteria, is it on global fan base or europe fan base or wealth of owner or club history or blah blah blah, I'm sure those in it can make a case, but for me it's purely about finance and not about the game.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			How is the "Big 5" decided? I'd love to know the criteria, is it on global fan base or europe fan base or wealth of owner or club history or blah blah blah, I'm sure those in it can make a case, but for me it's purely about finance and not about the game.
		
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Everything in football is purely about finance 

And the big 5 will be decided on which teams bring in the biggest worldwide appeal to fans - the clubs that are famous around the world and will attract the sponsers and players 

Arsenal
Chelsea
Liverpool
Man City
Man Utd 

There would have to be a way for other clubs to be able to enter the league or it's a closed comp


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## pbrown7582 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Everything in football is purely about finance 

And the big 5 will be decided on which teams bring in the biggest worldwide appeal to fans - the clubs that are famous around the world and will attract the sponsers and players 

Arsenal
Chelsea
Liverpool
Man City
Man Utd 

There would have to be a way for other clubs to be able to enter the league or it's a closed comp
		
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Oi stick your alphabetical order! :rofl:

Key ingredient to this all is the ability to sell match feed and or  highlights to mobile devices Â£1/Â£2 a match. Only about the money that's why all the overseas investment is here be it American Russian or Iranian.


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## FairwayDodger (Mar 2, 2016)

Just the latest example of the greed that blights the game at all levels.

The rich get richer and the rest can just just rot.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pbrown7582 said:



			Oi stick your alphabetical order! :rofl:

Key ingredient to this all is the ability to sell match feed and or  highlights to mobile devices Â£1/Â£2 a match. Only about the money that's why all the overseas investment is here be it American Russian or Iranian.
		
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I though Alphabetical was the fairest way to do it 

A European League would make the clubs and footballers billions but would kill loads of other areas of the game


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## Doon frae Troon (Mar 2, 2016)

A European League is almost inevitable, money talks.
I hope it involves promotion and relegation so we may then see some of the 'big five' end up with the likes of Wolves, Sheffeld Wednesday,
Portsmouth, Ipswich, Fulham and Charlton.
Money talks.


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## Stuart_C (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			How is the "Big 5" decided? I'd love to know the criteria, is it on global fan base or europe fan base or wealth of owner or club history or blah blah blah, I'm sure those in it can make a case, but for me it's purely about finance and not about the game.
		
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Spot on but there's 1 thing for certain, city nor Chelsea should anywhere the top table IMO.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

Doon frae Troon said:



			A European League is almost inevitable, money talks.
I hope it involves promotion and relegation so we may then see some of the 'big five' end up with the likes of Wolves, Sheffeld Wednesday,
Portsmouth, Ipswich, Fulham and Charlton.
Money talks.
		
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Those clubs won't ever be in a European Super IMO - they are not clubs that will attract what a European Super league needs


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 2, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			Don't know if this should of been in the "and we're off blog" and if it should then mods can you combine it, but.

I am proper bogged off, five big teams inc my own have had a meeting with an American billionaire with re to forming an European super league. Eh a flippin American? 

the American owners of Utd, Villa and Liverpool have shown they know diddly squat re the premier league, never mind European football.

Leicester and Spurs who for me are favourites for this years prem title have not been invited.

10 years ago, my club City would not of been invited, Utd as a club are one of the biggest in the world it will probably be not playing Champs league football next year, even Chelsea may struggle.

just read that Arsenal have said well " stick it up your jacksy" and good on them.

This is all about the rich getting richer, and it leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. Hope the fans tell them to get lost, coz I for one don't want it.
		
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I also hope it never happens.:thup:

120 years ago it may have been Villa, Everton, Royal Engineers, Blackburn and PNE.


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## Tashyboy (Mar 2, 2016)

The thing is that if it is based on how rich a club is then Newcastle, West Ham and the Spurs are in the top twenty richest in Europe.

on that basis we put Newcastle in an European league. They could be in the Championship next year.


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## 3offTheTee (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Those clubs won't ever be in a European Super IMO - they are not clubs that will attract what a European Super league needs
		
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Never say Never Phil. 15 years ago Man City would NOT have been included but probably Spurs and Everton


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## Tashyboy (Mar 2, 2016)

Stuart_C said:



			Spot on but there's 1 thing for certain, city nor Chelsea should anywhere the top table IMO.
		
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and that's my point Stu. Before 2009 when Sheik Mansour stepped in we were also runs, same with Chelsea and Roman. Twenty years before it was utd. If history has a say in this both Forest and Villa should be involved but they will be in the championship next year.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

3offTheTee said:



			Never say Never Phil. 15 years ago Man City would NOT have been included but probably Spurs and Everton
		
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And you can see why someone rich bought City - but you can't in all honesty see the same thing happening with the clubs mentioned


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## Norrin Radd (Mar 2, 2016)

3offTheTee said:



			Never say Never Phil. 15 years ago Man City would NOT have been included but probably Spurs and Everton
		
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and Leeds ,and look what happened to them.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			and that's my point Stu. Before 2009 when Sheik Mansour stepped in we were also runs, same with Chelsea and Roman. Twenty years before it was utd. If history has a say in this both Forest and Villa should be involved but they will be in the championship next year.
		
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City have just attracted the best manager in world football 

It's now that matters


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## Doon frae Troon (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Those clubs won't ever be in a European Super IMO - they are not clubs that will attract what a European Super league needs
		
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I seem to recall Man C & U and Chelsea being in the lower leagues. Man C only a few years ago.
Just needs a mega bucks backer for any club to reach the same standard as the 'big five'.
BTW, ATM Liverpool and Chelsea are well outwith the big five in the EPL.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

Doon frae Troon said:



			I seem to recall Man C & U and Chelsea being in the lower leagues. Man C only a few years ago.
Just needs a mega bucks backer for any club to reach the same standard as the 'big five'.
BTW, ATM Liverpool and Chelsea are well outwith the big five in the EPL.
		
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It needs more than a "mega bucks backer" - there are plenty of those backers around Europe but those clubs haven't become a big club. Both Chelsea and City had players and stadium and area and foundation to be a big club - the money helped. 

And it's not just about their current position in the league or what league there were in at any stage in the past


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

Apparently they weren't looking to break away but to make changes with the Uefa set up. No smoke without fire but I still can't see it happening anytime soon as Uefa will do whatever it takes to maintain the cash cow of the CL


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## fundy (Mar 2, 2016)

Doon frae Troon said:



			I seem to recall Man C & U and Chelsea being in the lower leagues. Man C only a few years ago.
Just needs a mega bucks backer for any club to reach the same standard as the 'big five'.
BTW, ATM Liverpool and *Chelsea are well outwith the big five in the EPL*.
		
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on what basis? as much as i dont like them theyre recent record better than anyones and are still defending champions, yes they had a couple of bad months due to some personality clashes


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

fundy said:



			on what basis? as much as i dont like them theyre recent record better than anyones and are still defending champions, yes they had a couple of bad months due to some personality clashes
		
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And technically aren't out of the equation to qualify for the CL next year either


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

fundy said:



			on what basis? as much as i dont like them theyre recent record better than anyones and are still defending champions, yes they had a couple of bad months due to some personality clashes
		
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He is purely looking at the current league table


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			He is purely looking at the current league table
		
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Still more chance of Chelsea qualifying than Liverpool


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			It needs more than a "mega bucks backer" - there are plenty of those backers around Europe but those clubs haven't become a big club. Both Chelsea and City had players and stadium and area and foundation to be a big club - the money helped. 

And it's not just about their current position in the league or what league there were in at any stage in the past
		
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The only reason LPool make the top 5 is history, you haven't competed with the other 4 for a few years now apart from 1. 
It wouldn't happen overnight and in 3-5 years you could changes to what is perceived as a top 5 club.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			The only reason LPool make the top 5 is history, you haven't competed with the other 4 for a few years now apart from 1. 
It wouldn't happen overnight and in 3-5 years you could changes to what is perceived as a top 5 club.
		
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And we attract worldwide appeal - we would bring in viewers around the world. 

IMO you couldn't turn any club into a City or Chelsea


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			And we attract worldwide appeal - we would bring in viewers around the world. 

IMO you couldn't turn any club into a City or Chelsea
		
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Actually agree you are one of the Big 4 or 5, based on your history, that's were your worldwide appeal comes from, not current success, anyone can become a City or Chelsea if they find the sugar daddy who wants to spend.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Actually agree you are one of the Big 4 or 5, based on your history, that's were your worldwide appeal comes from, not current success, anyone can become a City or Chelsea if they find the sugar daddy who wants to spend.
		
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I don't think they can - need more than just money.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I don't think they can - need more than just money.
		
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Like what. How much have Liverpool spent since they nearly won the PL and how close has that brought CL football. You have to spend but you have to buy the right players and build a squad that gels and has strength in depth. That's what the top sides across Europe all have and which to a large degree the likes of City, United and Arsenal have struggled with. Lose a number of first team players and the cupboard is pretty bare pretty quickly


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I don't think they can - need more than just money.
		
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How else did City do it? At least Chelsea had a team that was near the top, who have City brought through the club?


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			How else did City do it? At least Chelsea had a team that was near the top, who have City brought through the club?
		
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City also had the stadium , the facilities , the area to attract players , the fanbase 

Yes the money is massive to them but you couldn't for example drop 500 mil at Charlton and they then become a big club or indeed Wolves or Carlise etc. 

The foundations to be a big club need to be there as they were for both City and Chelsea


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			City also had the stadium , the facilities , the area to attract players , the fanbase 

Yes the money is massive to them but you couldn't for example drop 500 mil at Charlton and they then become a big club or indeed Wolves or Carlise etc. 

The foundations to be a big club need to be there as they were for both City and Chelsea
		
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You could for Spurs or West Ham or Newcastle or Leicester, all currently in better positions than City were when they were bought.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			You could for Spurs or West Ham or Newcastle or Leicester, all currently in better positions than City were when they were bought.
		
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Spurs , West Ham and Newcastle yes - Leicester not so sure 

And it's not about the positions they are in the league.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Spurs , West Ham and Newcastle yes - Leicester not so sure 

And it's not about the positions they are in the league.
		
