Wimbledon

NWJocko said:
The

I said maybe if you read my post closely, I mean in terms of expectation both by himself and from the media as, of course, on paper it's an easier game.

Unusually for him he made it look straightforward today.

I'm aware it was tongue in cheek, the inference is that his achievement is somehow lessened because of who was the other side of the net.

It's not his fault Djokovic and Federer weren't good enough to make the final this year is it!?
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Of course it's not his fault. Hence me saying you can only beat what's in front of you.

to be clear, he is a very good player. And I'm actually glad he wo. As I feel that for his talent he deserve 3/4. It's not like good ol Tim who was apparently unlucky to face Sampras. Tim simply wasn't anywhere near good enough.

For me, Murray will be remembered as one of our greatest. But not one of tennis' greatest.
 
Papas1982 said:
Of course it's not his fault. Hence me saying you can only beat what's in front of you.

to be clear, he is a very good player. And I'm actually glad he wo. As I feel that for his talent he deserve 3/4. It's not like good ol Tim who was apparently unlucky to face Sampras. Tim simply wasn't anywhere near good enough.

For me, Murray will be remembered as one of our greatest. But not one of tennis' greatest.
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I completely agree re Murray.

My point is just because he isn't one of the greats doesn't mean he should be knocked down for winning Grand Slams because other players haven't been good enough to stay the distance.

He's in a bit of a no mans land really as today showed he's a level above "the rest" he's just a level below the top 3!
 
NWJocko said:
I completely agree re Murray.

My point is just because he isn't one of the greats doesn't mean he should be knocked down for winning Grand Slams because other players haven't been good enough to stay the distance.

He's in a bit of a no mans land really as today showed he's a level above "the rest" he's just a level below the top 3!
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Agreed, the Darren Huckerby of tennis!
 
NWJocko said:
I completely agree re Murray.

My point is just because he isn't one of the greats doesn't mean he should be knocked down for winning Grand Slams because other players haven't been good enough to stay the distance.

He's in a bit of a no mans land really as today showed he's a level above "the rest" he's just a level below the top 3!
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Times have changed. Murray's not as good as federer or nadal were at their peak but on form this year he's easily #2 and would have been favourite even if he faced roger in the final.
 
FairwayDodger said:
Times have changed. Murray's not as good as federer or nadal were at their peak but on form this year he's easily #2 and would have been favourite even if he faced roger in the final.
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I agree, the bookies would of had him as such too. But I'd certainly not of laid money on him as such.

I recall the bbc saying that he'd hopefully enjoy many more. Unfortunately, I genuinely believe that if he continues to meet Novak, which past history shows, then he'll still struggle to add many more.
 
Papas1982 said:
I agree, the bookies would of had him as such too. But I'd certainly not of laid money on him as such.

I recall the bbc saying that he'd hopefully enjoy many more. Unfortunately, I genuinely believe that if he continues to meet Novak, which past history shows, then he'll still struggle to add many more.
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He still has managed to beat Novak twice in Grand Slam finals plus a number of times in Masters finals so whilst Novak is the number one player and always would be favour ire, Murray has shown he can beat him when it matters and will beat him again
 
Papas1982 said:
I agree, the bookies would of had him as such too. But I'd certainly not of laid money on him as such.

I recall the bbc saying that he'd hopefully enjoy many more. Unfortunately, I genuinely believe that if he continues to meet Novak, which past history shows, then he'll still struggle to add many more.
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He'll certainly always be the underdog and lose more than he wins against Novak.
 
Liverpoolphil said:
He still has managed to beat Novak twice in Grand Slam finals plus a number of times in Masters finals so whilst Novak is the number one player and always would be favour ire, Murray has shown he can beat him when it matters and will beat him again
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Hence why I said struggle. I wasn't saying he would never beat him.

Just as as I said, his record suggests it will be difficult to do so. One upset aside, Novak if possible looked even further ahead this year in perfomamce levels.
 
I love the he's not as good as Djokovic, Nadal and Federer at their peak. Federer the most successful men's GS champion of all time, Nadal joint second and Djokovic joint fourth and counting. Only Sampras and Roy Emerson can statistically match those three in Grand Slams.

Winning 3 Slams in an era with those three around is a mightily impressive performance. But apparently its just a bit meh.
 
Tongo said:
I love the he's not as good as Djokovic, Nadal and Federer at their peak. Federer the most successful men's GS champion of all time, Nadal joint second and Djokovic joint fourth and counting. Only Sampras and Roy Emerson can statistically match those three in Grand Slams.

Winning 3 Slams in an era with those three around is a mightily impressive performance. But apparently its just a bit meh.
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If that was aimed at my comment, it's worth pointing out that I think andy is brilliant, one of the top British sportsmen of all time, probably the greatest currently competing and that winning 3 slams is a fantastic achievement.
 
No disputing Murrays talent but we all have our favourite sportsmen (and women) and he isn't one of mine.

There's something disrespectful about fist pumping and shouting every time you win a point, not good sportsmanship IMO.

And that comment 'Anyone but England' has done him no favours, it was a really stupid thing to say. As a result many south of the border will want 'Anyone but Murray' which is fair enough.
 
Interested to know what Lendl does for Murray that other coaches don't, the man just sits their emotionless yet Murray wins slams with him about. Is it just coincidence or does Lendl give him added confidence/steel/belief? Hope he sticks around 2 years, if Djoko is having some issues the US and Australian opens coming up should be good opportunities for Murray. 5 slams would be a terrific legacy for Murray.
For me Fed and Nad are past it. None of the young guns are at the level of Murray/Djoko yet. Wawrinka on his day might bother them but thats about it.
 
Nadal's body is destroyed - Federer and Djokovic are showing that a tennis player's body will cope with a long career if kept relatively lean and supple. Nadal has worn his out with bulk and power at the expensive of long term inflexibility.
 
sawtooth said:
No disputing Murrays talent but we all have our favourite sportsmen (and women) and he isn't one of mine.

There's something disrespectful about fist pumping and shouting every time you win a point, not good sportsmanship IMO.

And that comment 'Anyone but England' has done him no favours, it was a really stupid thing to say. As a result many south of the border will want 'Anyone but Murray' which is fair enough.
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Is that any different to a footballer celebrating or fist pumping when they score or goal or make a save ? I don't think I have ever heard a tennis player say they feel disrespected when an opponent shouts or fist pumps when a point or game or set is won

As for the anyone but England - that's just rivalry between the nations that has been around for centuries on a sporting field - does anyone really expect a Scotsman or Welshman or Irishman to support England at any point in any sport ? I certainly wouldn't
 
Can't believe anyone is still using the ABE thing against him. It's widely known that was an off the cuff joke to (I believe) Tim henman who had started the whole exchange by winding him up about Scotland.
 
FairwayDodger said:
Can't believe anyone is still using the ABE thing against him. It's widely known that was an off the cuff joke to (I believe) Tim henman who had started the whole exchange by winding him up about Scotland.
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...and we don't really mean it - we just say it because it has to be said - to wind the English up. I would have supported England all the way to the final of Euro2016; all the way to sudden death penalty kicks - then maybe - just maybe...

But I would have at that point reflected that my Mrs and kids would want England to win and so...
 
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