Winter handicapping

[rulie]

Cant agree. Yes folks may play off a shortened course. Yes the roll might be much less than summer which may or may not balance out the former.

But the underlying ground conditions when it has been persistently wet makes playing the game and striking the ball cleanly so much more difficult for all but the best of golfers. At the end of the day, golf that affects your handicap should be a fair test, rather than an attritional war against the conditions.

Or, it could be like it is here -> no golf at all from 1st November to mid-March.

 

[twrmgoat]

If it works fine and everyone is enjoying their winter golf, isn’t it unfair to then use said winter golf to cut only selective groups?

Surely after a few weeks of yous reintroducing qualifiers the handicaps will look after themselves?

Where a new golfer has clearly and consistently demonstrated a better ability than current handicap then would be unfair not to review and adjust accordingly.

 

[rulie]

Where a new golfer has clearly and consistently demonstrated a better ability than current handicap then would be unfair not to review and adjust accordingly.

Or, let the system work. The system will adjust a new golfer's handicap much faster than someone who already has 20 scores in his/her record. Maybe "intervention" is not required?

 

[PaulMdj]

Where a new golfer has clearly and consistently demonstrated a better ability than current handicap then would be unfair not to review and adjust accordingly.

Maybe, but it still contradicts all your points about winter golf.
And your statement should apply to all golfers not just new ones.

 

[twrmgoat]

Maybe, but it still contradicts all your points about winter golf.
And your statement should apply to all golfers not just new ones.

Or, let the system work. The system will adjust a new golfer's handicap much faster than someone who already has 20 scores in his/her record. Maybe "intervention" is not required?

The system includes allowance for manual adjustments, not sure why why the clear need for one should be ignored. In the cases I’m talking about, the adjustment is welcomed. In most cases, players don’t want to win prizes playing off a clearly wrong handicap.

 

[PaulMdj]

The system includes allowance for manual adjustments, not sure why why the clear need for one should be ignored. In the cases I’m talking about, the adjustment is welcomed. In most cases, players don’t want to win prizes playing off a clearly wrong handicap.

You’re missing the point, you clearly stated you play non-qualifiers Nov-Mar and it’s no issue and everybody should enjoy their Golf.

So how is it OK to then use information from a non-qualifying course for NEW golfers only, surely their scores are as unacceptable as anyone else’s scores.

Why can’t you tell new golfers to enjoy playing and learning, then in March they are to submit acceptable cards to get their first handicap and once they have their handicap they can then enter competitions.

What if someone off 20-10 practises all winter and improves rapidly, is their handicap in March any more honest than the new golfer?

 

[Captain_Black.]

I've been a member of my club for 10 years
It's a parkland course
Every year between about the 2nd week of Dec through to the end of March (sometimes April) the course is virtually unplayable for handicap golf.
Yet my club runs qualifiers right through the year, even if its temporary greens, they'll run a qualifier at 60% h/c

Every week I see scores of players barely getting into double figures, some get cold & wet & walk off after 9 holes.
All the while increasing their handicaps
Come Spring, those players with artificially inflated handicaps will be coming in with scores in the high 40's
I've just given up now, I play in a couple of qualifiers during summer to maintain my current h/c, but I've lost all interest in competing in comps, as I'd have to break the course record to even get in the top 6.
All other sports have a defined season
Golf, especially in this country should be no different.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

@Captain_Black. For parkland courses I very much agree. For links, less so. Links have the capability to be true in winter, parkland rarely do.

I don't know enough about heathland courses.

 

[D-S]

I've been a member of my club for 10 years
It's a parkland course
Every year between about the 2nd week of Dec through to the end of March (sometimes April) the course is virtually unplayable for handicap golf.
Yet my club runs qualifiers right through the year, even if its temporary greens, they'll run a qualifier at 60% h/c

Every week I see scores of players barely getting into double figures, some get cold & wet & walk off after 9 holes.
All the while increasing their handicaps
Come Spring, those players with artificially inflated handicaps will be coming in with scores in the high 40's
I've just given up now, I play in a couple of qualifiers during summer to maintain my current h/c, but I've lost all interest in competing in comps, as I'd have to break the course record to even get in the top 6.
All other sports have a defined season
Golf, especially in this country should be no different.