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Agreed it's not about position, reasonable squad, reasonable stadiums, good fan base, City were not in that good of condition.


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## gregbwfc (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Agreed it's not about position, reasonable squad, reasonable stadiums, good fan base, City were not in that good of condition.
		
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No real local competition either.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Agreed it's not about position, reasonable squad, reasonable stadiums, good fan base, City were not in that good of condition.
		
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But had a lovely big new stadium with lots of potential to grow with not much debt to clear and nice big rival to challenge. It was set up ready to go - same as if the Iranian suddenly put loads in - the foundations are there


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

More than a big staduim needed. Needs to be managed properly. Look at the demise of Leeds over the last twenty years following their dream of CL football. Plenty of clubs have spent big and not got near a title or Europe and have amassed big debts


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Hope it never happens but we'll see.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Hope it never happens but we'll see.
		
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I hope it never happens as well but think it's the natural progression for the rich


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Hope it never happens but we'll see.
		
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Dont think it ever will. Can't see UEFA letting it happen and if it does, it'll implode spectacularly when the money runs out


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## Blue in Munich (Mar 2, 2016)

Stuart_C said:



			Spot on but there's 1 thing for certain, city nor Chelsea should anywhere the top table IMO.
		
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Last 20 years (1996 - 2015, completed seasons):

Arsenal; 0 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 3 Premier Leagues, 6 FA Cups, 0 League Cups, total 9

Chelsea; 1 Champions League, 1 Europa League, 4 Premier Leagues, 6 FA Cups, 4 League Cups, total 16 

Liverpool; 1 Champions League, 1 Europa League, 0 Premier League, 2 FA Cups, 3 League Cups, total 7

Manchester City; 0 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 2 Premier Leagues, 1 FA Cup, 1 League Cup, total 4

Manchester United: 2 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 11 Premier Leagues, 3 FA Cups, 3 League Cups, total 19

On recent history you might make a case for excluding one of the two clubs you cite, but you make a much better case for excluding your own club.


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## Blue in Munich (Mar 2, 2016)

FairwayDodger said:



			Just the latest example of the greed that blights the game at all levels.

The rich get richer and the rest can just just rot.
		
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Sadly this is probably the most accurate comment on the thread.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

Blue in Munich said:



			Sadly this is probably the most accurate comment on the thread.
		
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I assume if it ever went ahead, there would have to be some form of movement amongst clubs not in the initial league. Pretty sure the lawyers would insist on it somewhere along the line. Still don't think it'll happen


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## Blue in Munich (Mar 2, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			I assume if it ever went ahead, there would have to be some form of movement amongst clubs not in the initial league. Pretty sure the lawyers would insist on it somewhere along the line. Still don't think it'll happen
		
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The fact that it is even being thought about is sufficient for me to agree with FD, whether it actually happens or not.  I hope it doesn't, but I think what will stop it is the concern about where those teams will go if it does implode; they'll hardly be welcomed back to their former leagues with open arms.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 2, 2016)

If it does happen can see it working and bring a success for the teams involved 

It would be a weekly CL against the biggest clubs in Europe - all the players would want to play in it and the telly companies would throw money at it


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 2, 2016)

Blue in Munich said:



			The fact that it is even being thought about is sufficient for me to agree with FD, whether it actually happens or not.  I hope it doesn't, but I think what will stop it is the concern about where those teams will go if it does implode; they'll hardly be welcomed back to their former leagues with open arms.
		
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Its my concern and it will inevitably implode when the cash dries up. Can't see any league, in all likelihood already struggling with reduced TV and crowd revenues as a result of the super league letting them back in easily. I really can't see how it'll work especially as a closed shop


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			If it does happen can see it working and bring a success for the teams involved 

It would be a weekly CL against the biggest clubs in Europe - all the players would want to play in it and the telly companies would throw money at it
		
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You's are moaning at ticket prices now, you'll be fuming having to buy flights every other week as well.


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## Stuart_C (Mar 2, 2016)

Blue in Munich said:



			Last 20 years (1996 - 2015, completed seasons):

Arsenal; 0 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 3 Premier Leagues, 6 FA Cups, 0 League Cups, total 9

Chelsea; 1 Champions League, 1 Europa League, 4 Premier Leagues, 6 FA Cups, 4 League Cups, total 16 

Liverpool; 1 Champions League, 1 Europa League, 0 Premier League, 2 FA Cups, 3 League Cups, total 7

Manchester City; 0 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 2 Premier Leagues, 1 FA Cup, 1 League Cup, total 4

Manchester United: 2 Champions League, 0 Europa League, 11 Premier Leagues, 3 FA Cups, 3 League Cups, total 19

On recent history you might make a case for excluding one of the two clubs you cite, but you make a much better case for excluding your own club.
		
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I never included them, I was merely offering my opinion. If you use the last 25 yrs we'd have an extra 2 trophies to our tally:smirk:


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

Stuart_C said:



			I never included them, I was merely offering my opinion. If you use the last 25 yrs we'd have an extra 2 trophies to our tally:smirk:
		
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I think you should go back to the complete trophy haul and that shows you's as Englands most succesful side, oh no wait, that's Man Utd isn't it.


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## Stuart_C (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			I think you should go back to the complete trophy haul and that shows you's as Englands most succesful side, oh no wait, that's Man Utd isn't it.
		
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It depends what trophies were counting, do pre season tourney's count?


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## chrisd (Mar 2, 2016)

It'll happen, might be 5 years so away but it'll happen


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## Stuart_C (Mar 2, 2016)

chrisd said:



			It'll happen, might be 5 years so away but it'll happen
		
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I hope you're wrong, I really do.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 2, 2016)

chrisd said:



			It'll happen, might be 5 years so away but it'll happen
		
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No chance, the national leagues wouldn't accept it.


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 2, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			I think you should go back to the complete trophy haul and that shows you's as Englands most succesful side, oh no wait, that's Man Utd isn't it.
		
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I dont have to disprove your argument for the 2nd time, do I?


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			I dont have to disprove your argument for the 2nd time, do I?
		
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:rofl::rofl:


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## Grogger (Mar 3, 2016)

Don't know if it's already been said but I'd love to see this happen. Not for entertainment reasons but just because it would be great for them to go and leave the other 87 league teams to get on with things. 

Wont be long before the novelty wears off and fans are being priced out and the crowds will be full of plastic fans. As for travelling away support that'll be a thing of the past and there'd be nothing to stop home games being played in America or Asia. Be absolutley boring with nothing to play for. No promotion or relegation and who's going to challenge Barca or Bayern for the title?? 

I don't see it happening myself. Money is ruining the game as far as I'm concerned and I'm starting to lose touch with it. I could have had a season ticket for next season but due to my feelings towards the game and our chairman I've decided to invest the money into a golf membership instead. I'll probably watch more non league football next season. Cheaper admission and cheaper pie and a pint.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			You's are moaning at ticket prices now, you'll be fuming having to buy flights every other week as well.
		
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The amount of telly money and sponsership money thrown at the clubs would be massive 

And if it did happen the novelty wouldn't wear off - it would just get bigger and bigger and would swallow up most of the telly money


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 3, 2016)

Grogger said:



			Don't know if it's already been said but I'd love to see this happen. Not for entertainment reasons but just because it would be great for them to go and leave the other 87 league teams to get on with things. 

Wont be long before the novelty wears off and fans are being priced out and the crowds will be full of plastic fans. As for travelling away support that'll be a thing of the past and there'd be nothing to stop home games being played in America or Asia. Be absolutley boring with nothing to play for. No promotion or relegation and who's going to challenge Barca or Bayern for the title?? 

I don't see it happening myself. Money is ruining the game as far as I'm concerned and I'm starting to lose touch with it. I could have had a season ticket for next season but due to my feelings towards the game and our chairman I've decided to invest the money into a golf membership instead. I'll probably watch more non league football next season. Cheaper admission and cheaper pie and a pint.
		
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Have to agree. Away fans aren't going to fork out for flights every other week and won't go but won't be happy to sit at home to watch their team either. Costs and interest will wane after a season or three and it'll get farmed off as a touring circus to Asia and the US. TV money would get chucked at it as the only way to pay inflated wages but it would lose appeal eventually. What happens then to these clubs with no ball to play with. Can't see the leagues welcoming them back with open arms.

No way will it happen within the next five years and I still doubt that without UEFA/FIFA sanctioning it the whole thing will be a football version of Kerry Packers cricket debacle and we all know how that played out and what it did to the careers of some good players


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The amount of telly money and sponsership money thrown at the clubs would be massive 

And if it did happen the novelty wouldn't wear off - it would just get bigger and bigger and would swallow up most of the telly money
		
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How do you stay competitive without promotion and relegation or competeing to qualify for a bigger comp and why if you left shoukd you be allowed back in, you'd still have national leagues and Euro Cups, just without the so called Big Clubs.
Celtic would be massive in a European League, just not for footballing reasons.


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## guest100718 (Mar 3, 2016)

Its something thats been talked about for as long as I can remember. Doubt it will happen, not at the expense of national leagues anyway.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			How do you stay competitive without promotion and relegation or competeing to qualify for a bigger comp and why if you left shoukd you be allowed back in, you'd still have national leagues and Euro Cups, just without the so called Big Clubs.
Celtic would be massive in a European League, just not for footballing reasons.
		
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The Euro Cups would just vanish and they would create some sort of other cup between them. Yes the other leagues would still be around in the same way the other leagues still exists in Rugby Lge and Rugby Union. The competition would be heathy and massive between all the biggest clubs in Europe - people will watch around the world. It will be like the CL ( which just keeps getting bigger ) but extended throughout the season.

Interest wouldn't wane from around the world and could see it being extended to add more teams as it got bigger.

