What's your clubs Policy on

[Leftie]

Im not going to get into this one Homer, I know this subject far better than most as I have lived it for many years and I just cant be bothered, Im too tired because it is way too complex and too deep for the average road user to fully understand which is why the simplistic is often used to place things in the mind of joe public.

Goodnight.

Apart from being sickeningly condecending to 99% of this country's population (an approximate guess based on my experience, not on statistics .

I was going to say something like... If you are going to make yet another "you are all wrong 'cos I say so" or "you don't know what you are talking about but I do" statements and then say you can't be bothered with it any more... but I can't be bothered anymore either

 

[Cernunnos]

Indeed Murph. Its over political correctness that simply bulldoses through commons sense imo. That said if the rules are there, then we just have to grin & bear it & simply not enjoy two pints but instead go on the cola or tomato juice,or order coffee instead.

But I do agree its generally the Juvinile binge drinkers that push up stats, when most people don't drink much these days, mainly because of the tightening regulations. Though there is still a very small hardcore of 50+ adults who insist on enjoying more in a session than they ought to for safetys sake.

Now I think most of us enjoy a drink, but for the sake of our licences if we're out enjoying golf, we just have to stay off the sauce

 

[freddielong]

This thread has gone on a stupid path anyone who thinks drink driving is ok is so dumb I am suprised they can type (perhaps someone has helped them). I dont see how any club can have a policy on somthing that is illegal its like asking what your clubs policy on stealing from the proshop or soft drugs.

 

[Gustavo]

I can't agree with the holier than thou stance. I bet every forum member has broken the law (speeding DD etc). Whats the difference between driving 5mph too fast in a built up area and potentially killing a kid who runs out and the guy having two pints in the bar and driving home. Are you going to report all speeding motorists too.

Both are against the law so why discriminate. I'm pretty sure though if you did report DD drivers or made a big issue directly with members leaving after a drink you'd not have many partners to play with and playing lots of solo rounds. You can't pick and choose which laws to break

How can you compare Drink Driving to driving 55 in a 50 ?

"I bet every forum member has broken the law (speeding or DD etc)."

I have can happily say that I have NEVER partaken in Drink Driving.

 

[vig]

I have never driven after having a drink.... EVER!

Used to take it in turns to drive when I was single.
Driver never bought a drink, everyone else bought them the soft drinks all night.

Never been in a situation where I have had a drink and had to leave the car.

I have however had 2 x speeding tickets in 31 yrs of driving.
One for 7 miles per hour over the limit. The other for 12.

The latter was at 4.30 in the morning on completely empty roads

 

[Herbie]

Im not going to get into this one Homer, I know this subject far better than most as I have lived it for many years and I just cant be bothered, Im too tired because it is way too complex and too deep for the average road user to fully understand which is why the simplistic is often used to place things in the mind of joe public.

Goodnight.

Apart from being sickeningly condecending to 99% of this country's population (an approximate guess based on my experience, not on statistics .

I was going to say something like... If you are going to make yet another "you are all wrong 'cos I say so" or "you don't know what you are talking about but I do" statements and then say you can't be bothered with it any more... but I can't be bothered anymore either

Leftie, making quotes again I see yet not focussed on the subject, can you please list the times I have indicated that members of this forum are all wrong? I do get surprised by the ignorance in here sometimes as well as the social follow my leader mentality, but saying everyone is wrong????
I said I couldnt be bothered then because I was tired and knew for abosolute certainty some would be looking to have a go and I wasnt in the mood for it then, expectations of people forming their typical alliances and spit dummies out, people get set in their ways when you try to tell them the obvious when that obvious is not what they want to see.

people who drink and drive are dummies for a number of reasons.
If they cannot recognise their driving is affected as a matter of proven fact I might add then they are always going to be a risk and threat to themselves and others.

If people believe they are not a risk when they drive under the influence then they are dumb.

Comparing DD to speeding is also dumb, when even the sober dont understand the difference between speeding and inappropriate speed.

Speed is a factor of various degree affecting the cause in some cases and certainly the end result, it is NEVER a CAUSE in itself,driver error is and so is DRINK DRIVING!

The number of speeding motorists makes the number of drink drivers, as a figure, insignificant, but the sheer number of speeding motorists in relationship to the number of crashes should give you a significant numerical observation relating to crashes (yet not necessarily a causational speed factor)which makes the crash figure insignificant to the number who speed.
However, the small number of drink drivers account for a significant number of serious and fatal crashes as a matter of fact and this is still true in the face of high level focus on DD, the situation is not getting much better, probably due to the number of golfers who seem in favour of DD and despise those who would report them if they thought it needed to be done.

Use of a mobile phone has been recognised as a serious offence now and could lead to a Ban but is often up to £1000 and 6 penalty points, probably less penalty on the basis that the driver is sober and still has the ability to react, where drunks just dont!