On the face of it, without knowing all the details, this is totally contrary to the Rules of Handicapping and should be stopped immediately.

 

[twrmgoat]

You’re missing the point, you clearly stated you play non-qualifiers Nov-Mar and it’s no issue and everybody should enjoy their Golf.

So how is it OK to then use information from a non-qualifying course for NEW golfers only, surely their scores are as unacceptable as anyone else’s scores.

Why can’t you tell new golfers to enjoy playing and learning, then in March they are to submit acceptable cards to get their first handicap and once they have their handicap they can then enter competitions.

What if someone off 20-10 practises all winter and improves rapidly, is their handicap in March any more honest than the new golfer?

It isn’t inherently limited to new golfers. If others were to demonstrate similar significant discrepancy between handicap and current playing ability then they could be reviewed too. The reviews are fully in keeping with the rules.

 

[PaulMdj]

We don’t ply a rated course between mid Oct and end of March. Parkland course, we play off mats throughout (or move to side). Often can’t differentiate fairway and rough.

Works fine, everyone enjoys their winter golf. No problem from handicap point of view, not difficult to identify a few newish golfers / rapid improvers who need a handicap adjustment at start of season.

Can’t help thinking that much of the drive fir winter qualifiers is about stats and claiming growth in the game, etc rather than about handicap accuracy,

It isn’t inherently limited to new golfers. If others were to demonstrate similar significant discrepancy between handicap and current playing ability then they could be reviewed too. The reviews are fully in keeping with the rules.

I’m sorry, really not trying to be awkward but I’ve highlighted your initial post, if your winter course is not rated and you are playing non-qualifiers there is no way your are complying with the rules and are picking and choosing to fit yourselves.

 

[jim8flog]

I've been a member of my club for 10 years
It's a parkland course
Every year between about the 2nd week of Dec through to the end of March (sometimes April) the course is virtually unplayable for handicap golf.
Yet my club runs qualifiers right through the year, even if its temporary greens, they'll run a qualifier at 60% h/c

Every week I see scores of players barely getting into double figures, some get cold & wet & walk off after 9 holes.
All the while increasing their handicaps
Come Spring, those players with artificially inflated handicaps will be coming in with scores in the high 40's
I've just given up now, I play in a couple of qualifiers during summer to maintain my current h/c, but I've lost all interest in competing in comps, as I'd have to break the course record to even get in the top 6.
All other sports have a defined season
Golf, especially in this country should be no different.

As per D-S more than 2 temps and the comp should be a non qualifier (rules of Handicapping)

If players walk off after 9 holes their score will not count for Hcap ( assuming they record the card correctly i.e holes 10 to 18 as not started and not as no return).

I play a course where the we run comps all year round and have always been glad they do so. Already said - years ago most of the downs in my handicap were in winter because it is so much easier to control where the ball lands and stops.

 

[twrmgoat]

I’m sorry, really not trying to be awkward but I’ve highlighted your initial post, if your winter course is not rated and you are playing non-qualifiers there is no way your are complying with the rules and are picking and choosing to fit yourselves.

Well, we’ll just have to disagree. the review process allows information to be used other than qualifiers on rated courses.

 

[PaulMdj]

Well, we’ll just have to disagree. the review process allows information to be used other than qualifiers on rated courses.

Then you should be reviewing everybody, not picking and choosing certain groups.

Can you please share the link to that review process, I’m sure it would be very useful to other Clubs on here that don’t play qualifiers or have a rated course during the winter.

 

[twrmgoat]

Then you should be reviewing everybody, not picking and choosing certain groups.

Can you please share the link to that review process, I’m sure it would be very useful to other Clubs on here that don’t play qualifiers or have a rated course during the winter.

No one is excluded from review.You seem obsessed with the fact that I mentioned new golfers. I thought I’d already subsequently clarified that could apply to anyone demonstrating different ability. I’m going to leave it here.

 

[PaulMdj]

No one is excluded from review.You seem obsessed with the fact that I mentioned new golfers. I thought I’d already subsequently clarified that could apply to anyone demonstrating different ability. I’m going to leave it here.

Don’t care about new golfers or fast improvers or anyone playing the game we love.

I just want everyone being treated the same and no groups singled out for unfair treatment by Clubs or individuals who use the rules to suit themselves and their insecurities.