It nearly become a very real league about a decade or so ago until UEFA said they would change the CL - it will always be a cloud hanging over the game and clubs won't b afraid to play games all over the world because they know they would fill stadiums


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## Doon frae Troon (Mar 3, 2016)

It looks like the top European players will be off to China in the next few years.
Not sure if the European TV ratings will be able to cope with showing second rate sides.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The Euro Cups would just vanish and they would create some sort of other cup between them. Yes the other leagues would still be around in the same way the other leagues still exists in Rugby Lge and Rugby Union. The competition would be heathy and massive between all the biggest clubs in Europe - people will watch around the world. It will be like the CL ( which just keeps getting bigger ) but extended throughout the season.

Interest wouldn't wane from around the world and could see it being extended to add more teams as it got bigger.

It nearly become a very real league about a decade or so ago until UEFA said they would change the CL - it will always be a cloud hanging over the game and clubs won't b afraid to play games all over the world because they know they would fill stadiums
		
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Fantasy stuff to suggest people will keep watching if there are only the same sides every year and sooner or later there will be a divide in the breakaway league between those that can afford to pay top wages and those that can't or won't and that will dilute it further. Fans in Europe won't pay inflated prices to see their teams and sending around the year is hardly a Euro super league then. It becomes a travelling circus that sooner or later the big clubs from other continents will demand entry too further diluting the game at the top level even further. A poor idea brought about by nothing more than financial greed by those clubs already dining at the top table of football and reaping the cash harvest already


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## Tashyboy (Mar 3, 2016)

Don't wanna sound like an "alright Jack" but the first two fixtures I look for every year are the rags home and away. Then Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea. Yeah I would still see those teams every year but it would not be the same. Would find it hard to get excited looking for ? borrusia Dortmund.
Do fans think the ticket price will stay the same when Southampton are dropped for the likes of Real Madrid.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			Don't wanna sound like an "alright Jack" but the first two fixtures I look for every year are the rags home and away. Then Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea. Yeah I would still see those teams every year but it would not be the same. Would find it hard to get excited looking for ? borrusia Dortmund.
Do fans think the ticket price will stay the same when Southampton are dropped for the likes of Real Madrid.
		
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But then you would be playing teams like 

Barce
Real
Bayern
Milan
Juve
PSG

Plus all the big teams - it would be like CL every weekend

All the best players under one league playing against each other.

That's what will appeal to worldwide viewers and the money men


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## richy (Mar 3, 2016)

Grogger said:



			Don't know if it's already been said but I'd love to see this happen. Not for entertainment reasons but just because it would be great for them to go and leave the other 87 league teams to get on with things. 

Wont be long before the novelty wears off and fans are being priced out and the crowds will be full of plastic fans. As for travelling away support that'll be a thing of the past and there'd be nothing to stop home games being played in America or Asia. Be absolutley boring with nothing to play for. No promotion or relegation and who's going to challenge Barca or Bayern for the title?? 

I don't see it happening myself. Money is ruining the game as far as I'm concerned and I'm starting to lose touch with it. I could have had a season ticket for next season but due to my feelings towards the game and our chairman I've decided to invest the money into a golf membership instead. I'll probably watch more non league football next season. Cheaper admission and cheaper pie and a pint.
		
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This.

It won't happen and even if it did it wouldn't last very long.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

As much as I'm against it I definitely see a Euro League working on a world scale, Man Utd V Barca in Singapore woukd sell out, live on ppv, it's a financial dream, the more I think about it, the more I believe it could work.
Let's be honest they stopped caring about the man in the street years ago.
Any English club in the Euro League would guarantee a sell out every home game.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			As much as I'm against it I definitely see a Euro League working on a world scale, Man Utd V Barca in Singapore woukd sell out, live on ppv, it's a financial dream, the more I think about it, the more I believe it could work.
Let's be honest they stopped caring about the man in the street years ago.
Any English club in the Euro League would guarantee a sell out every home game.
		
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Exactly that - suggestions that it wouldn't last need to just look and see how big and popular the CL is now around the world


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## Tiger (Mar 3, 2016)

The drive for this is the fear Barca, Real and the others have about the Premier League TV money. What they don't understand is that the issue is there own causing. Bayern's dominance, the El Clasico duopoly, the Italian fixing scandal these things made those competitions less appealing to the TV money men. The Premier League is great because of the potential for upset not the dominance of a couple of massive clubs. What Leicester are doing this season makes it even more attractive...

I think this will go the same way as the last conversation they had and lead to a revamp of the Champions League and Europa League


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## Doon frae Troon (Mar 3, 2016)

If Leicester win the EPL will they be considered a 'big team' and included in the proposed super league.

or

Is it more about money than quality.

Most of us cannot remember when Liverpool last won the EPL [or indeed if they have] yet they are being considered, surely teams like Ajax and Celtic have a better case for inclusion than Liverpool.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Are there enough "Super" teams to make it both viable and interesting.

On current playing ability there are, at most, four or five top teams in Europe. Italian football is in a mess financially, only one team in France and Bayern completely in a class of their own in Germany.

How long would it take the English clubs to become competitive? After all according to Alan Hansen Liverpool need to spend Â£200m to win the PL so how much would they need to go toe to toe with Barca, Real or Bayern.

There may be an appeal to the tourist fans in USA & Asia but domestically and after the initial enthusiasm the appeal would wane.

More likely to succeed on an NFL/franchise basis with teams ultimately being based overseas.

Hard to be a Liverpool or Arsenal supporter when they are based in Shanghai or Boston.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

The first issue would be the financial rewards for the teams to want them to join, so let's say they start with 18 teams,

Arsenal
Chelsea
Liverpool
Man City
Man Utd
Barca
Real Madrid
Athletico Madrid
Bayern Munich
Dortmund
Juventus
Inter
AC Milan
PSG
Monaco
Ajax
PSV
Celtic

That's 18 teams that would worldwide interest, as much as Mickie's right about supporters, who cares so long as the money comes in.

Take the games round the world like they do with F1, Week 1 9 Matches in the Far East, Week 2 Middle East etc


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

Doon frae Troon said:



			If Leicester win the EPL will they be considered a 'big team' and included in the proposed super league.

or

Is it more about money than quality.

Most of us cannot remember when Liverpool last won the EPL [or indeed if they have] yet they are being considered, surely teams like Ajax and Celtic have a better case for inclusion than Liverpool.
		
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Why are you continually focusing on Liverpool ? 

It's all about which clubs would bring the worldwide appeal 

That's why even if Leicester won the EPL they wouldn't be included


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## garyinderry (Mar 3, 2016)

All this talk of over seas fans is nonsense.  

If every single one of Man Uniteds"fans" paid just one pound then they could spend 600 million next year. They may say they support United, click follow on twitter but they don't put the money directly from into their pockets. 

They may be overseas football fans, cheer on United on TV, but to call them fans is a nonsense. 



If this euro super league was formed I would pack in caring.   Or at least hope that arsenal would pull out at the last minute and try to win the league at home with the big boys on permanent holiday.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

garyinderry said:



			All this talk of over seas fans is nonsense.  

If every single one of Man Uniteds"fans" paid just one pound then they could spend 600 million next year. They may say they support United, click follow on twitter but they don't put the money directly from into their pockets. 

They may be overseas football fans, cheer on United on TV, but to call them fans is a nonsense. 



If this euro super league was formed I would pack in caring.   Or at least hope that arsenal would pull out at the last minute and try to win the league at home with the big boys on permanent holiday.
		
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Tell that to the LPool fans who bragged about selling out every match on their tour of Asia and Australia, kit sales alone make the Clubs millions, so a bit unfair to say they're not fans,


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

The appeal of football in the long term lies in its tribalism. You cannot create this and any overseas fans drawn to a match may well prove to be only temporary in their support until the next "trend" comes along.

As for 18 teams with a worldwide appeal; Ajax, Monaco, PSV really? And Celtic's overseas appeal lies almost exclusively in exiled Scots and Irish so might be an attraction in North America or Australasia but not likely to be a big pull in say Thailand or China.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			The appeal of football in the long term lies in its tribalism. You cannot create this and any overseas fans drawn to a match may well prove to be only temporary in their support until the next "trend" comes along.

As for 18 teams with a worldwide appeal; Ajax, Monaco, PSV really? And Celtic's overseas appeal lies almost exclusively in exiled Scots and Irish so might be an attraction in North America or Australasia but not likely to be a big pull in say Thailand or China.
		
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Not disagreeing and the 18 was just a 2 minute guess, surely part of any future league will have problems deciding who gets invited and who doesn't, imagine if they said max 3 teams from any one Country, it would be fun watching the bickering over who is top 3 from England.


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## garyinderry (Mar 3, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Tell that to the LPool fans who bragged about selling out every match on their tour of Asia and Australia, kit sales alone make the Clubs millions, so a bit unfair to say they're not fans,
		
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If I lived in Asia or Australia I would go to see any of the big teams that come on tour.  I would go as a fan of football, it doesn't make me a fan of the club.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

garyinderry said:



			If I lived in Asia or Australia I would go to see any of the big teams that come on tour.  I would go as a fan of football, it doesn't make me a fan of the club.
		
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Not in that scenario no, but if you lived, dreamed and breathed one team like some do, you'd consider yourself a fan and would go to the match as a fan and probably not go to other matches.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

But you cannot create support.

Look at the NFL games at Wembley, they sell out because of their scarcity value and, judging by the shirts worn, are attended by the fans of virtually every team in the league. But what would happen if a London franchise was created? Support would have to be developed over years.

If European Super League games were regularly played overseas the novelty would wear off and domestic support could also wane as the "product" on offer would not have the same appeal as the original.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

I can't understand why people keep saying the "novelty" will wear off - the CL keeps getting stronger , the appeal for the top teams around the world keeps getting stronger , the attendances abroad when teams go on tour keep getting stronger , the money spent by overseas telly companies just gets more and more. Football is growing every single day and people keep saying the bubble will burst but it's not happening - it's getting stronger and there is no sign of it stopping. 

Stadiums will fill up and matches abroad would sell out - nothing points to it going any other way but stronger and the top teams want to ensure they maximise the amount of money they gain from it all

It will be massive financial success globally but it will effect fans


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I can't understand why people keep saying the "novelty" will wear off - the CL keeps getting stronger , the appeal for the top teams around the world keeps getting stronger , the attendances abroad when teams go on tour keep getting stronger , the money spent by overseas telly companies just gets more and more. Football is growing every single day and people keep saying the bubble will burst but it's not happening - it's getting stronger and there is no sign of it stopping. 