Would you be happy to let one of your golf mates take your nearest and dearest, your kids out for a drive after a few jars down the club house?

If you are not prepared to do that then why pass that risk (you would obviously percieve if it were your own)on to innocent people elsewhere by letting your 'over the limit' buddies drive off from the club house in the first place.

If Homers suggestion is correct in that I would have no one to play with it has usually been a very very small number of people.

Now I could list quite a few statistics for the stat fans and quite a few facts for the more enlightened and could list my experience and quals past and present along with all the related courses Ive done, but this is not the right forum and I believe some of the wood in here is hardwood and very difficult to penetrate

If you are a drink driver you are an IDIOT and do not deserve the right to hold a driving licence, which after all is a privilage not a right, if your offended by that statement you are still an idiot.

 

[vig]

If you are a drink driver you are an IDIOT and do not deserve the right to hold a driving licence, which after all is a privilage not a right, if your offended by that statement you are still an idiot.

I agree 100% and also would dob in anyone that I thought had exceeded the drink limit. If that made me a social leper then so be it.

I also believe that it isn't the mass problem that it is perceived to be.
There was talk a while back that they were looking at a device that you blew into before commencing a journey and the car wouldn't let you drive if you had been drinking. Bring it on

 

[Herbie]

If you are a drink driver you are an IDIOT and do not deserve the right to hold a driving licence, which after all is a privilage not a right, if your offended by that statement you are still an idiot.

I agree 100% and also would dob in anyone that I thought had exceeded the drink limit. If that made me a social leper then so be it.

I also believe that it isn't the mass problem that it is perceived to be.
There was talk a while back that they were looking at a device that you blew into before commencing a journey and the car wouldn't let you drive if you had been drinking. Bring it on

You are right vig, its not a massive number in the scheme, unfortunately they account for too much

 

[Cernunnos]

No-one can afford to drink if they intend driving anywhere, as if the limit was any lower some people would set off the machines without even touching alcohol as there is always a natural base level, much like there is always background radiation.

Stay off the sauce... Simples... chk

I may think the current levels are too strickt, but as someone pointed out would we let someone who's had a few drive our nearest & dearest anywhere. And the answer is no we wouldn't.

Infact, If I thought someone was intending on driving after they'd been drinking & I knew I as usual had stayed dry, would simply offer to drop them off, even if it meant going out of my way.

Its not a case of shopping people its a case of making sure everyone is safe.

The irony is If someone has an accident after a drink they might not have actually have caused it, but they perhaps could have avoided it. Now that's the difference if you think about it for a moment.

And its the person with alcohol in their blood who will be liable. Its the person with alcohol in their blood who will not be covered by insurance. & it'll be them who are prosecuted.

We may live in an over politically correct society of spoilsports, but this isn't the 1960's or 70's, its 2009 & we have to live by & abide by the laws & rules laid down for us today.

If we want to drink, then we get a Taxi, Bus or Train, or find somewhere to be until we have gotten any trace of alcohol out of our system.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

HNJ

I find your insinuation that the majority of my clubs members are flouting the law rude, arrogant and crass. My point was that if you were to report a club member (at ANY club) and they were subsequently done for DD, you would gain a reputation. That would inevitably spread by word of mouth and that there would in MY opinion be a wave of discontent towards you and a lack of enthusiasm to share a round.

I have tried to put forward a reasonable point and have conceded that it is a serious matter but not one that any club is going to police. THe fact that you couldn't respond in like is a shame. Please take your bigoted view of my club and keep those thoughts private. I don't recall making such offensive comments about your clearly strong views on the subject

 

[vig]

TBH Homer.
I personally wouldn't give a toss if no one wanted to play with me if I had dobbed someone in. If it potentially saved a life and they couldn't see that then I probably wouldn't want to play with them anyway.

If I was drawn with/against them in a comp. it would more than likely, focus me more.

I haven't read through all the posts so don't know exactly what you're referring to but anyone who disagrees with the the contempt for drink drivers is not really worth worrying about.

I had a brother in law that did time for drink driving. Couldn't help himself. I told my sister that I would call the police, each and every night they went out, if that's what it took.
He said something to me that I was none too pleased about. The result was that my sister divorced him and I didn't see anything of him again. Was a good job really as I may have done time too.
Am I smug that I potentially kept a disaster from the road and broke up a marriage? You bet I am.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I think you're missing my point. I'm not condoning DD and if you want to report someone then that is fine. The OP was referring to making clubs responsible which won't work in the same way as pubs won't be held accountable. The thread asked what would happen if someone shopped a fellow member and my view was that there would be a fair amount of ostracising. I don't for one minute think that a guy who has had several hours on the juice after a round should drive home.

At the end of the day even if you report someone and they get done (rightly so) it is still the repsonsibility of every driver to make the decision as to whether they are legal. How far do you take it. Do you report a guy who has a pint and a half and may be marginal or only those that are over. Where do you draw the line.