Stadiums will fill up and matches abroad would sell out - nothing points to it going any other way but stronger and the top teams want to ensure they maximise the amount of money they gain from it all

It will be massive financial success globally but it will effect fans
		
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^^This^^ Plus, has anyone considered a backlash by the Clubs not chosen, PL and FA which may give the English players and game a boost, all them Man Utd fans in London may choose other teams to support&#128515;


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			I can't understand why people keep saying the "novelty" will wear off - the CL keeps getting stronger , the appeal for the top teams around the world keeps getting stronger , the attendances abroad when teams go on tour keep getting stronger , the money spent by overseas telly companies just gets more and more. Football is growing every single day and people keep saying the bubble will burst but it's not happening - it's getting stronger and there is no sign of it stopping. 

Stadiums will fill up and matches abroad would sell out - nothing points to it going any other way but stronger and the top teams want to ensure they maximise the amount of money they gain from it all

It will be massive financial success globally but it will effect fans
		
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Two traditional hotbeds of football in Europe where the game is not getting stronger, Italy and Spain.

As for CL plenty of games, particularly in the group stages, do not sell out.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Two traditional hotbeds of football in Europe where the game is not getting stronger, Italy and Spain.

As for CL plenty of games, particularly in the group stages, do not sell out.
		
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For the top teams is stronger - the likes and Barce and Madrid and Juve etc. And within a Super they would get stronger.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			For the top teams is stronger - the likes and Barce and Madrid and Juve etc. And within a Super they would get stronger.
		
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You are generally keen on facts but you have none on which to base your assumptions of success for this Super League.

I dobt that there is anywhere near sufficient depth of Super clubs to ensure success.


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## Qwerty (Mar 3, 2016)

Apologies if its already been said as I haven't read every post... But morally and ethically the whole thing Stinks.
If it were to go ahead the current value of every premier league club would drop through the floor and it would have a knock on effect on the rest of English and Scottish Football.
Are UEFA and the FA capable/Allowed to effectively pull the plug on the premier league?
Would the owners of the other affected Clubs just have to take it on the Chin?



If it were to go ahead Ive no doubt the whole thing would Take off. 
Fans would no doubt dig deeper into the pockets to pay the increased prices for the new 'Product' and those that didn't would easily be replaced.
..And kids will carry on growing up still thinking that Football is a TV Progamme.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			You are generally keen on facts but you have none on which to base your assumptions of success for this Super League.

I dobt that there is anywhere near sufficient depth of Super clubs to ensure success.
		
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The CL is the perfect pointer to the success 

It was extended and the same doom and gloom was mentioned and yet the CL just gets stronger - the most recent telly deal just here was for Â£1billion. A telly deal for games with just the biggest clubs in Europe would be even more than that


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			But you cannot create support.

Look at the NFL games at Wembley, they sell out because of their scarcity value and, judging by the shirts worn, are attended by the fans of virtually every team in the league. But what would happen if a London franchise was created? Support would have to be developed over years.

If European Super League games were regularly played overseas the novelty would wear off and domestic support could also wane as the "product" on offer would not have the same appeal as the original.
		
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Totally agree. Can't see how the CL can be said to be growing year on year unless you are talking purely on a monetary basis and that's surely down to UEFA and whoever sets the price of the coverage simply bumping up the cost to broadcast in each country annually. I don't see crowds etc have changed significantly. If anything I still say a closed shop, especially if games are initially played in Europe will see interest wane with the same sides playing over and over and no access to the big table for any outsiders. What a shame that Leicester, if they go on to win the PL suddenly being denied a place in the CL because someone says they aren't big enough or have enough money and why should they and whoever wins national leagues across Europe have to do with a watered down consolation prize

It may well sell out globally but how can a Chinese fan in a club shirt be classed as a fan? What about those in England, Germany, France, Spain etc who have supported their side for years and now find themselves unable to see their own side on a regular basis as they are touring Asia, South America or Australia. 

As a cash making exercise for the super league owners and the clubs of course its the next golden goose and sod everyone else but I seriously hope this doesn't come off. It gets talked about every year or so and yet we're no further forward so there must be some issues preventing this or I have no doubt Barca, Real, Bayern and everyone else would have been off like a shot ages ago and rolling in the money available. I think common sense will prevail to a degree and while Uefa will continue to hike broadcasting right money year on year as a way of keeping money coming into the clubs, and while there are broadcasters still happy to pay this to show the matches live the status quo will remain


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The CL is the perfect pointer to the success 

It was extended and the same doom and gloom was mentioned and yet the CL just gets stronger - the most recent telly deal just here was for Â£1billion. A telly deal for games with just the biggest clubs in Europe would be even more than that
		
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No guarantee as fewer teams will reduce the appeal in some areas such as Europe.

After all where is the attraction to a Dutch supporter in a game between Man City and Juventus or to an English supporter if Atletico play PSG.

Supporters from traditional football countries are primarily interested in their own clubs and will not be looking to spend more money to watch TV coverage of even more matches to which they have no connection.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Totally agree. Can't see how the CL can be said to be growing year on year unless you are talking purely on a monetary basis and that's surely down to UEFA and whoever sets the price of the coverage simply bumping up the cost to broadcast in each country annually. I don't see crowds etc have changed significantly. If anything I still say a closed shop, especially if games are initially played in Europe will see interest wane with the same sides playing over and over and no access to the big table for any outsiders. What a shame that Leicester, if they go on to win the PL suddenly being denied a place in the CL because someone says they aren't big enough or have enough money and why should they and whoever wins national leagues across Europe have to do with a watered down consolation prize

It may well sell out globally but how can a Chinese fan in a club shirt be classed as a fan? What about those in England, Germany, France, Spain etc who have supported their side for years and now find themselves unable to see their own side on a regular basis as they are touring Asia, South America or Australia. 

As a cash making exercise for the super league owners and the clubs of course its the next golden goose and sod everyone else but I seriously hope this doesn't come off. It gets talked about every year or so and yet we're no further forward so there must be some issues preventing this or I have no doubt Barca, Real, Bayern and everyone else would have been off like a shot ages ago and rolling in the money available. I think common sense will prevail to a degree and while Uefa will continue to hike broadcasting right money year on year as a way of keeping money coming into the clubs, and while there are broadcasters still happy to pay this to show the matches live the status quo will remain
		
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Since when has common sense prevailed when it comes to Football, if you read the posts in the we're off thread the normal local fan is already being priced out and corporate is getting bigger, the sooner we accept money is what it's about the better.
Totally accept it moralley and ethically stinks but the game has changed and the Euro League could maybe should happen.
Why isn't a Chinese person in a shirt not a fan? It's a global game with global appeal. English clubs are happy to sign foreign players, but we don't want those players attracting their fellow countrymen do we? Bloody Jonny foreigner liking our clubs! How dare they.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			No guarantee as fewer teams will reduce the appeal in some areas such as Europe.

After all where is the attraction to a Dutch supporter in a game between Man City and Juventus or to an English supporter if Atletico play PSG.

Supporters from traditional football countries are primarily interested in their own clubs and will not be looking to spend more money to watch TV coverage of even more matches to which they have no connection.
		
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I get what your saying and my reply maybe annoying, but if they've got sponsorship and revenue, who cares if the dutchman doesn't want to watch the Spanish and English team play.
If it goes global, the locals will pay, just like they do in this country for NFL.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			No guarantee as fewer teams will reduce the appeal in some areas such as Europe.

After all where is the attraction to a Dutch supporter in a game between Man City and Juventus or to an English supporter if Atletico play PSG.

Supporters from traditional football countries are primarily interested in their own clubs and will not be looking to spend more money to watch TV coverage of even more matches to which they have no connection.
		
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But the appeal is worldwide hence why abroad people love watching the PSG vs Atletico because worldwide people love watching the best players play - people love watching Ibra vs Greziman or vs Pogba 

The telly companies will spend the big money to secure the broadcast rights just like.

Football is worldwide and bigger than just supporters from the local area of a club 

180 million watched the last CL final in 2015 with other finals been watched by more than that. Those are the figures that will matter


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			But the appeal is worldwide hence why abroad people love watching the PSG vs Atletico because worldwide people love watching the best players play - people love watching Ibra vs Greziman or vs Pogba 

The telly companies will spend the big money to secure the broadcast rights just like.

Football is worldwide and bigger than just supporters from the local area of a club 

180 million watched the last CL final in 2015 with other finals been watched by more than that. Those are the figures that will matter
		
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If those were the figures that matter then cricket would be getting much more money as, for example, over 280 million watched the Pakistan v India game in the ICC World Cup.

The demographic of the viewers is the decisive factor as that is what will determine advertising revenues. Therefore, if it can be sold in developed markets such as USA then big money can be generated. The American market for "Soccer",or any other non-traditional (to the US) sport remains very fragile.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			If those were the figures that matter then cricket would be getting much more money as, for example, over 280 million watched the Pakistan v India game in the ICC World Cup.

The demographic of the viewers is the decisive factor as that is what will determine advertising revenues. Therefore, if it can be sold in developed markets such as USA then big money can be generated. The American market for "Soccer",or any other non-traditional (to the US) sport remains very fragile.
		
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He amount of money in the IPL , Big Bash and other T20 comps is on the rise - Big Bash especially. 

Football is already sold worldwide - that's why the Prem rights go for so much money because Sky etc can make a fortune selling them on to all areas. 

America is not the golden goose for football - Far East , Middle East , Africa all massively into European Football


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Far East , Middle East , Africa all massively into European Football
		
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None of which generate the big bucks for advertising revenue.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			None of which generate the big bucks for advertising revenue.
		
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Really ? sorry but a lot of the clubs will have advertising from companies based in those areas.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Really ? sorry but a lot of the clubs will have advertising from companies based in those areas.
		
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But that is not the same as generating advertising revenue for the TV companies who will be expected to fund this.


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## garyinderry (Mar 3, 2016)

I would hope massive fan protests could stop this from happening if it was ever close to happening. 

I personally don't think it will happen.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			But that is not the same as generating advertising revenue for the TV companies who will be expected to fund this.
		
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Companies would throw money at the league to get advertising - Gazprom throw millions at the CL to allow them to be main advertiser. 

The European League would be broadcast to billions of households and advertisers know that and the revenue will be massive - just as it already is for both the Prem and CL


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 3, 2016)

garyinderry said:



			I would hope massive fan protests could stop this from happening if it was ever close to happening. 

I personally don't think it will happen.
		
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It may well happen, greed is such a motivator and it provides a short cut back to the top-table for some clubs for whom that was becoming a distant memory.

And the largely foreign owners of these clubs will have no qualms about uplifting their "franchise" and taking it elsewhere when the traditional support dwindles in both numbers and financial significance.


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 3, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			Apologies if its already been said as I haven't read every post... But morally and ethically the whole thing Stinks.
If it were to go ahead the current value of every premier league club would drop through the floor and it would have a knock on effect on the rest of English and Scottish Football.
Are UEFA and the FA capable/Allowed to effectively pull the plug on the premier league?
Would the owners of the other affected Clubs just have to take it on the Chin?



If it were to go ahead Ive no doubt the whole thing would Take off. 
Fans would no doubt dig deeper into the pockets to pay the increased prices for the new 'Product' and those that didn't would easily be replaced.
..And kids will carry on growing up still thinking that Football is a TV Progamme.
		
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Bang on - even though my club may be one of those picked, I dont want it to happen - tory behaviour!!!!


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			Bang on - even though my club may be one of those picked, I dont want it to happen - tory behaviour!!!!
		
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I would be surprised if any would want it to happen.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 3, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			Bang on - even though my club may be one of those picked, I dont want it to happen - tory behaviour!!!!
		
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None of us do, but burying your head in the sand and saying it won't happen is daft, it's been muted before and now it's raising it's head again, as Mickie said, greedy owners.


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## freddielong (Mar 3, 2016)

I believe that this is inevitable. 

There is a lot of money to be made and who wouldn't want to be locked in.


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## GG26 (Mar 3, 2016)

To be honest if it did happen I would lose interest in watching football.  Apart from the odd game I have little interest in watching games that don't involve the teams that I follow and I would want them to be the top competition or at least be in with a chance of qualifying for it.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 3, 2016)

It seems the idea is coming from an NFL owner of the Dolphins who has already created a competition including the top teams Playing in China , Aus etc which appears to be a success


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## ColchesterFC (Mar 3, 2016)

GG26 said:



			To be honest if it did happen I would lose interest in watching football.  Apart from the odd game I have little interest in watching games that don't involve the teams that I follow and I would want them to be the top competition or at least be in with a chance of qualifying for it.
		
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That's exactly how I feel about it. I've given up on the Champions League since it went to BT Sport as I don't care enough about it to pay for that and Sky Sports for the Premier League. The only reason I've still got Sky is because I cancelled and they offered me 50% off for a year to stay with them. The free to air Champions League game recently was Juve v Bayern which turned out to be a great game but I wasn't even interested enough in it to bother tuning in. I probably would've watched if it had been an English team shown free but there is no chance of me paying a subscription or PPV to watch a European Super League.


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## SwingsitlikeHogan (Mar 3, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			The first issue would be the financial rewards for the teams to want them to join, so let's say they start with 18 teams,

Arsenal
Chelsea
Liverpool
Man City
Man Utd
Barca
Real Madrid
Athletico Madrid
Bayern Munich
Dortmund
Juventus
Inter
AC Milan
PSG
Monaco
Ajax
PSV
Celtic

That's 18 teams that would worldwide interest, as much as Mickie's right about supporters, who cares so long as the money comes in.

Take the games round the world like they do with F1, Week 1 9 Matches in the Far East, Week 2 Middle East etc
		
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A slightly flawed list as you could never have Celtic without The Rangers - after all it's where they both belong -and shot of the deadweight that is the rest of Scottish football.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 4, 2016)

ColchesterFC said:



			That's exactly how I feel about it. I've given up on the Champions League since it went to BT Sport as I don't care enough about it to pay for that and Sky Sports for the Premier League. The only reason I've still got Sky is because I cancelled and they offered me 50% off for a year to stay with them. The free to air Champions League game recently was Juve v Bayern which turned out to be a great game but I wasn't even interested enough in it to bother tuning in. I probably would've watched if it had been an English team shown free but there is no chance of me paying a subscription or PPV to watch a European Super League.
		
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And I don't think you are alone and despite what some think I can't see it being a huge viewing draw after the initial interest wanes as most aren't going to watch games between two sides they have no interest in especially if they then have to PPV or get charge extra on their monthly bill


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## Qwerty (Mar 4, 2016)

Is it really possible for this to be put in place with any hint of opposition pushed to one side?

My concern is that I'd imagine a huge financial gulf would appear between the 'In's and Outs' possibly larger than than the premier league and the Championship currently.
Ok, Liverpool or Spurs or A.n other could get promoted in... They simply wouldn't have time to get the quality of players on board to be capable of competing and so getting Battered every week.
Also local rivalries, built up over decades... Gone!
And basically the English Top flight .. built up over 100 years Gone! 

I can't help but get the impression (Not just on here) That some think this is a good idea.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			Is it really possible for this to be put in place with any hint of opposition pushed to one side?

My concern is that I'd imagine a huge financial gulf would appear between the 'In's and Outs' possibly larger than than the premier league and the Championship currently.
Ok, Liverpool or Spurs or A.n other could get promoted in... They simply wouldn't have time to get the quality of players on board to be capable of competing and so getting Battered every week.
Also local rivalries, built up over decades... Gone!
And basically the English Top flight .. Again, built up over decades.. Gone! 

I can't help but get the impression (Not just on here) That some think this is a good idea.
		
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I think the clubs contract with UEFA finishes soon which then allows them to move onto a different European Comp if they wish too 

What happens with the Prem Lge I'm not sure - it's a seperate entity to the FA so just as they set up the Prem Leage and teams left the Football league I guess they can do the same with a European league - 

There would be a lot of initial financial input from telly contracts that would go to clubs - added in sponser contracts etc would mean the clubs would get a lot of money quickly and then that would go to the players because the top players would want to be a part of it. 

If teams really wanted to do it I'm not sure what would stop them.


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## shewy (Mar 4, 2016)

I'm all for it, most leagues are are bore fest anyway, same top two or three teams winning every year.
With those teams in the ESL then the remaining teams could battle it out and have a chance of winning something, also they could play homegrown players and the national sides would improve. As things stand the PL doesn't give a monkeys about the national team, same in Scotland.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 4, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			And I don't think you are alone and despite what some think I can't see it being a huge viewing draw after the initial interest wanes as most aren't going to watch games between two sides they have no interest in especially if they then have to PPV or get charge extra on their monthly bill
		
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Imo, your issue is that you're being insular, worldwide the game is growing, they don't care if the public in the UK don't like it, the far east and middle east are waiting.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			If teams really wanted to do it I'm not sure what would stop them.
		
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Pretty sure Uefa/FIFA would put sanctions in place to stop them playing for the national sides, similar to the ban on players with the Packer cricket. I think for some the loss of playing in World Cups/Euros will be a big thing as all players aspire to play on the biggest footballing stages

I still don't see how it'll work and how once the initial cash injection has been spent where the necessary revenue will come from other than PPV and sponsorship and even the latter will dwindle once TV viewers get bored of being charged through the nose for a game between two sides they have no interest in. 

The obvious answer is that UEFA will do what it did a few years back, recognise the possibility of a Euro league happening at some point, although not for a long time in my view, and work out a way to tweak the CL format to make it more intersting to sponsors and viewers and in some way use what they have to form a "Euro league" with the existing comp. I wouldn't be surprised to see it become four groups of eight clubs (your ready made mini league) and for them to play home and away, with the top two in each going into a quarter final knockout. More longer term interest in the group stage, eliminates a knockout phase and more interest for local TV coverage and the fans.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 4, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			Is it really possible for this to be put in place with any hint of opposition pushed to one side?

My concern is that I'd imagine a huge financial gulf would appear between the 'In's and Outs' possibly larger than than the premier league and the Championship currently.
Ok, Liverpool or Spurs or A.n other could get promoted in... They simply wouldn't have time to get the quality of players on board to be capable of competing and so getting Battered every week.
Also local rivalries, built up over decades... Gone!
And basically the English Top flight .. built up over 100 years Gone! 

I can't help but get the impression (Not just on here) That some think this is a good idea.
		
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I don't think it's a good idea, I just think it's inevitable because of the greedy money men, UEFA/FIFA etc are not interested in the English game, just the opportunity to make money off it.


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## garyinderry (Mar 4, 2016)

If it was going to happen then what is the hold up? 

Also If you read the reports of the latest meeting that was held, the big 5 spent the day slapping each others back saying we are happy to be the big earners on TV money deals.  It is the likes of real Madrid who play in a two team league who are actually interested in making it a reality.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 4, 2016)

garyinderry said:



			If it was going to happen then what is the hold up? 

Also If you read the reports of the latest meeting that was held, the big 5 spent the day slapping each others back saying we are happy to be the big earners on TV money deals.  It is the likes of real Madrid who play in a two team league who are actually interested in making it a reality.
		
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Scared of the backlash I would guess, when they do make it happen I'd hope for the teams from England that join are immediately chucked out the League and all monies they receive stopped, We then look after the teams staying and protect them.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

garyinderry said:



			If it was going to happen then what is the hold up? 

Also If you read the reports of the latest meeting that was held, the big 5 spent the day slapping each others back saying we are happy to be the big earners on TV money deals.  It is the likes of real Madrid who play in a two team league who are actually interested in making it a reality.
		
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Current telly deals with UEFA in regards CL and a deal they had with UEFA when the CL was extended. Once those expire then they may look elsewhere


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Scared of the backlash I would guess, when they do make it happen I'd hope for the teams from England that join are immediately chucked out the League and all monies they receive stopped, We then look after the teams staying and protect them.
		