Sadly until the law is changed to say anyone driving with alcohol in the system is over the limit (zero tolerance) there is always going to be those that can get away with it (i.e. be stopped and blow marginal) and those that can have less and be done.

It was merely the insinuation that because my club, and to my knowledge its members have never reported anybody, that we're all raging DD's and have no sentitment to fellow road users and passing public.

 

[andycap]

Homer , if you reported any body for DD, you would not get a 'reputation',as you would be the only one who knows

 

[HomerJSimpson]

andycap

In theory yes. However in reality no. There have been a couple of instances in the village pub where drivers have been done (one guy had only had 1 1/2 pints) and the police have been waiting as the car pulled out. Turned out it was a guy who had been sitting int he pub every night watching who had been drinking what and seeing if they drove hme and reporting EVERY DD irrespective of whether they had one pint or ten.

Suffice to say it was put to him by the landlord that it wouldn't take the regulars long to add two and two and that it may be in his interests to drink elsewhere.

 

[TonyN]

Reputation? Makes me laugh.

Its like the guy who gets caught stealing and says its his colleagues fault he lost his job because he snitched.

NO, ITS YOUR FAULT BECAUSE YOU DID WRONG IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!

 

[Leftie]

Herb.

A) Don't get me wrong. A moving vehicle is a lethal weapon and anyone who uses it in an inappropiate manner (DD, speeding, mobile phone, dangerous driving, etc etc) deserves all they get if caught or cause an "accident".

B) I try to use extracts and quotes to highlight the parts of a post to which I am replying rather than pasting a complete copy.

C) To me, your post was as I said. If you are too tired to make sense, then leave it until the next day when perhaps you will not need to write a mini War and Peace to explain your views and comments.

D) I admit that I was a bit OTT in my final paragraph. In the more contentious threads it seem that it is only those who hold a different view to you are wrong. I can't be bothered to give chapter and verse on these but if you are really interested, then feel free to check out your many posts.

 

[Herbie]

HNJ

I find your insinuation that the majority of my clubs members are flouting the law rude, arrogant and crass. My point was that if you were to report a club member (at ANY club) and they were subsequently done for DD, you would gain a reputation. That would inevitably spread by word of mouth and that there would in MY opinion be a wave of discontent towards you and a lack of enthusiasm to share a round.

I have tried to put forward a reasonable point and have conceded that it is a serious matter but not one that any club is going to police. THe fact that you couldn't respond in like is a shame. Please take your bigoted view of my club and keep those thoughts private. I don't recall making such offensive comments about your clearly strong views on the subject

Rude arrogant and crass???? slow down or I will have to make a list. I think you seem to have rose tinted glasses after reading your own posts clearly directed at myself Homer, perhaps I should quote them? No, I dont think I will as that would be following others negative and demeaning posts. I have been called.....hang on let me try it from memory......oh yes, rude,arrogant,bigoted,crass,dogmatic,stupid, holier than thou, oh I could go on, all of which were directed at myself and not in the context of general populous observations nor in reply t the post or OP and most of these comments funnilly enough from yourself and one or two others.

If you cant deal an opinion relating to anothers post without lowering yourself to the charactoristics you like to label me under dont deal if you cannot handle an objective and equally facetious reply.

I suggest you read your 'holier than thou' post, second paragraph with an objective mind and think about how any reasonable person might interprit its meaning following my post, because non of it has anything to do with my post, I would be grateful if you would explain it in context. Thankyou.

 

[Herbie]

In reply to some of the more recent posts......If you report your suspicions to the police and the driver is stopped and tested, the most that could happen if they are not over the limit is a visit to the police stn for a second test and some advice because they failed the first. This would then make someone wiser and the follow on would be a clear message to everyone that someone dobbed them in, so all drinkers who like to drive would then be more careful, it is an absolute win win situation.

 

[CrapHacker]

I make it

Some people don't like DD and would shop them.

Some people don't like DD but wouldn't shop them.

It don't seem that far apart to me - at least not so far to be worth the risk of some of the serious ship arguing that could be going down any time soon.

I want a nice big

It doesn't seem worth falling out over to me.

C'mon guys, me first

 

[USER1999]

Why only DD?

That is the bit I don't get. Ok, yes, it is a serious problem still, particularly in the young, who tend to have bigger accidents, and skew the stats on speeding, DD, and fatalities. However, being on the phone (even hands free) is just as dangerous (sober or not, makes no difference), and that gets 6 points and a fine. DD gets 15 months ban etc. Not sure why phoning is seen as more acceptable.

So for those who would 'Dob someone in', would you do the same for any who use the phone in the car, or who habitually speed, or have tyre tread less than 1.8mm, or have an MOT 1 day out of date, or drive having forgotten their glasses, or drive with an injury (ie: a neck or back issue preventing proper head rotation), etc? Why stop at DD? It isn't the only contributary factor in accidents.