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A lot of money would go with them. Sponsers and telly deals won't pay massive bucks without the big draws in the league


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## Grogger (Mar 4, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Pretty sure Uefa/FIFA would put sanctions in place to stop them playing for the national sides, similar to the ban on players with the Packer cricket. I think for some the loss of playing in World Cups/Euros will be a big thing as all players aspire to play on the biggest footballing stages

I still don't see how it'll work and how once the initial cash injection has been spent where the necessary revenue will come from other than PPV and sponsorship and even the latter will dwindle once TV viewers get bored of being charged through the nose for a game between two sides they have no interest in. 

The obvious answer is that UEFA will do what it did a few years back, recognise the possibility of a Euro league happening at some point, although not for a long time in my view, and work out a way to tweak the CL format to make it more intersting to sponsors and viewers and in some way use what they have to form a "Euro league" with the existing comp. I wouldn't be surprised to see it become four groups of eight clubs (your ready made mini league) and for them to play home and away, with the top two in each going into a quarter final knockout. More longer term interest in the group stage, eliminates a knockout phase and more interest for local TV coverage and the fans.
		
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I agree with you Homer about sanctions from international football. I'm not sure how feasible it would be though? At the end of the day it'll be the owners who decide wether a club would breakaway and go to a European league not the players. Would it be fair to ban them? I think it's something that could be done over a period of time and I'm not sure the football associations would be too pleased about having their international players gone overnight. I'm sure a lot of players enjoy representing their countries but would the lure of mega bucks be to much to resist for some?


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## Hacker Khan (Mar 4, 2016)

Once those running the game and clubs start desperately chasing the dollar and the major revenue comes from sponsors rather than the fans who you could argue make the club, then this is an inevitable consequence. And football is in no way not unique in this, you could argue golf is similar. The gap between the professional level and the grass roots in most sports is just getting wider and wider, with the health and wealth of those involved in the sport at the elite level massively over riding any other consideration. 

Personally I gave up on football a long time ago now. Haven't deliberately sat down to watch an England match in a few years now (mostly take the opportunity to play golf on a mostly empty course when they are in major championships) and have not seen a premier league match from start to finish for years, even though I have Sky Sports. I must admit Leicester has partially restored a little bit of faith in the game and the fact it should be a sport and not a procession dominated by the richest teams that just get richer and richer.  But I suspect that is a temporary blip and the usual suspects will just spend and spend to get back to wining everything again soon.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Grogger said:



			I agree with you Homer about sanctions from international football. I'm not sure how feasible it would be though? At the end of the day it'll be the owners who decide wether a club would breakaway and go to a European league not the players. Would it be fair to ban them? I think it's something that could be done over a period of time and I'm not sure the football associations would be too pleased about having their international players gone overnight. I'm sure a lot of players enjoy representing their countries but would the lure of mega bucks be to much to resist for some?
		
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They wouldn't ban players from playing international.


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## Grogger (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They wouldn't ban players from playing international.
		
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I'm not saying they would but I'd agree with it if they did


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Grogger said:



			I'm not saying they would but I'd agree with it if they did
		
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I wouldn't tbh because the FA's who control the national teams don't run the leagues anymore.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They wouldn't ban players from playing international.
		
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Prove it. I disagree and think we'll end up with Fifa and Uefa invoking international bans on players in any form of breakaway league that falls out of its auspices in order to protect their own massive global brand in its own rights. A case of "it's my ball" and so will show any breakaway league that it comes at a price. 

I understand to a degree that players cannot dictate what a club does as an employer but in this day and age with the fluidity of transfers, I can see how they would make their preference to play internationals a priority known and will do everything they can to influence a move to a club that can provide that. It is after all arguably the only sanction the governing bodies would have left to make any form of statement against the league. Frankly at this stage I don't think the proposal has legs and won't happen imminently and UEFA will come up with a fudged response and rework the CL format to try and please everyone


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 4, 2016)

HomerJSimpson said:



			Prove it. I disagree and think we'll end up with Fifa and Uefa invoking international bans on players in any form of breakaway league that falls out of its auspices in order to protect their own massive global brand in its own rights. A case of "it's my ball" and so will show any breakaway league that it comes at a price. 

I understand to a degree that players cannot dictate what a club does as an employer but in this day and age with the fluidity of transfers, I can see how they would make their preference to play internationals a priority known and will do everything they can to influence a move to a club that can provide that. It is after all arguably the only sanction the governing bodies would have left to make any form of statement against the league. Frankly at this stage I don't think the proposal has legs and won't happen imminently and UEFA will come up with a fudged response and rework the CL format to try and please everyone
		
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Well as this is simply a debate between clueless golfers guessing what may or may not happen none of us have proof, but why on earth would FIFA and UEFA go against this league when financially they would benefit.
They are the ones destroying the game by letting money talk.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

pauldj42 said:



			Well as this is simply a debate between clueless golfers guessing what may or may not happen none of us have proof, but why on earth would FIFA and UEFA go against this league when financially they would benefit.
They are the ones destroying the game by letting money talk.
		
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Also why exactly would FIFA and UEFA ban the best players in the world when it's those players that make their tournaments the big events - imaging FIFA banning Messi and Ronaldo when they know they can market them to make millions. If a European League happens then UEFA will benefit from it financially no doubt and players won't turn it down because that's where the money and the exposure will be.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			They wouldn't ban players from playing international.
		
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Granted it is many years ago but there is a precedent.

Back in the 50's FIFA banned from international football those players who joined a non-sanctioned big money league in Colombia or Bolivia, not sure which.

Among those affected were Di Stefano and, from England. Neil Franklin.

As Homer said there have been more recent cases in other sports and in the post-Blatter era I certainly wouldn't rule it out.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Granted it is many years ago but there is a precedent.

Back in the 50's FIFA banned from international football those players who joined a non-sanctioned big money league in Colombia or Bolivia, not sure which.

Among those affected were Di Stefano and, from England. Neil Franklin.

As Homer said there have been more recent cases in other sports and in the post-Blatter era I certainly wouldn't rule it out.
		
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The difference will be as with the newly formed Prem all those years back it would be sanctioned

When they were talking about forming it previously it was going to sanctioned 

What reason would they not sanction it ? It would be a massive global spinner which would be perfect for FIFA and UEFA


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The difference will be as with the newly formed Prem all those years back it would be sanctioned

When they were talking about forming it previously it was going to sanctioned 

What reason would they not sanction it ? It would be a massive global spinner which would be perfect for FIFA and UEFA
		
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I agree with some of your points about the "attractiveness" of it to sponsors etc, but I still dont want it to happen.

I disagree, and agree with Homer that a Kerry Packer type breakaway could see sanctions against players and clubs if they try to do it alone, and outside of UEFA/FIFA's auspices.

Overal though, you seem to be in favour of it happening, am I correct?


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## louise_a (Mar 4, 2016)

American professional sport is all about franchises, the more they get involved with European football, the more likelihood is that will go the same way.


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## GB72 (Mar 4, 2016)

I am no means an expert on football, not really my sport, but looking at some of the leagues around Europe, they need this are more than the Premier League do. Some of the bigger leagues really do only seem to have one or two clubs that can seriously challenge and anything else is a rarity. PSG being so far ahead of the rest must be killing the French league as far as interest goes, Spain have Barca and Real and then the rest, Germany have Bayern. At least the Premier League throws up a winner from maybe half a dozen clubs.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			I agree with some of your points about the "attractiveness" of it to sponsors etc, but I still dont want it to happen.

I disagree, and agree with Homer that a Kerry Packer type breakaway could see sanctions against players and clubs if they try to do it alone, and outside of UEFA/FIFA's auspices.

Overal though, you seem to be in favour of it happening, am I correct?
		
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No I'm not in favour of it happening 

Just being realistic to it and can see it happening and it would be within FIFA's agreements because I think it would be a massive money spinner for football and FIFA will benefit from that. 

FIFA know that if something did happen with all the mass finance that would it attract would get all the top players going there and they know they need those top players to make the WC a marketing dream - it's all purely financial to them. 

The Kerry Packer thjng was an attempt at professional paid cricket for all - now cricket open their arms to it all because of the financial benefits 

Everything is controlled by greed and the financial rewards for a European League will make a lot open to it


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## NWJocko (Mar 4, 2016)

Part of the attractiveness of the PL to TV companies is the atmosphere as in England/UK there is a strong culture of going to away games that isn't true across most of Europe.

The atmosphere at Zenit v PSV for example would be even worse than some of the games on TV just now, not exactly an attractive "product" to market compared to Barca v Liverpool, Bayern v Chelsea.

Football is so far up it's own jacksie now it's probably inevitable, part of me hopes it happens and implodes taking all of the foreign owners with it.

If you're not in favour of it Phil you seem quite comfortable about the prospect from your posts, would you feel the same if it was unlikely the club you support would be included?


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			Part of the attractiveness of the PL to TV companies is the atmosphere as in England/UK there is a strong culture of going to away games that isn't true across most of Europe.

The atmosphere at Zenit v PSV for example would be even worse than some of the games on TV just now, not exactly an attractive "product" to market compared to Barca v Liverpool, Bayern v Chelsea.

Football is so far up it's own jacksie now it's probably inevitable, part of me hopes it happens and implodes taking all of the foreign owners with it.

If you're not in favour of it Phil you seem quite comfortable about the prospect from your posts, would you feel the same if it was unlikely the club you support would be included?
		
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not comfortable - just realistic enough to understand that is very much a possibility and can see it being a financial success ( which is the important thing to owners ) - that feeling is regardless of what clubs are involved.


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## Deleted member 16999 (Mar 4, 2016)

NWJocko said:



			Part of the attractiveness of the PL to TV companies is the atmosphere as in England/UK there is a strong culture of going to away games that isn't true across most of Europe.

The atmosphere at Zenit v PSV for example would be even worse than some of the games on TV just now, not exactly an attractive "product" to market compared to Barca v Liverpool, Bayern v Chelsea.

Football is so far up it's own jacksie now it's probably inevitable, part of me hopes it happens and implodes taking all of the foreign owners with it.

If you're not in favour of it Phil you seem quite comfortable about the prospect from your posts, would you feel the same if it was unlikely the club you support would be included?
		
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I'm not in favour but think, sadly, it's inevitable, and, picking on our lovable neighbours, they sold out their Far East tour and the crowd was brilliant, 90,000 singing You'll neve......apparently, so who says it will be about atsmosphere, if they fill the stadium the money men won't care if it's filled by nuns or hooligans.


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## Hacker Khan (Mar 4, 2016)

GB72 said:



			I am no means an expert on football, not really my sport, but looking at some of the leagues around Europe, they need this are more than the Premier League do. Some of the bigger leagues really do only seem to have one or two clubs that can seriously challenge and anything else is a rarity. PSG being so far ahead of the rest must be killing the French league as far as interest goes, Spain have Barca and Real and then the rest,* Germany have Bayern*. At least the Premier League throws up a winner from maybe half a dozen clubs.
		
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Dortmund could be only 2 points behind Bayern if they beat them this weekend.  

But I am being slightly pedantic and do agree with what you say.  To me sport is only worth watching if the outcome is unpredictable. And as there is so much money involved and invested in the teams becoming successful, then teams will do all they can to remove the unpredictability. I still say that all the 'draws' (and i use that world lightly) for the champs league and world cups are is an exercise in ensuring the teams with the biggest TV audiences get as far as possible in the competitions to please the sponsors.


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## Grogger (Mar 4, 2016)

Won't happen anytime soon


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The difference will be as with the newly formed Prem all those years back it would be sanctioned

When they were talking about forming it previously it was going to sanctioned 

What reason would they not sanction it ? It would be a massive global spinner which would be perfect for FIFA and UEFA
		
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How do you know it will be sanctioned?

The new President of FIFA has already suggested that, on his watch, there will be a different attitude towards the balance between sporting integrity and the demands of the money-men.

Reading what little has come out so far the man from Relevent Sports has spoken only about financial advantages to the participating clubs.

How does that benefit either FIFA or UEFA?

And as a "closed shop" it would rather fail the sporting integrity test or both bodies' stated aims of broadening participation rather than just increasing TV audiences.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			How do you know it will be sanctioned?

The new President of FIFA has already suggested that, on his watch, there will be a different attitude towards the balance between sporting integrity and the demands of the money-men.

Reading what little has come out so far the man from Relevent Sports has spoken only about financial advantages to the participating clubs.

How does that benefit either FIFA or UEFA?

And as a "closed shop" it would rather fail the sporting integrity test or both bodies' stated aims of broadening participation rather than just increasing TV audiences.
		
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What he suggests and what actually happens it an altogether different story 

Other sports have closed shops in regards certainly franchises so not sure where this "sports integrity test" comes from - the governing bodies have said lots of words over the decades yet it's just been words with actions meaning a damn sight more.

What they need to grow the game - money 

A competition that will provide a damn sight lot of money - a European Super League. 

The "sport" is money driven now - and it's not going change and in fact will get worse.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			What he suggests and what actually happens it an altogether different story 

Other sports have closed shops in regards certainly franchises so not sure where this "sports integrity test" comes from - the governing bodies have said lots of words over the decades yet it's just been words with actions meaning a damn sight more.

What they need to grow the game - money 

A competition that will provide a damn sight lot of money - a European Super League. 

The "sport" is money driven now - and it's not going change and in fact will get worse.
		
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None of that money is likely to benefit the authorities or be used for growing the game.

After all you only have to look at the wonderful example that is the Premier League. It is awash with money yet fewer people are playing the game at grassroots level, lower league clubs are barely staying afloat and parks (and other) pitches are disappearing.

The PL merely pays lip service to its "duty" to the game at large whilst the billions it generates are used to pay the inflated wages of players, many of whom have achieved nothing, and their agents' fees.

So yes this so called Super League may well come to pass but please do not insult our intelligence by suggesting that the money generated will be of benefit to football.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			How do you know it will be sanctioned?

The new President of FIFA has already suggested that, on his watch, there will be a different attitude towards the balance between sporting integrity and the demands of the money-men.

Reading what little has come out so far the man from Relevent Sports has spoken only about financial advantages to the participating clubs.

How does that benefit either FIFA or UEFA?

And as a "closed shop" it would rather fail the sporting integrity test or both bodies' stated aims of broadening participation rather than just increasing TV audiences.
		
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He doesn't and to be fair no-one does and I personally don't think it would be which would lead to other implications including international bans where precedents exist not only in football but in other sports. I really don't get all this talk of "franchises" and there is no way that clubs will be run that way or merged to form a London franchise, a Madrid, Berlin, North West England etc. Clubs will always maintain their own integrity and be run indvidually as a business. 

Personally I have no doubt this super league will keep emerging but I think there will be changes in the CL to head this off and I am certain Fifa and Uefa will do a lot more to control their product, integrity and the demands of those with the cash


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			None of that money is likely to benefit the authorities or be used for growing the game.

After all you only have to look at the wonderful example that is the Premier League. It is awash with money yet fewer people are playing the game at grassroots level, lower league clubs are barely staying afloat and parks (and other) pitches are disappearing.

The PL merely pays lip service to its "duty" to the game at large whilst the billions it generates are used to pay the inflated wages of players, many of whom have achieved nothing, and their agents' fees.

So yes this so called Super League may well come to pass but please do not insult our intelligence by suggesting that the money generated will be of benefit to football.
		
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When did i suggest it would be to the benefit of the game ?

UEFA get a lot of money from the CL - that money comes from the fact the big clubs bring in the sponsership and the big telly deals etc etc - remove the big clubs and that money goes with them so UEFA's funds for growing football is dramatically reduce - so to ensure they get funds from a Super League then they will be involved in some way and they will sanction it IMO 

The perfect example of a European League working is the Premier League - the Premier League was the first stage - the next stage is a European League.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			When did i suggest it would be to the benefit of the game ?

UEFA get a lot of money from the CL - that money comes from the fact the big clubs bring in the sponsership and the big telly deals etc etc - remove the big clubs and that money goes with them so UEFA's funds for growing football is dramatically reduce - so to ensure they get funds from a Super League then they will be involved in some way and they will sanction it IMO 

The perfect example of a European League working is the Premier League - the Premier League was the first stage - the next stage is a European League.
		
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Well in several posts you referred to "growing the game" so presumably you believe this development would help in funding that growth.

This despite the fact Charlie Stillitano seems to think that the objective is to provide the bigger clubs with more money that, apparently "they deserve".

In what way is that going to help grow the game.


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## sawtooth (Mar 4, 2016)

Tashyboy said:



			just read that Arsenal have said well " stick it up your jacksy" and good on them.
		
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Too right. :thup:


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Well in several posts you referred to "growing the game" so presumably you believe this development would help in funding that growth.

This despite the fact Charlie Stillitano seems to think that the objective is to provide the bigger clubs with more money that, apparently "they deserve".

In what way is that going to help grow the game.
		
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My one statement about "growing the game"

Was in regards that if UEFA want to grow the game they need money to do that and a European League that they are part of could provide them a lot of money 

But the clubs leaving CL and them passing some sort of "sanctions" which I'm pretty sure they wouldn't anyway wouldn't help UEFA in anyway.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

sawtooth said:



			Too right. :thup:
		
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Yet there CEO was seen at the meeting and was "fully involved" 

If it happens Arsenal would be straight into it and certainly wouldn't tell them " stick it "


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			My one statement about "growing the game"

Was in regards that if UEFA want to grow the game they need money to do that and a European League that they are part of could provide them a lot of money 

But the clubs leaving CL and them passing some sort of "sanctions" which I'm pretty sure they wouldn't anyway wouldn't help UEFA in anyway.
		
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Slight backtracking by the promoters or maybe misinterpretation by the media.

Mr. Stillitano is apparently proposing a change to the CL rather than a new Super League.

Of course the change involves money and its distribution, nothing to do with football. Quelle surprise!

As has been shown in the past UEFA do not necessarily see the interests of the so called "big clubs" coinciding with theirs.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Slight backtracking by the promoters or maybe misinterpretation by the media.

Mr. Stillitano is apparently proposing a change to the CL rather than a new Super League.

Of course the change involves money and its distribution, nothing to do with football. Quelle surprise!

As has been shown in the past UEFA do not necessarily see the interests of the so called "big clubs" coinciding with theirs.
		
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Yet UEFA changed the CL at the interests of the Big Clubs and will attempt to deflect any move of a League by making more changes to the CL to satisfy the big clubs - they know that the big club are crucial to the success of their clubs - so not sure what past you are referring to ?

And of course it's all about money - everyone knows it's all about money and everything that happens now in the sport will be based around money - that's not a new revelation


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## Duckster (Mar 4, 2016)

The premier league was nowhere near as drastic a change as some are thinking.  It was simply a tidy up and re-brand of an existing entity, granted this gave it a larger voice.

However it kept the promotion and relegation aspect.  How would that work in ESL?  If it were a closed shop, then there would be no way UEFA would sanction it as the member FA's would have no reason to sanction it as they effectively lose their best teams as I cant see how you could run a full league and still have time to also play domestically.  Would the Prem League let its top teams go, or La Liga etc..?  Would they hell as like.

Then the nitty gritty of who joins.  How many teams in total.  How many from which countries.

I think the current Champs League has a decent format and I cant see that changing for while.

Or at least until FIFA disbands.


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## sawtooth (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yet there CEO was seen at the meeting and was "fully involved" 

If it happens Arsenal would be straight into it and certainly wouldn't tell them " stick it "
		
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Yes but attending a meeting and being involved is one thing, supporting a new breakaway league is another.

It wont happen unless they get everyone to buy into it.


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Yet UEFA changed the CL at the interests of the Big Clubs and will attempt to deflect any move of a League by making more changes to the CL to satisfy the big clubs - they know that the big club are crucial to the success of their clubs - so not sure what past you are referring to ?

And of course it's all about money - everyone knows it's all about money and everything that happens now in the sport will be based around money - that's not a new revelation
		
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In which case why should FIFA or UEFA be bothered.

The extra money does not benefit them and the current set up generates nothing for the former whose income is very largely derived from the World Cup.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			In which case why should FIFA or UEFA be bothered.

The extra money does not benefit them and the current set up generates nothing for the former whose income is very largely derived from the World Cup.
		
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Sorry what do you mean a both FIFA being bothered ?

Both Federations make a lot of money from football


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## Qwerty (Mar 4, 2016)

Surely it would never be a closed shop as where would that leave the teams that didn't make it.. Within 5 years Liverpool would be worth about as much as Tranmere.

If promotion/ Relegation was included though as it should be..How would they work it with several countries/European Leagues involved?

I can't visualise a model that would work fairly. But then again will fair even be considered when the new breed of armchair fans will be glued to their TVs 7 nights a week on the New ESL PPV Channel popping tokens into the meter.

We might even see a few Name Changes for the Franchises.

Barcelona Buccaneers
Unreal Madrid Pirates
Manchester City Slickers.

It'll be a slippery slope.. Are we already on it?


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Sorry what do you mean a both FIFA being bothered ?

Both Federations make a lot of money from football
		
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What does FIFA get from the CL?

As I said their income arise from the ticket sales, sponsorship and TV rights of the World Cup, not the Champions' League.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			Surely it would never be a closed shop as where would that leave the teams that didn't make it.. Within 5 years Liverpool would be worth about as much as Tranmere.

If promotion/ Relegation was included though as it should be..How would they work it with several countries/European Leagues involved?

I can't visualise a model that would work fairly. But then again will fair even be considered when the new breed of armchair fans will be glued to their TVs 7 nights a week on the New ESL PPV Channel popping tokens into the meter.

We might even see a few Name Changes for the Franchises.

Barcelona Buccaneers
Unreal Madrid Pirates
Manchester City Slickers.

It'll be a slippery slope.. Are we already on it?
		
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I think they have been on the slippery slope for a while now and it's only getting worse


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			What does FIFA get from the CL?

As I said their income arise from the ticket sales, sponsorship and TV rights of the World Cup, not the Champions' League.
		
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Sorry again I'm not sure where you are going here. I know FIFA doesn't get anything from CL - no one has said they do ?


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## Deleted member 18588 (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			Sorry again I'm not sure where you are going here. I know FIFA doesn't get anything from CL - no one has said they do ?
		
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Are you deliberately obtuse.

You consistently claim that this so called Super League would be a global money spinner and that both UEFA & FIFA would welcome that. 

Yet the intention would appear to be for that money to benefit the participating clubs. So why would FIFA or UEFA welcome that?


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

MetalMickie said:



			Are you deliberately obtuse.

You consistently claim that this so called Super League would be a global money spinner and that both UEFA & FIFA would welcome that. 

Yet the intention would appear to be for that money to benefit the participating clubs. So why would FIFA or UEFA welcome that?
		
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A European Super League would IMO increase the exposure of the game all over the world - with that increased exposure the governing bodies will be able to jump on the marketing and ensure that any tournaments they host would be fully packed out and massively market it and gain further sponsership. 

All the best players playing with and against each other at club and then for their country - it's a marketing dream. 

IF it happened then I believe the governing bodies would sanction it because they themselves would be able to use the increased exposure of the game around the world and gain their own extra income 

Yes a European League globally would enhance the finances of the clubs but it's not exactly rocket science for the governing bodies to jump on it to ensure they get slices of pies. 

They wouldn't ban players because they need those players to be playing in their tournaments 

The thirst from people all over the world to watch the best players is something that can be utilised to the max to ensure maximum income for all. Basic marketing.


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## chrisd (Mar 4, 2016)

Crystal Palace v Barcelona. It does have a certain ring to it!  :lol:


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## Qwerty (Mar 4, 2016)

chrisd said:



			Crystal Palace Punks v Barcelona Buccaneers,It does have a certain ring to it!  :lol:
		
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:thup:


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			:thup:
		
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That would be the day football dies - frightening thought


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## SaintHacker (Mar 4, 2016)

Doon frae Troon said:



			A European League is almost inevitable, money talks.
I hope it involves promotion and relegation so we may then see some of the 'big five' end up with the likes of Wolves, Sheffeld Wednesday,
Portsmouth, Ipswich, Fulham and Charlton.
Money talks.
		
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Portsmouth!:rofl::rofl::thup:


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			No I'm not in favour of it happening 

Just being realistic to it and can see it happening and it would be within FIFA's agreements because I think it would be a massive money spinner for football and FIFA will benefit from that. 

FIFA know that if something did happen with all the mass finance that would it attract would get all the top players going there and they know they need those top players to make the WC a marketing dream - it's all purely financial to them. 

The Kerry Packer thjng was an attempt at professional paid cricket for all - now cricket open their arms to it all because of the financial benefits 

Everything is controlled by greed and the financial rewards for a European League will make a lot open to it
		
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Good - not sure FIFA would necessarily benefit overall though, as if there was no relegation etc they could break away. Look at boxing and the darts where you have different bodies.

Also the original leagues may suffer so could lose out overall.


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			Good - not sure FIFA would necessarily benefit overall though, as if there was no relegation etc they could break away. Look at boxing and the darts where you have different bodies.

Also the original leagues may suffer so could lose out overall.
		
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The overall leagues would suffer - the Prem etc would lose a good deal amount of revenue from telly deals and sponsership , it would awful for all the other clubs , the best players would look to be a part of it


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			A European Super League would IMO increase the exposure of the game all over the world - with that increased exposure the governing bodies will be able to jump on the marketing and ensure that any tournaments they host would be fully packed out and massively market it and gain further sponsership. 

All the best players playing with and against each other at club and then for their country - it's a marketing dream. 

IF it happened then I believe the governing bodies would sanction it because they themselves would be able to use the increased exposure of the game around the world and gain their own extra income 

Yes a European League globally would enhance the finances of the clubs but it's not exactly rocket science for the governing bodies to jump on it to ensure they get slices of pies. 

They wouldn't ban players because they need those players to be playing in their tournaments 

The thirst from people all over the world to watch the best players is something that can be utilised to the max to ensure maximum income for all. Basic marketing.
		
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But what if the "original" country leagues wither as a result, that may trickle down to grass roots level and get even less people playing the game, and turn them into fans of other sports.

Initially, there would be a massive interest, but 10 years later, it would just be like watching the Harlem globetrotters.

I dont bother to watch much CL these days.


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverpoolphil said:



			The overall leagues would suffer - the Prem etc would lose a good deal amount of revenue from telly deals and sponsership , it would awful for all the other clubs , the best players would look to be a part of it
		
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Ergo, UEFA might get loads of "extra" money from the ESL, but in the long run maybe less from the other leagues, if the other leagues arent as attractive and they earn less overall.

Another wall street crash/credit crunch and the ESL could die overnight.


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## Qwerty (Mar 4, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			Initially, there would be a massive interest, but 10 years later, it would just be like watching the Harlem globetrotters.
.
		
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:thup:
The thing that bothers me is that once it's done Theres no going back. 
100+years down the pan, All the history diluted IMO.

It all might sound a bit OTT but over time once it's established what has gone before will quite quickly be forgotten.


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## Liverbirdie (Mar 4, 2016)

Qwerty said:



			:thup:
The thing that bothers me is that once it's done Theres no going back. 
100+years down the pan, All the history diluted IMO.

It all might sound a bit OTT but over time once it's established what has gone before will slowly be forgotten.
		
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Correct mate.

I used to love the FA cup, going to places like Carlisle, Swansea, Hull, Barnsley, Oldham, Walsall (when some of them clubs were in the 2nd/3rd division) and used to pray for a ground I hadn't been to before. Would have loved a Bury, Rochdale, Brentford, Leyton Orient.

Over the years regularly going to Derby, Sheff Wed, Coventry, Forest when they were regularly in the top division. 

You can go all over this country, on holiday, on business and can still have something to chat to to people from other cities that you may have in common, or even remember a match between his/her and your own side.

If my side went into it, we would have nothing in common with these supporters, and would have more in common with "fashionistas" in their blag Barcelona tops.

Remember, my dad and your dad have seen United and Liverpool in the 2nd division!!! No success/level should be guaranteed.


Next stop - world league - Estudiantes away? You dont want to go there on a cold Tuesday night.


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## HomerJSimpson (Mar 5, 2016)

So basically the crux of the voice(s) in favour is that it will generate shed loads of money for those clubs involved and that there will be worldwide media/TV interest in showing this across and that this super league will be the flagship to grow the game

Sorry but as a model I see it as flawed and can't see how someone in Chile would be vaguely interested in PSG v AC Milan and why a South American TV company would pay top dollar to show it. With no way of effectively changing the line up with promotion and relegation, it remains a closed shop bar those invited to the top table who then rake off the huge money thrown at the league while domestic leagues become watered down. 

I can't see any way in which it can work as a long term project and while in the first 1-10 seasons there may be enough interest to keep the money flowing and the viewing figures and advertising revenue sufficiently high, even if they take it globally, I fail to see how it will grow the game worldwide. It's a case of the haves having more and sod everyone else and I can't see how Uefa/Fifa will allow it to happen or see it being in the best interest of a global model.

Anyway off to the Madstad to watch proper footie now


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## Liverpoolphil (Mar 5, 2016)

Liverbirdie said:



			But what if the "original" country leagues wither as a result, that may trickle down to grass roots level and get even less people playing the game, and turn them into fans of other sports.

Initially, there would be a massive interest, but 10 years later, it would just be like watching the Harlem globetrotters.

I dont bother to watch much CL these days.
		
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You are spot on it would have a massive effect on the leagues around Europe if the big clubs left the leagues - but I expect it wouldn't bother the big clubs because of the selfish nature of football and the thirst for the money.

The owners of these clubs want to have their team in highlights all over the world - it's seems like a boys toys to show off to their billionaire mates and as you and Qwerty it would be history just wiped away and having the likes of Exeter playing the big teams never happening- it's a frightening prospect but something that would wet the appetite of the rich


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## Tongo (Mar 6, 2016)

Well Charlie Stillitano has certainly got famous on the back of this controversy. One wonders whether that was one of his aims. 

It'll happen eventually. Just a case of when. Shame on pesky Leicester for getting in the way of the big 5. How dare they.


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